@Big Al
on lyrics myself. There's a local yokel guitar player here, a lefty (like Paul McCartney), who can damn near match Rhodes note for note on that song. I never knew the guitar part was that difficult 'til I saw the local guy play it. busts his ass just to (barely) keep up with that tune. He finished in the top 40 (top 3rd) of a competition to play for one of the top 7 or 8 metal bands at the time. One of the band members says to him, "woulda finished in top 10 except for your hair" (or lack thereof). Pretty good player. Damn fine rock song. And, I don't know if Oz wrote it or not, but he sings a kick ass (more traditional) love song (I think from the late '90s). Can't remember the name of it, but was surprised Oz sang it so well.

#1 I was a little surprised reading the lyrics tonight, I guess I never really focused on them before. That's why I posted them.

@Big Al Last year, I joked that Hillary 2016 was trying to push the turnout below 40%. Guess they succeeded.

Next year is a Congressional election, so the turnout will be lower, regardless of what the politicians do. Bernie yelling OMG Trump Viva La Revolucion is probably the only thing that will drive turnout higher.

#2 #2 probably only about 35% of the voting eligible public will vote in the next election. That will be less than 20% per party, the twenty percenters. I mean, think about that. In 2014, only 37% voted and I can't imagine this election will be better. The disgust level has only risen.
So in political terms, we're talking a super majority that has tuned out the two parties. Polls in the last ten years show the approval ratings of Congress to be in the low teens to an all time low of 8%.

It's all kept alive by the corporate media and our government, and those who want it to continue, from Daily Kos to the Young Turks to Democracy Now to anyone who makes money off it, to especially the Ruling Class, who need this system to maintain their power. I think that's a big problem, the professional left that whether consciously or not perpetuate this big fucking game and no one calls for an end to it. A gravy train has been developed over the last fifteen years on the internet, I was going to write about that sometime, that actually helps to keep this all going. Very few of the paid players will call for what is really needed or their gigs would end.

@Big Al Huh, and now that I've checked, looks like they've revised the early reports of low turnout to high turnout ("actually higher than 2012"). I don't know if I believe that; it kind of smells of "Oops! We'd better revise the narrative, fast!" but of course it's possible it's true.

#2 #2 probably only about 35% of the voting eligible public will vote in the next election. That will be less than 20% per party, the twenty percenters. I mean, think about that. In 2014, only 37% voted and I can't imagine this election will be better. The disgust level has only risen.
So in political terms, we're talking a super majority that has tuned out the two parties. Polls in the last ten years show the approval ratings of Congress to be in the low teens to an all time low of 8%.

It's all kept alive by the corporate media and our government, and those who want it to continue, from Daily Kos to the Young Turks to Democracy Now to anyone who makes money off it, to especially the Ruling Class, who need this system to maintain their power. I think that's a big problem, the professional left that whether consciously or not perpetuate this big fucking game and no one calls for an end to it. A gravy train has been developed over the last fifteen years on the internet, I was going to write about that sometime, that actually helps to keep this all going. Very few of the paid players will call for what is really needed or their gigs would end.

@Big Al
the results, reminding us all, once again, that "voting doesn't matter, nothing changes... "

#2 #2 probably only about 35% of the voting eligible public will vote in the next election. That will be less than 20% per party, the twenty percenters. I mean, think about that. In 2014, only 37% voted and I can't imagine this election will be better. The disgust level has only risen.
So in political terms, we're talking a super majority that has tuned out the two parties. Polls in the last ten years show the approval ratings of Congress to be in the low teens to an all time low of 8%.

It's all kept alive by the corporate media and our government, and those who want it to continue, from Daily Kos to the Young Turks to Democracy Now to anyone who makes money off it, to especially the Ruling Class, who need this system to maintain their power. I think that's a big problem, the professional left that whether consciously or not perpetuate this big fucking game and no one calls for an end to it. A gravy train has been developed over the last fifteen years on the internet, I was going to write about that sometime, that actually helps to keep this all going. Very few of the paid players will call for what is really needed or their gigs would end.

