Leaving the 9/11/16 ceremonies in New York.
Approx 90 minutes after event started.
Went to daughter's apartment.
Campaign statement said something about her being bothered by the weather? Heat. Wrong day for that excuse.
Here she is, looks like collapsing, and being helped into her van.
"Our society is run by insane people for insane objectives. I think we're being run by maniacs for maniacal ends and I think I'm liable to be put away as insane for expressing that. That's what's insane about it."
-- John Lennon
Bothered by the heat? I would bet $100 against a stale cookie that the 'heat excuse' is a complete lie. This is not the heat, whether it was 72 deg. or 102 deg. This is something else, the Hillary campaign has made a conscious decision to mislead the public. It's just that simple.
She went as limp as a rag doll. No muscle control. I could see no evidence of her grabbing for either of the people who came to hold her up (or even grabbing for air as people tend to do when they are conscious of the fact that they are falling). I've tried to keep my "Hillary health" comments to a bare minimum and my mind open on this particular issue. But this was very, very bad. At least as far as I'm concerned.
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"Just call me Hillbilly Dem(exit)."
-H/T to Wavey Davey
I don't believe the Hillary campaign made a conscious decision to mislead the public. Misleading the public is the campaign's normal mode of behavior, the default manner in which they communicate information about the candidate. The only type of communication that would require a conscious decision by the campaign would be that rare instance when it decided to tell the truth.
She's leaning against the granite pillar(semi-unobtrusively) and she tries to step off the sidewalk she goes down. If old boy hadn't grabbed her right arm, she'd of hit the deck!
Medical episode my ass. She's done. Get ready for tRumpf. They will not let anyone take her place in this election.
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Ya got to be a Spirit, cain't be no Ghost. . .
Explain Bldg #7. . . still waiting. . .
If you’ve ever wondered whether you would have complied in 1930’s Germany,
Now you know. . .
sign at protest march
Get ready for tRumpf. They will not let anyone take her place in this election.
I wonder if there's a contingency in place for it, like they do have to put up an alternate on a ticket, in the event of illness or death. Where does one start looking?
Not that these folk are apt to obey arcane law, I'm just truly curious at this point...
this will BE the issue from here on out. tRumpf will make this(if it isn't already) the focus of attention. What arcane rules? Remember the parties are 'private entities' that can make up the rules as they go along. The candidates represent the parties, not the people. Democratic nominee, Republican nominee. Where is The People's nominee?
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Ya got to be a Spirit, cain't be no Ghost. . .
Explain Bldg #7. . . still waiting. . .
If you’ve ever wondered whether you would have complied in 1930’s Germany,
Now you know. . .
sign at protest march
Incident? What incident? Everything's fine here. No problem. You're just looking for a "CT" excuse to attack Clintons.
Betcha - deny, deny, deny, lie, lie, lie, lie, "oh that's old news" - "we're past that" - "fiction" - no story here.
Seriously - isn't that what they all did with the private email server in the basement of her Chappaqua mansion - which everyone at Clinton Global Foundation could read, so sync their efforts to make money out of anything she did as SOS? Again, no story here.
They're gonna try to hide their way to the election.
Our job is to stop them! "Your mission, should you accept it...."
In at least two cases (we're aware of), when the president became too ill to perform his duties, his wife took over (Reagan and Wilson). Obviously, this situation was hidden, as the Constitution states that the VP should have taken over. So, let's say Hillary wins (yuck, wash my mouth out), and becomes too ill to perform. By two laws, Bill Clinton can't take over--1. should be VP. 2. he's already served two terms. Since it's the Clintons, and the press was thrilled to report, in great detail, about the famous White House Blow Job, does anyone think we'll know who's running the country?
And another question: Why does Hillary always dress like it's the middle of winter, regardless of temp? Is there something wrong with the skin (or hair) on her arms? I had a female boss one time who had really long and dark arm hair. It was the source of many jokes. (she isn't a very nice person)
Hillary has appeared on a number of occasions in jackets with 3/4 length sleeves. I am of the same age and wear a lot of 3/4 length sleeves in public because they are more flattering to an older woman's arms. I am far fitter and thinner than Hillary but I feel more comfortable in 3/4 length sleeves. She was dressed in a suit and all the men around her were in suits also. I see nothing unusual that she had a suit with long sleeves on.
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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
ill prepared for the weather conditions, and that she claims she was overheated, but didn't take her jacket off.
Not so much the jacket per se, as I, too, gave up sleeveless tops years ago, more along the lines that she didn't remove her jacket when she got ill from being hot.
I remove mine when I get hot. I do not wait until I am unable to stand.
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"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
That if you are used to wearing suits you feel naked or too casual not wearing one, specially in formal occasions like today. Men wear suits in summer too, you know andno one is speculating about their supposedly repulsive arm hair.
Section 1. No person shall be elected to the office of the President more than twice, and no person who has held the office of President, or acted as President, for more than two years of a term to which some other person was elected President shall be elected to the office of the President more than once.
So you are doubly incorrect - the limit is 8 years tops, total, lifetime. "Consecutively" has nothing to do with it.
This video was definitely a medical episode being experienced by Hillary. I don't deny that there suspiciouscurious documented events that warrant looking at. I am, however, against gleeful speculation and armchair diagnosis. A bit of decorum is called for, not for Hillary but for c99.
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"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
What is to me surprising (ok, it shouldn't have been) is TOP (socalled "reality-based") now claiming that pneumonia is "is no big deal" and flagging, or even TO-ing anyone who disagrees, even they provide a link to a medical journal (one person's opinion, RWTP, etc.)
I'm truly shocked at the medical denialism there -- it's the equivalent of "flat-earthism" or climate change denial.
I don't know how good scientists / science writers like Meteor Blades, FooW, etc. can in all conscience continue posting there.
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There are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns – the ones we don't know we don't know.
Does have procedures in case a nominee needs to withdraw. Committee, vote, etc. some have said the committee is bound to pick the person with the next # of delegates, but I haven't seen convincing evidence of that.
And of course, it matters if it's pre election, ore electoral college, etc.
the route of denial and concealment and mocking those who say she's ill, ala Reagan and others, or, much less likely, Biden will be the replacement under Party rules. No way, no how, will the DNC pick Sanders. If the rules meant that the candidate with the second highest number of delegates would step in, they would say that. If the Democratic Party were about the will of voters, its behavior, from overturning primary results at conventions back in the day, to creating super delegates to supporting only New Democrats and only incumbents, has been a heck of a clever disguise.
Whether Clinton likes it or not, her "overheating" episode comes at a very bad time for her campaign. Thanks to the likes of Rudy Giuliani and a small but vocal element of the Republican base, talk of her health had been bubbling over the past week — triggered by a coughing episode she experienced during a Labor Day rally.
That talk was largely confined to Republicans convinced that Clinton has long been hiding some sort of serious illness. I wrote dismissively of that conspiracy theory in this space last week, noting that Clinton had been given an entirely clean bill of health by her doctors after an episode in which she fainted, suffered a concussion and then was found to have a blood clot in late 2012 and early 2013.
Coughing, I wrote, is simply not evidence enough of any sort of major illness that Clinton is assumed to be hiding. Neither, of course, is feeling "overheated." But those two things happening within six days of each other to a candidate who is 68 years old makes talk of Clinton's health no longer just the stuff of conspiracy theorists.
Campaigning is physically taxing. Watching your back and stressing about getting caught for all the underhanded bullshit you do on a pretty regular basis can be taxing too.
All that stress can weaken the immune system, especially the older we get.
I have had pneumonia twice now. There is no quick recovery, but there certainly can be a quick relapse.
Now that even the Clinton News Network is reporting about Hillaty's pneumonia, her health is going to become a legitimate front-row issue for discussion. As was mentioned prior to me posting this, it will be downplayed by the Democrats, for It's HER Turn no matter what. But the longer they stall, the more likely it is that Kaine becomes the president in function if not necessarily in form, assuming Trump doesn't now win. I doubt The Donald can now be stopped.
with WaPo's Cillizza. This "episode" or whatever it was, couldn't have come at a worse time for Hillary, or during a worse occasion. Physically, she'll probably recover - but politically she might very well not.
But then, I'm not really a credible source on what heat stroke weather is, as I personally can't tolerate well a temperature above 80 without a cooling breeze. But then from what I've heard, over 80 with a high humidity (75%) is about what it takes to induce heat stroke.
you're frantically running around and not drinking enough water. But $Hillary wasn't "frantically running around", so I don't know what's up with that.
I live in Arizona. During the summer monsoon season, the temperature averages mid-90s to low 100s and humidity can reach 70 to 80%. That's heat stroke weather, and occasionally people die from it. On the other hand, I've mowed my yard and repaired cars and done other heavy labor on afternoons with those conditions. I've never fainted or suffered any heat stroke symptoms. I make sure to keep well-hydrated and take a 10 minute break away from direct sunshine every hour or two. And by the way, I'm 60 years old and overweight.
my money would be on your prediction being correct, albeit my bet would be for a modest amount. The scandals should've been more than enough already if it wasn't for the 4th estate being in her pocket.
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I never knew that the term "Never Again" only pertained to
those born Jewish
"Antisemite used to be someone who didn't like Jews
now it's someone who Jews don't like"
Interesting, you can really see more of her collapsing on this video. Huma still trying to hold her up. This is now several times, when it order to stand STILL, not moving, she has had to lean on, or hold on to something. In this case, that cement pillar is really holding her up. Then, unable to move when she has to. Go back and look at the pics of her with Joe Biden at his 'old house' in Scranton - she is always holding on to something when she'd standing still.
No press allowed with her. She goes from daughter to Chappaqua. Takes her campaign 1 1/2 hours to even release that she was "over heated."
how many oldsters would catch it.
Cronkite changed the trajectory of the war, the presidential election, ultimately the world, by telling the truth.
Of all people, Brokaw!
Who knew?
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"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Stunned to hear Brokaw speak the truth so clearly.
Now have to hope there are enough intelligent journalists still around to join him.
Intelligent journalists? Oxymoron?
What hasn't (yet?) been mentioned, is how once again, the Clintons have managed to make their own personal issues The Subject, taking all attention away from the Most Important Issue of the Day: Memory of 9/11. Once again, it is about them, and not us.
And here I thought I didn't have any fucks left to give....
thinly disguised as a Secret Service person or aide.
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“What the herd hates most is the one who thinks differently; it is not so much the opinion itself, but the audacity of wanting to think for themselves, something that they do not know how to do.”
-Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)
I watched the videos multiple times, and couldn't tell is it was him or an AA secret service agent that opened the van door. Even if he wasn't there, I am sure he connected quickly with HRC at the apartment.
Once her always present medical handler had verified that she was at least for the moment stable they could then trot out the lie.
For the record I personally had an episode of heat exhaustion today and actually was inside cooling off from it when I started reading this thread. I was outside mowing my lawn at the time.
It was a pretty bad one, was dry heaving in the kitchen sink with the faucet pouring water over my head. I was totally unable to focus mentally, was panting like my dog after a vigorous round of Frisbee, etc.
But I also live in SW FLORIDA! It was 89F with about 65% humidity and my dumb ass pushed myself too long without a break and didn't drink anything prior except for a sugar Free Monster Ultra Sunrise energy drink. (Yeah, I know, I am a dumbass, lol! I do know better, yet do this to myself at least once every summer...)
Although I may be a dumbass, I was smart enough to convince an awesome, smart woman to marry me and now she is an RN. She works nights so was asleep, but apparently my panting and retching was so loud it woke her up and she came out and put cold compresses under my arms and on my neck and head and in 15 minutes I was back to normal, just a bit tired and overheated, but as I sit here in front of the fan typing this I feel a LOT better already.
If it was only heat stroke, they would have been able to correct this in a very short time and been able to have her make a statement herself and not 90 minutes later some flunky make it for her. They are not dumb enough to not know what the optics of that would be and wouldn't do so unless she wasn't capable yet of speaking for herself IMHO.
Well, that or they are woefully incompetent at messaging, something we know is not the case based on the amount of b.s. they have convinced the public to buy so far.
What I saw in Clinton I am pretty damn well certain was not heat stroke or heat exhaustion.
She didn't exhibit any of the other symptoms such as:
High body temperature ... A body temperature of 104 F (40 C) or higher is the main sign of heatstroke, this one we cannot know for certain for obvious reasons, but given the temperature factors, her lack of vigorous activity and not wearing heavy clothing makes her obtaining this level of body temp highly unlikely.
Altered mental state or behavior ... None of those interacting with her prior to the episode appeared to react in a manner that would indicate that they perceived her to be acting in an unusual manner.
Alteration in sweating ... None was apparent in the video
Nausea and vomiting ... Same as above
Flushed skin ... Also none noted in the video prior to her episode, and heat stroke does not come on that quickly given a lack of vigorous activity or or other outside forces to raise her body temperature to the levels necessary.
Rapid breathing ... Also not apparent in the video during the episode, but none noted immediately prior in other videos.
But wait for it, I think I hear the chants of "NothingBurger" coming from over the horizon...
(Edited to add a sentence I intended to put in and correct a couple typo's. Maybe I am not 100% yet after all, lol!)
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"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me
According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, on average, over 600 people die from complications related to extreme heat each year in the United States - more than tornadoes, hurricanes, flooding, lightning or any other weather event combined.
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make was that if it was heat exhaustion, she would have recovered enough in a short period of time that she could have personally put the issue to bed by making a statement herself, which she failed to do.
I had recovered from actual heat stroke in about 20 minutes with basic , minimal treatment. (My temperature when we took it after about 2 minutes of me cooling my head under the sink was at 104.8 according to her thermometer.)
Yeah, people do die from it, but it is very rare considering the number of people that do get heat stroke every year. I would venture to say that many of those that died probably also had serious underlying health conditions as well and didn't die from the heat stroke itself.
Check out the link on WebMD for more info, I just did and even they say 15 minutes should be enough time for noticeable improvement.
I guess the short version of what I was trying to say was that it was obviously not the much less severe heat exhaustion, nor heat stroke, neither of which would warrant a 90 minute delay in disclosure, nor for denying her press pool access to her that extended period of time.
Something is very suspicious, but then again, this is the Clinton's we are talking about and "Suspicious" is their trademark...
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"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me
her age or older. Who else got overheated? Any vids of emt's giving aid to anybody?
Normal wear and tear of aging my 64 yr old ass.
I picked up and carried 150 lbs. of feed from my truck to my barn in 95 degree heat yesterday, then yanked weeds out of my flower beds, then grilled steaks, then unloaded 4 sacks of garbage into my truck to take to the county facility, then worked in my law office a couple of hours, and moved patio furniture to get it into some shade, and THEN did house cleaning.
That is what normal for 64 is.
And I expect to do the same on Saturdays a few years from now.
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"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
I'm more or less 70 and live in the Caribbean where it never gets below 80 F. (Its usually about 85 F. July through October) in the daytime, and manage to walk about for hours at a time without fainting. I do have to drink a lot of ice water though. And I am not wearing a heavy black jacket either.
looks like as she was leaning against the stone column she tries to step, her knee buckles or twitches, her head bobs up and down. Then the large man is at her right, holding her and her right foot looks like it is lifted off the ground as her head dips down.
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FDR 9-23-33, "If we cannot do this one way, we will do it another way. But do it we will.
I have seen people faint (as well as fainting myself) and never saw/felt the head bobbing thing. Usually people just go down.
Of course, I'm not a doctor and do not know the range of symptoms of a human body overheating in mildly warm weather. But, to me, that is not someone fainting.
The close ups of her face today, before and after the incident, show that she is haggard. She didn't take the time to fix her hair as she usually does -- it's like she crawled out of bed and ran a comb through it. In other words, from a layperson's view, she looks ill.
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We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when we are afraid of the light.
--Plato
It's from behind, but to me looks very similar to the video in the coffee shop that Camp HRC has tried to sell as an exaggerated (on-purpose) reaction to the gaggle of reporters.
I had a number of near-fainting spells and from a tilt table test, was diagnosed with orthostatic hypotension.
The tilt table test is an evaluative clinical test to help identify postural hypotension, a common cause of presyncope or syncope.[2] A tilt angle of 60 and 70 degrees is optimal and maintains a high degree of specificity.[2] A positive sign with the tilt table test must be taken in context of patient history, with consideration of pertinent clinical findings before coming to a conclusion.
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There are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns – the ones we don't know we don't know.
There are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns – the ones we don't know we don't know.
Do we know for sure whether Kaine would even have a standing if Hillary had to drop out? Would the DNC have to hold a special session to nominate a candidate?
wasn't there something significant about Bernie not "giving up" his votes? Remember, he wouldn't make it unanimous. Something about his keeping his votes at the convention.
Maybe Bernie and Jane knew something about this a long time ago? Probably everyone at DNC, and in Hillaryland knew too.
Maybe the DNC will go with that proven aparatchik DWS The DNC likes insiders, after all.
