"I can go out on the street and shoot someone and my poll numbers would go up."
So.......he is 9 points behind. How many does he have to shoot to get him over the top?
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Neither Russia nor China is our enemy.
Neither Iran nor Venezuela are threatening America.
Cuba is a dead horse, stop beating it.
Trump is the classic "law and order" Republican. That's what they do. Of course his numbers would go up if he went out and shot an innocent person on the street, because that's exactly what some of the people who are voting for him want. They're the same folks who defend the police/military no matter what and think that Black Lives Matter is some sort of militant movement that wants to hurt white people.
In some ways, Trump represents both the establishment and the anti-establishment, which is one reason why he's so tough to beat. He can be on all sides at the same time without looking like a hypocrite. You can't run the lying queen of milquetoast against someone like that and expect to prevail.
it seems Trump is finished. It was fun for awhile, but it's not what he really enjoys. Instead of holding on or backing away, they ought to get together and figure out a way to get him (and them) off the hook. I don't think he's dumb. So why is he saying so many really stupid things lately? "Always wanted a Purple Heart?????" It used to be kinda funny. Now, not so much.
I compared Donald Trump to the dog who caught the car. He doesn't know what to do now. The scary thought is that there are plenty of people in the Republican party who know exactly what to do. The scarier thought is that they're no longer that different from the people in the Democratic party who also know exactly what to do. Hillary's right in the middle of that gang already.
to be able to renounce him. They are the party faithful; more so than any other political party. They are like the pre-Y2K evangelicals, certain to the fiber of their being that Jesus would fulfill the prophecy at midnight. They have believed so hard and so long in their righteousness that there is no way, even in light of the obvious fact that Jesus remains missing in action, they stick to their faith contriving miscalculations of the Julian calender and what not so that they may preserve what is left of their invested egos. Otherwise, they would completely self-destruct. I like this comparison because so many of the hard right and tea party loons are also evangelical, or at least pretend to be.
Lets never underestimate the power of self-delusion lest we fall prey to it ourselves.
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"I can't understand why people are frightened of new ideas. I'm frightened of the old ones."
John Cage
If just about anybody not so entrenched in the establishment and the corporations' pockets were running, their numbers against orange Mr. Tribblehead would be YUUGE.
We tried to tell them.
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Rethugs are spinning this to their base of "Proof of the Media Bias"... and if you just "Watch him for five minutes you'll see he doesn't say those things all the time..." As if that somehow makes it better.
Of course, Clintonites say the same thing. "Just watch the speeches! Don't worry about the actions, the Speeches say the right things in a way that could possibly agree with you!"
... or Hillary for that matter. It would appear that a preponderance of Americans no longer care about anything except that their tribe wins.
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A lot of wanderers in the U.S. political desert recognize that all the duopoly has to offer is a choice of mirages. Come, let us trudge towards empty expanse of sand #1, littered with the bleached bones of Deaniacs and Hope and Changers.
-- lotlizard
Watch any of the political pundit shows, particularly MSNBC and CNN and tell me if it doesn't feel like watching Sports Center or one of its endless clones? (I exclude the FNC which is just a freaking nutbin cage match)
Politico--they purposefully turned politics and by extension, governance into a scorable game.
None of these ratings/click trolls get it that politics has consequences for governance and for the lives of "little people" for them and the 1% it's all a game.
Unfortunately many of the "pawns" in this "game" have been tricked into also believing it's a game.
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____________________________________________________________________________
"I'm not interested in preserving the status quo; I want to overthrow it. "
-Niccolo Machiavelli
Democratic and Republican supporters are both in denial as they watch their parties collapse. Hopefully they run some ads of Comey saying HRC was grossly negligent with National Security. It would speed up the process and drive voters to a third party.
Just as I was reading your post, an ad was playing on the teevee. It doesn't speak specifically about her carelessness, but it's Trey Gowdy asking questions of James Comey about the handling of the classified emails. Then it says at the end: "Should Hillary have faced criminal charges? With a phone number and press 1 for yes and 2 for no. Paid for by Great America PAC. Don't worry. They're on it.
they still spend most of their time on Trump, giving him more free publicity.
My Dad thinks the "isn't this terrible" part isn't nearly as important as the familiarity of his face; he thinks if they don't quit covering every idiotic word that falls from Trump's lips, he will win.
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It went a little further than just a lot of free media exposure. There is a direct connection between media exposure and votes, therefore they were intentionally helping him get votes. The same media machine that selected Clinton also selected Trump. It should be obvious why they selected Trump.
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“He may not have gotten the words out but the thoughts were great.”
Hillary has done everything but come out wearing a suit that looks like a flag with swastikas where the stars are supposed to be (she had about three dozen flunkies essentially do that - to drums; we should start calling her Mother Night) and she's still got legitimate supporters.
Is that John McCain made sure he lost in 2008 by choosing Sarah Palin to be his VP nominee he insured he had someone who was even more distasteful to mild racists than Obama was.
In my town that has an 100 year old integrated community he received almost no votes when 70% currently identify as leaning republican.
The reason in my opinion is they knew the housing crash was coming. Had they won nobody would have voted for a republican for along time. They would not have been able to lay it at the feet of democratic policy with any credibility.
Now it's a new election. We appear to have a new down turn coming hanging this around the democratic necks would be call their policies into question. Another down turn could be completely blamed on one party putting more liberal policies more open to criticism.
He was never trying to win, he's just trying to increase the value of the Trump brand. But try as he might, he was unable to lose the GOP nomination. His supporters are stuck to him like gum on the bottom of a shoe. That explains why he constantly ratchets up the outrageousness of his statements. His campaign can't come up with anything too far gone. Nothing is beyond the pale for his zombie followers. Here's a guy who's obviously trying to lose the election, and he can't.
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“He may not have gotten the words out but the thoughts were great.”
It looks like the Gold Star rebuke combined with the Purple Heart riff combined with not endorsing Ryan and McCain may be finally bringing this freak show to an end. Rance Priebus is purported to be "apoplectic" over the Ryan/McCain stuff as now Trump has moved on to threatening the incumbent status of leading Republicans. That may finally be the bridge too far for Trump. They were fine with the sexism, racism, bigotry, religious discrimination, xenophobia, infantile rants, the insults and all of that, but not endorse incumbents?!!! Now you've done it.
So now talking heads are discussing what the rules are for getting him out. It's as simple as the Republican National Committee meeting and deciding who they want to fill the position. They could recall a convention, but they don't have to.
The obvious suspects would be :
*elevating Pence (not likely IMO since the only guy who voted for him was Trump but maybe since he is the official VP candidate)
*choosing between the last two to remain in - Cruz or Kasich
* they could possibly ask Romney to run as the last legitimately chosen candidate
* they ask Ryan or someone else based on internal polling or whatever their criteria is
Yes, they can do this. They are a private organization. I don't know what the ramifications are for changing the ballots in the states however, but there must be some mechanism. What if Trump simply got ill?
I think this is happening. Now, what will happen to the Trump voters?
1. They furiously go off to vote for the Libertarians en masse to demonstrate their anger at the Party
2. They vote for the new candidate
3. They vote for Hillary
4. They sit out
The upside for Dems is disunity in the Republican side should rebound to her benefit. The downside is that any other capable Republican will be able to mount a devastating campaign against her by utilizing the server/ National Security issues, her blatant lying and the Clinton Foundation in a way that the short attention span, incoherent Trump couldn't.
I'm not sure that we have enough domestic popcorn on hand to cover upcoming events, we may have to have emergency imports.
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" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "
Because unlike the Democratic base that always falls inline, the GOP base is rabid and fully supports Trump. The only way I see this happening is if Trump meets some untimely demise. If the simply push him out, he will attack them with all of his might and the GOP base will be right there with him. Yes, the 'could' do it, but to do so would be political suicide.
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Democrats, we tried to warn you. How is that guilt and shame working out?
they appeared to be willing to overlook all his flaws until he actually threatened their incumbencies and majorities. I think that may have given them grounds to revoke his nomination based on that fact alone. I'm not sure he can slough that one off, especially when without exception the elected Republicans have gritted their teeth and endorsed him when everything fine and decent within them (such as it is) said otherwise.
If Republicans lost Trump's base, would that really be such a bad thing for them, long term? They were going to lose this time regardless with him at the top with the latest movement of "moderate" Republicans moving over to Clinton.
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" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "
I know Cruz had more delegates, but he also was a very divisive figure within the Party, not seen as a team player. IMO the Republican Committee could say that they narrowed the field to the last two men who had the endurance to stay in until the end and they felt the candidate who had the best chance of drawing the Party together was Kasich and that was their executive decision. That would be Cruz's chickens coming home to roost bigtime.
Or, they could flip a coin in public. That would be perceived as fair, and either one of them is better (from their perspective) than Clinton. Either one of them would be an effective anti-Clinton.
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" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "
My military son talked my rocket scientist son into voting for Clinton, he is so anti-Trump. 'A vote for Third party is a vote for Trump.' Lol he didn't have that little chat with me.
But a moderate Republican vs a moderate Republican? Anyone except Cruz? (Who is not a moderate Republican anyways) now, Kasich would win against HRC, not even close, IMHO.
went full ct on Trump and strongly implied he was a Democrat mole put in place by Bill Clinton to take down the Republican Party. It was so amusing. He did a full face in the camera shot and told Trump supporters they were being played by a Democrat (I guess he thinks Trump is a Democrat) and that they were allowing him to destroy the Party.
Why do I watch Moaning Joe? Because you will get the most complete overview of what the talking heads and Party apparatchiks have decided will be the day's talking points. It's been illustrative to watch Joe and Mika turn from fawning sycophants when addressing "Mr. Trump" into terrorized villagers running for the hills.
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" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "
There is nothing which I dread so much as a division of the republic into two great parties.. This...is to be dreaded as the greatest political evil under our Constitution.--John Adams
Comments
The Donald said it himself
"I can go out on the street and shoot someone and my poll numbers would go up."
So.......he is 9 points behind. How many does he have to shoot to get him over the top?
Neither Russia nor China is our enemy.
Neither Iran nor Venezuela are threatening America.
Cuba is a dead horse, stop beating it.
Not too surprising, all things considered.
Trump is the classic "law and order" Republican. That's what they do. Of course his numbers would go up if he went out and shot an innocent person on the street, because that's exactly what some of the people who are voting for him want. They're the same folks who defend the police/military no matter what and think that Black Lives Matter is some sort of militant movement that wants to hurt white people.
In some ways, Trump represents both the establishment and the anti-establishment, which is one reason why he's so tough to beat. He can be on all sides at the same time without looking like a hypocrite. You can't run the lying queen of milquetoast against someone like that and expect to prevail.
Depends. Are they Mexicans or Muslims?
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Just one
And he's such a media whore, I wouldn't put it past him.
We can’t save the world by playing by the rules, because the rules have to be changed.
- Greta Thunberg
I think it's that they can't admit
that they've already lost-- on so many fronts.
"I can't understand why people are frightened of new ideas. I'm frightened of the old ones."
John Cage
If they would stop and think about it,
it seems Trump is finished. It was fun for awhile, but it's not what he really enjoys. Instead of holding on or backing away, they ought to get together and figure out a way to get him (and them) off the hook. I don't think he's dumb. So why is he saying so many really stupid things lately? "Always wanted a Purple Heart?????" It used to be kinda funny. Now, not so much.
In another of Phoebe's diaries
I compared Donald Trump to the dog who caught the car. He doesn't know what to do now. The scary thought is that there are plenty of people in the Republican party who know exactly what to do. The scarier thought is that they're no longer that different from the people in the Democratic party who also know exactly what to do. Hillary's right in the middle of that gang already.
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Hi, really-in-NM-doc.
Good to see you here.
Likewise, I'm sure
Good to be seen.
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Perfect analogy Doc!
The dog that caught the car!!!! Please, please, may I use that analogy - all credit to you!
Trump isn't the heart of their failure
to be able to renounce him. They are the party faithful; more so than any other political party. They are like the pre-Y2K evangelicals, certain to the fiber of their being that Jesus would fulfill the prophecy at midnight. They have believed so hard and so long in their righteousness that there is no way, even in light of the obvious fact that Jesus remains missing in action, they stick to their faith contriving miscalculations of the Julian calender and what not so that they may preserve what is left of their invested egos. Otherwise, they would completely self-destruct. I like this comparison because so many of the hard right and tea party loons are also evangelical, or at least pretend to be.
Lets never underestimate the power of self-delusion lest we fall prey to it ourselves.
"I can't understand why people are frightened of new ideas. I'm frightened of the old ones."
John Cage
A decent opponent.
If just about anybody not so entrenched in the establishment and the corporations' pockets were running, their numbers against orange Mr. Tribblehead would be YUUGE.
We tried to tell them.
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Oddest thing about this election
is that both candidates are running against the one person that they stand a chance of beating.
“To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.” -Voltaire
What a coinkydink
Odd, isn't it?
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Who woulda thought?. . . . .. nt.
" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "
I wonder how that happened heh n/t
“To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.” -Voltaire
Oddest thing about this
Fixed that for you.
"When we remember we are all mad, the mysteries disappear and life stands explained." - Mark Twain
These "Gaffes" are exactly why they stick with him.
Rethugs are spinning this to their base of "Proof of the Media Bias"... and if you just "Watch him for five minutes you'll see he doesn't say those things all the time..." As if that somehow makes it better.
Of course, Clintonites say the same thing. "Just watch the speeches! Don't worry about the actions, the Speeches say the right things in a way that could possibly agree with you!"
I do not pretend I know what I do not know.
I don't think it matters what Trump does...
... or Hillary for that matter. It would appear that a preponderance of Americans no longer care about anything except that their tribe wins.
A lot of wanderers in the U.S. political desert recognize that all the duopoly has to offer is a choice of mirages. Come, let us trudge towards empty expanse of sand #1, littered with the bleached bones of Deaniacs and Hope and Changers.
-- lotlizard
How do you tell if it's SportsCenter or Political Pundit Show?
Watch any of the political pundit shows, particularly MSNBC and CNN and tell me if it doesn't feel like watching Sports Center or one of its endless clones? (I exclude the FNC which is just a freaking nutbin cage match)
Politico--they purposefully turned politics and by extension, governance into a scorable game.
None of these ratings/click trolls get it that politics has consequences for governance and for the lives of "little people" for them and the 1% it's all a game.
Unfortunately many of the "pawns" in this "game" have been tricked into also believing it's a game.
____________________________________________________________________________
"I'm not interested in preserving the status quo; I want to overthrow it. "
-Niccolo Machiavelli
"Sorry Hillary"
-TheJerry
Yep. We are the pre-show before Hunger Games.
And this transformation of politics divorced from governance is what set the stage.
" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "
Sports Center...
Is usually factually grounded and less likely to spin blunders or defeats.
Democrats, we tried to warn you. How is that guilt and shame working out?
Democrats put up someone who vacations with *Henry Kissinger*
Actions speak louder than words.
What kind of human beings would think Henry Kissinger is an admirable human being?
The answer to that question is as much of a deal breaker for me as anything Trump might say.
Democratic and Republican
Democratic and Republican supporters are both in denial as they watch their parties collapse. Hopefully they run some ads of Comey saying HRC was grossly negligent with National Security. It would speed up the process and drive voters to a third party.
Really weird.
Just as I was reading your post, an ad was playing on the teevee. It doesn't speak specifically about her carelessness, but it's Trey Gowdy asking questions of James Comey about the handling of the classified emails. Then it says at the end: "Should Hillary have faced criminal charges? With a phone number and press 1 for yes and 2 for no. Paid for by Great America PAC. Don't worry. They're on it.
