Putin, the man that singlehandedly destroyed America's democracy
For six months now, the top news story in the country has been how one man, Putin, managed to infiltrate the internets, take almost complete control of the US electoral system and put a puppet of a foreign nation into the country's highest position of power. What kind of superpowers does this man have to create such turmoil in all three branches of the federal government, the Executive, the Legislative and even the Judicial without so much as firing a single bullet or dropping one bomb?
/s (edited out remark that might be misunderstood - snark on snark - if you will)
I offer some videos for your edification on this Sunday afternoon.
Oliver Stone has produced a four part documentary that gives us considerable insight into this man. But, it doesn't explain why Putin hates America so much that 'he wants to destroy it'. For this we have to look deeper into his past.
How did Putin snatch the REAL prize, Crimea, with its NATO coveted naval base at Sevastopol, from under the very noses of those that spent $5 billion during a decade of covert/overt manipulation of Ukrainian civil and political society at the very moment that success was assumed?
Comments
Putin didn't destroy American democracy
that happened back in the 80s when the Fairness Doctrine got abolished, and we became exposed to fake news 24/7.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
I agree. The US is its own worst enemy.
Look at what it is doing to itself as we speak. The truth is that this current destruction has nothing to do with Russia. The sad part is that the people who hold the reins of power can't see it.
Maybe Putin can come to America after he puts Russia back on its feet and help the country? /s
Oh, they see it.
It's just that fear is a much more powerful tool than the truth.
Regardless of the path in life I chose, I realize it's always forward, never straight.
Exactly.
They see it very well, it's a feature, not a bug.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
@Pricknick
Especially when the truth involves admitting that pathological greed and control-freakery is running amuck - and the American government.
Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.
A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.
Nothing would irritate the Hillbots
more than that idea. I love it.
He's got a cool head and clear vision, and more talent than anything that's crawled out of the beltway recently.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
@CB Can't see it? Of course
Can't see it? Of course they can see it. Their unanimity is due to something else:
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2014/03/nancy-pelosi-when-l...
http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/312605-schumer-trump-being-re...
We don't need Putin to destroy democracy. How could even representative democracy of any kind survive in that atmosphere?
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@CB The thing about Putin
The thing about Putin taking over--what I'm wondering is why I should care?
There's an assumption that the Big Bad Russian Bear is going to do something terrible to us if they "take over."
What is he going to do that the politicians and their backers, who are the ones who really call the shots, haven't already done? What's he going to do that Wall St, the oil industry, the pharmaceutical industry, and the military industrial complex--especially the spooks--haven't already done?
So far, I've come up with Pussy Riot. It's the only bad thing he's done in the last ten years that my own government hasn't. Often, my own government has done worse, because apparently we're imperialists who don't mind having World War III. As opposed to Putin, who's an imperialist who thinks World War III is a stupid, idiotic thing to do.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
That's similar to the question I end up with
I have a too-long essay waiting in the wings right now that wonders about that at the end.
Do Americans really think Putin is going to do something bad to them?
Yeah. Pussy Riot is all I could think of, too. lol. They plant the propaganda and leave it dangling. Americans have to provide their own fears, and stir until it comes to a boil.
In my piece, I ask:
IMAGINE if you woke up the day after a US Presidential Election and headlines around the the world blared, "The Majority of Americans Refused to Vote in US Presidential Election! What Does this Mean?"
That's my big question lately too,
just what is it that Putin gets from this? And end to our wars? Is that a bad thing? How can he "discredit" our "democracy" any more than it already is? Will he too just skim off the little people until there's nothing left to skim, like our "leaders" do to us every single day? Is he going to shoot down Medical care for all when we don't even have it? Rein in Wall Street? Just WHAT does he get from this? Is it really all just a personal vendetta against the evil Queen?
And as an aside, after watching all 4 of the interviews last Friday, a man with that much seeming intelligence could certainly find a better puppet, wouldn't we think? After all, his "puppet" has created nothing but trouble for him!
Only a fool lets someone else tell him who his enemy is. Assata Shakur
I've always cited the revocation of the Fairness Doctrine
…as the watershed moment that changed the future history of the United States.
Sometimes when new technologies come along, like broadcast media, there is a fork in the road at the very beginning, before it is tamed (or before we are evolved enough to use it properly). The wrong choice at that fork can doom the species (as nuclear power just may). We are facing such a choice with Artificial Intelligence, at the moment.
