Kos's Daily Attack on Bernie's Campaign
Kos is engaged and is going to try to win back his blog! Yes, for the second time in two days, he has a post about Devine and the super delegates. The purpose is to convince people Bernie has no chance to win.
That has been his theme since early March, but now he is accelerating it.
Every day, people will be bombarded with these messages. Surrender Dorothy, you have no chance.
The aim is to cut off donations and votes for Bernie.
I doubt it it will have much impact. Those for Bernie are not quitting. He can preach to Hillary supporters.
Glad this place exists. It is going to get bad there. Expect more refugees.
No doubt there will be counter posts there. The whole world is outside of that blog.
Update: I wrote a post there. If you still go back, I'd appreciate a rec.
http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/3/29/1507568/-Respond-to-Kos-by-Don...
Here's what I said:
It what appears to be a Daily Theme, Kos has another post about Tad Devine and super delegates. Don’t be distracted.
Rather than all the yelling and fighting, I propose donations to Bernie. Don’t get all caught up in flame wars. What matters is helping Bernie win as many delegates as he can.
Donate or Sign Up to Volunteer at BernieSanders.com
Don’t take the bait, donate:
berniesanders.com/…
On Wisconsin! Then New York!!
Comments
We're up to 1356 members here.
What's the quickest way we can get to 135,600?
“Those who make Bernie Sanders impossible will make Luigi Mangione inevitable." - Dan Berger
Yes, he is pushing people out.
Amazing progress here.
I think this deserves a
Kos who? (tm). Hehe.
Kos is a paid Hillary shill.
Kos is a paid Hillary shill and you can throw Obama in there for good measure.
"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." - Groucho
How nice that can actually be SAID here
without the ever-present threat of the banhammer. I think we all know it's probably the case, although he's a little too slick to drop proof.
There is no justice. There can be no peace.
Yikes!
Poor JtC!
Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
It's obviously
becoming more and more of an echo chamber over there. I've noticed fewer and fewer Bernie supporters even engaging when someone throws up crap like Kos has.
He does not represent at all what his site pretends to be. But keep digging, Kos. There's bound to be a bottom somewhere. I'm sure you'll find it.
I'm inclined to conclude with, "Where's the money, Lebowski?" But it's obvious this jackass knows where the money is.
"The real power is in the hands of small groups of people and I don't think they have titles. -- Bob Dylan"
If we want to stop talking about Markos --
and how he's a jackass and all who makes a lot of money -- then we've got to be a lot bigger than we are today. That was the point of my post.
“Those who make Bernie Sanders impossible will make Luigi Mangione inevitable." - Dan Berger
He never made any money from me
I used an ad blocker and Ghostery on his site for years.
The handful of diaries I posted never seemed to reach more than a few dozen people.
" In the beginning, the universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry, and is generally considered to have been a bad move. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy "
love your graphic....
Did anyone watch the morning Joe show on the FBI investigation? I hope they drop a rock on her and her campaign.
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
How many agents are working on this ? Mother Jones --
A truth of the nuclear age/climate change: we can no longer have endless war and survive on this planet. Oh sh*t.
147 FBI agents, according to WaPo yesterday
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/03/28/there-are-147-...
~ Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle. ~
Wish I could believe that something could happen with this.
But I look at the DOJ investigation into Michael Brown's murder, in which they basically said "nothing here," and conclude similarly that I have no faith in both of these institutions. Especially given the rat's nest that the FBI has been, operating mostly as an operative to sow dissent among and ultimately dissipate the Left in this country.
Thanks to people like those brave citizens who broke into the FBI's office in Media, PA in the early 70's we know something provably true about their motives.
"If I should ever die, God forbid, let this be my epitaph:
THE ONLY PROOF HE NEEDED
FOR THE EXISTENCE OF GOD
WAS MUSIC"
- Kurt Vonnegut
ad blockers
BluHell Firewall works pretty good there, too.....
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
I hear what you are saying Cassiodorus,
but I think we all need to keep in mind that kos has hurt a lot of people...and they are still dealing with their anger and their hurt... keeping it all bottled up inside does no one any good. Being "bigger than" has it's points and is our goal... venting and letting go of the anger has it's value too.
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Content from here has to be
Content from here has to be cross-posted on social media. Articles to this site need to be linked from Facebook, Twitter and Reddit and other discussion platforms.
Beware the bullshit factories.
My waste-line is pretty big,
But it tapers off to a pinhead.
Come to think of it, I have large feet, too. And hands.
You make a good point, tho, we should shift our attention elsewhere . . . Unless there is REALLY JUICY GOSSIP, and then all beasts are off. Bets. All BETS are off.
Waste line? Hmmm.
Do we have a Facebook page?
I don't no jack about Facebook or twitter but I hear it's one way to get the word out fast and to younger progressives. It would be great to attract younger people. Pro Bernie types. The Hill Shills can stay the fuck away IMO...
ve vant ze money lebovski!
ve believe in nothing, lebovski!
Gold is the wealth of kings; silver is the wealth of commoners; barter is the wealth of peasants; and debt is the wealth of slaves.
This is a very good sign imo
“To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.” -Voltaire
Why bother it just gets them calling racism and sexism
They took the feminist movement and the racial justice
movements away from us like taking candy from a baby.
Of course, many are fighting back, esp on the racial justice front, but it's horrific watching the Hillary supporters dominate the discourse and use it for their own ends. Nasty! Toxic, and will cause lasting damage to both movements.
They've hollowed out the racial justice movement, b/c the anti-racist argument vs Bernie mostly consists of:
1)Lots of black people vote for Hillary.
2)They won't vote for Bernie.
3)Therefore, lots of black people don't like Bernie.
4)There's something wrong with Bernie, and it has to do with race.
5)He must be somehow racist!
This is why I like Ta-Nehisi Coates: he made an actual, concrete *criticism* of one of Bernie's policy positions--reparations. There's something real and solid about that. The bulk of the CBC and other establishment Black voices? There's nothing *there*. But if you say there's nothing there, and you've got white skin, look out! You're probably racist too.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
i heard something very revealing a couple of weeks ago
an a-a writer named alexander was being interviewed on rachel's show, & was asked why shill's strength among a-a voters was so strong. he said that she had a long relationship/history with the community, especially in the south, & how elected a-a leaders were the only ones they (a-a's) could go to when they needed things done--& when they (the elected leaders) said to vote for someone, like hillary, that's what their constituents did...& the money quote: hillary's the devil they know.
boom.
More evidence no one cares
"I've noticed fewer and fewer Bernie supporters even engaging when someone throws up crap like Kos has."
I noticed this yesterday in a diary purposely trying to draw Bernie supporters into a pie fight. The first 50 comments were all of the same theme: "Brave diary, expect Bernie supporters to swarm any minute now!!"
But instead it was a big echo. So much so that I couldn't resist poking them with this at the end of the comments:
Wow, any minute now this brave diary should be swarmed with angry Bernirbotbros.
…
…
Ahem… I said, ANY MOMENT NOW THIS BRAVE DIARY WILL BE SWARMED WITH ANGRY BERNIEBOTS!!!
Prepare yourselves brave defenders of the good and righteous, I just know they’re all about to pounce!
[crickets]
We’re waiting….
[crickets]
Any time now...
[crickets]
HellOoooo?
"Polls don't tell us how well a candidate is doing; Polls tell us how well the media is doing." ~ Me
Excellent, Thumb!
The sooner they realize we don't care about their crap, the funnier it will become as they sit there looking at each other with their fingers in their noses. I feel a bubbanomics coming on!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
"The “jumpers” reminded us that one day we will all face only one choice and that is how we will die, not how we will live." Chris Hedges on 9/11
Oh! This is priceless!
Well done Thumb, well done!
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First Nations News
Or into getting banned
top was started in 2002
so in the years to come, c99p should continue to grow upwards. fwiw a little bird just told me you will get a boost for november.
A little bird?
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jc2TVLoxsDA]
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Speaking of which, is Big Al still around?
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
Big Al is not in sync with the current direction of c99p
too much Bernie (i.e. Democrats). I'm halfway there with him.
Bernie is, for me, a compromise that I'm willing to accept. Al will have to speak for himself on that but I suspect he's waiting for all this to blow over.
Thanks, Shahryar
I'm pretty excited about Bernie, because he is the best thing I have seen come along in electoral politics, in my lifetime. That said, he is still "a compromise that I am willing to accept". I liked having Big Al around for some counterpoint. I agree with a lot of his viewpoint.
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
Al comes and goes
I am sure he will be back.
Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
Saw Big Al here a few days ago .
A truth of the nuclear age/climate change: we can no longer have endless war and survive on this planet. Oh sh*t.
There's a lot of gravity around that topic
And it's understandable. But for me, the movement that has coalesced around Bernie is so NOT limited to the Democratic party. Cenk is right: if Sanders tries to hand the movement to Hillary, the movement will leave him.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
you'll find him
here.
Thanks, hecate
Not feelin' the Bern, is he I think he would do better to say it here, but what do I know.
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
Addendum:
Besides, if he were here, I could ask him how the "forcible" overthrow of a government (a "real" revolution) differs from war, and what part a 60-ish man would play in it.
