Clinton and the Democratic Party are about to have a long-overdue day of reckoning.
The brilliant @yvessmith delivers the most detailed case yet why progressives hate Hillary--and might vote Trump: https://t.co/kgeP6kPd6P
— michaelhirsh (@michaelphirsh) June 1, 2016
Over at Politico, Yves Smith writes about a phenomenon which I am also seeing in my contacts. Progressives are saying 'enough is enough' and are saying that they will no longer be a party to the dismantling of our democracy. They have been used and abused and are no longer willing to vote between the lesser of two evils. After all, the lesser of two evils is subjective. How to quantify evil? Is it the methodical destruction of our planet and culture by the neo-lib and neo-con uber capitalist failure? Or the possibility of electing an unknown, undisciplined narcissist? The evil you know vs. the evil you don't know.
By contrast, the Democratic Party in the Clinton and Obama administrations has consistently embraced and implemented policies that strip workers of economic and legal rights to benefit investors and the elite professionals that serve them. Over time, the “neoliberal” economic order—which sees only good, never bad, in the relentless untrammeling of capital and the deregulation of markets—has created an unacceptable level of economic insecurity and distress for those outside the 1 percent and the elite professionals who serve them.
The result is that the U.S. economy is becoming lethal to the less fortunate, according to the New York Times, which reported this week that U.S. death rates have risen for the first time in a decade. The increase in death rates among less educated whites since 2001 is roughly the size of the AIDS epidemic. One cause, the opioid epidemic, resulted from Purdue Pharma overselling the effectiveness of reformulated OxyContin, then recommending higher dosages when it failed to work properly, which experts deemed a prescription for creating addicts, according to a number of lawsuits. This was permitted by the U.S. government, leading to thousands of unnecessary deaths. Despite President Barack Obama’s Panglossian claim that the economy is doing well, the spike in suicides to levels over those during the financial crisis belies that.
Yet the Clinton campaign is in such denial about this that it has become vitriolic in its verbal and tactical attacks on Sanders and his supporters—rather than recognizing that the stunning success of his campaign is proof of their abject policy failures. The message is clear: The Clintons believe, as Bill himself put it, that the true progressives have nowhere to go.
They are counting on us to follow the crumbs to the wicked witches house. I think this will be the year that progressives recognize that they have been enabling abusive treatment and will take their future into their own more capable hands.
I encourage you to read Ives Smith's entire piece. It is a brilliant analysis of where progressives are politically. A good description of between a rock and a hard place.
Comments
it's
not spurious. It's fact. "I live in a rather special world. I only know one person who voted for Nixon. Where they are I don't know. They're outside my ken. But sometimes when I'm in a theater I can feel them." And I am not about making fun of the arts. I believe the arts are infinitely more important than all this ludicrous bollocks of politics.
Webber herself cites to the circle-jerk of friends:
I've been to Naked Capitalism. It is deeply imbued in that which is not Real. Money.
If you think Trump is the lesser of evils, there is no helping you. Unless you undergo a Senator Rawkins transformation.
(No subject)
(no clue)
(no couth)
Great post and astute comments.
I am happy to share it with the world.
Life is strong. I'm weak, but Life is strong.
if Trump wins over Clinton...
...it will not be with my vote. i will not be party to that. i don't want Clinton in the White House either but my effort to keep her out will be limited to not voting for her. i'm taking a wait and see for my GE vote to see how the convention plays out, what Bernie decides to do and what any major news will be in the coming months but definitely no Clinton or Trump.
Wait, whats this?
Supers to switch if Sanders wins CA
come on wishful thinking don't fail me now!
It's true right now like it was back then. The old devils are at it again. When I say devil you know who I mean these animals in the dark malicious politicians with nefarious schemes charlatans and crooked cops. - 'Old Devils' William Elliot Whitmore
I could see some of the California supers
going with "the will of the people" and all that -- probably not diehards like Boxer (who's retiring anyway) but folks who'll actually have to stand for re-election in this and future cycles. Whether that's enough to get the other supers to reconsider, I have no idea.
In fairness, Boxer isn't just a diehard.
She's a Clinton family member (her daughter was married to Hillary's brother and they had a son)! No wonder her shilling got so toxic in Nevada.
!
I think we're all feeling a little Charlie Brown right now.
"If I sit silently, I have sinned." - Mossadegh
Never Trump
Sorry. Can't do it. Won't do it. That's pure nihilism.
So here's how it shakes out for me:
Point 1 - Bernie has my vote for as long as he wants it. Whether next Tuesday (I'm in NJ), or in November. If he's on the ballot, that's it.
Point 2 - If Bernie is not on the ballot, then I will still cast my vote in the most positive way I can. And there is absolutely nothing positive about voting for Trump. I am taking a hard look at Gary Johnson. Yes, I disagree with about 75% of his positions. But the other 25% includes some things I can get behind. And let's face it - I disagree with about 75% of Hillary's real positions, too. So what is my #1 priority? How about this - which one is least likely to launch WW3? That's fairly important, and one VERY good reason NOT to vote for Trump, no matter how disgusted you are. Which one has a record of actually governing something competently? I may not like all he did as Governor of NM, but at least he didn't blow the place up or drive it into bankruptcy. So I can see some positives that might point me toward Johnson.
As for Johnson vs. Stein, while I am certainly much closer to Stein politically, I do wonder if she has the ability to earn enough votes for anyone to even notice. Whereas Johnson I think does have the possibility of having a real effect. At this point, I don't know which way I would jump, I might not even know until I'm in the voting booth.
Though of course, if Bernie joins forces with Stein, refer back to my Point 1.
Hillary Clinton's foreign policy is worse than Dick Cheney's
This alone should be sufficient to give any progressive pause. Her year long plus deception of the American and Democratic voters about what she did with her e-mail also appear increasingly reminds me of John Edwards totally without regard to whatever else we might learn from the FBI investigation.
Exactly, but I still wouldn't vote for Trump
We need to break completely with Lesser Evilism once and for all. We deserve something better than the so-called "Lesser Evil."
Between Hillary and Trump, the argument could be made that Trump is the Lesser Evil. That's how evil Hillary is. No-one should ever vote for someone who counts the mass murdered Henry Kissinger among their friends and then brags that he is their friend. Ye gods!!! This is what the Democratic Party has come to.
We absolutely need to break free of Lesser Evilism.
Never be deceived that the rich will allow you to vote away their wealth.-Lucy Parsons
Reinforced today with her speech.
Not planning on voting for either of them.
But if I absolutely had to choose one, I'd probably choose Trump. On the theory that if I'm going down, I'm going to take Hilary and the DNC down with me.
My thoughts on Trump
My distaste for HRC grows exponentially by the day. Trump is a turd. My favorite options:
1. Bernie as dem nom.
2. Bernie as pres with Jill stein as VP on Green ballot
But in the event that the only 2 viable choices are HRC or Trump, here's why I would, at this point, choose Trump:
1. 4 yrs instead of 8. No one will primary Hill 4 yrs from now.
2. Less likelihood of WWIII. Hill wants to bomb Russia & Iran. Maybe we will anyway; NATO is pushing us there. Maybe Trump has enough spine to resist NATO, I don't know.
3. Gutting Social Security was on Bill's agenda when he was pres. Will Hillary "unfortunately just have to" gut it? Likely. Will Trump? Maybe not; he's waffling.
4. Bill in charge of the economy has to be the worst. Plus, I have a gag reflex at the thought of him back in WH.
5. Trump's incompetence may block some of the repub agenda; Hillary's competence means the repub agenda will have very smooth sailing, at least the economic issues, such as further derugulation, more corporate welfare, etc. I am not in favor of what she will get done, so I'd rather have someone who can't get as much done.
Then there's the question of SCOTUS. I don't know. I doubt Hill will nom anyone against CI, or anyone truly progressive. Trump might pick a similarly centrist person. I realize this is an issue, but I don't know. And a lot may depend on the effectiveness of A Brand New Congress in 2018.
So, my conclusion is that getting Green on the ballot in more states should be a priority after Tues.
(Maybe I'm not a true progressive. I was a moderate in college before both parties took the country so far to the right. Also, I can't say that some of my thought of voting for Trump isn't motivated by anger toward Hill.)
At least you have shown us your thought process
I respect someone who can verbalize their own calculations. I suspect that many of us are doing the same; hold for primary votes outstanding, hold for Convention(s), hold even through the short battle through to the General Election. Calculate.
Also a sign of some degree of self-reflection. Maybe your political views have changed over time. That is allowable. I tend to get on better with people who do seem self-aware. Except for the assholes.
Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.
What I found about the Russian perspective on this election
I am writing this from St. Petersburg. This is my third trip to Russia, the first two were to Moscow. I have two purposes, to learn Russian and to interview real Russians and find out their perspective on politics and economics.
As usual we live in a sea of Western propaganda probably because every MSM outlet wants to curry access with whatever administration. But I don't have nearly enough space and time right now to talk about this particular aspect and swimming uphill against doctrinaire attitudes is not fun.
So I'm only going to discuss the Russian response to our elections. Upon arriving at the airport here I immediately attracted three inquisitive Russians with lots of questions and they volunteered their opinions. I talked to some very well educated Russians from all sides of the political spectrum here. And yes they very well know that local Russian TV news is very slanted, but they read the news from around the globe on the internet. These are very smart, very well read people.
So what do they think? Hillary nyet, nyet nyet. Our relationship with Russia will take a huge turn for the worse and Cold War II will be a reality. She will lock heads with Putin at every turn, and he does not back off when it comes to protecting Russia, (Родина мать). They see her as a politician addicted to lying. They see her as a politician missing an important part of her personality.
So what do they think about Trump? They think that he is nuts. That his stated positions on issues is just off the wall.
Who are they rooting for? Trump. This is the theory. Trump is a business man with more of an open mind than Hillary. They want a very normal trading relationship with the US and cooperation fighting terrorism, but a US that recognizes Russia's key interests. They see Putin and Trump working this out, but can't see how Hillary will ever be anything but a serious enemy of Russia.
Look, I'm a lifelong Lefty. I f I found anyone here with views to the left of me, I would be shocked. But I'm starting to think that voting for Trump and keeping all of my fingers and toes crossed might be the right thing for this and this time only. We absolutely must crash the right-wing part of Democratic Party establishment and destroy the Clinton power structure.
Capitalism has always been the rule of the people by the oligarchs. You only have two choices, eliminate them or restrict their power.
Hillary will push it to a suicidal attack on Russia
and Russia will smash us. They are less noisy, but better prepared for war. Our side spends a lot on systems that don't work, and talks very tough, but Russia has been invaded before (Napoleon, Hitler), and takes it seriously. Our "homeland" (hate that term) won't be safe any more.
Trump might even pull out of NATO, and he knows our military expansionism is just stupid. Check out The Vineyard of the Saker ( thesaker.is ) or cluborlov.blogspot.com for the military analysis.
I'll vote for what will dismantle the Democratic Party fastest
voting for Hillary to stop Trump is like our old kitchen sink and countertop. We converted an old sideboard, dropped a sink into it, it looked great. After a few years the weight of the sink caused the wood to sag. Every time we washed dishes the floor would get wet. We propped it up by putting a wooden beam underneath the saggy part. That worked for a year, then the beam itself started compressing and we were back where we were.
So when we came into a little money we had people come in and.....rip it out! Unhook the pipes, remove the whole thing, put in a new one.
Voting for Hillary to stop Trump is just like propping up the sink. In the long run it's just putting off what needs to be done. We've got to rip the thing out and put something new in its place. Will voting for Trump hasten it? Or make it even worse? That is the question, isn't it?
What a great analogy.
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
Yes, but not the only one.
I have another, and it's a selfish, personal question, so I'll only ask it of myself....What vote can I live with?
Hillary? No. Trump? No. I'll go elsewhere, watch it all burn down if it comes to that, but I won't help light the fire. And I'll get some sleep, not necessarily at night, but it will be sound sleep.
