The fraud evidence is IN. But YOU can't see it. Nyah nyah!!

Submitted by edg on Tue, 11/10/2020 - 6:59pm

I don't know whether to laugh or cry. Kory Langhofer, the lawyer representing Trump in Arizona has asked to have his "evidence" of voter fraud in Arizona sealed so that people can't see it.

Team suing Maricopa County over allegations of voting problems asks to seal evidence

The attorney representing Donald Trump’s reelection team in a lawsuit alleging poll workers "incorrectly rejected" Election Day votes has asked a Maricopa County Superior Court judge to seal the evidence he plans to submit in support of that claim.

But lawyers representing the election officials being sued have moved to block the request, arguing the public “has a right to know how flimsy Plaintiffs’ evidence actually is.”

...snip...

“Entry of a protective order, as well as an order sealing the records when admitted into evidence, will allow full access to critically important evidentiary materials, while ensuring that the privacy of individual voters and witnesses is appropriately safeguarded,” Langhofer wrote.

In response, Maricopa County attorney Thomas Liddy [a Republican] acknowledged attorneys usually agree to a protective seal in “standard election-law cases” because “large quantities of documents from the Voter Registration Database must be offered into evidence.” But this is “not a standard, run-of-the-mill election law challenge," he argued, and plaintiffs are asking to hide "significantly more than what is protected by statute with no legal or factual basis."

Source: AZCentral.com - 4 pm entry

Tags:

#2020election #arizona #maricopacounty

Vote

Comments

Submitted by snoopydawg on Tue, 11/10/2020 - 9:08pm

Well...

” But this is “not a standard, run-of-the-mill election law challenge,"

It’s not is it? Trump/media have been yakking about how he would question the results if he doesn’t win. Then because he f'cked up COVID people got to vote by mail so then he started saying that it can’t be done because too much voter fraud..yada yada and all the time the democrats were playing along. Attorneys now involved.

Then there were the other stories about how democrats were going to stage a coup or steal it. Hillary played her role. "Don’t concede the election..." Plus I’ve seen articles on how a group of democratic insiders (TIP) are working on that too. Lots of them. I’m sure Biden’s attorneys are involved.

So are we being gaslit?

1- Did Biden win fairly?
2- Did Trump lose fairly?
3- I don’t care.

—

Was Humpty Dumpty pushed?

Submitted by The Voice In th... on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 7:15am

I choose Door number 3

@snoopydawg
But I do believe that both cheated a lot. Team Blue is just better at it. And mail in ballots make it easier. Look for spoiled ballots that voted the wrong way. Easy enough, just fill in Biden and trump on a Trump ballot. Throw the ballot away and substitute another. And apropos of the multi-day counts - just wait and manufacture ballots for those who didn't vote. That last was easier un the old days when most voted in person. The precinct captain just looks over the list of who didn't vote, hakes a scrawled signature, then marks up a fresh ballot and puts it in the counting stream. Of course, all the judges have to be in on it, but in the cities the judges are all appointed by the precinct captain/committeeman. Republicans don't even have an organization in the cities. OTOH, I'm sure Republicans do the same thing in the sticks.

EDIT: That's the old low rech way. Snoopydawg cites some high tech ways in another post below.

—

I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.

Submitted by edg on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 8:08pm

Yeah, imaginary cheating is easy.

@The Voice In the Wilderness

"just fill in Biden and trump on a Trump ballot. Throw the ballot away and substitute another"

Except that the bar codes of spoiled ballots have to be entered in the system, as does the substitute. And there has been NO spike in spoiled ballots this year.

I've been trolling around Fox News today. Republicans are really stupid and don't bother to think their fraud claims through. The country has been running elections a long time. Every supposedly brilliant cheat they pull out of their asses has already been thought of and protected against, plus hundreds more. The people that run our elections are pretty smart, way smarter than the Republican idiots coming up with these "brilliant" ways to cheat. Even more hilarious is that many of the proposed Republican "solutions" to the imaginary cheating would impact Trump as much as if not more than Biden.

"I do believe that both cheated a lot. Team Blue is just better at it."

Team Red has cheated far, far more by disenfranchising millions of potential voters. By controlling state legislatures and writing crafty legislation, they've been able to lock in 25 to 30 red states as reliably Republican. The scale of that cheat is massive compared to the pitiful way Team Blue operates. Team Blue couldn't even get Hillary Clinton across the finish line. You give them far more credit than they deserve.

Submitted by Marie on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 8:32pm

Thanks edg

@edg @edg After every close presidential election, there are swarms from the losing side making the same old claims but with the exception of FL 2000, they never have any proof of exactly where and how.

If Democrats 2020 are so good at cheating, how did they fail even to match HRC's totals in Philadelphia and didn't even come close to matching her totals in Chicago, NYC, and Miami?

(Didn't know there were so many closet Trumpsters here.)

Submitted by edg on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 8:33pm

Furthermore,

@Marie

If they're so good at cheating, why didn't they put Biden in an unassailable position? Another 1% here and there would have secured his immediate win. And why didn't they capture the Senate and increase their hold on the House? That wouldn't have even been questioned, because almost everybody thought Dems would take the Senate and bulk up the House.

I'm not sure they're all Trumpsters. I think at least some are anarchists.

Submitted by Blue Republic on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 10:59am

No evidence...

@Marie

After every close presidential election, there are swarms from the losing side making the same old claims but with the exception of FL 2000, they never have any proof of exactly where and how.

No, never. Except, well...

