@Pricknick
As one who wishes she had taken a firmer stand, I do recognize that "present" is like the rarely used jury verdict "not proven". I do wish she had gone all the way to "no", if for no other reason than that her future in the (D) party is now doomed.

I have been receiving no stop appeals from Bernie for donations. I've stopped because I don't want to throw my money away. That bitch, Pelosi, has killed any chance that Bernie had.

Note regarding the B-word. "If anyone ever deserved it, she does."

I do have issue with those who think that one who votes present is more dastardly than one who votes yes or no.
The state of the union is haphazard at best.

@lotlizard

Ohio Barbarian: "She lost me weeks or months ago when she refused to support Medicare for All. She also lost any chance she had of winning the nomination, not that she ever really had a chance."

is that true? or is he just a bernie fan (as he seems to be in another comment)?

and have officially pulled their front-page link to Tulsi’s campaign because of it.

https://jackpineradicals.com/boards/topic/the-tulsi-campaign-link-has-be...

https://jackpineradicals.com/boards/topic/a-clarification-on-taking-down...

Disappointing and disrespectful of the part of the JPR readership that backs Tulsi.

@gulfgal98
For demanding that the House set the trial rules in direct contravention of the Constitution.

on the impeachment vote.

Yes, which would mean that she supported the charade that Trump committed such a grievous act in temporarily with holding the sale of military weapons to Ukraine that he must be removed from office.

No, which would be interpreted that Tulsi supported Trump.

Not show up to vote, which would be portrayed that she was a coward.

Present, which was the right choice. It was not being in the center on this issue, but instead was being used to call out this impeachment fiasco for what it was. It was the position of higher ground.

The fact that Pelosi has not transmitted the articles of impeachment shows it for what most of us already knew, a very partisan display on the part of the Dems. Further, there is the very distinct possibility that Pelosi will eventually transmit the articles of impeachment at a time which will deep six the campaign of Bernie Sanders, perhaps right before the California primary. (h/t to Niko House for this possible scenario) The Democratic establishment would rather lose to Trump than win with Sanders.

@gulfgal98
@Centaurea

The Moral Hypocrisy of Trump's Limited Impeachment

If the Democrats and the Republicans were committed to defending the Constitution why didn’t they impeach George W. Bush when he launched two illegal wars that were never declared by Congress as demanded by the Constitution?

The impeachment process was a nauseating display of mortal hypocrisy. The sound bites by Republicans and Democrats swiftly became predictable. The Democrats, despite applauding the announcement of the voting results before being quickly silenced by House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, sought to cloak themselves in gravitas and solemnity. Pelosi’s calculated decision to open the impeachment proceedings with the 1954 “under God” version of the Pledge of Allegiance was an appropriate signal given the party’s New McCarthyism. The Democrats posited themselves as saviors, the last line of defense between a constitutional democracy and tyranny.
----
It was a mind-numbing spectacle, devoid of morality and ethics, the kind of political theater that characterizes despotic regimes. No one in the House chamber was protecting the Constitution. No one was seeking to hold accountable those who had violated it. No one was fighting to restore the rule of law. The two parties, which have shredded constitutional protections and rights and sold the political process to the highest bidders, have engaged in egregious constitutional violations for years and ignored them when they were made public. Moral stances have a cost, but almost no one in Congress seems willing to pay. Trying to tar Trump as a Russian agent failed. Now the Democrats hope to discredit him with charges of abuse of power and contempt of Congress.
----
If the Democrats and the Republicans were committed to defending the Constitution why didn’t they impeach George W. Bush when he launched two illegal wars that were never declared by Congress as demanded by the Constitution? Why didn’t they impeach Bush when he authorized placing the entire U.S. public under government surveillance in direct violation of the Fourth Amendment? Why didn’t they impeach Bush when he authorized torture along with kidnapping terrorist suspects around the world and holding them for years in our black sites and offshore penal colonies? Why didn’t they impeach Barack Obama when he expanded these illegal wars to 11, if we count Yemen? Why didn’t they impeach Obama when Edward Snowden revealed that our intelligence agencies are monitoring and spying on almost every citizen and downloading our data and metrics into government computers where they will be stored for perpetuity? Why didn’t they impeach Obama when he misused the 2002 Authorization for Use of Military Force to erase due process and give the executive branch of government the right to act as judge, jury and executioner in assassinating U.S. citizens, starting with the radical cleric Anwar al-Awlaki and, two weeks later, his 16-year-old son? Why didn’t they impeach Obama when he signed into law Section 1021 of the National Defense Authorization Act, in effect overturning the 1878 Posse Comitatus Act, which prohibits the use of the military as a domestic police force?
----
The impeachment circus, which will culminate in a preordained, choreographed and televised show in the Senate, coincided with The Washington Post’s release of what is being called the Afghanistan Papers. The Post, through a three-year legal battle, obtained more than 2,000 pages of internal government documents about the war. The papers detail bipartisan lies, fraud, deceit, corruption, waste and gross mismanagement during the 18-year conflict, the longest in U.S. history. It is a blistering indictment of the ruling class, which, as the papers note, since 2001 has seen the Defense Department, State Department and U.S. Agency for International Development spend or win appropriation of between $934 billion and $978 billion, according to an inflation-adjusted estimate calculated by Neta Crawford, a political science professor and co-director of the Costs of War Project at Brown University. “These figures,” the Post adds, “do not include money spent by other agencies such as the CIA and the Department of Veterans Affairs, which is responsible for medical care for wounded veterans.”
----
There is no difference, the Afghanistan Papers make clear, in the mendacity and incompetence of the policy making apparatus no matter who controls Congress or the White House. No party or elected official dares defy the military-industrial complex or other titans of the deep state. The Democrats through impeachment have no intention of restoring constitutional rights that would curb the power of the deep state and protect democracy. The deep state funds them. It sustains them in office. The Democrats are seeking to replace the inept and vulgar face of empire that is Trump with the benign and decorous face of empire that is Joe Biden. What the Democrats, and the deep state that has allied itself with the Democratic Party, object to is the mask, not what is behind it. If you doubt me, read the six-part series on Afghanistan in the Post.

Chris nails why this should not be taken seriously, but many of us already knew that the democrats had many other real reasons to impeach Trump, but wouldn't do it because it fits in with their agendas too. Nancy didn't even try to get agreements for the Dreamers or to stop Trump from flicking people off of Medicaid and food stamps. Or to get him to quit locking up kids past the 20 days that are legally allowed. The courts have weighed in on that and he is in violation of the law. No biggie says Nancy. The democrats are letting the taxes on medical devices go up in a puff of smoke even though they fought once to get them taxed to help fund the hideously flawed RomneyCare called the ACA. And she is letting Trump take money from wherever he wants to fund his damn wall. Including housing and other funds that help military families.

I am very glad that Tulsi saw this as just more theater for the masses to soothe the Resistance Pussy Marchers knowing that it will rile up Trump's base and most probably see him reelected. Byedone wins and things are fine. Trump wins and things are still fine. The donors keep sucking all the money from the lower classes, congress gets their cut and we keep falling further into the banana republic this country already is.

Kabuki bullshyte!!!

That's what I observed after the impeachment vote.

Whether Tulsi made the right or wrong decision, the fact is, her vote made absolutely no difference to the outcome. Yet in the 48 hours after the vote, there was immense rage and hatred directed toward her en masse by self-proclaimed liberals and progressives, including many Bernie supporters. Even people who say they don't like the Dem establishment were raging about Tulsi "defecting" from the Dems.

If we were living in the 1500s, they would have hunted her down and burned her at the stake while cheering each other on. It was classic mob mentality, out of control and irrational, and it was very disturbing to watch.

I think it was a clear indication of the superficiality of this impeachment. It will never accomplish anything tangible to rid us of Trump, and I don't believe it was ever intended to do so. It was an emotional manipulation, providing a "feel good" moment for the Dem rank and file (people who think of themselves as liberals and progressives) who have been trained over the past 40+ years to believe they are powerless.

I believe that what's been perpetrated on liberals since the mid-1970s is a form of PTSD, including learned helplessness and trauma bonding. The PTSD has been continually re-triggered and reinforced by the neoliberal Dem leadership in order to keep the liberal class under their control. The Trump impeachment has been used in this manner, to re-trigger the sense of learned helplessness and to yank the chain of trauma bonding.

I've also come to the conclusion that one of the Dems' main purposes in this impeachment was to reel independent-minded progressives back in to the establishment "tribe", and then to get us to turn on each other for being traitors to the "tribe".

on the impeachment vote.

Yes, which would mean that she supported the charade that Trump committed such a grievous act in temporarily with holding the sale of military weapons to Ukraine that he must be removed from office.

No, which would be interpreted that Tulsi supported Trump.

Not show up to vote, which would be portrayed that she was a coward.

Present, which was the right choice. It was not being in the center on this issue, but instead was being used to call out this impeachment fiasco for what it was. It was the position of higher ground.

The fact that Pelosi has not transmitted the articles of impeachment shows it for what most of us already knew, a very partisan display on the part of the Dems. Further, there is the very distinct possibility that Pelosi will eventually transmit the articles of impeachment at a time which will deep six the campaign of Bernie Sanders, perhaps right before the California primary. (h/t to Niko House for this possible scenario) The Democratic establishment would rather lose to Trump than win with Sanders.

@Centaurea . It is mob mentality with menacing overtones of witch hunt. It fits the parameters for scapegoating laid out by Rene Girard. Tulsi practices karma yoga, yoga of action, where one expresses one's love for God through genuine, altruistic service to others. Unfortunately, she is so good at this that it makes her fellow politicians look shabby -- which they are -- and this evokes jealousy and a desire to restore normalcy by getting rid of her, which Girard says is the function of scapegoating.

As a Tulsi supporter and also a helpless onlooker, it has become disturbing to witness. They are piling on; the former governor of Hawaii even called for her resignation! This is subjective, but when I see her, I see someone who, though strong and determined, has been hurt. I think the sheer ugliness and the weight of the hostility directed at her has made its mark on her, and I can see it in her face, especially her eyes. I wish I could help her. It's time to send her some extra money but also perhaps notes or tweets of encouragement and, for those who pray, prayers of love and support. Her deep faith will probably lead her back to a place of strength and confidence, but she could use some help in getting through this.

That's what I observed after the impeachment vote.

Whether Tulsi made the right or wrong decision, the fact is, her vote made absolutely no difference to the outcome. Yet in the 48 hours after the vote, there was immense rage and hatred directed toward her en masse by self-proclaimed liberals and progressives, including many Bernie supporters. Even people who say they don't like the Dem establishment were raging about Tulsi "defecting" from the Dems.

If we were living in the 1500s, they would have hunted her down and burned her at the stake while cheering each other on. It was classic mob mentality, out of control and irrational, and it was very disturbing to watch.

I think it was a clear indication of the superficiality of this impeachment. It will never accomplish anything tangible to rid us of Trump, and I don't believe it was ever intended to do so. It was an emotional manipulation, providing a "feel good" moment for the Dem rank and file (people who think of themselves as liberals and progressives) who have been trained over the past 40+ years to believe they are powerless.

I believe that what's been perpetrated on liberals since the mid-1970s is a form of PTSD, including learned helplessness and trauma bonding. The PTSD has been continually re-triggered and reinforced by the neoliberal Dem leadership in order to keep the liberal class under their control. The Trump impeachment has been used in this manner, to re-trigger the sense of learned helplessness and to yank the chain of trauma bonding.

I've also come to the conclusion that one of the Dems' main purposes in this impeachment was to reel independent-minded progressives back in to the establishment "tribe", and then to get us to turn on each other for being traitors to the "tribe".

@irishking

It ain't just her brothers and sisters who have died or been hurt in our wars. In fact more people whose countries we've invaded have been killed than the ones who did the invading have. And those that escaped from us had their homes and towns completely destroyed and they are now living in squalid refugee camps. I'd love for her to talk about this.

But I wish she showed more concern for the suffering we have inflicted on the innocent people in these countries.

In the entire Dore video she spends one sentence (6;40 - 6:50) to mention that Afghanis have been killed. It seems that 2400 US military dead are all that really matters.

Maybe this is not really how she feels, but almost all her antiwar talk that I have heard is about the cost to us. Almost nothing about the much greater cost we have imposed on the people of these countries.