Media
Primaries:
promoted Clinton
Ignored/destroyed Sanders
Gave Trump a free ride
General:
Boosting Clinton
Destroying Trump
Draw your own conclusions.
Whether the GOP are complicit is a really interesting question.
“To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.” -Voltaire
Actually per my parents, who are MSM network news addicts,
they still spend most of their time on Trump, giving him more free publicity.
My Dad thinks the "isn't this terrible" part isn't nearly as important as the familiarity of his face; he thinks if they don't quit covering every idiotic word that falls from Trump's lips, he will win.
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No such thing as bad publicity. n/t
Only connect. - E.M. Forster
Effects of a free ride
It went a little further than just a lot of free media exposure. There is a direct connection between media exposure and votes, therefore they were intentionally helping him get votes. The same media machine that selected Clinton also selected Trump. It should be obvious why they selected Trump.
“He may not have gotten the words out but the thoughts were great.”
All that matters in the end is that the public is watching
The horse race and not taking about what monsters hold power in this society.
Anything but the real problem.
“If there is no justice for the people, may there be no peace for the government.”
There's not much the GOP can
do about it now. It's too late for them to be changing horses in midstream.
native
Agreed, but in the same vein
Hillary has done everything but come out wearing a suit that looks like a flag with swastikas where the stars are supposed to be (she had about three dozen flunkies essentially do that - to drums; we should start calling her Mother Night) and she's still got legitimate supporters.
On to Biden since 1973
I used to think the same.
Till I saw the movie Idiocracy.
I got my law degree at Costco U.
I only got in as a legacy.
The top three movies for the American Condition:
Galaxy Quest
Office Space
Idiocracy
They should all be sealed in a time capsule.
" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "
Trump agrees with the
old saying, There is no such thing as Bad Publicity so anytime his name is mentioned or he is written about it's a good thing to him. He may be right!
???
well... he sure to hell doesn't want to win.
???
well... he sure to hell doesn't want to win.
My theory
Is that John McCain made sure he lost in 2008 by choosing Sarah Palin to be his VP nominee he insured he had someone who was even more distasteful to mild racists than Obama was.
In my town that has an 100 year old integrated community he received almost no votes when 70% currently identify as leaning republican.
The reason in my opinion is they knew the housing crash was coming. Had they won nobody would have voted for a republican for along time. They would not have been able to lay it at the feet of democratic policy with any credibility.
Now it's a new election. We appear to have a new down turn coming hanging this around the democratic necks would be call their policies into question. Another down turn could be completely blamed on one party putting more liberal policies more open to criticism.
I've always thought
He was never trying to win, he's just trying to increase the value of the Trump brand. But try as he might, he was unable to lose the GOP nomination. His supporters are stuck to him like gum on the bottom of a shoe. That explains why he constantly ratchets up the outrageousness of his statements. His campaign can't come up with anything too far gone. Nothing is beyond the pale for his zombie followers. Here's a guy who's obviously trying to lose the election, and he can't.
“He may not have gotten the words out but the thoughts were great.”
He may be trying to lose the election
but that doesn't mean that he will.
On the other hand, the Democrats are also acting like they want to lose so who knows?
Life is strong. I'm weak, but Life is strong.
There's a real push to get Trump out as the nominee
It looks like the Gold Star rebuke combined with the Purple Heart riff combined with not endorsing Ryan and McCain may be finally bringing this freak show to an end. Rance Priebus is purported to be "apoplectic" over the Ryan/McCain stuff as now Trump has moved on to threatening the incumbent status of leading Republicans. That may finally be the bridge too far for Trump. They were fine with the sexism, racism, bigotry, religious discrimination, xenophobia, infantile rants, the insults and all of that, but not endorse incumbents?!!! Now you've done it.
So now talking heads are discussing what the rules are for getting him out. It's as simple as the Republican National Committee meeting and deciding who they want to fill the position. They could recall a convention, but they don't have to.
