Nero

Could we have a candidate, a leader, advocating for peace in this world?

Parties be damned, money be damned, nations be damned, religions be damned.

Peace to all people,

let the bells ring.

"War, what is it good for? Absolutely nothing."

It astonishes me that no one running for office in my lifetime has truly advocated for peace; a few at best giving lip-service to the term have always couched it in nationalistic terms of American power first.

The word perilous can't describe our global situation and it matters not to humanity if fires set intentionally or by accident consume them, we all burn in the same atmosphere in which 'we all breathe.'

Peace.

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Lookout's picture

It astonishes me that no one running for office in my lifetime has truly advocated for peace; a few at best giving lip-service to the term have always couched it in nationalistic terms of American power first.

Gene McCarthy
George McGovern

More recently Mike Gravel and Tulsi (2 min)

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“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”

smiley7's picture

@Lookout

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smiley7's picture

@Lookout
American candidate like Mahatma Gandhi. Just straight-up non-violence, period. i recall Obama saying there is evil in this world in attempting to justify war, but if someone actually lead by example by putting down the sword, no matter what... we haven't tried this as naive as my appeal may seem.

Thanks for joining in the conversation, feeling helpless today.

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thanatokephaloides's picture

@smiley7

but if someone actually lead by example by putting down the sword, no matter what... we haven't tried this as naive as my appeal may seem.

It is, unfortunately, naive. Any nation which refuses to take up the sword will be swiftly conquered by those who don't. This is an unfortunate occupational hazard of humans having governments at all. Once put into existence, organizations defend their own existence; and when those organizations are public authorities, that defense is always violence. So long as we have nation states, this will remain the case. It was instrumental in why the first President of newly-independent India wasn't Mahatma Gandhi, but rather Jawaharlal Nehru, who was more willing to deal with these facts than Gandhi was. Satyagraha, while meritorious, will only take you so far in the nasty, dirty business of actually running a nation state, and Nehru dealt with that unpleasant fact by taking up the sword to defend India. If Nehru had not done so, China would have conquered India soon after its conquest of Tibet in the 1950s.

The only cure for this problem is for humanity to evolve beyond the use of nation states, and beyond the use of pecking-order authority in general. No one now reading this message will live to see that necessary evolutionary step accomplished; hence my use of the term "unfortunately".

Sad

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"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg

smiley7's picture

@thanatokephaloides
historically correct; maybe we can turn back, as Ike warned, the MIC and rushing into war.

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travelerxxx's picture

There may be some leaders who stand for peace in this world, although none come to mind immediately. American mass media would obscure them anyway.

I do know this: John Bolton and Mike Pompeo are the direct opposite of advocates for peace, hence the guy who hired them — knowing this — is even more heinous than are they.

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smiley7's picture

@travelerxxx
and candidates for president on MSM last evening lacking to say the least, not one of them rallied publicly against the strike upon Iran they were informed of at WH or after Pelosi's caucus meeting to my knowledge, going along with the initial strike plans as i understand yesterday's events.

They may have argued against the strike behind closed doors, but we have a right to know what's up when going to war.

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travelerxxx's picture

@smiley7

I can think of no one in an American leadership position, or even close to it, who would not stand directly behind Bolton, Pompeo, and their boss Trump, in support of them attacking any country of brown people. This includes the entire Democratic political leadership. In fact, it appears the Democrats are even worse than the Republicans, at least a few of whom are pushing back slightly against Trump's military belligerence and dangerous bluster.

Congresswoman Ilhan Omar had it dead on target when she said, “It’s all about the Benjamins baby.” Now, whenever contemplating American foreign policy, I consider her statement. Go back as far as you want in American history; there have been very few exceptions to that observation.

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gulfgal98's picture

@smiley7 Tulsi Gabbard has been on the forefront against all regime change wars. She recently said that going to war with Iran would be devastating.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/rep-gabbard-tells-tucker-carlson-war-wi...

Yes, I know that Tulsi is not one of the top candidates, and perhaps her comments were not anti war enough for some, but to me she was very clear in where she stands and has never equivocated.

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"I don't want to run the empire, I want to bring it down!" ~Dr. Cornel West

"There is no instance of a nation benefitting from prolonged warfare." Sun Tzu

"Propaganda is one hell of a drug." Abby Martin

"Politicians are cowards." Mike Gravel

smiley7's picture

@gulfgal98
equivocation, like Gandhi is closer to my motivation for posting and secondly, didn't see her or Bernie say, "No more war" yesterday or today and i wanted them to.

American exceptionalism has political restraints Bernie and Tulsi operate under
in my view and i suggest today, almost in fantasy, that we and they support breaking from reality and turning the other cheek for once, give 'all' of peace a try.

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Unabashed Liberal's picture

@smiley7 @smiley7

told Chuck Todd in a MTP interview (today) that he pulled back right before the strike plans were finalized, and, carried out.

(Supposedly, about 10 minutes before the aircraft were slated to take off.)

[Edited: Oops! 'understanding' not 'understand']

Mollie

“Dogs have given us their absolute all. We are the center of their universe. We are the focus of their love and faith and trust. They serve us in return for scraps. It is without a doubt the best deal man has ever made.
~~Roger Caras

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Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.

smiley7's picture

@Unabashed Liberal
say she didn't know or something to that effect about an hour ago. But that still does not excuse her or Chuck or any congresscriter from taking to the mikes yesterday and saying HELL NO, no more war.

If Pelosi's statement this afternoon is true, then we are in even deeper shit as you write it appears, Trump did notinform the "bipartisan" leadership.

Lies all around, i fear.

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Unabashed Liberal's picture

@smiley7

being in 'deep shyte' Smile )

Hey, I, too, look forward to your uplifting OT, tomorrow. They always do my weary soul a lot of good. If I don't chime in, it'll only be because we're on the road, and I can't. I look forward to reading it, though. (Thank goodness for smart phones. Pleasantry )

Have a nice weekend, if I don't run into you again.

Mollie

“Dogs have given us their absolute all. We are the center of their universe. We are the focus of their love and faith and trust. They serve us in return for scraps. It is without a doubt the best deal man has ever made.
~~Roger Caras

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Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.

smiley7's picture

@Unabashed Liberal
Always a pleasure. Smile

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ggersh's picture

@travelerxxx who hired her heinous who then actually waged some
serious shit. Do you not for one moment think if her
heinous was in charge the bombs wouldn't be falling on
Iran?

