Do We Really Want/Need a President?

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Eric Zuesse posted an article on Washington's Blog titled, "Let's Have a Public Debate Now, for and Against Replacing Trump by Pence". He posted a couple arguments for and against and explained that in a real democracy (heh) the public would be consulted and want to be consulted in the matter. The comments under the article were depressing to him in that they didn't address the question, leading him to add:

"Apparently, the public, in any case, don’t really care much whether the President is Trump, or else Pence. So, the dictatorship will probably encounter no significant opposition — not even in words, much less in any deeds.

Somehow, I find this situation exceedingly depressing. Not only is America a dictatorship, but it’s one where the public don’t care whether it is or not."

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2017/10/lets-public-debate-now-replacing-...

I hear you Eric, depressing indeed. It's like Pink Floyd once almost said, "If you don't get involved you can't have any democracy! How can you have any democracy if you don't get involved!"

But I'm going to go him one further. Why do we need a president and should we want a president? Maybe it's time to discuss that instead of simply replacing one sociopathic asshole with another?

Doesn't the mere fact that there's so much angst over this question indicate we have a problem Houston? Zuesse called this country a "dictatorship". Of course it's not really that, we do have a Congress and Senate that prevents that, sort of. But do we really need a political system where one person has so much power, where one person has the country and the world in a twitter, pun intended, about what he will do next? Where one person can sign executive orders, unilaterally and without any democratic underpinning, that literally affects the lives of millions? Where we have to worry about whether he/she will drop the bomb?

Presidents, Emperors, Dictators, Kings, Queens, Despots, Rulers. Why do we put up with it?

I agree with Zuesse, there won't be any democratic input from the people on this issue. Hell, we don't have any input on anything except being "allowed" to vote on the next dictator. It looks to me like Trump is fully prepared to fulfill his first term and go for a second and I doubt any of our politicians are going to change that. The system is rotten to the core and this is what we get, what we deserve. First it was a choice between Clinton and Trump and the people let that happen. Now it's whether it's Trump or Pence and the people will let that happen. Then we'll do it all again in 2020 (starting in 2019).

Do we really need/want a President? I know I don't. Man, would I love it if we (this country) had that conversation instead.

If we don't even want democracy, we sure as hell will never have it.

[video:https://youtu.be/wSoq3ZDTlVc]

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The Aspie Corner's picture

Americans are too sick, tired and stupid to fight back. And that's how the capitalists like it:

[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCegj5JNq4U]

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Modern education is little more than toeing the line for the capitalist pigs.

Guerrilla Liberalism won't liberate the US or the world from the iron fist of capital.

Big Al's picture

@The Aspie Corner But for those that aren't sick, tired and/or stupid, maybe we're not asking the right questions. Like Zuesse asking if we should replace Trump with Pence while also admitting we don't live in a democracy but more like a dictatorship. Then why not ask whether we should change this system? It's not like Trump has made it this way all by himself.

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mimi's picture

@Big Al

because people need income to feed themselves and if you "fight" to change the system, you lose your livelihood. Americans are scared to death (and scare people around the world because of it) to lose their lives, jobs, homes and sanity. For a reason. They do lose it.

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mimi's picture

@mimi

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Citizen Of Earth's picture

@The Aspie Corner
because he is too corrupt to run the DEA. As if Pres. Doomkoff didn't know before he nominated him.

So he goes back to congress where he can't do any damage. ... Oh wait. 8-(

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Donnie The #ShitHole Douchebag. Fake Friend to the Working Class. Real Asshole.

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

Doesn't the mere fact that there's so much angst over this question indicate we have a problem Houston?

Yes, of course.

Zuesse called this country a "dictatorship".

He's sort of right, in that we're living under tyranny. But he's wrong in that a dictatorship usually implies one strongman who has most of the power (backed by a group, of course, but it's often difficult for the group to get rid of him if they decide he's more of a liability than an asset; Hitler is the obvious example of this). We absolutely are not a dictatorship in the traditional sense of one strongman, publicly known, being the bastard who runs everything. In fact, that's the flaw in almost all the reasoning behind the "should we impeach Trump?" argument. The argument itself implies that it would make a whole lot of difference if we did.