When the broadcast spectrum came along, homo sapiens were still swinging in the trees, figuratively. But our better selves (who are all dead now) made the right choice! They saw the willing devastation that propaganda allowed in Europe, and so they developed a standard called the "Fairness Doctrine" at that first fork in the road. They instinctively knew that they were dealing with a technology more powerful than any weapon they had created so far.
It took the former-nazi-neocons a half-century to elevate a moron to the White House, who, in the early stages of his brain death, imperiously revoked the Fairness Doctrine in 1987. Those neocons became the Deep State and lived behind walls of classified documents. They believed that the propaganda, as perfected by the Germans, would finally bring them ultimate Empire over the world. It has brought them close.
That is the enemy we are fighting here, on this website, and across the globe.
We are too brainwashed to reinstate to reinstate the Fairness Doctrine, which would neutralize propaganda, so I suspect we are on the path of doom. The Deep State invented "fake news" to distract and absorb excess IQ among the populace. Behold how sheepishly people are now led to their deaths the world over. The sometimes travel hundreds of miles to reach their extinction.
Leaders come and go; it's the mind-destroying broadcasters of propaganda that reign supreme.
IMAGINE if you woke up the day after a US Presidential Election and headlines around the the world blared, "The Majority of Americans Refused to Vote in US Presidential Election! What Does this Mean?"
That's a brilliant comment Pluto.
Damn.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
It's the most terrible comment in my arsenal.
I've written more than a half dozen essays on the revocation of the Fairness Doctrine — and the horrific results.
No other topic has done more to make an outcast of me.
That's how I know I found the heart of darkness.
Apparently, we are programmed to extinguish ourselves, and nothing can be done about it.
IMAGINE if you woke up the day after a US Presidential Election and headlines around the the world blared, "The Majority of Americans Refused to Vote in US Presidential Election! What Does this Mean?"
Actually, I think we're programmed
to extinguish others.
If your band of 40 or so found a spring, and the use of it was a life or death reality, they may have slaughtered the prior occupants wholesale, to preserve themselves and propagate. We're all descended from deadly and vicious killers, who used murder as a means to life.
We aren't much different now. What I wonder, is if people can be convinced to stop participating, or even to turn on those bad chiefs who keeping sending our warriors on raiding parties?
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
Who exactly are you descended from?
Perhaps I have read too much National Geographic.
Most Americans, it is true, are ethnically descended from the Goths, a species that apparently boiled up out of a hole in the ground, near Germany. Some say Cassiodorus tried to legitimize the Goths and invented an illustrious past for them. But where the Goths originally came from remains unknown. They are currently concentrated in Israel and the United States. /s ±
IMAGINE if you woke up the day after a US Presidential Election and headlines around the the world blared, "The Majority of Americans Refused to Vote in US Presidential Election! What Does this Mean?"
@Pluto's Republic Um...I hope that's
Um...I hope that's snark, because that's been the establishment's main talking point for the past 7 years or so.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@dervish Pluto does that.
Pluto does that.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@Pluto's Republic What's interesting is
What's interesting is how many people are buying the propaganda. It's intensely distressing to interact with those who have, because many of them are former allies. Many of them are friends and family.
But on the up side, there's a lot fewer who are buying it than, say, after 9/11 when Bush et al convinced 70% of Americans that Saddamn Hussein had attacked us and therefore we should go to war.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Yes it is.
There are no words. Even if you find agreement and understanding once the fallacies and realities are examined — there are still few words. This person is not intellectually reliable, and they secretly resent you for knowing that.
Society is poisoned, as we can clearly see around us. The Fairness Doctrine allowed an ordinary person to rebut the verified lies and the deliberate malicious misinformation of the powerful, using the very same airwaves to recite the proven facts that expose the lies and misinformation for the American people to see. Opinions were not at issue.
Propaganda was ineffective, by nazi standards, and that was unacceptable to the Deep State.
IMAGINE if you woke up the day after a US Presidential Election and headlines around the the world blared, "The Majority of Americans Refused to Vote in US Presidential Election! What Does this Mean?"
