Open Thread - Thurs 23 Feb 2023 - Sleep? Sleep!
Sleep? Sleep!
Some cool research has been done recently (within the last 10 or 20 years) on historic sleep patterns by A. Roger Ekirch (see his book At Day's Close: A History of Nighttime, also titled At Day's Close: Night in Times Past).
It turns out, humans throughout history have not slept in what is considered the 'normal' modern industrial world pattern. In fact, sleep patterns/habits were radically different before the industrial revolution. Many of today's sleep problems may be due to the changes which industrialization, and 10, 12, and now 8 hour jobs have made in the more 'natural' sleep patterns/habits of many people. Mind you, this doesn't mean that people who do well with 8 to 10 hours of straight sleep are 'wrong', but that sleep pattern may be somewhat unnatural and unlikely without the addition of gas/electric lights and so on. It's apparent that there is nothing the matter with those who sleep habits differ, and nothing the matter with those who can't manage an 8 to 10 hour sleep habit (like, ermmm, me). See also this short article on sleep and history.
In the Middle Ages and the Renaissance, in Europe and other locations (such as Africa, South and Southeast Asia, Australia, South America and the Middle East according to this longer BBC article), many people practiced 'biphasic', or double, sleeping. This meant they slept for a few hours after it got dark (this was called 'first sleep') then got up and did peaceful things for a few hours, and then laid down for 'second sleep'. This habit was actually earlier than the Middle Ages, the Romans seem to have practiced biphasic sleep, and the first reference to biphasic sleep is in the 8th C BC Greek work, The Odyssey, which is pretty darn early for an historical reference!
Image from the BBC article
During the time between sleeps, people did various things. Some people just sat by the fire and relaxed, perhaps smoking a pipe as Mrs. Rowth did in the opening to the BBC Future article discussing the research Ekirch did for his book (both linked to above). People at that time slept communally, many to a bed, if there was a bed. Poor people slept on the floor, many to a room. They woke after a few hours sleep, the first sleep, naturally - without any alarms. The time between sleeps was called the 'watch'. During this time people sat around the fire, tended the fire, tended farm animals, did chores like working with wool, or peeling rushes to go on the fire, or mending clothes. People took medicines, chatted and visited, did religious work, prayers, and more, during the watch. If the children had left the bed, parents could have some time 'alone' and have sex.
I am a night person although I am also biphasic with regards to sleep, so I tend to have my two sleeps very early to late morning and late afternoon to evening. How's about you? What sleep patterns make you feel good and well rested?
Thanks for reading and here's the open thread - and remember, everything is interesting if you dive deep enough, so tell us about where you're diving!
Comments
The Farm at Night
I've taken to the nightly coyote patrols. I sing the 'The Coyote and The Cowboy' song which Lookout introduced me to, and I have a good time examining things I see and hear. I hear owls a LOT. A couple of nights ago I saw one of these, a northwestern salamander, meandering down the path towards the barn, alongside the ditch which was full of water. It was awesome to see!
Northwestern Salamander, picture from the Burke Museum
And tonight, after we had a little, pretty unusual, snow, I saw these on the plank which crosses a drainage ditch along that path. I'm not sure what animal made this, maybe a rabbit? The prints are about an inch by an inch and a half, and there are four in each group. So I was thinking maybe a hopping rabbit. I know there is a rabbit that lives down there, I see it almost every other night or so. It has become used to me, and doesn't even hop away more than about 10 feet when I go down there!
Whatcha think? Rabbit? Racoon? Something else?
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
my bet is on the bunny
coon tracks are more spidery with their splayed toes
sleep with me has become more like cat naps - off and on
very rarely sleep more than 4 hours straight anymore
thanks for your essay!
Zionism is a social disease
My husband thinks it's a bunny too
And I agree with you both. We've got coons around here, but they don't make hoppity tracks like that.
4 hours is a good amount of sleep for me, so I completely understand where you're at with that.
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
I sleep well...
Typically 9 hours straight per night...8pm till 5AM usually. We heal during sleep, and I've been healthy throughout my life. I think all the sleep contributes.
When people are put in dark caves they tend to develop 25 hour day patterns. As to double sleeping, I think it was/is very common. How else does the fire make it till morning?
It is a bipolar weather pattern in the US ...cold in the west and warm in the SE. Mid-80's today, but cooling back to the 60's tomorrow.
Hope everyone is well rested regardless of their sleep patterns. Thanks for the OT.
“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”
9 hours straight, nice!
I'm lucky in that I don't have to sleep that much straight, and still am in pretty good health. I think it's the years of outside and farm work. I do get about 9 hours total, just not in one go.
Weather up here, in the west of the PacNW, is much colder than normal. We got that little bit of snow, which has melted off in the sunshine today, but it's only about 32-35 outside. I know there's a heat wave in the south, where you are! It's nuts.
Is it warmer than it was in Mexico? That would be extremely nuts.
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Sleeping with animals
Sleep has evolved recently for us with the introduction of new animals. This past year our two old big dogs died
and my daughter acquired two bagel dogs. There were supposed to be basset hounds but turned out to be mixed with beagles. The big dogs slept on the floor. The bagels sleep on the bed with us, in addition to three small dogs, a wiener, a chihuahua, and a chiweenie. The little dogs are not so invasive.`There are also lots of cats. There only used to be two cats who might sleep on the bed. That has grown to as many as six, as folks keep dumping cats at our gate. Five more kittens just last week. We have inside cats and outside cats who can come in the cat door in the laundry room into our bedroom. There are a bunch of kitty beds in the laundry room.
Simply put . . . this year it went from 3 small dogs and maybe 2 cats on the bed to as many as 5 dogs and 6 cats on the bed. I have to clean the bedroom every evening now because of the dirt the animals bring in. Shake out the bedding every night and change it every few nights.
I have lots of memory foam on the bed so it is really comfy. If we are all situated appropriately, it works OK. But sometimes it is just too much and one of us gets up and sleeps elsewhere.
I'm a morning person, definitely not a night person, although often, especially now, I am awake at night and do a Duolingo lesson and listen to inspirational teachers.
This all just evolved. Gotta take care of and love the animals too, but it does cut into our snuggly time. Hmmmm . . .
For me, I guess it is just an "accept the things you cannot change" thing.
Anyone want a kitten?
Marilyn
"Make dirt, not war." eyo
Good gravy!
I shouldn’t complain about Sam wiggling when you’re dealing with this. I was just grumbling to myself this morning about how many times Sam woke me up last night.
I have never been a morning person. I actually think that I’m allergic to it.
Please don’t mention the kitty to Sam. She watches the neighborhood cats and says that she wants one. With my mornings affliction I don’t think that’s a good idea. Cats have never respected my boundaries.
To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.
- Kevin Alfred Strom
True . . . cats are more invasive . . .
Three of my cats want to sleep on my head!!
Marilyn
"Make dirt, not war." eyo
Yeah what’s up with that?
I hear so many people saying that their cat sleeps on their head. I wouldn’t think that would be very comfortable.
Sam likes to snuggle on my neck and loves to do it when I say I have to get up. Nope.
The wind broke a tree branch that fell on the cable line and the poor guy is up on the pole fixing it in this wind. I offered to let him come back tomorrow when it’s warmer. Horrible job at times.
To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.
- Kevin Alfred Strom
do cats actually want to suck out your thoughts?
whenever I see cats sleeping together
they tend to have their foreheads touching
perhaps this is one of those telepathy things
It actually explains a lot of why cats look at
humans with their curious eyes
the way they do
Zionism is a social disease
The average cat wants nothing to do with what
passes for thought among humans according to the (late) twins
be well and have a good one
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Maybe they can hear our thoughts?
Or our dreams?
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Not a morning person either...
Unless I"m still up from the night before!
Be careful, Sam might lead home a cat and then... you are stuck!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Wow, you are doing great by those kittens...
I am sorry people keep leaving them at your gate. I think people would do that to us, as well, but our house is down a long driveway, and either they don't bother leaving them, or the animals, sadly, don't make it down the driveway. We adopt ferals from time to time from the local rescue because cats are good for the farm.
