@JtC
trying to get caught up, I guess I’ll see soon what you refer to.
I, Too, have to watch myself and will make greater efforts to do so. I hope this shit mellows soon, it’s a long way to November 2020.
@gulfgal98
forward to cover vacations and dealing with personal business which is piling up at an alarming rate. I have to remember to stop and check things out.
I have not been paying close enough attention to the boards lately.
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2 users have voted.
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That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Different points of view are what makes this site what it is and the reason I come here so I hope that never stops but personal insults serve no purpose other than to dampen the conversation. That said considering how stressed people are in this day and age I can understand the occasional flare up.
up
24 users have voted.
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All I want is the truth. Just give me some truth. John Lennon
@burnt out
I agree. Problems arise though when folks become so rigid in their beliefs that they refuse to listen to other's opinions.
Different points of view are what makes this site what it is and the reason I come here so I hope that never stops but personal insults serve no purpose other than to dampen the conversation. That said considering how stressed people are in this day and age I can understand the occasional flare up.
@dkmich
I don't demand that anyone "listen" to my opinions, or anyone else's. They're free to ignore me altogether, or simply talk past me -- in which case, I'll usually ignore them altogether.
It is, however, rather annoying when my opinions are treated like some sort of dimwitted naivete and/or ignorance. I mean, really. I'm not dimwitted, and I'm not naive, and I'm not ignorant. There aren't very many people on this board who could win an argument with me about very many things of consequence, though they might suppose themselves to have done so via arguments from strange and dubious authority.
Blah. People need to have more doubt about their opinions. I recommend to everyone, The Doubter's Companion: A Dictionary of Aggressive Common Sense.
I don't want to hear. But they do need to give everyone the same rights and respect they want.
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11 users have voted.
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The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
I always talk politics. I have never been hassled. I have always received respectful and insightful comments.
up
16 users have voted.
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Prof: Nancy! I’m going to Greece!
Nancy: And swim the English Channel?
Prof: No. No. To ancient Greece where burning Sapho stood beside the wine dark sea. Wa de do da! Nancy, I’ve invented a time machine!
I always talk politics. I have never been hassled. I have always received respectful and insightful comments.
Likewise.
I just got one of my friends registered here because of what this place is and the kind of open discourse community we are.
To JtC: As always, thank you -- and nihil illegitimis carborundum.
As usual, I guess I missed something?
Link?
This place is the best.
I always talk politics. I have never been hassled. I have always received respectful and insightful comments.
up
10 users have voted.
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"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat." -- snoopydawg
I always talk politics. I have never been hassled. I have always received respectful and insightful comments.
Likewise.
I just got one of my friends registered here because of what this place is and the kind of open discourse community we are.
To JtC: As always, thank you -- and nihil illegitimis carborundum.
up
4 users have voted.
—
Prof: Nancy! I’m going to Greece!
Nancy: And swim the English Channel?
Prof: No. No. To ancient Greece where burning Sapho stood beside the wine dark sea. Wa de do da! Nancy, I’ve invented a time machine!
I totally agree with you. Why some people think anyone who disagrees with them on whatever is fair game for bitching out, I haven't a clue. I was going to say something, then I thought I might just be adding to the mess so I didn't. I was going to send you a note, and then I thought, JSTFU.
I am glad you called it out.
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19 users have voted.
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"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
I totally agree with you. Why some people think anyone who disagrees with them on whatever is fair game for bitching out, I haven't a clue. I was going to say something, then I thought I might just be adding to the mess so I didn't. I was going to send you a note, and then I thought, JSTFU.
have good arguments/suppositions to make based on facts and a reading of trends. Others seem to be emotionally invested-why?
WTFK?
Same shit happened with Bernie and foreign policy.
All we are is monkeys throwing poo, that’s it.
DO SOMETHING REAL. I include myself in that.
Some people get caught up in the dilemma that their view is the "correct view". They are so convinced that anyone who differs is WRONG....blind to the insight. Failing to understand that insight is personal and by nature individual. Even fact driven conclusions can be incorrect if you miss or ignore essential data.
We sit at a crossroads...a crossroad of human extinction. The actual stress on the climate system is just beginning and it is going to get more severe. It is past time to put our shoulders to the wheel and push in the same direction, and stop standing on the side yelling "you won't get any where".