Per zerohedge, the idiot in charge measures everything by
god only knows, but in this moment it was body count that
stopped tinyhands from retaliating......I really can't fathom
that her heinous woulda done the same.

he's nothing but a bully and a bad one at that, you stand
up to him and he's clueless

https://www.zerohedge.com/

do know this: John Bolton and Mike Pompeo are the direct opposite of advocates for peace, hence the guy who hired them — knowing this — is even more heinous than are they.

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12 users have voted.

trump will be amerika's last president

so now that the D's are a wholly owned subsidiary of the CIA
anyone saying that we live in democracy is a conspiracy theorist.

smiley7's picture

@ggersh

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travelerxxx's picture

@ggersh

Do you not for one moment think if her heinous was in charge the bombs wouldn't be falling on Iran?

Do I think that Her would be bombing Iran right now?

Actually, no. I think we'd all be radioactive ash by this time, that's what I think. As bad as Trump seems to be, with Hillary Clinton we'd all be dead already — with the possible exception of some in the southern hemisphere.

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@ggersh voice Wikileaks cable showed her saying a 'no fly zone' "would kill a lot of Syrians" but her Public voice doggedly pushed for the 'no fly zone'.

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@ggersh voice Wikileaks cable showed her saying a 'no fly zone' "would kill a lot of Syrians" but her Public voice doggedly pushed for the 'no fly zone'.

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@travelerxxx Trump called off the strike...asking about human casualties and decided such a strike would be disproportionate.

Well, well, well.....and now the dems are hissing and spitting about him for this decision.

(but we all know he's gonna blow up the whole world someday, right???)

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dfarrah

travelerxxx's picture

@dfarrah

... but we all know he's gonna blow up the whole world someday, right???

We know nothing of the kind. However, with Bolton and Pompeo on the clock the chances move in ominous directions. Bolton is especially worrisome; in fact I consider him to be quite mad. Pompeo is just a Koch-planted whore. In fact, California-boy Pompeo has been a whore for the Koch klan since his carpetbagger days in Kansas. He still is.

By the way, who hired those two?

As for Trump, the ultimate narcissist, ratings are everything. Evidently, there must be some talking heads on Fox that made him doubt the Netanyahu front-man, Bolton. We can thank our lucky stars for that, I guess.

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snoopydawg's picture

@travelerxxx

were all on board with the attack, but people are leaving out Bibi. He doesn't care how many Americans die in the war on Iran and you can be damned sure that no Israeli troops will because they never have to fight in the wars that we fight for Israel. In fact the only time Israeli troops do fight is either from the safety of their jets or when they are killing unarmed Palestinians..

I'm betting that Bibi was fuming when he found out that Trump stopped the attack. lol.

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America is a pathetic nation; a fascist state fueled by the greed, malice, and stupidity of her own people.
- strife delivery

travelerxxx's picture

@snoopydawg

I haven't forgotten Netanyahu, but yes, I could have mentioned him as he's riding in the same clown car ... perhaps even driving.

I wish it were possible for a clandestine recording of a high level national security meeting of Israeli leaders to be made public to the world — Americans, especially. Would it even faze Americans to listen to the Israeli political and military leaders discussing how they intend to goad America into sending their sons and daughters to die for Israel's benefit? I wonder whether they discuss the numbers of American troops that they estimate would perish to further their apartheid state? Do you imagine they discuss the hundreds and hundreds of billions of dollars of America's treasure they intend to waste? Do you suppose some of them laugh out loud at our naivety and unbelievable foolishness?

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snoopydawg's picture

@travelerxxx

while the American people are suffering because the amount of money spent on war are our sanctions. I'm working on an essay on how bad things are for so many people here whilst congress just passed another obscene military budget that was increased more than Trump asked for? Why? For our upcoming war with Russia or China or...

Here's a good article about how the sanctions on Venezuela are hurting Americans.

How the Coup in Venezuela and the US Housing Crisis are Inextricably Connected

The United States economy is organized such that all commodities, including both weapons and housing, drive the lion’s share of profits upward, into the pockets of a wealthy elite class, at the expense of the masses of working people who generate those profits through their labor power. The functioning of this system in the interest of a tiny few at the expense of the many is made equally apparent by the orchestration of war against Venezuela by the U.S. ruling class and the orchestration of a massive housing crisis within U.S. borders by wealthy developers.

Meanwhile, in the cities of Washington and Baltimore, a small minority of wealthy developers are the controlling force in making housing policy — a function carried out with the assistance of banks and political administrators like Mayor Muriel Bowser of Washington, whose office released a press statement earlier this year titled, “Bowser Makes Historic $138 Million Investment in Affordable Housing.” However, the reality on the ground is thousands of homeless families and children — with 19 percent of the total D.C. population living in poverty, while the city boasts a $14.5 billion budget, with $2.4 billion in reserve. Meanwhile, in Baltimore, approximately 7,000 families get evicted yearly for nonpayment of rent.

Clearly, problems like the affordable housing crisis or underfunding of schools and hospitals could be alleviated if our country prioritized the needs of the masses of working people over the needs of weapons manufacturers and oil barons. To make clear the contradiction between the United States’ stated values and actions, let’s consider the function of the U.S. economy and U.S. foreign policy, whom these policies are intended to benefit, and whom these policies leave out of the picture.

What does the war economy have to do with the housing crisis?

The war economy is the last stage of a capitalist empire. It is when the rich resort to using war to violently force open new markets so they can invest the surplus value (profit) they’ve accumulated to continue making new profits. The U.S. military serves as a battering ram for U.S. corporations seeking to exploit a foreign country such as Venezuela or Iran. Non-military industries like the U.S. oil industry, banking, fast-food, soda, car manufacturing, or technology industries have historically leaned heavily on the U.S. military’s ability to overthrow governments and install puppet leaders who create a favorable environment for investment and profit making.

Despite worker productivity reaching historic highs, wages remain stagnant. Coinciding with massive increases in living costs, particularly the cost of rent, the war economy has displaced over 20,000 people, primarily native Washingtonians right here in Washington, D.C. No amount of tweeting will convince working-class people that the war economy, under both Obama and Trump, hasn’t failed them.