"If I sit silently, I have sinned." - Mossadegh
I don't know how I'm going to be reckoned with.
I'll find it interesting when someone comes up to reckon with me
No Way
No way would I ever, EVER vote for Trump. I lose some respect for Yves Smith for suggesting that, and for anyone else suggesting that we vote for Trump. Ugh. He's horrible and would lead to horrible things for our country. His reign would take us backwards -- way backwards.
I don't want to be a Bernie supporter who is associated with those who would support Trump. If this site turns into that, bye-bye. He is totally revulsing.
If anything, write in Bernie, or Jill Stein. Or don't vote at all for the top spot.
I am in a swing state. I will be monitoring the polls and if Hillary is the nominee and has a good lead on Trump, I will write in Bernie. If it's close, I will hold my nose and likely vote for Hillary. I don't believe we have the luxury of making up all the losses that would occur under a Trump and GOP run government. There would be much less ground to make up after a Clinton presidency than a Trump presidency.
Can’t endorse Democrats’ NSA-CIA, anti-Snowden & Manning actions
Voting for Hillary is an endorsement of all the current administration’s policies, plus excesses that are all her own (“he died,” cackle, cackle).
No Way
No way would I ever, EVER vote for Trump. I lose some respect for Yves Smith for suggesting that, and for anyone else suggesting that we vote for Trump. Ugh. He's horrible and would lead to horrible things for our country. His reign would take us backwards -- way backwards.
I don't want to be a Bernie supporter who is associated with those who would support Trump. If this site turns into that, bye-bye. He is totally revulsing.
If anything, write in Bernie, or Jill Stein. Or don't vote at all for the top spot.
I am in a swing state. I will be monitoring the polls and if Hillary is the nominee and has a good lead on Trump, I will write in Bernie. If it's close, I will hold my nose and likely vote for Hillary. I don't believe we have the luxury of making up all the losses that would occur under a Trump and GOP run government. There would be much less ground to make up after a Clinton presidency than a Trump presidency.
If neither candidate gets 270
If neither candidate gets 270 electoral college votes, Congress --i,e, Paul Ryan and the GOP, picks the next president.
Carefully consider what your vote or absence of vote for POTUS will lead to.
I care about the planet and it's inhabitants. The GOP would rape and pillage the world MUCH faster than a Clinton presidency. Clinton could be primaried starting on inaugaration day -- if that comes.
Brokering
Electoral College members are not bound. That would mean a candidate could be brokered at the Electoral College before being thrown into the House. I figure Green can win a plurality in at least 5 states Minnesota, WA, Hawaii, Vermont and Oregon, and maybe even in some red states (in a 4 way race).
That being said, it comes down to constant, non-violent everyday/somewhere, massive street demonstrations and protests. In Bolivia we (the masses) even had a successful strategy to keep the neo-liberal/land owner class and letting the socialists from getting into the parliament building to vote. We practically forced corruption investigations causing a bunch of the worst grafters to escape to Miami. Mobile road blocks work, or if there are enough of them, permanent ones... always on overwhelmingly popular and just issues. Climate change is the most urgent, the Earth is melting down as we speak. Racial justice is equally important and extends to foreign policy and militarized police, education and a lot of other issues.
Its making me upset that two parties can somehow both consider choosing the worst of all candidates. Strategy will have to develop as time goes forward. But, it will take a massive street effort to get anything done. And I know it can be done in a short space of time.
From the Light House.
Here's my comment from Politico, FWIW
On the political spectrum I consider myself a Progressive. Am I one of the "smartest?" I don't know. Yves' blog "Naked Capitalism" is on my daily reading list. There is an important point being overlooked in all of this. It's not just Donald Trump that's part of this election, it's the rest of the Republican party. Here's my take on what a Trump presidency may be like. Like most of his business ventures, the Trump presidency will be merely a brand applied to the broader Republican agenda. Reporting is that Trump is looking for a VP to do the parts of the job that he doesn't want to do. Like public policy. He'll rely on the likes of Newt Gingrich (who the author cited earlier) to advise him. Grover Norquist famously said "We are not auditioning for fearless leader. We don't need a president to tell us in what direction to go. We know what direction to go. We want the Ryan budget. ... We just need a president to sign this stuff. We don't need someone to think it up or design it." Trump will be such a president. A puppet like GW Bush was.
A Trump election will also mean that the House would definitely remain in GOP hands, and possibly the Senate. If that is true, it's "game over." McConnell will not hesitate to abolish the filibuster. And we'll get every horrible policy that they push now. The ACA (Obamacare) while imperfect, does manage to get more Americans into healthcare. Absent the ACA the worst abuses of the health insurers will return. Policy rescission, denial of coverage, double digit rate increases year after year. Will the Republicans offer an alternative? Not likely. Will Attorney General Chris Christie pursue action against “bathroom laws?” Will he take up voting rights cases? Will Secretary of State Jeff Sessions or John Bolton work for peace? What will happen with the Paris climate accord? Although inadequate IMO, it has at least united the world to start taking action. What will happen with the Iran nuclear agreement? The US may withdraw, but the others will not, isolating us with Israeli warmongers. Despite his public pronouncements, Trump will rubber stamp free trade deals. He will be persuaded by his GOP cohorts that these are actually good for average Americans. And then there is the Supreme Court. The court is effectively nine robed kings and queens whose word is law and they cannot be challenged. Trump has promised more Scalias. The next two vacancies could easily be the liberals Ginsberg and Breyer. Do we want Scalias, young Scalias, in those chairs?
So this is what our political system has given us. The Republican who is involved in fraud litigation on both coasts, and is perhaps involved in up to 3,500 civil cases. Then there is Clinton. Do I believe that she used a private e-mail server to avoid transparency and FOIA? Yes. Do I believe that there was/is a “pay to play” relationship between wealthy corporations, governments and the Clinton Foundation? The circumstantial evidence to me is pretty compelling. Do I think that her foreign policy in places like Honduras, Haiti, and Libya (among others) is misguided? Yes. Do I think that she is too cozy with the big banks? Yes. Do I think that she changes a policy position based on political expediency? Again, yes. But the answer to those issues is not to hand the reins of government to a dangerous, unbalanced, narcissist like Trump and the ghouls in the Republican party. I’d rather that Sanders, and his supporters mobilize with other progressives in Congress (Warren, Franken, Brown, Ellison just to name a few) and keep her on a more progressive path. Sanders supporters are already starting to move onto the next step with brandnewcongress.org in an effort to elect more progressives into the legislature. In the meantime we need to stay strong and vote against trade agreements that harm Americans. Withhold support for cabinet members that come from corporate boardrooms. Vote against changes/cuts to programs like Social Security and Medicare. Propose legislation to accomplish the goals that will benefit the majority of Americans. Constantly, consistently, and relentlessly push the President to do the right thing. Will we win all of these battles, no. But at least they will be the right battles and we will win some of them.
The trouble with that pitch is, it hasn’t changed since 2006–08.
Mobilize with other progressives in Congress and keep [the President] on a more progressive path?
Elect more progressives into the legislature?
Stay strong and (get those we voted for to):
- vote against trade agreements that harm Americans?
- withhold support for cabinet members that come from corporate boardrooms?
- vote against changes/cuts to programs like Social Security and Medicare?
- propose legislation to accomplish the goals that will benefit the majority of Americans?
Constantly, consistently, and relentlessly push the President to do the right thing?
Yeah, yeah, that’s what was supposed to happen with Speaker Pelosi and President Obama.
How did any of that work out for us? Would we even be here in this present pickle if any of that had actually worked?
which one of the 2 hitchhikers on the interstate
I pick up, which one will do the actual carjacking?
Both of them are shady and appear to be rough, prone to violence.
I refuse to endanger my life and have my car stolen.
I realize they will probably get a ride from someone else and will be riding a crime wave once they steal another car and have convenient transportation to pillage and plunder.
I won't consider myself as being responsible for their future criminal behavior, by refusing either of them a ride.
Another good analogy.
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
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