Occupy Trump - it's happening

I speculated in an article yesterday that from here on out all the way through the primaries, the general, Nov 8, and potentially beyond, we would se Occupy Trump every day. It's happening. The day after his Chicago Surprise, Herr Drumpf saw peace warriors protesting his rally in Kansas, MO. Opposing groups, cops gone wild, pepper spray, etc. More below.

Here is the link (I hope!) and the opening paragraphs:
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/mar/12/donald-trump-cancels-cinc...

Police used pepper spray on crowds outside a Donald Trump rally in Kansas City as the Republican frontrunner continued to face angry protests that a day earlier forced him to call off a major campaign appearance in Chicago.

As Trump’s electoral machine regrouped after a humiliation at the University of Illinois Chicago Pavilion, there were further disruptions inside the Midland Theatre in Missouri. Trump was just a few minutes into his speech on Saturday night when the protests began. “I’ve got plenty of time. ... We’re in no rush. We’re in no rush,” he told the crowd.

The protesters appear to be scattered throughout the theater and Trump remarked on how many were in the crowd, bemoaning they were taking seats from his supporters, “thousands” of whom were waiting outside.

Kansas City police confirmed pepper spray was used amid protests in the streets around the theater and also said a “fogger” was deployed to disperse “two large groups (200+) preparing to fight”.

Welcome to 1968 and Occupy Trump - the real fight for democracy. Elections matter. Stopping fascists before they win elections could be even more important. To paraphrase Ben Franklin, "a democracy, if you can keep it."

As this new phase - Occupy trump - is gathering steam, please keep a peaceful heart. Remember MLK, remember Ghandi. Keep a level head. Please do not get suckered by the MSM and the elites coming spin (same-old, same-old) of "Clutch pearls and be afraid of the protesters; we'll wipe them out so you can go back to your regularly scheduled programming."

Update: The right-wing meme is launching everywhere from their silos in the MSM. Here's The Hill with the feathery GOP chairman Priebus: http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/272800-priebus-violence-only-begets-...

GOP Chairman Reince Priebus condemned the violence that has broken out at Trump rallies in recent days and called on both parties to help calm tensions.

“While we have differences, our right to free speech should be just that: speech,” Priebus said in a statement. “Violence is never the answer. Violence only begets more violence.”
“Leaders and activists in both parties bear a responsibility to ensure that the discourse we engage in promotes the best of America,” he continued.

You'll see this "violence only begets violence" meme - it's a truly Orwellian beauty - in your MSM feeds every day from now on. Think of how Nixon used the human rights protests of the 60s to win the 1968 election.

Please don't get sucked into opposing our brave peace warriors, who are nonviolently resisting fascism. They're rowdy and there's some hooligans hiding among them, but they're OUR protesters fighting for OUR democracies. Buckle up, folks, it's gonna be a bumpy ride. Go Occupy Trump!

Peace be with us, if we work for it with peaceful hearts,
gerrit

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riverlover's picture

under in the Controversial subs, apparently Trump has now kinda threatened Sanders. That little bag of wingnuts are plotting counter demonstrations at Bernie and Hillary events. Things could get very weird.

There was also some discussion of assassination of Dem candidates. That subreddit may have been yanked. I can't find it to point now.???

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Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.

Gerrit's picture

in Yuuuuuuge red scare forthing. The fat is in the fire now, for sure. This new phenomenon of Occupy Trump will swing the whole primary. I guarantee it. Dem voters will swing in huge numbers, either behind the candidate who is Our Fighter against fascism, or behind the Our Law & Order candidate against "all hooligans." In two days, we'll know. Cheers, mate

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3D+: developing language for postmodern spirituality.

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

And try to bring about the full-scale upgraded race war during the primary rather than during the general, because Bernie was becoming too successful in building his movement.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

detroitmechworks's picture

the white nationalist websites, which I will NOT mention by name because I refuse to give them power, are salivating at the prospect of a race war. They can't wait to actively start attacking protestors, and have even come up with a name for the new SA. They call themselves "The Lion Guard" now.

Was tempted to do an essay on this, because it's disturbing as hell...

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I do not pretend I know what I do not know.

Gerrit's picture

apartheid SA. I know these kinds of motherfrackers well. We need to stand toe to toe with the racist fascists and not give one inch. If we resist en masse using nonviolent resistance, we will beat them. It will be whack a mole at first, but 80% of them are cowards and will slink back to their holes, if we hold firm. Do an essay if it will not disturb your peace of mind. Otherwise, don't. It's not worth your peace offend. Research ways and examples of stoning them with nonviolent mass resistance. I appreciate your contributions, man. Hang tough, eh.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

"Send them. They deserve to hear what an honest politician sounds like."

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Lady Libertine's picture

did he really say that? if so I missed it. Ive been spotty online (busy spring cleaning!) but damn if MSM TV isnt going nuts over this. Drumming it up like crazy non stop Trump.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

Even better than my rejoinder to Trump on Twitter, which was: "Sure, let 'em come. Maybe they can fight for a living wage and Social Security with us."

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

moneysmith's picture

What a great reply!! Did not see this, thanks!!

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Hell is empty and all the devils are here. William Shakespeare

gulfgal98's picture

This article in the NYT International edition examines factors correlating to high support for Trump. Number one of those factors is white without a high school diploma. Trump is famous for saying that he loves the poorly educated.

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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy

Bisbonian's picture

He's just taking the show live, and on the road. Gathering viewers.

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"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X

Azazello's picture

He's been honing his character for over a decade, watching his ratings, learning what the dummies like to hear and how they like it delivered. It's politics as Reality TV. The guy who wrote Idiocracy says: I never expected #idiocracy to become a documentary.

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We wanted decent healthcare, a living wage and free college.
The Democrats gave us Biden and war instead.

detroitmechworks's picture

But at least in Idiocracy the idiots KNEW they were stupid.

Here, they think they're geniuses who have rejected the "brainwashing" of a decent society.

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I do not pretend I know what I do not know.

Cassiodorus's picture

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"But in America particularly, a deep worry is now consciously gnawing the ruling class—they can see it, feel it: that the American Empire is on its last legs, close to collapse."-- Simplicius

detroitmechworks's picture

I've yet to see it.

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I do not pretend I know what I do not know.

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

a ten-month promo. It's just that innocent people are getting hurt in process.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Shockwave's picture

A disgusting theater. I guess the audience probably vote for him.

Trump WWE photo donald-trump-wwe-hall-of-fame_zpsqffvl3yd.jpg

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The political revolution continues

Martha Pearce-Smith's picture

They are useful tools/idiots. They are fodder for his war on the "Other"....

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First Nations News

We need to focus on defeating Hillary Clinton and winning the nomination. This is a diversion that is not helpful at this time. When the general election comes peaceful protests outside of his rallys would be a sign of inclusion and American unity.

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Gerrit's picture

the primary is the priority. I'm telling you that the universe is not contained in the primary race. The primary race is merely one phenomenon in a rising political revolution. Keep on keeping on with your support of Bernie - I assume that you are donating and volunteering. If you ignore reality though, it does tend to surprise you. What I call Occupy Trump will fast become the news headlines above the election news.

I have 6 tours in urban counter-insurgency. I grew up in apartheid south Africa and was a Desmond Tutu Anglican. I know this shit cold. It's 1968 again today. Buckle up.

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Resilience: practical action to improve things we can control.
3D+: developing language for postmodern spirituality.

soon enough, experience fascism first hand. Sometimes it makes me feel panicky.
I don't believe Hillary can carry the general election, and in two days DK will be a campaign site strictly for her.
I was fooled for a long time that DK was a democratic site. I'm not sure what that says about my judgement.
I'm so glad to have you here, Gerrit. I know I can learn about the things that are scaring me the most from you.
And (old but still true) knowledge is power.
Thank you.

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'Well, I've wrestled with reality for thirty five years, Doctor, and I’m happy to state I finally won out over it." Elwood P. Dowd "

occupy dKos? Smile

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but the proprietor seems to have forgotten the "better" part of the "more and better Democrats" slogan.

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gulfgal98's picture

as in DNC site, but it certainly is no longer a democratic site.

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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy

More and better since when? 2003 was 43.6% registered D, now 43.1% as R support craters out I'm not alone with NPP. Every year goes by it seems the state party leaving people in the ditch and established Ds pulling up the ladder behind, same same, Where is the future? Metaphor mangling but hopefully "you know what I mean". Report of Registration - January 5, 2016
ca_reg_party.jpg

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Gerrit's picture

and we'll all learn together about this most dangerous threat of fascism in our history. And we'll all help each other with our fears - and these are actual, existential threats - together here on c99p. We'll work hard as we can for Bernie and we'll help each other become peace warriors with peaceful hearts in the struggle - note the word "struggle" - to rescue democracy from fascism.

The solution to proto-fascism is nonviolent resistance to domination, as MLK and Ghandi taught, and Bernie knows so well in his very body. The how-to is all there, just waiting to be learned again during a new time of need. I'll do my best to help fetch some practical cognitive tools from what works in nonviolent resistance. I have to learn myself. Best wishes,

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pswaterspirit's picture

Is that you are probably right. A funny thing happens when I get to come home to my farm far removed from most people and day to day events. It allows my brain to step from the fray and look at it from the outside.

We are at a fork in the road and we have to decide which road to choose. That choice will have consequences many will be unentended. If the republicans try to deny Donald Trump the nomination nothing good will come of it.

Hillary Clinton represents an attempt to turn back. Her election may very well be a very nasty lesson to her in "be careful what you wish for" trying to turn back could devolve into civil unrest with both sides freaking out.

Bernie for all his amazing skill is going to find it challenging to unite us should he be elected.

The waters ahead look turbulent no matter which direction we take. At this point all we can do is hang on and try to make the best choices possible.

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Gerrit's picture

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Lady Libertine's picture

to the lifeboats!!!

Wink

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

His jobs are 1)to take media space away from Bernie, and 2)start a full-scale race war (maj of white people and maj of black people wanting to kill each other). He's trying to provide a false people's candidate to take oxygen away from the real one, and to set white working people and black working people at each other's throats. Then the Washington Post can say that "democracy" is now threatening "American self-government," because "democracy" has given rise to Trump.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

gulfgal98's picture

Let's face it. Trump and Clinton families are close through their daughters. Chelsea and Ivanka are best friends. Recently, it occurred to me that this just might be scripted to get Clinton into the White House. I do not believe I have seen her call out Trump at all. The other thing that occurred to me is does the Donald really want to govern? It is the same phenomenon as Sarah Palin...a narcissistic personality who is clueless about governing. Clinton versus Trump builds the empires of both oligarchs.

The whole thing is frightening. And Neither political party really cares because they are both owned by the same basic interests.

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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy

It will amplify the amount of Trump coverage and create a backlash that will fall on Bernie.
It will suck all of the media air out of platform and policy, and it will cover the violence.
They will retaliate at Bernie rallies. This will devolve into the mud.
Everyone has a right to attend a political rally without be harassed.

Not only is this bad strategy, it is morally wrong. If they want to protest, go protest Wall Street, Washington DC - put pressure on the superdelegates to move their support. What a yuuge mistake.

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"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon

Gerrit's picture

The poor have lost their religion. It's 1968 again. Which side are you on? Remember, fear is the mind killer. Courage, friend, courage. We're all in this together.

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I will be pissed. These protests are a distraction. The prize and the enemy is the Democratic establishment - not Trump. Let the GOP worry about Trump. We need to stay focused on taking out Hillary and controlling the primary.

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"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon

Unabashed Liberal's picture

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Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.

hecate's picture

disagrees. Because such things cannot be controlled.

Them that's got, they prefer the people stay squirreled away at home, "doped with religion, sex, and TV."

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"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon

hecate's picture

Nobody else is doing it.

Like what Jorge Ramos said today:

Where were all the candidates nine months ago? He announced June 16. Where were they? Where was the press, asking the tough questions? He was as hateful and divisive when he said that Mexican immigrants were rapists and criminals and drug traffickers. And where was the press? And where were the candidates? Where were the political parties? Where was the government? Where was the government of Mexico? And so who is surprised now? I am not. Who is surprised, that he is being confronted in rallies right now? People are saying, well, if the political establishment decided not to confront him, now we are going to do it. And that's exactly what we're seeing.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

That's why it's complicated. There's the political economy--the political system AND the people agitating against it from many directions--and then there's the media spider, draining the blood out of ideas and events and turning it into threads that come out of its ass and entrap everyone into immobility.

What people who fear the protests are saying is that they fear the spider and what it will do when it sinks its fangs into this event, and others like it. And they fear the threads coming out of its ass. And they're not entirely wrong to fear.

Also, of course Trump (and Clinton, I think) want the white working class and black working class to tear each other apart. That's why Bernie is a bit of a wrench thrown into their plans. He has to be careful in his response to this, but so far, I think he's been spot on.

It's important to remember that Bernie and his campaign are not the originators of this event. It's not like Bernie 2016 is planning Trump rally protests. So the question is, how does he respond to the protests? Tell them to stop doing it? Does he even have the right to do that? I don't think he would think so. Lecture them from above, telling them they're not moral because when they got punched, some of them punched back? Is that a moral thing to do? I don't think he would think so. And whether it would be moral or not, what would the impact be *politically* on his campaign? As a campaign manager myself (retired), given Sanders' campaign narrative, it would be political suicide to oppose the protesters or lecture them from above. The moment he does that, he undermines the populist and anti-racist narrative of his campaign--and then he's done.

On the other hand, he's not going to pull a Trump, egging people on to violence, nor is he going to start planning anti-Trump events. The one thing I think he's done a bit wrong is that I think he may have spent more time and energy on this than he should--putting it into the beginning of his Friday night speech and issuing a statement and a few Tweets is enough--more threatens to let Trump define the course and direction of your campaign. And you don't want that.

This is a Scylla and Charybdis moment for Sanders, and he's steering the ship pretty well so far. I'm pretty sure he's not going to crash on the rock. He just needs to not get drawn down into Charybdis (the vortex).

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Unabashed Liberal's picture

the primary contests, but my definition of 'civil disobedience' and/or peaceful protests is along the lines of what Chris Hedges does.

(I've seen videos of him protesting at the White House, handcuffing himself to the fence, etc.)

Hedges' nonviolent disobedience is just that. For instance, when the Capital Police come to arrest him and his minions, they walk peacefully by them to the paddy wagons, sometimes even appearing to be chatting with them. And that's not what some of the rally videos depict.

Again, some folks don't believe in protest in any form--and I am not among those. But the model needs to be that of peaceful, nonviolent advocates for change like Hedges. And that has to be regardless of the ignorant taunts or actions of some of Trump's supporters.

Bottom line, violence begets violence.

Thanks for this post, Gerrit. And 'welcome.'

(Music City) Mollie
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"To maintain pure discipline is to do away with pretense and concealment."--Milarepa

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Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.

gulfgal98's picture

The Trump protests were originally organized by students at the University of Illinois at Chicago where Trump was scheduled to speak. It was a broad coalition of black, Muslim, undocumented Latinos, and other student groups along with BLM. Originally they petitioned the school to not allow the speech based upon their concerns for security of minorities. When that did not happen, they decided to launch a protest. Move On then joined by printing signs for them.

Planning for the event started Monday night, when leaders from a range of groups gathered in a campus lecture hall. They included the Black Student Union, the Muslim Student Assn. and the Fearless Undocumented Association, which advocates for immigrants in the country illegally.

Other local and national activism groups also got involved, including some local labor organizations, Black Lives Matter and MoveOn.Org, which has endorsed Democratic candidate Bernie Sanders.