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
No he's not with good reason
and neither am I to tell you the truth. I am not that into the farcical duopoly of partisan politics at thin point. I don't like Bernie's 'foreign policy' one bit. I don't like that fact that he's running as a Democrat or that he caucus's with the Democrat's to begin with. Of course he's better then HRC my cranky cat would be better then HRC.
I'm very leery of the of love of persona and being a fan of a 'leader' or feeding their parking meters. I hope he wins, but I also think if he was serious about a real political revoluti0on he would have no qualms about running as an indie or letting that bitch HRC have it with both guns. Why
Perhaps I've just od'ed on partisan politics that are nothing but a kabuki show after knocking my head on their anti-democratic walls for too many years. He also has a hard time dealing with the dkos mentality after his leaving the site quite a while ago. I can't speak for him but I can understand why after jumping out of the frying pan he'd not want to go back into the fire.
To me Bernie is a good moderate pol who I will vote for, even if I have to write him in, and have donated to. He's better then McGovern lol, but too much like him as he is a mushy middle of the road liberal and not willing to really take this global madness or the political machine on. I understand why he had to run as a Democrat and why he is playing this electoral circus game but that doesn't light my fire. Corbyn in the UK is another pol I would support but he is much more upfront about the insanity he see's going down.
I just don't think it's a good idea to pin your hopes on any pol. Especially one who thinks drones should be smarter and the Saudis need more skin in the game. I do want him to win but worry that he in the end will herd his flock to voting against Trump. The platform is a sick joke of a lie to get the suckers to support the Democratic party which is just evil and rotten and saying it could be worse if the RW lunatics win does not light me up.
Good thing there are no HR's here as I'm basically a political, partisan heretic in no mans land at this point. Look at Hollande who billed himself as a socialist. Politicians can't be moved nor do they evolve. Sorry I'm so cynical but looking at any pol as a solution just seems like a bad idea. If he's elected it will be a 'victory for compromise'. Maybe so but compromising with the war criminals and the global gangster's of austerity who own and run our party, country and as the dude from GS said rule the world isn't my idea of any kind of victory.
Go Bernie!
Go Bernie! Indeed :)
I just don't see any non-violent alternative. We can work within the system, or we could overthrow it. The latter WOULD involve bloodshed. I am getting a bit old to run around with guns...I think Big Al is a bit older. That would relegate us old heads to the role of sending younger ones to die in our stead. And we would be changing what?
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
Plus he's a peace guy
me too. Other countries have had peaceful political revolutions. In Iceland for instance the people got out the posts and pans. I know they are not a giant crazy ass Empire but their are historical alternatives to violent government overthrows that get humans some relief. He doesn't advocate for a bloody revolution.
As an young'un in the 60's I went to a sit in in the park and was horrified at the yippies and revolutionary radicals who took to empty zoo cages and beat their manly chest's. I though man o man these are the last people I want to get power and run the country. I don't think our choices as humans globally is binary, working with in the system or violently over throwing it. OWS was a start and if things keep moving in the current direction toward this horrendous global agenda people can and will take it down.
I have no answer but do have faith in peoples ability to rein in the current crop of Visigoth hoards that seek to rule the world. Maybe the people of the world will step up and stop the US and rein in the oligarchical collectivists. Us not me? Human's do have power that is not derived from killing each other and if ever it was time to withdraw the consent to be governed this is it. Enough is Enough. See I can do sloganeering and believe that 'we are the change we have been waiting for'.
"When I despair, I remember that all through history the ways of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants, and murderers, and for a time they can seem invincible, but in the end they always fall. Think of it--always."
Mahatma Gandhi
The country with the largest military on Earth, ever,
will not go peacefully. Ghandi was assassinated. India was partitioned, with violent consequences lasting through today. Infiltration is at least worth a try.
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
solution?
So what do you see as the solution?
We're essentially out of time for anything incremental, and, as Bisbonian points out, we really don't need to try Yet Another Fucking God Damned War (YAFGDW) either.
So I'd be really interested in knowing what you'd consider to be the solution here.....
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
thanatokephaloides, see comment above for solution?
how is electing Bernie and trying to take back the Dem. party anything but incrementalism? No fucking godamn war is the solution but I just don't believe somehow that our choices are confined to the false binary R and D breakdown. I think one way or another were going to get a real political revolution or else 'there will be blood' as Obama said at the launching of The Hamilton Project. This is the once again the fierce urgency of now, or is it? Will we take the sop of better then and weak tea compromise with the devils we know? I have no solution, other then play it as it lays which is why I'm voting for Bernie. The solution is up to 'we the people' in and out of the system, at this point.
