Where are the new polls about Afghanistan?

When it comes to say, a presidential debate, there are snap polls within the hour, and more comprehensive polls the very next day.
However, with the debacle in Afghanistan, which has been happening all week now, I have not seen any new polls. Instead you have the media universally spinning this as "we shouldn't have pulled out".

But they don't show polls backing up this viewpoint.
Why? Because the American people disagree, and every single poll from earlier this year tells the same story.

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While you wouldn't know it from following the beltway discourse, President Biden's plan to withdraw from Afghanistan is incredibly popular.
...
This overwhelming approval is not limited by party lines. While support for withdrawal is higher among self-reported liberals, 65 percent of conservatives approve of Biden's plan.

And though politicians are quick to speak on behalf of members of the U.S. military to justify their warmaking, the evidence shows that support for withdrawal is actually higher among veterans than in the general public.

This isn't just a domestic phenomenon. Eighty percent of Afghans now believe that only a political (non-military) solution will bring about peace, and only one third would prefer U.S. and NATO forces remain in the country. Meanwhile, globally, U.S. military presence in Afghanistan has been found to be a major driver of anti-U.S. sentiment.

That last number, how 2/3rds of Afghanis want us to leave, is not something that I've heard on any news media outlet.
The Afghan people were not enamored with the foreign occupation.

The Institute of War and Peace Studies also found that an overwhelming 80% of Afghans surveyed said a political solution was the only way to bring about an end to fighting. Twenty percent said a military solution was possible.
The survey found that 46% of Afghans want U.S. and NATO troops out of the country once a deal is struck, while 33% would have them stay.

It isn't just one poll, nor is it just recently. The Afghan people wanted us out for years.

Of those issues that the survey covered, the presence of foreign forces was the least important when considering what should be compromised during negotiations. Afghans are more willing to give up the presence of foreign forces than almost everything else....However, when asked how important foreign military forces were, only 17.5 percent said it was very important.
The Taliban have sympathy from only about 13 percent of the population according to this year’s survey and target civilians as a deliberate strategy, and yet, Afghans still fear foreign forces at near similar levels.
Of those that Afghans would trust to represent them in negotiations, 1 percent selected the Taliban and a mere 0.5 percent selected the U.S..
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Raggedy Ann's picture

on them supporting the war. That's why generals are now news anchors. I think we're about to witness some dominoes falling. Just a guess. Pleasantry

Edited to add that Whitney Webb is a treasure:
https://www.mintpressnews.com/us-afghanistan-peace-deal-rekindled-busine...

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18 users have voted.

"The “jumpers” reminded us that one day we will all face only one choice and that is how we will die, not how we will live." Chris Hedges on 9/11

mimi's picture

it has beem a failure and every body knows it.

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15 users have voted.

and released ONLY when the polls support the MIC views. Or Big Phama's views.

Just as political polls reflect who pays for them more than actual public opinion.

But you know all this gjohnsit, and pointing it out even to those who understand what polling has become, is always a good thing! So, I welcome this post.

The Way Biden failed at this withdrawal is what's galling to me. Not that we are leaving. That's a good thing.

Let me point out that we left Bagram Airfield on July 31 in the middle of the night. If the US Military had even the slightest concern for Afghanis who helped us, they could have been evacuating masses of them discretely with no public scrutiny.

That failure is so spectacular that to me it proves that any nation that respects or trusts the USA deserves what they get. I bet the number of nations cheering "America is Back" along with President Biden, is now dropping to zero.

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NYCVG

@NYCVG

Just as political polls reflect who pays for them more than actual public opinion.

But you know all this gjohnsit, and pointing it out even to those who understand what polling has become, is always a good thing! So, I welcome this post.

I was just pointing out the obvious, as you've already guessed.

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11 users have voted.

@gjohnsit and "Sympathy Theater" are what's happening now.

We are OH! so concerned about women and girls education in Afghanistan. omg, the refugees. and so on.