Of course it's not really that, we do have a Congress and Senate that prevents that, sort of.

I don't think Congress and the Senate prevent tyranny of any form. What prevents us from having a dictatorship is not the presence of the legislature, which is essentially there so that the actual powers can pretend we live in a republic and create theater for us to watch and be distracted by, but the presence of a deal between the shadow government of the CIA, NSA, NIA, and fifth-branch military like the Joint Special Operations Command, and private-sector forces like private security firms, weaponsmakers, petrochemical barons, and bankers. Any strongman in the Executive is usually vetted and hired by these forces like a CEO, or, sometimes, more of a CFO (the President is not totally without influence/power, but how much s/he wants to use that power versus how much s/he wants to just funnel money to his/her real employers depends on the person). The reason there's so much fuss over Trump is that, for the first time since 1976, the shadow government and their private-sector allies have not had complete control over who became CEO. That's one reason they've been thrashing around stoking the fires of anxiety and hostility about Trump. It certainly isn't his racism, sexism, or reckless violence. We've had those qualities in Presidents repeatedly, and there was no movement whatsoever by politicians or journalists to impeach on that basis. This tolerance for bigotry, recklessness and incompetence has happened so recently, and so gratuitously, in the person of George W. Bush and the impeachment that was "off the table" that I can't believe anybody actually thinks that the political and media establishment are objecting to Trump on an ethical basis. They don't have the capacity to have an ethical basis for their decisions, for one thing; and they clearly aren't independent actors, but employees doing what they're told, for another.

But do we really need a political system where one person has so much power, where one person has the country and the world in a twitter, pun intended, about what he will do next?

No, of course we don't. But there's another point in your comment: the importance of Twitter in all this is pernicious in multiple ways. When we were mobilizing against Bush, we were upset by his drone strikes, his reckless, murderous wars, and his illegal ascent to power (also by his destruction, with the help of Congress, of the remains of the Bill of Rights). Now, much of the time, we're upset at Trump because of what he said on Twitter. That's not good. It trivializes the whole dispute and tends to sweep more important objections to Trump out of sight. It also, as Noam Chomsky recently said, tends to take the focus off the horrible shit all the rest of the Republicans are doing. And, finally, the constant focus on what Trump said in social media enables the rest of the establishment to repair their shattered reputations and gain moral credibility by saying "Oh, how shocking!" every time Trump shoots his mouth off. They don't do anything, but because they're shocked and horrified, they get to look like the good guys. George W. Bush is the most disgusting example of this; he actually had an interview with People magazine where he objected to Trump's racism and said "I don't like the racism....Nobody likes that." He liked it just fine when he was using it to become President twice.

Where one person can sign executive orders, unilaterally and without any democratic underpinning, that literally affects the lives of millions? Where we have to worry about whether he/she will drop the bomb?

Yeah, I object to all of that. I objected to it under George W. Bush--even though it was pretty obvious it was Cheney and others calling the shots. But a puppet President kind of makes it even worse. But of course the current practice of the President being able to kill anybody s/he wants to, whenever s/he wants to, is objectionable. Even Al Gore, who is not much of a leftist, said during the first Bush term: "If the President can assassinate and torture, what can't he do?"

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

@Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal

May I say "WOW!!!"? You've nailed a lot to the wall, right there, and it looks great!

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Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.

A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.

Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal's picture

@Ellen North Thanks, Ellen!

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"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha

"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver

@Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal

Thank YOU! Did my heart good, reading that.

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Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.

A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.

EdMass's picture

See History of the Earth.

Presidents, Emperors, Dictators, Kings, Queens, Despots, Rulers. Why do we put up with it?

There was that whole hunter/gather thing. Mingling with Neanderthals. Being scared about meteor showers and eclipses. Plato told us about Atlantis. Let's not forget Easter Island. Over 900 Moai statues. The Nasca Lines.

You're concerned about governance? Crikey. How were Pyramids built around the world when they only had stone hammers and rope.?

Huh. Huh?

Yahoo Yahoo Yahoo Yahoo

Governance? Right of Kings? Proletariat Rule or not? Revolution?

Let's get with whats important.

The beatings and slaughters will continue until our Overlords return. Or perhaps they never left and they're still here and just toying with us? Oh my!

Peace and blessings upon you.

Wink

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Prof: Nancy! I’m going to Greece!
Nancy: And swim the English Channel?
Prof: No. No. To ancient Greece where burning Sapho stood beside the wine dark sea. Wa de do da! Nancy, I’ve invented a time machine!

Firesign Theater

Stop the War!

thanatokephaloides's picture

Big Al's question is not a new one. The Jewish Bible records ancient Israel's wrestle with it thus:

And it came to pass, when Samuel was old, that he made his sons judges over Israel. Now the name of his firstborn was Joel; and the name of his second, Abiah: they were judges in Beersheba.

And his sons walked not in his ways, but turned aside after lucre, and took bribes, and perverted judgment.

Then all the elders of Israel gathered themselves together, and came to Samuel unto Ramah, And said unto him, Behold, thou art old, and thy sons walk not in thy ways: now make us a king to judge us like all the nations. But the thing displeased Samuel, when they said, Give us a king to judge us. And Samuel prayed unto the Lord. And the Lord said unto Samuel, Hearken unto the voice of the people in all that they say unto thee: for they have not rejected thee, but they have rejected me, that I should not reign over them. According to all the works which they have done since the day that I brought them up out of Egypt even unto this day, wherewith they have forsaken me, and served other gods, so do they also unto thee. Now therefore hearken unto their voice: howbeit yet protest solemnly unto them, and shew them the manner of the king that shall reign over them.

And Samuel told all the words of the Lord unto the people that asked of him a king. And he said, This will be the manner of the king that shall reign over you: He will take your sons, and appoint them for himself, for his chariots, and to be his horsemen; and some shall run before his chariots. And he will appoint him captains over thousands, and captains over fifties; and will set them to ear his ground, and to reap his harvest, and to make his instruments of war, and instruments of his chariots. And he will take your daughters to be confectionaries, and to be cooks, and to be bakers. And he will take your fields, and your vineyards, and your oliveyards, even the best of them, and give them to his servants. And he will take the tenth of your seed, and of your vineyards, and give to his officers, and to his servants. And he will take your menservants, and your maidservants, and your goodliest young men, and your asses, and put them to his work. He will take the tenth of your sheep: and ye shall be his servants. And ye shall cry out in that day because of your king which ye shall have chosen you; and the Lord will not hear you in that day.

Nevertheless the people refused to obey the voice of Samuel; and they said, Nay; but we will have a king over us; That we also may be like all the nations; and that our king may judge us, and go out before us, and fight our battles.

And Samuel heard all the words of the people, and he rehearsed them in the ears of the Lord.

And the Lord said to Samuel, Hearken unto their voice, and make them a king. And Samuel said unto the men of Israel, Go ye every man unto his city.

-- Jewish Scriptures, I Samuel 8 source

I daresay that our more modern experience shows old Samuel to have been right here.....

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

thanatokephaloides's picture

@thanatokephaloides

And he will take your daughters

.... yea, even by the pussy .....

to be confectionaries, and to be cooks, and to be bakers.

Wink

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

Big Al's picture

@thanatokephaloides Kind of like that apple thing, we had our chances, now it's too late.

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dervish's picture

due to legislative gridlock. What they realized is that it really didn't make much difference, and nobody really minded. If they could get rid of parliament and a few ministries as well, that might be real progress.

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"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."

thanatokephaloides's picture

@dervish

Lebanon had no President at all for about two and a half years due to legislative gridlock. What they realized is that it really didn't make much difference, and nobody really minded.

