Why did the Dems lose? It's even worse than you might think

The Democrats' internal research has been quietly churning out autopsy reports regarding the 2016 election debacle, and the results are disastrous.
Unlike the GOS, they don't blame the loss on racist Bernie supporters, nor Putin! Putin! Putin!
Instead the reason cuts to the core of the Democratic Party's raison d'être.

One finding from the polling stands out: A shockingly large percentage of these Obama-Trump voters said Democrats’ economic policies will favor the wealthy — twice the percentage that said the same about Trump. I was also permitted to view video of some focus group activity, which showed Obama-Trump voters offering sharp criticism of Democrats on the economy...
“[Hillary] Clinton and Democrats’ economic message did not break through to drop-off or Obama-Trump voters, even though drop-off voters are decidedly anti-Trump,” Priorities USA concluded in a presentation of its polling data and focus group findings, which has been shown to party officials in recent days.
The poll found that Obama-Trump voters, many of whom are working-class whites and were pivotal to Trump’s victory, are economically losing ground and are skeptical of Democratic solutions to their problems.

In other words, exactly what those "racist" progressive Bernie supporters have been saying for over a year.
This is coming from the Dems' own internal polling!
Of course those voters are giving Trump waaayyy too much credit, and will soon be forced to recognize their mistake, but that doesn't mean the Dems have an economic message to bring them back.

Hold on a second. You are probably thinking, "Tell me something I don't know."
Here is where the rubber meets the road - the reaction of the Democratic Party.

Much of the debate over how to move forward has centered on whether the party should try to win back working-class white voters – who make up the bulk of Obama-Trump voters – or focus instead on mobilizing its base.
Turning out the base, the data suggests, is simply not good enough.
“This idea that Democrats can somehow ignore this constituency and just turn out more of our voters, the math doesn’t work,” Canter said. “We have to do both.”

OK. Once again the opposite of what you might read on the GOS.
So what do the Dems plan to do about it?

That debate is complicated, she added, because some Democrats think winning over voters is already a lost cause.
“There’s still a real concern that persuasion is harder and costs more than mobilization, so let’s just triple down on getting out the people who already agree with us,” she said. “And I think there’s a lot of worry that we don’t actually know how to persuade anymore, and so maybe we should just go talk to the people we agree with.”

Good Lawd! Seriously?
Let's keep doing what the math says won't work because anything else is hard. This is a one way ticket to irrelevancy.
When even 44% of Democrats say the party is out of touch, and they can't bring yourself to reform, you are looking at a political party on its way to oblivion.

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could go and get their very own voter ID laws instated and then they'd only need worry about their "base" of identity voters and moderate Repugnants. Hey, what's to worry about, they'll be relevant again, all they need do is go full Repugnant and they're in!

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Only a fool lets someone else tell him who his enemy is. Assata Shakur

@lizzyh7

all they need do is go full Repugnant

People already think they are the party of the rich.

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coloradoblue's picture

maybe

We don't stand for anything but vote for us anyway.

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Dear Dems: You lost the WH, Senate, House, dozens of governors, state level SOS and AG and about 1,000 state legislative seats. Maybe...you're doing something wrong.

the DP will gladly accept it. Even better, if it is from an individual human, because it goes straight to profits: No expectations on ROI.

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Fighting for democratic principles,... well, since forever

thanatokephaloides's picture

Wink

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@thanatokephaloides Funny. I thought it was gonna be "Rich Girl."

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Phoebe Loosinhouse's picture

with the concerns of most Americans, I think the issue is that many have come to the realization that any concern Dems do voice is inauthentic and not to be trusted; much of the blame for that can be laid directly at Barack Obama's door and the choice to run Hillary Clinton at all costs.

When President Obama was elected in 2008, it was a repudiation of both Bush and Clinton and Obama proceeded to become an amalgam of some of the worst aspects of both. Additionally, particularly in matters within the purview of the Executive Branch, most specifically the Justice Department, the Treasury, the SEC and Hud, Obama and the Democrats ignored the economic carnage that had been wrecked upon average Americans and let Wall Street and the mortgage and finance industries plunder with impunity. American lost their homes, their jobs, their savings, and their pensions while Obama and his minions just stood by and let it happen. Americans know what happened to them and who is to blame and also who is to blame for allowing the miscreants to roam freely and benefit from their frauds and predatory behavior.