Nauseating.

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NYCVG

@NYCVG
Except when we bomb their weddings, schools, and hospitals.
Then we are nearly so concerned.

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16 users have voted.

(by those with a vested interest in continuing an expensive and failed US military occupation) is just noise and give media pundits something to bloviate about.

Twenty years in South Vietnam (expanded to SE Asia for a few years near the end) and twenty years in Afghanistan appears to be the limit of a solid majority of patient Americans. Other than installing US puppet governments, there are few other similarities between the two operations. One reason being that the USMIC learned from S. Vietnam -- make sure casualties are few.

The poor logistical planning for the evacuation of both likely reflects that some key resources and players didn't plan to leave at all. In 1975, the WH and military still harbored illusions that they could mount and win a new fight. This time there appears to be some passive-aggressive behavior among Obama loyalists that Biden hired, factions within the military, and Congress.

Biden likely and appropriately depended on State and Pentagon intel and planners to make this go as smoothly as possible. And if he has any advisors worth a damn, they should begin preparing the list of subversives and incompetents to fire.

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11 users have voted.

@Marie hits the target.

Biden may or may not do this, however. I'm not certain about what or how much he knows what to do or can do what would be appropriate. Him against the larger forces of the Military Machine.

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NYCVG

@NYCVG
based on Biden's opposition to Obama's 2009 Afghanistan surge, it seems to me that the old warmonger had soured early on this operation. Biden may not be swift these days (he was never all the swift to begin with), but he seems to be done with being subservient to Obama,, and therefore, will notice those that continue to speak/act on behalf of Obama.

Generally assigning blame to an underling for a messed up operation is dicey. Scapegoating often, but not always, works all too well. However, I can't recall an instance where the public holds the top dog responsible for authentic subordinate failings.

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5 users have voted.

@NYCVG
OPINION Ex-Obama adviser: Why Biden must fire his national security adviser for Afghanistan failure

President Joe Biden needs to shake up his national security team.

The disaster that unfolded in Afghanistan is illustrative of other major issues at the White House. The people, plans and processes the president has put in place to keep America safe are not working.

Those he has chosen for key positions have repeatedly failed to challenge their own assumptions. It sadly led to the most unnecessarily embarrassing day in the history of the National Security Council.

The national security adviser has two jobs. As the name suggests, they are the last and ideally closest counselor to the president in the Situation Room.

Their second duty is to translate the commander in chief’s decisions and direction into practical policies. Sometimes that requires speaking truth to power. On all of these scores, the current occupant of the office appears to have failed.

In particular, he names Jake Sullivan, Hillary Clinton's right hand man.

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CB's picture

@Marie
for getting out was the MICMC (military-industrial-congressional-media complex) has got bigger fish on the menu. Fucking about in the middle-east and wasting tons of money/resources in Afghanistan, Iraq, Somalia, Libya and Syria has got to end if they want to successfully Pivot to Asia(TM).

America (in the uni-polar corner) will be facing off against real adversaries, China and Russia (in the multi-polar corner), that can reach out and punch back for the first time in it's 245 years of existence. Those great oceans that have been so protective in the past can no longer protect it. Besides, I think the country has a bad case of dry rot within.

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@CB
but they could only cook them with nukes.

I'm sticking with a split military and mostly unified state and Congressional perspective. Otherwise, the evacuation logistics would have been handled far better and avoided having the US look like Keystone Kops. In the 21st century, how things look on video is the most important thing of all.

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7 users have voted.

@Marie and Total failure says it all.

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NYCVG

@CB
as evidence for my take existed. March 20, 2019, Ben Smith at Buzzfeed News Richard Holbrooke ... Who Smith praises and then takes a couple of curious sidesteps at the end:

Obama’s Republican defense secretary, Robert Gates, wrote in his memoir that Biden had been “wrong on nearly every major foreign policy and national security issue over the past four decades.”

As there probably was little daylight between Gates and Biden on 90% of FP and nat-sec positions, both were nearly always wrong. Smith then segues into praise for Biden.

But in the Obama administration, he was a voice of relative caution that looks wise in retrospect: against escalation in Afghanistan, and intervention in Libya. That sometimes pitted him against the generals, other times against Obama’s utopian strains. Biden’s recent speech on American leadership in Nebraska stressed the importance of things Trump has abandoned: alliances, traditional diplomacy, concern about America’s image in the world. What comes through in Holbrooke’s book is something pragmatic, improvisational, and modest about the use of American force.

And Biden’s opposition to the 2010 American build-up in Afghanistan looks, a decade later, obviously correct. There are no major American figures pushing for anything but a negotiated exit any more.

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@Marie just a theory. I have no supporting facts. Bioden will serve for one term and who knows what comes next.

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NYCVG

@NYCVG
If he were younger and more cognitively and verbally fluid, this would put him in a good position for a second term.

As it is, this is one of the few issues on which he deviates from his warmongering, neoliberal political allies. As I don't expect that he and his advisors have the wisdom and skill to carve out a more humane faction within the DP, in 2024 Democratic voters will be stuck once again with a choice between Clinton or Obama proxies.

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gulfgal98's picture

In my four and a half years (ending in mid 2016) with a local Peace vigil in a small southern town, nearly every person I spoke with, regardless of political self identification (most were conservative or Republican), wanted us out of all these wars. The American people are war weary and want their tax dollars to be spent here at home.

The media is once again trying to gin up support for war.

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Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?

“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy

@gulfgal98
as the improbable Mr. Trump who spoke of ending "dumb wars" defeated the pro-war shoo-in.

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mimi's picture

right now live. I couldn't continue doing that, he is such a "Märchenonkel" with a monotone intonation that one just has to fall asleep after half a minute.

Go to bed, Mr. President, it's time for you hit the sack.

Good Night. All hope for better times to come, at least in your dreams.

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The Liberal Moonbat's picture

I just got a poll from them asking me about:

- Biden
- some of my state politicians
- ObamaRomneyHeritageCare
- Black Lives Matter
- "the alt-right movement" (a label I have multiple serious qualms with)
- UBI
- a federal jobs guarantee
- defunding the police (no mention of reform, cutting SOME funding, or defunding SOME PDs)
- repealing the 2nd Amendment (Is that even possible short of a Constitutional Convention???)

...Not one word about Afghanistan (to be fair, maybe they prepare these things well in advance or something? Not everyone works on South Park's timetable).

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In the Land of the Blind, the One-Eyed Man is declared mentally ill for describing colors.

Yes Virginia, there is a Global Banking Conspiracy!

Eye-opening.

CNN covered pretty much how I felt about Biden's poor effort. He was fighting for a withdrawal that 1) we all agree with and 2) is a fait accompli. Patting himself on the back.

Biden did not address the total calamity about the withdrawal itself. The State Department informed us that US citizens ahould not travel to Afghanistan. No kidding, asshole. The Pentagon spokeman was all defensive and shameful. He offered assurances he is in no position to make. Oh sure, all 22,000 Loyal to USA Afghans and their families will be transported safely out. As slimy a reptile as could be imagined.

The USA cares about its wealthiest and most powerful rulers and Nobody Else.

Long-time well known FACT. "Born on the Fourth Of July" told us all about it decades ago.

Nothing has changed.

Oliver Stone should make his next film about this tragedy and catastrophe. Not that any more info will change things. If I have learned anything at all in my lengthy lifetime, that is it.

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13 users have voted.

NYCVG

CB's picture

Afghanistan - Chaos Pictures Increase Fallout From U.S. Defeat

The Wall Street Journal describes the current situation at the Kabul airport as '‘Saigon on Steroids’

It indeed is as satellite pictures and a number of videos posted on Twitter show. Thousands of people rushed towards the airport. There was some panic at one of the entry gates and three persons there seem to have died in a stampede. Hundreds ran onto the runway. Other tried to climb fly bridges to get into planes.