At this point the politics seems almost trivial...glacial in a moment of expediency. I think people feel the stress of our critical situation, and often are reactive rather than proactive. In these times we are better together...supportive and cooperative. Let's work in that spirit at c99 and face these existential threats with clear eyes and strong hearts.
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23 users have voted.
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“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”
@Lookout
If only I could be so eloquent. Thank you.
Some people get caught up in the dilemma that their view is the "correct view". They are so convinced that anyone who differs is WRONG....blind to the insight. Failing to understand that insight is personal and by nature individual. Even fact driven conclusions can be incorrect if you miss or ignore essential data.
We sit at a crossroads...a crossroad of human extinction. The actual stress on the climate system is just beginning and it is going to get more severe. It is past time to put our shoulders to the wheel and push in the same direction, and stop standing on the side yelling "you won't get any where".
At this point the politics seems almost trivial...glacial in a moment of expediency. I think people feel the stress of our critical situation, and often are reactive rather than proactive. In these times we are better together...supportive and cooperative. Let's work in that spirit at c99 and face these existential threats with clear eyes and strong hearts.
For my part I'm not offended and my incipient absence is because I have competing priorities.
Should you need some content you can always ask or just reprint and link.
If I've pissed someone off, well... too bad. I'm not responsible for your feelings. I've been doing this for 14 years and my very best advice is to get over yourself, you're not your online avatar and there is a whole world of real to explore.
since there's no specifics in this thread we can all get paranoid and think we said something, or replied discourteously or whatever.
ek, I'm glad to see you here. What's jtc talking about? I'm not sure! It was probably that thoroughly rude gulfgal. (that's a joke. She's the nicest one here and I chose her because she knows I love her)
For my part I'm not offended and my incipient absence is because I have competing priorities.
Should you need some content you can always ask or just reprint and link.
If I've pissed someone off, well... too bad. I'm not responsible for your feelings. I've been doing this for 14 years and my very best advice is to get over yourself, you're not your online avatar and there is a whole world of real to explore.
since there's no specifics in this thread we can all get paranoid and think we said something, or replied discourteously or whatever.
ek, I'm glad to see you here. What's jtc talking about? I'm not sure! It was probably that thoroughly rude gulfgal. (that's a joke. She's the nicest one here and I chose her because she knows I love her)
@Shahryar
You can rest assured that if you don't know what I'm talking about then you have no reason to be paranoid, although I am keeping a close eye on you. You and gulfgal. Heh!
since there's no specifics in this thread we can all get paranoid and think we said something, or replied discourteously or whatever.
ek, I'm glad to see you here. What's jtc talking about? I'm not sure! It was probably that thoroughly rude gulfgal. (that's a joke. She's the nicest one here and I chose her because she knows I love her)
But seriously, I have things to do other than monitor comments and I know I'm not the nicest guy here, though I'm usually civil I don't speak except to make a point.
I'll be back unless they ban me, just not sure when.
since there's no specifics in this thread we can all get paranoid and think we said something, or replied discourteously or whatever.
ek, I'm glad to see you here. What's jtc talking about? I'm not sure! It was probably that thoroughly rude gulfgal. (that's a joke. She's the nicest one here and I chose her because she knows I love her)
since there's no specifics in this thread we can all get paranoid and think we said something, or replied discourteously or whatever.
ek, I'm glad to see you here. What's jtc talking about? I'm not sure! It was probably that thoroughly rude gulfgal. (that's a joke. She's the nicest one here and I chose her because she knows I love her)
up
5 users have voted.
—
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
@ek hornbeck
you can get over yourself because this wasn't about you. If you piss me off I'll let you know.
For my part I'm not offended and my incipient absence is because I have competing priorities.
Should you need some content you can always ask or just reprint and link.
If I've pissed someone off, well... too bad. I'm not responsible for your feelings. I've been doing this for 14 years and my very best advice is to get over yourself, you're not your online avatar and there is a whole world of real to explore.
And it's straight up true that I have a life that demands my attention elsewhere. I'm not upset or going away at all. I contribute when I can. I'm also sincere about my offer, all I ever ask for is attribution, notification is nice but not required and should you change my password to use my account for the byline (which is possible folks, don't kid yourselves) I would hope you would let me know so I can change it back.
