Midnight Special - M.A.D., We're Letting Them Do It Again Edition
Submitted by Big Al on Sat, 03/03/2018 - 10:55pm
Just because the psychopaths on one side start it, does that mean the other side that participates aren't psychopaths as well? Doesn't it take two to tango? At least for "our" purposes?
They're taking us back when America and Russia were great, again. They're all fucking whacked out. M.A.D. is not the way forward. Fucking Duh.
Are we really going to let them do this? They must be stopped. That's got to be like, a priority. Why isn't it a priority?
1972. I remember 1972, man. Wow. What's going on?
Comments
China is also getting in on the act,
http://www.businessinsider.com/china-military-increase-nuclear-deterrenc...
and India has been doing the same for a number of years. We need another Kellog-Briand type international pact to outlaw all nuclear weapons, imperialism and war. Many have been working on that for years, somehow the heat has to be turned up.
(Jimmy Durante voice) “Everybody wants ta get inta the act!”
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=jimmy+durante+everybody+wants+act
Looks like America will now have to triple it's defense budget.
It now has two major threats to deal with. In addition, there are also those other little countries that are getting rather uppity with the master.
This is going to put a serious crimp in America's programs of social uplift.
Maybe this was Russia and China's devious plan all along.....
Sounds familiar
wasn’t that how they claim Reagan “won” the Cold War against Russia?
Idolizing a politician is like believing the stripper really likes you.
Yep - Ronnie Raygun's 'Star Wars'
Several trillion dollars worth of social uplift spent on that canard completely wasted. Putin shot it out of the water like a sitting duck.
Who can blame the other countries for developing nukes
since our country has been marching around the world invading one country after another and overthrowing governments? This is a way for them to defend themselves from our constant warmongering. We demanded Iraq and Libya to give up their weapons and then we invaded them anyway. What right do we have telling other governments that they have to stop working on their nuclear weapons while ours are saying that we're going to spend $1 trillion to upgrade our nukes and possibly use the "mini nukes" that they think won't do as much damage to the world?
This is why Kim is telling Trump to go f*ck himself. This is what Putin's warning was about. He isn't threatening to use his, he's telling our government that he wants them to stop threatening others.
Iran just told us that before they give up their defense missiles we should give up our nukes and so should Europe.
After what we did to Iraq, Libya and Syria, why would any country give up theirs? Especially when Graham says that "now is the time to invade North Korea? MAD works both ways.
What we should do is tell Israel to go f*ck themselves and if they want another country invaded then they should do it themselves and use their troops and money for it. Israel has been getting our troops killed long enough.
The whole damn world protested against the Iraq war and they didn't give two sh*ts. We all know what needs to happen to stop them from doing it. Unfortunately too many people are in favor of us nuking NK. How do we change that?
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.
The US
was already happily marching down this path.
dfarrah
Compare that to the 2nd Amendment arguments in this
country. If the criminals have AK-47's, why shouldn't I have one?
Also, relative to Iraq, Syria, Libya, etc., they're a little different from Russia which already has 3-5000 nukes. Russia is also a strong second to the U.S. in military arms exports, including to Israel and Saudi Arabia.
Of course I agree the U.S. has no moral right to tell other countries what they can and can't do. But another nuclear arms race between the world's oligarchs isn't in my interest, I know that.
Israel
And almost everybody else's as well, in NATO at least.
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
Can you think of any other way to prevent the US
from attacking your country and killing millions even w/o nuclear weapons? Who has been the world's major aggressor and military killer since the fall of the USSR? How many innocent women and children have died in the last 25 years? What country has ringed Russia with 400 missiles placed within 100 km of their borders? What country is spending the most on weapons of war? What country has it's military boots firmly placed in over 70 nations on 800-1000 bases?
Here's what America did to a country they were not even at war with.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4UM2eYLbzXg]
The most powerful nation on earth, the most technologically advanced, the wealthiest, would spend nine years bombing the fuck out of one of the weakest countries on earth, one of the least technically advanced, one of the poorest. Their children and simple farmers still get disemboweled or have their legs blown off from the millions of bombies still littering the countryside. We don't even know for certainty how many MILLIONS died is Southeast Asia during that war.
Do you think Laos would have been bombed like that if they could retaliate in kind?