On the military side of the airport the U.S. military fired shots to keep people from storming it. They later set up razor wire.

People ran along a departing C-17, a large military airplane. Some climbed onto the planes landing gear doors.

The plane started, the landing gear retracted and the doors closed. At least three people fell to their death. Some others were alledgedly overrun by a plane and died.

Those sad little stories are an aside in the larger picture but it does reflect how little control the U.S. has over the airport. Why was there no planing for this?
...

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@CB no planning no concern

Biden did make time, however, to fear monger today. He read a list of terrorist organizations and reminded us to be afraid.

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NYCVG

The Liberal Moonbat's picture

@NYCVG

He read a list of terrorist organizations and reminded us to be afraid.

...ANYBODY who likens him to FDR is a raging idiot at best.

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13 users have voted.

In the Land of the Blind, the One-Eyed Man is declared mentally ill for describing colors.

Yes Virginia, there is a Global Banking Conspiracy!

lotlizard's picture

Online polling company Civey polls everything political and commercial at the drop of a hat, but never anything that might deliver an answer the establishment doesn’t want to hear and/or doesn’t want ordinary Germans to know they’re not alone in thinking.

https://civey.com

Bottom vs. top populism, especially its local vs. global-homogenizer variant, is severely discriminated against in Germany — the elites’ claim being that such sentiment must inexorably lead to a Voldemort-like reincarnation of Muskatnuss Man.

Gegen Islamophobie – Afghanistan bleibt bunt

The fact is, the national government that approved the first use of German military outside Europe since WW2 was a Social Democrat / Green party coalition, and today Green voices are reacting to the Afghanistan situation by saying a continued NATO occupation, unlimited in time, was the answer. A militarist, imperialist Green party that assumes the Pentagon, CIA, NSA, etc. are benevolent, sees the future of the EU as developing into a similar federal MIC mega-state of its own, and has zip to say re Assange or Snowden? Who needs that?

(Yes, as a former decades-long backer and member of the Green party in Hesse, I’m disappointed.)

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6 users have voted.
usefewersyllables's picture

to support the agenda of whoever is paying for them. Similarly, front-page news stories are pretty much all pay-to-play in one sense or another. Money is speech, and war is the single most profitable thing we have going in this country.

The people who actually want an end to our eternal wars don't have any money. And that is precisely why our voices are never heard.

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Twice bitten, permanently shy.

Support for US withdrawal from Afghanistan tumbles in new poll
.

The survey, conducted by Morning Consult and Politico between Aug. 13 and Aug. 16, the day after the Taliban completed its takeover of Kabul, found that 49 percent of American voters support President Biden's decision to pull troops from the country.

That is significantly down from the 69 percent who expressed support for the exit in an April survey by the same firms.

Thirty-seven percent of voters polled in August said they opposed the president's decision to withdraw troops from Afghanistan, which was more than double the 16 percent opposition recorded in April.

.
Your guess is as good as mine as to whether this poll measured anything real -- but assuming it is valid, the Hair On Fire "news" moved opposition to withdrawal from tiny to small.

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I cried when I wrote this song. Sue me if I play too long.

@fire with fire And even after the "Ah!! the sky is falling!" coverage, a majority is still for pulling out.

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pswaterspirit's picture

Only interested is whipping up fear and division. They have gone big time with it now. Maybe they could have planned it better but then again we don't have all the information and we are not likely to get it from any of fear mongers spouting garbage on TV.

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mimi's picture

@pswaterspirit @pswaterspirit
I recognized your name. When it comes to spirits, there was anothier spirit on dailykos, I think his name was lightning spirit and his kos name was Ojibwa or Ojibwe. Is he still there?

also, are Aji and Wing still there. I often think of them and their books and images I have over my med in Germany now.

Nice to see you. I hope you are doing fine doing fine and are healthy.

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