They'll replace Clinton only if she collapses or asks to be replaced. In those situations, if the DNC does not want to see a Trump win (or maybe a Stein win which would be better unless you're a Dem insider, in which case it's much worse) , they'll have to call in Sanders. Because of the setback, anyone else they could pick will have to work really hard—maybe impossibly hard—to catch up to Trump. Kaine just won't cut it since he was chosen for his blandness and Biden is still pretty much a zero and will only appeal to the insiders (who might be too much in the bubble to realize this).
They'll replace Clinton only if she collapses or asks to be replaced.
Seriously, I'm inclined to believe what FSC's anonymous 'close friend' was reported to have said when the 'Ready For FSC' PAC was rolled out--that this is another 'two for the price of one' deal, that FSC would have been just as happy if she had left public life, and spent her time at home being a Grandmother--if it weren't for Bill's desire for a third term, due to the last two years of his Administration being mired in the Lewinsky scandal, and totally unproductive.
IOW, it's mostly about Bill's 'unfinished business.' (Who knows, it could partly be about his desire to 'reform' Social Security.)
So, (IMO) unless FSC is/becomes absolutely so ill that it can no longer be hidden from the public, I believe that she will remain the nominee.
IOW, I think that Bill is slated to be the 45th (unofficial) President--not FSC. I wonder--what does the Dem Party Leadership know about her medical issues (if there are any)? I'm sure we'll never know.
I do need more proof than what I've seen, before I'm totally convinced that she is very ill; but, some of the accounts of 'bodymen' holding her up, today's collapse, and even more pointedly--her prolonged absences from any campaign events, lack of press conferences,etc--are beginning to indicate to me that all may not be well. And, that it's not just the usual 'C' paranoia, at play--which is what I've attributed some of her actions to, before today.
Hey, thanks for the essay. Good question.
Mollie
“I believe in the redemptive powers of a dog’s love. It is in recognition of each dog’s potential to lift the human spirit, and, therefore, to change society for the better, that I fight to make sure every street dog has its day.” --Stasha Wong, Secretary, Save Our Street Dogs (SOSD)
In July I wrote about people saying Bernie's very careful getting his delegates recorded at the convention before he allowed her to be 'selected' SHOULD have preserved his right to be the alternate. What I had seen seemed compelling to me that this is why he did that the way he did.
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'What we are left with is an agency mandated to ensure transparency and disclosure that is actually working to keep the public in the dark' - Ann M. Ravel, former FEC member
what you've written is what I was trying to remember from the convention. Think it's now more significant.
Also really wonder if Bernie knew or knows anything about Clinton health?
Comments
Yeah, this one's scary....
"Our society is run by insane people for insane objectives. I think we're being run by maniacs for maniacal ends and I think I'm liable to be put away as insane for expressing that. That's what's insane about it."
-- John Lennon
This is bad.
Bothered by the heat? I would bet $100 against a stale cookie that the 'heat excuse' is a complete lie. This is not the heat, whether it was 72 deg. or 102 deg. This is something else, the Hillary campaign has made a conscious decision to mislead the public. It's just that simple.
She went as limp as a rag doll. No muscle control. I could see no evidence of her grabbing for either of the people who came to hold her up (or even grabbing for air as people tend to do when they are conscious of the fact that they are falling). I've tried to keep my "Hillary health" comments to a bare minimum and my mind open on this particular issue. But this was very, very bad. At least as far as I'm concerned.
"Just call me Hillbilly Dem(exit)."
-H/T to Wavey Davey
This!
Gëzuar!!
from a reasonably stable genius.
Or That
I don't believe the Hillary campaign made a conscious decision to mislead the public. Misleading the public is the campaign's normal mode of behavior, the default manner in which they communicate information about the candidate. The only type of communication that would require a conscious decision by the campaign would be that rare instance when it decided to tell the truth.
inactive account
Here's a news report on it...
Hillary Clinton Has A 'Medical Episode' At 9/11 Ceremony
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FfxU3JyNpQ]
“I never did give them hell. I just told the truth, and they thought it was hell.”
― Harry Truman
Holy shit!
She's leaning against the granite pillar(semi-unobtrusively) and she tries to step off the sidewalk she goes down. If old boy hadn't grabbed her right arm, she'd of hit the deck!
Medical episode my ass. She's done. Get ready for tRumpf. They will not let anyone take her place in this election.
Ya got to be a Spirit, cain't be no Ghost. . .
Explain Bldg #7. . . still waiting. . .
If you’ve ever wondered whether you would have complied in 1930’s Germany,
Now you know. . .
sign at protest march
Interesting statement
I wonder if there's a contingency in place for it, like they do have to put up an alternate on a ticket, in the event of illness or death. Where does one start looking?
Not that these folk are apt to obey arcane law, I'm just truly curious at this point...
I just meant
this will BE the issue from here on out. tRumpf will make this(if it isn't already) the focus of attention. What arcane rules? Remember the parties are 'private entities' that can make up the rules as they go along. The candidates represent the parties, not the people. Democratic nominee, Republican nominee. Where is The People's nominee?
Ya got to be a Spirit, cain't be no Ghost. . .
Explain Bldg #7. . . still waiting. . .
If you’ve ever wondered whether you would have complied in 1930’s Germany,
Now you know. . .
sign at protest march
The People's nominee was forced out n/t
There is no justice. There can be no peace.
Amen, T.O.M.
"Just call me Hillbilly Dem(exit)."
-H/T to Wavey Davey
Double Amen!
And now we've got this on our hands, or rather the PTB have this on their hands. Thanks, DNC. How in the heck are they going to spin this???
That was a scary vid, btw!
Bet they ignore it
Incident? What incident? Everything's fine here. No problem. You're just looking for a "CT" excuse to attack Clintons.
Betcha - deny, deny, deny, lie, lie, lie, lie, "oh that's old news" - "we're past that" - "fiction" - no story here.
Seriously - isn't that what they all did with the private email server in the basement of her Chappaqua mansion - which everyone at Clinton Global Foundation could read, so sync their efforts to make money out of anything she did as SOS? Again, no story here.
They're gonna try to hide their way to the election.
Our job is to stop them! "Your mission, should you accept it...."
This is an interesting conundrum.
In at least two cases (we're aware of), when the president became too ill to perform his duties, his wife took over (Reagan and Wilson). Obviously, this situation was hidden, as the Constitution states that the VP should have taken over. So, let's say Hillary wins (yuck, wash my mouth out), and becomes too ill to perform. By two laws, Bill Clinton can't take over--1. should be VP. 2. he's already served two terms. Since it's the Clintons, and the press was thrilled to report, in great detail, about the famous White House Blow Job, does anyone think we'll know who's running the country?
And another question: Why does Hillary always dress like it's the middle of winter, regardless of temp? Is there something wrong with the skin (or hair) on her arms? I had a female boss one time who had really long and dark arm hair. It was the source of many jokes. (she isn't a very nice person)
Long sleeves?
Hillary has appeared on a number of occasions in jackets with 3/4 length sleeves. I am of the same age and wear a lot of 3/4 length sleeves in public because they are more flattering to an older woman's arms. I am far fitter and thinner than Hillary but I feel more comfortable in 3/4 length sleeves. She was dressed in a suit and all the men around her were in suits also. I see nothing unusual that she had a suit with long sleeves on.
Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
I noted the long sleeves as being sort of
ill prepared for the weather conditions, and that she claims she was overheated, but didn't take her jacket off.
Not so much the jacket per se, as I, too, gave up sleeveless tops years ago, more along the lines that she didn't remove her jacket when she got ill from being hot.
I remove mine when I get hot. I do not wait until I am unable to stand.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
From personal experience I know
That if you are used to wearing suits you feel naked or too casual not wearing one, specially in formal occasions like today. Men wear suits in summer too, you know andno one is speculating about their supposedly repulsive arm hair.
Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur.
#2 is wrong
the deal is no president can serve more than 2 terms or 10 years consecutively so Billy boy is cleared to land
Exact Words
So you are doubly incorrect - the limit is 8 years tops, total, lifetime. "Consecutively" has nothing to do with it.
There is no justice. There can be no peace.
Whew!!! TY, T.O.M
was scared for a moment! Thank you - can breathe again
A lot can be said for the delivery.
This video was definitely a medical episode being experienced by Hillary. I don't deny that there
suspiciouscuriousdocumented events that warrant looking at. I am, however, against gleeful speculation and armchair diagnosis. A bit of decorum is called for, not for Hillary but for c99."Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
I agree with this.
What is to me surprising (ok, it shouldn't have been) is TOP (socalled "reality-based") now claiming that pneumonia is "is no big deal" and flagging, or even TO-ing anyone who disagrees, even they provide a link to a medical journal (one person's opinion, RWTP, etc.)
I'm truly shocked at the medical denialism there -- it's the equivalent of "flat-earthism" or climate change denial.
I don't know how good scientists / science writers like Meteor Blades, FooW, etc. can in all conscience continue posting there.
There are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns – the ones we don't know we don't know.
The dem party rules
Does have procedures in case a nominee needs to withdraw. Committee, vote, etc. some have said the committee is bound to pick the person with the next # of delegates, but I haven't seen convincing evidence of that.
And of course, it matters if it's pre election, ore electoral college, etc.
If she is ill, my speculation is that it will either go
the route of denial and concealment and mocking those who say she's ill, ala Reagan and others, or, much less likely, Biden will be the replacement under Party rules. No way, no how, will the DNC pick Sanders. If the rules meant that the candidate with the second highest number of delegates would step in, they would say that. If the Democratic Party were about the will of voters, its behavior, from overturning primary results at conventions back in the day, to creating super delegates to supporting only New Democrats and only incumbents, has been a heck of a clever disguise.
Of course, States and Federal play by different rules...
but remember, Missourians elected the dead candidate over Ashcroft!
Hillary Clinton’s health just became a real issue
in the presidential campaign
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/09/11/hillary-clinto...
Coughing + being too weak to walk could be pneumonia
Campaigning is physically taxing. Watching your back and stressing about getting caught for all the underhanded bullshit you do on a pretty regular basis can be taxing too.
All that stress can weaken the immune system, especially the older we get.
POTUS ain't no walk in the park either.
And So It Has Been Admitted
I have had pneumonia twice now. There is no quick recovery, but there certainly can be a quick relapse.
Now that even the Clinton News Network is reporting about Hillaty's pneumonia, her health is going to become a legitimate front-row issue for discussion. As was mentioned prior to me posting this, it will be downplayed by the Democrats, for It's HER Turn no matter what. But the longer they stall, the more likely it is that Kaine becomes the president in function if not necessarily in form, assuming Trump doesn't now win. I doubt The Donald can now be stopped.
This nation is about done, once and for all.
http://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2016/09/11/hillary-clinton-pneumonia-...
Vowing To Oppose Everything Trump Attempts.
For once, I agree
with WaPo's Cillizza. This "episode" or whatever it was, couldn't have come at a worse time for Hillary, or during a worse occasion. Physically, she'll probably recover - but politically she might very well not.
native
Wow! Pretty Crazy. nt
“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu
I think Alligator Ed has been an accurate observer of this
matter and those who read his diaries have been prepared for an episode like this one.
"The justness of individual land right is not justifiable to those to whom the land by right of first claim collectively belonged"
While it's still early,
Alligator Ed may have a giant "I told you so" to utter. Just sayin'.
"Just call me Hillbilly Dem(exit)."
-H/T to Wavey Davey
To Alligator Ed
I suggest a HUGE windsock/banner flying from the top of the Empire State Building
I dunno, I get the feeling our favorite Gator is a bit more...
laid back than that and would probably be happy with a beer and a, "My Bad."
But that windsock would be one hell of a nice gesture, lol!
"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me
I live about 30 minutes north of ground zero
Its just now reaching 77 degrees. 41% humidity, 20 mph breeze.
FDR 9-23-33, "If we cannot do this one way, we will do it another way. But do it we will.
Doesn't sound like heat stroke weather to me
But then, I'm not really a credible source on what heat stroke weather is, as I personally can't tolerate well a temperature above 80 without a cooling breeze. But then from what I've heard, over 80 with a high humidity (75%) is about what it takes to induce heat stroke.
You can get heat *exhaustion* in less, *if*
you're frantically running around and not drinking enough water. But $Hillary wasn't "frantically running around", so I don't know what's up with that.
There is no justice. There can be no peace.
May I jump in...
I live in Arizona. During the summer monsoon season, the temperature averages mid-90s to low 100s and humidity can reach 70 to 80%. That's heat stroke weather, and occasionally people die from it. On the other hand, I've mowed my yard and repaired cars and done other heavy labor on afternoons with those conditions. I've never fainted or suffered any heat stroke symptoms. I make sure to keep well-hydrated and take a 10 minute break away from direct sunshine every hour or two. And by the way, I'm 60 years old and overweight.
Yikes
I never wanted this lady to be president, but this is also not the way in which I would've wanted her not to accomplish that.
I hope she lives a long life enjoying her grandchildren after she either loses or drops out of this election.
I'm with #Jill
I never knew that the term "Never Again" only pertained to
those born Jewish
"Antisemite used to be someone who didn't like Jews
now it's someone who Jews don't like"
Heard from Margaret Kimberley
I could not agree more.
My sentiments exactly.
"Just call me Hillbilly Dem(exit)."
-H/T to Wavey Davey
Now waking up tomorrow to "breaking news"
that her heinous had to drop out due to "health concerns"
oh yes I'm a dreamer.
I never knew that the term "Never Again" only pertained to
those born Jewish
"Antisemite used to be someone who didn't like Jews
now it's someone who Jews don't like"
Heard from Margaret Kimberley
Hopefully the both of them...
I predicted that she would have to drop out, along with Trump, some weeks ago... although this was in reference to scandals, not health.
From the Light House.
If I was a betting man
my money would be on your prediction being correct, albeit my bet would be for a modest amount. The scandals should've been more than enough already if it wasn't for the 4th estate being in her pocket.
I never knew that the term "Never Again" only pertained to
those born Jewish
"Antisemite used to be someone who didn't like Jews
now it's someone who Jews don't like"
Heard from Margaret Kimberley
I will take it however it comes
This might be my last general election and i have no more fucks to give.
Also, heat my big fat Puerto Rican ass. That was the last four days. Today is cool and breezy here in NYC.
Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur.
Wow!!!
That video footage is quite something. She could barely move, and did she topple headfirst into the vehicle?
Gëzuar!!
from a reasonably stable genius.
another view of video
Yup, it's Breitbart - now reading many more sources than I used to read!
http://www.breitbart.com/2016-presidential-race/2016/09/11/hillary-clint...
Interesting, you can really see more of her collapsing on this video. Huma still trying to hold her up. This is now several times, when it order to stand STILL, not moving, she has had to lean on, or hold on to something. In this case, that cement pillar is really holding her up. Then, unable to move when she has to. Go back and look at the pics of her with Joe Biden at his 'old house' in Scranton - she is always holding on to something when she'd standing still.
No press allowed with her. She goes from daughter to Chappaqua. Takes her campaign 1 1/2 hours to even release that she was "over heated."
WOW.
Brokaw calling for her to see a neurologist:
http://www.breitbart.com/video/2016/09/11/brokaw-hillary-clinton-go-hosp...
WOW is right!
When you've lost Brokaw...
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Remember what we said when LBJ lost Cronkite?
Brokaw really reminds me of that time. Think there are now many more sane people who will speak up, after Brokaw has taken the lead.
Exactly what I was alluding to, wondering
how many oldsters would catch it.
Cronkite changed the trajectory of the war, the presidential election, ultimately the world, by telling the truth.
Of all people, Brokaw!
Who knew?
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Strange days indeed.
And more yet to come, unless I miss my guess.
native
"oldster" indeed, you made me smile :)
Stunned to hear Brokaw speak the truth so clearly.
Now have to hope there are enough intelligent journalists still around to join him.
Intelligent journalists? Oxymoron?
What hasn't (yet?) been mentioned, is how once again, the Clintons have managed to make their own personal issues The Subject, taking all attention away from the Most Important Issue of the Day: Memory of 9/11. Once again, it is about them, and not us.
And here I thought I didn't have any fucks left to give....
We have no way of knowing
We have no way of knowing that she didn't already see one...say at Chelsea's apartment? No doubt HRC would avoid the hospital setting at all costs.
She very likely travels with one already.
thinly disguised as a Secret Service person or aide.
“What the herd hates most is the one who thinks differently; it is not so much the opinion itself, but the audacity of wanting to think for themselves, something that they do not know how to do.”
-Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)
Yes, I believe a Dr. Ola?
I watched the videos multiple times, and couldn't tell is it was him or an AA secret service agent that opened the van door. Even if he wasn't there, I am sure he connected quickly with HRC at the apartment.
No, it's not Dr. Ola.
Her big black shadow is someone else. His identity and role have not yet been revealed.
native
It probably took them so long because they had to make sure
she wouldn't need to be rushed to the hospital...
Once her always present medical handler had verified that she was at least for the moment stable they could then trot out the lie.
For the record I personally had an episode of heat exhaustion today and actually was inside cooling off from it when I started reading this thread. I was outside mowing my lawn at the time.
It was a pretty bad one, was dry heaving in the kitchen sink with the faucet pouring water over my head. I was totally unable to focus mentally, was panting like my dog after a vigorous round of Frisbee, etc.
But I also live in SW FLORIDA! It was 89F with about 65% humidity and my dumb ass pushed myself too long without a break and didn't drink anything prior except for a sugar Free Monster Ultra Sunrise energy drink. (Yeah, I know, I am a dumbass, lol! I do know better, yet do this to myself at least once every summer...)
Although I may be a dumbass, I was smart enough to convince an awesome, smart woman to marry me and now she is an RN.
She works nights so was asleep, but apparently my panting and retching was so loud it woke her up and she came out and put cold compresses under my arms and on my neck and head and in 15 minutes I was back to normal, just a bit tired and overheated, but as I sit here in front of the fan typing this I feel a LOT better already.
If it was only heat stroke, they would have been able to correct this in a very short time and been able to have her make a statement herself and not 90 minutes later some flunky make it for her. They are not dumb enough to not know what the optics of that would be and wouldn't do so unless she wasn't capable yet of speaking for herself IMHO.
Well, that or they are woefully incompetent at messaging, something we know is not the case based on the amount of b.s. they have convinced the public to buy so far.
What I saw in Clinton I am pretty damn well certain was not heat stroke or heat exhaustion.
She didn't exhibit any of the other symptoms such as:
High body temperature ... A body temperature of 104 F (40 C) or higher is the main sign of heatstroke, this one we cannot know for certain for obvious reasons, but given the temperature factors, her lack of vigorous activity and not wearing heavy clothing makes her obtaining this level of body temp highly unlikely.
Altered mental state or behavior ... None of those interacting with her prior to the episode appeared to react in a manner that would indicate that they perceived her to be acting in an unusual manner.
Alteration in sweating ... None was apparent in the video
Nausea and vomiting ... Same as above
Flushed skin ... Also none noted in the video prior to her episode, and heat stroke does not come on that quickly given a lack of vigorous activity or or other outside forces to raise her body temperature to the levels necessary.
Rapid breathing ... Also not apparent in the video during the episode, but none noted immediately prior in other videos.
But wait for it, I think I hear the chants of "NothingBurger" coming from over the horizon...
(Edited to add a sentence I intended to put in and correct a couple typo's. Maybe I am not 100% yet after all, lol!)
"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me
There's a difference between heat exhaustion and heat stroke;
"only" heat stroke? Heat stroke can be fatal. http://www.accuweather.com/en/weather-news/what-is-heat-exhaustion-heat-...
Please check out Pet Vet Help, consider joining us to help pets, and follow me @ElenaCarlena on Twitter! Thank you.
Yeah, I am aware of the differences, my point, which I failed to
make was that if it was heat exhaustion, she would have recovered enough in a short period of time that she could have personally put the issue to bed by making a statement herself, which she failed to do.
I had recovered from actual heat stroke in about 20 minutes with basic , minimal treatment. (My temperature when we took it after about 2 minutes of me cooling my head under the sink was at 104.8 according to her thermometer.)
Yeah, people do die from it, but it is very rare considering the number of people that do get heat stroke every year. I would venture to say that many of those that died probably also had serious underlying health conditions as well and didn't die from the heat stroke itself.
Check out the link on WebMD for more info, I just did and even they say 15 minutes should be enough time for noticeable improvement.
I guess the short version of what I was trying to say was that it was obviously not the much less severe heat exhaustion, nor heat stroke, neither of which would warrant a 90 minute delay in disclosure, nor for denying her press pool access to her that extended period of time.
Something is very suspicious, but then again, this is the Clinton's we are talking about and "Suspicious" is their trademark...
"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me
Wouldn't they take off her wool jacket in either case?
I am not medically trained, but if I was feeling overheated, that's the first thing I would do!
"All Life is Problem Solving" - Karl Popper
Can't someone give the poor lady some water?
Her puppet masters from Coca Cola, Pepsico and Nestle could at least see to it that her handlers were supplied with iced bottled water...
From the Light House.
I clicked on the link, but didn't see video?
I just saw a picture with a little story talking about what happened.
Am I missing something?
Thanks
here is a link
Embedded in this all day story, there are several videos that show the incident from 2 different angles.
http://www.breitbart.com/2016-presidential-race/2016/09/11/hillary-clint...
.....
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmoD8bGaCAY]
I am sure there were people attending that are
her age or older. Who else got overheated? Any vids of emt's giving aid to anybody?
Normal wear and tear of aging my 64 yr old ass.
I picked up and carried 150 lbs. of feed from my truck to my barn in 95 degree heat yesterday, then yanked weeds out of my flower beds, then grilled steaks, then unloaded 4 sacks of garbage into my truck to take to the county facility, then worked in my law office a couple of hours, and moved patio furniture to get it into some shade, and THEN did house cleaning.
That is what normal for 64 is.
And I expect to do the same on Saturdays a few years from now.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Finally, the proof
Heat my ass.
I'm more or less 70 and live in the Caribbean where it never gets below 80 F. (Its usually about 85 F. July through October) in the daytime, and manage to walk about for hours at a time without fainting. I do have to drink a lot of ice water though. And I am not wearing a heavy black jacket either.
From the Light House.
Damn, thanks for making me feel like a total slacker... ;)
You got
exactlyAlmost two decades on me and just reading that made me tired, lol!(Edited, apparently my math skills still suck as 18 years is not two decades, but then again that was the case before the heat stroke too, lol!)
"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me
18 is almost 2 decades, you big wuss! lol!
Take good care of you!
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Watch her right foot
looks like as she was leaning against the stone column she tries to step, her knee buckles or twitches, her head bobs up and down. Then the large man is at her right, holding her and her right foot looks like it is lifted off the ground as her head dips down.
FDR 9-23-33, "If we cannot do this one way, we will do it another way. But do it we will.
I noticed head bobbing, too.
I have seen people faint (as well as fainting myself) and never saw/felt the head bobbing thing. Usually people just go down.
Of course, I'm not a doctor and do not know the range of symptoms of a human body overheating in mildly warm weather. But, to me, that is not someone fainting.
The close ups of her face today, before and after the incident, show that she is haggard. She didn't take the time to fix her hair as she usually does -- it's like she crawled out of bed and ran a comb through it. In other words, from a layperson's view, she looks ill.
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when we are afraid of the light.
--Plato
The head bobbing.
It's from behind, but to me looks very similar to the video in the coffee shop that Camp HRC has tried to sell as an exaggerated (on-purpose) reaction to the gaggle of reporters.
Not.
I had the same thought.
"Just call me Hillbilly Dem(exit)."
-H/T to Wavey Davey
At least during that incident she was standing/moving
Here, if it hadn't been for the concrete post and staff, she would have taken a nosedive into the ground...... likely suffering a nasty head injury.
This seems far more serious.
Gëzuar!!
from a reasonably stable genius.
Dorsiflex is the First Thing I Thought, and I don't Recall it
being a sign of fainting or heat exhaustion.
“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu
It's known medically as
presyncope or colloquially, as "near syncope".
I had a number of near-fainting spells and from a tilt table test, was diagnosed with orthostatic hypotension.
There are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns – the ones we don't know we don't know.
It could also be orthostatic hypotension. nt
There are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns – the ones we don't know we don't know.
Yup.
I just checked NYC weather. Temp is 80. Nope.
If she steps down does the Dem party go with Bernie?
Is that possible?
The political revolution continues
It Will be Kaine, Because Bernie LOST! Get Over It Hippie...
I can't see Bernie getting close to the Presidency.
Kaine will save us all. Kaine is Able. /blech
“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu
he's not the VP yet...
Do we know for sure whether Kaine would even have a standing if Hillary had to drop out? Would the DNC have to hold a special session to nominate a candidate?
Your title made me laugh.
Thanks.
It was either that, or cry ...
Gallows Humor is Better Than the Alternative. nt
“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu
Gallows humor
is better than the gallows for sure. Nice title on video up thread on becoming the walking dead, politically, we can hope.
Ya got to be a Spirit, cain't be no Ghost. . .
Explain Bldg #7. . . still waiting. . .
If you’ve ever wondered whether you would have complied in 1930’s Germany,
Now you know. . .
sign at protest march
It made me laugh as well, but it also gave me flashbacks... ;)
for a second I thought I accidentally clicked a link and ended up at TOP. Teeheehee
"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me
But, but, but
wasn't there something significant about Bernie not "giving up" his votes? Remember, he wouldn't make it unanimous. Something about his keeping his votes at the convention.
Maybe Bernie and Jane knew something about this a long time ago? Probably everyone at DNC, and in Hillaryland knew too.
The clueless DNC to the rescue?
Maybe the DNC will go with that proven aparatchik DWS
The DNC likes insiders, after all.
They'll replace Clinton only if she collapses or asks to be replaced. In those situations, if the DNC does not want to see a Trump win (or maybe a Stein win which would be better unless you're a Dem insider, in which case it's much worse) , they'll have to call in Sanders. Because of the setback, anyone else they could pick will have to work really hard—maybe impossibly hard—to catch up to Trump. Kaine just won't cut it since he was chosen for his blandness and Biden is still pretty much a zero and will only appeal to the insiders (who might be too much in the bubble to realize this).
That certainly would be the moral thing to do.
Beware the bullshit factories.
Well, if it is the Moral thing to do then we can remove that
option from the equation.
This is the DNC we are talking about after all...
"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me
Agree with half of that comment,
Seriously, I'm inclined to believe what FSC's anonymous 'close friend' was reported to have said when the 'Ready For FSC' PAC was rolled out--that this is another 'two for the price of one' deal, that FSC would have been just as happy if she had left public life, and spent her time at home being a Grandmother--if it weren't for Bill's desire for a third term, due to the last two years of his Administration being mired in the Lewinsky scandal, and totally unproductive.
IOW, it's mostly about Bill's 'unfinished business.' (Who knows, it could partly be about his desire to 'reform' Social Security.)
So, (IMO) unless FSC is/becomes absolutely so ill that it can no longer be hidden from the public, I believe that she will remain the nominee.
IOW, I think that Bill is slated to be the 45th (unofficial) President--not FSC. I wonder--what does the Dem Party Leadership know about her medical issues (if there are any)? I'm sure we'll never know.
I do need more proof than what I've seen, before I'm totally convinced that she is very ill; but, some of the accounts of 'bodymen' holding her up, today's collapse, and even more pointedly--her prolonged absences from any campaign events, lack of press conferences,etc--are beginning to indicate to me that all may not be well. And, that it's not just the usual 'C' paranoia, at play--which is what I've attributed some of her actions to, before today.
Hey, thanks for the essay. Good question.
Mollie
“I believe in the redemptive powers of a dog’s love. It is in recognition of each dog’s potential to lift the human spirit, and, therefore, to change society for the better, that I fight to make sure every street dog has its day.”
--Stasha Wong, Secretary, Save Our Street Dogs (SOSD)
National Mill Dog Rescue (NMDR) - Dogs Available For Adoption
Update: Misty May has been adopted. Yeah!
Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.
I still believe it would be Bernie if it's before October
In July I wrote about people saying Bernie's very careful getting his delegates recorded at the convention before he allowed her to be 'selected' SHOULD have preserved his right to be the alternate. What I had seen seemed compelling to me that this is why he did that the way he did.
'What we are left with is an agency mandated to ensure transparency and disclosure that is actually working to keep the public in the dark' - Ann M. Ravel, former FEC member
thanks MsGrin
what you've written is what I was trying to remember from the convention. Think it's now more significant.
Also really wonder if Bernie knew or knows anything about Clinton health?
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