Other than that I write for myself, not to please anyone in particular or in general.
#9
you can get over yourself because this wasn't about you. If you piss me off I'll let you know.
notification is nice but not required and should you change my password to use my account for the byline (which is possible folks, don't kid yourselves) I would hope you would let me know so I can change it back.
I can attribute a piece to anyone here with the click of a mouse with no need to enter anyone's account let alone change a password. Drupal is very flexible software.
I appreciate the offer, I'll keep it in mind. Although I prefer you post it yourself so you can attend the comment threads.
And it's straight up true that I have a life that demands my attention elsewhere. I'm not upset or going away at all. I contribute when I can. I'm also sincere about my offer, all I ever ask for is attribution, notification is nice but not required and should you change my password to use my account for the byline (which is possible folks, don't kid yourselves) I would hope you would let me know so I can change it back.
Other than that I write for myself, not to please anyone in particular or in general.
notification is nice but not required and should you change my password to use my account for the byline (which is possible folks, don't kid yourselves) I would hope you would let me know so I can change it back.
I can attribute a piece to anyone here with the click of a mouse with no need to enter anyone's account let alone change a password. Drupal is very flexible software.
I appreciate the offer, I'll keep it in mind. Although I prefer you post it yourself so you can attend the comment threads.
If we’re going to be spending time here, then we may as well make the most of the opportunity we have to spread informative, critical and inspiring perspectives in a positive way.
@earthling1
just say 74 hail markoses and ... no wait, that's not right ...
of all wrongdoing.
Please!
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15 users have voted.
—
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
...I can relate to this conversation! LoL! And, yeah, I'm a big AOC fan. (Read my comment at the bottom of "the other" post. Comparisons between Lieberman and Crowley/State of Connecticut and NY-14 aren't that credible, IMHO.)
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7 users have voted.
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"Freedom is something that dies unless it's used." --Hunter S. Thompson
As we head closer to another election, I think people should be allowed to argue their points in their own essays, but perhaps tone it down, as a courtesy, in other people's essays. That way it gives people a choice which debates they would prefer participating in without feeling as if the conversation is being hijacked by someone with a very different argument.
That said, I saw nothing terribly egregious in any of the essays, and other than a persistent attempt at making an argument with a few different posters, I can't imagine what ruffled the feathers of a group of people who are all very smart, very passionate, and very articulate.
Frankly, from where I sit, compared to other sites, we have an embarrassment of riches here.
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13 users have voted.
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If we surrendered to earth's intelligence we could rise up rooted, like trees
~ Rainer Maria Rilke
@Anja Geitz
dueling essays are less harsh than embedded battles
As we head closer to another election, I think people should be allowed to argue their points in their own essays, but perhaps tone it down, as a courtesy, in other people's essays. That way it gives people a choice which debates they would prefer participating in without feeling as if the conversation is being hijacked by someone with a very different argument.
That said, I saw nothing terribly egregious in any of the essays, and other than a persistent attempt at making an argument with a few different posters, I can't imagine what ruffled the feathers of a group of people who are all very smart, very passionate, and very articulate.
Frankly, from where I sit, compared to other sites, we have an embarrassment of riches here.
because a member didn't present their argument in an existing essay, choosing instead to write their own essay to rebuke another essayist--in some cases, harshly. So, that situation can also be rather dicey.
IMO, the key to avoiding contentiousness is reason and civility. Ideally, folks (including myself) should try not to be so overly sensitive and/or defensive that another commenter cannot "respectfully" disagree with a point--particularly, if they bring facts to the table to back up their point(s) of dissension. I thought the main point of blogging was to learn and/or exchange ideas.
Also, there's a relatively distinct line between "debating a topic, and badgering someone," because they don't share the same view(s).
FWIW.
Blue Onyx
"Dogs have given us their absolute all. We are the center of their universe. We are the focus of their love and faith and trust.
They serve us in return for scraps. It is without a doubt the best deal man has ever made."
The best and most beautiful things in the world cannot be seen or even touched--they must be felt with the heart.~~Helen Keller
#14
dueling essays are less harsh than embedded battles
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4 users have voted.
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Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.
because a member didn't present their argument in an existing essay, choosing instead to write their own essay to rebuke another essayist--in some cases, harshly. So, that situation can also be rather dicey.
IMO, the key to avoiding contentiousness is reason and civility. Ideally, folks (including myself) should try not to be so overly sensitive and/or defensive that another commenter cannot "respectfully" disagree with a point--particularly, if they bring facts to the table to back up their point(s) of dissension. I thought the main point of blogging was to learn and/or exchange ideas.
Also, there's a relatively distinct line between "debating a topic, and badgering someone," because they don't share the same view(s).
FWIW.
Blue Onyx
"Dogs have given us their absolute all. We are the center of their universe. We are the focus of their love and faith and trust.
They serve us in return for scraps. It is without a doubt the best deal man has ever made."
The best and most beautiful things in the world cannot be seen or even touched--they must be felt with the heart.~~Helen Keller
Could you please share a bit more about all this? If it is important enough to write a diary about it, I think we could at least be clued into what caused your reaction.
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4 users have voted.
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"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin
@Fishtroller 02
the general phenomenon is straightforward enough: People mistake their considered and informed opinions for obvious truths, and behave with improbable rudeness towards anyone whose considered and informed opinion somehow has missed these obvious truths.
The solution is also straightforward: Comprehend the difference between TRVTH and your considered and informed opinions, and behave accordingly.
By way of a clue: If I do not share your considered and informed opinion, then that opinion is not an obvious truth. Obvious objective truths do not escape my comprehension.
Could you please share a bit more about all this? If it is important enough to write a diary about it, I think we could at least be clued into what caused your reaction.
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6 users have voted.
—
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
would like to know the particulars of the conversation that caused this diary to be written. Without them, the reader is made to feel like he/she is in a room where everyone knows the joke/gossip and are not allowing you in on it. It's frustrating and not productive.
#15
the general phenomenon is straightforward enough: People mistake their considered and informed opinions for obvious truths, and behave with improbable rudeness towards anyone whose considered and informed opinion somehow has missed these obvious truths.
The solution is also straightforward: Comprehend the difference between TRVTH and your considered and informed opinions, and behave accordingly.
By way of a clue: If I do not share your considered and informed opinion, then that opinion is not an obvious truth. Obvious objective truths do not escape my comprehension.
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3 users have voted.
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"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin
would like to know the particulars of the conversation that caused this diary to be written. Without them, the reader is made to feel like he/she is in a room where everyone knows the joke/gossip and are not allowing you in on it. It's frustrating and not productive.
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4 users have voted.
—
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
Pointed maybe. A little snarky, perhaps. Exasperated, definitely. But like I said in my own post in this thread, we have so many intelligent writers here who are both impassioned and opinionated that I think it's unrealistic to believe that all our conversations are going to mimic the polite chipmunks in tone. They're just not.
#15
the general phenomenon is straightforward enough: People mistake their considered and informed opinions for obvious truths, and behave with improbable rudeness towards anyone whose considered and informed opinion somehow has missed these obvious truths.
The solution is also straightforward: Comprehend the difference between TRVTH and your considered and informed opinions, and behave accordingly.
By way of a clue: If I do not share your considered and informed opinion, then that opinion is not an obvious truth. Obvious objective truths do not escape my comprehension.
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4 users have voted.
—
If we surrendered to earth's intelligence we could rise up rooted, like trees
~ Rainer Maria Rilke
Pointed maybe. A little snarky, perhaps. Exasperated, definitely. But like I said in my own post in this thread, we have so many intelligent writers here who are both impassioned and opinionated that I think it's unrealistic to believe that all our conversations are going to mimic the polite chipmunks in tone. They're just not.
Perhaps we have different tolerance levels of what intolerant looks like?
Honestly, I just didn't see anything really awful in the two threads about AOC I suspect you are talking about. The back and forth was, for me anyway, expected.
Did you feel it reached what you would characterize as a flame war? Please help me understand your concern?
#15.1.2
that the tolerance that I'm calling for just isn't going to happen? That's encouraging.
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5 users have voted.
—
If we surrendered to earth's intelligence we could rise up rooted, like trees
~ Rainer Maria Rilke
@Anja Geitz
we can characterize it as difference in tolerance levels. I saw those threads and others lately much differently than yourself.
I'm trying to resolve what I see as a serious problem in an amicable fashion, because if it isn't resolved I see some rule changes to this site in the future and that would be most unfortunate. I don't want that, I'm sure you don't want that, and I'm sure everyone here doesn't want that.
I've tried and tried, but it's becoming clear to me that there may be no other way.
Perhaps we have different tolerance levels of what intolerant looks like?
Honestly, I just didn't see anything really awful in the two threads about AOC I suspect you are talking about. The back and forth was, for me anyway, expected.
Did you feel it reached what you would characterize as a flame war? Please help me understand your concern?
@JtC
but what makes it so irritating is that it is pointlessly beyond the pale. there are times when going savage is necessary. arguing about, for example, whether AOC is or is not a creation of the Machine is not one of those times.
#15.1.2.1.1
we can characterize it as difference in tolerance levels. I saw those threads and others lately much differently than yourself.
I'm trying to resolve what I see as a serious problem in an amicable fashion, because if it isn't resolved I see some rule changes to this site in the future and that would be most unfortunate. I don't want that, I'm sure you don't want that, and I'm sure everyone here doesn't want that.
I've tried and tried, but it's becoming clear to me that there may be no other way.
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2 users have voted.
—
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
Well, then, now I'm not sure if my own discourse on this blog falls into the category you've identified as intolerant since I have no specifics to go on. Would I be off the mark to ask if disagreeing is considered intolerant? Because that's what I saw. Disagreement.
#15.1.2.1.1
we can characterize it as difference in tolerance levels. I saw those threads and others lately much differently than yourself.
I'm trying to resolve what I see as a serious problem in an amicable fashion, because if it isn't resolved I see some rule changes to this site in the future and that would be most unfortunate. I don't want that, I'm sure you don't want that, and I'm sure everyone here doesn't want that.
I've tried and tried, but it's becoming clear to me that there may be no other way.
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4 users have voted.
—
If we surrendered to earth's intelligence we could rise up rooted, like trees
~ Rainer Maria Rilke
Well, then, now I'm not sure if my own discourse on this blog falls into the category you've identified as intolerant since I have no specifics to go on. Would I be off the mark to ask if disagreeing is considered intolerant? Because that's what I saw. Disagreement.
In a different direction. What I've come to appreciate in my conversations with you is the example they set. While you have what I would call a "soft" touch in tone, I am much more direct. Perhaps even abrupt at times. But even though our communication styles appear to be polar opposites, I never feel you are dismissing my underlying message. You hear it. And you inspire me to reciprocate in kind. Thank you.
In a different direction. What I've come to appreciate in my conversations with you is the example they set. While you have what I would call a "soft" touch in tone, I am much more direct. Perhaps even abrupt at times. But even though our communication styles appear to be polar opposites, I never feel you are dismissing my underlying message. You hear it. And you inspire me to reciprocate in kind. Thank you.
@Eagles92
with language, it's been corrupted over the years.
Though maybe not:
I've always wondered about this phrase: "If you think [X] ... then you've got another _____ coming."
What goes in the blank space? Thing, or think?
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2 users have voted.
—
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
Comments
Crap!
n/t
Ya got to be a Spirit, cain't be no Ghost. . .
Yes it is
I’m still
trying to get caught up, I guess I’ll see soon what you refer to.
I, Too, have to watch myself and will make greater efforts to do so. I hope this shit mellows soon, it’s a long way to November 2020.
Ya got to be a Spirit, cain't be no Ghost. . .
Sorry JtC
I have not been paying close enough attention to the boards lately.
"I don't want to run the empire, I want to bring it down!" ~Dr. Cornel West
"There is no instance of a nation benefitting from prolonged warfare." Sun Tzu
"Propaganda is one hell of a drug." Abby Martin
Hi gg...
I'm losing my patience with the intolerance I've been witnessing lately.
Me neither, caught up in staying on top of writing my OTs
forward to cover vacations and dealing with personal business which is piling up at an alarming rate. I have to remember to stop and check things out.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Been sick and busy but really mostly read . . .
. . . happy stuff.
I have not seen ugly crazy shit. Sorry if it is happening.
Today moved my greenhouse starts into bigger pots. Then hung out with rescue cats and played arthritis piano (all improvisation).
Contemplating essays on trauma recovery and agriculture in Cuba. And a youtube video on dyslexia.
Cheers!
Marilyn
"Make dirt, not war." eyo
Hi JtC
Different points of view are what makes this site what it is and the reason I come here so I hope that never stops but personal insults serve no purpose other than to dampen the conversation. That said considering how stressed people are in this day and age I can understand the occasional flare up.
All I want is the truth. Just give me some truth. John Lennon
Howdy burnt out...
I agree. Problems arise though when folks become so rigid in their beliefs that they refuse to listen to other's opinions.
they don't even have to listen.....lord knows I ignore what
I don't want to hear. But they do need to give everyone the same rights and respect they want.
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
I absolutely agree with this.
I don't demand that anyone "listen" to my opinions, or anyone else's. They're free to ignore me altogether, or simply talk past me -- in which case, I'll usually ignore them altogether.
It is, however, rather annoying when my opinions are treated like some sort of dimwitted naivete and/or ignorance. I mean, really. I'm not dimwitted, and I'm not naive, and I'm not ignorant. There aren't very many people on this board who could win an argument with me about very many things of consequence, though they might suppose themselves to have done so via arguments from strange and dubious authority.
Blah. People need to have more doubt about their opinions. I recommend to everyone, The Doubter's Companion: A Dictionary of Aggressive Common Sense.
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
What the F happened?
As usual, I guess I missed something?
Link?
This place is the best.
I always talk politics. I have never been hassled. I have always received respectful and insightful comments.
Prof: Nancy! I’m going to Greece!
Nancy: And swim the English Channel?
Prof: No. No. To ancient Greece where burning Sapho stood beside the wine dark sea. Wa de do da! Nancy, I’ve invented a time machine!
Firesign Theater
Stop the War!
Yeah, I always miss the interesting stuff too
I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks
Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa
nihil illegitimis carborundum
You're not alone on that one!
Likewise.
I just got one of my friends registered here because of what this place is and the kind of open discourse community we are.
To JtC: As always, thank you -- and nihil illegitimis carborundum.
"I say enough! If Israel wants to be the only superpower in the Middle East then they can put their own asses on the line and do it themselves. I want to continue to eat."
-- snoopydawg
You always make me Google
You bastard, you.
Heh!
Prof: Nancy! I’m going to Greece!
Nancy: And swim the English Channel?
Prof: No. No. To ancient Greece where burning Sapho stood beside the wine dark sea. Wa de do da! Nancy, I’ve invented a time machine!
Firesign Theater
Stop the War!
If you are talking about what I think you are talking about,
I totally agree with you. Why some people think anyone who disagrees with them on whatever is fair game for bitching out, I haven't a clue. I was going to say something, then I thought I might just be adding to the mess so I didn't. I was going to send you a note, and then I thought, JSTFU.
I am glad you called it out.
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
It is...
rather obvious, is it not?
Some folks
have good arguments/suppositions to make based on facts and a reading of trends. Others seem to be emotionally invested-why?
WTFK?
Same shit happened with Bernie and foreign policy.
All we are is monkeys throwing poo, that’s it.
DO SOMETHING REAL. I include myself in that.
Some things to think about.
Ya got to be a Spirit, cain't be no Ghost. . .
Thanks for your tolerance my friend
Some people get caught up in the dilemma that their view is the "correct view". They are so convinced that anyone who differs is WRONG....blind to the insight. Failing to understand that insight is personal and by nature individual. Even fact driven conclusions can be incorrect if you miss or ignore essential data.
We sit at a crossroads...a crossroad of human extinction. The actual stress on the climate system is just beginning and it is going to get more severe. It is past time to put our shoulders to the wheel and push in the same direction, and stop standing on the side yelling "you won't get any where".
At this point the politics seems almost trivial...glacial in a moment of expediency. I think people feel the stress of our critical situation, and often are reactive rather than proactive. In these times we are better together...supportive and cooperative. Let's work in that spirit at c99 and face these existential threats with clear eyes and strong hearts.
“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”
Oh...
If only I could be so eloquent. Thank you.
It's tougher than it looks.
For my part I'm not offended and my incipient absence is because I have competing priorities.
Should you need some content you can always ask or just reprint and link.
If I've pissed someone off, well... too bad. I'm not responsible for your feelings. I've been doing this for 14 years and my very best advice is to get over yourself, you're not your online avatar and there is a whole world of real to explore.
I see a problem here
since there's no specifics in this thread we can all get paranoid and think we said something, or replied discourteously or whatever.
ek, I'm glad to see you here. What's jtc talking about? I'm not sure! It was probably that thoroughly rude gulfgal. (that's a joke. She's the nicest one here and I chose her because she knows I love her)
Paranoia, they destroy ya.
Hey, Shah...
You can rest assured that if you don't know what I'm talking about then you have no reason to be paranoid, although I am keeping a close eye on you. You and gulfgal. Heh!
Study my methods Watson...
And all shall be revealed.
But seriously, I have things to do other than monitor comments and I know I'm not the nicest guy here, though I'm usually civil I don't speak except to make a point.
I'll be back unless they ban me, just not sure when.
Lol. That funny shah.
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
ek...
you can get over yourself because this wasn't about you. If you piss me off I'll let you know.
I'm sure you will.
And it's straight up true that I have a life that demands my attention elsewhere. I'm not upset or going away at all. I contribute when I can. I'm also sincere about my offer, all I ever ask for is attribution, notification is nice but not required and should you change my password to use my account for the byline (which is possible folks, don't kid yourselves) I would hope you would let me know so I can change it back.
Other than that I write for myself, not to please anyone in particular or in general.
Not sure what you mean...
I can attribute a piece to anyone here with the click of a mouse with no need to enter anyone's account let alone change a password. Drupal is very flexible software.
I appreciate the offer, I'll keep it in mind. Although I prefer you post it yourself so you can attend the comment threads.
Wow. Innovation!
I would have to do it that way but I don't have a custom platform so- Bravo!
Do keep it in mind, as I like you guys but I just don't have time to tend so much.
Whatever.
If we’re going to be spending time here, then we may as well make the most of the opportunity we have to spread informative, critical and inspiring perspectives in a positive way.
I demand to be absolved
of all wrongdoing.
Please!
ok.
just say 74 hail markoses and ... no wait, that's not right ...
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
Don't forget...
the roses.
The roses? Quelle roses?
These:
?
These:
?
OR .....
those?
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Lol. That’s as funny if not funnier
Than Shah’s joke about gulfgal.
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
Based upon personal experience (cough, cough)...
...I can relate to this conversation! LoL! And, yeah, I'm a big AOC fan. (Read my comment at the bottom of "the other" post. Comparisons between Lieberman and Crowley/State of Connecticut and NY-14 aren't that credible, IMHO.)
"Freedom is something that dies unless it's used." --Hunter S. Thompson
Omg. So many favorites.
This place is full of my favorite people. Everyone that mattered to me at TOP is here.
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
Just my 2 cents
As we head closer to another election, I think people should be allowed to argue their points in their own essays, but perhaps tone it down, as a courtesy, in other people's essays. That way it gives people a choice which debates they would prefer participating in without feeling as if the conversation is being hijacked by someone with a very different argument.
That said, I saw nothing terribly egregious in any of the essays, and other than a persistent attempt at making an argument with a few different posters, I can't imagine what ruffled the feathers of a group of people who are all very smart, very passionate, and very articulate.
Frankly, from where I sit, compared to other sites, we have an embarrassment of riches here.
If we surrendered to earth's intelligence we could rise up rooted, like trees
~ Rainer Maria Rilke
Good point zoe
dueling essays are less harsh than embedded battles
Listen to your higher mind.
Not so sure about that--I've witnessed blowups
because a member didn't present their argument in an existing essay, choosing instead to write their own essay to rebuke another essayist--in some cases, harshly. So, that situation can also be rather dicey.
IMO, the key to avoiding contentiousness is reason and civility. Ideally, folks (including myself) should try not to be so overly sensitive and/or defensive that another commenter cannot "respectfully" disagree with a point--particularly, if they bring facts to the table to back up their point(s) of dissension. I thought the main point of blogging was to learn and/or exchange ideas.
Also, there's a relatively distinct line between "debating a topic, and badgering someone," because they don't share the same view(s).
FWIW.
Blue Onyx
Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.
Cheers Mollie
You make so much sense.
Learning and exploring (in your words) are more naturally supported by those receptive of diversified understanding and perception.
Hi, and thank you, Janis. Very good to see you! Hope
to catch up with you in the Photography OT, if we're not on the move this Friday evening.
Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.
What happened?
Could you please share a bit more about all this? If it is important enough to write a diary about it, I think we could at least be clued into what caused your reaction.
"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin
the particulars are unimportant.
the general phenomenon is straightforward enough: People mistake their considered and informed opinions for obvious truths, and behave with improbable rudeness towards anyone whose considered and informed opinion somehow has missed these obvious truths.
The solution is also straightforward: Comprehend the difference between TRVTH and your considered and informed opinions, and behave accordingly.
By way of a clue: If I do not share your considered and informed opinion, then that opinion is not an obvious truth. Obvious objective truths do not escape my comprehension.
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
Yeah... I get all the theoretical/overview stuff, but I still
would like to know the particulars of the conversation that caused this diary to be written. Without them, the reader is made to feel like he/she is in a room where everyone knows the joke/gossip and are not allowing you in on it. It's frustrating and not productive.
"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin
there's not that much content here.
you won't have to look hard to see some people going off the rails.
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
I really didn't see that on either side
Pointed maybe. A little snarky, perhaps. Exasperated, definitely. But like I said in my own post in this thread, we have so many intelligent writers here who are both impassioned and opinionated that I think it's unrealistic to believe that all our conversations are going to mimic the polite chipmunks in tone. They're just not.
If we surrendered to earth's intelligence we could rise up rooted, like trees
~ Rainer Maria Rilke
So, you're saying...
that the tolerance that I'm calling for just isn't going to happen? That's encouraging.
No, I wouldn't necessarily say that
Perhaps we have different tolerance levels of what intolerant looks like?
Honestly, I just didn't see anything really awful in the two threads about AOC I suspect you are talking about. The back and forth was, for me anyway, expected.
Did you feel it reached what you would characterize as a flame war? Please help me understand your concern?
If we surrendered to earth's intelligence we could rise up rooted, like trees
~ Rainer Maria Rilke
Yes...
we can characterize it as difference in tolerance levels. I saw those threads and others lately much differently than yourself.
I'm trying to resolve what I see as a serious problem in an amicable fashion, because if it isn't resolved I see some rule changes to this site in the future and that would be most unfortunate. I don't want that, I'm sure you don't want that, and I'm sure everyone here doesn't want that.
I've tried and tried, but it's becoming clear to me that there may be no other way.
personally, i thought some of it was beyond the pale.
but what makes it so irritating is that it is pointlessly beyond the pale. there are times when going savage is necessary. arguing about, for example, whether AOC is or is not a creation of the Machine is not one of those times.
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
Hmmm...
Well, then, now I'm not sure if my own discourse on this blog falls into the category you've identified as intolerant since I have no specifics to go on. Would I be off the mark to ask if disagreeing is considered intolerant? Because that's what I saw. Disagreement.
If we surrendered to earth's intelligence we could rise up rooted, like trees
~ Rainer Maria Rilke
I think it might have been a matter of degree.
Right now it's really hot and dry here, and it irritates me. Can I yield to the reality of it or do I try to fight it?
Opinion can be very valid and strong until it becomes obsessive, I think.
I think I might understand now
What you're getting at.
If we surrendered to earth's intelligence we could rise up rooted, like trees
~ Rainer Maria Rilke
I think I might too.
Thank you zoe, for your consideration and your opinions.
I appreciate your efforts to gently steer me
In a different direction. What I've come to appreciate in my conversations with you is the example they set. While you have what I would call a "soft" touch in tone, I am much more direct. Perhaps even abrupt at times. But even though our communication styles appear to be polar opposites, I never feel you are dismissing my underlying message. You hear it. And you inspire me to reciprocate in kind. Thank you.
If we surrendered to earth's intelligence we could rise up rooted, like trees
~ Rainer Maria Rilke
Thanks zoe
It’s so much about the sharing of individual impressions that are rewarding.
Off-topic ...
Though maybe not:
I've always wondered about this phrase: "If you think [X] ... then you've got another _____ coming."
What goes in the blank space? Thing, or think?
Judas
Might be the definitive voice on this?
it's supposed to be "another think", but as often happens
with language, it's been corrupted over the years.
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.