Oh yes. I had two friends just Friday
say over text that Mitt was better than Trump with his binders of women, that GWB looks so "cuddly" and that she just wanted to hug him like Michelle had done.... And Pence? Why, they're willing to chance that as he's better than that pussy grabber in the White Hut. Took me a couple days to let that one go, maybe they were just being snarky but I don't think so.... And they resent like hell some of my more confrontational statements rebutting them too. And these two are the ones I send stuff to, the ones who read some of it and respond to it!
Another third one I think I lost a couple weeks ago when I just went off about Democrats and Russia. She needs to have something to hope for, how dare I attempt to shatter that illusion!
Only a fool lets someone else tell him who his enemy is. Assata Shakur
@Pluto's Republic
Lol, considering the fact that murderous warmongers/fascists and power-seeking, censorship-approving internet giants are staffing/running/influencing the US government and interested in/working on Artificial Intelligence, I don't think we'll have to worry for long if they achieve it. Neither will they, I suspect.
But the same goes for the 'survivable' 'limited' (profitable for MIC, while it lasts) nuclear attacks and for the (profitably for polluters/corrupt politicians, while they last) unlimited pollution/destruction of the global life support system, so this could be a triple-header extinction event for life on the planet.
Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.
A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.
If you look at the first video at about the 5:10 mark
there's something that I found remarkable. In the early 1990's Soros commissioned the production of thousands of textbooks for teaching Russian students. All the books were written with an American bias. One of the examples given was the history of WWII - "ideological manipulation and sabotage." Only three sentences discussed the Battle of Stalingrad but four pages were given about the American Forces linkup at the Elbe. The exercise books also showed American presidents but not Russian leaders.
Remember the "book burning" scandal that Russia was accused of? Now you know why. I'd be pretty pissed off also.
Trump vs. Clinton
As I said many times well before the election, the very fact that we the Serfs had a choice between Trump and Clinton clearly showed the election was a farce, not that we needed that. It was proven long ago.
Putin and Russia provide a convenient excuse to make people not think about that. Instead of demanding a new political system where we're all not literally trapped into having one person, selected from the oligarchy, rule over us, people will demand paper ballots and secure voting for a corrupt system that won't be changed by paper ballots and secure voting. It's perfect for the ruling class, like their war of terror.
@Big Al Absolutely! This is the
Absolutely! This is the fight we should have been in, would have been in if half the people who consider themselves left-of-center hadn't run off to wear pussy hats and fear the Russian bear.
WTF, man. Even supposing Putin is a tyrant, why should I fear a tyrant halfway across the world when I have so many here?
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Trillions upon trillions spent
on NSA, CIA, FBI, DHA and this one man in charge of a nation that was politically wiped out and bankrupted in 1980 took down Murica.
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
One would think that would be more embarrassing to the country
than the truth. And the truth is the nation was offered a choice between two pieces of crap. Now, rather than admit the truth, they are attempting to put the blame on the US government's perennial boogeyman.
The saddest part is that a significant percentage of the population actually believes this stuff.
#someofthepeopleallofthetime
Fortunately most people can still recognize truth when they hear it. It's vital that we keep hammering away at it.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
Right there's the problem!!
We've only spent trillions and trillions when we needed to spend gazillions and gazillions. Underfunding lead to the destruction of Mom, baseball and apple pie.
@edg About half of the Moms
About half of the Moms are living in poverty. Probably can't afford apple pie, and certainly can't afford the time to make one. Even the Moms NOT living in poverty can't afford the time to make one. And no, this is not a diatribe against women working; this is a diatribe against a broken wage scale that makes everyone work so many hours that they barely have time to look over their kids' homework and watch an hour of Netflix with their spouse before going to sleep for six hours and doing it all again.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@dkmich Well, he had Macedonians.
Well, he had Macedonians. We didn't stand a chance.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Let's not forget who was president
when this so called hack happened. People are saying that Trump colluded with Putin to steal the election from Hillary. If this was true, why didn't Obama stop it.
As dkmitch stated, Putin did that while all of the intelligence agencies were helpless to stop him.
Seriously? This is what the democrats are putting their hats on?
I would blame the Awan brothers for releasing the DNC and Podesta's emails to Wikileaks.
Yep. This is more believable than Putin doing that.
There were problems with running a campaign of Joy while committing a genocide? Who could have guessed?
Harris is unburdened of speaking going forward.
We were seriously outmatched.
Our 17 intelligence agencies were impotent against two 15 year old Russian hackers, er, against mighty Putin's fabulous GRU.