Trump's budget for domestic stuff cuts $1.5 trillion in 10 years from our social programs including social security and Medicare. Gee...wasn't that amount how much the tax cuts added to the deficit?

HUD housing is a f'cking joke. It's already underfunded and people have to wait 2-8 on lists to get apartments or section 8 vouchers. You should see what the apartments and houses for it look like.

But of course there is always enough money for our special interests wars!

Would it even phase Americans to listen to the Israeli political and military leaders discussing how they intend to goad America into sending their sons and daughters to die for Israel's benefit?

I would like to think that if we could sit in on the war planning meetings that yes it would make people think about sending their families to war. I just don't understand why people don't see already that the military is not fighting for our country, but for big oil and the defense companies profits! But on my local news site in the articles that talk about Iran people are all for a war. They parrot the propaganda that Iran is the biggest sponsor of terrorism and that they hate America. As Caitlin says, "those that control the narrative..." this is why we are constantly bombarded with propaganda. It works.

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America is a pathetic nation; a fascist state fueled by the greed, malice, and stupidity of her own people.
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travelerxxx's picture

@snoopydawg

I already mentioned something from this month's Harper's in a previous post, but I'm going to do another one. It seems appropriate. This from the Harper's Index:

Number of U.S. counties in which a full-time worker making minimum wage can afford a one-bedroom apartment: 22

In which that worker can afford a two-bedroom apartment: 0

But we can somehow always find the benjamins to bomb brown people.

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snoopydawg's picture

@snoopydawg

Working class under attack in D.C. and Baltimore

Working class residents in both Washington and Baltimore have been caught in the throes of the carnage wreaked by wealthy developers, including slumlords operating with little accountability. In both cities, tenants and organizers have been fighting back through grassroots organizing campaigns that have exposed the practices of elected officials and developers working together closely to oversee the displacement of working-class people and the rapid gentrification of both cities.

Brookland Manor, a 535-unit affordable housing complex in Ward 5 of Northeast Washington, has some of the few remaining affordable family-sized apartments left in the city, including three-, four- and five-bedroom units. It is also the site of a $600 million proposed luxury redevelopment project pushed by developer MidCity Financial. The project will reduce overall affordability in the historically black working-class neighborhood, and eliminate almost all of the multi-bedroom size units. The plan? To replace 535 units of affordable housing with over 1,750 luxury apartments; tripling density on 20 acres of land.

Meanwhile tens of thousands of people are losing their jobs after companies promised Trump that if he cut their taxes they would give people raises, but instead they are closing their companies and laying people off. So people are not only unable to find places to live they are also having to look for jobs in the decreasing job market.

$7 trillion for wars in less than 20 years on top of the pentagon not knowing how they can't account for the missing $21 trillion. We must find a way to stop congress from destroying our country. I just wish I knew how. Massive work stoppages and boycotting the companies that receiving huge subsidies even though they have offshored their companies. Like Facebook, Google and Apple that are moving to Israel after laying off Americans, but still receiving subsidies. This is just robbery IMO..

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America is a pathetic nation; a fascist state fueled by the greed, malice, and stupidity of her own people.
- strife delivery

smiley7's picture

@snoopydawg
for your good posts in this essay, appreciate your contributions and work.

Hope the critters are healthy and happy, have a good one.

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Unabashed Liberal's picture

@snoopydawg

Security are mostly 'bait & switch.' By that, I mean that they are intentionally misleading, at least to the approximately 95% (or so) seniors who receive one, or both, of our primary so-called entitlements--'Old Age and Survivors' Social Security (OASI) and Medicare.

Obviously, this was/is no accident.

Consider, while Cohn and Heitkamp are actually 'schooling' Harvard students on making proposals (to present to Congress to slash these benefits), print media is splashing headlines/banners that scream of massive cuts to Social Security and Medicare--with no explanation, or clarification, as to what is meant.

(IOW, what part of the programs the cuts pertain to, or, if they result in diminished benefits to seniors.)

Of course, in spite of Dems like Budget Chair John Yarmuth voicing the hope that there can be a 'bipartisan' agreement to cut these programs (I've already posted the video at EB), Dems pretend (to believe) that these budget proposals--not backed up by legislation, that I know of--would actually take away most seniors benefits.

Not so.

Politifact

The proposed Medicare savings would have meant little to no change for beneficiaries, according to Paul Van de Water, a senior fellow at the left-leaning Center on Budget Policy and Priorities, a Washington, D.C., think tank.

Trump's budget would have reduced reimbursement rates for services, lowering the overall cost. The lower rates would not have changed the care received by people on Medicare, he said. Rather, it would force providers to charge the government less for services.

"The Medicare cuts were for the most part reductions to payments to providers, and that latter category is something members of Congress from both parties have been working on for decades," Van de Water said. "The reason the U.S. spends more on health care is that we end up paying much more to providers than other countries."

The same idea was included in Obamacare. The law included lower reimbursement rates for providers — something Republicans criticized as a cut at the time.

Here's the exception, that I saw, which applies to "medical residents."

But some of the projected savings will be spent elsewhere outside the program, Goldwein said.

"For example, Medicare currently pays medical residents in the United States – not just those who serve the elderly, but all residents," Goldwein said. "The president’s budget would instead create a new program to pay those residents outside of Medicare."

Also, regarding OASI (regular Social Security) -

As for Social Security, experts agreed that Trump’s budget would cut the program by about $25 billion, or less than one-fifth of 1 percent. The savings would come from several proposals, the largest of which would cut retroactive disability benefits from 12 to six months.

From everything that I've read, the 'cuts' to this program are from SSDI and SSI--not, OASI.

Also, this is a budget--not legislation.

Having said that, I absolutely don't agree that there should be ANY CUTS to Medicaid--which would be cut drastically is legislated, SSDI--which should be bolstered, and, certainly, I don't support any cuts to SSI, which goes to help the most vulnerable and low income folks.

But, in order for the Dem Party Base to not be duped, they need to know exactly what's going on. And, if you listen to Dem lawmakers, alone, you won't have a clue. Which is why I always try to go to the think tanks, less partisan sources, etc.--to interpret budget proposals, proposed bills, etc.

Both parties demagogue the issues.

Which is 'why' Dems almost got a "Grand Bargain" through--with probably 90-95% of their Base, totally unaware. I'm 'guessing,' to this day.

(Excluding folks, here, of course! Smile )

I'm probably going to post a link to some of this material in one of my sig lines, 'cause I'd prefer to move on from commenting on 'entitlements.' Still, I'm quite concerned that there's a truckload of mis- and disinformation out there.

After all, "knowledge, is power." (as they say)

PleasantryHappy Weekend!

Mollie

“Dogs have given us their absolute all. We are the center of their universe. We are the focus of their love and faith and trust. They serve us in return for scraps. It is without a doubt the best deal man has ever made.
~~Roger Caras

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6 users have voted.

Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.

@snoopydawg How do you know that HUD housing is horrible and how do you know about any waitlists?

What part of the country do you live in (unless you don't want to say).

I my area, we have several large non-profits, for-profits, and city agencies that develop low income housing both with federal and non federal funding. It is perfectly good housing.

Also, there are non-profits that help with rental assistance (federal and non-federal funds). If someone suddenly needs rental assistance, they can get help and/or they can get hotel vouchers.

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dfarrah

smiley7's picture

@dfarrah
college community, been seeing her on the streets for weeks. We do have a lot of street folks but also, thanks to the progressives in our village of sanity surrounded by a sea of red, we have a new facility for the homeless on our bus line serving three meals a day with around 100 beds, fifty rooms. But it has a thirty-day rule.

Not knowing if i should interfere, i broke through and said hello to this woman the other day saying, "you're living in your truck aren't you?" she replied, "Yes."

I then asked about social services and public housing and she said she was told she didn't qualify. I do know the repug general assembly in Raleigh has cut assistance and raised qualifying criteria since taking over in 2010 making any public assistance hard to qualify for, so she probably has social security income or other assets preventing her from getting assistance. And, the University has made local landlords rich as they charge exorbitant prices and the beauty of our area also draws tourists, very wealthy ones prepared to pay millions for second homes, a very competitive market for rent, a similar story across the country.

Any suggestions?

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3 users have voted.

@snoopydawg @snoopydawg and Pompeo were fuming, too. Can you imagine how pumped up Bolton would be, only to be let down by the Pres?

I saw a clip from years ago (the other night on Fox news - Tucker)of him speaking in front of a huge group, saying that when we defeat Iran, "we will" or "we'll" (in reference to those attending), be over there celebrating. Really sick stuff.... (I assume when he said there, he meant Iran).

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6 users have voted.

dfarrah

@travelerxxx @travelerxxx of the past three years?

The dems were all hissing and spitting, and that includes some posters on this site, over how dangerous Trump was (is), and how he was going to go to war with the whole world.

Trump ran on disengaging, and he hasn't started any new wars.

As to his hire of Pompeo and Bolton, I don't get these hires at all. But then there is the notion of keeping your friends close and keeping your enemies closer.

Bolton is truly a freak; he has been lusting for war with Iran for at least 10 years. But if Trump can keep him on a short lease, rather than him running around the world undermining Trump like Kerry does, I'm fine with that.

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4 users have voted.

dfarrah

travelerxxx's picture

@dfarrah

My memory is fine for my age. Mostly.

Please don't lump me in with Democrats as I am not one. Neither am I a Republican, although I know quite a few.

I mention the despicable Pompeo and the warmonger Bolton as employees of Trump for a reason. He hired these people knowing full well what he was getting. If he did not, he is certainly the biggest fool on the planet. Further, he has hired a known proponent of torture, Gina Haspel. Both Pompeo and Haspel were drug-up from the bowels of the CIA — aka, Deep State Central. The background of both in no mystery and well known. Bolton is possibly the leading warmonger in the entire nation, and is well known as such.

If the leader of an organization decides to hire mafia hitmen as employees, any reasonable person could accurately infer that said leader was questionable at best, and probably operating at a level even worse than those hitmen he hired.

This modus operandi of Trump is not limited to national security issues. He has made the decision to hire persons to run the various departments of our government who, through past actions, declarations, and fundings, were well known to be diametrically opposed to the departments which Trump hired them to oversee. He has hired Betsy DeVos to run the Department of Education, though DeVos has spent her adult life attempting to distroy public education; he has hired Ben Carson to run HUD, though he is an opponent of the very laws he is charge of enforcing; he placed Rick Perry in charge of the Department of Energy, though Perry has publically stated his desire to abolish the agency ..... I could go on and name every single one of Trump's cabinet appointments and describe how Trump's pick seems based on the willingness of those choices to destroy the agencies with which they have been entrusted.

In the end, the hiring of these people is no accident and presents a clear picture. If you want to destroy the ability of the Interior Department to manage our natural resources (which belong to the people of this nation, not the billionaires), you hire someone who has a position of doing exactly that. No accident. If you intend to give every possible advantage to huge Wall Street banks, you put their man in place. When we see such a pattern, we can safely assume that the guy doing the hiring of these people is getting exactly what he desires.

It is no different with the choice of Bolton and his ilk in the realm of our military vis-à-vis our empire building. Trump was obviously well apprised of those he hired. He did not make an error - they reflect his views or they wouldn't be there. Period.

So, this "Look at what a peacemaker Trump is!" talk is bullshit. Frankly, it reminds me of the reactions of the (good) Germans when Hitler's death camps were made fully public at the end of the war. The phrase was, "If Hitler had only known!" and "They kept these camps secret from Hitler!" Well, hell no they didn't; he knew every bit of it.

The action of putting an obscene warmonger like Bolton in charge of our national security speaks for itself. Trump fully knew Bolton was a snake when he hired him. It is no different than the others he has employed. You don't hire a hitman if you intend to pet kittens all day. You hire a hitman to do what he does. Trump did that and is even more guilty than Bolton.

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12 users have voted.
mimi's picture

@travelerxxx
it was needed. And you had the capability took the pain and effort to write and spell it out. Respect.

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9 users have voted.

TTTT (too tired to talk)

@travelerxxx turns out.

I wasn't celebrating Trump as a peacemaker; only that I thought his decision was sound. After all, who do you think presented the attack action to Trump amongst different choices? (or another way to look at it, Trump really pulled the chair out from under Bolton, now, didn't he?)

My job depends largely on HUD funding; Carson was celebrating some of the housing programs the other day (but I don't recall the details). So, after 2 years of hysteria on the dem side, I'm not sweating Carson at the moment.

Also, I wouldn't take a person's history as the be all and end all in predicting what they will do. After all, Kavanaugh has already sided with (and written) court decisions that could not have been read from his history, and Jack Kemp was assigned to wreck HUD until he realized how intractable the housing issues were.

But, DeVos certainly seems true to her faith in school choice.

So, you never really know.

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3 users have voted.

dfarrah

snoopydawg's picture

@dfarrah

Ben Carson Wants To Evict Families With Undocumented Immigrants From Public Housing

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2 users have voted.

America is a pathetic nation; a fascist state fueled by the greed, malice, and stupidity of her own people.
- strife delivery

travelerxxx's picture

@dfarrah

Yes, you truly never know, sometimes a flower manages to emerge from the cracks in pavement. Mostly though, it is the exception.

It's growing in the street
Right up through the concrete
But soft and sweet and dreaming

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3 users have voted.
snoopydawg's picture

@dfarrah

relaxing the rules of engagement for the military to not kill civilians in the war zones. Plus he is continuing every one of the wars that he inherited. He shouldn't get points for that.

Trump ran on disengaging, and he hasn't started any new wars.

So Trump just posted Bolton so he could keep an eye on him?

As to his hire of Pompeo and Bolton, I don't get these hires at all. But then there is the notion of keeping your friends close and keeping your enemies closer.

It couldn't have been a surprise for Trump to find out how Bolton has wanted to go to war with Iran since he first entered politics or that Trump's BFF Sheldon Anderson wants Iran destroyed? Defending Trump no matter what he does is beyond my comprehension. The sanctions on Iran are killing people because they can't afford their medications or even have access to them which is what's happening. Just like when Bush's sanctions killed many Iraqis. Sanctions are an illegal act and a war crime.

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3 users have voted.

America is a pathetic nation; a fascist state fueled by the greed, malice, and stupidity of her own people.
- strife delivery

Wanted to create a Department of Peace.

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21 users have voted.

The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.

smiley7's picture

@UntimelyRippd

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9 users have voted.
mimi's picture

@smiley7 '
the little man Kucinich. As they did Jimmy Carter. Not tough enough Americans...

And I have not seen any European leader who dared to ridicule Trump. They are not tough enough either and always scared to stand up against the US leadership in power.

Same old, same old... the shit people poop is brown everywhere and not dependent on their skin's melanin level.

So, can you talk about something more uplifting?

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11 users have voted.

TTTT (too tired to talk)

smiley7's picture

@mimi
on tomorrow's OT; but i'm shaking inside with developments of yesterday and knowing there's not a leader in sight, in place, to prevent more madness.

Scary, depressing truths in which we 99 percent attempt to live.

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12 users have voted.
mimi's picture

@smiley7
because he averted 10 minutes before he was about to attack Iran, a military strike, 'cause it would have killed 160 civilians, and that's just not him. He wouldn't do that. No, no. See, how nice he is?

He got cold feet? Or were it his military and other advisers who got cold feet? Boltino and Drumpelstiltzchen had a noisy verbal fight? Apparently you could hear that all the way over the Atlantik. And now stiltzchen asks for a special session of the UN security council.

Sez the German media. So, it must be true. Move on, nothing to see here, no bloody bodies. All is well.
WackoDiablo

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9 users have voted.

TTTT (too tired to talk)

smiley7's picture

@mimi @mimi

May the great spirit protect us all because our leaders do not.

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7 users have voted.

@mimi nothing that Trump can do that you won't interpret in the most negative way??

Anything at all? Ever??

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3 users have voted.

dfarrah

gulfgal98's picture

@smiley7 shaking inside over the fact we came that close to another war that we cannot win. We are in at least seven or eight undeclared wars already. War with Iran would in all probability could lead to a nuclear confrontation. I am terrified as to how cavalier the leadership (both Dem and Repub) of this country is. And it is not just Trump or his people. It is the entire US Congress with a few exceptions. We ALL are just cannon fodder for the oligarchs. And that what is so terrifying.

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14 users have voted.

"I don't want to run the empire, I want to bring it down!" ~Dr. Cornel West

"There is no instance of a nation benefitting from prolonged warfare." Sun Tzu

"Propaganda is one hell of a drug." Abby Martin

"Politicians are cowards." Mike Gravel

smiley7's picture

@gulfgal98
and happy to see you; cause yes, i was shaking last evening and this morning over going to war, again, for no good reason with the question being "There is no good reason."

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7 users have voted.

@smiley7 Shaking?

You know, I'm a stress case, always worrying, yet Trump doesn't bother me at all - or at least not anymore than any other president.

I think part of the reason I can keep a lid on it is because I always ask, "what is the worst that can happen?"

And what is the worst that can happen? We all die? And to that I ask, so what? We did fine before we were born, right? Do you recall bad things happening before you were born? I would think that death would be similar - a big nothing (except that I believe in everlasting life).

I really wonder why people are so overcome by emotions nowadays? The hysteria and rhetoric is breathtaking. Maybe it is environmental.

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4 users have voted.

dfarrah

snoopydawg's picture

@dfarrah

Just because you believe that Trump isn't going to get us into a war with Iran shouldn't allow you to dismiss what others feel or think.

Civilian casualties have increased by a lot since he became president because he relaxed the rules of engagement. Have you seen the picture of some Syrian cities where the military dropped bombs on it?

Besides we wouldn't be worrying about war with Iran if he had kept the deal intact and relaxed the sanctions he has put on them. Sanctions aren't allowed to be put on food or medicine, but because he's refusing to let them sell their oil and the restrictions he's put on the banks it's happening. People are dying because of this. And 40,000 Venezuelan people have died from their sanctions.

Trump is not wearing a white hat here. He's no different than Obama or Bush or Clinton and people are hurting because of his actions.

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14 users have voted.

America is a pathetic nation; a fascist state fueled by the greed, malice, and stupidity of her own people.
- strife delivery

@snoopydawg just need to get a grip.

I am sick of feelings. I am sick of people freaking out over just about everything. I am sick of the way people use their feelings to manipulate and control others.

Things done by our government, including Trump, are extremely upsetting to me, too, and I hate, hate, hate economic sanctions of any type.

But I can still give credit where it is due.

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3 users have voted.

dfarrah

wendy davis's picture

@dfarrah

demonstrating a major cognitive dissonance?

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8 users have voted.
snoopydawg's picture

@dfarrah

in the first place. Meaning that he had every intention of bombing Iran.

But I can still give credit where it is due

And you are not addressing the rest of my comment.

Civilian casualties have increased by a lot since he became president because he relaxed the rules of engagement.

Are you saying that smiley wrote this just to manipulate and control others here? What an insult to smiley.

I am sick of feelings. I am sick of people freaking out over just about everything. I am sick of the way people use their feelings to manipulate and control others.

The fact is that there is a very good chance that Trump will attack Iran sometime in the near future. If he doesn't then that would be great, but there are too many people in Trump's cabinet that have been itching for war on Iran for decades. Ever since they overthrew the puppet government we installed in 1953. And it was Trump who gave the okay to put those people in his cabinet. He might have gotten pressure from Bibi and Sheldon Anderson, but if you are going to give credit where it's due, then you also have to accept when he does something boneheaded.

Besides we wouldn't be worrying about war with Iran if he had kept the deal intact and relaxed the sanctions he has put on them.

The threat of war would not be here if he hadn't pulled out of the deal.

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7 users have voted.

America is a pathetic nation; a fascist state fueled by the greed, malice, and stupidity of her own people.
- strife delivery

thanatokephaloides's picture

@dfarrah

Sometimes people just need to get a grip.

English Translation: People need to stop caring what happens and leave everything to the so-called "experts". No, thank you.

I am sick of feelings. I am sick of people freaking out over just about everything.

Natural selection has ruled against you, dfarrah. Animals, including ourselves, who "freak out over" threats live longer and have more and healthier babies than those who always "get a grip". And the threats Americans and the rest of the world face due to America's conservatist rule over the past 50 years are very real indeed. People should be freaking out about them. If anything, Americans aren't freaking out enough about this shit.

Those feelings are there for biological reasons. Clamping them down is almost never a good idea.

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9 users have voted.

"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg

Eagles92's picture

@smiley7 @smiley7

(Edit: this was supposed to be a reply to Wendy, and I can't figure out how to fix it. Long day).

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2 users have voted.

@mimi

Dancing With the Stars? America's got Talent. Nothing uplifting about politics in the US.

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6 users have voted.

"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon

thanatokephaloides's picture

@dkmich

Nothing uplifting about politics in the US.

Or anywhere else.

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3 users have voted.

"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg

snoopydawg's picture

@mimi

the shit people poop is brown everywhere

Sad

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4 users have voted.

America is a pathetic nation; a fascist state fueled by the greed, malice, and stupidity of her own people.
- strife delivery

mimi's picture

@snoopydawg
btw. I hadn't read the EB of Friday evening, when I wrote my ranting overtoned mess of a comment. So, I would say, it was not wrong to say that, but not appropriate for the faint of heart. Reading now other comments that were posted as a reaction of my comment after I have slept it over for one night, I realize that I am not the only one who couldn't handle the planned and called-off plan to attack Iran.

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8 users have voted.

TTTT (too tired to talk)

travelerxxx's picture

@mimi

I realize that I am not the only one who couldn't handle the planned and called-off plan to attack Iran.

You are correct, mimi. You're not the only one. It's not easy to watch insanity beyond comprehension.

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8 users have voted.
smiley7's picture

@travelerxxx
posts in this essay, all of them, and thanks for being here.

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3 users have voted.
thanatokephaloides's picture

@snoopydawg

This is uplifting huh?

the shit people poop is brown everywhere

Brown poop is very uplifting! It means that the pooper is in reasonably good health and has had something to eat lately. Compost that brown poop, and the pooper will eat tomorrow, too! works for fuel in a pinch, too, with the ashes almost as good for food crops as the composted poop is.

I challenge you to find anything about our governmental or military situation at the current time that's as uplifting as good, brown poop! Smile
.
(My apologies for the shitty content of this Comment!) Wink

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4 users have voted.

"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg

mimi's picture

@thanatokephaloides
I guess... there is hope in it too. Our peasants used our shit to fertilize our fields back in the days. I remember it well. Luckily they did not do that more often than once in a season.
May be that frequency could be a guideline for how often it is acceptable to make a shitty comment. You know ... "Bauernweisheit" (shrewdness of the peasants?) and all that.... -
Smile

Thanks. .

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3 users have voted.

TTTT (too tired to talk)

thanatokephaloides's picture

@mimi

So, can you talk about something more uplifting?

No disrespect intended to you, mimi, but what do you expect smiley7 to do, lie? Or maybe drop some serious entheogenic hallucinogens? ("LSD: Consumes millions of times its own weight in excess reality!")

Reality isn't very uplifting now for at least 99% of humans. Bad

And Cat bless smiley7 for having the guts to honestly share some genuinely honest fears held by all thinking people.

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8 users have voted.

"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg

mimi's picture

@thanatokephaloides
were not at all meant to be a patronizing request to smiley7. Just a helpless low key attempt to put an end to my ranting along. I was grateful to read in smiley7 response to wendey davis that he understood my comment and did not take offense at my 'suggestion'.

And I feel not disrespected, if you tell me what you think about my words in comments straight forward and in public. That's what we are all here for. To be honest with each other with our comments and words.

Peace.

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6 users have voted.

TTTT (too tired to talk)

thanatokephaloides's picture

@mimi

And I feel not disrespected, if you tell me what you think about my words in comments straight forward and in public. That's what we are all here for. To be honest with each other with our comments and words.

Indeed!

Peace.

Always.

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2 users have voted.

"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg

yea, verily, even peace in the Middle East, if and when peace yields certain people more money and power than does war or a "peace process."

I've had similar feelings about researchers finding a cure for cancer. Meanwhile, we will continue to study every activity and substance on the planet to see if it causes cancer (which it will) and keep telling people to change their diets, habits, etc.

I'm sorry, but it is what I believe.

ETA: I am less certain about cancer because drug companies may have economic incentive to find a cure. However, independent researchers working via grants from the government would just research themselves out of a living if they found a cure. Most of the time, they are not even looking for one; they are looking only for one cause after another.

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15 users have voted.
smiley7's picture

@HenryAWallace

Just one candidate unequivocally screaming peace with a chance of being followed and elected or one presently elected congresscritter to say No more war, no matter the consequences.

Too much to dream for before i go.

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9 users have voted.
wendy davis's picture

i was about to use this on my diary re: nuclear bombs, israel's bombs, israel's leaking dimona reactor site in the negev, and of course: the coming war with persia...and which other 'enemies of the Empire' that refuse to accept a multi-polar world.

anyway, immortal technique helped out on this (iirc) 2011 mumia abu-jamal speech from prison (note how prescient he was even then): (the lyrics)

yes, it's so hard that peace is such a marginal ask. i will say that howie hawkins, running for Green, has a long history of working for peace and justice, but he's not screaming it from the rooftops, sadly. and i don't find it necessary that you should feel a need to be 'uplifting' any time, myself.

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14 users have voted.
smiley7's picture

@wendy davis
bad in choices made and indeed we are friends in peace.

i don't find it necessary that you should feel a need to be 'uplifting' any time, myself.

mimi and i go way back, with the dinosaurs, even; and, i understood her comment perfectly, no worries.

Have a good evening.

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12 users have voted.
wendy davis's picture

@smiley7

just noting that it's fine to express our fears and grief about the Empire's wars on so many fronts is all, as well as there are no true peace candidates afoot (not just limited to 'regime change', nor war on Iran)

i really came back to say that increasingly howie klein is running on the Green Party's green new deal, and i think it's a mistake, given that none of it will matter a tinker's damn by now. i wish he'd shout peace and justice from the rooftops, but climate chaos is the big seller right now. but at least he'll seek a peace dividend to pay for it by closing bases, no wars of choice, etc.

i do hope you played the video, though. ; )

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9 users have voted.
snoopydawg's picture

Read a comment yesterday on MoA that said for all the time this country has existed it's only been at peace for 20 years. And almost every war has been over seas against people who haven't threatened us in any way. Just think of how many people we have killed. Just since WWII we have killed at least 20 million if not twice that number and here we are involved in so many countries and even more than we know about. Congress didn't know that we were in Nigeria or Nigere or Somalia or in almost every country in Africa which Obama decided we should go and fight.

On the 4th of July how many people stop and think about why our families ran away from England and elsewhere because of its tyrannical ruling parties? The flag made its way out of the fight semi intact, but our nation has been broken almost ever since. Rescind the Monroe doctrine and the AUMF and get congress to quit funding the wars and military and rebuild America. Great idea huh? If we can just figure out how to do it, but bringing back the anti war movement would be a start.

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16 users have voted.

America is a pathetic nation; a fascist state fueled by the greed, malice, and stupidity of her own people.
- strife delivery

smiley7's picture

@snoopydawg
i've use often, because it stuck with me long-long-time ago:

“We are raised to honor all the wrong explorers and discoverers - thieves planting flags, murderers carrying crosses. Let us at last praise the colonizers of dreams.” ~ Peter S. Beagle

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11 users have voted.
snoopydawg's picture

@smiley7

Thanks for posting it.

"Let us at last praise the colonizers of dreams.”

Indeed!

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7 users have voted.

America is a pathetic nation; a fascist state fueled by the greed, malice, and stupidity of her own people.
- strife delivery

mhagle's picture

or to better explain, i'm thinking of an American candidate like Mahatma Gandhi. Just straight-up non-violence, period.

That is her main schtick. Department of Peace and everything. She is going to be on the debate stage with Bernie next week.

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11 users have voted.

Marilyn

"Make dirt, not war." eyo

smiley7's picture

@mhagle
will take closer look, now.

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6 users have voted.
travelerxxx's picture

@smiley7

I knew a bit about her, mostly from years ago due to her writings. However, I had no idea she was a candidate for president.

Her site is here, for those interested. I've read a little and so far she seems to actually process sanity. That would be a change, eh?

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6 users have voted.
mhagle's picture

@travelerxxx

Read that she went on the View yesterday and the Megan person was especially rude to her.

I donated to her campaign because I want her voice in the debates. As I donated my small amounts to tulsi, mike, and bernie.

We want all of the good voices to be heard.

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9 users have voted.

Marilyn

"Make dirt, not war." eyo

mhagle's picture

@mhagle

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6 users have voted.

Marilyn

"Make dirt, not war." eyo

thanatokephaloides's picture

@mhagle

.... lost me at "compulsory youth service".

Compulsory youth service of any kind serves one purpose alone: to prepare a rising generation for warfare. It's why the Nazi Germans invented it. (Good evening, Counselor Godwin!) And the Nazis, to their credit, were at least honest about it.

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7 users have voted.

"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg

enhydra lutris's picture

@thanatokephaloides
compulsory youth service, Sparta did, or perhaps some yet older culture/state.

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3 users have voted.

That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

Jen's picture

When I heard Tulsi say she was a hawk for war against terrorism, I honestly felt sick to my stomach. It brought tears to my eyes. Because that can be used to justify any dang war they want.

I have a song stuck in my head because of this essay. The version I remember...

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14 users have voted.
smiley7's picture

@Jen
came to mind, this morning. Thanks for pointing out what i also recall Tusi saying and Bernie has said similar things. No more war, straight up, an old meme renewed in other perspectives.

E. O. Wilson and ants and all.

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9 users have voted.
Big Al's picture

we can only save ourselves. If enough people don't rise up and take down these corrupt political systems, particularly our own, we'll never have peace. I sure as hell am not hoping for some political "leader" to save us.
Btw, I have no idea what is being talked about as to the news yesterday. I was camping in the wilderness, no internet or phone access and just got home an hour ago. I'll go read up. My first reaction to some comments seemingly saying Trump pulled back from an attack on Iran because he feared the body count (or something like that), is to laugh to be honest. Sounds like straight up propaganda to me, but I'll go do my research now.

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14 users have voted.

@Big Al to have to catch up with this mess. Yes on spin for Trumps "hesitation," these freaks won't give up that easily. Good for you on getting away from the madness for a while.

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11 users have voted.
Big Al's picture

@lizzyh7 it was very refreshing. I always feel better when I go out "in the woods". Ya, the first reaction to the official line should be to doubt it, particularly one about body count when the entire thing is illegal and immoral from the getgo and coming from a country that's killed an estimated 20-30 million people since WWII.

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13 users have voted.
smiley7's picture

@Big Al
years; just 'looking for a hard-headed woman' who makes peace.

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8 users have voted.

@Big Al impossible to believe that someone actually thought about casualties, and that person happened to be Trump this time?

Think of what would have happened had we struck.

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4 users have voted.

dfarrah

Big Al's picture

@dfarrah Come on man, these are people that think it's "worth it" to kill a half million kids for their geopolitical agenda. Trump is no different. It's more likely, if it happened at all, that he decided it was too illegal and he couldn't get away with it, it would hurt his election chances, and/or it was felt it was too dangerous relative to pushback. If casualties were discussed, it would have been in the context of what would be politically acceptable, not for some kind of compassion reasons. So I don't see, even if this story is true, that Trump should be given any kind of credit at all for what is all illegal crimes against another country and humanity in the first place.

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12 users have voted.

@Big Al (I say pfffft is better than "come on man" Smile )

Show me where Trump has said that 1/2 million people dead are worth it.

And Trump is certainly not responsible for the killing the US did in the past.

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3 users have voted.

dfarrah

Big Al's picture

@dfarrah is actually against international law, an illegal war crime in effect. And it is all based on lies and the false narrative that the U.S. somehow can use force to prevent Iran from even trying to develop a nuclear weapon while this country itself has thousands. So whatever Trump decided, he's still a war criminal that is lying his ass off.
So giving credit to him for this alleged "humanitarian" decision is like giving Jeffrey Dahmer credit for only killing two gay men in one night instead of three. It makes no sense and exhibits a lack of knowledge regarding what this is all really about.

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12 users have voted.

@Big Al I tend to think maybe wall street got cold feet, far too many derivative bets could blow up for them if Iran shuts down the straight. Just my opinion but we know the banks own our policies, always have.

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8 users have voted.
Big Al's picture

@lizzyh7 that's why I said, "if it happened at all". I also saw an article headlining that Trump (or somebody) notified Iran of the attack well before hand to give them time or something, didn't read it. But that indicates a bluff to me.
I read another article a couple weeks ago explaining how they can't attack Iran, that the shutting down of the Hormuz is a pretty sure thing and with something like 25% of all oil going thru there it would fuck up the world economy in a nanosecond. Trump was explained all this evidently and knows what that would do to his presidency and reelection chances.
But I have no doubt they will do whatever they need to do to continue their quest for worldwide hegemony.

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8 users have voted.
Big Al's picture

@lizzyh7 "All wars are bankers wars".

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8 users have voted.
thanatokephaloides's picture

@dfarrah

Is it really that impossible to believe that someone actually thought about casualties, and that person happened to be Trump this time?

Yes, it is that impossible.

Were casualties really on the horizon, much less the agenda, of any Americans in the power-bearing community (or having any real chance of becoming part of it), we wouldn't be in the Middle East at all. There's not a damn thing in that odious desert worth the death of anybody, American or otherwise. Not even the oil. Alexander and his Roman successors needed the Middle East because it's the physical crossroads between Eurasia and Africa. With the Panama Canal and our Pacific Coast, we don't share that need, and we'd be better off without that particular millstone necklace.

Bad

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9 users have voted.

"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg

snoopydawg's picture

@thanatokephaloides

if he did he would reinstate the strict rules of engagement. He'd lift the sanctions on Venezuela because 40,000 people are said to have died from them. He'd lift them on Iran instead of putting even more on today. And he would fully fund our social programs instead of trying to cut them. Same with Medicaid work requirements which has seen people dropping off it and no increase in them getting jobs.

But of course Trumps cruel budget cuts are nothing new. I just finished reading the article aliasalias posted on how Obama tried for years to cut social security and the other programs.

People keep saying that he was blocked from passing his legislation because of the republicans, but it was the republicans that refused to work with him on doing that only because it meant raising taxes on the rich.

Obama’s Long Battle to Cut Social Security Benefits

Inside it says that two conservatives were running in 2012. Amen to that! Just wow.

Remember when Obama said that the republicans drove the car into the ditch? Welp he brought a tow truck to get their car out of it. This is why so many people stayed home in 2012 which some people blame them for doing it. Just this week I read that it was the voters that let the democrats down not the other way around. Yep. Every person who ever voted for democrats in the past still owe their votes to them.

More..

Obama was, it appeared, willing to destroy the Democratic Party, if need be, in order to stay in the White house, even if this would mean his ruling as the titular “President” when both houses of Congress would be Republican in a second Obama term. Obama wouldn’t be able to achieve anything that way, but he still would retain the title of “President,” and he still would have the power to place the aristocracy even deeper into his debt, perhaps so that they’d finance yet-bigger memorials to him (etc.) during his retirement. And needless to say, a President retiring like that would have money poured at his feet, by lots of aristocrats who have money to pour.

$600,000 for a speech! $60 million for two books. When will we start seeing the monuments built in his honor outside Goldman Sachs and Citibank?

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9 users have voted.

America is a pathetic nation; a fascist state fueled by the greed, malice, and stupidity of her own people.
- strife delivery

thanatokephaloides's picture

@snoopydawg

Remember when Obama said that the republicans drove the car into the ditch? Welp he brought a tow truck to get their car out of it.

So that's why that car's being crushed by a capsized tow truck. Wink

(+1 on all the rest, as usual!)

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3 users have voted.

"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg

Eagles92's picture

@dfarrah What, exactly, is wrong with you? SMDH.

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4 users have voted.
enhydra lutris's picture

@Big Al
"motive" in the bank as against some future mass war crimes trial when the empire collapses. "Disproportionate response" is one of the hallmarks or characteristics that are deemed to make things crimes against humanity or war crimes. I found it odd that he used that precise language.

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4 users have voted.

That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

Big Al's picture

@enhydra lutris not to mention a violation of the constitution warranting removal from office. So the disproportionate defense falls flat based on that. It's disproportionate (in a way) to bomb Iran at all based on pure lies.
That's the problem with this whole thing. No one in the media, not even Dennis Kucinich who I saw on a Fox news clip yesterday, are saying what needs to be said. That this is all a lie and there is no justification for any action at all.

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4 users have voted.

Peace and Love.

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13 users have voted.
smiley7's picture

@OPOL
always a pleasure.

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2 users have voted.
skod's picture

Therefore, it may be a little while before we as a society try it. Sad, but so it goes.

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4 users have voted.
smiley7's picture

@skod
from the last century and now innocent beings pay the price. "When we we ever learn?" indeed.

Thanks for reading and being here.

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3 users have voted.