You echo my original concerns with Bernie
I.E., how is his playbook any different from Howard Dean's? And if we're going to use Dean's playbook again, shouldn't we consider the fact that last time, that playbook resulted in terrible failure?
BUT I also see lots of ways this movement could go that are not dependent on Bernie.
I don't really believe the Democratic establishment will allow any kind of socialist, or any kind of truthteller, to get the nomination. If he doesn't win, then the movement will need a plan. We don't have one yet, which is the main problem with the Bernie movement. As always, it's hard to get the non-electoral activists and the electoral activists working together. That's why it's too bad that Big Al doesn't want to stick around.
But in the meantime, Bernie's campaign is doing a great job of "outing the ringers:" [video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9zkQcLi4Yo] And the question becomes, how far can we push the Democratic establishment? How crappy are they going to make themselves look in the eyes of the public? How low will they stoop? (So far, the answer is: pretty damned low.)
The goal here is to break the two-party duopoly and its corrupt control of the political process. And that requires at least two things: people need to be well and truly fed up with both parties, and people need to believe there is an alternative. The idea of inevitable inescapable reality ordained by Clintons and Bushes needs to be punctured and deflated. That's what Bernie's doing, and if you think that's not important, ask yourself why the media keep blacking him out & why character attacks on him and his supporters are rife.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
I don't know if I'm like other Bernie supporters in this regard
But I don't see Bernie as "the solution." The movement is bigger than Bernie.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
You see it like at least some others.
That part needs to be done first.
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
That's exactly how I see it.
The wave was building long before Bernie. He just happened to be an insider well positioned to ride that wave. By that I don't mean that he's cynically using us. But his positions over the years fit well with the movement. But as you say, the movement is much, MUCH bigger than Bernie... a point I'm pretty sure Bernie agrees with.
A lot of wanderers in the U.S. political desert recognize that all the duopoly has to offer is a choice of mirages. Come, let us trudge towards empty expanse of sand #1, littered with the bleached bones of Deaniacs and Hope and Changers.
-- lotlizard
That is how I
see Bernie. When he says "not me, us". He knows he not the mover of the revolution. He happens to be the voice of today. And he's showing very much how much impact WE can be. and WE talk about voting in others of progressive thinking., rather than establishment thinking.
Again, he is the voice of today, but other voices will also speak up and they are speaking up. And, he is 74, so we know he's not thinking of himself down the road, that it can only be what he thinks is right (and yeah, he gets some things wrong, but he has shown he will listen and can change when given a reasoned argument).
And heck, he certainly didn't even think he would get this far, it was a way to fan the flames and it just worked better than expected. I like Bernie, but I'm not one for blind, unquestioning faith. I never have (which got me picked on a lot in HS back in the day and even some bruises).
-9.75, -8.21
thank you shaharazade
Thank you for answering me. I do agree that we need to keep the pressure on everyone who aspires to lead this movement. Merely electing Bernie won't get the job done. It's going to take a lot more than that.
But keeping Yet Another Corporate MIC Shill away from the principal levers of power can't hurt!
Anyway, thank you for your answer, shaharazade. I'm still mastering this site's methods of tracking replies......
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
top comment, I'll meet you in no-man's land ...
... I always see the no-man's land we had between the West and East German border area in front of me. If they wouldn't have had landmines in there, it would be a really quiet nice place...
https://www.euronews.com/live
I don't think Bernie is a mushy middle, BUT
the important thing here is not primarily (heh) Bernie's horse-race with Hillary. That's only important inasmuch as it punctures the establishment narrative.
As someone said, establishment politics is waging a war on our imaginations
http://time.com/4235720/democrats-sanders-clinton-black-voters/?utm_sour...
What the establishment doesn't like about Bernie is that he's puncturing their inescapable bubble.
The important thing is for the movement to be able to outlive Bernie's candidacy. So far, it's the best chance we've had.
I didn't want him to run as a Democrat, either. But I believe him when he says he did it for the media coverage. And part of what he's doing is illuminating the duopoly and its incestuous, corrupt collaboration with Big Media.
When he backs off from doing that into a "Oh those Republicans are so bad, we must stop them," that's when I start to back off from Bernie. If he tries to hand us to Clinton, everybody in the establishment is gonna get a shock.
The question is, what will we be doing that goes beyond Bernie?
There's nothing wrong with organizing around him for now--if people can avoid seeing him as the sine qua non.
One thing I like about Bernie is that he doesn't see *himself* as the sine qua non--or, at least, he doesn't act like it.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
What I've said all the way along regarding this is...