I do Duolingo at night too! Right before I try to fall asleep, usually. Used to sleep with Jaska on the bed, but she decided that she'd had enough of that when I started menopause. I think I tossed and turned too much for her. Spoilt dog!
I hope you can get some sleep with all the critters on the bed, and that the kittens find homes!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Duolingo
Cool . . . what language(s) are you learning?
Marilyn
"Make dirt, not war." eyo
Spanish,
German, Latin and... whispers - Russian. I want to learn Finnish too, or try to learn it. At least it doesn't require a new alphabet, like Russian! What are you learning?
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Currently mostly Russian
Very cool to find someone else doing Duolingo. I think it's a blast. For me it started a year and a half ago when my son wanted to learn Japanese, so I was doing it with him as part of our homeschooling. I think Japanese may be one of the hardest languages because it has 3 alphabets. At that time I also started doing Norwegian, German, and Russian. I took German in school and my parents spoke Norwegian at home. There were many many words I already knew, so those would be the logical choices if I wanted to become proficient quicker. Spanish would be logical too since I live in Texas. My son went far past me so quickly in Japanese. I stuck with it for a year just to be in solidarity with him until one day he told me he moved on from Duolingo to Anki and watching movies/videos with Japanese subtitles. He still spends an hour or two a day, even after starting college last month.
Then I dropped Japanese and started focusing on Russian. It was about the same time that Duolingo added a "learn the alphabet" section and that helped tremendously. I spent months just doing that and then I went back to the beginning. I am repeating each section until I completely get it so I am only on Unit 2.
I'd also like to do Chinese. It's similar to Japanese but only has one alphabet. Unfortunately, that alphabet has about 5000 characters!
How far along are you with Spanish?
Marilyn
"Make dirt, not war." eyo
My apologies for responding so late!
Extended family health troubles took over the weekend and early week.
I've been doing Spanish for, well, my streak is 5+ years for Spanish, German and Russian. But I grew up in California, had friends who were Hispanic, and started learning Spanish in about the second grade. I lost a lot of it after I left college, but it's back now. German is pretty good for me, I learned that in High School and College and Duo has made me able to understand it at least, if not speak it. Russian... heh, I sound out the words slowly and hope I'm doing it right.
I'm glad I'm not the only one doing several languages with Duo. I admire you for trying Japanese. I just am not ready to do that yet... too much extra study!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
I sleep fitfully.
Too many nightmares. Don't see that improving soon.
All of our animals are rescues, dumped somewhere before they came to us. Our little white dog (Maltese mix, we think) must have been abused badly before he came to us, because he sleeps with his eyes wide open. He doesn't sleep at all during the day, but at night he dives under the covers on the bed, and sleeps by my wife's feet.
I completely get the idea of pulling the covers up over my head. I could learn a thing or two from the dog, with respect to adaptive behavior...
Twice bitten, permanently shy.
I sleep with the covers almost over my head
I really like it that way. In the summer, it gets too hot, though. Maybe your little Maltese has a good idea with that. So glad you rescued him!
I'm sorry about the nightmares. I used to have lots of them, but now I don't really remember them much. I do wake up in fright or alarm quite often though, so I know I'm having them. I used to have really nice dreams too, exploring strange lands, being with wild animals, playing music in bands, and whatever... I don't remember any of those anymore either, if I'm still having them.
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
I remember a great many
of my dreams- certainly, the ones that occur just before I wake up (or they wake me up). At times, this can be very useful: as I've posted before, many of the advances and cool design details and solutions to really gnawing problems I've come up with during my engineering career have come to me in the form of dreams, not as waking inspirations while sitting at my desk. I have some of the latter, to be sure. But it seems to me that many if not most have come with a "Eureka!" awakening moment, followed by frantic scribbles on my notepad at the head of the bed, followed by a restful sleep afterwards knowing that a problem has been solved. I like those.
The ones that are slowly killing me are the ones where the gnawing problem has absolutely no solution, and that end up with me living the inevitable outcome, over and over. I don't particularly care for those, but I can't control which one I'm gonna get when I close my eyes.
The only time I don't remember my dreams is when I have well-saturated myself with Adult Beverages prior to falling over. And I do that more and more, here lately. I'm sure that I still have them- I just don't remember which one woke me up. So I go back to sleep and snooze lightly until the next one.
Truth be told, I kinda envy the folks who don't remember their dreams, and/or the folks whose dreams don't wake them up. On balance, I think remembering so many may have been a net negative. Just ask my liver...
Twice bitten, permanently shy.
I too come up with solutions..
to problems during dreams. I wake up, and use my cell phone (now) to record them. I used to write them down. I think maybe this is an engineer/overthinker thing that I might have inherited from my Dad. A weird thing for me, I dream differently depending upon which side of my body I am sleeping on. One side has 'good' dreams, the other can have good dreams, but has nightmares too!
Nuts, I think I am nuts
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Give me 6 hours of sleep
and I am ready for a tussle.
I am a bit more restless on evenings prior to heavy court dockets, or jury trials. I awaken at 3 a.m. with a good line of questioning, or novel argument, and I might even get up and write it down.
I am so used to it, I consider it my normal.
The weather here last week was nights of freezing temperatures. This week, the low is 68, high of 88. Summer will not be pleasant.
Must get to the office, put out fires.
Thanks, Sima, and give the kids and Jasta a hug, ok?
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Everyone has gotten a hug!
The goat kids really like them in the cold weather we are having. And Jaska sez 'licks' back!
I do something similar to you, I get 'great' ideas when I'm about ready to fall asleep, or I wake up with them. I used to write them down, but now I record them on my cell phone. Sometimes they are really good, when I listen to them after waking up. Sometimes, just rubbish!
Thanks for stopping by!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Both the wood stove and bladder will favor ‘biphasic’ rhythm
As a younger adult, with central heating, 10-12 hr sleeps were the norm on no-work days. Today, with careful moderation of evening hydration and a good airtight wood stove, 6-8 hrs are possible. When colder nights favor an early am reload of the stove, I will naturally shift to a biphasic mode, with the intermission being a quiet spell for reading, introspection or gazing at moonlight.
Humans can be very adaptable. For those who can easily wake and sleep, I see no harm in my seasonal two part sleep cycle, but I am married to someone who NEEDS a solid night’s sleep.
To each their own.
“The story around the world gives a silent testimony:
— The Beresovka mammoth, frozen in mud, with buttercups in his mouth…..”
The Adam and Eve Story, Chan Thomas 1963
I like how you naturally switch to biphasic...
I have done that too. I am lucky in that I can set my own sleep times, or let my body set them. Farming was/is good that way for me. The goats don't care when they are milked, as long as it's a regular schedule. So I used to milk at noon and at midnight!
My husband does tend to sleep in one long session, although that is changing as he's getting older and retired now. I think it's the bladder as well, and the wood stove. That's our main source of heat now, as well.
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
I’d sleep much better if Sam didn’t wiggle all night
Or get up to see what’s happening outside or moving positions or….. it takes a long time to get back to sleep. I’d kick her off, but I’d miss her snuggling up with me.
Snow totals for the valley are well over 2 feet south of me but I got another 3 inches last night. Lots of people are also dealing with snow drifts up to 4 feet high. The mountains got up to 4 feet. It is incredibly beautiful out now with the sun shining and the trees coated with snow and everything in sight is too. Big clumps are falling off the trees. Very few people lost power yesterday. I’ve lost my internet but it’s something on my end.
This is a massive storm across lots of the country with very cold temperatures and high winds. Apparently most roads in Wyoming are closed. Huh I haven’t heard of that in some time.
To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.
- Kevin Alfred Strom
The storm
missed us to the north. We only got an inch of snow, but the low last light was -2degF.
Our snowy months are just about to start now, here in the Denver area. We shouldn't get this cold again anytime soon, but our big dumps are always in March and April. It'll be interesting to see if they happen at all this year...
Twice bitten, permanently shy.
That’s surprising that it missed you
Looking at the weather maps I thought everyone north of us was involved with the storm. It’s been very cold here since the new year and most of the snow is still around. The house across the street is empty so no shoveling and not much has melted. It faces east so that’s one reason. I’m going to let the new snow melt since it’s not enough to use the blower and it’s warming up in a few days.
Have you been unusually cold too? We’ve had a few nights of zero and this morning was only 20. A lot of the snow is frozen on my car and won’t scrape off.
To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.
- Kevin Alfred Strom
We got the cold,
but missed the moisture. It wasn't a proper upslope storm. The track of the low that drives the storms can vary by 50 miles to the north or south, and the outcome goes from zero snow to feet of snow to zero snow... Our forecast went from 7" to "trace" over the course of 6 hours.
For us, the real doozy upslope storms are the ones where the low cruises right along the state line to the south. That's when we get buried. If the low goes further north across Pueblo, like this one did, then the moisture gets pushed too far north. If it goes south of the state line, then Colorado Springs and the southern mountains get buried, and north of the Palmer Divide we get nothing. For metro Denver proper, the microclimate is pretty amusing.
Generally speaking, if it snows up in the mountains, we get nothing- all the moisture gets squeezed out of the air on the way over the hump. It has to duck around to the south across New Mexico, and then be carried upslope by the counterclockwise circulation around the low, coming in the back door as it were. And *then* it gets fun here.
Our big storms are when there's a topical thing that comes northeasterly across Baja California that arrives just at the right time to meet up with a cold front dancing southeasterly along the state line. That's basically where all of our moisture comes from, here in the rain shadow of the Rockies...
Twice bitten, permanently shy.
Oh yeah, I mentioned it in last night's EBs.
High winds, cold temps,and rain, both now and projected for the next week or so; Here, San Diego, Los Angeles. It's here and moving in as well.
be well and have a good one
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
The snow sounds gorgeous
Here, it was very pretty and then it melted. It's quite clear and cold now.
Snuggling with the dog on the bed, or maybe it's the dog snuggling with the human, is good. Jaska got tired of my restless sleep a few years ago, so she gets off the bed when I crawl in to sleep!
I hope the snow storm doesn't create too many problems. Today, we had such slick roads that people were going off the edges constantly. Never seen so many cars off the road.
Give Sam a snuggle and a huge for me.
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Hi all,
Hi Sima,
GREAT to see a salamander! I love 'em, but now hardly ever see them compared to the days of my youth. I grew up with California Newt being the default, and it was abundant. They are a big 5-6" beast. We had a secret walk-in spot in the Santa Ana Mtns. in Org. Co. CA where on the right days in spring thousands could be seen at once. Not any more. Had some as pets back then.
There are some salamanders that live underground in caves here in the Edwards Plateau of central TX. No pigment, they retain gills as adults, and as they found out moving some to Sea World San Antonio, they have a 1 or 2 deg.F temperature range tolerance. There are 6 or 9 different types, they each have number/letter codes, are not named, each cave system with its own version. Once I got lucky and saw some that were not subterranean, where they rarely come above ground at a spring fed pool that is a direct pipe to major caves and a known site below.
Nice tracks too. Rabbit methinks. The pattern of front legs inside hind legs is typical. In the Petersen Field Guide series there is one called Petersen Field Guide to Animal Tracks. It is awesome, by Olaus Murie, who seemingly had experience with (or knew someone that did) every type of mammal. The natural history gold in the book, besides all the great track (and scat) illustrations, are his species behavior accounts in which he discusses amazing aspects of everything's lives, which he has learned from spending his as a keen observer of them. A lot of those Petersen series guides are often available at used book outlets, like the baby chicken said, cheap cheap.
Thanks for the salamander and tracks! A++
Have great days, all!
We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.
Look deep into nature, and then you will understand everything better.
both - Albert Einstein
UC's botanical garden has 2 resident species of newts:
Taricha torosa (California newt) and Taricha granulosa (rough-skin newt). They migrate, en masse, from uphill down to the "Japanese Tea Garden" pools, where one can just hang out and watch them .
I think the "rabbit" tracks are specialized sandals that bigfoot wears to throw people off of the scent.
be well and have a good one
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Big Foot Sandals!
But Big Foot would have to be tiptoeing or something, right? That would be great to see!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
sounds great EL!
Ah, the Rough-skinned Newt. They are supposed to be hard to tell from California, but not a problem if south of I think Santa Cruz or so, as all in southern areas are California Newt. When viewed from above the eyes stick out past the jaws on California, not on Rough-skinned. Like many birds a morphological difference not obvious by typical external things we use like color or pattern.
Maybe Sima should put out some game cams for some BigFoot pics? ROFL
Maybe I have some here?
We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.
Look deep into nature, and then you will understand everything better.
both - Albert Einstein
Game Cameras...
Maybe we should. Last night, around 3 am of course, I heard the coyotes calling. So I went out and just walked around. While going down the path by the ditch, where the Big Foot Rabbit lives, I heard scrabbling and running from the other side of the ditch. It was not a horse, the neighbors' horses were inside because it's so cold. It was... a coyote, or two. Right up by the goats. The goats were alarmed, but relaxed as soon as I was there. So, maybe it's actually a Big Foot (short though) pretending to be a coyote, pretending to be a rabbit?
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
probably
a midget bigfoot/coyote/rabbit
by jove, I think you've got it!
elementary watson
Zionism is a social disease
I Love Salamanders too!
I was so surprised to see one at 2:30 am. They used to be common around here, not so much anymore, same with newts. I've seen quite a few newts here over the years, but, once again, not so much anymore. It sucks, and I think is indicative of the amount of wildlife we are losing, or have lost, due to climate change. One thing we still have a lot of, although not as much, are tree frogs. They create a huge cacophony every night in the late spring and throughout the summer. It's not as loud as it used to be, but there's still frogs. I do my best to live and let live, so some of them live in our greenhouse and hoop house. They do great work on the aphids and other bugs!
I would love to see some cave dwelling newts, salamanders, bats... whatever. That would be so cool! No caves right around here though, we are too close to the Puget Sound (only 80 ft above sea level).
I'm going to have to find that Petersen Guide and add it to my collection. Thank you so much for the recommendation.
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Thanks
for mentioning that Peterson Guide. I've seen it referenced in a couple of other books I have been reading about the Hill Country. I wonder if it is the same Peterson. Anyway, it is another book I will now have to check out.
Hope all is well in your neck of the woods. It has been unusually hot here the past couple of days. Today is cool again, a good day to spend outside.
Archive.org has a copy
of the Peterson Guide to Animal Tracks. Here's a link: https://archive.org/details/peterson-field-guide-animal-tracks
I downloaded the pdf copy. I will probably buy a copy too, because... because... because I'm too old and I want books in hand!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
hear hear
... there is nothing like curling up with a book!
We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.
Look deep into nature, and then you will understand everything better.
both - Albert Einstein
I'm the same
. I would rather have the hard copy if it's a book I care about. Otherwise I'm happy to read online or listen to an audio book or check it out from the library. Problem is, I spend way too much money on books and always have.
Thanks for the archive.org link!
@randtntx Hey Rand! There is a
Hey Rand! There is a very popular in Texas bird field guide in the Petersen series, called Field Guide to the Birds of Texas. About 1960 maybe. It is fantastic. The two two original Petersen guides were east and west birds. The Texas state guide was the first ever for just one state, and it had both the eastern and western stuff in it. It is the most found field guide owned by the ranch wives of Texas. It was huge. Then Petersen got experts in every field to do a guide. The Stars and Planets one is fantastic. So is the Butterflies of which the original is eastern butterflies only (Klots was author). They can have my Klots when they pry it from my cold dead hand. The Animal Track one is awesome, so is Pacific Coast Seashells, every species regular folk would find. Nowadays lots of guides are done with photos and I do like the modern stuff too. But, it all sits on the shoulders of the Petersen Field Guide Series.
The biggest thing unique to the old orig. Texas Bird guide is that instead of just front and back end-plates being silhouettes, it had about 6 more pages of just silhouettes in various habitats. Like roadside/highway, or marsh, silhouettes, etc. This taught the magic secret to bird ID. The silver bullet. The three S's. Size, shape and structure. They are all different. A good birder does not need to see the feathers on a vulture to ID it from a half-mile. Size, shape, and structure. Every species of hawk, or sandpiper, has a unique size, shape, and structure. The problem is, you sorta have to learn the birds by field marks, to learn the 3 S's of each species.
edit: mis-spell fixed
We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.
Look deep into nature, and then you will understand everything better.
both - Albert Einstein
Thanks for the comprehensive response
. That is just awesome. A couple of us in the household have been doing deep dives into Texas history and natural history...the fun stuff...not the goofy taught-in-highschool-stuff. Geology, Botany, early Tx explorers, botanists, naturalists, Indigenous peoples, rivers, wildlife, etc.
We're having a good time with it. Field trips are a thing.
Thanks again dysto!
After a certain age, a lot of folks develop sleepus interruptus,
whereupon the question becomes do I stay up or not and they the huge decision tree kicks in off of the Yes answer, do I eat, read, both, play computer games watch tv, etc. Sometimes it is easier to just go back to sleep. OTOH, a good recliner near a good reading lamp can lure one into the afternoon nap syndrome, whether one consciously desires it or not.
be well and have a good one
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
also a nightly dilemma for moi
reading for a couple hours will normally put me back into the sleep mode
(tired eyes). the real whatchacollet is during the 3 - 4 AM pause. Have yet
to figure it out, but mostly if I try to re-bed pre sunrise, it carries a groggy
reawakening. Sleep is whenever you get it, like hunger and inspiration.
Zionism is a social disease
I used to use reading
to get myself calm and ready for sleep as well. Then, I got old and have to use reading glasses. For some reason, that stopped me reading before bed. I guess I was just denying that I need the glasses. Now, I am trying to get myself back into the habit of reading before sleep because it really does help me get a calm, 4 hour or so stretch of sleep.
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Naps,
we tend to take those a lot. Jaska insists. And I mean, insists. I must leave my computer desk, I must lay down, so she can crawl under the computer desk and have her afternoon nap. I often just lay there and relax for a bit, then get up and sneak back onto the computer. If I go outside, she must come as well, once again she insists, so no going outside then for me!
Whatever you decide to do during your interrupted sleep, have fun with it! That's how I figure it. I often read, for some reason, that clears my mind so I can sleep easier when I try again.
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
not very good flying weather today
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Not good walking weather either
Winds are blowing over 25 mph with gusts much higher. I love to walk in the cold and snow, but not when it’s this windy. My face can’t handle it. I have bones to give Sam on these days as an apology, but it’s rare that I don’t walk. Rain and wind are the only reasons I won’t. And yes I have a scarf but even then I can’t tolerate it.
Did you get any snow on the peaks in your area? I read that most of California would see some somewhere.
To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.
- Kevin Alfred Strom
I heard that we're in for low level snow (and we were)
but didn't look into any detail. Been crazy here in a lot of ways so we just holed up. Lick reported 2 feet of snow on Mt Hamilton, Mission hills got a dusting, Skyline, vague report of "Oakland Hills" which could mean anything,projected light snow on Griz tonight and heavier on Diablo.
be well and have a good one
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Wind gusts that high suck for walking..
I used to have to go out and work in that from time to time, not anymore, phewww. Jaska hated it when she was younger, she's adjusted now. She goes out, sits down stoutly and faces the wind, and barks at it. Her barks get blown about 2 miles (just kidding, but it seems like that) behind her, so we don't hear a thing!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Thanks for the heads up
on that book; At Day's Close, It sounds like a book I would enjoy. I will put it on my 'to check out list'.
You are right about the weird weather. I think it is that way just about everywhere. I'm curious to see what March will bring.
Thanks for the OT Sima. I haven't been commenting much but I do [eventually] stop by to read.
It's a good book
I need to buy a copy, my old copy is missing (probably loaned it to someone once and never got it back).
So it's brightly sunny here now, and ... 35. Amazingly cold. I sat in the sun outside, wrapped up in my jacket and scarf. I think my fingers might have got some sun as I petted the feral cats :).
You are welcome for the OT, and I'm glad you stopped by. I am much the same, I read things 'late' and then comment 'late'. It's just the way we are
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so