The obvious suspects would be :
*elevating Pence (not likely IMO since the only guy who voted for him was Trump but maybe since he is the official VP candidate)
*choosing between the last two to remain in - Cruz or Kasich
* they could possibly ask Romney to run as the last legitimately chosen candidate
* they ask Ryan or someone else based on internal polling or whatever their criteria is
Yes, they can do this. They are a private organization. I don't know what the ramifications are for changing the ballots in the states however, but there must be some mechanism. What if Trump simply got ill?
I think this is happening. Now, what will happen to the Trump voters?
1. They furiously go off to vote for the Libertarians en masse to demonstrate their anger at the Party
2. They vote for the new candidate
3. They vote for Hillary
4. They sit out
The upside for Dems is disunity in the Republican side should rebound to her benefit. The downside is that any other capable Republican will be able to mount a devastating campaign against her by utilizing the server/ National Security issues, her blatant lying and the Clinton Foundation in a way that the short attention span, incoherent Trump couldn't.
I'm not sure that we have enough domestic popcorn on hand to cover upcoming events, we may have to have emergency imports.
" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "
They really can't do this...
Because unlike the Democratic base that always falls inline, the GOP base is rabid and fully supports Trump. The only way I see this happening is if Trump meets some untimely demise. If the simply push him out, he will attack them with all of his might and the GOP base will be right there with him. Yes, the 'could' do it, but to do so would be political suicide.
Democrats, we tried to warn you. How is that guilt and shame working out?
Well, like I said
they appeared to be willing to overlook all his flaws until he actually threatened their incumbencies and majorities. I think that may have given them grounds to revoke his nomination based on that fact alone. I'm not sure he can slough that one off, especially when without exception the elected Republicans have gritted their teeth and endorsed him when everything fine and decent within them (such as it is) said otherwise.
If Republicans lost Trump's base, would that really be such a bad thing for them, long term? They were going to lose this time regardless with him at the top with the latest movement of "moderate" Republicans moving over to Clinton.
" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "
There is only one party and
There is only one party and it chose Hillary a long time ago.
You would think they would be smart enough
The reality is if they had nominated Kasich (who while a nicer and more normal person still has horrible Rethuglican policies) Hillary would be toast
If it came down to Cruz and Kasich
I know Cruz had more delegates, but he also was a very divisive figure within the Party, not seen as a team player. IMO the Republican Committee could say that they narrowed the field to the last two men who had the endurance to stay in until the end and they felt the candidate who had the best chance of drawing the Party together was Kasich and that was their executive decision. That would be Cruz's chickens coming home to roost bigtime.
Or, they could flip a coin in public. That would be perceived as fair, and either one of them is better (from their perspective) than Clinton. Either one of them would be an effective anti-Clinton.
" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "
Kasich would win.
My military son talked my rocket scientist son into voting for Clinton, he is so anti-Trump. 'A vote for Third party is a vote for Trump.' Lol he didn't have that little chat with me.
But a moderate Republican vs a moderate Republican? Anyone except Cruz? (Who is not a moderate Republican anyways) now, Kasich would win against HRC, not even close, IMHO.
Moaning Joe (I know, I know)
went full ct on Trump and strongly implied he was a Democrat mole put in place by Bill Clinton to take down the Republican Party. It was so amusing. He did a full face in the camera shot and told Trump supporters they were being played by a Democrat (I guess he thinks Trump is a Democrat) and that they were allowing him to destroy the Party.
Why do I watch Moaning Joe? Because you will get the most complete overview of what the talking heads and Party apparatchiks have decided will be the day's talking points. It's been illustrative to watch Joe and Mika turn from fawning sycophants when addressing "Mr. Trump" into terrorized villagers running for the hills.
" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "
Our owners must be pleased.
Neither Russia nor China is our enemy.
Neither Iran nor Venezuela are threatening America.
Cuba is a dead horse, stop beating it.
Principles. When you have none you'll never fall short.
There is nothing which I dread so much as a division of the republic into two great parties.. This...is to be dreaded as the greatest political evil under our Constitution.--John Adams