I respect Bernie. If he wants to try to convince me to vote for Clinton then I owe him a good honest attempt at that and I'll listen. But if his argument is the same as Noam Chomsky's (scary Republicans) then it will fall on deaf ears. In order to get me to vote for Clinton he would need to somehow convince me that she is not the woman I believe her to be. Further, after the campaign she has run, I'm unclear how anyone could convince me of that. But if he wants to make a stab at it, I'll give it an honest listen.
If someone thinks I'm just going to vote for Clinton because Bernie told me to then they are sadly mistaken.
A lot of wanderers in the U.S. political desert recognize that all the duopoly has to offer is a choice of mirages. Come, let us trudge towards empty expanse of sand #1, littered with the bleached bones of Deaniacs and Hope and Changers.
-- lotlizard
Al has said it here and he comes and goes as he likes,
nothing wrong with that. Nobody should be manipulated to support nilly-willy the Sanders political revolution or campaign. Lots of people have given up on any campaign. No need to challenge someone to a debate. As JtC said this site is not by default a Sanders campaign support site. Many do support Sanders, but those who stay back shouldn't be "chastised" for it. Wait and see is one way to approach it.
Just saying and throwing my support for Al's peace of mind in here.
https://www.euronews.com/live
I certainly don't want to chastise him
And I know better than to campaign for Sanders to him. I respect his opinion, and largely agree with it. And his peace of mind. But debate is what this place ought to be about, and I am saddened to think he has been chased off of it.
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
I think he will be back - nobody chased him away from here -
afaik. People can get tired of debates, too.
https://www.euronews.com/live
I don't think anyone chased Al off.
There was one person who spoke to him disrespectfully. There's never gonna be a website that can guarantee that no one will ever say something crappy.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
True that
but still one can still find websites that do not preach the gospel of the system/machine is invincible and the only alternatives to taking it back is by infiltration or violent bloody war. History and politics or the world is not static or binary thank god. I for one figure do what you can to mitigate the damage the vampire squid is inflicting but do not be stopped by the shock and awe they pump out. All these fuckers throughout history say they are inevitable or the biggest military killers ever. They get have and do get brought down by ordinary humans one way or another
The power of people globally is more awesome then the owners biggest baddest global military police state ever. I'll keep voting as I believe in democracy. It's a powerful thing that has roots deep in humankind. That doesn't mean that I think people should accept 'victory's for compromise' that slightly alter the fuckatude we face globally. As far as the internet goes it's still despite all their efforts to rein it in a big wild world web where you can stretch your concepts of what is possible other then the duopoly and soft sell offered up by the pols of mass deception and their enablers.
No one drove off Big Al but he like me is a hot head and that endears him to this 99%'er. He may be back but regardless of him ad many like him i do not like the direction this site has taken. I fucking do not like Obama or any of the Democratic weasels with power. He's a war criminal PR empty suit with a corporate wife from the healthcare for profit 'industry'. A guy they groomed and sent out to placate the masses. His rhetorical skills were amazing. Of course his writers plagiarized everybody from Malcolm x and MLK to the misaligned white dude what's his name. I am not playing this game no more.
As far as Bernie goes good luck and thank you people who are showing up and voting for his revolution. I'm voting for him donated and a committed delegate. Still I wonder who'll stop the rain. It's up to us not them.
I may be gone soon too as I could give a fuck about the Democratic party which is complicit with the scary loonies on the Republican side. I reject 99% of what dkos has pumped out at me for the last 10 years and I just don't want to deal with a mentality that says what's your solution we only have this choice. Bullshit. People have always had to deal with this kind og bs. and they have somehow managed to rein them in. The beat goes on and we cannot let them convince us that we only have this farce as an alternative to violent bloody war.
Smart drones ? Yeah that's the ticket. Forget about really taking this on cause it's the biggest baddest scarist military stare ever. Nah it's not that's what these fuckers always say. Don't believe them they are all pure evil.
My two cents signing off and voting for Bernie but not counting on this to even make a dent in the grip of the blood sucking vampire squid attached to humanities face. I'm not about to make nice with any purveyor who tells me this is all you can get and tells me to vote for the the ticket of the lesser evil. Kind of a mind blow to have democracy and my vote limited to Bernie vs a bunch of maniacs that should all be in the Hague and in jail here in the US for rearranging the rule of law to suit the purposes of the 1%'ers and the hangers on who don't want to let go of what they have gained through coincidence.
I think I just got on a list
by clicking that link. Oh well. I was probably already on it.
Thanks, hecate.
What kind of list are you speaking of?
