Insurance Companies Announce: You Can't Have A Pony!

The establishment's response to Bernie Sanders' Medicare-For-All proposal has gotten hysterical. A good example is the opening sentence to this article.

Having destroyed the private health insurance market, Democrats have a new target in their sights: Medicare.

How exactly has private health insurance been destroyed again? I seem to recall them making billions in profits this year.
It doesn't have to make sense. It only needs to scare and confuse.

The anti-MFA propaganda reminds me of the 1988 California ballot. Consumer advocates put Proposition 103 on the ballot to do something about sky-high auto insurance rates. The insurance industry responded that they would all leave California if 103 passed. They also paid to have three competing ballot measures in order to muddy the waters, as well as billions for deceptive ads.
Everyone was shocked when the voters weren't fooled. Only 103 passed.

According to the Consumer Federation of America, a D.C.-based organization, auto insurance rates in California dropped from the third-costliest in the nation to the 18th after Proposition 103 was approved. Average premiums declined from being 30% higher than the national average to being exactly at the national average.

The insurance industry lost in 1988, but they are using the same tactics in 2017.
Insurance and Pharma lobbyists are certain that single-payer health care "cannot work". Just ask them.

Bernie Sanders has a health care plan he calls Medicare for all. He’s underselling it. His proposal really should be called Medicare for all and a pony.

They have an endless supply of reasons why Americans can't have something that they badly need, but in the end they can never answer a basic question:

How come every other major nation on Earth can accomplish universal health care for a fraction of the cost that we already pay? Why does Canada, Australia, South Korea, and Mexico have the ability to do the impossible, but we don't?

America doesn't sound very "exceptional".
Because the advocates of the status quo can't answer those questions, and because everyone is familiar with Medicare and likes it, most Americans aren't going to believe them.

Let's look at some of the reasons for "No You Can't Have It!"

Purity Test

What we’re left with is little more than the distinct impression that the “Medicare for all” bill effectively doubles as an ideological litmus tests for Democrats, as POLITICO has speculated. For a party trying to reclaim a modicum of exercisable control in Washington, this newest test of progressive purity is but another footstone in the Democratic Party’s path to electoral isolation, one more deviation from a true route to success in November.

This is laughable. The Dems have been decimated because they don't stand for anything.
Now progressives stand for just one single issue - MFA - and suddenly they are "too pure".
So the Dems should be less pure and stand for nothing again? Those seem to be the only options.

It's Hard

Politico’s Bill Scher put it well: “Single-payer hardly comes with an Election Day guarantee. More than 90 percent of voters support requiring background checks for gun buyers. More than 60 percent oppose a border wall. Fifty-six percent say America should discourage the use of coal. And yet, we have a president on the opposite side of all those issues.”

Yes, it will be hard.
So that means we shouldn't try? Once again, America doesn't seem very exceptional.

Rationing Care

In 2016, the Fraser Institute found a median 20-week wait in Canada between a generalist’s referral and the time the patient actually received a definitive test or treatment/procedure from a specialist.
...unlike Canada, we will never tolerate such long waiting lines, which is one of the reasons single-payer will never work here.

This is half-right: Americans don't like long waiting lines.
In America, we ration needed health care by ability to pay, instead of by need.
45,000 Americans die every year because of lack of health insurance.
The good news is that all those people who died didn't have to wait in a line.

Americans are happy with the way things are

Despite growing problems in access and cost, most Americans don’t want change to jeopardize what works. A 2016 Gallup Poll revealed that 65% of Americans are happy with the way the healthcare system works for them. The backbone of our system is employer-based health insurance.

Another half-truth.
The poll in question measures ALL AMERICANS, including those with Medicare. This is from the poll:
"Americans with Medicare, Medicaid and military or veterans' insurance continue to express the most satisfaction, at or near 75%, while uninsured Americans report the lowest (40%)."
The tens of millions of Americans with Medicare, Medicaid and military or veterans' insurance inflate the satisfaction numbers.

As for employer-based health insurance, that isn't sustainable either.
insurancechart_0.JPG
insurancechartthree_0.JPG

The current employer-based health insurance system is slowly collapsing, and it is crushing full-time employment in the process.
MFA advocates need to emphasize this.

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51 users have voted.

Comments

thanatokephaloides's picture

How come every other major nation on Earth can accomplish universal health care for a faction of the cost that we already pay? Why does Canada, Australia, South Korea, and Mexico have the ability to do the impossible, but we don't?

Canada, Mexico... and North Korea, Cuba, Vietnam, Nepal......

Some of the poorest freakin' countries on Earth have established health and medical care as a right of everyone. But we, alone, the richest and most powerful nation in history, can't.

Because it would interfere with some fat cats' un-earned profits. And deplete the money we need for more important things, like endless war. Bad

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35 users have voted.

"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

@thanatokephaloides

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dance you monster's picture

@thanatokephaloides @thanatokephaloides

Merrill Matthews, the author of the opinion piece at The Hill, is a resident scholar at the Dallas-based (well, of course) Institute for Policy Innovation, whose website describes its organization as . . .

The Institute for Policy Innovation (IPI) is a non-profit, non-partisan public policy "think tank" based in Irving, Texas and founded in 1987 to research, develop and promote innovative and non-partisan solutions to today's public policy problems.

IPI's focus is on approaches to governing that harness the strengths of individual liberty, limited government, and free markets. IPI emphasizes getting its studies into the hands of the press and policy makers so that the ideas they contain can be applied to the challenges facing us today.

IPI is engaged in an extensive publication program of policy studies, issue briefs, newsletters and books on public policy issues, all of which are available in electronic form at this site.

Though IPI is a non-partisan organization, we approach policy issues from a consistent philosophical viewpoint of individual liberty and responsibility, free markets, and limited government.

IPI is a public foundation, supported wholly by contributions from individuals, businesses, and other non-profit foundations. In order to maintain its independence, IPI neither solicits nor accepts contributions from any government agency.

Contributions from insurance companies, otoh, would be a-okay.

That The Hill permits such blatant shilling for corporations to grace its pages tells you a lot about that site, too.

So, if you get sick (and everyone does sometime), that's your problem!

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thanatokephaloides's picture

@dance you monster

The Institute for Policy Innovation (IPI) is a non-profit, non-partisan public policy "think tank" based in Irving, Texas and founded in 1987 to research, develop and promote innovative and non-partisan solutions to today's public policy problems.

IPI's focus is on approaches to governing that harness the strengths of individual liberty, limited government, and free markets.

Aaaaiieee! That "unregulated free market" bullshit again!! Diablo

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6 users have voted.

"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

detroitmechworks's picture

if the election doesn't go the way the major companies want it to...

Who are we kidding, they ALWAYS go the way the way the major companies want it to. And if you don't believe the elections are legitimate anymore, clearly you're delusional. It is a complete coincidence that so many people vote exactly the opposite the way they said they would.

I mean, if people thought that, nobody would vote... oh wait...

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22 users have voted.

You can't expect to wield Supreme Military power, just cause some corporate tosser lobbed a contract at you!

@detroitmechworks

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detroitmechworks's picture

@gjohnsit But after watching people buy into the Kayfabe over and over again...

I just can't believe that any major anti-corporate action on a national level will ever be capable of occurring with the system entrenchment over the time from then till now. One state, even a HUGE state, maybe. National, there's far too much money spread far too deep. (And Ironically, fewer people you have to bribe to ensure things come out the way you want...)

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13 users have voted.

You can't expect to wield Supreme Military power, just cause some corporate tosser lobbed a contract at you!

@detroitmechworks
In 2004 11 states voted to ban same-sex marriage (11 out of 11).
Who would have guessed that by 2012 the whole issue would be settled the opposite way?

In the 90's marijuana was a demon weed. Now that's going away too.

Eventually we'll have medicare for all.

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Wink's picture

@gjohnsit @gjohnsit
than later. Love him or hate him, Bernie has done more in the last two years than most politicians in ten: exposing the DNC for the $h!tpile they are, and putting "Medicare For All" on the tip of America's tongues (regardless that it isn't the 'Single Payer' we'd like).

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27 users have voted.

the little things you can do often are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. All about building progressive media. (-1.9) On Twitter @winkradio.

thanatokephaloides's picture

@gjohnsit

In the 90's marijuana was a demon weed. Now that's going away too.

Eventually we'll have medicare for all.

And it will cover medical marijuana..... Smile

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15 users have voted.

"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

thanatokephaloides's picture

@detroitmechworks

National, there's far too much money spread far too deep. (And Ironically, fewer people you have to bribe to ensure things come out the way you want...)

And even more ways to bribe them, at that..... DiabloBad

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8 users have voted.

"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

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36 users have voted.

that shouldn't be replaced by single-payer socialized systems.

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Sigh

thanatokephaloides's picture

@UntimelyRippd

i can think of few "ordinary" consumer insurance markets
that shouldn't be replaced by single-payer socialized systems.

I can't think of any.

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20 users have voted.

"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

@thanatokephaloides
i didn't have any in mind when i wrote that, and i was too lazy to try.

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Sigh

The Aspie Corner's picture

And they accuse us of being entitled? Please. These assholes hold the country hostage every time the issue of tax cuts and subsidies come up. Meanwhile, wages as a share of the market are lower than they've ever been while living expenses are borderline insane (Don't tell that to the Libertarians who hold the purse strings of both parties).

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24 users have voted.
Big Al's picture

how to serve the oligarchy, which includes the big insurance companies. The only way we'll get what is really needed is if we the people go take it, not if the politicians give it to us.

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Wink's picture

@Big Al
Which, short of pitchforks, suggests pressuring the mofos (with primaries) to get MFA passed.

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the little things you can do often are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. All about building progressive media. (-1.9) On Twitter @winkradio.

snoopydawg's picture

and I haven't had to wait very long for the procedures that my doctor has ordered. My co-pay for doctor appointments, tests and prescriptions is $3.00.
I have had two lumbar injections and I didn't have a co-pay for some reason.
This is the insurance plan that I think everyone should have. It seems to be much cheaper for us than Medicare is. But I don't know what people on Medicare have to pay out of pocket, but isn't there a donut hole when Medicare doesn't pay even part of prescriptions?

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16 users have voted.

a longtime oligarch eugenics plan is already well underway

earth is the insane asylum for the universe

Eagles92's picture

@snoopydawg I'm still not all that well-versed in this, but as of this year, my mother is covered by Medicare and yes, indeed, there is a prescription donut hole. I believe it kicks in once you reach a certain spend ceiling, after which point you are 100% responsible for your prescription costs until the next calendar year.

Of course, she depends on several name-brand drugs (generics not yet available) with astronomical costs as a feature. She reached her spend limit last month and is now on the hook for $800 per month -- PER MONTH -- through the end of the year.

How this makes any sense for our senior citizens is beyond my comprehension.

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edg's picture

@Eagles92

With the donut hole, prescriptions are covered up to $X, then the person pays until $Y, then Medicare D picks back up for anything over $Z.

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Eagles92's picture

@edg I knew there was some nuance I was missing.

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@Eagles92 like some spinal shots my mother used to get, those co-pays were a couple hundred bucks I want to say. But that was Medicare. Very, very fortunately for me, my mother was not broke and had saved enough. She died right before I had to really seriously hit her money, and while it's great she left money behind, I always got on her about her consistent whining about co-pays. She did abuse Medicare for a bit when she wanted some attention, very passive aggressive that way, don't just call your daughter and ask her to come over, no, go to the ER! We argued incessantly about that. My mother was a Tea Bag Repugnant who had no problem using what she felt she deserved while voting it away for others. She died with money so we didn't get to Medicaid for her last care, but I did remind her that for many, it does come to that. Poor thing in a way, obviously we had a contentious relationship. But I had logic and math on my side, not to mention moral right. All she had was all that Tea Party puke she'd swallowed her last years, she had NO argument...

Anyway, sorry to go off on a tangent but yeah, that donut hole can get very expensive. And while Medicare is great, it does not cover long term Skilled Nursing beyond 100 days. I didn't know that but I got a real eye opener on it even if I didn't have to use it for her.

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@lizzyh7 Few people would choose a nursing home for themselves or loved ones. The people who work in nursing homes are often underpaid, unskilled and short staffed. Because of dementia I had to place my father into a nursing home. It was the hardest thing that I ever had to do and it still rips me up inside. Now the GOP wants to slash Medicaid which pays for a lot of nursing home care. I wonder how much Trumpsters will like it when the elderly and disabled get kicked out into the street? I swear these right-wing fools think that they will be immune to any consequences from the GOP's ill conceived
immoral and corrupt law making.

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edg's picture

@snoopydawg

But it's costly. In the interim, a plan where everybody gets Medicare, employers offer Medicaid-equivalent Medigap instead of full insurance plans (saves them $$, too), and people of lesser means get Medicaid would be a good idea.

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and a simple response

One writer noted that “that bloated military spending does something else single-payer fans would do well to grapple with: It creates jobs.” Yes. And then it kills people. Chen and Weinberg write: “Yet the United States scores much more highly on different measures, including innovation, patient-centered care and preventive health.” When you were cobbling together those jury-rigged metrics, guess what your beloved health care system did? It killed people!
... Twenty-five percent of Americans can’t afford to go to the doctor. Eventually they don’t need a doctor at all.

My elected friends in Washington, the choice is a simple one: we either give everybody health care and or we decide to dump bodies in the ground. That sounds like an exaggeration: it’s not. If health care isn’t universal, then it’s rationed: some get more than others. The way we currently ration it is by money. It is literally a matter of life and death. Politicians and journalists who oppose single payer, tear away the veil of rhetoric when you talk of cost, and be direct: money buys life. Say what you mean: everyone won’t be treated all the same. The rich literally get more life than the poor. Layer as much makeup over that fact as you like—that is the truth. That’s what we are deciding when we decide to remain with the status quo. Single payer stops that rationing.

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@gjohnsit

One writer noted that “that bloated military spending does something else single-payer fans would do well to grapple with: It creates jobs.”

like ... does the writer imagine, fantastically, that diverting resources towards healthcare for the millions who currently don't receive it would not, um, create healthcare jobs? nevermind the second- and third-order economic effects of slashing healthcare costs for employers, which would also, whether ones applies right-wing and left-wing economic theory, increase demand for labor.

i guess we should just draft everybody who can't find a job, give them M-16s, and send them off south of the border to kill Mexicans. squishy liberal-minded anti-killing-of-mexican lefties would do well to keep in mind that this would CREATE JOBS!!!! wahoo!!!

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Sigh

@gjohnsit

But The Right People make tons of money harming and killing people both ways - and nothing off money being wasted this way on saving the health and lives of the non-super-wealthy poors.

Where are your priorities mislaid - find them at once???!!!

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2 users have voted.

Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.

A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.

@gjohnsit and probably thanks to gjohnsit, "defense" spending does not create nearly the number of jobs they like to tout. A lot of that manufacturing is automated already, so it's not like our economy overall gets much from it. Certain areas, yes, but not enough to cover those astronomical costs. My God, does not one remember that stupid $600 hammer that came out decades ago? I guess not but "we" all should know they pad their bills, big time.

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5 users have voted.

@lizzyh7 Do not forget the trillions of taxpayer money that the Pentagon loses time after time and they do not care. There is unlimited money for the military, but our country and its people are dying.

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Lenzabi's picture

Huh, they need to try Medicare with an Insurance carrier tagging along. No 100% coverage with Humana or other companies dictating things, as at 53yrs old, I am too young to get the good stuff. Co-pays abound, and 75bucks for ER visits, and 45bucks for specialists, and just 2 teeth pulled at a time allowed for a certain period, so dentures are delayed. But the costs of my meds is down, and my regular doc is just 10bucks a copay per visit. But there are long waits already, I see my doctor every 3months, and the same for others due to the lack of general practitioners nowadays, and they make the suggested specialist visits.

I would love a system in place where my meds are low cost, and visits were handled w/o co-pays and paperwork, just show my card and done, like the UK's NHS, but as long as greedy CEOs have their companies drawing money to pay their multi-million paychecks, like the huge bloated blood suckers that they are. They even will deny treatments or meds that cost more.

I say we do what the rest of the world does and get single payer!

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13 users have voted.

So long, and thanks for all the fish

SnappleBC's picture

In 2016, the Fraser Institute found a median 20-week wait in Canada between a generalist’s referral and the time the patient actually received a definitive test or treatment/procedure from a specialist.

I live in British Columbia (arguably Canada's worst health care province). I've worked in several volunteer organizations meaning I've worked around a bunch of older people who had reasons to need a doctor. My general sense is that shit gets handled pretty much immediately. I'd love to know where the 20 week median figure comes from. It doesn't match my admittedly personal anecdotal evidence.

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14 users have voted.

A lot of wanderers in the U.S. political desert recognize that all the duopoly has to offer is a choice of mirages. Come, let us trudge towards empty expanse of sand #1, littered with the bleached bones of Deaniacs and Hope and Changers.
-- lotlizard

thanatokephaloides's picture

@SnappleBC

I live in British Columbia (arguably Canada's worst health care province). I've worked in several volunteer organizations meaning I've worked around a bunch of older people who had reasons to need a doctor. My general sense is that shit gets handled pretty much immediately. I'd love to know where the 20 week median figure comes from.

It comes straight out of the Fraser Institute's collective arse.

The Fraser Institute is a right-wing think-tank, and a tentacle of the Kochtopus.

The likelihood of there being any factual basis behind this claim of the Fraser Institute is what my first Calculus instructor would call "small". Wink

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12 users have voted.

"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

@thanatokephaloides

...It comes straight out of the Fraser Institute's collective arse.

The Fraser Institute is a right-wing think-tank, and a tentacle of the Kochtopus.

The likelihood of there being any factual basis behind this claim of the Fraser Institute is what my first Calculus instructor would call "small".

So, they should have gone to the large intestine for this one?

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1 user has voted.

Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.

A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.

thanatokephaloides's picture

@Ellen North

So, they should have gone to the large intestine for this one?

Yes, the large intestine.

Of an un-castrated male bovine. Wink

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1 user has voted.

"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

@thanatokephaloides

So, of virtually any member? I see...

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1 user has voted.

Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.

A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.

@SnappleBC
not to emergencies

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3 users have voted.
edg's picture

@gjohnsit

My wife sees a lot of doctors to deal with health problems related to rheumatoid arthritis. The wait time for US specialists ranges from 3 weeks to 3 months or more. It can take 6 months to see a rheumatologist.

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8 users have voted.
SnappleBC's picture

@gjohnsit

Again, I haven't conducted any sort of study but my sense is that any sort of required medical attention happens much quicker than that. I have no real bead on the elective stuff so that may be where it's drawn from. Honestly though, even there I'd suspect some cherry picking of data.

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2 users have voted.

A lot of wanderers in the U.S. political desert recognize that all the duopoly has to offer is a choice of mirages. Come, let us trudge towards empty expanse of sand #1, littered with the bleached bones of Deaniacs and Hope and Changers.
-- lotlizard

@SnappleBC @SnappleBC And I always wonder where the impression comes from that we don't already have "long lines". Not 20 weeks maybe (which is a BS number anyway,) but for instance, I needed a specialist appointment recently for a chronic condition. Nothing too obscure really, plenty of doctors in the area. I made the appointment at the beginning of last month. The soonest they could get me in is the middle of next month. About 10 weeks out, by my math. The kicker being, the issue has more or less gone into remission now.

Edit to add, I've always thought the potential for lines was a really dumb threat. Let's see, I might be able to have care I wouldn't otherwise and not go bankrupt trying to afford it but I might have to wait for care, which you do anyway...hmm?

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edg's picture

@Dr. John Carpenter

My wife has RA. It can take up to 6 months to get an appointment with a rheumatologist in the US.

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5 users have voted.

@SnappleBC That is why my son, daughter and grandkids are all Canadian. I never waited for any visit to a doctor and a few months ago my youngest grandson was experiencing some things that made my daughter feel an MRI was needed asap. He got the MRI immediately and thankfully he was ok and he got treatment for the real cause of it all. My other grandson needs ongoing physical therapy treatments and as I pointed out to an American in an argument about universal health care(not insurance) my daughter and grandsons live in a nice house on Van. Island because their money goes to a mortgage not a blood sucking insurance corporation.A much better life.
On this side of the border my experience with the system is quite different and I have a lot of experience in that I've had an endoscopy 23 times over a period of eight years. The first one was when I told my primary care giver that I could hardly swallow anything (clue # 1 I couldn't swallow a raisin) and it was three weeks before I got the procedure. Then another a few weeks later but if I didn't have Medicaid I'd have to wait until I was at a choking point and the ER would deal with it because I can't afford one procedure and couldn't get medical help at the early signs of my throat closing up on me.
I am so happy that none of my children and grandchildren were not born in the USA and my daughter has heard that from me countless times and I told the same to her dumb ass cousins in New Orleans (they were Palin supporters).

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SnappleBC's picture

@aliasalias

For us, one of the best parts is that we are not constantly at risk of losing everything in the event of some unforeseen medical situation -- which may or may not have been anyone's fault. We are one of the lucky few Americans that have some retirement savings... not much... not enough really. But we're solidly in the black. I'd like to keep it that way.

In American, having Insurance is no protection from Medical bankruptcy. It just means the doctors might actually treat you.

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2 users have voted.

A lot of wanderers in the U.S. political desert recognize that all the duopoly has to offer is a choice of mirages. Come, let us trudge towards empty expanse of sand #1, littered with the bleached bones of Deaniacs and Hope and Changers.
-- lotlizard

Lookout's picture

...but health care is too expensive. We throw away money to kill people (often women and children), but no universal care!

Sad isn't it?

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19 users have voted.

“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”

ggersh's picture

@Lookout by a huge factor, more like criminal in my book.

And these are the same assholes that always end a
speech w/god bless merika. and mostly pro life
except for when they aren't.

and the same assholes that already have universal
healthcare, what makes them so bloody fucking special
absolutely nothing!!!

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9 users have voted.

“Those who don’t study history are doomed to repeat it. Yet those who DO study history are doomed to stand by helplessly while everyone else repeats it.” Unknown.

@Lookout came from Kamala Harris, Cory Booker and Elizabeth Warren. Of course my two Senators voted for it, I knew it before I read the list because that is how Patty Murray and Maria Cantwell vote every time (they also voted against that bill to lower prescription drugs) but hey they are Democrats!

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DKH_VeUUMAATBSg.jpg

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WoodsDweller's picture

Who are you going to believe? Your lying eyes or health insurance executives whose wealth comes from letting thousands of Americans die every year?

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12 users have voted.

The lesser evil is still evil. Vote your conscience, not your fear.

They always threaten to take their ball and go home. Yet, they never do. They stomped their feet and, despite getting pretty much everything they wanted during Obamacare, I don't remember a single insurance company folding or even losing money. So sick of this game.

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edg's picture

Why does Canada, Australia, South Korea, and Mexico have the ability to do the impossible, but we don't?

Canadian ponies are tougher and stronger and smarter. They have to be to deal with the cold winters.

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thanatokephaloides's picture

@edg

Canadian ponies are tougher and stronger and smarter. They have to be to deal with the cold winters.

OK, wise guy, then how does Cuba do it? Hurricane-resistant ponies? Wink

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4 users have voted.

"Some members of the government are now investigating opioid pain killers but they are investigating the wrong thing. Despair-masking drugs are not the problem. Despair is."
-- featheredsprite

detroitmechworks's picture

@thanatokephaloides It's just two escorts that he hired to pretend to be a pony!

Wait... I just made it sound better...

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4 users have voted.

You can't expect to wield Supreme Military power, just cause some corporate tosser lobbed a contract at you!

edg's picture

@thanatokephaloides

Cuban ponies smoke Cuban cigars. Toughens 'em up.

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4 users have voted.

@thanatokephaloides

In the US, you're forced to deal with horse thieves - of course they won't allow anyone a pony!

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3 users have voted.

Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.

A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.

SnappleBC's picture

@edg

CanadianPonies.jpg

(OK, I had an awful lot of fun making that image. It's too bad it's going to largely go unseen buried in this comment thread. Well, it makes me laugh anyway.)

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2 users have voted.

A lot of wanderers in the U.S. political desert recognize that all the duopoly has to offer is a choice of mirages. Come, let us trudge towards empty expanse of sand #1, littered with the bleached bones of Deaniacs and Hope and Changers.
-- lotlizard

edg's picture

@SnappleBC

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The Aspie Corner's picture

Only now, the Dems have joined the Repigs with regards to TrumpCare and MFA.

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7 users have voted.

Is Adam Johnson. Today in an oped at the LA times:

He makes several of the points that are made above, and also talks about the (my take) stupidity of democrats. It's almost as if they don't want to win...

There are 3 types of single-payer 'concern trolls' — and they all want to undermine universal healthcare

...Progressives lose nothing by setting bold targets right out of the gate. Why not make every Republican lawmaker go back to his or her constituents in 2018 and explain opposition to free healthcare? Force the issue, shift the debate, just as the far right has been doing for years.

President Eisenhower — an early practitioner of concern trolling — told the New York Times in 1957 that he supported integration “in principle” but said activists in the South risked going “too far, too fast.” Give it more time. We need more details. Who will pay for it? All meaningful changes to society have been met with these types of objections. But the game of politics isn’t won by waiting for the ideal. Its most successful actors establish a moral goal and fight for it until reality catches up to them.

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@peachcreek

... It's almost as if they don't want to win... ...

All this - including Hillary refusing to campaign and hanging out with rich donors instead, saying that Single Payer Healthcare will never happen in America, et endless cetera, alienating voters even more than already were by her record and evident pathology - makes (sickening) sense if a sufficient Republican majority (with no actual choice between corporate parties or any actual representatives of the public permitted citizens in rigged selections, toward the plausibility of this goal) is required for Constitutional rewrites, with citizen rights written out of it - and when viewed in the context of destroying the public's faith in the very concepts of democracy, democratic government and of having 'a land of laws, not men', to leave only the appalling and unsustainable principles of 'might makes right' and of human worth measured only in terms of wealth and power, as corporate Republicans have been instilling all along, through 'right-wing' media propaganda.

The US Constitution may be regarded as 'only a piece of paper' by corporate US politicians, but it does define the tenor of the legitimate 'law of the land' as its more enlightened Founders envisioned it, as being designed to assure the maximized potential for the welfare, freedom and happiness of the country and the people who inhabit it and of, by and for whom government at all levels exists to serve the interests of. Not merely a few of the most ruthless and greedy predators among them.

The corrupted US government at all levels is typically unconstitutional and consistently fails to fulfill its Constitutional obligation to maintain the guaranteed rights of all Americans throughout all States of the Union.

As it stands, there is no Constitutionally legitimate US government of, by and for the people, ensuring equal rights, treatment and opportunity for all, as would also befit the wealthiest nation in the world, under sane governance.

The privately owned corporate 'political parties' with exclusive membership and an unofficial platform designed for the selling off of their country's and people's interests to the sufficiently wealthy are not legitimate, being not of, by or for the people, instead draining and poisoning them, their land, air, food, water and future, for the further enrichment and empowerment of hostile self-interests already having gained the most, at The People's expense.

What The Psychopaths and Parasites That Be most fear are the people understanding this and dislodging them from their backs before The People are hag-ridden to death.

And that means that it can be done.

Just my theory, of source, but until I see something that fits better, I'll keep it handy, in case.

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Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.

A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.

SnappleBC's picture

@peachcreek

But the game of politics isn’t won by waiting for the ideal. Its most successful actors establish a moral goal and fight for it until reality catches up to them.

In my mind it is almost the dictionary definition of leadership. You plant your banner on some hill and encourage the troops to go take it. You don't plant your banner on hills you already own. You plant them on the ones you don't own. Nor is it helpful to try to figure out every detail before the goal is established. If a leader did that then no worthy goal would ever go anywhere.

I can't count the number of times in my career I started out with, "Well, I have no idea how we're going to do it, but here's what we need to get done...." Amazingly, those things frequently got done despite the mountain of obstacles evident on initial analysis.

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A lot of wanderers in the U.S. political desert recognize that all the duopoly has to offer is a choice of mirages. Come, let us trudge towards empty expanse of sand #1, littered with the bleached bones of Deaniacs and Hope and Changers.
-- lotlizard