Lots of expletives but they're deleted OT - 1-14-16
I don't like that -ista ending...Clintonista for example. It's [expletive deleted]. First of all it's meant to be derogatory. Secondly, it's from Sandinista, as if Sandino was bad, as if Ortega was bad, as if any form of Communism is terribly awful...obviously! Thirdly, it implies blind followers, that anyone who would like any form of Communism must be an idiot. (The people I'm thinking of might, in fact, be blind followers and idiots but those who like Communism aren't...at least not necessarily.)
So I don't call them Clintonistas, I call them Clintonites. They aren't Democrats, that's for sure. When they become so rabid that single payer is attacked...ye gods. Does anyone doubt for a second that if Hillary had suggested it, that the same people would be loving it? That they'd scoff at anyone who wanted to "see the plan"? [expletive deleted] Turkana. What an [expletive deleted]. [expletive deleted] Democratic sites, and I mean the ones who are in favor of whatever tripe we're thrown.
And then there's the hilarious arrival of long-dormant accounts. And noobs who sound suspiciously like plants. [expletive deleted]
'em. The arguments are funny. We all noticed that it took a day for them to get the talking points together. But they're so non-Democratic...and they can't see it!! Should Hillary win the nomination she'll lose the general because people won't forget this. We knew it already but it's good to have such a clear reminder. Oh, and also Chelsea just took herself out of the running for the future. But don't mention that she had a $10 million wedding and is married to a hedge fund trader. Don't say she's a liar, just like her mother because that's going negative!
Well, ok, go ahead and say that. The Clintonites have been exposed as pathetic liars with no core beliefs. Normally I scoff at such a statement because memories are short. But this was a turning point. I'm very curious to see what happens in the polls in the next week or so. Bernie has money. He really should get a commercial produced ASAP highlighting Hillary's hypocrisy. Contrast her 2007/2008 statements with what she's saying now. What a [expletive deleted]!
So about these arrivals of people we never heard of who are so adamant about how Hillary is battle-scarred and other [expletive deleted]...are they Zombie accounts? Long ago banned posters who got out of hand in 2008? People who hated Obama? Hillary is 44 types? Believers in the "whitey tape"? I get the feeling that some are. What a [expletive deleted] cesspool!
Anyway...here's what I think will happen. It's like a flow chart so we can go in different directions. Hillary will win the nomination, either through not enough voters seeing her for what she is, or maybe superdelegates will put her over. In that case she'll lose the general election because, hey, lots and lots of people hate her. I believe it won't work this time. You know what I'm talking about. "Hold your nose and pull the lever". No. Assuming there are 41 or more Democrats in the Senate we might be better off with a President Trump or President Cruz (ugh!) than a President Hillary Clinton. The same dopes who can't see the [expletive deleted] of the Obama adminstration will insist that Hillary is the new greatest President ever or, if they think it'll make them look like they thought, the second greatest ever. But if the Democrats lose the Presidency then those same dopes will oppose the Republican President...even if he institutes the exact same policies that Hillary wants. Or that Hillary would come up with if it suited her ego. With a Republican Prez they'll be on the right side even if they're [expletive deleted] idiots who don't have a clue. But we'd be united. Whoopee!
If Bernie gets more delegates and the superdelegates go for Hillary then it'd be a disaster. This superdelegate idea is really toxic, isn't it? I think they put it in so McGovern types couldn't win. Thus it stinks.
Or Bernie will get the nomination and the DNC, led by that What-Kill-Lister, DWS, will not work very hard for his election and he'll lose. Then the Dem party will claim that it's Bernie's fault. If Hillary is the nominee and loses it'll be, according to the Dems, our fault, yours and mine and probably Bernie's too.
Or Bernie will win the election and get impeached with Democratic help. Or he'll serve out one term with Democrats stabbing him in the back the whole time.
Or, and this is the last one...if Bernie wins Iowa and New Hampshire and looks like he might win South Carolina as the tide turns, we'll see Joe Biden get into the race. [expletive deleted] 'em all!
Yeah, Zombie accounts...
some don't want to hear the truth
others have been burned before and need to warn others...in this case the fellows would like to believe but...
it all leaves me pining for the dream
Comments
Thanks for the OT, Shah...
Morning folks. I think it time we start planning for this sites near future, the future of Hillary vs. whoever. I'm as hopeful as ever that Bernie gets the nomination, but as Shah points out there are many bumps and logs in the road. If he gets the nomination, great, if he doesn't we need to prepare for the aftermath.
Certain sites are now unbearable in their gushing Hillary love, they'll be even more unbearable if she's the nominee, and just imagine what they'll be like if she becomes the President. This site needs to be positioned as a refuge from the downright bullshit that will ensue. I think it very possible that we'll experience an influx of folks looking to escape. We need to anticipate that and prepare for it.
What can we do to make a difference? How can we influence the outcome? How can we use this site to further Bernie's movement that he's developed, if after the primary, and if he is defeated, and if he decides to back Hillary and suggests his backers do the same? In a just world Bernie will recognize the momentum he's established with his movement and create a third party rather than just toss it to the wind, letting down those that are sick of the status quo and looking for true change. But I'm not going to hold my breath, and we must be ready for that outcome.
So far this site has avoided an outright promotion of any candidate although it's obvious most of us are Bernie supporters. We've kept this place more of an issues oriented venue, but if it's going to be Hillary then I think it's time we make a stand. For me, not voting is out of the question, if all potential non-voters would back the Green Party rather than sit it out, then it's possible that the Greens would make some headway. To me that's a better protest than boycotting the election.
Hopefully Bernie will be the nominee, but I think it prudent to prepare for the possibility that he's not. Should we go full-tilt Green if the establishment party wants to run another neolib/neocon or do we continue with an issues oriented agenda. What say you?
be
patient, my advice. Not a single vote has yet been cast. It is entirely possible neither of the dynastic royal family candidates shall be nominated, this time around.
Meanwhile here is a list of everyone who has filed to run for president. The most recent candidate filed yesterday. There are some interesting people there.
I'm thinking about supporting Annabella Piugattuk. Unlike all the major candidates—including Jill Stein—she does not have a birther problem. She's Inuit.
And Shah, you can go ahead and say it. It's music. ; )
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScxI94XDdtY]
Thank God for good music... :-) /nt
That's some list
Maybe I'll vote for SUCK, PONZI SCHEMES. I like his/her stance just about sums up my take on the 'issues'.
yes I agree with all of this JtC
1. yes, time to get ready, it will take some discussion, of course, to decide what "being ready" looks like for us.
2. I will definitely be voting Green if Hillary gets the nomination. the whole "lesser-evil" voting strategy has been a disaster for the working class over the past 40 some years. Time, at long last, for working people to try a new strategy.
This web site has not endorsed a candidate nor a political party, which position I support, at least for now. Of course, members here, as individuals, should be free to voice their own opinion.
I think not voting as a form of protest is a terrible strategy for working class people. The ruling class would love to see us adopt that strategy. They like that even better than our losing "lesser evil" voting strategy. Either way, the ruling class wins, but they win bigger with the not-voting strategy.
If the Greens got even 5% of the vote, the entire ruling class would shit its collective pants. That would be a great sight to see.
Never be deceived that the rich will allow you to vote away their wealth.-Lucy Parsons
If Bernie gets the nomination, and even if
he doesn't, there is some useful content in the post I put together yesterday titled "talkin' 'bout a Revolution". I think it is also time to seriously look at strikes and boycotts and such, trying to fight with the weapons that we have.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
If Sanders doesn't get the nomination
I really hope he will not hand over his supporters and will not advise them to accept HRC's nomination. I think there is a movement of people, who should not get thrown under the bus, and sites like this one could use their voices to convince Sanders to not support HRC. I remember he said he would "play by the rules" and be "curteous" to do what he needs to do (paraphrased), if he looses the nomination. I think he doesn't have to and shouldn't do that. I would be disappointed, if he did.
There is enough of "enough is enough" out there to justify another third party that should include the Green Party. My feeling is that the "betrayal" has done so much harm to the Democrats that one can't just go on "as usual". He wants a political revolution, I would want a constitutional revolution, don't know how to express myself better. But the devil is in the details of the laws and they are so many and so convoluted and so interconnected that they are used to blackmail one law against the other, that a rewrite by some "future forefathers in spe", who take equality more important than the liberty to allow inequality infinitely, is necessary.
I don't know how it is done technically, but if I could vote in this country (I wonder if I really wanted to) I would not vote for the establishment Democratic Party and would try to argue to support a third party or a write-in or vote Green Party.
I feel I am losing hope. I hope you don't. Just be stubborn and go on.
I can roll with any outcome.
Empire's pre-selected presidents are all the same to me.
Whatever site-message you choose to go with, I'll support it and happily contribute appropriate content.
____________________
The political system is what it is because the People are who they are. — Plato
X2 -- my 'bag' is mostly issues, but
anything is okay with me.
And, I think you're spot on that there will likely be an exodus away from DKos--if FSC is 'given' the nomination.
Mollie
"The best and most beautiful things in the world cannot be seen or even touched. They must be felt with the heart."--Helen Keller
Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.
No doubt I'm not voting for another Clintonite,
or as some call them, Rubinites. There is already a #bernieorbust out there. They will write Bernie in if he doesn't win the primary. They are adamant - no green, Warren, or Daffy Ducks. Hence, the Bernie or bust. There is pledge you have to sign. I don't know how members they have. Other than Bernie, I don't know that anyone can muster any organized ballot opposition. Perhaps if DFA, WFP, and MoveOn took it that far and agreed on one write in, it could have impact. I always sort of longed for "none of the above". As long as we provide a place where people are free to oppose the status quo, I think we are on the right track.
I see some of my favorite fellows here today. Nice. Have been enjoying bobswern's and NightProwlKitty's return to dkos as well. If Hillary wins, no matter how, we will have an influx of refugees. dailykos is a riot on a playground during recess now. lol, oops - that'll get you into a lot of trouble over there. OPOL really pissed of Christin with it, and I got his flag in another diary for saying how clever it was. Three little letters and OPOL destroyed the phony college kid's first ever diary on the rec list. There are at least two of them that I know of, and if I found them, they must really be bad. I'm just looking forward to a homecoming of the good folks at c99. Speaking of good guys, thinking of DetroitMark. He was giddy with being able to speak his mind.
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
The PTB (DLC/Third Way types)
Ae already talking about fielding another candidate should Clinton implode, which she will eventually. Harold Ford (ugh) was actually saying it out loud on tv the other day. i cannot find the video right now, but he mentioned Al Gore, Joe Biden, and maybe someone else.
They are desperate. But what this campaign has done is expose the vast and very deep corruption of the Democratic party. If Bernie Sanders does not win the nom, Clinton will lose the general. I have been posting since the summer of 2014 (@#*%#@ DK5 search function) that Clinton's unfavorables are way too high to carry the general. In addition, I think enough people nationwide are fed up with the Clintons. Hillary is not a good candidate and the Clintons, all of them, are nasty self serving people who need to disappear from the public eye forever.
If Bernie wins the nom, it will be a hard slog. The power brokers would rather see the country die than give up power. But at least, the entire system is exposed for what it is.
And if Bernie does not get the nom, I will be voting Green.
Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
Or, it doesn't matter because the Deep State,
that which we've heard about, read about and nodded our heads about, will still be in charge. The institutions and organizations and think tanks and systems the ruling class has painstakingly put in place over the last 110 years will prevent anything but meager progress for the serfs and continue to serve the rich and powerful. And maybe it doesn't matter because it's not democracy and isn't that what we want?
And unless we stop that, we can change nothing. As the saying goes, if voting really changed anything, it would be illegal. We are absolutely brainwashed to believe that voting for "representatives" is some sort of human cornerstone for life itself, that without voting for politicians to represent us we are somehow not whole, not part of the human race, not contributing to or participating in human society. It's no different than all the brainwashing we receive.
Just look at where it's coming from. I've never been a big voter for politicians. I vote for direct democracy actions, as imperfect as they are depending on the state processes, but I've only voted for politicians maybe 5-6 times in my life. And that was because of the brainwashing primarily, the feeling that I NEEDed to do this or I'm not doing my part, I'm not participating in the most important thing we Americans can do. Sometimes I ask people if they vote and invariably, those that say no, will do it with a sheepish, apologetic tone like they're letting someone down.
Personally I'm done with that. One thing abstaining from voting for representatives does is it in effect withdraws consent or does not give consent to be governed. People that advocate voting say things like, "if you don't vote, you don't count", or , "if you don't vote, you have no say and can't complain".
There's absolutely nothing written in the Constitution that says anything like that. This is all coming from people that want to perpetuate a rotten system of oligarchy. If I don't vote, I'm not giving my consent to be governed by this system. It's like when they look at the percentages after an election and decide whether they have a people's "mandate" or not. How can a politician or a party have a "mandate" from the people when they only received votes from 17% of the voting public? Those kinds of questions are purposefully disregarded or ignored so it's not discussed. It's just brushed off as part of the famous American system of democracy and we move on to the next one. This system of government, this two party duopoly, needs to be radically changed. We were warned about that before and after the country was "founded".
You are absolutely right, Al
Americans know very little about Human Rights, especially the most important Human Right of all: Self Determination.
This is why they are so easily bamboozled about Crimea, and the Crimean's right to self-determination.
The time will come, soon, when "self determination" will be very important to Americans.
____________________
The political system is what it is because the People are who they are. — Plato
Should be important
right now. Isn't there something in the constitution or the other lofty documents we are founded on that mentions this self evident truth?
Some big events in 2016
These things may or may not happen, but I think the chances of them happening are over 50%. And if they happen it will be very significant.
1) A recession and bear market in stocks. I think the chances of this happening within 6 months is around 60-70%. How deep is impossible to say.
This will be bad for Hillary and establishment candidates in the GOP, while good for Sanders and Trump.
2) The collapse of the ISIS caliphate. They are obviously wilting under the military pressure, and I think it's only a matter of time before they collapse.
This event will be good for Hillary and establishment candidates in the GOP, while bad for Sanders and Trump.
That being said, there are several conditions:
a) the end of the caliphate isn't the end of Daesh. They will almost certainly become a guerrilla group, like they were in 2013
b) the end of the caliphate will usher in the start of the next phase of the war, which might be worse, but might take a while to happen
ISIS lives inside hearts and minds.
The only thing keeping it alive (besides the Saudi's effort to exterminate all Shias) is the bombing runs of the US "infidels.
I predict the US will play right into the Hands of ISIS and the Saudis — with its continuous murder-sprees in the Middle East.
I know that US Intelligence and State also know what I know. (And, what the entire global Intelligence community knows.) Therefore, one must assume that ISIS benefits US Empire, which participated in its creation, with Hillary's help in gun running through Benghazi. Really, that's the only perspective that provides a clear view of the situation.
____________________
The political system is what it is because the People are who they are. — Plato
What does this mean?
Alarming
Where does he have in mind?
i'm thinking
Detroit. Minneapolis. Yellowstone National Park.
saudi arabia and turkey?
i know, dream on. we wouldn't want to wipe out the source of support for such a profit-generating enemy.
Another spy chief gets hacked
how does it feel?
well if he's not doing anything wrong, what's the problem?
eh?
^^^THIS!^^^ (n/t)
Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
From Popular Resistance:
https://www.popularresistance.org/nestles-bid-to-throw-out-child-slavery...
Never be deceived that the rich will allow you to vote away their wealth.-Lucy Parsons
Thanks, Shahryar. No matter what happens, I think it
is time to get your funds out of the Big Banks and into anything else, credit unions, food co-ops, or whatever.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Thanks to online writers like
gjohnsit we moved all our money business, personal and mortgage to a reputable CU in 2007? right before the house of cards collapsed . It was/is Oregon's state teachers credit union. We used to bank with Washington Mutual and had a mortgage that had been bundled, sold, swapped and God knows who owned it or how they got it. I had to pay 35.00$ to get a paper copy for our refinance at the CU and it was as big as the old phone books used to be. The mortgage guy at our CU went over it and said it was chock full of time bombs ready to explode.