I'm a wikileaks reader from way back. I even donated to them years ago. When as a Ludditte I first got online during the Bushies I wrote an email to Nancy Pelosi yelling at her for hustling Dem. money from people and then refusing to fight the Republicans. I went on and on about funding the illegal wars and the war criminal Nazis's like Cheney and Rumsey in the WH and then made the mistake of sending it to the WH. I'm still here and not in Gitmo so I think you'll be okay.
shaharazade, just teasing hecate. nt
I know Orlinda
I'm just teasing back. It's is a paranoid world by design and I sometimes go uh oh I better quit reading this and back away, or else, then I giggle nervously. Back then I was even more paranoid and hadn't adjusted to the brave new world as we find it I woke up one day and found myself living in Brazil the movie...
I disagree with this statement
"They think they're on the cusp of something important, that they're literally leading a shift in American poltiics.
Bullshit. Most of the Sanders supporters are none other than Obama supporters, the war criminal, liar extraordinaire that still maintains an over 80% approval rating from Democrats. Sure, there are some non-Democrats supporting Sanders, including some republicans, but overall his supporters is made up of Democrats. They're the ones leading this "revolution", people who support a war criminal. Now what the hell kind of revolution is that."
I am against everything that Obama stands for and I am sorry that I believed his hope and change shit the first time. His FISA vote gave me pause, but I knew that there would be no hope or change after I saw his cabinet appointments. After the first drones started flying. After saying that even though "we tortured some folks, we will look forward not backward"
And especially letting Bush, Cheney and the banks off with their crimes against humanity.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.
~Hannah Arendt
Leading a shift in American politics
I'm not so sure about that.
I think that most of Sanders' support comes from the very flavor of Obama voter that you described yourself as:
Add to that the arch-fiasco corporate welfare-a-thon called the "Affordable" Care Act, and you've got me described to a "T", too. And a great many other Bernie supporters as well. I wrote off a lot of the war stuff because of the old saying of General William T. Sherman: "War is Hell and you cannot refine it." Dumbya bequeathed wars to Obama, and everything that touches war sucks. But Obama had a clear opportunity to put the United States on the same high standard as all civilized nations on Earth with the ACA, and instead he screwed the pooch royally, allowing Lieberman and Baucus to kill the public option after he himself removed single payer from the table despite the fact he had the votes and the powers to push single payer through if he really meant what he had said about hope and change.
Were what you said correct, and Bernie's supporters were nearly all typical Democrats, he'd already be out of the race and Her Inevitability would already be crowned. But instead, Bernie really is leading a shift in American politics: he's restoring the moderate left to a nation whose politics had been the exclusive preserve of various flavors of the right for 40 years. And he's doing it with the help and support of a lot of people who, like both of us, are very disappointed in Barack Obama as President.
That this is viewable as "a political revolution" is simply another symptom of how far we've deteriorated as a nation from the JFK years.
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
Also, I deeply disagree
with the idea that the millenials who support Bernie are just a bunch of Obama supporters. No. By and large, they are either young people who have never been involved in politics, or young people who WERE Obama supporters and then got turned off by his crappy betrayal.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Like my granddaughter
and her mom and me. That's three of these cooked up generational demographic's of mass deception who saw Obame for what he is and what he represents. They were hip to his crappy betrayal. This country is so huge and so polarized culturally and regionally that it's easy to assume for instance all poc like Hillary or all young one's like Bernie. I will say one thing the millennials that I know are not at all hooked into or buying into the partisan bullshit, the fear tactics or the divisive cultural war.
When my granddaughter who grew up in a upscale conservative burb turned 18 during Obama's administration she refused to register to vote as it was rigged. She was a big Obama fan even though she could not vote and as a tiny one thought bush was a bad man because of the war, torture and the environment mainly. We talked her into registering and with eyes wide open she is a Bernie supporter. Lately she's been looking at Jill Stein as an alternative to Bernie if they rig this primary. My daughter inlaw a x'er wrote in Bernie in 2012 she got so angry with the Democratic corruption. She's now an Indie as I am and my granddaughter is.
I think the Democratic party even if Bernie is elected is going to do it's trick of assimilating and neutering his movement. Theses young people are not going to fall for this they are wired to the whole wide world, they also have less to lose. So yes, Cant Stop the Signal we need to make plans for after the farce of an primary and general election. That's what I thought this site was about. Not interested in falling in line with the defeatist we have to work in the system. How insane the system is the very problem we need to fix and it's obvious by now that it cannot be via the rigged hijacked electoral process. Once elected then you get complicity with the very people who you voted to stop. It's an exercise in futility that keeps the wheel turning and people dying globally.
that is the truth, Shaharazade
you always saw through Obama's facade.
but don't underestimate Sanders and how he would get things done as president. he's learned one thing or maybe two: traditional politics ain't gonna get it done.
hugs to you (and I can't believe you guys have a granddaughter that old! you write soooooo young!!!)
“There are moments which are not calculable, and cannot be assessed in words; they live on in the solution of memory… ”
― Lawrence Durrell, "Justine"
I guess I see Bernie's run as a tactic rather than a solution...
A tactic w/one serious drawback, and a lot of great benefits.
The drawback is: we don't want this to end in collapse, whether via despair (OMG he lost! it's over!) or via co-optation (well, I guess I have to vote for Hillary b/c OMG! Donald Trump!)
I honestly don't think co-optation will work at this point. I think it's too late for that. Despair...I'm worried about that.
We need a plan, and it's difficult to make one because:
the electoral activists don't want to decide what to do in case of a Sanders loss b/c OMG! It's like conceding defeat! We can't make a plan B without saying we definitely will lose!
and the non-electoral activists don't want to make a plan b/c OMG! It's a Democratic campaign! Corrupt, slimy and useless!
My thing is, work w/the Bernie campaign for its benefits, and the moment IT becomes corrupt, slimy, and useless, leave. For me, that moment is when Bernie starts doing what the Dems want him to do: playing up how much worse Trump is than Hillary and how we all have to UniteBlue.
Work with the campaign without *becoming* the campaign. Be useful, but indigestible.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
It's a revolution alright
and it's not going away, Bernie or no Bernie. We need to conquer the Democratic party, and depose DWS and the corporate shills.
I'm sick of working for shitty politicians who are sold out to any interests but ours.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
As someone who spends a lot of time talking to
Sanders supporters, let me say that I don't see it that way at all.
There are tens of thousands of indies registering as Dem to vote for Sanders, and it ain't b/c they have any loyalty to the Democratic party or to Obama. In fact, Obama has come out for Hillary, for Debbie Wasserman-Schultz, etc. The Sanders campaign is afraid to criticize Obama--that's one of their failings--for fear it will make the "Bernie is a racist" argument take off even more (meanwhile, of course, Clinton can say whatever shit she wants to about Obama).
However, you shouldn't conflate the official Sanders campaign with the Sanders supporters, who show an unusual degree of independence and initiative--I think b/c a lot of us are not really Dems at all, but indies who registered Dem so we could vote and fully intend to de-register shortly.
In fact, that's what made Donna Brazile so butthurt about Sanders when he said he ran as a Dem to get media coverage! They know that lots of us have little or no loyalty to the Democratic party.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Amen
I first registered to vote in '86 (government class, senior year). Couldn't vote in November, but was able to the following spring.
I was an Independent until 4 years ago when I decided to choose a Green ballot and voted for Jill Stein in the primary against the crazy Roseanne. I reluctantly voted for Obama in the GE.
This year was the year I voted in the Democratic Primary and was the first time my brother voted in the Democratic party. Only because of Bernie. Next primary, I'll probably go back to Independent or Green.
-9.75, -8.21
i expect a compromise with sanders
but it may be a better compromise for us working stiffs than a hillary or trump version once in office.
my friend jason smith stated this recently to me:
"No I don't think Sanders will live long enough if he gets the nomination. Even if he did he is just another right wing Gompersite labor fakir."
jason teaches his fundamentals of the theory of historical materialism as explained for students from various working class parties. link below -
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCyjaJCGmsieJCIX_DwG1jXA
snoopy I agree with everything you said about Obama
but I do NOT agree about Sanders supporters. you have us confused with Hillary supporters.
the people who think Obama did a great job are just drooling over the idea of HIllary in the White House.
the reason so many of us Sanders supporters will NOT support Hillary is because we know what we are getting this time . . . more Obama, Bush, Reagan.
i understand you're upset. and we all are. literally, the fate of the world hangs in the balance.
“There are moments which are not calculable, and cannot be assessed in words; they live on in the solution of memory… ”
― Lawrence Durrell, "Justine"
I think you read my comment wrong
I don't know how to do block quotes here yet. If what you think that I wrote that Sander's supporters are Obama supporter, I didn't write that. It came from the article. That's what I said that I disagreed with.
Hillary will be Obama in a pant suit. I won't vote for her period.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.
~Hannah Arendt
Oh. You know, I misunderstood that too!
We're on the same page.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
CStS (cantStoptheSignal)
wow... it's hard to keep track of comments and who is replying to whom so i keep using people's names but you have a long one, so i hope you don't mind CStS
all that to say... yeah, i misunderstood as well.
“There are moments which are not calculable, and cannot be assessed in words; they live on in the solution of memory… ”
― Lawrence Durrell, "Justine"
CSTS is fine! :-)
I had to choose this handle, despite its length because of this:
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVF9lZ-i_ss]
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
snoop, here's how to block quote
you highlight whatever you want in the quote and then press the QUOTE MARKS about the comment box and viola...
go ahead and try and see if it works.
