BrandNewCongress / JusticeDemocrats join Forces to Support U.S. Imperialism

duopll.jpg

Third party? Independent movement? Reform the Democratic party? Brand New Congress? Antiwar movement? Revolution? I try to be as objective as I can regarding the options we (those interested) have in trying to overthrow the ruling class/oligarchy (Revolution). Personally I've ruled out the Democratic party because I see it and the republican party, the duopoly, as part of the oligarchy/ruling class, or completely controlled by them, so they certainly aren't going to help overthrow themselves. I'm not big on third parties because the system is so corrupted and set against third party participation that it will take decades at best to make progress, and we don't have the time. But in the end we don't have alot of options and I'm in a severe minority when I call for boycotts of elections and major changes to our political system, so I need to be objective. Whatever we do there has to be a lot of people on board the good ship Lollipop.

Brand New Congress (BNC) seeks to elect 400 plus new politicians to Congress and Senate all who will work under the same pre-agreed upon political platform regardless of which political party they are elected under. I'm not sure how that will work but on the surface it sounds sketchy. Many questions on how it would actually play out. It sounds like more and better democrats combined with a backdoor maneuver to elect more and better republicans. Let's take a look at their "platform".

They boil it down to two primary goals: 1) Good jobs for everyone, and 2) liberty and justice for all. That's an interesting combination of two goals. Specifically they want to:

-Invest trillions of dollars in new industries
-Invest trillions of dollars to rebuild and repair towns, cities and rural areas
-Spend exactly what it will take to repair our nation’s broken infrastructure
-Build the inevitable cheap, renewable energy economy now,
-Overhaul the IRS and the tax code
-Solve the healthcare mess once and for all by making Medicare available to anyone who wants it, and letting insurance companies fend for themselves in a truly free market.
-Provide free college education and technical training
-We will get money out of politics once and for all: This means getting rid of the revolving door between Wall Street and our government. It means repealing Citizens United. It means moving to a publicly financed, transparent system of campaign financing that amplifies small donations. -And it means all BNC candidates pledging to never lobby Congress after they're out of office.
-We will support the demands for justice from all groups that have been targeted by government:
-We will reform our electoral system to create a more perfect democracy: This will include removing the electoral college, implementing ranked choice voting, creating a holiday on election day, improving the actual mechanics of voting to make it easy to vote and make electoral fraud impossible.
-We will refocus our criminal justice system on reducing the number incarcerated:
-We will say no to wars of choice: Let's stop destabilizing other countries and focus on fixing our own.
-We will give every government body new marching orders.

Some good goals, some that do not go far enough, some that are that are plain old copouts.

duopoly 2.jpg

Just this past week JusticeDemocrats, a group led by Cenk Uyger of the Young Turks, has joined forces with BrandNewCongress. The goal is to reform the democratic party. I'm not sure how the republican party infiltration part of BrandNewCongress will be incorporated into their joint effort, but clearly the primary goal is within the oligarchy's democratic party and the duopoly.

Relative to their platform, what's up with the non-statement on U.S. imperialism? That is pure bullshit and shows me where this is headed. They can't be serious if they aren't serious about U.S. imperialism. Here's what they say (all they say):

"We will say no to wars of choice: Let's stop destabilizing other countries and focus on fixing our own."

First of all, that sounds like what they all say now, it sounds like what Trump said. It's an easy fucking out from the FACTS, which are if we don't end U.S. imperialism nothing else matters. What they don't say, what they don't have the guts to say, is the word imperialism. "Wars of choice". What the hell is that? That's like saying, "we will only fight the good and necessary wars". Bullshit, all wars are wars of choice by the rich and powerful. ALL WARS. If whoever is driving this BNC/JusticeDemocrats train doesn't understand that, which evidently they don't, then none of their other goals matter. And wars are only half the battle. If we don't end U.S. imperialism, i.e., the drive to RULE THE WORLD, we aren't going to invest trillions in new jobs, free education, and fixing the infrastructure. If we don't end U.S. imperialism, we will all continue to be accessories to mass murder. If we don't end U.S. imperialism, we might all get blown to kingdom come.

The second major goal of the BNC is "Liberty and justice for all". Imperialism is the enemy of liberty and justice.

This was typical of most Bernie supporters, they didn't want to face up to U.S. imperialism, just like their hero Bernie Sanders. Now they're joining with Cenk Uygur, who advocated for voting for Hillary Clinton in the presidential election, a war criminal imperialist, and the JusticeDemocrats, a group of democratic party partisans who want to "reform" the warmonger and Wall Street oriented half of the duopoly, the Democratic party. The party that brought us Bill and Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama, liars of the highest order who belong in prison.

These are people who will play politics and compromise their lives away, along with the rest of us.

It's time to call it like it is and not take any more compromising like "no more bad wars". Hell, it's time the people rise up and protest the hell out of what is happening right now with Trump the Maniac and his Merry Band of Warmongers. Right now, the people should be in the streets demanding an end to ALL OF OUR WARS and U.S. imperialism in total. Enough of this madness.

So we don't need any deceiving and detrimental language about "wars of choice". That only serves to let them excuse their way into more wars, because they always have excuses as to why they had no choice. That's why they create the fucking enemies. That's why they're painting Russia as the Soviet Union and Putin as Vlad the Impaler.

The BNC/JD Democratic party wing sounds like the democratic party with some mild steroids. Once they run out of those mild steroids, they'll turn into the same thing we have now.

These two parties have phucked the people for so long and now the people behind BNC/JD want people to elect more republicans and democrats to solve the problem. Screw them and screw that.

Bummer, I was trying to be objective.

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44 users have voted.

Comments

gulfgal98's picture

That is just how bad it is. Al, you have convinced me that you were right all along.

Our Peace vigil disbanded early last summer due to the other two remaining members aging out. I have thought seriously about starting a Peace vigil of one because I believe it is extremely important. My main hurdle is that my SO is very opposed to me going solo.

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28 users have voted.

"I don't want to run the empire, I want to bring it down!" ~Dr. Cornel West "...isn't the problem here that the government takes on, arbitrarily and without justification, an adversarial attitude towards its citizenry?" ~CantStoptheMacedonianSignal

Big Al's picture

@gulfgal98 I'd join you. As it is, I'm in the same boat. But I'm with ya, I'm going to start my own peace vigil here when the farmer's market starts up. Go down there with a small table and chair and just engage anyone who wants to engage.
The more people that know the truth the better.

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27 users have voted.
gulfgal98's picture

@Big Al even with many self described conservatives. The key is to have a conversation and to listen to what they have to say too. I am thinking about printing out a fact sheet with references to hand out so people can check it out for themselves. It may not change the world, but knowledge is power and I hope we can spread that knowledge.

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22 users have voted.

"I don't want to run the empire, I want to bring it down!" ~Dr. Cornel West "...isn't the problem here that the government takes on, arbitrarily and without justification, an adversarial attitude towards its citizenry?" ~CantStoptheMacedonianSignal

earthling1's picture

@gulfgal98 @gulfgal98 I will come and help.
Sorry gulfgal, this was meant for Big Al.

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Big Al's picture

@earthling1 I'll pm you if I do. Thanks.

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Creosote.'s picture

@gulfgal98
and especially if it appeared here too, more than once.
Also perhaps a bold-type version introducing the idea that could be put up on telephone poles, like the anti-fascist ones that have been appearing up on Capitol Hill in Seattle recently.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@gulfgal98 Are you in Florida? If so, pm me and we can chat, see what we might do.

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1 user has voted.

The part of John Edwards could easily be played by a burnt out light bulb.
--strollingone

The issue is patriotism. You've got to get back to your planet and stop the Commies. All it takes is a few good men.
--Q

Unabashed Liberal's picture

Zack Exley, when I went over to check out the BNC website--I thought from MoveOn. I was right.

From Zack Exley, Wikipedia:

. . . In 2004, he was the Director of Online Communications and Organizing on John Kerry's presidential campaign and, according to British press reports, he directed Internet operations for the UK Labour party's re-election campaign in 2005. In both cases, the campaigns' opponents attacked Exley as a controversial figure, hoping to make his hiring a campaign issue.[7]

Exley was Organizing Director at MoveOn.org during the group's campaign to prevent the Iraq War, and during its controversial involvement with the Dean campaign. He was criticized then too, for "rigging" the "MoveOn Primary" in favor of Dean—a charge the group rejected.[8] . . .

After the 2016 United States Presidential election Exley along with other members of the 2016 presidential campaign of Bernie Sanders, Cenk Uygur of The Young Turks and Kyle Kulinski created the Justice Democrats in 2017 to try to fix the Democratic Party and take on President Donald Trump.[13]

I thought their gig was to start an independent or third party-like movement. How many organizations will these folks stop at? First OR, now these two new efforts. Personally, I would be very circumspect of this outfit.

Mollie


"If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went."--Will Rogers

“When the narrative at the heart of a system of rule falls apart, when the flow of history runs counter to the story told by those in power, then we know the entire edifice is crumbling under the weight of its own contradictions.

The political crisis arrives when the people sense that the prevailing order is built on a foundation of oppressions and lies. The rulers panic, scrambling to reweave the matrix of fables and myths that justify their waning supremacy.

At such points in history, the truth is up for grabs – and a change of regime is in the offing.”

____Glen Ford, Black Agenda Report

[my italics and reparagraphing]

Taro
Taro, SOSD

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26 users have voted.

"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it."
--George Bernard Shaw, Irish Dramatist & Socialist
"We [corporations] are the government!" Actor John Colicos (1978)

Phoebe Loosinhouse's picture

@Unabashed Liberal

I just read an interesting article about how the consultancy contracts pretty much ate up the DNC money bags leaving little to devote to actual down ticket campaigns. I'll have to poke around and see if I can dig it up again. This is one reason for my skepticism about reform from within the Democratic Party - I think a lot of that consulting had to do with how to advance centrist, Third Way, pro-corporate agendas while still providing just enough lip service to keep the progs hanging around the fringes and voting. Mentioned was a quiet effort to get a Terry McAuliffe campaign tooled up for 2020 by one of the usual suspects.

Can you imagine that? Virginia's triumvirate of McAuliffe, Kaine and Warner have to be three of the most unexciting, boring candidates in history. IMO, he McAuliffe) would be a Third Way/Clintonian Dream candidate, but he doesn't check any identity politics boxes so they would have to have to have a powerhouse in that regard for the VP position. Say- How about Chelsea? Or Michele? Magic!

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16 users have voted.

" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "

gulfgal98's picture

@Phoebe Loosinhouse I just threw up in my mouth.

Mentioned was a quiet effort to get a Terry McAuliffe campaign tooled up for 2020 by one of the usual suspects.

The scandal riddled Terry McAuliffe? The Democratic Clinton pary love them scandals, don't they? The arrogance and hubris of these people knows no bounds.

Of course, we all know the Democratic Clinton party loves Terry McAuliffe. In addition to all of his scandals, McAuliffe was a prodigious fund raiser, often using questionable tactics.

In the early 90s, really big money began to pour into the DNC. McAuliffe recruited robust donations from Arco and Chevron, Entergy and Enron, Phillip Morris and Monsanto, Boeing and Lockheed, Citibank and Weyerhaeuser. Many of these corporations had all but abandoned the Democrats during the Reagan era. McAuliffe lured them back with promises of favorable treatment by a new generation of anti-regulatory Democrats attuned to the special needs of multinational corporations. This was the mulch bed from which the Clinton presidency took root.

The Democratic Clinton party can go to hell.

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23 users have voted.

"I don't want to run the empire, I want to bring it down!" ~Dr. Cornel West "...isn't the problem here that the government takes on, arbitrarily and without justification, an adversarial attitude towards its citizenry?" ~CantStoptheMacedonianSignal

TheOtherMaven's picture

@gulfgal98
Virginia has a "one and done" rule for Governors, so he can't run for re-election. But if he thinks he can just continue to fail upward....

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0 users have voted.

There is no justice. There can be no peace.

Alligator Ed's picture

Thom Hartman is another good example of sell out as is Van Jones plus many more. Al, you are entirely right: failing to call out war as bad is cowardly. Just as Obama was cowardly on not naming Jihadist terrorists as cowardly (especially since he and W created them).

Is it delusion, self-hypnosis, brainwashing, or what keeping so many well-intending people to believe that anything good will come from the DemonRATic Party? If "Obamacare lite" passes then so many people are of the Repugnant persuasion will either vote Democratic (as the lead cartoon indicates) or not vote at all that Dems might gain in formerly Red areas. But with the Bernie wing of the Democratic party abandoning it continually, the Dems could well be replaced by Repugnants. This of course would create a dramatic turnaround in political geography. But this might also be an opportunity for new 3rd parties to win a few seats at state and national level--a start. Remodeling the ossified system of ours requires jackhammers and grinding wheels and chisels (perhaps a bit of dynamite too).

JusticeDemocrats may be as spineless as the Corpradems they despise.

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OLinda's picture

Whatever we do there has to be a lot of people on board the good ship Lollipop

I like it, Al. The Good Ship Lollipop Party. Smile

Thank you for the essay.

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16 users have voted.

- - - -
If you don't like the Mafia, why don't you join it and change it from the inside?

mimi's picture

@OLinda
by that expression "A Good Ship Lollipop Party". Referring to this?
The real Good Ship Lollipop
When it comes to Lollipop I have that song from "Stand by me" in my ears. To me these are some of the better memories I have, my son and me loved that song and movie back then. No cynicism yet. We were new to the US and had no clue about politics (still really haven't today).

hmm, all I have is that I would "stand by him": Lawrence Wilkerson

I am still listening to it and again wished there were a transcript. I think the interview was produced in 2015 and so far I would say what he said back then still is valid today.

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11 users have voted.

"History is what the present chooses to remember" - Carl Becker

gulfgal98's picture

@mimi I appreciate Wilkerson's honesty about his own role in the Iraq invasion and I suspect that is why he keeps warning us about the perils of empire. What Wilkerson is doing is giving us some (probably not all) insight into how the deep state operates. While we cannot undo the past, we can try to prevent it from going further down the road.

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12 users have voted.

"I don't want to run the empire, I want to bring it down!" ~Dr. Cornel West "...isn't the problem here that the government takes on, arbitrarily and without justification, an adversarial attitude towards its citizenry?" ~CantStoptheMacedonianSignal

@gulfgal98
we have about the machinations of the Deep State, comes from its ex-members and apostates. I'm thinking of people like William Binney, Edward Snowden, Thomas Drake, John Perkins, Sybil Edmonds, and any number of other bold truth-tellers.. Col. Patrick Lang and Paul Craig Roberts come to mind, as examples of well-respected insiders who have dared to venture outside the bowels of the System to which they once were loyal, and to reveal their knowledge to the public... often at the cost of great personal sacrifice. We owe these people a large debt of gratitude, because they are the real American heroes, as opposed to all the ersatz heroes we can see any day of the week on our corporate-owned, and highly-manipulated teevee shows.

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native

ovals49's picture

Any popular movement that is large enough to overtake the duopolistic system that we live under will be subsumed by the duopoly. Co-opted, sheepdoged, propagandized, bought off, fragmented, imprisoned, tortured or just plain stomped into the ground; whatever it takes. First and foremost power protects its power, without mercy or ethical considerations.

In the same way that most Americans believe in their own exceptional importance in the world, many good people cling to the belief in the essential goodness of all humans and see the barbarity and violence that permeates humanity as the result of lost and wayward tortured souls. The simpler explanation is that humans have "succeeded" in dominating the planet and subjecting all other life forms to their subservience due to their essentially violent and selfish nature. Natural selection run amok. The worst among us have ascended to positions of power and have no intention of letting go.

As individuals we can choose to live differently, but we shouldn't expect the comfort of a lot of company in that endeavor.

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24 users have voted.

"Humanity is just an evolutionary cul de sac."
George Carlin

LeChienHarry's picture

@ovals49 That the current administration (need better word here), does so badly, the DemElite will be regarded as a safe haven and the electorate will zag back to them.

No matter who takes Trump's place, now or later, what will keep the folks watching, questioning, making those elected and in powerful positions, accountable?

Even this wave will burn out I fear, out of exhaustion, too much, too long, whatever.

Engaging and staying engaged is surely part of the answer.

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You may choose to look the other way, but you can never say again you did not know. ~ William Wiberforce

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SnappleBC's picture

@LeChienHarry that it's likely there'll be some pillar-to-post movement... that's been going on for a while. But I think voters are slowly wising up and beginning to realize that neither party is a safe port in the storm. How long it will take until that realization reaches critical mass (or will we ever get there) is anyone's guess. What I know is that my two sons are very different with very different social circles and both see systemic corruption as a "gee duh" sort of comment. Neither trusts MSM. They didn't get that from my parenting as I was fully swilling the kool-aid while I raised them.

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11 users have voted.

A lot of wanderers in the U.S. political desert recognize that all the duopoly has to offer is a choice of mirages. Come, let us trudge towards empty expanse of sand #1, littered with the bleached bones of Deaniacs and Hope and Changers.
-- lotlizard

k9disc's picture

@ovals49 .

The Left has to build something. Has to remain in the affirmative, focused and flexible towards a goal.

All Establishment forces have to do is tear it down.

It really makes me appreciate abolitionists, populists, and progressives back in the day that built something humane out of this complex machine.

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21 users have voted.

“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu

dkmich's picture

@k9disc @k9disc

It is easier for us to sabotage the establishment than it is to build something. It is why they don't want primaries, Ralph Nader, Bernie Sanders or the Greens. I remind everyone, Hillary lost despite 99% of the billionaires on the globe being on her side.

She tears Bernie a new one. This one is about 20 minutes.

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k9disc's picture

@dkmich ?

We got a bunch of corporate dictators in waiting. Economists and the Masters of the Universe are dying for the day that belief in self governance, or even the facade of self governance, blinks out of existence.

They got all kinds of plans for that. It's the AEI and Heritage Foundation's (or the neocons/neolibs) wet dream.

I think we need to have something lying around and I think corporate needs a mighty big black eye before the shoe drops so we can avoid their guaranteed hegemony. They are REALLY close, IMO. Drumpf is like a short fuse or an emergency pressure valve that's never been tested.

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13 users have voted.

“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu

@dkmich Debbie did rip Sanders a new ass.
Thanks so much for that vid.

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gendjinn's picture

@ovals49 "Any popular movement that is large enough to overtake the duopolistic system that we live under will be subsumed by the duopoly. "

Erm, I think a movement big enough to win, will actually win. A movement not big enough to win could be subsumed, but surely not one large enough to win?

I sense defeatism.

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thanatokephaloides's picture

@gendjinn

Erm, I think a movement big enough to win, will actually win. A movement not big enough to win could be subsumed, but surely not one large enough to win?

I sense defeatism.

It took the barbarians several tries over several centuries to bring the Roman Empire (Western) down, too. It was only when the Visi-Goths were "big enough to win" possession of Spain, and did so, that the Burgundians and Franks became "big enough to win" control of the rest of the Western Empire. Until the Visigoths won their victory, the Romans were able to keep the Burgundians near the Empire's borders and the Franks east of the Rhine. (The latter was the claim to fame of one General Constantius Chlorus, which put him on the Imperial Throne from 305 to 306, and gave us his son Constantine the Great of notorious Christian fame.)

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5 users have voted.

"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

Creosote.'s picture

@thanatokephaloides @thanatokephaloides
also does strong work and has useful factual outreach. Here's a link: https://www.organicconsumers.org/about-oca -- and there's more info at Wikipedia. OCA is particularly active now against Monsanto, Bayer, Syngenta and the corporate push for GMO foods (like the "doesn't turn brown" Arctic apple, now being secretly introduced in ten midwest markets). Their take action emails are straightforward and informed.

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3 users have voted.

@ovals49
that TPTB currently hold on the US body politic is not an eternal state of affairs. Like all things mortal, it had its beginnings and it will have an end. There are now undeniable signs and portents that its end may be nigh. Do not despair all ye people of good faith. Evil has a known propensity for self-destruction, while the tendency of virtue is to endure.

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native

ovals49's picture

@ovals49

Like all things mortal, it had its beginnings and it will have an end.

The clock is ticking. Will we still have a habitable world by the time that happens? Will we collectively be able to abandon the mindlessly destructive production of stuff, consumption of resources and burning of fossil fuels that is already threatening an inevitable mas extinction event? I think not. After all, there is still money to be made by continuing the madness.

We'll leave it to Nature to clean up our mess and start over.

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2 users have voted.

"Humanity is just an evolutionary cul de sac."
George Carlin

Capitalism - and realizes the system is the enemy of the earth and its species, including us, it'll be both ineffective and an enabler of global monopoly capital which is, by definition and practice, imperialistic.
Occupy hasn't gone away but Occupy will not be able to displace the Money Party With Two Branches.
The RW understands that it's Capitalism vs Climate and chooses capitalism. The so-called centrists and liberals think tweaking around the edges will make us whole and happy. The New Deal showed forever that as soon as people-oriented programs and policies are enacted, capitalists will begin working, 24 hours a day, 365 days a year(usually with tax deductible staff) to undermine these small and medium sized victories. The USA is worse off now by many measures than it was in 1932 and the trend is anti-people and pro-profit at the expense of both the majority of the people and a habitable planet.
I'll support a movement - which I think is gathering but needs leadership - which envisions a sustainable future with equitable treatment of all people and respect for nature which sustains life. I call it EcoSocialism.

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33 users have voted.

"The justness of individual land right is not justifiable to those to whom the land by right of first claim collectively belonged"

thanatokephaloides's picture

@duckpin

I'll support a movement - which I think is gathering but needs leadership - which envisions a sustainable future with equitable treatment of all people and respect for nature which sustains life. I call it EcoSocialism.

The term anarcho-socialism applies at least as well, for the very reason specified by your own tagline:

"The justness of individual land right is not justifiable to those to whom the land by right of first claim collectively belonged"

We need rid of capitalists, yes. And every other flavor of bosses as well.

Smile

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5 users have voted.

"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

@thanatokephaloides a possible negative reaction to the "anarcho" lead in - maybe I'm wrong (hope so) but with people under 40 socialism is not the scare word it is for older people and "eco" is more positive than negative.
Personally I am happy with "anarcho."

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4 users have voted.

"The justness of individual land right is not justifiable to those to whom the land by right of first claim collectively belonged"

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@duckpin You're quite right. It's as important as the word imperialism.

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3 users have voted.

The part of John Edwards could easily be played by a burnt out light bulb.
--strollingone

The issue is patriotism. You've got to get back to your planet and stop the Commies. All it takes is a few good men.
--Q

orlbucfan's picture

-Invest trillions of dollars in new industries
-Invest trillions of dollars to rebuild and repair towns, cities and rural areas
-Spend exactly what it will take to repair our nation’s broken infrastructure
-Overhaul the IRS and the tax code

-------------------------------------------------------
To pull all this off, the bloated MICC has to be popped and deflated. Your words quoted here, not mine. That's just reading what you wrote. Give the anti-Bernie rap a rest!

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5 users have voted.

Some yahoos make me want to change species!

dkmich's picture

@orlbucfan

I really believed he meant it when he said he was in it to win. I know he would never want to be a spoiler, but a spoiler for whom? (who?)

I am posting this again because she is right about Bernie. While I admire the hell out of him, his policies, and some of the things he's done, he doesn't have to own his short comings along with his virtures. For us to do any less makes us a bot just like pick one: a) Obamabot 2) Hillarybot 3) Berniebot

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eyo's picture

@dkmich lol thanks, I am finally watching it. Right about 5m0s in the interview, Bernie says "The bottom line is, we want foreign policy to be made for the benefit of the American people, not the Russian people."

Our oligarchs, not Theirs.
Us or Them is where I say nope! Fts, I'm out. Here's my version "The bottom line is, we want foreign policy to be made for the benefit of everyone, not just billionaires."
But that's so last year I guess it's dead. Wow he is really spewing bullshit to Wolf Blitzer, that's too bad. Another reason to not watch TV, it's where good people go to cave in. Meh. Good rant video that one, thanks.

Peace & Love

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15 users have voted.

On a blog.

thanatokephaloides's picture

@dkmich

I don't like the fact that Bernie is letting us down either.
I really believed he meant it when he said he was in it to win. I know he would never want to be a spoiler, but a spoiler for whom? (who?)

I don't think Bernie is "letting us down". I think he got thoroughly fucked over by the PTB in the "Democratic" Party, the same exact people who fucked us over in 2016. The main reason Bernie's still working with the Dems at all (again IMHO and based on the tiny scraps of actual information out there) is to prevent the said clusterfuck from reaching the people of Vermont as much as possible, to whom he is honestly obligated in so many ways.

Don't address the symptom (Bernie as he stands today). Let's cure the disease (Hillary Clinton and the assholes who created her and back her today) instead! Cure the disease, and the symptom will disappear!

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5 users have voted.

"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

@thanatokephaloides
Bernie's "capitulation", as well as his tolerance of MIC-sponsored foreign policy, are just symptoms of the disease. The only political environment Bernie knows is the one in which he rose to prominence, and in which he has established an officially recognized place. I find it perfectly understandable that he would choose not to abandon that position in favor of some hypothetical third-party movement.

If I'd been Bernie, I would have seized the moment, split the Party, and devil take the hindmost. But I'm not him, and neither am I a sitting US Senator of long standing, with a lot of influence to lose.

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7 users have voted.

native

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@thanatokephaloides Here's the thing: we can't listen to Bernie while he's compromised. We can't follow him.

He's obviously under the control of the Clinton machine and has been since last June--whether voluntarily or not doesn't matter. At least, it doesn't matter in any practical way.

When I see him talking, I don't pay much more attention than I would to a hostage praising his captors on video. I feel sad that he's in that condition, but I can't help him. And he sure as hell can't help me. If he ever gets free, I'll be glad. Meanwhile, there's a lot of more important things to think about.

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4 users have voted.

The part of John Edwards could easily be played by a burnt out light bulb.
--strollingone

The issue is patriotism. You've got to get back to your planet and stop the Commies. All it takes is a few good men.
--Q

dkmich's picture

I need to disagree. I am not as cynical as you towards these groups. I am not convinced their motives are not well meant. Even Chris Hayes makes the case that we have to take control locally and work for 40 years like the neocons did to overthrow the rest of the system.

As I said, I believe in options - the more the better. I think attacking on multiple fronts is a credible military tactic, and I'm all for blowing up the establishment that has failed the country so miserably.

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Big Al's picture

@dkmich it's more that I just will not compromise on U.S. imperialism, war, and the killing that goes with it. I just read an article about the Mai Lai anniversary on Counterpunch that detailed the atrocities that occurred on that day. 182 women killed, 173 kids, 56 babies. That was 49 years ago and this country is still killing innocent women and kids in faraway lands. These are human beings.

If these groups are serious, they need to change their tune on imperialism and supporting the democratic party and in effect, the duopoly, then they might be an option. But right now, they're in the way.

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gulfgal98's picture

@Big Al

That was 49 years ago and this country is still killing innocent women and kids in faraway lands. These are human beings.

In another essay on whether or not Donald Trump was a patriot, I posted the following. I think we all should start thinking about our world in terms of the human beings who inhabit it. All human beings.

Patriotism or being a patriot means that you place a country above the people. So it is possible that Trump and his supporters could see him as a patriot. But none of us here would ever see Trump as a humanist who cares more about people.

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11 users have voted.

"I don't want to run the empire, I want to bring it down!" ~Dr. Cornel West "...isn't the problem here that the government takes on, arbitrarily and without justification, an adversarial attitude towards its citizenry?" ~CantStoptheMacedonianSignal

thanatokephaloides's picture

@dkmich

As I said, I believe in options - the more the better. I think attacking on multiple fronts is a credible military tactic, and I'm all for blowing up the establishment that has failed the country so miserably.

By any means necessary. Indeed.

This is one reason why I haven't given up on these movements, although I don't really trust them around the proverbial glass corner.

The force necessary to overthrow oligarchical rule in this country, Russia, China, Britain, France, etc., needs to be gleaned from everywhere it can be found, accumulated, and applied.

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"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

@dkmich -the notion that you have to start small, at the local level, at school boards. Demand less, aspire to less. It's the perfect bourgeois trap designed to keep the status quo in place. There is no law that says that "change must be slow" or "gradual" or "small." Perhaps it's the fact that I came of age fighting for my rights as a gay man and then my life and the lives of my friends during the AIDS crisis. If Act Up had adopted this bourgeois attitude, tens of thousands more would have died.

The problem with that attitude is the real hurdle we face in any movement for change- the resistance of the bourgeoisie. They are the real obstacle. They will spout the right words, but lack the courage to actually take a stand. It's understandable because struggle is something exterior to their experience. It is the stuff of movies and novels and uplifting life stories of "those people." MLK recognized this. And I've lived it myself. The potential problem with these new movement groups is that they are either run by or will quickly be coopted by the bourgeoisie. Cenk Ugyur is never going to gain courage. Hell, he didn't have the courage to vote for Jill Stein in CA, for christ's sake.

Disclaimer- not all members of the bourgeoisie are social/political cowards, but most are. Also, one can adopt the bourgeois mindset without being a member of the bourgeoisie.

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ZimInSeattle's picture

'Democrat' in it is suspect.

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"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." - JFK | Bernie would have WON!

gendjinn's picture

The Whigs were replaced by the Republicans in six years, the Democrats birth occurred over a similar timeframe. The Dems can be taken over from the inside and they can be replaced by a third party. In the right circumstances. Circumstances we have today.

Now you could be out there with your shoulder to the wheel helping bring that change about. Instead of telling us that there is nothing to be done because the Dems cannot be reformed and third party takes decades.

You are correct about US Imperialism and the MIIC, eliminating the CIA and cutting the budget by 75% are required. I am not giving up on that fight. Yes BNC/JD are taking the same objectionable position the Sanders campaign did. But that is still a much better deal than the status quo on both economics and MIIC.

By 2018 one of two things will have happened. The BNC/JD will have successfully taken over the Dems and gotten their candidates through a majority of primaries, or they have been defeated. The people in those movements will still have those same problems that the corporate Dems will not fix. If they are defeated, they are going to go a third party. All that is missing is the leader, during the next 12 months of attempts to take over the Dems those leaders will emerge.

Half the country is poor. The people are waking up because of their problems living. They are not going back to sleep until their problems are addressed. Whether that is within a reformed Dems, a third party or a revolution is yet to be seen but change is coming now.

So get out there, and get stuck in, talk to people and push for what you believe in because this is the tipping point and it is certainly not the time to be sitting on your hands bemoaning the state of affairs. Get out there with your lever and move the world!

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eyo's picture

@gendjinn Yeah!

Now you could be out there with your shoulder to the wheel helping bring that change about.

because of course! Just fill in the out there part, check off the wheel thingy, and bring that change about! Electoral politics for the win!

Pretty sure there was a farm market for peace mentioned at some point, but go on. I see hamsters. lol Thanks for Al's pep talk gendjinn, that made my day! Go get 'em, everybody has to do something, eh?

Peace & Love

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gendjinn's picture

@eyo The weekend? Civil Rights? Whinging on the sidelines? Or was it a different approach?

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eyo's picture

@gendjinn pardon my sarcasm, but your pep talk did cheer me up. I met Donna Brazile in the basement of some S.F. Castro District church in the 80s, when I was a baby activist. I can show you photos and stuff if you demand proof I was around then, I don't have one of her but I have lots of Gay Pride. Now I got nothin', not even a fair vote in California.

To me the Brazile gang seemed greedy back then, now I think she is corrupt to the core. "...as a persecuted Christian I know what it's like..." omfg I could not believe her when she said that about passing debate info to the campaign. Double-down lie on national TV, she is going somewhere stabby with that one. San Francisco in the 90s is why I hate the Clintons, lol just kidding, but not really. Look at "us" now, and look at "them". Clintons don't look so poor or homeless to me, don't say progress because there are a bunch of wealthy hipsters stinking up the joint. Nope, do better.

Some people believe money makes the world go 'round as if it's perfectly natural. The Clintons and their ilk do, I don't. It has no place in politics, none whatsoever, that's what I think. I don't like any lobbyists, left right or center. Like I said before, nothing but a purge from the top down (they can resign) will bring about change, because the new faces get chewed up by the machine no matter how good-hearted they start out. Money money money. I've seen it over and over again, haven't you? Call it whinging if you want, I call it truth to power.

The established system is based on seniority, that is why there are so many damned old politicians. Too many are not leaders, they're retreads clinging to power. Tear it down immediately, that's what I say. Begin anew right now, none of this waiting around forty years, I already did that. Biggrin

Peace & Love

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gendjinn's picture

@eyo
It has been apparent for 20 years that the Dems are paid to lose. The strength, vigor and success of "the resistance" make it glaringly obvious now.

I think it is unlikely the Dems/DNC can be reformed, but I've been wrong before. If the BNC/JD/Whomever accomplish it, fantastic, we win a major battle and can now focus on the Republicans. If they lose, they will do it by 2018 and that energy goes into a third party.

There is a tide in the affairs of men, and after 25 years here I see the opportunity for change that has never been as strong before. The Sanders campaign woke a lot of people up and the problems they face are not going away.

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thanatokephaloides's picture

@gendjinn

You are correct about US Imperialism and the MIIC, eliminating the CIA and cutting the budget by 75% are required. I am not giving up on that fight.

Don't forget "the other CIA", the Drug Enforcement Administration.

We need rid of that insidious cancer NOW. The CIA isn't supposed to be acting within the US; the FBI isn't supposed to operate outside of it, by Federal Law. And the laws making those demands are there for a very good reason: we need to insure that spies and cops remain under strict civilian control.

The DEA routinely does both, and is openly permitted to do so. This is a BAD. IDEA.

And, of course, that's just for starters.

Diablo

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"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

@thanatokephaloides
all these "National Security" outfits into a single entity -- toss them all into a massive alphabet soup of agencies, to be known henceforth as the CIAFBIDHSNSADEA. I'm sure someone could arrange these letters into a pronounceable word or two, and so everyone's particular paranoia could be centralized, and greatly simplified.

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native

Strife Delivery's picture

While I had hope for BNC and I will watch them closer here in the future, I do have something though that I will comment on.

This may just be my own take on writing and approaching a market, but I'm not surprised they didn't include the word "imperialism" though we may have different reasons for that exclusion.

Peace and Human Rights:

Establish a foreign policy based on diplomacy, international law, and human rights. End the wars and drone attacks, cut military spending by at least 50% and close the 700+ foreign military bases that are turning our republic into a bankrupt empire. Stop U.S. support and arms sales to human rights abusers, and lead on global nuclear disarmament.

This was Stein's section on her site for 2016 who I voted for. I will give props for the inclusion of empire. But nothing on the term imperialism, though she has an easier to grasp "end the wars". To me, I view that as similar as "war of choice". Now, now...I definitely know how that can be easily construed and twisted into whatever power structure wants that to mean.

Vietnam, had no choice
Korea, no choice
Iraq, no choice,
etc. etc. etc.

I get that. I guess put another way, if you walk up to people and say end U.S. imperialism, how many may give you a blank stare when the word imperialism rolls out? But saying "End the wars!" or "No more Vietnams and Iraqs!" (Which in people's minds were useless wars with no real purpose and tons of bloodshed) is perhaps just an easier means to get that message out there. Hell, even Bush senior during his Gulf expedition had to say "This won't be another Vietnam".

In 2016, terms such as oligarchy became popularized because of the message of Bernie and him hitting it over and over again. You would need a high-profile individual such as that in 2020 to introduce imperialism/empire into the American lexicon.

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earthling1's picture

Naming a third party "The Disinfectant Party" makes it clear what it's purpose is. To cleanse the entire party of frauds. Who among the 99% would not click on a Disinfectant Party website just to see what it's about?
Vote Republican in 2018. They already have complete control of our government now. How much worse could it get?
Here is a great opportunity to drive out all the Third Way turncoats and then we can begin filling those seats with whom we want in 2020.
Anything less is futile, Imho.
In the lead up to 2020, the party name will shift to " The Credexit Party".
Again, the name says it all. The party platform would be; We know we cannot win, because it's all rigged against us. But we can fight back by refusing to shop their corporate stores. By refusing to continue to borrow from them.
By cutting up those credit cards and moving your money to a Credit Union.
The candidacy itself would act as a bully pulpit, spreading the message without the mechanisms of the MSM.
How much would it cost to field a candidate for POTUS in every state?
Would we even need to field one in every state to get the word out?
The fact that we are upfront about having NO chance of winning would get everyones attention at least. Best case scenario is the 99% would agree and elect our candidates and give Corporate America a big o' black eye.
I'm going to keep pushing this meme until I'm banned from here also.
But I'm wide open to suggestions.
Thanks for at least considering my proposal.

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7 users have voted.
shaharazade's picture

and the Repug's doesn't do anything. Who believes the so called 'progressive reformers' anyway. If you look at the number of people who are drifting or running away from the R and D duopoly it tells a hopeful story. 40 years someone up thread said to rebuild the Demorat's? Well the Demorat's have had at least 30? years of this false remaking the party. After the shock and awe of the Bushies/Cheney regime the people gave them a clear majority starting in 2006-2008.

I remember the so called Demoratic pols, the Dem. apparatchik including the progressive pundirt's of the fake left, Kos, Cenk, Rachael, Keith and the Thom's all proclaimed the RW was dead as a door nail and that the country was now liberal make that progressive. The weasel word they cooked up for recasting the DLC/Third Way New Demorat's as 'moderate' and 'socially liberal' vs.bigoted theocratic pig ignorant deplorable's.

My point is that only a minority of the population believe the Red vs Blue bs. that's being hoisted on us. Hillary lost and not because of the so called lefty purist's but because people has had enough of this complicit thoroughly corrupt rotten to the core duopoly. The global ruling class along the corporate mouthpieces that write and control the story line of us vs. them have no credibility these days.

Fake news and Orwellian propaganda cannot cover the stark reality we're living in. When your water is killing you and you cannot make enough money to feed or house yourself or your children are being summarily slaughtered by the goon squad robo-cops how can people believe that this is what democracy looks like. Looks to me like most of us are aware of this but feel we're powerless to stop it. It's a binary, artificially intelligent, ass backward world by design.

I'm not too worried about third party's forming or political saviors arising to take us to the democratic promised land. I think it's hard right now to see beyond the edges of the rulers of the universe and their inevitable, endless corporate imperialist global 'world as we find it'. As long as they set the story and the agenda and we the people everywhere dance to their tune, they will stay in power. I guess I just think that to go looking for solutions that involve the same players who brought us here is an exercise in futility.

People need to also get to a point where they see that the issues are all connected. Nobody ever talks about why their are millions of refugees or immigrants fleeing the places we decide to invade, democratize via 'humanitarian interventions'. Cause and effect has been shattered and instead of solidarity with each other people seem stuck in the fake divides and generated fear and loathing. When austerity, endless bloody global wars, living in a police state, or disastrous weather isn't scaring the pant's off you enough for compliance they drag out the nukes of mass destruction and Russia/Putin.

Ask me the only way to stop this insanity is to realize they are not invincible and their power is consolidated/centralized globally by thinking that the only possibility for humanity and the planet is going to come through political revolution here in the USA! USA! USA! I think helping people by countering the fear locally in your community be it a big city or a rural town is a start. Expanding your imagination of what is possible when humans stop hating and fearing each other and stop believing that the divisive lines drawn by the perpetrators are real.

Pols and leaders even the new latest progressive faces that operate under this horror show are not going to do a damn thing. The constant rehashing of the heroes and villains who betrayed us, lost or won in a rigged oligarchical global system of death and misery does not help. Opening your eyes to the positive rejection of their inevitable power going on by ordinary people globally and believing in the possibility of another way forward is a start. People say to me but the Republican deplorable's hate government and want to destroy our system. Well shit man the Demorat's already have. They are complicit between the two party's they have licked the platter clean. There is nothing left to save or reform.

Real resistance is not futile it's necessary. It's time has come. I too hate the government were living under. As OPOL said 'Bag o'rats. I'm now an anarchist'. We have here in Portland a group of anarchist's who are donning black masks and fixing the endless pot holes in the city streets. A friend said these are not anarchist's they're hippies. Someone replied 'anarchist's are the 'new hippies'.

Think global, Act local.

Or as OWS said
No Justice, No Peace + This is not what democracy looks like.

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gulfgal98's picture

@shaharazade You always say what I am thinking and in such clear language. Good

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"I don't want to run the empire, I want to bring it down!" ~Dr. Cornel West "...isn't the problem here that the government takes on, arbitrarily and without justification, an adversarial attitude towards its citizenry?" ~CantStoptheMacedonianSignal

thanatokephaloides's picture

@shaharazade

Real resistance is not futile it's necessary. It's time has come. I too hate the government were living under. As OPOL said 'Bag o'rats. I'm now an anarchist'. We have here in Portland a group of anarchist's who are donning black masks and fixing the endless pot holes in the city streets. A friend said these are not anarchist's they're hippies. Someone replied 'anarchist's are the 'new hippies'.

Anarchists were pretty much the old hippies, too!

And I say: "It's about damn time!", having been an Anarchist when it wasn't popular! Smile

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"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

eyo's picture

@shaharazade I don't even know if small gestures work anymore, but I put a little No Racism sign in a window pane after having a meltdown with the neighbors recently. Diversity is the spice of life :-D. I don't want to attract bad energy but felt like putting something up. Kinda like No Solicitors, lol. No Racists. That's just me, I also have a Fuck Hate hoodie, but thought that somewhat out-of-bounds for the moment. There are plenty of BIG pick-ups with yuge flags flying out the back around here. Some of 'em like to give me "rolling thunder" if no cops are around when I'm out walking. Lovely.

I notice my "local" acts go about one step, or maybe two, and then it's conglomerates supplying the goods again. It's like there's no "there" there, but keep going. Commerce happens no matter what. I'm not very excited about this new "transitional" organic stamp for food labeling either. "Sort of" organic? "On it's way to being" organic? I smell corporate organic but maybe there is more to it, like incremental sustainability or something. Better hurry up.

Home grown is all right with me , home grown is the way it should be. /neilyoung
Thanks

Peace & Love
P.S. This is a sawmill town, hate treehuggers like me since Earth First action days. Koch Bros., Georgia Pacific, they are right down the road in my sight. In fact I think the Healdsburg mill shutdown recently and moved up here. Fair-paying jobs for mill-workers, yes, but they get killed on the job like OSHA doesn't exist, same as it ever was. No clue about environmental ecocide of the watershed, Chamber of Commerce directs everything but you'd never know it reading the newspaper, gentrification marches on. We're like everyone everywhere, pretty much. ta

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thanatokephaloides's picture

@eyo

I'm not very excited about this new "transitional" organic stamp for food labeling either. "Sort of" organic? "On it's way to being" organic? I smell corporate organic but maybe there is more to it, like incremental sustainability or something.

What it means is that although grown under organic conditions this year, the ground it was grown in doesn't yet qualify for full organic status. To qualify for full organic status, the ground needs to have done without artificial chemicals (fertilizers and pesticides) for a term of years, usually 3 years. So, say, the veggie in your hand was grown without non-organic inputs this year, but the ground has only gone without them for 2 years; that's "transitional organic".

Otherwise, farms transitioning to organic production are stuck with 3 years where their produce can't fetch any more money than regularly grown stuff while still facing the extra expense of organic production, leaving those farmers in a bad way, and this in turn causes fewer farmers to serve the organic market, which drives prices through the moon!

transitional organic website (WARNING: Written mostly in Lawyerese, but does contain some useful information if you can wade in that far!)

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"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

shaharazade's picture

@thanatokephaloides if the farm their grown on is listed and it's local and not a Big Ag.farm. I'd rather buy 'transitional' produce then Dole's so called organic monocropping giant plantation grown bananas. It takes years to get the soil declared organic. The main reason a lot of our local organic farmers are billed as transitional is that it coast's a fortune to get organic certification. I buy local eggs that are not organically certified. These egg producers are really local list all of the feed sources which are GMO free and are pasture raised come from local ranchers etc.

I guess as a life long health food nut I have learned which farms, orchards and growers I trust. Some are in Washington some in California but mostly I try to stick with locally grown. I try to consider also how faraway the source is. A lot of organically grown food has been shipped from South America, Mexico, China and points beyond. Why does my so called progressive healthy grocery chain only carry spring lettuce mix from AZ?

I think it's because they are now owned by some vulture capitalist's in CA and are into growth and maximizing profit for there new overlords. The new CEO is a former CEO of Starbucks. Small local cannot meet the demands of their growing chain of stores We still have two co-ops and lots of farmers market's here so I buy most of my produce in smaller venues. People's lists the farm and location and carry's fair trade only for imports like bananas or coffee.

I'm sorry your surrounded by racist flag waving assholes. Oregon has it's share too. Where I live not so many of these assholes but plenty of yuppie greedy who want the homeless and poor moved out of here and drive jacked up earth destroying SUV's and tell demonstrator's to get a job. Mammon is their religion even though they profess to be socially liberal progressives. I don't know which of these groups of assholes are worse.

We're thinking of moving to a small coastal rural town as Portland is becoming intolerable where it used to be affordable and liveable with mixed demographics. It is now trying to morph into San Fransisco. I think it all boils down to disaster capitalism run amok. There seems to be no where to run or hide so I guess people of good spirit need to stand their ground and push back where ever you live.

I was replying to eyo but missed the reply. However you where involved in the transitional discussion so I'll leave it where I parked it accidentally.

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eyo's picture

@shaharazade , @thanatokephaloides great conversation, thanks. I thought I was part of the radical "Organic Food Movement" of the 70s and 80s lol. Mrs. Bitterman wants to know, where were those farmers then? Making money? For who? Never mind, go on. No use looking back eh? Go forward, move ahead. Now that "local" farm markets can take SNAP and get $5 bucks for a head of "artisanal" lettuce, and $12 for a dozen ethical eggs, go on.

I'm pretty sure the local farmer I worked with last year (there was one, yay!) could benefit from the transitional label, but I think he won't try. He just hates bureaucracy, it's all such a big waste of time and he's just trying to feed people. He gets bare minimum licensing, sells everything for $2/lb, delivered right to the front door during the season, no bags no receipts no nothing but veggies. You can borrow a basket from them to weigh stuff, and I think they have paper bags for "normals" lol. For nine years they spent every Sunday feeding homeless down river in Guerneville. I know they're organic because I spent days brushing aphids off leaves last year. ;-D Namaste

Now, they are pretty well swamped helping aging family here and nearby, with dementia, Alzheimer, brain and memory stuff it robs parents of their independent life and really tears families up. I never had that problem myself but I can feel it. They have a big family but little support, it's weird. Thanks goodness for VA benefits, but for how long? All of us depend on Social Security. It's another thing I keep seeing all around too, bad healthcare system in collapse. I don't know what other people are looking at every day (oh wait a smartphone?), noticing every shitty thing is not fun. I wish I could go camping. Thanks.

Peace & Love

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shaharazade's picture

@eyo in the 70's i was a back to the land hippie Near Bandon Oregon who rented 2 acres and a couple of cabins in a decommissioned cranberry bog for 50$ a month. The land and house was owned by a couple who had moved to Alaska.I had a great vegetable garden and we even built a primitive green house out of driftwood and other salvaged material. I didn't sell my crops I did trade with others in the community.

Where were all these farmers back in the day? I think maybe many of them were farming.I have an old friend whose daughters are now grown up own and farm on the land their parents bought back in the 70's. They are doing okay Now I live in a city and still garden organically. I think Sonoma is a really expensive place to live. 12$ for organic eggs at a farmers market is outrageous. Lettuce at 5$ a head is also insane. My favorite farmers market is at People's Co-op and hardly any of the farmers there are certified organic or transitional. I can buy eggs there for 5-6 dollars a dozen and lettuce by the pound. For 20$ in season I can buy a huge bag of produce that keeps me going till the next Wednesday Market.

Do you have CSA's (Community Sustainable Agriculture) in Sonoma? I just looked up SCA's in my neighborhood and found there is a lot of these fairly close by. I'm going to check them out and join one if they are affordable.

Portland Area CSA Coalition
http://www.portlandcsa.org/about-pacsac/

We are a 501(c)3 non-profit organization. Our vision is a community where everyone eats local food, farmers thrive, and CSA is a household name. Our mission is to promote Community Supported Agriculture (CSA) by:

Directly connecting local CSA farmers with people
Providing farmers opportunities to learn and grow and meet their business and
sustainability goals.
Educating the public about the CSA experience and the benefits of healthy eating.

For Farmers

For farmers, we offer opportunities for networking and resource sharing through a listserv, on-farm events (November-March), and workshops. If you are a farmer or someone in the agricultural field interested in the our listserv or events.

They list all the farms urban and outside the city near us. I noticed that some of these farms are familiar and I buy from them via local co-ops and farmer's markets. Zenger Farm is a great one that has been around for decades. They may not have a Certified USDA Organic sticker but I trust their food.

http://www.portlandcsa.org/csa-directory/wpbdp_category/southeast-portland/

We also have an organization called Oregon Tilth. They certify food locally. They used to share an office space in a converted old house close by with Shah. They had a great garden in the back yard of the office/house. I don't know how expensive it is to get their certification.

https://tilth.org/

As Portland get's more and more gentrified and corporate I don't know if these local affordable food sources will survive. I hope so. Thanks for chatting about food and growing. You inspired me to look around in my city and see that their are alternatives to the over priced trendy yuppie supermarket chains that have been taken over by vulture capitalist investment firms from CA. I'm going to try and join a CSA if they are not to expensive. Has to cheaper then my local 'progressive' New Seasons grocery store is.

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eyo's picture

@shaharazade thanks for the reply, I remember New Seasons from IT work. I can keep going but not right now. Maybe we can start again abusing an Open Thread somewhere and trade stories about the old days, but also post alternatives available in our areas, that would be interesting I think.

Peace

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thanatokephaloides's picture

"Wars of choice". What the hell is that? That's like saying, "we will only fight the good and necessary wars". Bullshit, all wars are wars of choice by the rich and powerful. ALL WARS.

The only question being whose rich and powerful are making the choice.

As long as there are rich and powerful, anywhere, we will have wars. Not all of those wars were of American choice. Many were, of course, but not all.

The fact you point out here regarding wars of choice is an inevitable consequence of the existence of the boss class, anywhere. As long as some humans have the supposed "right" to tell other humans how they will live, there will be wars. Take that to the bank.

BTW: You're right about the use of the word "imperialism". These reform movements' leaders are showing us that they lack the cojones to do what they propose to do, by refusing to mention the principal disease by its name.

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"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

shaharazade's picture

@thanatokephaloides Even the biggie WW11 was a result of the wrong choices by world 'leaders' left over from the insane sick WW1. A battle of the 1% ruling class Victorian global empire left hanging around. Look at the still rich powerful crime families that supported and liked the Nazis. Them and their rich descendants are still lurking around and in power. You can't erase history but you sure as hell can read between the lines and see that the by-partisan global rulers, fascistic believers, have learned from history how to keep the masses at each others throats.

All of our current endless wars on terra are by choice. No nation state including Russia threatens our grasp on global dominance. We are the biggest bad asses ever! Is this something that should make people feel safe, proud or fearful? WTF people war is always by choice and never something that leads to anything other then power plays that kill us and the planet. Are we not the 'Family of Man' and women children all living things on earth?

Delve into history and all wars start with greedy territorial power and the worst impulses of human beings. Are we devolving? Hell yeah. When I look at the money spent on so called security by this country globally it makes me cry. It's so sick my mind cannot comprehend why anyone would think that the killing fields the USA! promotes and causes have a thing to do with 'security' and everything to do with destruction on a scale that blows one's mind.

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2 users have voted.

of effectively countering the MIC's policy of endless war, it would need to be very broadly based, bi-partisan, and as inclusive as possible. It would need to be widely perceived and promoted as a primarily nationalist cause, rather than as a leftist or progressive cause. I do not see the BNC platform as being necessarily helpful in this regard, because it ties anti-war sentiment (much of which originates on the Right) to all kinds of exclusively Leftist goals and policy proposals.

The BNC is an intrinsically partisan effort, so by its very nature it tends to be a divisive, rather than a unifying force. The MIC is a unified, bi-partisan force, and has been one for quite some time. To effectively counter it, an equally unified, bi-partisan force would be necessary.

It would need to include for example, Rand Paul and other libertarians of both the Left and the Right. It would need to include many fiscally conservative Republicans. It would need to include all manner of Deplorables whose politics might indeed be otherwise deplorable, but who nonetheless oppose US imperialism... and so on.

If it were possible for all these ideologically opposed groups to unite around the one thing we all agree on -- to end US military adventurism -- then there would be a very real chance of stopping the MIC in its tracks. Otherwise, not so much.

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8 users have voted.

native

divineorder's picture

with you on BNC because am seeing so little else in the works that I can support and at least they are working for some things I feel strongly about.

You know me, have worked for peace and against imperialism for many years.

You and I both know that short of some national strikes we are not going to get really significant shit done that will really rein in the Oligarchs influence on the military/security apparatus.

Was just reading about Ghandi and how his movement was studied by the US Civil Rights movement and how many decades it took. Meh. I realize we don't have that much time left.

All in for 3rd party that gets cranking, heh, I voted for Jill Stein in two different elections. Will continue to support Green candidates or any others where I see them as worth it.

But nah, hey, even though their platform needs work, for now I am going to continue to promote BNC until I see something better, learn more about them that convinces me to not, or give up on all because it all seems so fcking hopeless. At one time I thought kos was a leader but now know better. Maybe that's where I will end up with BNC.

Would love to see BNC et al can drag people along to a true post-partisan state. Just my two cents. Have a good one.

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3 users have voted.

A truth of the nuclear age/climate change: we can no longer have endless war and survive on this planet. Oh sh*t.

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

in particular for the Howard Dean movement, I suggested this exact idea to Jim Dean, and he pooh-poohed it.

It would be a good idea if you actually had an electoral system that wasn't entirely compromised by greed and fraud.

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4 users have voted.

The part of John Edwards could easily be played by a burnt out light bulb.
--strollingone

The issue is patriotism. You've got to get back to your planet and stop the Commies. All it takes is a few good men.
--Q

shaharazade's picture

@native @Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal via Howard Dean's local so called Dem. progressive movement here in Oregon. We went to many Dean meet ups in 2004. We went to a Howard Dean's DNC Multnomah Dem. party rally for the Democratic party in late 2006. Shah stood up after he was done with his rah,rah Dems. scripted speech and asked 'What should I tell people the liberals about what the Democrat's including Nancy Pelosi are going to do about the Bushies?' He said 'Tell them to vote for more Democrat's' and Shah said 'That's not not going to cut it.' at which point he tasered Shah with his eyeballs. It was an amazing sight to see as his eyes literally blazed at Shah's rejection of his rah,rah fake Dem. progressive rallying hustle. So please people here do not be lured back into the Dem. fold by fake progressives who will eventually show their true colors.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

I'm in a severe minority when I call for boycotts of elections and major changes to our political system,

Well, I'm with you. The only reason I want a third party is because we need some organization--and because, if we don't get some visibility soon, in a few years there won't be even the concept of a "left" in this country. Right now, all the people calling themselves and being called "the left" in the MSM are Hillarybots/Dems and Bernie Sanders--and Sanders is being horrible right now, exactly on the DC Dems' message, especially in regard to Russia and World War III.

I thought that bird was supposed to be a dove of peace.

So I don't know if we even need to care whether the concept of the left disappears--maybe we should just let it go. But we'll need some kind of infrastructure, if we want to do anything.

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3 users have voted.

The part of John Edwards could easily be played by a burnt out light bulb.
--strollingone

The issue is patriotism. You've got to get back to your planet and stop the Commies. All it takes is a few good men.
--Q

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

make electoral fraud impossible.

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3 users have voted.

The part of John Edwards could easily be played by a burnt out light bulb.
--strollingone

The issue is patriotism. You've got to get back to your planet and stop the Commies. All it takes is a few good men.
--Q

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

Hell, it's time the people rise up and protest the hell out of what is happening right now with Trump the Maniac and his Merry Band of Warmongers. Right now, the people should be in the streets demanding an end to ALL OF OUR WARS and U.S. imperialism in total.

The people who protest Trump are often also protesting against Putin. At the Women's March I saw a sign, all in pink, that said "I Don't Want Putin's Bitch." I guess calling a guy another guy's bitch is now part of feminist discourse. Never mind the homophobia and sexism, it's all for Old Glory and our pal Hillary.

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4 users have voted.

The part of John Edwards could easily be played by a burnt out light bulb.
--strollingone

The issue is patriotism. You've got to get back to your planet and stop the Commies. All it takes is a few good men.
--Q

least somewhat -- a national movement demanding an end to the two parties. EVERYONE knows both have something other on their minds than dealing with the People's and the nation's needs. It was 88% saying so in a recent poll, after years of it being 70% or so. If the Dept of Justice did its job both parties would have been destroyed as Rackets long ago.
We need to mobilize an inhidable pan-USAian, full-spectrum calling out of the -- not just the irrelevance of both parties, but their actual harm. Ideas of 'changing the system from within' are delusional and ludicrous at this point.
I'm talking 'action item' and not some rhetorical schtick. Make it so there's not a talking head or party representative who doesn't have to deal with that whenever they appear in public.
Include a massive deregistration by party drive do we see their 'self-identified' numbers fall to single digits.

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3 users have voted.