From affidavit of Robert Cushing included in 11.11 filing against Wayne Co., MI election officials:

3. During my observations of the normal processing of ballots on November 4th
between about 7:45 a.m. and 8:30 a.m. I was substantially obstructed from performing my
challenger duties of observing and making notes at Board Number 31. The persons involved either directly or indirectly involved: 1. A worker named Joe, 2. A supervisor named Miss Browner, 3.an unknown person with no credentials, 4. a Democratic Challenger with credentials and one of the AVCB leaders named David Nathan.
4. On Wednesday, November 4, 2020, Detroit election officials told us that they were
going to process military ballots last. I did my best to try to observe the processing/duplication of the military ballots.
5. On November 4, 2020, I was surprised to see numerous new boxes of ballots arrive
at the TCF Center in the evening. I first noticed these boxes in the distribution area after many of the military ballots had been distributed and processed. I estimate these boxes contained several thousand new ballots when they appeared.
6. The main list of persons who had registered to vote on or before November 1, 2020,
was listed on an electronic poll book, often referred to as the QVF. As I understand it, the
Supplemental Sheets were the lists of persons who had registered to vote on November 2, 2020 or November 3, 2020.
7. I observed that none of the names on these new ballots were on the QVF or the
Supplemental Sheets.
8. I saw the computer operators at several counting boards manually adding the names
and addresses of these thousands of ballots to the QVF system.
9. When I asked what the possible justification was to counting ballots from unknown,
unverified “persons,” I was told by election supervisors that the Wayne County Clerk’s Office had “checked them out.”
10. I challenged not one ballot, but the entire process as the names were not in the QVF
or Supplemental Sheets and because the DOB’s were all wrong, all being marked as 01-01-1900.
11. An Election Supervisor near board number #86 advised me to go to the podium of
election officials and ask one of them to help me. I did, and I enlisted the help of one of the leaders, a young man named Anthony Miller.
12. Mr. Miller walked me back to board number #86 and asked what I wanted the
challenge to say. I said that I did not want to challenge just one ballot, but the entire process, as I was witnessing several thousand ballots inputted illegally.
13. Mr. Miller advised the computer operator what to type in as a challenge so that it
was part of the Official Record in the Poll Book for Board Number #86.
14. I challenged the authority and the authenticity of all of these ballots that were being
processed late with absolutely no accompanying documentation, no corresponding name in the
QVF, and no corresponding name in the Supplemental List.
15. Every ballot was being fraudulently and manually entered into the Electronic Poll
Book (QVF), as having been born on January 1, 1900. This "last" batch of ballots was processed in the 8:00 p.m. to 10:00 p.m. time frame.
16. When I asked about this impossibility of each ballot having the same birthday
occurring in 1900, I was told that was the instruction that came down from the Wayne County
Clerk's office.
17. Mr. Miller was very clear about these late ballots and that the instructions were
coming from the Wayne County Clerk's office.
18. I was surprised and disappointed at the preponderance of dishonesty, irregularities,
and fraudulent tactics at the November 3, 2020 election at the TCF Center.
19. The above information is true to the best of my information, knowledge, and belief

Complete filings here:

courtlistener.com

Keep in mind that in the 2016 MI recount various bizarre and suspicious anomalies were found - no least of which

voting scanning machines at 248 of the city’s 662 precincts — 37 percent — tabulated more ballots than the number of actual voters counted in the poll books

source

Submitted by edg on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 11:38am

That "affidavit" is garbage.

@Blue Republic

The idiot didn't challenge any specific ballots. He challenged the "authority and the authenticity of all of these ballots". That's not even legal. The guy's an amateur "challenger" with no education or training. Show me something real.

#1.1.1.1 After every close presidential election, there are swarms from the losing side making the same old claims but with the exception of FL 2000, they never have any proof of exactly where and how. No, never. Except, well... From affidavit of Robert Cushing included in 11.11 filing against Wayne Co., MI election officials: 3. During my observations of the normal processing of ballots on November 4th between about 7:45 a.m. and 8:30 a.m. I was substantially obstructed from performing my challenger duties of observing and making notes at Board Number 31. The persons involved either directly or indirectly involved: 1. A worker named Joe, 2. A supervisor named Miss Browner, 3.an unknown person with no credentials, 4. a Democratic Challenger with credentials and one of the AVCB leaders named David Nathan. 4. On Wednesday, November 4, 2020, Detroit election officials told us that they were going to process military ballots last. I did my best to try to observe the processing/duplication of the military ballots. 5. On November 4, 2020, I was surprised to see numerous new boxes of ballots arrive at the TCF Center in the evening. I first noticed these boxes in the distribution area after many of the military ballots had been distributed and processed. I estimate these boxes contained several thousand new ballots when they appeared. 6. The main list of persons who had registered to vote on or before November 1, 2020, was listed on an electronic poll book, often referred to as the QVF. As I understand it, the Supplemental Sheets were the lists of persons who had registered to vote on November 2, 2020 or November 3, 2020. 7. I observed that none of the names on these new ballots were on the QVF or the Supplemental Sheets. 8. I saw the computer operators at several counting boards manually adding the names and addresses of these thousands of ballots to the QVF system. 9. When I asked what the possible justification was to counting ballots from unknown, unverified “persons,” I was told by election supervisors that the Wayne County Clerk’s Office had “checked them out.” 10. I challenged not one ballot, but the entire process as the names were not in the QVF or Supplemental Sheets and because the DOB’s were all wrong, all being marked as 01-01-1900. 11. An Election Supervisor near board number #86 advised me to go to the podium of election officials and ask one of them to help me. I did, and I enlisted the help of one of the leaders, a young man named Anthony Miller. 12. Mr. Miller walked me back to board number #86 and asked what I wanted the challenge to say. I said that I did not want to challenge just one ballot, but the entire process, as I was witnessing several thousand ballots inputted illegally. 13. Mr. Miller advised the computer operator what to type in as a challenge so that it was part of the Official Record in the Poll Book for Board Number #86. 14. I challenged the authority and the authenticity of all of these ballots that were being processed late with absolutely no accompanying documentation, no corresponding name in the QVF, and no corresponding name in the Supplemental List. 15. Every ballot was being fraudulently and manually entered into the Electronic Poll Book (QVF), as having been born on January 1, 1900. This "last" batch of ballots was processed in the 8:00 p.m. to 10:00 p.m. time frame. 16. When I asked about this impossibility of each ballot having the same birthday occurring in 1900, I was told that was the instruction that came down from the Wayne County Clerk's office. 17. Mr. Miller was very clear about these late ballots and that the instructions were coming from the Wayne County Clerk's office. 18. I was surprised and disappointed at the preponderance of dishonesty, irregularities, and fraudulent tactics at the November 3, 2020 election at the TCF Center. 19. The above information is true to the best of my information, knowledge, and belief Complete filings here: courtlistener.com Keep in mind that in the 2016 MI recount various bizarre and suspicious anomalies were found - no least of which voting scanning machines at 248 of the city’s 662 precincts — 37 percent — tabulated more ballots than the number of actual voters counted in the poll books source

Submitted by Blue Republic on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 1:05pm

More here on the actual incident the observer

@edg

is reporting on in the affidavit:

Gateway Pundit

Submitted by edg on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 2:06pm

Sure, except...

@Blue Republic

Every state uses 1/1/1900 as a placeholder date until the correct date is obtained. So what you're saying is that every vote for Trump in Red states and Blue that ever had that placeholder should also be disqualified. Cool!! I'm sure Biden would agree to that.

Submitted by Marie on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 12:06pm

If there were anomalies

@Blue Republic found in the aborted MI 2016 recount, why did Trump file legal objections to a hand recount in both state and federal courts?

Only WI performed a recount in 2016 and the original counts prevailed.

Not interested in your other Trump promulgated gobbledygook.

#1.1.1.1 After every close presidential election, there are swarms from the losing side making the same old claims but with the exception of FL 2000, they never have any proof of exactly where and how. No, never. Except, well... From affidavit of Robert Cushing included in 11.11 filing against Wayne Co., MI election officials: 3. During my observations of the normal processing of ballots on November 4th between about 7:45 a.m. and 8:30 a.m. I was substantially obstructed from performing my challenger duties of observing and making notes at Board Number 31. The persons involved either directly or indirectly involved: 1. A worker named Joe, 2. A supervisor named Miss Browner, 3.an unknown person with no credentials, 4. a Democratic Challenger with credentials and one of the AVCB leaders named David Nathan. 4. On Wednesday, November 4, 2020, Detroit election officials told us that they were going to process military ballots last. I did my best to try to observe the processing/duplication of the military ballots. 5. On November 4, 2020, I was surprised to see numerous new boxes of ballots arrive at the TCF Center in the evening. I first noticed these boxes in the distribution area after many of the military ballots had been distributed and processed. I estimate these boxes contained several thousand new ballots when they appeared. 6. The main list of persons who had registered to vote on or before November 1, 2020, was listed on an electronic poll book, often referred to as the QVF. As I understand it, the Supplemental Sheets were the lists of persons who had registered to vote on November 2, 2020 or November 3, 2020. 7. I observed that none of the names on these new ballots were on the QVF or the Supplemental Sheets. 8. I saw the computer operators at several counting boards manually adding the names and addresses of these thousands of ballots to the QVF system. 9. When I asked what the possible justification was to counting ballots from unknown, unverified “persons,” I was told by election supervisors that the Wayne County Clerk’s Office had “checked them out.” 10. I challenged not one ballot, but the entire process as the names were not in the QVF or Supplemental Sheets and because the DOB’s were all wrong, all being marked as 01-01-1900. 11. An Election Supervisor near board number #86 advised me to go to the podium of election officials and ask one of them to help me. I did, and I enlisted the help of one of the leaders, a young man named Anthony Miller. 12. Mr. Miller walked me back to board number #86 and asked what I wanted the challenge to say. I said that I did not want to challenge just one ballot, but the entire process, as I was witnessing several thousand ballots inputted illegally. 13. Mr. Miller advised the computer operator what to type in as a challenge so that it was part of the Official Record in the Poll Book for Board Number #86. 14. I challenged the authority and the authenticity of all of these ballots that were being processed late with absolutely no accompanying documentation, no corresponding name in the QVF, and no corresponding name in the Supplemental List. 15. Every ballot was being fraudulently and manually entered into the Electronic Poll Book (QVF), as having been born on January 1, 1900. This "last" batch of ballots was processed in the 8:00 p.m. to 10:00 p.m. time frame. 16. When I asked about this impossibility of each ballot having the same birthday occurring in 1900, I was told that was the instruction that came down from the Wayne County Clerk's office. 17. Mr. Miller was very clear about these late ballots and that the instructions were coming from the Wayne County Clerk's office. 18. I was surprised and disappointed at the preponderance of dishonesty, irregularities, and fraudulent tactics at the November 3, 2020 election at the TCF Center. 19. The above information is true to the best of my information, knowledge, and belief Complete filings here: courtlistener.com Keep in mind that in the 2016 MI recount various bizarre and suspicious anomalies were found - no least of which voting scanning machines at 248 of the city’s 662 precincts — 37 percent — tabulated more ballots than the number of actual voters counted in the poll books source

Submitted by Blue Republic on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 12:42pm

You weren't interested

@Marie

in my "gobbledygook" about Trump's increased support from AA, Latino and Asian voters, either.

Anyone ever tell you it's considered a mark of maturity to admit when you're wrong about something?

This ring a bell?

If Minnesota is solid...
and hasn't gone Republican since, what, 1972... then why would Biden
have put it on his schedule?

Also, you seem to dislike Rasmussen, but in their daily tracking of likely black voters they have Trump at 31%. OK, they could be wrong. BUT - even if they are over-rating Trump support there by half - that would still leave Trump at 15%, nearly double what he got in 2016 and the highest by a Republican since 1976.

Matt Towery, who has decades of polling experience said, speaking of Pennsylvania that

“Trump also continues to hold about 14% of the African American vote in this survey. In twenty years of polling, and as one who has polled Pennsylvania many times, I have never seen a Republican candidate consistently hold these type of numbers among black voters this close to an election. And this appears to be a developing trend in numerous states.”

source

So, we'll find out soon enough, but is there any way Biden wins if Trump ends up with 14-15% of the AA vote? (I'm pretty sure we can agree Biden is toast at anything higher than that.)

Forget about all the rappers endorsing Trump - what about people like *this*?

Straight outta Flint:

(video of Flint, MI Democrat City Councillor Maurice Davis 10/28/20 speech at Flint, Michigan Trump Rally)

1 user has voted.
edit reply

Submitted by Marie on Sat, 10/31/2020 - 1:34am
Can we agree that Trump loses if
his white vote drops to 54%?

Since I haven't been talking about the national popular vote, slight ups and downs in id groups may or may not be relevant as to who wins.

Surely you're not serious when you postulate that AA voters are going to save Trump's ass. If you are serious, you're not even grasping at straws.

0 users have voted.
reply

Submitted by Blue Republic on Sat, 10/31/2020 - 10:38pm
AA voters and...
@Marie

"Can we agree that Trump loses if
his white vote drops to 54%?"

Well, no. Using the numbers from 2016

source

it seems that vote totals were (slightly rounded):

White - 101 million
Hispanic - 12.7 million
Black - 16.4 million
Asian - 4.9 million

Dropping Trump's white vote from the 58% he got to your 54% takes away 4,040,000
from his total.

Doubling his AA support from 8 to 16% only offsets 130,000 of those votes and still leaves
him 3,910,000 down.

However 23% support from Asian and Hispanic voters would more than make that up.
(H+A = 17.6 million x .23 = 4.05 million)

Of course Trump could get the same PV totals and lose if the distribution was wrong. But I contend that 15% AA and 25% Asian and Hispanic are not unrealistic numbers for Trump at all.

So, as to

"Surely you're not serious when you postulate that AA voters are going to save Trump's ass. If you are serious, you're not even grasping at straws."

Not AA alone. AA plus Hispanic plus 'other' - particularly Asian. That's if his ass even requires saving...

IMHO - higher than Dems seem to be anticipating support from the Hispanic, Asian and AA demographic may well end up providing Trump with the margin he needs.

(Link to Pompano Beach, FL Vietnamese-Americans for Trump Rally video)

0 users have voted.
edit reply

Submitted by edg on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 2:15pm

Trump increased his black votes by 2%.

@Blue Republic

He went from 6% AA support in 2016 to 8% AA support in 2020 according to exit polls. While a nice increase and a testament to his outreach to AAs, a 2% rise is hardly earth-shattering and proves Rasmussen's 31% claim was full of shit.

#1.1.1.1.2.2 in my "gobbledygook" about Trump's increased support from AA, Latino and Asian voters, either. Anyone ever tell you it's considered a mark of maturity to admit when you're wrong about something? This ring a bell? If Minnesota is solid... and hasn't gone Republican since, what, 1972... then why would Biden have put it on his schedule? Also, you seem to dislike Rasmussen, but in their daily tracking of likely black voters they have Trump at 31%. OK, they could be wrong. BUT - even if they are over-rating Trump support there by half - that would still leave Trump at 15%, nearly double what he got in 2016 and the highest by a Republican since 1976. Matt Towery, who has decades of polling experience said, speaking of Pennsylvania that “Trump also continues to hold about 14% of the African American vote in this survey. In twenty years of polling, and as one who has polled Pennsylvania many times, I have never seen a Republican candidate consistently hold these type of numbers among black voters this close to an election. And this appears to be a developing trend in numerous states.” source So, we'll find out soon enough, but is there any way Biden wins if Trump ends up with 14-15% of the AA vote? (I'm pretty sure we can agree Biden is toast at anything higher than that.) Forget about all the rappers endorsing Trump - what about people like *this*? Straight outta Flint: (video of Flint, MI Democrat City Councillor Maurice Davis 10/28/20 speech at Flint, Michigan Trump Rally) 1 user has voted. edit reply Submitted by Marie on Sat, 10/31/2020 - 1:34am Can we agree that Trump loses if his white vote drops to 54%? Since I haven't been talking about the national popular vote, slight ups and downs in id groups may or may not be relevant as to who wins. Surely you're not serious when you postulate that AA voters are going to save Trump's ass. If you are serious, you're not even grasping at straws. 0 users have voted. reply Submitted by Blue Republic on Sat, 10/31/2020 - 10:38pm AA voters and... @Marie "Can we agree that Trump loses if his white vote drops to 54%?" Well, no. Using the numbers from 2016 source it seems that vote totals were (slightly rounded): White - 101 million Hispanic - 12.7 million Black - 16.4 million Asian - 4.9 million Dropping Trump's white vote from the 58% he got to your 54% takes away 4,040,000 from his total. Doubling his AA support from 8 to 16% only offsets 130,000 of those votes and still leaves him 3,910,000 down. However 23% support from Asian and Hispanic voters would more than make that up. (H+A = 17.6 million x .23 = 4.05 million) Of course Trump could get the same PV totals and lose if the distribution was wrong. But I contend that 15% AA and 25% Asian and Hispanic are not unrealistic numbers for Trump at all. So, as to "Surely you're not serious when you postulate that AA voters are going to save Trump's ass. If you are serious, you're not even grasping at straws." Not AA alone. AA plus Hispanic plus 'other' - particularly Asian. That's if his ass even requires saving... IMHO - higher than Dems seem to be anticipating support from the Hispanic, Asian and AA demographic may well end up providing Trump with the margin he needs. (Link to Pompano Beach, FL Vietnamese-Americans for Trump Rally video) 0 users have voted. edit reply

Submitted by The Voice In th... on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 2:59pm

(8-6)6 = .33333....

@edg
That's how they are calculating 31%. He got 31% more AA votes than last time.

In 2008, Obama got some number like 96% of the black vote (97, something like that).
I asked my friend, a black shop steward interested in politics, "Wjhat happened? did 4% mark the wrong box?" He told me, "Many older black voters vote Republican because of Lincoln and Democrats supporting Jim crow in the South. I talk to them, but their minds are made up. Democrats, Jim Crow, Republicans, Abolition.".

—

I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.

Submitted by edg on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 3:09pm

That's what I thought at first.

@The Voice In the Wilderness

I even originally titled my comment "Trump increased his black voter support by 33%". But then I went back and re-read what the comment stated:

in their daily tracking of likely black voters they have Trump at 31%. OK, they could be wrong. BUT - even if they are over-rating Trump support there by half - that would still leave Trump at 15%, nearly double what he got in 2016

It is referring to raw percentages, not percentage increase. Here's the original Rasmussen Tweet that number came from:

Oct 29, 2020 - Morning Reader Data Points:

"If the presidential election was held today, would you vote for Donald Trump or Joe Biden?"

National Daily Black Likely Voter % For @POTUS - October 26-29, 2020

Mon 10/26 - 27%
Tue 10/27 - 30%
Wed 10/28 - 30%
Thu 10/29 - 31%

— Rasmussen Reports (@Rasmussen_Poll) October 29, 2020

Submitted by The Voice In th... on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 5:20pm

Who are their black "likely voters"?

@edg
Black businessmen? i.e. Black republicans?

Thanks for the clarification, BTW. It's hard to keep track moving around the page, especially since my browser keeps jumping around. Something is loading slow. I don't have the ad blocker turned on here, is that it?
OTOH, when I scroll back I see a lot of smart phone images. On "the Evening blues" there always is a big lag and a jump, sometimes several jumps, before the music links fill in.

—

I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.

Submitted by bondibox on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 4:29pm

I disagree

@Marie There was a pretty good forensic footprint showing how Ohio flipped votes for Bush in 2004. Not to mention the CEO of Diebold voting who vowed to "deliver Ohio for Bush".

—

“He may not have gotten the words out but the thoughts were great.”

Submitted by Marie on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 6:05pm

Maybe, maybe not.

@bondibox Unfortunately, a "forensic footprint" isn't actionable.

My take - and why I avoided all the claims of 2004 OH vote flipping, etc. - was

1) GWB won OH by 3.5% in 2000. That's on the high side for reasonable assessment to flip the state (county, city) in the next election. My on the ground OH staunch Democratic source told me that Gore's team concluded the the situation was viewed as hopeless and therefore, they shifted OH resources to FL. My source viewed that as a dumb move.

2) The OH SoS was seen to be actively engaged in purging voter rolls for the 2004 election. OTOH, voter turnout was so low in 2000 that figuring out how many voters to disenfranchise was a difficult task. However, I doubted the Kerry -- who had no natural affinity for OH voters - wouldn't be able to beat the spread.

3) If all the SoS needed to do was flip a switch, there wouldn't have been a need to suppress voting by under-resourced polls that led to very long lines and wait times. That undoubtedly cost Kerry a significant number of votes.

Voter turnout was strong for both parties that year and completely in-line with turnout and voting in other states in 2004 and also consistent with subsequent OH turnout and voting patterns.

My considered opinion is that based on the votes cast, Kerry lost OH. Doesn't mean I'm right, but the alternative can't be proven and therefore, it's a debate that I try to avoid.

Submitted by snoopydawg on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 12:30am

Escobar thinks it’s a color revolution

This mentions the TIP I do above. Lots of info on the net about them.

First Comes A Rolling Civil War

The massive psyops is ongoing. Everyone familiar with the Transition Integrity Project (TIP) knew how this would imperatively play out. I chose to frame it as a think tank gaming exercise in my Banana Follies column. This is a live exercise. Yet no one knows exactly how it will end.

US intel is very much aware of well-documented instances of election fraud. Among them: NSA software that infiltrates any network, as previously detailed by Edward Snowden, and capable of altering vote counts; the Hammer supercomputer and its Scorecard app that hacks computers at the transfer points of state election computer systems and outside third party election data vaults; the Dominion software system, known to have serious security issues since 2000, but still used in 30 states, including every swing state; those by now famous vertical jumps to Biden in both Michigan and Wisconsin at 4am on November 4 (AFP unconvincingly tried to debunk Wisconsin and didn’t even try with Michigan); multiple instances of Dead Men Do Vote.

This information was leaked about a month ago so everyone knew about it and that dems would use it. Now if you have planned on overthrowing the US president would you really advertise it? Of course not. So why did they?

But Barr is a criminal and he wants to help Trump win. (Said in the whiniest voice ever) What did he do? He told attorneys that if they see evidence of fraud then they could investigate it. Of noes! Anyway color me confused. It’s too bad that I can’t eat popcorn....sigh.

—

Was Humpty Dumpty pushed?

Submitted by edg on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 8:19pm

Pablo Escobar? I thought he was dead.

@snoopydawg

those by now famous vertical jumps to Biden in both Michigan and Wisconsin at 4am on November 4 (AFP unconvincingly tried to debunk Wisconsin and didn’t even try with Michigan); multiple instances of Dead Men Do Vote

The entire first clause has been thoroughly debunked. There were no mysterious, unexplained jumps except those in the synapses of the conspiracy theorists. Election counts have ALWAYS jumped. Edison Research feeds the data they collect nationwide to the networks. Sometimes an election jurisdiction releases a batch of votes after a few hour pause. Sometimes the jump is for the Republican. Sometimes it's for the Democrat. If you doubt this, just think about how Trump amassed a large early lead. That happens because a batch of ballots that favored him was reported. When the next batch favored Biden, that was reported. It's how things work. IT'S NOT REAL TIME!!!!!!

The second clause is equally specious. Ballots are automatically checked against state and Federal death indexes. Votes from dead people are invalidated. The only way a dead person can cast a vote nowadays is if there death was so close to the election that it hadn't been recorded yet. That occurs so infrequently as to be meaningless to the results of an election.

Why am I so sure about this? Because I've spent 45 years in the technology industry. I've built computers. I've written software. I know how this stuff works, and it doesn't work the way the conspiracy theorists posit.

Submitted by Marie on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 8:38pm

Thanks again.

@edg It's as if those claiming something mysterious about the reporting of election returns have never observed election night (and morning) reporting. I did get a kick out of the early 2020 reports in Kansas and iirc Oklahoma that had Biden in the lead and therefore, the electoral maps were were shaded a light blue. Of course only an idiot would claim that those returns suggested that Biden had any chance in either state.

Submitted by snoopydawg on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 9:37pm

I’m not claiming anything

@Marie

I’m questioning the narrative we’ve been spoon fed by many players.

(Didn't know there were so many closet Trumpsters here.)

You still don’t. Just because I hate democrats doesn’t mean I support Trump. But if I did so what? This isn’t a partisan blog.

—

Was Humpty Dumpty pushed?

Submitted by Marie on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 12:43am

What narrative are you referring to?

@snoopydawg If you mean that Trump lost the election, that's not a narrative. It's based on reported counted vote totals. Same standard used in all elections. Dig into the numbers. There's nothing odd or mysterious in any of them other than Miami-Dade.

Two pathetic choices -- in 2012 voters slightly hated HRC more than Trump and this time voters slightly hated Trump more than Biden. Other than Miami-Dade there were no large vote margin swings anywhere.

Submitted by Blue Republic on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 12:21pm

au contraire

@Marie

If you mean that Trump lost the election, that's not a narrative. It's based on reported counted vote totals. Same standard used in all elections.

The standard for winning a US Presidential election is achieving a majority of electors in the Electoral College or if that is inconclusive, the House of Representatives.

More specifically, a majority of those electors participating, which can only occur if the state issues a Certificate of Ascertainment naming the state's electors and stating that they are the appropriate electors based on the certified results of the election *and* if Congress accepts the certificate.

In many states legislatures have to approve certification and in all (AFAIK) both the SOS and governor have to sign off on it. If any of those things do not happen a state would not be able to have electors participate in the EC vote. And if no candidate gets a majority in the EC it goes to the House, with one vote per state.

Submitted by edg on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 2:19pm

WTF?

@Blue Republic

Donald Trump wasn't certified in Oregon until December 3, 2016. Yet he claimed the win 29 minutes after the last poll closed on November 8th. I'm not sure what you thought your comment proved, but it failed miserably at proving anything.

Submitted by CS in AZ on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 3:02pm

The Evil Media called the 2016 election for Trump

@edg

Within hours of the polls closing.

BREAKING: Donald Trump is elected president of the United States. pic.twitter.com/yJpgfsAbc6

— The Associated Press (@AP) November 9, 2016

It's funny how this long standing tradition was totally fine, right up until Trump lost. Heh, hypocrisy on parade.

Submitted by Blue Republic on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 9:19pm

Oh, come on

@edg

Marie said that the election outcome was determined by reported vote totals.

But, of course, it is not. It is determined by by majority vote (of participating electors) in the Electoral College - and there are important steps which have to be taken at the state level before a state's electors can even participate in the EC vote:

- The state SOS has to certify the election; who the winner is and that the vote was duly canvassed

- (in most states) the state legislature has to affirm the SOS's certification and

- *both* the governor and SOS have to sign off on the Certificate of Ascertainment which is the official document submitted to the House that says the election has been certified and identifies who the state's electors are.

Normally, these are pro forma, rubber stamp matters, but that doesn't mean they will be this time. For example, a governor's refusal to sign off on the SOS's certification could result in that state fielding no electors.

Fact check on state legislature right to determine electors here (USA Today 11/10)

Far as I can tell, the Constitution makes no mention of 'CNN projections' or 'reported vote totals'.

Submitted by CS in AZ on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 10:17pm

Have you noticed how they keep finding more mystery votes for

@edg

Trump here in AZ? I'm following 538.com's election count and they still have not called Arizona for Biden due to the number of votes still to be counted. Every time they drop a new report, Trump closes the gap a little bit more. It won't be enough, but his count is going up daily! Where are these mystery votes for Trump coming from, the sky?

Don't talk to me about provisional ballots and absentee and military ballots being counted still. Clearly someone is manufacturing Trump votes from right out of nowhere. You have to admit, this is very, very suspicious, no?

Submitted by Marie on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 11:53pm

What I can telll you --

@CS in AZ -- based on my sloppy tracking -- that as of late last Thursday, the total AZ counted ballots were 2,908M, and Maricopa county total 1,848M. Prior to the Thursday close, the Maricopa Co clerk said that they had another 300M ballots to count.

Thursday - Maricopa only (without Hawkins or anyone else)
Biden: 994M (53.8%)
Trump: 880M (47.6%)
Jorgensen: 24M

Saturday:
Biden: 1,024M (50.5%)
Trump: 977M (48.1%)
Jorgenson: 31M
total 2,032M

Monday:
Biden: 1,027M (50.3%)
Trump: 980M (48.1%)
Jorgensen: 31M
total: 2,038

Wednesday:
Biden: 1,038M (50%)
Trump: 994M (48.2%)
Jogensen: 32M
total 2,064M

AZ total: 3,366M

Doesn't look as if ballots have been found -- still within the MC clerk's estimate of remaining ballots. It's not particularly off for a batch of ballots to somewhat more heavily favor one candidate than the previously counted ballots. Although I didn't note anything similar in the other AZ counties. Doubt that there's another net 12M votes for Trump.

Expect Trump lawyers to file suit for a recount, but odds aren't good that they'll get an order for a recount.

Submitted by edg on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 11:40am

CS was being facetious. n/t

@Marie

Submitted by edg on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 11:43am

Dang cheaters!!

@CS in AZ

You should write an affidavit. An affidavit is the current standard of irrefutable proof. Here's mine:

1. Republicans lie and cheat.
2. The above information is true to the best of my information, knowledge, and belief.

Signed: EdG

Submitted by CS in AZ on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 11:51am

Good idea, but I'm going with a Post-It note

@edg

In which I have carefully documented the situation and addressed it directly to Donnie himself:

Post It for Donnie.jpeg

Submitted by Blue Republic on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 12:31pm

Well, if you are that knowledgeable about this stuff

@edg

Then I don't suppose you'd mind pointing out the flaws in these people's
analysis:

[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ztu5Y5obWPk&feature=emb_logo]

Submitted by edg on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 2:26pm

Sheesh!!

@Blue Republic

Why are these conspiracy theorists always so long-winded. I can't spend 2 hours watching those. If you can give me the 30 second elevator summary or a text transcript, I'd appreciate it.

Submitted by Blue Republic on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 10:41pm

Executive summaries

@edg @edg

Fair enough request.

The "Fractions Magic" doc is from four years ago and deals with an analysis of the capabilities of the GEMS software that is (as I understand it) utilized by all the major voting system vendors (descended from Diebold circa 2000, IIUC).

The video itself is a bit scattered but this Youtube commenter sums it up this way:

For those not wanting to sit through something that could have been explained in a matter of minutes... it's simple:

These machines which supposedly are only to count contain programs that allow you to create the result you want, rather than simply count votes and there's no reason for them to even have such capability whatsoever other than fraud. People who are in command of them know this and are doing what they can to hide it.

You're welcome.

Bennie Smith, the programmer who discovered the above is also a participant with Dr. Shiva in the very recent video which analyzed the vote in four MI counties looking at the deviation of individual votes for Trump or Biden from straight ticket Republican votes (one axis) second axis showing precincts ranked by the degree to which they were predominantly D or R in registered voters.

Three of the counties showed an only a slight variation in votes for Trump that were straight ticket votes and those that were individual votes in heavily Democratic precincts, but an increasing deviation between the two in favor of Biden in precincts that were higher percentage Republican. Wayne County - the largest - showed no such pattern, but in the other three counties the curves were near-identical.

Dr. Shiva MI vote analysis result.jpg

FWIW - 'Conspiracy Theorist' Shiva Ayaddutai holds several advanced degrees from MIT. He is from a very low-caste Indian background and would likely be shovelling shit or plowing behind a bullock if still in India - try telling someone like that that America was never great...

Look forward to your take on this - the first 13 or so minutes of the vid is intros and background info - main discussion of their methodology and the data is between there and 45 minutes or thereabouts - balance is answering questions from livestream audience.

Executive summary:

Dr. Shiva MI executive summary.png

(EDIT)

Oh, there is also this:

https://noqreport.com/2020/11/12/it-expert-finds-multitude-of-flaws-in-dominion-voting-systems-solutions-allowing-easy-manipulation-of-vote-tallies/

Submitted by edg on Fri, 11/13/2020 - 12:57pm

Haven't examined in detail yet, but my initial thoughts...

@Blue Republic

1. I've been in the technology industry for 45 years. I've written hundreds of computer programs. I've built computers. I've repaired mainframe computers.

2. I've worked with hundreds of Republican software and hardware technologists.

3. These voting systems are in widespread use in Red States.

4. Red State IT departments employ many thousands of Republican IT workers and supervisors.

5. The chance that all of those IT workers in multiple states would miss major hardware and software flaws that jeopardize the vote is near nil.

6. Even if there were such flaws, a person wishing to exploit them would need unsupervised access to the voting machines. They'd need the machine code for the EPROMs and an EPROM coder. They'd need the source code to the software, the ability to compile modifications, and the supervisory access necessary to override executable file access restrictions inside the voting machine.

#2.1.3.1 #2.1.3.1 Fair enough request. The "Fractions Magic" doc is from four years ago and deals with an analysis of the capabilities of the GEMS software that is (as I understand it) utilized by all the major voting system vendors (descended from Diebold circa 2000, IIUC). The video itself is a bit scattered but this Youtube commenter sums it up this way: For those not wanting to sit through something that could have been explained in a matter of minutes... it's simple: These machines which supposedly are only to count contain programs that allow you to create the result you want, rather than simply count votes and there's no reason for them to even have such capability whatsoever other than fraud. People who are in command of them know this and are doing what they can to hide it. You're welcome. Bennie Smith, the programmer who discovered the above is also a participant with Dr. Shiva in the very recent video which analyzed the vote in four MI counties looking at the deviation of individual votes for Trump or Biden from straight ticket Republican votes (one axis) second axis showing precincts ranked by the degree to which they were predominantly D or R in registered voters. Three of the counties showed an only a slight variation in votes for Trump that were straight ticket votes and those that were individual votes in heavily Democratic precincts, but an increasing deviation between the two in favor of Biden in precincts that were higher percentage Republican. Wayne County - the largest - showed no such pattern, but in the other three counties the curves were near-identical. FWIW - 'Conspiracy Theorist' Shiva Ayaddutai holds several advanced degrees from MIT. He is from a very low-caste Indian background and would likely be shovelling shit or plowing behind a bullock if still in India - try telling someone like that that America was never great... Look forward to your take on this - the first 13 or so minutes of the vid is intros and background info - main discussion of their methodology and the data is between there and 45 minutes or thereabouts - balance is answering questions from livestream audience. Executive summary: (EDIT) Oh, there is also this: https://noqreport.com/2020/11/12/it-expert-finds-multitude-of-flaws-in-dominion-voting-systems-solutions-allowing-easy-manipulation-of-vote-tallies/

Submitted by Blue Republic on Sat, 11/14/2020 - 9:48am

Tejas

@edg

2. I've worked with hundreds of Republican software and hardware technologists.

3. These voting systems are in widespread use in Red States.

4. Red State IT departments employ many thousands of Republican IT workers and supervisors.

5. The chance that all of those IT workers in multiple states would miss major hardware and software flaws that jeopardize the vote is near nil.

In Texas they did not miss the flaws, they detected them and refused to authorize the use of Dominion's products - three times since 2012 - Ken Paxton, Texas Attorney General discusses why here

Of course, not all jurisdictions are going to regard the ability to readily manipulate outcomes as a flaw but rather a *feature*.

Submitted by edg on Sat, 11/14/2020 - 4:00pm

Which jurisdictions is that?

@Blue Republic

Arizona, Georgia, Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin all have Republican legislatures. Under the US Constitution, state legislatures make the election rules. Do you seriously believe that the legislatures in those states conspired to arrange Joe Biden's win?

Submitted by edg on Fri, 11/13/2020 - 1:33pm

My Personal Opinion

@Blue Republic

In my view, the best voting method would use a telephone interface. Each voter would register their smartphone or landline number and establish security codes such as passwords, PINs, and/or fingerprints. To vote, voters would dial-in to their local precinct and receive a callback (to prevent spoofing) session, which would require entry of their security credentials prior to voting. Some of the hardware would be installed and maintained by telcos at their facilities -- switches and routers, etc. -- while voting servers would be installed and maintained at election authorities. Voters would be immediately emailed a copy of their ballot entries upon completion of voting. That's just a rough outline of course, but it would be a vast improvement over current systems. Who uses similar systems? The IRS. State governments. Banks. Insurance companies. And others. We need a national election system for national elections. Having 12,500 separate jurisdictions implementing their own systems and policies has proved suboptimal.

#2.1.3.1 #2.1.3.1 Fair enough request. The "Fractions Magic" doc is from four years ago and deals with an analysis of the capabilities of the GEMS software that is (as I understand it) utilized by all the major voting system vendors (descended from Diebold circa 2000, IIUC). The video itself is a bit scattered but this Youtube commenter sums it up this way: For those not wanting to sit through something that could have been explained in a matter of minutes... it's simple: These machines which supposedly are only to count contain programs that allow you to create the result you want, rather than simply count votes and there's no reason for them to even have such capability whatsoever other than fraud. People who are in command of them know this and are doing what they can to hide it. You're welcome. Bennie Smith, the programmer who discovered the above is also a participant with Dr. Shiva in the very recent video which analyzed the vote in four MI counties looking at the deviation of individual votes for Trump or Biden from straight ticket Republican votes (one axis) second axis showing precincts ranked by the degree to which they were predominantly D or R in registered voters. Three of the counties showed an only a slight variation in votes for Trump that were straight ticket votes and those that were individual votes in heavily Democratic precincts, but an increasing deviation between the two in favor of Biden in precincts that were higher percentage Republican. Wayne County - the largest - showed no such pattern, but in the other three counties the curves were near-identical. FWIW - 'Conspiracy Theorist' Shiva Ayaddutai holds several advanced degrees from MIT. He is from a very low-caste Indian background and would likely be shovelling shit or plowing behind a bullock if still in India - try telling someone like that that America was never great... Look forward to your take on this - the first 13 or so minutes of the vid is intros and background info - main discussion of their methodology and the data is between there and 45 minutes or thereabouts - balance is answering questions from livestream audience. Executive summary: (EDIT) Oh, there is also this: https://noqreport.com/2020/11/12/it-expert-finds-multitude-of-flaws-in-dominion-voting-systems-solutions-allowing-easy-manipulation-of-vote-tallies/

Submitted by Blue Republic on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 11:56am

Darren Beattie on the Color Revolution scenario

@snoopydawg

Lots more at revolver.news

Submitted by edg on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 2:29pm

OMG!!

@Blue Republic

Trump is trying to oust Trump!! Or is it their claim that he's not supportive of or behind the Juan Guaidó coup attempt in Venezuela? Not behind the Bolivian coup? Not behind the Iranian regime change policy? Doesn't support overthrow of Assad in Syria? And on and on and on and ....

Submitted by Blue Republic on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 10:30pm

Calling what we've had the last four years

@edg

the 'Trump DOJ' 'Trump CIA' as if he actually had effective control of them is ludicrous.

The situation is more akin to the Carter and the CIA or the Kennedy's and Hoover's FBI - in neither case did the president have effective control of the agencies.

Win or lose, I hope Trump fires Wray and Haspel and goes full scorched earth on the Deep State.

Brennan sounds a bit nervous.

Submitted by Raggedy Ann on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 7:59am

The fix is in

for Biden and has been. They were going to oust Herr Drumpf any way possible. The media is playing their role by cutting away from anything he says - why? because they are not afraid of him anymore. Biden will be placed in office - orchestrated by the oligarchs. We're watching it with a front row seat. If you think anything other than that, you're not getting that we are not a democracy. This is exactly why I didn't vote. It wouldn't have mattered - they put in who they want. Period.

—

"The “jumpers” reminded us that one day we will all face only one choice and that is how we will die, not how we will live." Chris Hedges on 9/11

Submitted by edg on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 8:28pm

I disagree.

@Raggedy Ann

There's no rational reason for replacing Trump. He's bulked up the military and black budgets, which pleases the Pentagon and CIA. He's taken deficit spending to a new high, which makes the banksters and moneylenders ecstatic. He's enriched the oligarchs through tax cuts and, until recently, a decently robust economy. He's further enriched the oligarchs and industrialists through deregulation. He's enriched the oligarchs even more by not going after tech monopolies (something Biden might do). And he's almost single-handedly reignited the Cold War, and this time its against China as well as Russia; that enriches the MIC and oligarchs to an almost unbelievable level.

I'd be interested in hearing your solid case as to why TPTB would want Trump replaced and Biden installed. I fail to see how it benefits them in any material way.

Submitted by out of left field on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 10:49pm

I disagree back

@edg TPTB maintain control by feeding us narratives about what reality is like. Trump, with his constant shifts and willingness to contradict himself from day to day was not an effective narrative controller. He kept blundering around and exposing the nature of how we are ruled. TPTB don't want that--the consequences are unpredictable, and may not be favorable to them in the long run. So a substantial portion of our rulers decided that Trump had to go, for someone more adept at playing the game in a convincing looking way.

Submitted by snoopydawg on Wed, 11/11/2020 - 10:58pm

Yep

@out of left field

They not only got everything they wanted from Trump, but he further divided the country for them to play with and adjust themselves. I think it’s important to watch what the narrative is and try to figure out what they’re doing. Caitlin got me aware of focusing on the narrative over the actions.

—

Was Humpty Dumpty pushed?

Submitted by edg on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 11:47am

I disagree with your disagreement.

@out of left field

Trump is a useful buffoon. The oligarchs are like the Wizard of Oz: "Ignore the man behind the curtain!! Look over there!! Trump tweeted something!!" And the slobbering masses focus on the buffoon's latest tweet while the oligarchs steal more of our money.

Submitted by Marie on Thu, 11/12/2020 - 1:22am

That's not a fix.

@Raggedy Ann That's merely a preference among MSM reporters for one candidate over the other. Generally based on nothing more than personality. Happens in every presidential election. They build up the one they like and trash the one they don't like. They can be fickle. And can switch from their darling in the primaries. ie. in 2000 they loved McCain, but were cool with GWB when McCain lost and didn't like McCain at all in 2008.

Sometimes it works - 2008 and 2012 and sometimes it doesn't -- 2000 (the real winner) and 2016.

A "fix" is what was done in FL 2000. Purge 200,000 minority voters from the voting registrations, "granny farming," police preventing minority voters from getting to the polls, and falsifying the vote totals in one county and not performing the automatic recount in that county. That last point is why they were desperate not to have a full recount because they knew they couldn't prevail.