Back in the late '90s
I worked with a programmer from Russia. One day I mentioned how Americans feel the CIA is a bunch of screw-ups and the KGB were demi-gods. He laughed very heartily and told me that Russians believe the exact opposite!
I mentioned watching the tanks shooting into the Parliament building on TV while people actually watched from the sidewalk. He said he was one of those people. I asked if he wasn't afraid to be there during the shootings. He shrugged and said it was something to do to relieve the monotony. I don't understand Russians.
I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.
It's all comparative
Russia still has vivid memories of the Great Patriotic War which they honor every year with parades. As a nation they are a very stoic people.
I was re-reading a Tabbi
book this weekend, and he talks about living in Russia during the 90's I think. Bombings in metro areas were pretty common occurrences during those days and many Russians just got used to it.
I also remember a remark from a Russian character from the Sopranos. One of the women had lost a leg, the whole leg, and while she and Tony were having a little connubial visit he asked her about that. She said to him that most of the rest of the world lives expecting tragedy while Americans are always shocked when it happens to them. Great point.
Only a fool lets someone else tell him who his enemy is. Assata Shakur
@edg @CB It's up from
It's up from around 35% to 44% as of the latest polls. But shit, I haven't looked at how the poll was structured...back in a mo, I'll see if I can find data...
Edited to reflect accurate numbers rather than my imperfect memory! It was a nine-point jump. Of course, I'm only comparing two polls, given a week apart.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal OK, I've looked at
OK, I've looked at the questions, and they were remarkably neutral and fair, as if somebody was actually trying to figure out what the people think. It's so weird to inhabit this looking-glass world where Fox News is providing an actual poll that isn't a weaselly attempt to manipulate public opinion.
Here's the link:
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/interactive/2017/05/24/fox-news-poll-may...
It's 44% in this Fox News poll, a week after an Economist/YouGov poll produced this result:
Asked whether they believe it’s true that “Russia tampered with vote tallies in order to get Donald Trump elected President,” 35 percent of all American adults responded it is “probably” or “definitely” true, while 65 percent of all Americans said it is either “probably” or “definitely” false.
For Democrats, however, the numbers were much different.
The poll found 55 percent of Democrats responded they think Russia either “definitely” (23 percent) or “probably” (32 percent) tampered with the vote tallies in the election.
A much more even split in the Fox poll, so I guess Americans' mental fortitude is wearing away under the propaganda blitz. Or perhaps there is another explanation. I've come up with two things that might have effected a difference in results within one week:
First, the Economist/YouGov poll asked the question about Russia under a section called "conspiracy theories." That's obviously not the language of neutral social science, and that could have predisposed more people to think about the Russia claim as false. Of course, I think it IS a conspiracy theory, a particularly poisonous one, but if I were constructing a survey I probably wouldn't do that.
As for the Fox News poll a week later, I delved into the data on who was asked these questions in the Fox poll--it's about 45% Democratic to 38% Republican. That may have had an effect on how the responses turned out, given that the Economist/YouGov poll showed a strong partisan bias on this issue. In that poll, 59% of Democrats believed the Russia claim, while only 35% of independents did, and 14% of Republicans. So having 7% more Democrats in your respondent pool could actually produce a small increase in the number of people who believed the Russia claim. I don't believe it could account for a 9-point swing, but it could account for some of it.
Interestingly, those polled still seem to have faith in the U.S. government--68% think a special investigator appointed to investigate the Russia hacking claim is a good idea, 24 points above those who believe in the Russia hacking claim. I guess the idea here is that we should investigate and find out whether there's any truth to it, whether the respondent personally believes in the claim or not. An admirable position to take--except of course that the government is full of shit and can't be expected to do its job honestly. But I think the American public should get a hat tip for preferring to make sure and find out the truth. Too bad they won't be vouchsafed that privilege.
I'm starting to think this is what the powers that run the U.S. are really like:
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Partisan bias is what fucked up the pre-election
"Clinton will become president" polls.
@Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal
As I vaguely understand it, even if some Dems have not yet DemExited/have been sucked back in with a hope of turning it democratic, they would probably continue to still form the smallest voter group, with Indies still probably forming the largest? (Would this be right, wrong or sideways?)
So even if more than half of Dems believe in Super-Putin, The Magical Election-Fixer, what actual population percentage would that work out to?
Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.
A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.
@Ellen North I'm not sure...
I'm not sure...
OK. 29% of the population is Democrats, 26% Republicans.
And last I noticed, 59% of Democrats believed in Super-Putin.
So what's 59% of 29%? 17% is what my calculator says. However, there are some indies and even a few Republicans who believe it too, so I'm guessing we're looking at between 25% and 30% of the population. But it feels like more, because all my liberal friends believe it!
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal
I'm sorry about your friends! It's extra-painful when people you know and care about are conned over to the Dark Side...
And thanks for the calculations! Although if the number of PR-swallowing Dems was around 17%, I wouldn't have guessed that anywhere near another potential 13% could be found among Indies and Repubs so often aware of the degree of Dem (if, in the latter case, too-often not of Repub.) propaganda and corruption at a higher level than the more auto-voting of the Dems. Guess the Trump thing worked to that extent...
My thought was that the bulk of those following the PR lines were likely be either participants in the propaganda or under-informed Dems, but, on the other hand, there are so many signs in too many people of media brainwashing shutting down critical thought in the face of reality where such as the Clintons/their paymasters are concerned...
According to this rather interesting breakdown:
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/08/01/us/elections/nine-percent...
Remember when we used to laugh at the right-wing nuttery, back before we (me, at least, belatedly) recognized it as actually general corporate/billionaire self-interest-sourced nonsense which had also worked on many of us, to at least some extent? (Well, me, anyway, some of it.) There's no time left to waste and windows still potentially leading to our survival within a civilized society are closing as we speak - yet there has to be a way to trigger independent thought in enough people in order to negate this...
The pathological self-interests sponsoring political corruption and global destruction using power and funds typically stolen from The People have got to be cleaned out of public policy - which is none of their business!
Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.
A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.
@Ellen North That part was
That part was a guess. Sorry, I should have made that clear.
59% of 29% is 17%, so 17% of the US population definitely believes in Super Putin.
I didn't figure out the exact percentages for indies and Republicans, but I will now, and we'll see how close my guess was...
33% of independents believe in Super Putin. I've seen both 43% and 42% as numbers of indies in the U.S. So 33% of 42% equals about 13%.
5% of Republicans believe in Super Putin. Republicans are 26% of the population. So 5% of 26% is .013%
By this reckoning, it would be a hair's-breadth above 30% of the population believes it.
But the study said 44% believe it--or, at least, 30% believe Russian interference "helped Trump a lot" and 14% believe it "helped him a little."
I'm gonna throw my hands up here and just say I'm not a social scientist and I'm not sure what mistake I'm making in the math.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Amazing how "hacked the DNC" became changing vote tallies.
I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.
@The Voice In the Wilderness Well, yeah,
Well, yeah, because "hacked the DNC" wasn't having the desired effect!
Even 35% compliance is a shit ROI for a nationally-saturated piece of propaganda like that.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@snoopydawg If any of it were real, I
If any of it were real, I'd guess because Obama actually hates Hillary's guts, and rightly so.
I may not like him, but what she did to him during the '08 election was off the charts horrible. Un-fucking-believable. Had people on both the left and the right shocked.
I don't think Obama is a very forgiving person. If any of this were real, which it ain't, I'd say it would give him a lot of pleasure to watch her taken down, as long as he couldn't be held accountable for it by their mutual bosses.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@snoopydawg Well, but--doing what?
Well, but--doing what?
That's the issue that often gets lost. When they initially said it was 8 states that were "hacked" I looked at them and half of them went for Hillary and half for Trump. Other than Florida, there's not one that surprised me.
North Carolina: Trump. Yeah, it's true that if all the left-wing white people and all the POC came out in NC while all the conservative Republicans stayed home, Hillary could have won it. But is it really surprising that the state that gave us the trans bathroom law voted Trump?
Illinois: Hillary is fucking from Illinois. Also, her friend Rahm Emmanuel runs Chicago and has plenty of power in the IL political machine. Trump didn't have much chance there.
Indiana: A midwestern state without a big city run by a Clinton henchman. The state which gave us Mike Pence and pray-the-gay-away. Is it surprising they voted Trump?
Virginia: A few years ago, Virginia going for Hillary would have been surprising. But lately, the demographics have shifted due to the increase of population in NOVA, near DC. Those parts of VA are tipping the balance toward DC establishment and toward Dems. It's also where the CIA lives, and mondo defense contractors. Who do you think they wanted in office? Now, if it had been a more establishment Republican running against Hillary, it might have been a better contest.
West Virginia. For fuck's sakes. Anybody who thinks this state would go Hillary has a problem with non-firing neurons. There are towns in West Virginia that have passed resolutions saying they don't want the Clintons to come there. How the hell anybody could think that WV would go Hillary is beyond me.
California. This is another "for fuck's sakes," just aimed in the opposite direction. California would be likelier to go for Jill Stein than Donald Trump.
New York. OK, I know Trump is from New York, unlike transplant Hillary. But come on. New York City, due to the increasing price of rent, is increasingly filled with the upper-middle class, many of whom think Hillary is just peachy. They certainly like her better than Trump, who is rich but doesn't act right in public. Besides, the international banking power has two main addresses in this nation: New York City and Chicago. Sort of like the military industrial complex lives in Northern Virginia and the Maryland suburbs of DC. Who the hell did we think the financial sector was going to vote for? Perhaps the person they paid large sums of money to so she could give them private speeches? A nice way to cover up the fact that they're actually giving her a paycheck. I mean, seriously, did anyone expect Hillary not to win New York?
Florida. This is the only one that surprised me a little, but only a little, because we are still essentially a swing state. I don't expect that to last as we move farther away from democracy and have a more and more unitary kangaroo electoral system (no diss to Aussies implied).
So what the fuck were the hackers after, trying to make sure the vote got counted accurately?
I guess we should...thank the Russians for trying to ensure an accurate vote count?
None of this makes any goddamned sense.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Nice value-added comment.
The state-by-state deconstruction is very helpful. It's what it is.
Until I see the IP addresses and associated code and server logs — I'm not buying intrusion, let alone Russian hacks of various states. I stand with the rest of the private security technology community who are well aware that — if it has Russian calling cards on it, it's definitely not Russian.
IMAGINE if you woke up the day after a US Presidential Election and headlines around the the world blared, "The Majority of Americans Refused to Vote in US Presidential Election! What Does this Mean?"
@Pluto's Republic I know, right? That
I know, right? That was the first red flag to me.
Felix Edmundovitch? Seriously?
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@Pluto's Republic Are our hackers out
Are our hackers out there calling themselves J Edgar Hoover, with this running constantly in the background?
Is this how espionage works these days?
Maybe I should start a renegade leftist anarchist group, call myself Emma Goldman, and play this in the background:
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
The number of states keeps going up and up and up
DK had a diary yesterday that stated Russia tried to hack into 39 state's elections and possibly change votes. It doesn't matter how many times someone says that no votes were changed during the election, all that matters is that someone is saying that Russia TRIED to do it.
The diary went on to blast Trump for not caring if that happened during the next election. Not one word about what Obama or our intelligence agencies did to stop that, just that Trump wasn't doing ANYTHING about it.
They are so blinded by Trump rage they can't look beyond him.
There were problems with running a campaign of Joy while committing a genocide? Who could have guessed?
Harris is unburdened of speaking going forward.
@snoopydawg OK, I wasn't going to
OK, I wasn't going to get into this, but this is another thing that makes me extremely unlikely to trust the establishment story.
This story began last summer, and massively accelerated in December and beyond. For about eleven months, then, there was no mention whatsoever of Russians hacking into our voting software. In fact, that was one of the critiques I had of the story--they'd talk about an election "hack" and then turned out what they were really talking about was Hillary's emails, the DNC's emails, and John Podesta's emails being leaked and published by Wikileaks. That was, supposedly, the Russian election hack, tovarisch.
The fact that this doesn't constitute an election hack, no matter who does it, but rather bears a closer resemblance to opposition research or even journalism, was often brought up by me and Henry among others. When the fuck did telling the truth about a politician become election fraud?
So, finally after about 11 months of pushing the "Russia hacked our elections because somehow they leaked actual true documents that reveal actual true conversations within the Democratic Party power structure to the general public" story, suddenly we get "Reality Winner" who risks her safety to leak a document that provides the public with no new information whatsoever, but does upgrade the establishment story to something that at least would be a hack if it were true. Still no evidence whatsoever. Why not? The two magic words: National Security.