I won't even delve into Obama being the first President to offer cuts in Social Security and the Democrats attempting to embrace the suck and ram it through. How about that great catfood commission anyway? Is that what anyone expected when they elected Democrats in a sweep?

When it came to healthcare, the Democrats served up a program that maintained health predators as the linchpin and gave Americans healthcare they couldn't afford if they needed to actually use it when the co-pays and deductibles were factored in. This was no surprise, people tried to tell them this from the very beginning. Medicare drugs are still not negotiated, there is no public option, and cheaper drugs from Canada are still forbidden to desperate Americans who continue to go bankrupt when they become ill. Thanks, Democrats!

I think the final straw was when Chuck Schumer openly said that they'd LOVE to have 2 moderate suburban Republican voters for every white collar working vote they lost.

Yes, Republicans are insane and awful, but the Democrats are no longer perceived as the answer and antidote.

BOTH parties have failed and blown up at the same time in our two party system. How someone does not capitalize on this moment to build from the foundation Bernie Sanders laid and start a new third Party that does truly care about the welfare of the 99% blows my mind.

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" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "

Raggedy Ann's picture

@Phoebe Loosinhouse

BOTH parties have failed and blown up at the same time in our two party system. How someone does not capitalize on this moment to build from the foundation Bernie Sanders laid and start a new third Party that does truly care about the welfare of the 99% blows my mind

.

It blows my mind, too, but it takes work - actual work to move in another direction. I wish I didn't have to work full-time, right now. I wish I had the time to devote to do this. Something's gotta give. I'm willing to jump in and help.

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"The “jumpers” reminded us that one day we will all face only one choice and that is how we will die, not how we will live." Chris Hedges on 9/11

@Raggedy Ann Almost makes me want to join the Dems again to re-Demexit!

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O.k. When is the next meeting for the revolution?
-FuturePassed on Sunday, November 25, 2018 10:22 p.m.

@Phoebe Loosinhouse

Both will lose. Biden is Obama's boy. Warren lost her most fervent supporters by not endorsing/running with Bernie. Neither can or will be trusted.

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"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon

gulfgal98's picture

@dkmich but I wonder if Merkley has been positioning himself for a run in 2020 or 2024? Will he run as a Dem or something else? He endorsed Bernie pretty early which showed me that he had his finger on the millennial pulse, and has laid low lately. The party continues to ignore the biggest demographic out in the near future, the millennials.

If the party persists on running Biden, Booker, or Gillibrand, they are going to be dead in the water. I do not think Warren will run. Her campaign skills suck.

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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@dkmich Warren maybe as a VP....but Booker is my bet.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Pluto's Republic's picture

@dkmich

Warren lost her most fervent supporters by not endorsing/running with Bernie.

Warren lost her most fervent supporters by whoring for Hillary.

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____________________
Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.
— Voltaire

@Phoebe Loosinhouse

How someone does not capitalize on this moment to build from the foundation Bernie Sanders laid and start a new third Party that does truly care about the welfare of the 99% blows my mind

people want to believe Sanders is that "someone", but he doesn't have what it takes.
leaves us waiting for a hero. not much of a strategy.

but the Sane Progressive is right. we can't start lying for sanders.
this is just what ails the "pragmatic" dems.

no more! and screw Sanders until he comes clean.

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Pluto's Republic's picture

@irishking

If they had any of those instincts left, they would have fixed their absurd slave-owner's constitution long ago (which is what made the present day helplessness possible).

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____________________
Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.
— Voltaire

@Phoebe Loosinhouse How the very important people and pundits were so surprised by Trump's victory given the state of affairs for most voters as you've described here, just proves once again the thickness of their bubble.

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Strife Delivery's picture

@Phoebe Loosinhouse

BOTH parties have failed and blown up at the same time in our two party system. How someone does not capitalize on this moment to build from the foundation Bernie Sanders laid and start a new third Party that does truly care about the welfare of the 99% blows my mind.

Well a few things with that. If we are talking a 3rd party, they sadly need a lightning rod, a large figurehead to take millions of voters with them. And the only large lightning rod that currently exists is well Sanders, which he has shown won't do that.

If we are talking other movements, there are many but due to the numbers I fear that they are going to be not only splintering but reinforcing the duopoly anyway. Things such as Justice Dems, Brand New Congress (have a little hope for them I guess), um... who else has cropped up here? I mean Dem Socialists have seen a large spike in numbers but I think they still ultimately run candidates under the Dem party. So overall, a lot of smaller movements going in various directions instead of one, large powerhouse movement and agenda.

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@Strife Delivery has some people throwing an exploratory dinner for him to see if there is a future there. He is the other non-party, independent politician who could follow Bernie's campaign model.

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bygorry

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@Phoebe Loosinhouse Because fighting this system is scary. It's big, entrenched, and has no scruples.

Also, people want prepackaged microwave politics, not a home-cooked meal. They're exhausted, demoralized, way too busy, and they haven't cooked in years.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Wink's picture

@Phoebe Loosinhouse
I thought for sure that once Bernie shed Hillary like so much flotsam he would be back out there leading the parade. The time is Now! There won't be a better one. Anyone with Bernie cred could get this done. The problem is nobody from Capitol Hill supported him in the Primary, all scared to death to oppose Hillary.

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the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-2.1) All about building progressive media.

Cassiodorus's picture

http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2012/09/10-arguments-the-republicans-aren...

It's an argument about why the Republicans tried to lose the Presidency in 2012. It's worth reading in sum, but this is the money quote:

The Republicans don’t want to discuss tax cheating, offshoring, corruption, inequality, dissent, the rule of law, endless war, or Wall Street criminality. They’d rather lose. It’s not that they want to lose in 2012, it’s just that they aren’t going to go after every vote. It’s the same reason no one talks about how Romney is a flip-flopper anymore, or points out that Romney is the architect of Obamacare, or was a moderate Republican governor in Massachusetts. Those arguments are worse for the political class, and better for the public. And that is how elections operate in authoritarian America. The secondary goal is to win the election, the primary goal is to keep the public out of the deal-making.

Now it's the Democrats' turn to try to lose. They'd rather hand government over to the Republicans than let the Berniecrats have any of it.

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"The future is inside us/ It's not somewhere else." -- Radiohead

Raggedy Ann's picture

@Cassiodorus

They've got a pretty good jump on it now.

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"The “jumpers” reminded us that one day we will all face only one choice and that is how we will die, not how we will live." Chris Hedges on 9/11

Hillbilly Dem's picture

Now it's the Democrats' turn to try to lose. They'd rather hand government over to the Republicans than let the Berniecrats have any of it.

@Cassiodorus

Without a doubt. Call it whatever...progressivism. leftism, democratic socialism...the Dems want no part of it. First off, how would they ever comply with the demands of their Wall Street overlords if the power was actually given to the people?

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"Just call me Hillbilly Dem(exit)."
-H/T to Wavey Davey

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@Cassiodorus Actually, I disagree. I think it was their turn to win. There is, IMO, genuine shock from the establishment that their candidate lost. The whole idea of Donald Trump running was supposed to be that Hillary would coast in on a wave of American Terror at the thought of Trump in the White House. I don't think Trump expected to win, and I certainly don't think Hillary expected to lose. It was the Dems' turn to win the White House (and continue massively losing Congress), because the establishment loves the Obama model: put some Democrat in the White House who has some demographic claim on victim status, whether that be race, gender, ethnic identity, sexual identity, or religion, while giving Republicans enormous majorities in Congress and keeping the Supreme Court marching ever rightward. That's a lovely winning formula for them, in which the President acts as a kind of moral meatshield for his own party, the political system, and the horrible policies perpetuated by it, while the Republicans anchor the narrative by playing the diabolical heel.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Wink's picture

@Cassiodorus
the DNC would rather have lost with Hillary than win with Bernie. Had Bernie won the DNC would have been out of power. And it's all about maintaining power.

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the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-2.1) All about building progressive media.

viable winners of elections just to the degree that billionaires will keep grafting them. Might take 2018 to lose their money.
Winning over voters by representing their interests is just hard work, to quote their role model.

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Orwell: Where's the omelette?

karl pearson's picture

Aren't the big donors to the Democratic party getting tired of the losses? I don't expect the Dem elites to change so they can truly appeal to white working class voters; however politicians have to win to stay relevant. As the effects of neoliberalism worsen, more people will become less well off. I don't see how the Democratic party stays truly alive without returning to their FDR roots. Concentrating on turning out higher numbers in their base isn't going to solve the problem. Dems need to provide a reason to vote for them.

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@karl pearson and that's what makes me think these Democrats are fine with him and his agenda - let him rip it all to pieces, let him put even more people into poverty, let him go to town on deportations and war, and then they get to come back in and try to "save us" from the damage, but they'll do nothing that hurts their big donors, and their big donors know that.

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Only a fool lets someone else tell him who his enemy is. Assata Shakur

snoopydawg's picture

@lizzyh7
They let Bush do what Trump is doing and they ran on rolling back the Bush abuses if we put them in power.
I don't have to remind anyone of what Pelosi said after she got the gavel.
If they think they can run on that platform again they will be in for a big surprise.
They burned us, Obama burned us, Bernie burned us and people are not going to fall for their shit again.

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It is not until the tide goes out that you discover who has been swimming naked.

gulfgal98's picture

@karl pearson don't really care about winning elections, just winning votes in Congress and the states. They are playing both sides. The Democrats are their insurance policy in close votes to ensure the votes go the way of what the big donors want.

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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy

@karl pearson
If the Dems are reduced to having no political power then that will also cut into their legal bribes as well.

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detroitmechworks's picture

as long as they can.

Last time they tried "New Clinton" which tasted just like the old Clinton, but with more bombing. They also tried changing the color on that.

Nobody wanted to try "Clinton II", but they blitzed the media for years trying to get us to buy it.

Now of course, they're going to sell "Clinton II Jr." Which has a rather predictable outcome.

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I do not pretend I know what I do not know.

Cassiodorus's picture

@detroitmechworks

Now of course, they're going to sell "Clinton II Jr." Which has a rather predictable outcome.
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"The future is inside us/ It's not somewhere else." -- Radiohead

@detroitmechworks But..but....isn't it Tim Kanes turn?

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. . . but this presentation they sponsored is totally consistent with GJohn's diary, including the title:

When the losership of a party makes Third Way sound reasonable, you gotta know that party sucks big-time.

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@PhilK I started watching but need to leave. Will definitely take it up later. But some of those early figures still continue to devastate. Hillary's popular vote win was due to three states--NY, MA, and CA. And ended up losing total popular vote of remaining 47 sates.Apparently, the DNC and the Hillary campaign never heard of the Electoral College.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@MrWebster Much like your car doesn't bother you if it performs as expected, the Electoral College doesn't bother them as long as it produces the results they like.

Last year a wheel came off while the engine sputtered and died. Whoops. How did that happen? There must be something wrong with the car.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

@Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal The democratic establishment is okay with election fraud and its many variations so long as it continues to serve their purposes to good effect. As it did with destroying Bernie's run.

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@PhilK During the Q&A woman noted in the poorer white areas are probably using social security, ACA, etc. Basically, in polite tone, white people are voting against their own interests. The problem is she thinks the democratic party is the party of New Deal running from FDR to LBJ. Since really maybe McGovern, the New Deal wing of the party is fighting a rear guard action protecting the New Deal until it lost to the DLC and the Clintons. Those social services the woman says people are using were literally destroyed by the Clintons and other democrats. Clinton nearly privatized social security with the Newt. I think people are realize the gop ain't going to help them, but the democrats will also fuck them over. Voting against your interests becomes a wash.

While the guy had some very interesting stat which was well worth watching for, eventually the third wave are corporatists. When the speaker mentioned he is great friends with Jennifer Palmerie, Clinton's director of communications, the guise was cracked. She was the one who on Meet the Press proclaimed that the Women's March and other protests are NOT about the %$15/hr min. wage. WTF??? And later I believe she said it should re Russia 24/7.

But gotta say, I thought the democratic party is in trouble. Now, I think it is in deep deep shit.

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Wink's picture

@MrWebster
I'm not even sure if the DNC knows how fucked it is. Many #DemExiters will Not be coming back. The DNC is left with the Hillary wing of the party.

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the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-2.1) All about building progressive media.

@Wink That will finish the party off.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@PhilK Surprising how hard it is for me to voluntarily listen to a member of the 3rd way.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

@Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal
to be able to listen people you don't like if they are telling the truth.
Otherwise you end up like people at TOP.

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@gjohnsit I think it depends on why you don't like them.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@gjohnsit To put it more bluntly, it's inaccurate to say I "don't like" the Third Way. I don't dislike them, like I dislike shredded sweetened coconut and lima beans and Attack of the Clones and late-80s techno. I don't dislike them, like I dislike the guy who has been spreading lies about my former roommate.

I distrust their organization to the point that it seems completely implausible that they would ever state the truth, and when reports come to me that one of them is stating it, my first response is something like "All right, what are you REALLY after?"

But I'll watch it.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

I was expecting "Rich Girl", but I guess that was too obvious.

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On to Biden since 1973

thanatokephaloides's picture

@doh1304

You got me thanatokephaloides! I was expecting "Rich Girl", but I guess that was too obvious.

punctuation adjusted

That one does describe Hillary Clinton and Nancy Pelosi rather well, doesn't it?

Smile

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

orlbucfan's picture

You've entitled to your opinion. Exactly what is it based on, @irishking?

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Inner and Outer Space: the Final Frontiers.

thanatokephaloides's picture

@orlbucfan @orlbucfan Addressing your question, orlbucfan:

Get off the anti-Sanders rap! You've entitled to your opinion. Exactly what is it based on, @irishking?

Of course, I'm not irishking. But let me take this stab at it: I suspect that irishking isn't happy that Bernie isn't doing more to (in Phoebe Loosinhouse's words):

"start a new third Party that does truly care about the welfare of the 99%".

Unlike irishking, I don't really suspect subterfuge here on Sanders' part. I think that the Dem structures and their masters -- the ilk of Schumer and Pelosi -- are now seriously corrupt; and they are in a position to seriously fuck over the People of Vermont if Bernie doesn't play ball.

It's a paradox, really. Bernie can't openly back positions we know from the 2015-6 election season and before that he holds personally and wants to advance unless he has a fully functional nationwide Social Democratic or Socialist Party behind him; yet any attempt by him to make that very thing happen will cost him his entire political value that he possesses now.

It's just more than any single human being can cope with. And until we get rid of the dollarcrats like Schumer (D-Wall Street) and Pelosi (D-Silicon Valley), the bitter situation will live on.

Sad

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

@thanatokephaloides
VT's senior senator is Patrick Leahy, the most senior Democrat in the senate, establishment all the way. VT's single member of the house is Peter Welsh, a member of the Pelosi leadership team.VT even has a Republican governor for an extra margin of safety.

The only thing more important to Bernie than the policies he believes in is the sound of his own voice. If Bernie bails, the media will suddenly find him a lot less newsworthy.

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Wink's picture

reposted to my Storify (with author credit and link back here). Thanks!

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the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-2.1) All about building progressive media.

Not Henry Kissinger's picture

“There’s still a real concern that persuasion is harder and costs more than mobilization, so let’s just triple down on getting out the people who already agree with us,” she said.

On a strictly expenses basis, it doesn't cost any more to run on policies that persuade working class voters to vote Dem than it does not to run on those policies.

Where it 'costs' the Dems is in their fundraising from big money donors and lobbyists for whom those policies are anathema to their profiteering interests.

So there you have it: The Dems know they can't win with big money donors, suburban 10%ers, and identity politicians alone, but they can't/won't change their messaging for fear of losing their only remaining source of donations (no $27 soup for you Third Wayers!)

No wonder Kos says not to run on policy. Voters hate the ones that lose them elections and donors hate the ones that win.

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The current working assumption appears to be that our Shroedinger's Cat system is still alive. But what if we all suspect it's not, and the real problem is we just can't bring ourselves to open the box?

1. If you believe that Hillary actually got 65 million votes you also believe in pixies, brownies and fairies.
2. His county map is even worse than he shows it to be. Hillary really only won 4 cities - NYC, Boston, Los Angeles, and Chicago. without those cities she would have lost 3 or 4 states.
3. "Demography = destiny is actually true, but is being misinterpreted. The Harvard poll shows that the groups best supporting Bernie were African Americans and women - the presumed demographic wave is going to be Berniecrats, exactly those groups that the third way are abandoning.
3. The types of whites who turned against the Democrats are the lower end of the working class - the part of the middle class that minorities (well people without college degrees) step into. In other words, if the Republicans give up on the racism stuff minorities will start shifting also.
4. Finally I agree with him wholeheartedly! Social progress without scorn. (though I disagree with his indictment of M*A*S*H, it was a lot more complex and forgivable than he (and modern feminists) present it)
5. His 1/3, 2/3 rather than 1%, 99% - he's just wrong, though possibly his 1/3rd are just starting to realize it.

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On to Biden since 1973

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@doh1304 I am not entirely sure she won Boston.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

i've been yelling for years that it's stupid and pointless to try to persuade people who don't agree with you, when there are millions of people who do agree with you, but don't vote.

the problem for the Dems in "mobilizing their base" is simply that there are no longer enough people who agree with them, because they are running way, way too far to the right. they've actually lost track of the fact that working-class whites ARE THEIR FUCKING BASE, the dumbasses. they don't need to work on "persuading" these working-class whites to agree with them -- they need to start agreeing with working-class whites, whose problems are largely identical to the problems of working-class latinos and working-class african-americans.

if the republicans ever manage to stop being overtly racist, the democrats are going to lose millions of minority voters very quickly, because the only thing that keeps a lot non-whites voting for Democrats is the Republicans' racism. that's why HRC did so well amongst southern african americans -- they're just as socially and economically conservative as she is.

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The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.

@UntimelyRippd

they've actually lost track of the fact that working-class whites ARE THEIR FUCKING BASE

Over on TOP they will tell you that they don't want to have anything to do with the white working-class.

Dems started losing all the time when they decided to become the party of suburban professionals (i.e. Eisenhower Republicans).

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Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@UntimelyRippd Problem is, I don't think the Democrats are answering that question honestly. I think they're using the insider language of campaigns as a way to make it sound like they're actually engaging with the question when they're not.

The truth is: the policies they support suck, voters know it, and they won't support them. The truth is: you can't trust a thing they say, voters know it, and they won't support them.

The Democrats can't change their policies, at least not to the benefit of the public (they can change them to be yet more beneficial to the plutocrats). They are known to be liars, but they don't have a lie good enough to cover the shitty truth.

They are hoping to come up with a good trick, like they did in '08, but each time it gets harder to convince people that the next guy in line really means he wants to help you, no really. And they don't really have much of anybody on their bench that is as good as Obama at tricking people. They need someone better than Obama at deception now, and they don't even have anybody as good. Their bench sucks. They are relying on people's hearts being warmed by memories of Chelsea and Sasha and Malia as kids, or of Michelle, who for some reason has always been well liked, because they really have almost no-one on the bench who is popular at all. Somehow Warren has held onto her 48% approval rating, but she doesn't want to run for President, and if she did, all the people who hold her behavior last year against her will start bringing it up. How well her popularity held up would directly relate to how she answered those questions. And anyway, they don't want to run Warren. They--the big bosses, the donors--are still irritated because Warren asked them some questions about their deeds once instead of truckling to them nonstop like legislators are supposed to do. For some reason, that insufficiency of truckling is supposed to convince me Warren is Lady Liberty herself.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Phoebe Loosinhouse's picture

and that is the Medicaid expansion of healthcare through the ACA. Yes, that saved lives and it also recognized that income and assets are different and did not require people to spend themselves into poverty before offering to save them from dying in ditches by the side of the road for lack of simple basic decent healthcare. But even then, they found it necessary to screw those over 55 by allowing states to place liens on their properties (no, this has NOTHING to do with nursing home care) so that people between the ages of 55-65 can be asset-stripped by the states while those younger than 55 are not affected. Who writes laws like this?

Now, given that the Medicaid expansion saved thousands of lives, how is it that the Democrats are completely unable to frame this winning situation in Red States that did not accept the expansion and literally chose to kill off their inhabitants as the alternative? What kind of a Party can lose with an argument like that in their arsenal? (Although the did hinder themselves with the asset-stripping Trojan Horse for older voters, it does not affect younger voters, many of whom have multiple part-time jobs with no healthcare plus they are in student debt bondage.)

IMO, the answer is that our Congress and Senate are comprised largely of people in the upper percentiles of income in the first place and they can't conceive of anyone not having a spare 20K hanging around in order to pay off co-pays and deductibles. I believe this is literally true and they don't know that many Americans cannot cover one unexpected $500 expense, whether it is a car repair or an MRI and that they are one paycheck away from disaster. Congresscritters should be required to spend one week-end a month with a randomly selected constituent to see how the other half lives, eats, works and survives.

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" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "

@Phoebe Loosinhouse Congress and media big shots and talking heads have at least 2/3 of their meals prepared and served by chefs and wait staff.

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Orwell: Where's the omelette?

Haikukitty's picture

@Phoebe Loosinhouse See, I think the asset-stripping is intentional. It's just another way to transfer assets from an older person to the state rather than to their family. There's simply no rational reason that assets are not protected for a person over 55. That's when they are likely retiring and most in need of whatever assets they have. It's deliberate. It has to be.

Also - hi, folks!

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Unabashed Liberal's picture

@Haikukitty @Haikukitty @Haikukitty

for the expansion of the MERP, or the Medicaid Estate Recovery Program. It was included in the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1993--or, OBRA-93-- which was a federal law enacted by the 103rd United States Congress and signed into law by President Bill Clinton.

It has also been referred to, unofficially, as the Deficit Reduction Act of 1993. (Per Wikipedia.)

I'll post a summary of the MERP mandate at EB tonight. As you stated, it was very much intentional. Welcome back.

Mollie


"I think dogs are the most amazing creatures--they give unconditional love. For me, they are the role model for being alive."--Gilda Radner

"If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die, I want to go where they went."--Will Rogers

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Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

Bet I know where a lot of them came from!

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

thanatokephaloides's picture

@Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal

Wow, look at those independents. Bet I know where a lot of them came from!

"All your base are belong to us!" -- Indies to the Dems

Or, for a more up-to-date version:

Wink

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@thanatokephaloides Wow. Those videos are stunning.
Almost as good as this classic:

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

Bollox Ref's picture

just west of downtown Minneapolis, sums up the 'Democratic' party of today.

Extremely well heeled....

and the only place I saw any number of HRC signs.

Sounds like the clientele of one Orange Dead State.

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Gëzuar!!
from a reasonably stable genius.

Phoebe Loosinhouse's picture

@Bollox Ref

when the Democrats talk about appealing to "moderate" voters, they are not talking about policy, they are talking about social status. There's a whole bunch of moderately wealthy Democrats who just want to be on the right side of social justice, but don't particularly care very deeply about economic justice because they are doing okay in the grand scheme of things: they have money in the bank, 401K's and IRAs, property equity and employer provided healthcare. They don't "get" the struggle because they are not struggling. You can include the entire Democratic pundit and consultancy class in this group. They know where their bread is buttered.

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" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@Phoebe Loosinhouse I'm doing relatively OK, if you can do OK on a dying planet in deep danger of nuclear war.

Their economic prosperity is part of the picture, but it's not enough on its own to do the job of producing these horrendous political opinions and behaviors.

What it really comes down to is that they have enough money that they can successfully lie to themselves about a whole range of political phenomena, if they want to.
They apparently have the kind of brains that can pretend to themselves they're living in 1994. Or maybe 1974.

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver