I wrote a diary in the Daily kos regarding current US foreign policy in Ukraine and Syria. I believe this response to that diary is a perfect example of Democrats in this day and age.

I will take American officials arming neonazis in Ukraine (even if I were to accept your characterization, which I do not) over Russians making us NOT arm them every day of the week and twice on Sundays. And I think anyone who wouldn’t should just go ahead and move to Moscow already and let the Americans figure out America for ourselves.

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The Aspie Corner's picture

And full imperialist.

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Modern education is little more than toeing the line for the capitalist pigs.

@The Aspie Corner No kiddin'. It's scary what's happened over there ever since they parted with reality.

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16 users have voted.

@OPOL and honestly very odd seeing as what it used to be. It truly is a monumental shift.

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18 users have voted.

Solidarity forever

Wink's picture

chose Hillary over
@OPOL
Bernie (and the Staff naturally followed) - and the Site started offing 'BernieBros' - that the world had flipped upside down. But not allowing ANY criticism of Her Heinous was a bit over the top, I thought, even for ToP! But nope. I got the heave ho for mentioning something about Her granny panties. Wow, I thought, ToP has gone full corporate. Like overnight. And indeed it had.

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the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-1.9) All about building progressive media.

snoopydawg's picture

@Wink

But the thing that stood out for me was when people thought that Bernie's ideas were stupid when they used to want them too and that was why they voted for Obama instead of Hillary in 2007.

I laughed my tush off the first time I read how angry people were because Trump pulled out of the TPP. I guess that they forgot that Herheinous wasn't going to vote for it either, or they knew that she was lying to them and they would have supported her if she did sign it if she became president. There are other things that people there used to be for or against when the site was first created, but they aren't any more. That they didn't have a problem when Hillary stated that "universal health care will never happen in this country!" is still mind boggling.

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12 users have voted.

@The Aspie Corner full blown.

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9 users have voted.

Solidarity forever

lotlizard's picture

they can’t be serious.

Alas, after investing so many years and so much energy and heart among Democrats like those at TOP and other forums, I know all too well that they are indeed quite serious, in the sense of being 100% emotionally invested in such extreme, performative methods and manners of expression.

I fear that Newton’s third law applies here. “For each action there is an equal and opposite reaction.” For every person expressing themselves like your sample Democrat, there will soon enough be another person whose response is, “Well, then, how about if I take Alt-Right white nationalist, basement-dwelling weirdoes (if that characterization is even correct) over people like you?”

It’s like in Germany, when writers post opinion pieces, the gist of which is that Germans can’t die off and be replaced by immigrants fast enough to suit the Left, and then wonder why right-wing populists and nationalists do better and better in the polls.

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The Aspie Corner's picture

@lotlizard the capitalists continue to rake in massive profits. But that's one connection no one is allowed to make for fear that if people figure it out, the whole operation will come crashing down.

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15 users have voted.

Modern education is little more than toeing the line for the capitalist pigs.

Amanda Matthews's picture

@The Aspie Corner

updates on Bezos, Buffett, and Gates daily. But those are the ‘good’ capitalist lefty one percenters so they’re fine.

The premise is that greed is only evil when it’s the ‘other side’ whose fingers get caught under the lid. It’s an example of leftist hypocrisy at its finest.

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I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks

Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa

The Aspie Corner's picture

@Amanda Matthews As far as I'm concerned, any cappie pig who calls himself left-wing while supporting far-right policy behind the scenes is just paying lip service.

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2 users have voted.

Modern education is little more than toeing the line for the capitalist pigs.

dkmich's picture

Unless someone is a masochistic sheep, I have no clue why they would be at that other place. Its' stats are thru the floor even during election season.

The video below is only 5 minutes.

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"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon

*donate to c99 *like us on Facebook *follow us on Twitter

Wink's picture

@dkmich

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the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-1.9) All about building progressive media.

Amanda Matthews's picture

@dkmich

all snippy there for a minute. Those giys are right. Since theday I landed on this Earth (lotsa years ago) there has not been a time when we weren’t afraid of war with Russia. Now the so-called ‘Left’ is actively trying to stir one up.

The Democratic Party has no ethics, morals, or credibility. And they’re more than a tad bloodthirsty. Of course, them and theirs won’t be in the ‘trenches’.

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3 users have voted.

I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks

Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa

detroitmechworks's picture

To get more readers back to TOP.

I've seen more mentions recently by the big twitter stars and networks. Looks like they know that nobody believes them any more, so they're trying to steer the straying sheep into a nice safe pasture where the wolves can keep watch.

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18 users have voted.

I do not pretend I know what I do not know.

dance you monster's picture

President Merkin Muffley:
I will not go down in history as the greatest mass-murderer since Adolf Hitler.

General "Buck" Turgidson:
Perhaps it might be better, Mr. President, if you were more concerned with the American People than with your image in the history books.

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lotlizard's picture

is now a “moral imperative,” says Kos, speaking ex cathedra as vouchsafed unto us through the Guardian:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jul/11/trump-protest-harassment...

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detroitmechworks's picture

@lotlizard be accompanied by an SA member or two at all times, this is exactly the one I would use. I mean they're public figures, and Guns are EVERYWHERE.

The very first pie thrown as a gag will see full prosecution, probably deadly.

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7 users have voted.

I do not pretend I know what I do not know.

lotlizard's picture

@detroitmechworks

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Wink's picture

Exactly my intent.
@detroitmechworks
To have a cream pie standing by in the event a TrumpCo staffer should choose the same restaurant as I, at the same time. I would not hesitate to "deliver" said pie after first delivering a few choice words. One of the very few ways of expressing dissent in America these days.

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5 users have voted.

the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-1.9) All about building progressive media.

Wink's picture

few tools we have
@lotlizard
left to deal with these asshats.

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3 users have voted.

the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-1.9) All about building progressive media.

snoopydawg's picture

“Public shaming of Trump regime officials isn’t just useful, it’s a moral imperative in these difficult times,” says Markos Moulitsas, the founder of Daily Kos and the author of last year’s The Resistance Handbook: 45 Ways to Fight Trump, which offers practical advice for protesters and advocacy groups.

So far the democrats have voted for everyone of Trump's policies except for rescinding the ACA which was their total failure to give us a functioning health care plan when they could have passed universal health care.

For Moulitsas, though, that’s exactly the point. Excluding Trump officials from the public sphere is a powerful political tool. He says it’s up to Trump officials to decide whether destroying other people’s lives is worth the public shame. “None of them should ever be allowed to have a peaceful meal in public, unless they want to spend all their time in rural flyover country they pretend to love so much. They are destroying lives every single day, literally killing people in many cases, so they don’t get to be treated like royalty. They need to be confronted with the reality of their choices.”

I think that should go for Bill and Hillary who also destroyed lives every single day because they passed welfare reform that sent millions of families especially women and children deeper into poverty and is still affection millions of us to this day. I love the selective outrage, Markos.

BTW. Guess who paid the people who harassed Kirsten of the DHS? None other than Barry Obama's new OFA PAC.

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Wink's picture

on public shaming.
@snoopydawg
Especially in public restaurants.
There is no better way to protest this admin than to shame them in a public place, confront them while they attempt to swallow a bite of pork chop.

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the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-1.9) All about building progressive media.

gulfgal98's picture

@Wink Going down into the mud does not make us any better than those with whom we disagree. All this does is call attention to the Democrats' lack of solutions for the problems that face we the people in this country. The Democratic party and those like Markos who support this stupid and divisive idea are devoid of ideas of their own so they want us to resort to public shaming? That should win some votes. Not. It will not change anyone's mind.

All public shaming does is further divide us against one another. And that is something I am firmly against and have posted as much on numerous occasions here at C99.

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"I don't want to run the empire, I want to bring it down!" ~Dr. Cornel West

"There is no instance of a nation benefitting from prolonged warfare." Sun Tzu

@gulfgal98

And now that I know Markos is one of those who endorses this tactic, I agree even more.

I don't have a problem with addressing a public figure in a public place and making a statement. But I disagree with anyone being ejected from a business because of who they are. The ACLU points out that doing this is the same as a business refusing to serve gays (bake a cake) etc.

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"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin

Wink's picture

"normal" circumstances.
@Fishtroller 02
But these times are beyond normal, and desperate times...
I don't know how it gets any more desperate than this.
Screw decency.
These people deserve none.

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the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-1.9) All about building progressive media.

@Wink

have we lived under "normal circumstances"?

Who is the "decider" when it comes to public shaming? You Wink? Me? Markos? I'd like to shame Obama for further destroying the wall of separation of church and state and handing Trump a loaded gun on not only that, but the separation of families policies. I'd like to put a pie in the face of every democrat who pushed for charter schools.

Trump is business as usual in this country. If you don't believe that then I have a photo of him and the Clintons at his wedding to Melania to show you.

You are swallowing the hysteria and adding to it. Sorry to say that since I usually agree with you.

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"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin

snoopydawg's picture

@Wink

administration too? He did many of the same things that Trump is doing to immigrants. He deported more of them then any president including 56% of them who hadn't committed any crimes. How about shaming them for his drone policies, killing 3 Americans without due process, bombing wedding parties and then the people who came to their rescue? Or the many, many other things he and his admin members did that were absolutely heinous?

Should we have done that to the people in the Bush administration too or how far back should we have been shaming people who worked in a president's administration?

Maybe we should be shaming the democrats who have been voting with the republicans to pass Trump's legislation, cabinet picks and justices? Where would it stop?

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thanatokephaloides's picture

@snoopydawg

Maybe we should be shaming the democrats who have been voting with the republicans to pass Trump's legislation, cabinet picks and justices? Where would it stop?

Where it should -- with the non-voluntarily-complicit.

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"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg

edg's picture

@Wink

... you don't stand with most of C99 and most of progressive society. He is wrong, on this and many other things. Where was his (and your) outrage when Obama was droning American citizens, destroying Libya and creating Europe's current refugee crisis, and helping Saudi Arabia wreak havoc on Houthi civilians? How many pies did he throw then? How many Obama administration officials did he publicly shame?

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thanatokephaloides's picture

@edg

Wink merely struck on a Markos "stopped clock" moment. No matter how phucked up, everybody gets one of those once in a while.

Just because Markos mentions a good idea here or there does not mean he isn't phucked up, seriously, in general.

And, as gulfgal points out, it might not be that hot an idea.....

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"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg

Amanda Matthews's picture

@Wink

the publicly harassing, embarrssing, and running off the oposition then we’re really fucked. Or do you seriousy think those tactics won’t be repaid in kind?

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I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks

Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa

Wink's picture

and these Are desperate times.
@Amanda Matthews
(not the good ol' days).
Nearly every protest action has been taken away, the simple act of protesting in the streets an invitation to jail and a fine (for acting upon the 1st amendment I guess).
We're left with a pie in the face.
About which I would not hesitate to deliver.
Actions repaid in kind, you ask?
If only we're to have such good fortune.

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the little things you can do are more valuable than the giant things you can't! - @thanatokephaloides. On Twitter @wink1radio. (-1.9) All about building progressive media.

Even for Daily Kos or Democratic Underground, that is a jaw dropper.

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gulfgal98's picture

seem to be non-existent over there.

Again, Markos and his staff refuse to discuss policy from a positive perspective. Instead, they focus their readers on the outrage de jour and tribalism. The entire purpose of that site is a massive propaganda push designed to keep us divided. And the narrative they keep pushing are not only divisive, but extremely dangerous.

I rarely go there any more, mostly because I would like to keep as many of my remaining brain cells intact. But when I have visited that place, it is a very frightening place to see how Markos (post purge) has herded the remaining members into a small corral, all of them nodding in agreement with whatever gruel Markos and his front pagers are serving up.

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"I don't want to run the empire, I want to bring it down!" ~Dr. Cornel West

"There is no instance of a nation benefitting from prolonged warfare." Sun Tzu

Eagles92's picture

@gulfgal98 The temptation was strong in the beginning, and I caved to it on more than one occasion. Now, you couldn't pay me go back: directly, or via click-through.

The place is a joke. If I want to voluntarily destroy my own brain cells, I'll do it with tequila.

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thanatokephaloides's picture

@gulfgal98

Critical thinking skills seem to be non-existent over there.

Markos himself, on March 15, 2016, wrapped all the critical thought on his site in bubble wrap, put it in boxes, and shipped it express to this place care of JtC.

JtC found it a great gift, unpacked the boxes, and kept it here, as it is today!

Wink

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"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg

gulfgal98's picture

@thanatokephaloides Awesome! GoodDirol

Markos himself, on March 15, 2016, wrapped all the critical thought on his site in bubble wrap, put it in boxes, and shipped it express to this place care of JtC.

JtC found it a great gift, unpacked the boxes, and kept it here, as it is today!

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6 users have voted.

"I don't want to run the empire, I want to bring it down!" ~Dr. Cornel West

"There is no instance of a nation benefitting from prolonged warfare." Sun Tzu

thanatokephaloides's picture

@gulfgal98

I rarely go there any more, mostly because I would like to keep as many of my remaining brain cells intact. But when I have visited that place, it is a very frightening place to see how Markos (post purge) has herded the remaining members into a small corral, all of them nodding in agreement with whatever gruel Markos and his front pagers are serving up.

And a cruel gruel it is, too!

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"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg

snoopydawg's picture

@gulfgal98

The Daily Tabloid. Or The Daily Gossip because of some of the topics covered there.

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"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin

ZimInSeattle's picture

BAR Book Forum: Jeremy Kuzmarov’s and John Marciano’s “The Russians are Coming, Again”
“The American people have been constantly manipulated and made to fear the Russian threat when it is the United States that has been the aggressive power.”

In this series, we ask acclaimed authors to answer five questions about their book. This week’s featured authors are Jeremy Kuzmarov and John Marciano . Kuzmarov is Jay P. Walker Assistant Professor of American History, University of Tulsa. Marciano is Professor Emeritus at SUNY Cortland. Their book is The Russians Are Coming, Again: The First Cold War as Tragedy, the Second as Farce.

Roberto Sirvent: How can your book help BAR readers understand the current political and social climate?

Jeremy Kuzmarov and John Marciano: Our book provides a historical perspective on contemporary affairs by showing how the Russo-phobia that has been prevalent in our political discourse over the last four to five years has deep and long historical roots, and has often been used by government leaders to turn public attention away from domestic inequalities by channeling societal resources towards the military sector. During the early Cold War, a period of labor militancy and momentum for the expansion of the New Deal was destroyed by McCarthyism and the Cold War.The Korean War brought on huge military budgets that have never left us and an expansion of the U.S. overseas military base network. These policies were underlain by exaggerated views about the Soviet Union which were stoked by political elites, who had worked for companies that reaped enormous profit from the permanent warfare state. The same forces are behind the renewed efforts to demonize Russian President Vladimir Putin and exaggerate the Russian threat, with serious adverse consequences for society that have already been evident. The consequences include a revitalization of the arms race, waging of proxy wars, and a further poisoning of the domestic political culture through the reinvigoration of a McCarthyist discourse and tactics.

“During the early Cold War, a period of labor militancy and momentum for the expansion of the New Deal was destroyed by McCarthyism and the Cold War.”

More: https://www.blackagendareport.com/bar-book-forum-jeremy-kuzmarovs-and-john-marcianos-russians-are-coming-again

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"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." - JFK | Bernie would have WON!

thanatokephaloides's picture

I will take American officials arming neonazis in Ukraine (even if I were to accept your characterization, which I do not) over Russians making us NOT arm them every day of the week and twice on Sundays. And I think anyone who wouldn’t should just go ahead and move to Moscow already and let the Americans figure out America for ourselves.

So you say that anyone who advocates a non-interventionistic foreign policy for America isn't "American" and needs to move to Moscow?

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"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg

lotlizard's picture

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=leningrad+billy+joel&t=ffsb&iax=videos&ia=videos

The album was called “Storm Front” too. Obviously an allusion to stormfront.org and thus a dogwhistle to white nationalists.

</snark>

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