It's the intellectual equivalent of dumping ketchup over rotten vegetables.
Here's the thing: I have no faith in somebody who cries wolf for 10-11 months, and then, when his cries don't have the desired effect on the townsfolk, starts alternating the cry of "Wolf!" with the cry of "Fire!" An actual intelligence agency with the capacities and resources of the NSA would have discovered that sort of hacking months before Reality Winner leaked a classified document. Did they discover it and keep it secret? If so, why? They didn't mind sharing their views with us on the DNC hack/Podesta phishing.
If they didn't discover it initially, why the hell did it take 9-10 months after they first got the idea that Russia was interfering with our elections to figure it out? I mean, they were talking about this to the public last July, weren't they? So presumably that means they would have known about it previous to *that*? And it takes them until what, March 2017 to figure out there was a hack into our elections systems' software? Who the hell are these guys? I mean, I thought we were paying a lot of money for these services (whether we want them or not) and now we find out it takes them 10 months to figure out that "the Russians" are hacking our voting software, when they already knew 10 months ago, according to them, that "the Russians" were going to try to interfere in the election?
Is this like when you know that "Bin Laden Determined to Strike Targets Within U.S." but somehow you colossally fuck up anyway?
Or is it more likely that the original OMG RUSSIA! story wasn't having the desired effect on the populace, and required an upgrade?
Thank you, Reality Winner, for delivering the patch. It's my sincere hope that you are an operative and not just a stupid person caught in the gears.
Now at least we have a hacking story that's about hacking. Still comprised of baseless claims, but hey! you can't have everything.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
YEP. Since the propaganda of Russia hacked the DNC
worked so well, tptb kept adding more and more unsubstantiated propaganda and the rubes are falling for it because it is the only explanation of why HRC could lose the election to Trump.
It isn't because she didn't go to the states he won, or that she was the most despised candidate the democrats ran in history, no, she lost because an outside interference made her lose.
When the truth showed that the DNC deliberately messed with the primary to make sure that HER won it.
There were problems with running a campaign of Joy while committing a genocide? Who could have guessed?
Harris is unburdened of speaking going forward.
@snoopydawg No, snoop, the
No, snoop, the point is, it DIDN'T work well. About a month ago, one poll showed 35% of the American public bought the Russia story. That is abysmal ROI, and an abysmal level of compliance. A good level of compliance, indicating a very successful piece of propaganda, was the 70% of Americans who believed we were going to war in Iraq because Saddam Hussein attacked us on 9/11. This Russia hack story is fucking abysmal. In politics, unlike in baseball, succeeding 1/3 of the time is not considered good--especially where propaganda is concerned.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal
And uses to allow those
to take all to do with future US elections away from any hope of public/independent oversight or investigation into questionable election results or massive voter disenfranchisement through such as altered party or other status at any or all stages.
Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.
A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.
@snoopydawg That idea still kind of
That idea still kind of blows my mind. Wikileaks must have paid them well, if that was the case--why the hell would the Awan brothers care about tyranny in the U.S.--why would they strike at people who were paying them and giving them access to private Congressional data?
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
The question should be why did DWS and other democrats
hire them to be in charge of their IT in the first place? Seriously, no one thought that hiring a company with ties to Pakistan was a bad idea? And after they were found to something criminal and the police took their computers for evidence, DWS threatened the police to return them.
Why isn't the media covering this? Or the DNC lawsuit? The threats to the lawyers who are bringing the lawsuit?
Or the biggest question: WHY HASN'T ANYONE COVERED WHAT THE LEAKED EMAIL SAID?
I know the answer.
The propaganda of Russia interfering with the election is sucking all the air out of the room.
There were problems with running a campaign of Joy while committing a genocide? Who could have guessed?
Harris is unburdened of speaking going forward.
@snoopydawg Absolutely with you.
Absolutely with you. That DWS thing stinks to high heaven. In a really old-fashioned way.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
You know...
come to think of it, I did see some horsemen in full 'K'ossack garb ride past the local polling place, sabres at the ready.
Putin even managed to have the horses imported beyond the scrutiny of Customs...!!?? He makes Blofeld and Goldstein seem like rank amateurs when it comes to pure villainy.
/s
Gëzuar!!
from a reasonably stable genius.
@Bollox Ref Those were Markos' forces
Those were Markos' forces. I know it's easy to make that mistake.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver