Unanswered questions
Folks, I'm not seeing a lot of point to all this discussion unless we can get some real answers. I mean, why bother?
1) Is anything about the American political scene going to change? Everyone worries that "Trump is our face to the world," but maybe he ought to be. Y'all read William Blum? America maintains wars every day because the war corporations always need the money, and keeps the fossil-fuel-burning deadliness in business because the folks in power don't want to waste "value," and yet nobody can figure a better way of business. So everyone continues to pretend it's about the public image of the President or whatever. I mean, so far the answer is "no," but, you know, after four or eight years we'll get a Democrat in the White House, everyone will go back to ignoring stuff, and I'll still be waiting for the answer to change to "yes."
2) Is education obsolete? Education "innovators" these days are busy finding new ways to circumvent institutions, and the folks who go into hock for at least five figures to get degrees so they can qualify for tepid job markets will ALL be looking to do some circumventing. At some point the corporations will not want to be in business helping folks like Pearson suck down money, and so they will set up their own "credentialing" franchises. If you can prove that you know how to do the job, you'll get the job regardless of how you learned how to do it, and the education corporations (and by extension the teachers and professors) will have priced themselves out of the business. Speaking as a professor, I really don't know why anyone would want to hire the likes of me in a decade or so. And the public schools? "Online schooling" will replace them. It's not as if teaching and learning are bad things, I suppose, if we're going to continue to have human societies in the future (and right now we're short a motive for doing that, even). But commodities disappear if nobody is willing to pay for them, and the teacher-as-commodity might just disappear pretty soon. You could probably program a sophisticated computer to teach online.
3) Where is this big technological fix that will solve the climate change problem? Supposedly we're all dying in "fireball Earth" when the methane clathrates go up in a big... well, fireball (so maybe my word choice needs more variety!), yet nobody wants to do anything about the fossil fuel industry and the Earth's atmosphere accumulates 2.3 ppm of carbon dioxide every year (or is it 2.77 ppm?) and then of course if we kill off the oceans (acidification y'know) it gets much worse. You'd think there'd be panic in the streets. And then it occurred to me: y'all waiting for the techno-gods to come down from the sky with a solution. So where's this solution? Certainly something must be on the books by now. But what if there's nothing there, or if nobody's looking because there's no profit in it?
4) What is the size of the American micro-Left? I get a lot of push-back whenever I mention that America has no Left, but it's mostly from people who say that "America has a Left because I say so." I'd like to see some documentation. Let's start with the 2016 Presidential election, in which 1% of the voters chose an actual Left candidate. 1%! Woot! Woot! Seriously -- if you can find a "Left" that hasn't been co-opted to death by the Democratic Party or its attendant Veal Pen non-governmental institutions, then let's see its documentation. How many people participate? What's the extent of their participation? And if it's as big as you say it is, maybe they can come down here to the wastelands between LA and Riverside and do some organizing? I look out my window every morning and see a public that doesn't believe in politics except maybe as an avenue for the well-connected to become even moreso.
5) Why do y'all continue to believe in money and property so fervently? As Yuval Noah Harari points out in "Sapiens" (here's a mini-version of the chapter in question), "value" as embedded in the economy is all wrapped up in our trust in the future. But is the future set in stone? Yeah I didn't think so.
6) What's the big thing about lawnmowers and leaf-blowers and weed-whackers? Y'all really into noise pollution and monoculture?
So yeah I have questions, and until some solid, trustworthy answers start to appear, it's looking really quiet, except of course for all the noise pollution. As for the audience for c99% in general, here are the statistics. So let's just continue to go along for the ride. It is, after all, just a ride.
Comments
@FuturePassed I used to want
I used to want to do this back in the glory days at DKos. There was little interest until after the place had become sufficiently toxic I didn't want to be part of it anymore.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@FuturePassed This place is
This place is called "the Lifeboat," a holdover from days when we were just a little group of people on Google Groups. But lifeboats usually need to go someplace. I was thinking meet-ups could be islands of a sort.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
What is my position?
What I said was:
I did NOT say that:
'kay?
“When there's no fight over programme, the election becomes a casting exercise. Trump's win is the unstoppable consequence of this situation.” - Jean-Luc Melanchon
@Cassiodorus OK...it sounded
OK...it sounded like you thought, if we did something different, there would be better numbers.
I guess the point is that you think we should be finding answers. I'd like to find some too, actually, but I've got no answer to the problem of power. However, there's a shitload of things that would need to be done/invented/built in order to make political power for us even possible, in my opinion. If it's possible for us to save ourselves, those things would need to be done in order to make it possible to amass power; if it's not possible to save ourselves, those things would make the time we have left better.
Most of them involve community-building, greater local independence on things like food, water, communications, basic medicine, and even energy. Basically, it's developing or encouraging developments that are already going on, which are building/could build an alternative culture/system for us to inhabit, the way the black market and grey market exist in relation to the official marketplace. I hate to say "tune in, turn on, drop out" (which was never my style) but I don't see a viable path to policy change.
Although I may be wrong; God knows I'd like to be. Considering the obsessive paranoia with which the powerful regard our minds, our imaginations, our perceptions, our reason--the constant attempt to reach complete control of perception and opinion--maybe I am wrong, and there is something that we would see if enough of us woke up; something we could do that we're missing. It's possible.
Either way, I don't see anything to do other than 1)build alternative structures, 2)party like it's 1999, 3)tell oneself a series of lies. I think most people here are disinclined to do #3.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@dkmich In retrospect, my
In retrospect, my comment didn't exactly address yours. Sorry about that--what I was trying to get to is that no, it's not the site's fault, and it's not the people on the site's fault, that we don't have "the answer" in our back pocket.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
I have been very clear over the years
that the problems we as a nation face will not be solved by a third party or even through the electoral process. We saw that very clearly in the primaries of 2016. The entire political structure must change or we are just spinning our wheels in the same revolving door. I do not have the answers to this although I am a firm believer in social movements as a way to effect change. The problem is that the government now has structure in place that prevent any widespread social movement like Occupy which was literally beat down by the powers that be, most of whom were Democrats.
I personally believe our situation in the country regarding freedom of speech is far more dire than any of us realize. Two massive examples right now are the Seth Rich/Wikileaks connection and the DNC fraud lawsuit. The mainstream media has refused to cover either. And why? Because both will expose the enormous depth of the corruption in our public systems. Now that net neutrality is flying out the window, our ability to share information or organize is going to be even more compromised.
I personally see this site as a way to educate ourselves and others who may read us of the realities and truths out there through the essays posted and the comments on those essays. We have been working to expand our foot print on the net through social media via Facebook and Twitter. I monitor Twitter and not only do I post essays from here, but I also retweet interesting tweets. Many of our essays and retweets are retweeted again. That is an excellent way to expand our audience. The same with Facebook.
Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
@gulfgal98 I didn't mean "you"
I didn't mean "you" as in "you, gulfgal" but in the sense of "one" or "somebody, whoever tries to do this."
Of course you've been clear on the futility of electoral politics for quite a while. I was just pointing out that Cass had brought up an idea, but that the idea had not been taken up by people because so many people, including me, feel that one more round of electoral politics is unlikely to be helpful. I'm willing to consider electoral work as a piece of a larger strategy, but to my mind, it's a later-stage activity and should never be the most important thing going on. Problem is, it's resource-intensive.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
I absolutely did not take it personally
I was actually addressing the issue of a third party. Even if a third party become viable, there are so many structural problems in our system of elections and governance, that they render political change impossible from the inside. That would be nearly impossible even in the absence of corruption. When we add in the far more pervasive corruption than even I imagined, change will never be possible.
Exposing all these things may go a long way to enlightening people who are being kept in the dark. This is why everyone in DC is in a state of panic over both the resurgence of the Seth Rich story and the DNC fraud lawsuit.
Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
@gulfgal98 I refuse to sit down and
I refuse to sit down and STFU. We must keep talking or our silence may hang us all. I appreciate all the people on this little site. They give me hope for tomorrow.
This site is full of ex-Kossacks.
I am one.
I have seen former site participants disappear, but have no idea where they went. Reddit got quite a few, I think. Kos and his site are worthy of scrutiny and discussion because that place is where you go to find out exactly what Democrats are really up to.
Trump bashing on this site seems very limited and targeted, and always put into context of how his actions hurt the 99%ers. Trump praising, a rare occurrence, is also couched in terms of the effect on the 99%ers.
1) I agree when the Dems get back in, nothing will change. Most people here were once Dems, or Independents that often voted Dem. If anyone is going to go vote, that is their damn choice. Shit and smellier shit. I do not believe political parties beholden to their corporate masters will help we little people. I might vote for a person, but the impact is for Exxon, or Raytheon. A person on the fucking ballot is a person funded by more money than I could raise against.
All of them. Even at local levels.
So, we need laws to keep money out of politics. Good fucking luck getting any politician to go along with that.
2) Gov. Perry bragged that Texas educates workers. Education is horrible. History is edited. Arts are not addressed in curricula. Critical thinking is absent. Teaching to The Test rules. Money is made from student loans. The Constitutional guarantee of free public education is being eroded. Separation of Church and State is going south.
This has been happening for decades. Education is now a money maker for corporations. Do you want to teach for free? I have a life time teaching certificate for history and social studies. The only way I could set up a private school would be if I had funding.
3) I would hazard an educated guess that the technological answer to global warming exists, or at least something getting there does. Copyrights, trade secrets, and employer ownership of the work done is the issue. There is no way that info will get to us. Rich people have bunkers and spreads in New Zealand. The 99%ers will be fried or starve to death.
4) There is no way to measure the percentage of lefties. Polling questions are skewed. The other measure might be voting, but how does one demonstrate their left leanings with ballots full of corporatist whores?
5)I love my car (9 years old) and my 2(17 and 10 years old, respectively) trucks. Shit on me for that, but I live in Texas where nothing is close. Drive to work. Drive to the dr. Drive to the grocery store. Drive 40 miles one way to the heart specialist, and the vote against anybody wanting to have public transportation. In the county where I live, there is no taxi or bus service, or trains. I pick up hitch hikers all the time. I love having vehicles that allow me to do that.
I built my house. I literally took hammer and nail and built it. It is my shelter. I am not in love with it. I love the security of it, since we have no apartments and very few rentals in my community. I never paid the first mortgage payment. I paid for the construction. It took 5 years before I spent my first night in the home I built.
6) I do not live in a subdivision that requires certain yard and fence and house standards. I do have acreage. I do have deadly snakes. I do live in a part of the country where summer heat can easily kill you. So, my yard guy uses every single thing he can to get my yard clipped to the point where I can see a rattlesnake or coral snake, and he does it sometimes in 110 degree heat.
Cassiodorus, our democracy has failed. It is a matter of time when we start all over. I do not think it will be internal, because we go all out with strikes and protests. I think the real change will be from the globe.
This world is getting tired of us.
c99 will not lead the way.
c99 will alert a few ahead of the disaster.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Excellent comment but I disagree with the conclusion
What we do here is, metaphorically talk, actually write. This site, at least for me, has been extremely educational. I liken c99 to masters level political education. Lots of people start college, then drop out and some of the dropouts succeed. The majority who do finish college or masters degrees actually do things other than that for which they trained. Conferring an educational degree upon someone does in no way predict what the life course of that individual will be. But an education, such as the "advanced degree" we earn here at c99 by our participation, prepares us, if we so desire, to be political activists.
What college or university ever questions its reason for existence? Their goal is to educate. How they educate and what they educate are often different. But they educate. For educational value alone c99 is very worthwhile.
Do not sell this small community short. There is a lot of value here. To stay relevant here, one must continue self-education of the issues. Lots here take for granted what skill sets we have learned here. Some do lament that we do not TAKE ADVANTAGE of this. That is an incorrect approach. Do any of us communicate only with community members? No, of course not. Little by little we spread enlightenment and perhaps infect others with critical thinking skills.
I agree
I have learned much from visiting this site and glad to be part of it. I don't have any solutions to the problems we are all facing but at least I understand the cause of most of them and that's half the battle. I also try and share the knowledge with others any time I get a chance even though most of the time I get very little response but it doesn't stop me from trying.
heh, If questions had answers, they stop being questions
Sorry for playing dumb.
For sure to me this site is educational. I never expected it to be more than that. Writing and talking and discussing is the base to make up your mind about what and where someone would actually do something in off-line, ie real life politicial organizing and movements.
There is nothing "activist" or "revolutionary" in thinking, writing and talking to each other online per se. So, I wonder, why people would expect that from an online site. OWS happened "offline" in real space. But online blog reading leads you to understand, what you might want to support in real life. So, it's important, a first step to find the next step, your organized political participation in real life. You know all that stuff that is so much harder than 'online activism'.
Why do you expect answers? We all come here to see what others think about questions we have in our minds and often I find something that is really worthwhile and educative and even beautiful to listen, read and talk about.
This little site is beautiful to me. I don't care how "large" it is, how many "clicks" it gets. Really. Do you care, if you read a book, how many others have read it too? No, but if you find that book really enlightening I guess you would love to talk about it with someone else. That's what you can do here. And I think it's wonderful.
The statistics? Ok, first I ran into dailykos and many things written there were in my mind a lot. I think that was around 2004 to 2005. So I read there often til I got a little annoyed too often. I didn't like to read the comments over there anymore. So, I decided to stop reading there and found this site and then through this site most of the sites that are listed here on the left hand site. I am glad I did.
The higher participation here in 2016 were due to the god-awful primaries. The lower participation here in the last couple of month is due to a persuasive depression and disgust about the results of the election. That's a pretty normal reaction. I couldn't care less about dailykos. Most of what they write about I can read somewhere else as well. Comments there were often an annoying waste product. Comments here are NOT a waste. That is important.
This is the only blog I read. Why would I need to read several? Most talk about the same thing, but express it a little different. I like dry talk. I don't need embellished, flowery, heated talk, though sometimes it's fun to read. I like truthdig and like the real news network and democracy now. I read general news articles in news papers. What's wrong with that? It doesn't mean that by default I fall for propaganda. I don't read facebook, or any of the many sites you follow. Why would I have to do that?
I trust if a major movement evolves that is worth considering to support or engage in, I would learn that here. Luckily a lot of folks follow all that for me, and that's why I come here. I am grateful for what people do (for my education) here.
How many lefties are there? Oh, plentiful, they just are conditioned and scared to admit it in the open. Wait til the political shit hits anyone's personal lives, and the lefties will come out of the closet and shout. People have an inate need for justice, equality, personal freedom to speak up. It's there. Don't give up. Of course then the others, the righties, come out as well and present "their solutions" to all the problems. What a frigging tragedy. Life goes on and so do I. I go along to take the ride.
Oh, btw, most of the 99 percent care for money, because they need to buy some basic stuff and the care for property, because they need a safe roof over their head. There is nothing wrong with that.
https://www.euronews.com/live
Along with the remainder of your comment, the following
is well-said:
Another nice thing about c99 is that there is no down voting (thumbs down).
"there is no down voting" And? whoop-de-do :)
so what does the thumb voting thing do for everybody? I mean, what's it for? SEO usually, and that is not obvious here so... why? I don't get it, so I just try to be consistent with either thumbs up all, or none. Because why not, members can't tell who is clicking on what comment or essay, even if they could, what's the point?
Whoosh! That is the sound of clue rushing by me. Enlightenment awaits.
Thanks
The thumb thing
is a way for someone reading your comment to let you know they liked and/or appreciate it. It is a visual "atta boy." There is no such thing as mojo here or any type scoring, but it is nice to know people appreciate what you have said. We purposely made it anonymous because it is actually more meaningful.
Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
behavioral psychology and operant conditioning
thanks for answering, and I apologize for being so contrary all the time. It is not you all, it's me. LOL This operant does not like to be conditioned, it creates discomfiture for me, I am too sensitive. I guess I meant data-mining, not SEO one begets the other I mixed it up.
Found the phrase on medium.com, didn't learn it in school: Data Mining Reveals How The “Down-Vote” Leads To A Vicious Circle Of Negative Feedback
It is from two years ago, around the middle it talks about the behavioral psychology experiment with "up only" votes.
I don't know if they followed up with results but my personal problem is feeling like a guinea pig all the time, constantly captured, probed, questioned, herded and penned it is Five Man Electric Band 24/7. How you feeling now? how 'bout now? how 'bout now? how 'bout now? It exhausts my psyche to the point the outside world is almost intolerable, it is online filtering that saves my sanity now. How ironic.
Well at least here I can say how I feel about it, and not get zeroed in to oblivion, usually. heh Thanks? I'd rather people just talk and not have to vote. Voting used to mean something else that was dear to me, that's all. (shakes fist, yells at sky)
peace and love
I give up, eyo
I found 20 alternative meanings for SEO in my acronym finder. Please, explain your acronyms--or did you really mean Survivability Enhancement Operations?
Search engine optimization
search engine optimization (SEO)
Noun: computing
@Alligator Ed You are absolutely
You are absolutely correct about the educational value of this site. I haven't found any place even close to it for observations on the state of play.
It helps all of us to see current events in an honest, non-propagandized way.
My last comment is more about global conflict. I do not think the US will start WWIII. I think some alliances will be formed and other countries will start it and we will be the cause.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
@on the cusp I'm sure they'd like
I'm sure they'd like that a lot (the violent nutcases currently running our society)
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Yay for the home team!
Thanks for pointing out the enlightening aspects of this site Mr. Alligator.
oh my, Texas
Please excuse my nasty cracks about Texas and the south. Of course, I realize people who aren't ignorant live in Texas too. It is metaphor and not personal. Honest. Michigan is rapidly turning into Michissippi. Besides our rural voters, we have a pocket of DeVos religious bigots dominating the west side of the state.
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
@dkmich For every nasty crack
For every nasty crack you make about Texas, I can make 3. After all, you haven't sat down and attempted to talk to Kevin Brady.
Still, we produced Bill Moyers, Barbara Jordan, Molly Ivins, so there is something in the water besides oil.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
3) Where is this big ...
... technological fix that will solve the climate change problem?
None exists ... if you are asking about removing our influence without a trace. Our influence has already caused changes so unless we invent a time machine and go back in time what is done is done.
Can we have a positive influence? Yes, we can mitigate our bad practices, and everyone knows how to do that. The question becomes: Can we force the bad actors to do the right things? The answer is a simple, "yes." The challenge is to work out a way to maneuver them into doing the right thing.
"that would have been great."
action that might have saved the planet.
as far as I could get.
if we could only beam this clip into every household every day and night.
compare it with what MSM dishes out & we see a big part of the problem.
same deal on every issue of importance. survival of life on the planet should be high on list, though. (++)
Life will survive don't worry about that.
"Will we survive?", is an open question at this point. We could be headed for a "choke point", a few thousand individuals, like the one that happened on the Southern coast of Africa from which all later humans descended. Or, some large fraction of us will survive to have another go at really screwing it up. Or, we will all die off with no evolutionary influence on the future biology of this planet.
We are working on the problem and will be able to generate a more precise prognostication as we flow into the future.
" We are working on the problem..."
lol.
it takes a train to cry.
I have been "on the job" ...
... for quite some time now. I have been giving talks and throwing flags but no one cares.
thought you meant humanity.
As a group, we seem to be writing out the answer in large letters.
Soon anyone will be able to read it.( & you won't need a weatherman either.)
thx for trying to ring the alarm.
We = Humanity versus We = a definable subset of same.
Yea, communicating efficiently is not necessarily congruent with communicating effectively.
@PriceRip Me too.
Me too.
Way back when, trying to sell energy efficiency to a Democratic-majority Senate drove me to drink. Tequila.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Comment adjusted to account for current Neocon policies
I love the edit ... thanks for the thought.
Here is another take on our situation:
@Alligator Ed SNORT!
SNORT!
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@PriceRip We could be headed
We could be headed for a "choke point", a few thousand individuals, like the one that happened on the Southern coast of Africa from which all later humans descended.
I'm guessing that's what the ultra-rich want. Of course, they would be the "few thousand individuals."
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Actually that is not at all clear.
The process of surviving the "event" is not as predictable as you suggest, at least that's what the science tells us.
@PriceRip Oh, I don't
Oh, I don't think it's so predictable. But I bet you they do.
They probably have teams of experts explaining the exact things they need to do in order to survive.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Therein lies the trap.
They have the conclusion. They want their experts to define the conditions necessary to generate the desired results. The process is called "Reverse Engineering". Reverse Engineering works, but only under a set of conditions not applicable to this situation.
If they had it wired, HRC would be president.
Unfortunately their stupidity may mean only that they will die with us.
That would be the bright side of things, I suppose.
@irishking They were a
They were a bit shocked to encounter effective opposition. Hence the ensuing brouhaha (six months and counting), though even that isn't entirely what it seems.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
I do agree alot of the discussion on this site is useless.
Others don't, which is fine. I've reached a point where I want solutions also. But that's the big problem in trying to form an agenda everyone can work together on. With Daily Kos, it's easy, elect more and better democrats. This is a non-partisan site so there's no mission. Should this site have a mission or an agenda? Not for me to answer but it's looking like that might need some discussion.
What one thing can we do?
I, from time to time, ask this question in various forms and guises. I will continue to pose this challenge, from time to time, until something interesting occurs.
I suspect the majority of the "word count" on this and any other site is redundant. I suspect the true value of this majority dialogue is therapeutic and community building to the extent such can be accomplished in this environment.
I detect an increase in the "what are we going to do" stream of consciousness at this site. So, I suppose, we shall see ...
c99 as a site will do nothing.
comment by JtC. "c99p is a nonpartisan site...
@irishking
in the sense that the site itself will not officially back any particular party or candidate. Members are free to advocate as they will.
Case in point: Bernie Sanders. Myself, all the admins, moderators and the vast majority of the members supported Bernie. Yet, we as a site, took no official stance.
You may advocate for any candidate or platform that you wish, but the site itself wont. We consider the site as an advocate for the 99%."
thx.
Very much like a University
I suppose that's why I feel comfortable here. I am sure there are people here analogous to the Political Science Professors that tried to get me fired one year. I am sure there are others analogous to the Biology Professors that secretly supported me as I took down a "let's teach creationism" Junior College Physics instructor during a different year.
The genus of what JtC has set up here is not lost upon me. I have never been in a state of mind where I expected agreement from even a reasonable fraction of my cohort. If everyone started to agree with me I would be concerned ... very concerned.
When I ask, "What can we do?", I am really looking for ideas I can steal and maybe use "out in the real world" where I know now to accomplish objectives, like getting deans to back off or get fired. You know, just ordinary everyday stuff.
@Strife Delivery@Big Al We can have a mission
We can have a mission. But as Cass himself has often pointed out, we have few to no ways of getting anything done. We need to invent the tools (as Phoebe said recently) in order to do much at all.
You guys (you, and Joe, and some others) think the mission/agenda should come first, then the tools. That's fine; go ahead and establish the agenda. If anybody disagrees with it, they'll let you know, but as far as I can see, most of us here would like to see the same policies. If you're talking about what 1-3 things to emphasize, or focus on, that's something that would probably engender argument. However, say we said Medicare for All, or climate change, or the Big War Machine, is our one main thing to focus on and our mission is to get good policy on one of those three issues enacted. It's obvious that we won't get anywhere at all trying to get good policy through the current political system. Therefore we'd have to do something else to get results. It's fine to say "take it to the street," but most street protests of the last thirty years have had no impact on policy or on the political system beyond making the system bring out some of its uglier employees and sending them to do its dirty work of busting heads, discrediting movements, spreading disinformation etc.
We have an impermeable political system which answers only to a few people far above us, and they are apparently suicidal, or at least homicidal, maniacs. Unfortunately, they've arrayed massive military might around their lunacy.
Establishing an agenda is fine, but pretty quickly you're going to have to answer "what must we do?" And neither "get people elected!" nor "take it to the streets!" is going to work, or, rather, we've seen exactly how those things work and what the results are. The best we've done so far is Occupy, IMO. But we need a lot more invention than that. And we also need to understand the enemy's methods for dealing with resistance--mainly co-optation, infiltration, character assassination, disinformation, and fraud--and at least attempt to counter those tactics, or to build counters to those tactics into our plans ahead of time, else there's not much point in taking the action in the first place.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
My answer - we're less than a hill of beans, folks, but ...
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rEWaqUVac3M]
"You can't just leave those who created the problem in charge of the solution."---Tyree Scott
I learned driving techniques from a race car driver.
It takes very little effort to critically alter the trajectory of a high performance machine.
"... we're less than a hill of beans", ... indeed ... here's looking at you kid ...
@Cassiodorus @Steven D Right! I mean, we
Right! I mean, we might as well try to do what we can. It's either that or party till the lights go out. Those are the only remaining choices with any integrity.
I recommend that everybody listen to Ursula LeGuin's short story, "The End."
Or find it and read it (she has it in The Wind's Twelve Quarters as "Things.")
http://www.openculture.com/2015/10/hear-ursula-k-le-guins-story-the-end-...
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
probably our best move
but I have always done things the hard way.
have you checked Jared Black's JamPac idea?
he deserves a read, given his strong move in DNC case.
we should invite him on here.
he replies to people on twitter. this might be ok with c99 nonpartisan stance.
a good fight is a party, if you are on the right side.
https://beckandlee.wordpress.com/2016/04/14/jampac-a-hack-for-an-ailing-...
It's like a hummingbird dropping a mouthful of water
on a forest fire. It is well documented that climate change can happen really rapidly. Ice cores, tree rings, and sediment cores all show this. Lions and tigers and bears, oh my. This ain't Kansas anymore Dorthy.
Stop Climate Change Silence - Start the Conversation
Hot Air Website, Twitter, Facebook
All it takes is ...
... a tiny change in one variable flipping the sign of one term in the differential equations and the system goes from stable to unstable or maybe even chaotic.
It ain't rocket science.
With regard to question 6
I use an electric lawnmower.
And my wife has planted both front and back gardens to be havens for bees and butterflies for many years now.
Gëzuar!!
from a reasonably stable genius.
I have no mower. A battery-powered weed-whacker, rarely used.
And a manual weed whacker. And very little lawn: it's reverting to green stuff. I have a second mortgage, paying down for the second time. First assumed to pay for son's college tuition. Then a new roof. I get to pay $7000 in property taxes, and 20 acres makes little difference. That $7000 represents over 5 months of Social Security survivor's benefits.
I am the guardian of my woodland. It generates O2. And supports wildlife. I am planting value trees now, fruit trees not grown by my neighbors. Next year, nut trees if I am able. And planting trees one or two zones S of here, an accelerated migration.
Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.
Why bother?
I don't know how old you are, Cassiodorus. But I can tell you that I date back to the "Golden Age" of underground publications in America. At 58, I am a little young for that perhaps. But I was there, and reading them, as soon as I could get hold of them. (I estimate roughly 1968, age 10.)
Publications from The Straight Creek Journal to ABAPA Freer were very instrumental in my forming class and political consciousness growing up. They made my political mind what it is today.
I also am reminded of some other publications which forwarded the cause of freedom and of the "99 percent" throughout history: Iskra and Pravda in late-Tsarist Russia; Jean-Paul Marat's L'Ami du Peuple in revolutionary France, etc. These papers did much the same kinds of thing that c99p does in the Internet age. To wit: they asked the questions that needed to be asked, and that the mainstream media (MSM) of their days would not touch.
We don't necessarily have all the answers. But as long as we ask the hard questions, we are indeed doing useful work towards the change in the world we all desire.
And that is why I, for one, "bother", to answer your original question, Cassiodorus.
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
No mower, electric string trimmer, and I'm
solar. It isn't used much anyway, because we have only small areas where it's use would be appropriate. Electric leaf vacuum to pick up the leaves from out deciduous trees and bushes for composting - it does less damage to all the native flora and fauna here than a rake would. Just FWIW.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
I weighed answering.
My view of it all is pretty dark. If anyone has great grandchildren, they probably won't die natural deaths. So, let's get your questions out of the way first.
In my opinion, . . .
1) The politics in the US is so riddled with cancer now it's not going to recover. It may die a natural death, or it may get smacked from outside, by others on this planet. A Bernie coming along will not be permitted power to change things, and will only be a rallying point that enables us to see just how many Americans know the system is cancerous.
2) You are conflating education with a specific context in which it takes place. Education will be with us, and valuable, right up to the end when we all are toast. Whether that takes place in universities is pertinent only to those whose livelihoods depend on universities -- which is a kinda selfish way to frame the question.
3) Ain't no big tech fix. If there's any fix at all, it'll be lots of little fixes that merely reduce the degree of damage we will face.
4) Who cares how big the Left is? That only bears any significance if we assume that might makes right and a big Left can beat a little Right by numbers.
5) Money is what permits the pieces on the chessboard to move. It's the friction and the lubricant, both, depending on who is wielding it to what end. Property, in the larger sense, not just real estate, is the world's resources, what we collectively have to get by with. Does this reading mean I'm obsessed with either?
6) Speaking of obsessions, while I don't have any love for lawn mowers (or lawns), and while I think the question of monocultures on a larger scale may encompass one of the little fixes I mentioned above, that's a curious thing to fixate on when so many more significant things are about to go kablooey.
So yeah, kinda dark. But rather than give up altogether, I have posed a thought or two some months back that goes outside the politics we have now, that looks at a wider frame of education, that considers climate and societal change and how we might cope with it, and that leaves your other three questions aside as less crucial to some bigger ones: https://caucus99percent.com/content/resilience-upwelling
Maybe there is a place for a website like this. Depends on what people do with it.
@dance you monster Agreed with most of this
Agreed with most of this, would just add: money is currently weaponized to a bad extent. They're trying to do the same with words and information, and are having some success. Not as much as they're having with money, or food.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Nope, no, nowhere, nil, nah, nbt
nbt = no big thing, those are my answers in the order asked.
Climbing The Ladder of Awareness
I confess to experiencing the symptoms of Stage 5, major depressive disorder for at least the last 14 years, before that was inside a bubble where activism, the outer path of electoral politics seemed effective. Now I'm just stuck, seeking solidarity, collective survival, something/anything. My inner path no worky.
Sure don't feel like I am the aware one, when The Whole Foods of Pot is seen as progress nearby. So when I get kicked to the curb, this is why:
Rich assholes are still exporting us to death, sorry Coho, sorry Steelhead, sorry Crabs on the coast, sorry sorry sorry. Good grief.
http://www.paulchefurka.ca/Sustainability.html
at The End, "Here is my advice:"
those are "new" goals I mostly fail at every day now, except for maybe the laughing part, I do lol a lot. Thanks.
peace
@eyo I'm not sure I agree
I'm not sure I agree wholeheartedly with that entire "ladder of awareness."
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Did you want to talk about it, or just disagree?
it's cool, I'm fine either way. Your reply did make me lol cheerily, way to represent!
I guess (again) because there is no downer thumb to click on here, you did it the polite way. Thanks. If you do want discussion, what about the links to his definition of sustainability, and how he got to The End? That's the part I keep returning to, find interesting. I can no longer wholeheartedly agree with anything, but that is my own heart problem.
peace
@eyo Sorry. Got
Sorry. Got distracted from online. I don't see why realizing that the problem encompasses, or at least affects, all of life, implies the following:
The very concept of a "Solution" is seen through, and cast aside as a waste of effort.
Climate is a case in point. The problem affects all of life. But the solution is plain: stop burning petrochemicals, or at least vastly reduce burning of them. Therefore a capitalist economy based on petrochemicals cannot remain the norm and must be changed. A great deal of work was done conceiving how to make that transition, until people figured out that the ultra-mega-powerful had nixed the entire project.
It's not that there is no solution possible; in fact, a lot of the smaller-s solutions that would add up to a big-S solution were all around us. We simply were not allowed to go that way.
There's nothing inevitable about the impossibility of structural change. Structural change has been going on in spades since the early 70s; it just hasn't been directed by decent people (a mild way of putting it). There isn't some kind of nirvana moment that happens when your realization that everything is connected makes it impossible to conceive a solution. There's just a bunch of thugs and an ugly agreement between the very rich and the military.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
So, carrying capacity, and concept of overshoot mean little
it seems you are speaking about one section there, not the whole concept of "different levels of awareness". Number five looks a little like C99 to me, seemed familiar. But I always hope someone follows the links and sees something interesting to talk about.
I used to comment "Welcome to Overshooters Anonymous" on another blog, when linking to that site, it is full of charts and graphs and stuff. Went ker-plunk over there too, as everywhere it is solo clubhouse heh. Thanks for the reply.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrying_capacity
@eyo I was attacking
I was attacking the notion that the Lack of Solution is a general, universal truth.
Overpopulation might or might not be a problem without a solution, but certainly possible solutions were discarded early on, and no effort made in those directions, mainly because the most powerful nations in the world have been controlled by a handful of rich sociopaths since at least the 80s.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
NYers wanted a vote on whether to reopen the 9/11 investigation.
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=%2B%229%2F11+investigation%22+%2B%22referendum...
They jumped through all the hoops, gathered enough valid signatures.
The New York state Supreme Court ruled that you couldn’t ask that question on the ballot.
Obviously, the people who pull the strings in this system will go to any lengths to block all normal routes and channels for re-opening 9/11. All other attempts to change anything those people don’t want changed will — playing by their rules — meet the same fate.
Therefore, real change will only come through people working outside their rules, outside the normal routes and channels.
Look around. Who is breaking taboos? Who is boldly ignoring established limits on discourse? Who is speaking their minds in ways most people have been conditioned to believe is outrageous and unthinkable?
One way of doing this — one I personally reject but which has become fashionable — is decrying white people in general and threatening them with violence.
A very substantial percentage of Americans,
(many knowledgeable and impartial experts among them) are convinced that 9/11 was at least in part, an inside job. Most would assert that that the 9/11 Commission Report provided at best a shoddy and incomplete investigation, and at worst a deliberate cover-up. A thorough and fully impartial investigation is long overdue, one that at least encompasses the possibility of USG involvement and/or culpability. IMO the likelihood of such involvement is very high.
The obvious problem with all this, is that the findings of such a proceeding might very well shake the current US political establishment to its very roots. So much so, that almost nobody in any position of authority wants it to happen. But IMO it is something that does need to happen, and in the interests of simple moral decency, should already have happened. Because the longer it doesn't happen, the stronger the apparatus of the "National Security State" is likely to become.
native
9/11 (and ensuing anthrax in the mail) is a good litmus test
It launched this whole political era, gave Bush-Cheney the power to remake America in their image. People who refuse to question, or no longer even remember, the many holes in the Bush-Cheney official story — well, let’s just say they are likely to be a slim reed to rely on regarding other topics as well.
People at our Green Party meeting were freaked out by Trump
Thinking things are going to get so bad.
I smiled and said, "Yes, they will. Which is a good thing because it's finally going to swing the pendulum back to the left. Bush was a chimp, but at least he had Cheney and Rove to keep him from making a damn fool of himself. Trump is an orange clown and he's going to bring out the worst side of the Republican Party for all to see and it's going to horrify Kansas. Maybe not northern Idaho and Alabama, but Kansas, if you know what I mean.
Four years of fucked up shit. It's always darkest before the dawn.
@Battle of Blair Mountain I thought the same thing
I thought the same thing after Bush's first term. How could he possibly be reelected after starting a war on false pretenses ?
I am glad you are working in the Green Party. Vermont, where I live, doesn't have one. We have the Progressive Party which is arguably the most successful 3rd party in the USA. That said, we just elected a Republican Governor who of course, sucks.
It's my belief that most voters are unconscious. They can't see past their own slice of the world. I haven't a clue how to change it and the minor shifts we take in the "overton window" seems to appease most and kill any search for real change.
I'm not sure the pendulum analogy
is operative any longer. A pendulum's swinging back and forth depends on a pivot that holds the two extremes together. I think traditional Left/Right politics may have become disengaged from its central point of orientation.
native
caucus99percent provides
a refreshingly congenial forum that is IMO, representative of the best avante garde political thinking to be found anywhere on the net. Commenters and essayists alike tend to be very well-informed, boldly outspoken, thoughtful, and unfailingly polite. The interactive software works remarkably well, and the moderators are top-notch. What more would you want?
For me, having all this excellent quality in one place is more than one can reasonably expect from a single, relatively small, un-funded website. It seems to me that caucus99percent functions well as a kind of idea-lab, or mini-think tank, rather than as a place primarily geared for hands-on activism. More theory than practice in other words, at least for the time being -- which is fine by me. I don't expect it to ignite or to lead any revolution.
There are times that do call for immediate and decisive action, but there are other times when a more strategic, contemplative, and long-term kind of thinking is perhaps more valuable. The current political climate being so chaotic, so mutable, and so rife with disinformation, with people disagreeing everywhere you look, a certain amount of distancing is absolutely necessary. Here at least, we find an oasis of relative sanity, goodwill, and fundamental agreement. The fact that it is somewhat far from the maddening crowd may actually be a good thing.
native
Why not discuss?
Is the fall of Roman, er American Empire worth discussion by itself even if we have no answers?
@gjohnsit The Romans at least kept
The Romans at least kept the roads up. Jesus effing Christ.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Not towards the end
That's one of things I remember reading, is that Roman roads weren't safe over the last couple centuries
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