"Putin just threatened to nuke Florida"
Guess which website is pushing this meme? The insanity of Russia Gate has very real consequences and people are not looking at the big picture. This propaganda has been debunked numerous times and yet it's still talked about like it was a world ending event. It might be if people don't stop and question why the PTB are pushing it. Hillary and Podesta made the Russian "interfered with the election" up to give people an excuse for why she lost the election. I don't think that Trump being president is a good enough reason to blow the world up, does anyone?
Lotlizard posted this link in the school teacher's essay and it makes a damn good point.
"Does any sentient human being read the New York Times’ or the Washington Post’s coverage of Russia and think that he or she is getting a neutral or unbiased treatment of the facts?”
Is MSNBC Now the Most Dangerous Warmonger Network?
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.
Western MSM have gone berserk
Rachel Maddow is rapidly reaching the point where she should be fitted with a self hugging jacket.
nuke Florida
TOP, j'assume?
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
MSLSD is more dangerous
than Fox.
the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-2.1) All about building progressive media.
I think we need to
quit buying into the fantasy that the US is the most powerful and technologically advanced nation.
China and Russia are leaving us in the dust economically and technologically.
dfarrah
I would hope the human race could think of another way.
Maybe I'm wrong, maybe we're not capable.
I think Putin and Xi could use their power on the UN security council and their voices on the world stage to force a come to jesus moment regarding another arms race. I think both countries now have their own military industrial complexes making it nearly impossible to get off this track.
Since when has the US EVER recognized any power from the UN
that has gone against it's own interests?
Not talking about the U.S.,
I'm talking about the rest of the world.
Perhaps this is all theater and we're just the props.
I think the UN it is just theater
Yesterday we told Iran to give up their missle program and today France took their turn to tell them that. Looks to me that the Iran war is getting ready to begin.
I'm so fricking tired of our warmongering! Yay, let's spend more money on it!
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.
fucked-out old war pig
bragging about his wonder weapons. People making excuses: "Well, they feel under threat." Right. That's what they all, always say.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KU7_G2grxJE]
One threat leads to another to another and
one weapon leads to another and another. It's a never ending cycle. I think people defending Putin are doing so within a manufactured reality.
I'm not defending him
I am pointing out that if his speech causes people to stop and think, then I don't have a problem with it. Besides there are so many countries that already have nukes already to destroy us and the other beings that don't have any say about what humans do. Funny how no one talks about Israel's nuclear weapons isn't it? Bibi seems to be losing his mind lately and who knows what he's capable of doing if he thinks Iran is developing nukes? Israel is just as big a warmonger as our country is. They have been involved in our foreign policies for a very long time.
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.
small tweak
Small tweak: Compared to Israel, we're pikers. And that's no compliment to Israel!
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
Understand,
I think it's an issue where there is only one answer, similar to health care and war, and that is the total abolishment and outlawing of all nukes. Putin might seem to be acting sensibly but this is a game we can't accept no matter how sensible his actions seem under the circumstances. Iow there has to be pushback against this dangerous game of tit for tat. They aren't going to stop and it could be just getting started, the first Cold War lasted 45 years. You've seen what our MIC wants for the next ten years, Russia and China have their own MICs. In my opinion of course. For those that think there is no other option, I can understand how they would approve of Putin and Russia's actions. I personally have to refuse to allow for that.
The fear of them using nukes is very real, I agree with you
about this. I'm all for coming up with a way to tell our government that we will not stand for using nukes and trying to get them destroyed. During the Reagan administration there was talk about doing just that, but someone in his administration talked him out of it. (sorry, I can't find that article)
The nuclear clock is at two minutes to midnight and the threat is higher now than it was during the Cold War and it was because of the actions of our country. I'd like to know what it's at now. It was at two minutes to midnight even before Putin's speech because of our actions. In fact the f*cking pentagon is saying that his speech was a threat to us and now we have to spend more money on nukes because of what he said. Not that they weren't already doing just that. Bastards.
Peace, Big Al.
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.
@Big Al
Surely you're not suggesting that the rest of the world should just stand there and wait, even when directly and immediately targeted, for the slaughter of their people to begin, without even attempting to forestall this or make it known that they will defend themselves and their allies against murderous psychopathic bullies, in order to enable these to - then entirely unimpeded - finish this brutal and destructive take-over of the planet, which will anyway result in the extinction of life under a micro-managed fascism, run by those who believe that they can ignore reality to make their own, and somehow make it actually real, apparently by some method such as wishing really hard while wearing Google Glasses and praying to Super-Tech?
Only the psychopathic believe that nobody has a right to defend themselves or their people and country against their attacks; we cannot let ourselves be fooled into adopting their talking points. It takes two to tango as a cooperative effort; it only takes one to inflict a rape or a murder on someone perceived as vulnerable or unlikely to fight back hard enough to at least hurt the attacker.
We do indeed need strong pushback against the psychopathic lunatics intent on Total Global Dominance, and the destruction of life on the planet, with or without nukes, 'disrupting' multiple countries with created/imported terrorists, overthrowing other people's elected governments to install dictators they hope will act as their own corporate-interest puppets, interfering in their own and other people's elections, spying on and tracking everyone on Earth, (whether to be droned or not - how do they 'mistakenly' target/drone so many innocents and war journalists 'by accident' while labeling them as 'terrorist hits' once dead?) attacking, invading and threatening - including with nukes - ultimately every country and all people in the world, and thereby forcing others to come up with deterrents to try to stop them.
The above being among a multitude of other sick and disgusting crimes, from bombings often killing not even terrorists but what are massive numbers of random citizens in other people's often-small/impoverished countries 'by mistake' (when caught out) and the kidnapping and torture of people around the world whenever it suits them, to routine police murders - on top of atrocious levels of incarcerations - of their own citizens, and labeling their own pacific citizen protesters as 'terrorists' and treating them like even dangerous and violent rioters shouldn't be, all for hostile outside interests having no business interfering in the public's but draining extra profits from there, nonetheless.
These are not people who should be loose in society, never mind running a country; people are entitled to defend themselves however they can against what are undeniably grossly criminal psychopaths posing an equally undeniable hazard to the entire world.
Obviously, it would be much better for American citizens to stop them before TPTB polish off life on the planet, to install a democratic government of and on their own: what's the plan?
Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.
A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.
On the face of it, defending oneself,
no I'm not saying people and/or countries don't have the right to defend themselves. I'm saying it's an insane game to play that's been going on since the end of WWII and could end up killing us all. And that the answer can't be to keep playing. I don't think Putin has done anything to end the game, in fact, he's insured it's continuation with a challenge to the western military industrial complex and the Pentagon.
And it's all based on lies and false narratives, i.e., the entire drama is about power and greed, not about what the vast majority of citizens want. We are all just pawns in this sicko game.
And what Putin just said isn't going to stop it, it's only going to cause the vaunted military industrial complex to up the ante causing the game to go on and on.
So while I can appreciate Putin's calls for an end to the U.S. aggression toward Russia, the approach of building new weapons to counteract their weapons will never end and is not the answer. Can Putin's words make a difference? I'm not sure, still thinking about that. In some respects perhaps, but other actions (such as Russia being number 2 in global arms sales) and the nature of the American/western oligarchy tell me no. Perhaps it might affect other countries, particularly Europe, to pause and think about what's happening. Everything has to be rejected from these global oligarchs. We need to reject their lies and games.
Not attacking you, as I hope you realize, just making a point.
I absolutely agree that it has to stop, only I don't see how to do so without cleaning the corruption out of governments, and not only in the US but in all-too-many other countries.
The point I'm trying to make is that the US PTB are threatening and have long been planning to invade/attack Russia, Syria and Iran, among many others and as well as all of those attacks/invasions already in process, in order to kill their people, take over their countries and steal whatever they want as they have done to so many others. Putin is calmly but firmly telling them that he will not stand by and let them do that to his or his allies' countries. The Russian people have been invaded before by fascists; they will not allow that to happen again.
This isn't a game to the targeted people, who know what happens and is happening now to other targeted countries and their citizens who were unable to discourage the US and other PTB from attacking them. This is life, limb and death to them, their loved ones, their independence from occupying forces.
The Russian people have been undergoing nuclear drills for, I believe, the past couple of years while waiting, minute by minute, for conventional bombs or nukes to start screaming in over their heads or exploding nearby, in their cities, because the US PTB like killing lots of civilians - and at least some think that this high murder rate makes the victim's victimized leaders look bad, rather than themselves.
If that isn't stressful, I don't know what is. But at least Putin has bomb shelters for his people - as Russians also did during the Cold War - built/refurbished and stocked with food and water, and apparently can get everyone in cities/target areas (too-often the same thing to TPTB) who can access them (was it 40 million people?) in them within 15 minutes, due to the drills.
So far, his priorities seem to involve protecting his people and country, while the US PTB are focused on sacrificing Americans and America to increasing their own wealth and power to the point of having it all.
Putin also demonstrates concern for protecting his allies - something not a concern for the US PTB, not just notorious levels of friendly fire in war being a long-running issue due to 'shoot first, check later' training/inclinations, but TPTB's feeling that 'collateral damage' involving people in allied European countries from their prospective nuking of one of their many target countries wouldn't be an issue for them, because they're psychopaths and can't feel such things as ethics and empathy as we do. That's the combination that creates what we term conscience, all of which they lack.
Americans now, as during the Cold War, are told, if not able to afford to build a bomb shelter themselves, to duck under a desk or whatever and kiss their butts good-bye. TPTB of the time tested radioactive blasts and radioactive fall-out on military, unwitting schoolchildren driven out to the test site 'for educational purposes, because history' and on residents miles away and now known as the Downwinders - just to see what would happen, although already knowing that radiation exposure at any level could prove health-destroying and ultimately fatal, never mind deliberate near-blast nuclear exposures at a test site.
The Russian people also have health care and pensions, ensuring the latter were received by citizens being partly why Putin cut back on his military budget even with NATO armies massing on their borders.
Quite the reverse with the already-drained American people being told they must sacrifice Medicare and pensions - into which people have paid in all of their working lives in order to have something in their old age - for ever more billions and trillions of the American public's money to (vanish, or to) go into the MIC profiteering racket, when the US already has the biggest, most insanely bloated military ever, scattered in bases all over the world all ready to invade anyone's/everyone's country at any time, and waaaaay more nukes than would destroy planetary life, and is evidently working toward being able to invade/attack the entire world not yet economically subjugated, all at once.
Putin is known for keeping agreements he's made; The US PTB are notorious for not doing so. Putin does not appear to be psychopathic; the US PTB and their lackeys are obviously so.
I absolutely cannot see the two cases as being similar in any sense. Still less can I see the situation as some competitive 'game' of who has the biggest bomb when only one side has to worry about keeping their people healthily and safely alive and their country strong, neither of which matter to TPTB, who doubtless plan to be safely in their luxury bunkers, (now, with Putin's weapons, I'd expect certainly well clear of America, NZ being popular, although laws there are changing regarding this trend) before starting WW3 and Mutual Assured Destruction, no doubt expecting to absolutely rule whatever remains of the ruins of the world when they clamber out again.
This is less of an arms race, than an arms chase, where a comparison might be to a situation where one party of bandits chases various families, the surviving ones desperate to find a big enough club to save themselves from an awful death by sadistically murderous maniacs. If the bandits pick up larger clubs and begin to move in, one can't very well tell the kids, sorry, if I pick up that larger club and save us all right now, they'll start looking for an even bigger one, and then so will I; it'll never end so you might as well be raped and beaten to death right now while we adults are being tortured for fun. You grab the biggest club you can get, scare the bandits away to save them and yourselves at least for the moment and hope that one day, if you have a big enough club, the bandits will finally give up and go away, sanity will ultimately prevail and/or some better solution will be found. At least you then have some time, which you otherwise don't.
And I cannot fault those trying to save themselves and their people from those seeking to kill, main, orphan/widow and dispossess them.
I do see your point, but it will only end when the murderers are stopped from murdering - which was what the UN was, I believe, supposed to be for, except that the US (among several others,) has a veto, psychos in the driver's seat and the largest military in the world. As with the concept and principle of public-protective law and order, now being replaced with law done to order for those with the most wealth - or access to the sponsorship of the biggest billionaires - to buy/bully politicians and other officials, elections, governments and power.
That, however could be changed, as could the corrupt psychopaths in office be changed for humans acting in the public interest, in a government at long last legitimate because of, by and for the people and enforcing equal rights, treatment and opportunity for all throughout every state in the Union - with none being 'more equal than others' or 'above the law'. And I personally believe that all efforts should be made on behalf of this and with all possible speed, because there's only hope while there's life.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnIL8AKWRNQ
Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.