@ggersh

#2 lock stock and barrel

You're right that there is no point in voting for the lesser of two evils democrats. They have proven since 2006 that they won't go against republicans. Their loss of 1,000 seats was deliberate, IMO. This gave them their excuse for not being able to block the republicans. Plus they never tried to do it anyway. Seems that only the republicans can use the filibuster and secret holds. Republicans are not bat shit crazy. They just show their ruthlessness up front and don't try to hide it like the democrats do.

Pelosi with guidance from clinton knowing it was a twofer first in the fact she had the dubya foil in running to be prez, secondly why upset the donors
and further funding by going after the other wing of the duopoly.
Once she lost though she still remained in power, proof being her and zero did a kumbaya with her becoming SOS, upon which she really enhanced the families grifting operation (selling the country to the highest bidder, fuck that, any and every bidder).

Zero's $65mil book deal was the quid pro quo, for looking forward and as being a big a zero as he was in every respect, he actually made dubya look good, how bad is that. rhetorical.

The Koch's 3rd way plan worked like a charm, buy the D's and make them meaningless, while they believe they're priceless. The clintons will go
down in history as the biggest traitors in US history, with zero being
nothing but a willing accomplice

@Alligator Ed
For a convenient period of time, Trump was a populist and was calling out the other Republican candidates for their corruption and lies and he destroyed them. Jeb Bush was utterly helpless against him. Now an authentic progressive who has integrity and a soul and empathy should be able to do the same damn thing to these talking point actors who can't act.

#3 (and believe me the rest went the way of the wooly mammoths) will have as much effect as a rowboat trying to dock the Queen Mary. Even 100 such "progressives" would only splash about a little, making small ripples--just like the current D's do.

@WIProgressive

At some point do we have legal means to declare a winner under those circumstances illegitimate?

Nope.

That's why refusal to vote amounts to a vote for "whoever wins". This is a feature, not a bug.

#6 about not voting at all. I agree with Big Al the system has to go but even if a large majority of people don't vote many still will. So even though I don't vote there will still be an election resulting in a status quo legislator. At some point do we have legal means to declare a winner under those circumstances illegitimate?

@Big Al

instead of boycotting the system and demanding democracy.

What does this even mean? Boycott the system... to ultimately do what? To do any of this requires power. Power is violence or economic. You could have 100% of people boycott the election and not vote...and what would that change? OK, everyone stayed home and no one voted, now what? Hell at that point the politicians themselves would vote themselves in as the only voters who voted.

You got people boycotting the system and demanding democracy, and then over there you have the system you want which is democracy. In the middle there is the actual mess and transition to get it.

What is the transition? These folks won't give up power. Violence or economic -- pick one. And I'm not seeing either.

Americans don't have it in them to do violence against the system. Violence against everything else, definitely a possibility but not where it actually matters. Scapegoats against easy targets could happen, but ultimately Americans are still too intoxicated by creature comforts to do what is necessary. And economic boycotts? With Black Friday just recently being one of the biggest in years if I remember correctly it seems people can't stomach that option either.

#9 Do you see anyone talking about the lack of participation in this corrupt system, why and what we can do about it? No, and as long as the left remains too fucking chickenshit to do so, then ya, then the ruling class will get away with what they want to get away with.
Hell, we got progressives advocating for electing politicians to the republican party now, instead of boycotting the system and demanding democracy.

@MichaelSF I think this is where I start to differ, especially with Al.

A mandate for what? That people are boycotting the election? Cool, what does that mean?

Really, what does that mean?

Unless again you got 100% of the people to participate, the system will keep churning. Do you think they ultimately care if there is a record number of people not voting? Nope.

Again, a mandate to do what? Destroy the system and demand democracy? OK, and those in power will laugh and continue on with business as usual.

What people want and what they get are two different things. Vast majority want single payer. Sound like a mandate, but well our politicians won't vote for it.

Unless whatever we do has power, it is meaningless. Power is either violence or economic.

#9 That sounds like a mandate from the people to me.