“There are moments which are not calculable, and cannot be assessed in words; they live on in the solution of memory… ”
― Lawrence Durrell, "Justine"
Snoopy, you might be able to insert a blockquote using your Edit
icon in that comment.
Go to the comment and hit the little 'edit' at the bottom. Select the quote text (like you're going to copy/paste). With the text highlighted, hit the little "Quote Mark" icon in the formatting options at the top of the comment-space. That should put the selected text in a block quote.
If for some reason that doesn't work, you can add a blank line above and below the post (using Enter) and just add old-fashioned double-quotes.
Be sure to Save the comment again when you are finished.
Good Luck!
I had never heard of Big Al
Thanks for the link.
I don't think Bernie is any kind of savior, but he is not a Democrat. He could have run as an indie and split the vote, I am not sure what good that does anyone. Bernie will be what we make him. He'll be a tragedy if we walk away and he will be a powerful force if we back him. This shit doesn't end in June or November.
There is a reason Bernie remained Independent. Republicans are hideous on the surface while Dems are hideous once you scratch the surface. He never had any luck with other parties like "Liberty Union" here in Vermont. They turned out to be a bunch of unattractive old cranks that spend their time talking about revolutions in coffee shops. These folks are completely incapable of working together because they want to run everything themselves but are horribly incompetent.
Frankly, I was surprised Bernie ran as a Dem. He continues to surprise me with his success. Who am I to criticize his desire to over take the D Party rather than start from scratch (again).
He is our brother from The Evening Blues
An old compatriot from past DKOS activities. Al bailed a couple of years ago and we reunited here. Al is definitely a burn out, not a rust guy. Al is kin to the early C99 members. I enjoy his company and miss him when he leaves.
The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself. - Friedrich Nietzsche -
Thanks Hecate
I always enjoy a good Al rant. He is a restless individual with no home club, a nomad.
The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself. - Friedrich Nietzsche -
I dunno...
Contract with the CIA for their PsyOps services?
Hire a mob of minions to manage the word farm?
Jam every nook and cranny with advertising?
Start an online 3-card Monte site; the losers have to sign up?
Improve the Resilience Resource Library by adding your links.
Vote Smart - Just the Facts - 40,000 politicians by name or zipcode
i like no i love the last option
winners can be such whiners. selfish. entitled. you know the profile!
“There are moments which are not calculable, and cannot be assessed in words; they live on in the solution of memory… ”
― Lawrence Durrell, "Justine"
Prescient.
FDR 9-23-33, "If we cannot do this one way, we will do it another way. But do it we will.
We don't need 135k members, we need 135k readership,
and all that it requires for c99p to achieve THAT is for ONE SINGLE C99P ARTICLE TO GO VIRAL, and once that happens, overnight, we will have massive readership. We've already acquired most of the quality writers from TOP, so really are poised to take off in a massive way. JtC may need some help with upgrading to support bandwidth once that happens, but it will happen, very soon. There are just too many quality writers contributing here during the premier political news season for it to not happen. Just wait. It will happen. All it takes is one. Just one.
In fact, if we can get Bernie to post an article here, now that would do it.
Hmmm....
“I never did give them hell. I just told the truth, and they thought it was hell.”
― Harry Truman
I agree & side note
JtC bought the software and contracted the server/ISP. He wrestled Drupal into the current form factor. The site loped along for a year and then the purge. Almost overnight, membership increased exponentially. There were a couple of crashes and a server upgrade. JtC is planning a software upgrade and some ease of use features. The site has no venture capital, advertising nor a rich benefactor. I encourage anyone who has some loose change to donate. The worst case scenario is that the site collapses under it's own weight, so let's work together to create our place.
The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself. - Friedrich Nietzsche -
I've actually put
some status updates on my FB account of a couple of essays, including OPOL's recent one, so that may bring a couple of clicks here.
Well, at least for the people on my list called "SanePeople". I created the list long before Bernie decided to run, but I think that every person on it that lives in the US is for Bernie. It's not a lot of people as I don't have a large number of "friends" on FB, but they too can spread the word.
Actually, I think one of my friends that I don't "follow" is actually supporting Bernie and switched to Dem from Rep. He actually had been pro Ron Paul, but is now feeling the "Bern".
-9.75, -8.21
Sanity is over rated
I am nuts and I voted for Bernie.
The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself. - Friedrich Nietzsche -
Exactly why I didn't read it, TomP!
As I said in another comment - I can't stand to read a grown man whine!
"The “jumpers” reminded us that one day we will all face only one choice and that is how we will die, not how we will live." Chris Hedges on 9/11
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