A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.
Oh no, greatly appreciate the perspective.
I shouldn't have inferred the inclusion of Putin in the psychopath comparison. Sociopath maybe. He does sell arms to Saudi Arabia and Israel after all.
We'll see how it goes. I think we're all being played anyway. It's not in the interest of those profiting off all this for it to end with a nuclear war.
they're
of the same mindset as the MAGA hats who justify any and all US nuke bombs. They're just rooting for a different football team, that's all.
Kim Jong Nutgong. Kim Jong Hairshlong. Kim Jong Xipong. Kim Jong Bibibong. Kim Jong Vladkong. They are the same. And so are their supporters, enablers, excusers. Monkey-men, blithely blithering mass murder. Mad bulls. Lost their way.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3CIhGXnntM]
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEP_ntNg9WY]
NBC fuckwit interviews Putin - again.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=4&v=QtRo5NunriQ]
We will have to wait for the uncut version from RT.
" Doesn't it take two to tango? At least for "our" purposes? "
When you are the target of a bully, you really only have two options. Roll over, or stand up. I see Putin's (and Kim's) recent actions as "standing up".
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
Me, too.
They haven't been permitted any other potentially survivable option and certainly can't be expected to toss away their arms while a psychopathic madman patrols their homes, threatening to burn them and their families alive inside, as they know has been done to others too-often before.
Hitler and the Nazis, the US industrialists first attempt, were stopped before, (even if many Nazis were brought into American and other country's industry and governments by such as the Bush family, to further pollute the cultures, among other things) - ultimately defeated mainly by the Russians, explaining The Psychopaths That Be's hatred of the country; this current global fascist takeover attempt effort can be stopped now, if the world of humans only unites.
Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.
A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.
two options
Become a coward or a murderous criminal. (Rational middle ground is pretty much not to be had in bullying situations.) To stand up to a bully, you need a certain amount of power; and to show the bully you have that power, you must subject him to most of it.
In The Godfather Part II, the actions of the extortionistic bully Fabrizio Fanucci turn Vito Corleone from a small-time thief and burglar to an actual Mafioso, "making his bones" as it were. Of course, this happens the only way it can: Corleone shoots Fanucci dead.
The applications of all of this in nuclear armed brinksmanship are utterly horrifying. Especially when one realizes that in the above analogy, the US Government and Military are Fanucci and Putin is analogous to Vito Corleone!
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
I think that Putin made it perfectly clear
Listen to his full speech, not excerpts on the MSM along with their editorializing.
We had MAD, and that was nuts but it kept the peace, although barely. The US then said "screw this we are going to make ourselves immune from your missiles." That would be one-sided MAD, actually AD. Russia said, heh bad idea! Lets talk about all of this and come to a geo-strategic control agreement. The US said: F-off, we are the exceptional, indispensable nation and we are going to provide 100% protection from your missiles, and then we can ignore you and threaten you with Assured Destruction right from your neighbor's soil.
NATO now controls every single Warsaw pact nation and some Soviet Republics. The pressure on President Putin has been enormous from within Russia. He continually said that he was not worried. That he had a plan. Now we know.
So here's the decision for the US. Renegotiation another strategic weapons agreement and remove all of the missiles from Eastern Europe. Or face a huge challenge to respond in kind. How to do that and what would it cost? About $10 Trillion and 20 years of development. That's another $500 Billion increase in the war budget. Do they concentrate on defense? I don't think it's possible, stopping hyper-sonic indeterminate course missiles or trans oceanic underwater missiles travelling 200 mph at 1000 m under the surface with monstrous warheads? Or, match Russia's four new offensive weapons. In which case the US will spend a ton of money and time building back to equal MAD, meanwhile at a disadvantage.
President Putin's speech was a major geopolitical event as changing as the DPRK announcing that they had developed the bomb. From the view of gamesmanship, the US has been trumped by at least North Korea and Russia and probably China. It's now time to rethink who we are as a nation and what our relationship is to the rest of the world. Or we could just bluff, but no nation will bite on that, see DPRK.
Capitalism has always been the rule of the people by the oligarchs. You only have two choices, eliminate them or restrict their power.