That's because Lebanon is on the Westminster Parliamentary clusterfuck system, where the President's office is largely ceremonial.

For your analogy to really fit, Lebanon would have needed to have done OK for about two and a half years with no Prime Minister.

And you're right: the kind of situation which results in "no President" is typical of Parliamentary systems. The government's Executive really does need to have some independence from the Legislature. That's why anyone bearing that particular power needs to be directly elected by the nation's People, not the Legislature.

Now if we could just figure out how to accomplish that..... Sad

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

OLinda's picture

Good post.

Someone else mentioning this is Chelsea Manning. I believe she said we don't need a president - rather than asking the question. Wish I could find the tweet.

First time I thought about it was on seeing her comment about it. That's the first step, hm? Getting people to even think about it. Right now, it's just a normal, expected thing - Of course we need a prez. It doesn't enter anyone's mind (most anyone) to not have one!

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Big Al's picture

@OLinda Ya, first step is asking the question. Glad to see others asking it also. It's got to be occurring to more and more people, "what are we doing here?"

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Big Al's picture

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Raggedy Ann's picture

a president to lord over us and help the oligarchs steal everything out from under us.

I don't want a president and have decided not to play their game anymore.

I'm not participating in the charade any longer.

I'm fully convinced.

I'm helping them steal from me by voting for them.

I'm out.

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"The “jumpers” reminded us that one day we will all face only one choice and that is how we will die, not how we will live." Chris Hedges on 9/11

Big Al's picture

As American satirist H.L. Mencken predicted almost a century ago:

“All the odds are on the man who is, intrinsically, the most devious and mediocre — the man who can most adeptly disperse the notion that his mind is a virtual vacuum. The Presidency tends, year by year, to go to such men. As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart’s desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

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gulfgal98's picture

And lately I have been questioning do we even have a government? What we currently have is a mega corporation wholly owned by big money and our President is its figurehead CEO. Every President in recent history has consolidated power in the office of President. This allows the deep state to control things through one individual. The President is not really in charge, but is only the person through which the deep state operates. If he does not comply, the deep state organizes to have him removed,either through impeachment or assassination.

I have not been commenting as much recently because I am so disillusioned by the reality of what our government is really doing in all of our names.

What we are seeing is that there is always money for war and killing of people all over the world. There is always enough money to spend on "homeland security" which is, in reality, an excuse for the government to abrogate our rights under the first, fourth, and fifth amendments. We the people are systematically being herded into increasingly smaller and smaller pens by our own government. Meanwhile, there is never enough money to provide real direct benefits to our own citizens, such as clean air and water, safe shelter, food, healthcare (not health insurance) and free quality education for all. Instead, our government at all levels is increasingly outsourcing public facilities and services, thus leading to an increasingly corporatized state.

The bottom line for me is I cannot see how we can change this suicidal track that our own government has put upon us. We are unwilling passengers on a runaway train. Doing away with the office of President may be a positive step, but it still does not solve the real issue of the deep state controlling our government. I am not sure how we can solve this problem without doing away with centralized banks and other tools of corporatism first.

Big Al, I am grateful that you raised this issue because it points out how we must seek a new paradigm of governance.

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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy

@gulfgal98 @gulfgal98

Yesssss!!!!! Exactly! There is no legitimate US government, concerned with the welfare of the people and country, just an infiltrating corporate entity run by pathologically greedy billionaires, concerned with draining the people and country of everything they have.

Once the general public understands this, perhaps then they'll act toward positive change in the removal of what we term TPTB from politics and policy - and not merely the corrupt and too-often psychopathic front puppets enacting their various wills.

Edited to add a missed space and for a letter-typo. Got a 'timed out', which is just as well as I missed a letter on the edit, (between being The Typo Queen and having a variably sticky keyboard, I'm also The Edit Queen! Yay, me!) so will try again and sorry if this doubles.

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Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.

A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.