I know Markos and many others at dkos do not believe in the effectiveness of protests, but I do and have had no qualms participating in making my wishes known. It is something that I could not do when I was working for fear of losing my job, but now I feel as though I have nothing to lose by helping those who have no voice be heard. In the last five years, I have been involved in Awake the State (multiple marches) and the local Occupy group in Florida where we marched on the state Capitol. I also participate in a weekly Peace vigil in NC. and have participated in a local NAACP vigil in NC. While protesting may not be for everyone, I love it and am energized by it. If not me, then who? My experience has been that it gives me an opportunity to talk to other people one and one and maybe find common ground.

Most of the violence at protests is caused by those invested in maintaining the status quo which is why Occupy was so brutally shut down in many cities. But overall, protest to me is part and parcel of my first amendment rights and you gotta use it so you do not lose it. That is why Markos Ides of March edict is so egregious.

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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy

Mark from Queens's picture

I'm considering writing a piece on how #BLM and OWS are the salvation of the Democratic Party, or it will be extinguished. The conversation here has been enlightening and informative.

I agree with the author, the amazing uplifting activist protest actions in Chicago are way more meaningful than the dumbed-down MSM can see.

Off to phone bank for Bern now. Was at Zuccotti Pk doing the same yesterday. Which is where I received a flyer announcing a big Dump Trump rally at Columbus Circle next Sunday. Standing very publicly, right now, against that POS fascist and his boneheaded and racist minions, is exactly what needs to happen, especially in the face of a venal and complicit media nurturing this insanity by not scrutinizing his bullshit "businessman" credentials and bigotry.

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"If I should ever die, God forbid, let this be my epitaph:

THE ONLY PROOF HE NEEDED
FOR THE EXISTENCE OF GOD
WAS MUSIC"

- Kurt Vonnegut

Gerrit's picture

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

All I'm saying is: watch out for the co-optation of your struggle, because I can see the oligarchy licking its lips. Be ready to push your own narrative through any means of dissemination you have. If you're a veteran of OWS, you already know as much or more about that than I do.

The danger of this struggle being used to fuel Trump and give the establishment what it wants is real. That doesn't mean the struggle doesn't need to happen, and right now. One can't refuse to act every time the oligarchy might co-opt the action.

It does mean that people in the struggle need to be watching for when the oligarchy makes its move. WaPo is already doing some of the introductory work, blaming the rise of Trump on democracy itself.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Haikukitty's picture

The rise of Trump can be laid squarely at the feet of the Media, not Democracy. If the Media was doing their job, instead of giving Trump hours upon hours a free, non-judgmental press, this situation would be 100% different.

And of course, Citizens United, the anti-democracy ruling, doesn't help - because even though Trump didn't need fundraising money, the influence of money in politics means better candidates can't complete.

Screw the Washington Post.

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mimi's picture

several times. They are "non-violent" and "intentional" and "staged" and peaceful protests with the intent to get handcuffed and arrested and to make a "statement" and for the next day headlines and the media. If you have been arrested several times, it also gets expensive to get out of the one to two days imprisonments.

With a White House fence it is easily done. There is a certain section in front of the fence where you are not allowed to stay, you would have to walk on and pass, but not to stand still. So, if you on purpose stand still at that point, you get arrested. Handcuffing yourself at that part of the WH fence makes it harder for the police to "carry or drag you away". Would you stand still ten meters further down in front of the fence, nothing would happen to you.

A couple of celebrity protesters used this place to make their political resistance known that way. I think Bill McKibben and some actors as well. Have forgotten it. It's peaceful protest and civil disobedience, but staged for a purpose. Same kind of protests happen in front of the Supreme Court (Cornel West among those who got handcuffed there). You are not allowed, if I remember correctly, to sit and stand on the steps that lead up to the Supreme Court. So, placing yourself there, leads to handcuffing and arrests. These are staged events and both sides know it, demonstrators and police.

These demonstrations are not comparable with spontaneous mass demos, who tend to be more explosive in nature when they are suppressed or abused by groups, who want them to become violent and seek out confrontation with the police in a violent manner. I am not sure, who started the violence on the rallies, the demonstrators or the police.

Just saying, because the US is so huge, any mass demonstration has to be organized, people have be bussed in and with that usually it gets civil and non-violent. If those happen at the Washington Mall, the only damage they leave behind is a trampled up lawn with lots of bare soil spaces in between. And it leaves the barriors behind and the beautiful mall looks like a field for cattle whose pathways are caged so that the "cattle people" can't trample on the grass anymore.

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Gerrit's picture

matter. Struggle we must. This is existential. Ghandi said, "With a coward you can do nothing." He emphasized that because the heart of resistance is the willingness to put our fearful bodies out there on the line of resistance. Those who have the courage have to get out and get into the struggle. The question is how.

Nonviolent resistance to domination is how. As taught by MLK and Ghandi. Just as you described. Violent actions are counterproductive and should be outlawed by us. No exceptions. That doesn't mean we fall into the Orwellian "violence only begets violence" meme. We must stand by, and where we can side by side, with our youth in the street. The violent minority within OUR ranks must never be the reason for abandoning street protest. For that is merely capitulation to fascism. We must outlaw violence, educate our peace warriors, provide them the practical tools and skill-sets for NVR to domination. But we cannot fall into the trap of pulling our heads back like scared turtles. This is chin up time.

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Nixon won the Presidency in 1968 on a law and order campaign message. When voters see violence on their TV sets at dinner they are repulsed at vote for stability. We need to let the Trump rallys brew in their own cesspool and concentrate on a message of hope for working Americans. Peaceful demonstrations of establishment politicians offices, based on Ghandi's approach, after the election is the best approach to effect change. Nothing can be gained from clashing with poorly educated, low information voters on the nightly news.

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Cassiodorus's picture

Are Cruz, Rubio, and Kasich, who will impose fascism on you quietly. Clinton will have the Democrat cheerleaders loving her fascism, all the while pretending it's something it's not.

Trump is merely scary because he's open about what the neoliberals have agreed by consensus. If the regime of commodities is to be imposed upon all of us, force will be necessary.

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"But in America particularly, a deep worry is now consciously gnawing the ruling class—they can see it, feel it: that the American Empire is on its last legs, close to collapse."-- Simplicius

gulfgal98's picture

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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy

detroitmechworks's picture

That's the one nice thing about him. To use an analogy, the Rethugs and Democrats have been slowly turning up the temperature on the pot we're in.

Trump pulled out a blowtorch, and shouted loudly that he was gonna get shit done.
Bernie pulled out a Icepack and said pretty much the opposite.

Either way, the game is up and it will be almost impossible to ignore the fact that we're in a pot, and the temperature keeps going UP. (This analogy also works for global warming, IMHO.)

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I do not pretend I know what I do not know.

Gerrit's picture

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

Look away from the ball.
Apply this to politics, and you'll see some mighty interesting things.

Right now, Trump is the ball.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

gulfgal98's picture

football included, your boyfriend is right. I used to always watch the defense and the line play. Smile

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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

That's what he told me.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

gulfgal98's picture

I always used the glasses. My husband would ask me why since I could not see the entire field with them. I told him I was watching the line and occasionally the linebackers.

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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy

Gerrit's picture

I made an addictive discovery of the coaches camera on NFL Game Pass. It shows the all-22 view and you can retrace the flow from the lines outward. Addictive, addictive Smile I'm an old-fashioned stop the run, run the ball, guy. i miss the old days!

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Gerrit's picture

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TheOtherMaven's picture

rolled into one.

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There is no justice. There can be no peace.

Gerrit's picture

that whole bunch of RWNJs. He plays a long, long, long game. I think he knows he can't win the presidency of the U.S.A. and his real goal is to become the president of a new Christian Confederacy in the south, based in Texas. That's why I say he's Jefferson Davis.

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detroitmechworks's picture

I'm going to go with... Negative 32 years.

Reagan got that started when he started the private prisons.

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I do not pretend I know what I do not know.

Gerrit's picture

from that 32 years of "southern strategy." When we've dispatched Herr Drumpf, we gotta be eyes front about that frikkin weasel.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

whyvee's picture

If the MSM had not given him so much airtime from the very beginning I do not think he would have made it halfway out of the starting gate. He was basically covered non-stop because the MSM was loving all those viewers that like to watch a "car crash." Now that he has become unstoppable I blame the media for this unbelievably poor-excuse- for-a-human-being for being as a viable candidate for President. I am embarrassed for our country....

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detroitmechworks's picture

They mocked him mercilessly... and then SNL abandoned their duty and decided instead, hey, lets defuse the best tool against tyranny ever and let him write a fucking episode!

Tyrants must be mocked.

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I do not pretend I know what I do not know.

Lady Libertine's picture

I sure do miss Jon Stewart...

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Unabashed Liberal's picture

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Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.

PastorAgnostic's picture

headlining as the first of 8 bands. Great concert, nice time, lots of opportunity to sketch people. Not surprisingly, the conversation often headed to politicks, and of course, Der Trump. Only one person said he supported him, especially on his anti Union stances. Everyone else, every single person said NFW. While most leaned for a bern, a few supported Hillary, especially the oldest in our group. But you mention his name, and people shake their heads.

Watching Der Trump this morning on UpChuck, then CNN, then someplace else, I was astounded by something new. Finally, the media is beginning to consider the possibility of thinking about whether to weigh the upside vs. downside in determining whether to opt for or against wondering whether it should allow the idea of standing up to him, cross their minds. But they aren't there yet.

What is even more depressing, how the remaining GOPs continue to say they will vote GOP in November, and following up on how Bernie is so bad ordering his troops to attack poor defenseless Der Trump. Not quite giving him a pass for his inciting riots, but damn, they are spineless.

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Gerrit's picture

that nasty MSM BS. We have to keep their feet to the fire to report the truth about Herr Drumpf and the CONSEQUENCES of boosting him.

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Martha Pearce-Smith's picture

For the last couple of years I have been expecting a blow up. I thought Ferguson would have been THE spark... it came close.

And I AM torn.... I don't want people to get hurt... but I am sick and tired of being a door mat for the Trumps of the world... I am Pagan, and there is a saying amongst some of us (we are not all pacifists)...."Never again the Burning Times, because THIS time we are armed...."

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Gerrit's picture

all true democrats have concluded that the four-decade GOP hate fest has produced it's first fascist standard bearers in Drumpf and Cruz. And they understand that Drumpf (first) has to be stopped NOW before he gets to Nov 8 with a head of hate-filled steam.

We can help by actively promoting nonviolent resistance, it's operating philosophy, it's time-tested strategies and tactics, and practical tools to our young peace warriors. I know that nonviolent resistance will destroy Drumpf before the election, because I know warriors and he is not a warrior at all. Like most bullies, he is a coward. When his bluster is met with fierce nonviolent resistance (NVR) he will back down and crumble. And his supporters will see it and melt away. They want THEIR bully and if Drumpf is exposed as a coward, they'll look for another bully. And we'll stop that one too. Until they become to weak to put up bullies. Violence against them is counterproductive and will in fact create the conditions for civil war.

There are five phases in this process:

First, recognize the threat. Check.
Second, decide to resist. Cowards melt away, courage steps forward. This is where we are today.
Third, choose how. Violence leads to civil war. Nonviolent resistance wins as long as people hold firm.
Four, learn and communicate the philosophy and strategies of NVR.
Five, work very hard for victory. With peaceful hearts. (I will write more about that.) Volunteer our bodies in the street or provide support behind the line on in the rear echelon.

Thank you for helping the conversation. We think things out together and learn from each other.

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Big Al's picture

People had the same hopes in the sixties and early seventies about building a sustained movement to bring Power to the People. By the mid seventies, the ruling class had actually solidified their power and on we went to Reagan. I'm not saying give up hope, far from it, but this looks like just more of the same. Remember the WTO protests in 2000 and the Occupy protests. People have been angry at the ruling class forever. Back in the early part of the 20th century there was massive organizing and protesting on all fronts and in the end, look where that got us. Because in the end, we're here at this present time in a FUBAR situation worse than any before.

One thing that bothers me about these protests is the lack of the same protests by these people against Hillary Clinton. As some have said, Clinton's actions have been far worse than Trump's rhetoric against people of color. She is responsible for the deaths and displacement of millions, responsible for entire countries being torn apart. And what's going to happen if Clinton wins over Sanders and it becomes Trump vs. Clinton. Are they going to continue to protest while giving Clinton a free pass, in effect lending their support to Clinton? If it's Sanders it would be a different story, but if it's Clinton, the hypocrisy is going to be too much.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

your other comments.

Yes, of course, Trump is being used to:
1)Be a false populist and draw people away from the actual populist
2)Take race war to the next level
3)Be the Republican Hillary can beat
4)Make Hillary look better by comparison

If Clinton wins over Sanders, in part it depends on what Sanders chooses to do. Most of his options at that point will result in serious change in party politics/the ripping down of certain curtains. That could turn out very crappy (if he throws support to Clinton) or very good (if he doesn't and dedicates himself to the movement. But either way, the Clintonista lies of the past 35 years are done for. It's just: will it matter?

What I don't like about movements that deeply intersect w/elections is how dependent one is on the leader and what s/he chooses to do. The fact is, that if Bernie doesn't win, our task is still the same. But we need to figure out HOW we're going to do it, rather than simply wringing our hands over the Democratic party and its perfidy. We need to build social and political infrastructure and set about the business of living a different way, and--here's the rub--defending that life when the bastards come to tear it down. That's the issue none of us wants to face. And that's why it's easier to focus on the parties than on what *we're* going to do. I include myself in this criticism.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

gulfgal98's picture

Major change in society comes as a result of social movements, not politics. And sometimes it takes a long time for a social movement to gain enough momentum to force political change. The politics follows the social movement, not vice versa. Most politicians are guardians of the status quo of power so they are reluctant to cede that power for change until they are forced to. Good politicians recognize this and act accordingly. Great ones will be on the forefront. And there are very few that are ever on the forefront of real social change.

I think same sex marriage is a good contemporary example. What appeared to happen overnight was a long time in the making. The enacting of anti-gay marriage laws in many states in recent years was a good indicator that the critical mass was being reached and those in power were doing their best to stem that momentum. Obama and Clinton were way behind the social movement and Bernie was ahead of it. Ironically, a good Catholic Joe Biden was the one who recognized the power of the social movement to legalize same sex marriage and he forced Obama's hand on the issue.

What I see in the Sanders campaign is the continuation of Occupy in that there is national public figure giving a public voice to the issues raised by the Occupy Movement and its predecessors. Throughout his campaign, Sanders has talked about this being us and that he cannot do it alone. I think most of his core supporters clearly understand that concept and are in it for the long run. I keep going back to my own small experience in Occupy and the millennials I met there. They are literally fighting for their future and their existence. At our Occupy, climate change was clearly their greatest concern.

My greatest fear is that in order to run under the Democratic banner, Bernie may have been required to support the nominee if he is not it. So I will be looking for two things as this race continues. First, if Bernie is mathematically eliminated, will he continue to stay in the race and go to all 50 states? This is something I very much support as a means to getting his message out. The second thing if he does not get the nomination, I will be looking at how he frames whatever support he does or does not give to Clinton.

There is so much more I could write, but this is enough for one comment.

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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy

ppnortney's picture

the only commitment Bernie had to make to run under the Dem banner was not to run 3d party if he didn't get the Dem nomination. I agree with you that how he handles such an eventuality will be critical to keeping the movement alive. He's politically savvy and I think a true believer in what he says, so it's hard for me to imagine him endorsing Hillary except as a possible (and I believe futile) preventative against the Fascists from taking over.

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The smaller the mind the greater the conceit. --Aesop

Gerrit's picture

I have a nose for folks who have seen the elephant Smile It's good to meet you here on c99. We're all in this together, eh. Best wishes,

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

after the pressure of his campaign has shown her to be corrupt, and a liar.
If he does, no American will believe in any change candidate from the Democratic party again.

That's why I say, things are gonna change, either way.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

I agree that we (those here and Americans in general) need to start planning and working together to determine 'What do We Want?' What do we ant our country to be? How do we want it to be governed? If our votes counted on every law and policy, what laws and policies would we vote *for*.

I don't have a clue how to begin doing this, and my brain is cloud-gathering today so I can't even explain myself well. But what I appreciate about your comment is that you are pointing out is that, no matter who is elected, we have to start *now* to determine what we *expect* our government to do for the citizens of America, and we need to figure out new ways of conveying our expectations to the political call and its parties.

I'll try to make up an example: We all know that America's economic policies toward its citizens have to change, so let's choose that as one area of change that will we demand. That's a broad area, so I'll focus on scraping back some of the wealth that catapults around Wall Street and transferring it back to the citizens and their General Welfare. So here's a possible scenario:

Sanders (if I understand correctly; corrections welcome) is saying he wants a .05% transaction tax on Wall Street, which will be used to provide free college for all (and I saw today that a UMass (iirc) study has shown such a tax will more than covers the education costs). That's well and good -- but I don't think it goes far enough. Let's make the transaction tax 3.0% -- while also bringing back Glass-Steagall and otherwise regulating the industry. Earmark the additional tax revenue for rectifying the damage done to Americans by 30 years of far-right economics (Or even 'center-right' economic policy if you wanna be all Clintonista about it, ok with me if you do). So another portion of the revenue could be earmarked to relieve existing student debt and ease up Millennials' monthly costs-of-living. (Plus additional uses I can't think of now.)

Now, somehow, in the background of this imaginary scenario, I've already got established a wide-spread, beyond-partisan coalition, with well-constructed and accessible internet communications established, making communications and coordinated actions possible quickly. (Possibly some thing like a Union of American Citizens could be brought into being, coordinating with (say) the Labor Party. (I had a realization this last week, after reading about the Labor Party, that -- in the political/economic zeitgeist we're in now -- we're all either Labor, or Fodder, or both.)

So, from this imaginary standpoint of all being part of this post-Party Unified Citizens of America, when (say) Congress is going to consider a transaction tax bill, our representative all receive text, emails tweets and (yes!) postcards saying 'as a member of UCA, I expect my government to do [this] with this bill. I will be watching your vote.' To party leaders, we write: 'The members of UCA will no loner accept [this] and expect our gavernment to [do that]. If you want my vote for your party in [year], please know I will be watching your actions as a Party Leader.'

(Okay, why postcards? Because not everybody has Internet (and that should be a plank in the 'UCA' platform). They're cheap, so even most poor people can afford them, and 'UCA' members who are 'buddied up' with poor folks (hmm, I'll have to build that in) can buy a bundle for their buddies. They are physical and have to be handled; when they are handled, they can be read; they have no envelopes so don't have to go through safety procedures like letters; they have to be handled again in the pol's offices, where they will be read again by handlers in addition to the addressee. Because of 'UCAs' amazing online presence, members can report how many, to whom were sent, so that if word goes out on a Fri about upcoming transaction tax action, asks members to Send Now, by Mon or Tues 'UCA can put out a press release announcing that 'over 350,00 individual messages were sent to Congress and Party Leaders by member of the UCA, all asking that their reps do [this]', while UCA members who have made themselves Press Outreach Coordinators call the pol's media officers saying, 'Hi, Louise, we sent a bunch [actual number] of messages to your guy, have you seen them yet? Yeah, I'm calling to get the Congressman's statement . . ..' Pol's statement or non-statement would be put online immediately.

Ah, what a world! (That's my brain for you; give it a concept and it writes a story.)

And yes, I know, I went pretty far with that scenario. But the technology is already here to support it, or at least 'close enough for governnment work' [haha].

But where we need to start is with the FOUNDATION and the framing timbers -- the FUNDAMENTAL IDEAS AND GOALS -- of what we want American government to change into. We need to develop that framework of thought beginning RIGHT NOW, imo, in order to have a coherent package in place by January 2017.

I think the economic aspect should be developed first, since its effects will be felt by all Americans. (Bernie's proposals are a place to start, as are the Congressional Progressives' budget.) Because economic concerns affect us all, I think this could be used as a unifying concern.

Economic issues are already cross-partisan -- and if you want to learn something surprising about this, look for the article about the excerpt of Thomas Franks' new book at TruthDig.com. Franks write about a survey done by ACL-CIO among its blue-collar members, which Franks uses to illustrate the major concern among Trumpists. Trumpists, Franks says, are not unified as bigots, but because of their economic fears after the last 30 years.

OK. I'm done now. If I had known this was going to come out this way, I would have set it up as a diary instead of a comment. You'll have to blame my brain, which has a mind of its own.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

My brain goes in other directions, compatible with yours but not identical. For instance, I want two groups of people involved in any such movement: the whistleblowers, like Thomas Drake, and people with experience in founding successful sustainable communities. I want them, not just because I care about civil liberties and the environment, but primarily because the whistleblowers understand the security state from the inside, and successful founders of sustainable communities understand how to build lasting communities under great pressure. We need both of these things.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Many other groups to share their views and expertise.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

of the great social movements of early part of century: that they are somehow responsible for this Powell memo counter-revolution.
And I even have a problem w/characterizing the New Left movements of the 60s/70s that way.
Fact is, we were clobbered by an extremely smart, effective, and well-funded counter-revolution, and a lot of Boomers, Silents, and Greatests decided to drink the Kool-Aid and side with Reagan rather than fighting back. Give me a tenth of the money and support Dem leadership had in the mid-80s and I could have built a pushback that would make your jaw drop. But of course, that's what Clintons are for: to prevent that from happening.

Point #1: a bunch of people made an incredibly lame, crap set of political decisions in the 80s that amounted to "I'm tired of being upset about the world; I want to be on the winning team." Point #2: we haven't been very strategic-minded or organized in our fight, have we? And the Democratic party has wasted sheer tons of our energy, labor, and morale.

The decisions of the 80s literally cannot be repeated b/c it's now too obvious that the status quo demands that all of us have crap lives, steadily worsening; we won't be allowed on "winning team."

As for Point #2, we could choose to be strategic-minded and organized and improve on Occupy rather than viewing it as a footnote.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

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"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon

Big Al's picture

I'm just saying look where we're at. We've never succeeded in overturning the power. They're stronger now than ever.

I guess that's my role on this blog.

"to take exception: 1.object strongly to; be offended by:"

Sorry for offending you.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

to *part* of what you said.

I'm in favor of a strategic analysis of how we got where we are, and where we might go from here, and I strongly disagree with *part* of your view of history.

Hopefully, there's a place in politics for fruitful disagreement among allies.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Gerrit's picture

questions like yours to help think straight. It's critical that you play your part.

I wanted to just add that I agree with you that if Bernie supports Clinton, the FUBAR becomes Technicolor. We'll be swallowed by the Abyss. I think though, that Clintons I and II have alienated Bernie forever. I'd be gobsmacked if he endorses her. I expect him to continue the political revolution should she win the primary. (Which she won't because she can't: I think the FBI will ask the DOJ for an indictment.) Hang in there, mate

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Unabashed Liberal's picture

but I would be gobsmacked if he doesn't endorse FSC.

From all that he's said (repeatedly), unless he decides not to run again, I sincerely believe that he will not only support FSC, but that he will campaign for her.

(Her campaign has already told Glenn Thrush that they want to use him to campaign in college/university towns to drive the youth vote.)

However, he probably has several options:

(1) Endorse her, and go on the campaign trail for her;

(2) Endorse her, but refuse to campaign for her;

(3) Refuse to endorse her, but not work against her efforts;

(4) Full renouncement her as the Dem Party Presidential candidate, and work against her efforts;

(5) Run against her as a third party candidate (though, probably too late for that);

(6) Quit politics altogether; and/or

(7) Drop out of politics, but lead a political revolution as a non-politician!

I figure that I'm more likely to get hit by lightening every day from now until the election, before Bernie would chose #4. If he did so, he would probably have to resign/retire from the Senate, almost immediately.

So, I'm really hoping for #3. But, I wouldn't bet the family farm on him doing that. (Since he'd likely be 'Nadared,' and have to leave the Senate after his current term.)

I suppose #2 would be better than nothing.

Now, #1 would be very hard to watch.

Guess we'll know fairly soon. I expect him not to continue his campaign too terribly long, if/when it appears that he's not got a delegate path to the White House. FSC will need all the help that she can get, and everyone knows it.

Wink

The biggest task ahead if to prevent the Dem Party Establishment from thwarting the will of the people. I am very wary of them, to put it mildly.

Postcript: Thank you for your contribution, JtC!

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Mollie
elinkarlsson@WordPress


". . . Integrity and courage are powerful weapons. We have to learn how to use them." --Chris Hedges

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Gerrit's picture

(8) Bernie keeps his day job, leaves Clinton out to dry AND continues to work for the political revolution.

I honestly think that the Clintons have alienated Bernie altogether. I think she's crossed the line so much and so often and so weaselly that he considers her now to be the neocon corporatist she is. (If he had any charming doubts about that before Smile ) He's not gonna say a thing until the dust settles and he would fight against the GOP fascists without doing anything for the Clintons. I don't see him as their surrogate ever. They're not dispatching Bernie anywhere. In fact, I think every snippet of her campaign postulating anything about "using" Bernie pisses him off more. What do I know? Nothing. It's just my speculatin', eh!

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Unabashed Liberal's picture

hateful and dismissive as she's been to him at times (when he's been very kind to her)--I hope that you're exactly right in your prediction.

Hey, thanks for being so good-natured in discussing the various options.

Give rose

Have a nice evening, Gerrit.

Mollie
elinkarlsson@WordPress


"If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went."--Will Rogers
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Gerrit's picture

Rogers. I want to go where my dog goes Smile

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Gerrit's picture

(8) Bernie keeps his day job, leaves Clinton out to dry AND continues to work for the political revolution.

I honestly think that the Clintons have alienated Bernie altogether. I think she's crossed the line so much and so often and so weaselly that he considers her now to be the neocon corporatist she is. (If he had any charming doubts about that before Smile ) He's not gonna say a thing until the dust settles and he would fight against the GOP fascists without doing anything for the Clintons. I don't see him as their surrogate ever. They're not dispatching Bernie anywhere. In fact, I think every snippet of her campaign postulating anything about "using" Bernie pisses him off more. What do I know? Nothing. It's just my speculatin', eh!

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