This is why I can't trust Warren
I want to like Elizabeth Warren. I really do. But I can't.
Not when I read stuff like this.
At this point in Warren’s campaign, it’s not a surprise anymore when she spends hours working a “selfie line” after a major event, as she did following two massive rallies she’s held in the past week. But it was a surprise when more than 150 of the Democratic Party’s biggest donors similarly lined up on Thursday night after her speech at a dinner here—and it struck even some of the Democrats waiting to take photos with her.
“These are people who should not like her,” said one attendee, who spoke to me on the condition of anonymity to avoid showing favoritism. “And they love her.”
The next day, at the summer meeting of the Democratic National Committee, party members were on their feet cheering when she took the stage for a brief address...
But it was the Massachusetts senator who got a standing ovation before she’d even said a word, and another as soon as she’d finished speaking.
How could anyone, who isn't already wealthy, trust a candidate that is beloved by big donors?
Warren is trying to run a campaign in a very narrow window. She's trying to be progressive, but not too progressive. This strategy has risks.
However, a few of the Democrats I spoke with noted that her positioning could become a trap: With Sanders and Warren expected to battle even more intensely in the coming months, the change-hungry part of the Democratic base might begin to ask why establishment insiders seem so comfortable with her.
Exactly. Anyone who wants to shake up the system should be asking that question.
And boy, do people want to shake up the system.
According to a new NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll released on Sunday, Americans are just as angry with the nation’s political and financial establishment as they were before Trump was elected.Seventy percent of Americans told pollsters that they feel angry “because our political system seems to only be working for the insiders with money and power, like those on Wall Street or in Washington.”
That number overall has barely budged since October 2015.
That's bad news for Biden and Trump, but good news for Bernie.
Which brings me to article number two.
Her point was easy to grasp: While her liberal agenda may be further left than some in the Democratic establishment would prefer, she is a team player who is seeking to lead the party — not stage a hostile takeover of it.
...
Ms. Warren’s wooing could prove important should the nominating contest deadlock at the Democratic National Convention next summer: Many of the officials she is courting are so-called superdelegates, who are able to cast a binding vote should the primary go beyond a first ballot.
I have to give Warren credit for turning her campaign around after it stumbled out of the gate. She's savvy and deserves respect, but are we still looking at incrementalism and protecting the status quo?
As for those superdelegates, I don't believe that they will be a factor. Why? Because Biden didn't show up, and that speaks louder than anything else.
Skipping a gathering like the DNC annual meeting would have been surprising in years past. Biden, however, can afford to pass it up in part because of the diminished role of party insiders in the nominating process...
But after the super delegates overwhelmingly supported establishment candidate Hillary Clinton in 2016, her primary opponent, Senator Bernie Sanders, complained that their role subverted the will of voters. So the party modified its rules to give super delegates a vote only on a potential second ballot.
Comments
She’s the candidate of the 10%
Who want to stick it to the 1%. (At least until they become the 1%.) The problem is, that doesn’t change things for the rest of us but works out pretty well for the donor class.
Idolizing a politician is like believing the stripper really likes you.
Well put
IOW, more meritocracy.
More job training for jobs that don't exist.
More college for already saturated job markets.
More leveling of the playing field for people that are born on 1st and 2nd base, not just those born on third base (f*ck those born in the dugout).
I think only
Andrew Yang has made the bold, honest, truthful observations about the job market undergoing radical change and college being unjustifiably too expensive and too unnecessary for many. The rest of them don't want to question things in a systemic way, but just want to try to put lipstick on the current job and college situations.
I agree.
Whether or not he is the candidate, he holds intelligent truths and enlightened solutions. He's not so much ahead of his time as Americans are very slow to grasp reality.
____________________
The political system is what it is because the People are who they are. — Plato
Bingo!
Meritocracy is one of the hallmarks of the neoliberal philosophy. And that is what has gotten us to the hell hole where we are now.
Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
This is an excellent description
I will use this from now on when I argue with strangers online LOL
Agree with this 100%
I also think her moment of greatest impact has passed, which for me was running in 2016. I think a lot of people in this current primary were counting on a Hillary Clinton presidency to secure themselves cushy cabinet/other leadership appointments and would have mud wrestled their own grandmothers for the chance at at a seat by the throne. Now? Hahahahahahahahahaha haven't seen her being invited on the campaign trail!
Hmm, Keep your
friends close and your potential enemies closer??
Well, FDR didn't run as a radical lefty or socialist in 1932, running a "reassuring" sensibly moderate campaign, though he did shake things up in his first term especially. I'm sure he did his fair share of wooing the party big wigs and financial big shots.
She obviously knows she needs to be aware of perceptions developing that publicly she sounds populist notes but privately she is singing to the party powerful.
FDR called himself a Liberal
He went out of his way to avoid being called progressive...
" In the beginning, the universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry, and is generally considered to have been a bad move. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy "
Does anyone call him/herself
a liberal these days? No. Not on the radar of self-descriptions. The ones wanting to move left call themselves progressives. FDR had the liberal label available to him back then, no controversy.
EW definitely is not as much to the left as progressive-socialist democrat Bernie. So if the label hadn't been tarnished and tossed away, she would fit the liberal category. One foot in the establishment-centrist wing, one foot planted with the progs.
And to add to the above: she might have thought it wise to make nice with TPTB in the party in case the convention goes to a second ballot, when superdelegates have a vote.
Oh well.
As long as she wins, all will go back to normal. This game they play is the American way. Those of us who are skeptical just need to get out and VOTE whether we like it or not, just accept the reality and move along, our betters know oh so much more than we peons do. Get on board or forever be called out as THE problem in America. Right? We don't need to like these candidates, we just need to do our part and VOTE for them anyway. And of course, this does not reflect at all the reason we are where we are today, not at all. S/?
Only a fool lets someone else tell him who his enemy is. Assata Shakur
Vote Biden: He's not going nuts
Maybe the only time in my life that I will quote Newt.
Let's not overlook Trump's campaign slogan: I am the chosen one.
Can't wait for the Biden/Trump debates.
I felt sad yesterday re: Warren
We live in a very liberal section of a very liberal town (Portland Oregon). Yesterday I was walking through the Hawthorne Blvd. Street Fair when I came upon a booth run by the Democratic Party. There was an informal poll where you'd get a sticker and you'd put it on the little sheet next to the picture of the candidate you prefer. Amy Klochubar, for example, had two stickers. Andrew Wang had about a half dozen. Tulsi Gabbard had maybe a dozen. Kamala Harris' sheet had been filled up and another placed on top of that which had been filled, and another, marked "page 3" on top of that. Bernie was on "page 4". And the killer....Warren was on "page 7".
So even in a left-leaning district she's doing well, really well. I don't want to understand why. I think it would be like coming face to face with Cthulu.
You mean like this?
We can’t save the world by playing by the rules, because the rules have to be changed.
- Greta Thunberg
Vote Giant Meteor: The only one that can stop Cthulhu
How many minorities, students and blue collar voters?
Warren has more support from college-educated white liberals, while Bernie's support is young people, people of color and poor and blue collar workers. My question then is "how many of those groups were at the Street Fair?". If the fair-goers were more highly-educated white liberals, then it would not be surprising that they favor Warren. If there are a lot of blue collar and poorer people and students then I'd be worried about Bernie.
So far Warren
has more Gene McCarthy backers (white educated middle-class) while Bernie roughly equates to RFK's support (poor, WWC, POC, less educated).
I prefer Bernie's broader base and potential for growth. But Warren showed very well at a black forum in SC a month or so back -- so, unlike Gene McCarthy, who didn't care about a broader base, do not underestimate her ability and willingness to peel away black folks and WWC from Bernie and Biden.
She's not my first or second choice, but by all appearances she is running a solid primary campaign.
what is interesting is that those were first bernie supporters
From what I remember it was white educated younger progressives who first supported Bernie in Oregon and gave his campaign a huge boost early on--huge crowds. Looks like the group is going for Warren.
Bernie's picking up Biden's declining POC vote
The new Monmouth poll indicates that
"as Joe Biden has plummeted, Bernie has gained 6 points since June — the most of any candidate in the race. Additionally, the poll shows Bernie is now the candidate with the largest amount of support from people of color. Compared to Monmouth’s June poll, Biden has dropped 14 points among people of color, while Bernie has gained 7 points among people of color — the biggest gain of any candidate."
excellent question re: types of supporters
Portland's very white.
House District 42
81.7% white
median income $56,900
65.2% more than high school
largest age group is 30-34 (15.2%)
21-39 totals 46.2%
Thanks for report
I trust these on ground reports more than the polls. I can sorta see the support for Warren. I remember seeing pictures of Obama in Portland and I thought they were photo-shopped showing what looked like a massive crowd. Warren seems to me to be closer in temperament to Obama than anybody else.
Warren IS Obama 2.0
without the charisma. But she has just enough to carry her. She is a Trojan horse who cannot commit to anything except getting elected.
Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
Warren's recent surge, in the media if not among the people,
has me wondering if she has "public positions" and "private positions" like Hillary did.
We wanted decent healthcare, a living wage and free college.
The Democrats gave us Biden and war instead.
Bank on it.
There's no question
Although I'm sure that Warren's private positions aren't nearly as horrific.
Do you suppose she'll be correcting the record ?
Twitter
We wanted decent healthcare, a living wage and free college.
The Democrats gave us Biden and war instead.
It's naive to
think even your preferred candidates and pols don't have public vs private positions, on a whole range of things.
PrefCandidate, just back from campaigning in Iowa, to the spouse back home: "Yuck, those dreadful corndogs, and all that pork eating out there."
"I am so sick of hearing from the gun nuts."
"I just get impatient with the God talk people and their invisible deity."
"Do I have to go back out there again?"
"How many more months to go until I don't have to smile all day and pretend to enjoy campaigning?"
(Edit: this was meant to be directed to Azazello above)
Pretty sure Azazello isn't naive.
[Edit: spelling].
Many, many reasons not to trust her; and,
if she is the nominee, Trump will tear her apart.
For quite some time, in my Caucus 99 Percent draft file has been a draft essay entitled (tentatively) Why I Can't Trust Elizabeth Herring Warren.
Almost since Obama set her up with the DNC to run for US Senator from Massachusetts, the Party has been positioning her for a moment like this, pretending she is very left. Big donors don't have to guess. Their friends among the Party PTB tell them what's what. It's only shlubs like us who have to worry about being fooled.
Yet. Again.
Manufacturing consent.
Warren is the mythical “better branding” the DNC is obsessed with. Heck, she may even actually care about the issues she’s talking about. (Her couldn’t even feign concern, so I’ll give Warren that much.) But her policies never meet her words. As gjohnsit points out, look at her support. That should tell you how worried they are about her disrupting the status quo.
And yeah, Warren vs. Trump would be a cringer.
Idolizing a politician is like believing the stripper really likes you.
herring
Sounds like you're rapidly arriving at an opinion more of the nature of Elizabeth Surströmming Warren....
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
Fool me once ...
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjmjqlOPd6A]
should the primary go beyond a first ballot
What are the chances that this is exactly going to happen and that is why we have so many candidates running this time? The primary was setup for exactly this scenario.
I read this on another article and lol because it's so far from the truth as this essay shows that Warren is kissing up to party insiders.
The only change the DNC was to remove the SD from the first ballot and let them vote on the second one for the chosen one.
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.
Bummer
If you like capitalism, you’ll like Warren.
For me, the final straw was her standing up in approval when Trump said the U.S. would never be a socialist country. There is so much that can be laid at the feet of capitalism, but worst by far is that capitalism is at the core of the murder of the planet. Sanders doesn’t go far enough for me, but he is definitely going in the correct direction, and socialism suffuses everything he does.
Here's the photo that will never be deleted
Trump - Socialism will never happen here!
Warren - Bravo! Yippee! You betchoassitneverwill!
Bernie - No shit Sherlock and that isn't what I'm suggesting! Liz, sit down you're embarrassing yourself.
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.
Warren sounds like a reformer
But isn't. She has positioned herself as safe to the establishment, but she talks about breaking up tech. That's her claim to change ("you can believe in" ). However she will never break them up and in fact they will support her. Even if she did break them up it would make no difference in income disparity. She understands the problem well, but won't prescribe solutions strong enough do anything significant. However, is it better to have someone in office who at least acknowledges the real issues? Would she be as useless as Obama? Most likely. Bernie would be a much better choice, on most issues. However they are both out to lunch on foreign affairs. Expect to see the same clapped out retreads in her admin. That's going to be one of the biggest disappointments. Especially seeing ex Goldman Sachs characters running the financial side of the admim. I would predict that the closer she gets the more she will be like every past Democrat, Carter, Clinton and Obama, yet sound like a reformer exactly as they did. As Saint Ronnie would say, "there you go again".
Capitalism has always been the rule of the people by the oligarchs. You only have two choices, eliminate them or restrict their power.
Warren would be much better than Obama
I believe she is sincere about reforming Wall Street.
The problem is that things are much worse now than they were in 2008. We need twice as much reform, if not more.
So Warren is as far behind the times as Obama was, even if she is still better than Obama.
Golly Gee, Lookee at Today's Monmouth Poll
Bernie and WARren have tied for the lead with 20% apiece with Biden trailing at 19%.
Here's the most recent polls. You can also compare the new Monmouth poll with the one previous.
It's gonna be a tossup the closer and closer we get to the primaries.
some good news.
Biden down 13 pts, Bernie up 6 from their June poll. Liz trending up. Encouraging overall.
However, this poll was from a whopping 298 person sample, with an equally whopping 5.7% margin of error. But it does seem, without seeing all the internals, they probably sampled from more than just old folks with landlines.
This is an issue for me about polls
This is one of the polls that the DNC was using to determine who would be allowed on the debate stage. A f*cking 5.7% margin of error far exceeds rounding up or down percentages.
Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
Yep, just crazy
the DNC would certify this poll and not others with a far smaller MOE.
I tried to qualify my enthusiasm sufficiently above -- I like the outcome, I like the trends it shows, but it's just one poll, and could be wildly off the mark. And to tout it too much leaves me vulnerable to hypocrisy charges when I criticize the other polls with dubious polling samples which have less desirable outcomes.
In any case, I hope Tulsi stays in a little longer, perhaps to qualify for the Oct debate. But at a certain point, in a few months if she can't break 4-5%, she will have to decide whether she wants to keep her House seat.
Warren tweeted that she thinks
the whole world should stand with Pompeo's Amerikan-flag waving protesters in Hong Kong. Sanders tweeted that he thinks they're an inspiration. Almost enough to make me "cancel" both of them.
ETA: How many members of The Squad™ are going to endorse Warren? I am sure that Ayana Pressley will at some point. I have a feeling that AOC will as well.
Yes, they will
because the squad has been browbeaten or brainwashed into thinking that we need a woman President. It is still all about Identity Politics, but only when it is convenient for the establishment.
Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
is it another color revolution?
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
The Virginia Slims candidate?
When Warren burst on the Senate and was publicly humiliating banksters, Pelosi went out of her way to say that Warren did not represent the democratic party. Wikileaks exposed mail to Hillary I believe it was from rich donors demanding that Hillary shut up Warren up. I vaguely remember something about banksters warning Hillary about making Warren her VP candidate or else...
And now she is appearing to be the favorite among insiders? She has come a long way....
Biden-Warren 2020?
Yep, Bernie really sucks, doesn't he?
That way, if Biden's health is as poor as it looks
and his time runs out, a woman would just "accidentally" become president.
Or is the establishment that liberal?
Not that far
I'm gonna post another essay about this.
The corruptocrats have spent the whole time looking
for someone to stop Bernie from winning on the first ballot. First it was Harris, then once the insiders looked at the tea leaves and saw that Harris had a forked tail and cloven hooves that she couldn't hide they told Joe to run, but then his brains started leaking out of his ears and nose. The polls showed Warren as the next great capitalist hope - I bet they loved to see that.
But what if Warren and Bernie are the only two standing at the convention? Wild speculation: Bernie/Warren run as Greens. (Bernie would not run against Warren)
On to Biden since 1973
Ain't gonna happen.
Bernie had his chance to go Green with Jill as his V.P. and he passed the ball.
Warren would never go Green. Even if she did, I think Green voters would be too skeptical to support her.
Also too, even if Bernie were to go Green, against all available evidence to the contrary, the Greens aren't on every state's List of Approved Parties to Vote For (that's a technical term), so even with overwhelming support, he still wouldn't win.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5dBZDSSky0]
You're right, I checked the map
There are 135 Electoral College votes where the Greens are not on the ballot. (in 2016 according to Snopes) By my count 28 would go blue, that leaves 107 for Trump. (raising his total to about 180) That 28, plus CA, NY, MA, and Illinois would be enough to send the election to the House, where Pelosi would be able to play kingmaker.
The question would come down to whether the Dems have the gall to elect the 3rd place finisher after 4 years of complaining about the popular vote in 2016. (I say they will)
i'll subtract their EC votes from Bernie's 353and give them to Trump
On to Biden since 1973
"Unexpectedly drawn" to Elizabeth Warren?
Well, I guess it was unexpected that Tulsi Gabbard destroyed Kamala Harris' reputation in under a minute on national tv. That's not supposed to happen.
Warren's like a backup goalie. And that's all I'm gonna say about that.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
I've been barely keeping up with your comments ...
... in the past few days' essays, CStMS, but I gotta say -- the ones I've seen have been pure money. As in, you're nailing it (the ones about Twitler normalizing past evils especially).
We're living in interesting times.
Thanks, Eagles!
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
WARela Harren
For the same reason I liked Barney Frank when I first met him 30
Years ago and grew to distrust him. They're both highly intelligent mifits who learned how to negotiate with the system on its own terms, but secretly adore being flattered in return. Useful critics who are really insiders. People who believe the system can be saved from itself but only by themselves. In other words, not to be trusted.
https://medium.com/
https://medium.com/@caityjohnstone/intersectional-omnicide-6d57127c946b
“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu