An understandable explanation for the 2008 Stock Market Crash (that Hillary will never tell you, because it was the fault of BILL and HER DONORS!)

I originally published this essay on TOP in December 2015; it received 352 recs back then. I have decided to republish it here today with minor revisions because I, like many others, am outraged by Hillary Rodham Clinton's horrificly insensitive remarks about Sanders supporters. #BasementDwellers What is ESPECIALLY UPSETTING to me is that we wouldn't be living in basements if it weren't for the actions of her husband and the elite financial institutions that are her biggest donors. FUCK THIS SHIT!

The stock market crash of 2008 basically ruined my life (think "eat cat food in old age"), and I've been driven to understand why it happened, do you know what I mean? It’s actually taken me a few years to figure out WTF was even happening to me. I once was a highly skilled software engineer (Java, databases, yada yada), who decided to avoid the latest round of layoffs at my company by taking a personally financed sabbatical. It was lovely for a short while ... and then the stock market crashed! Woo-hoo! It was great.

Do you remember that time when nobody was hiring because we all thought the world was coming to an end? Yeah, that time helped me meet the requirements of becoming “long-term unemployed”, without me even realizing it. Add to that an industry that loves young people, and voila! My options were seriously limited. But I am not alone, many, many other families were hurt in the crash, and hurt far more than me. I especially grieve for low-income families, thousands of whom lost their homes. Did they get all their money back afterwards? No. And Republicans actually BLAME the entire crisis on them.

FYI, I found a certain episode of a show called This American Life to be especially brilliant at enabling me to understand what was behind the crash.

"The Giant Pool of Money" is an episode of the radio show This American Life which originally aired on May 9, 2008. The episode described to a general audience the causes and factors which led to the subprime mortgage crisis. Specifically, the show aimed to show the chain of people who were "participants up and down the subprime food chain".[1]

The show featured Adam Davidson, a business correspondent for National Public Radio and Alex Blumberg, a producer for the show, interviewing and reporting on the financial crisis. Blumberg described it as trying to answer the question “why are they lending money to people who can’t afford to pay it back?”

Link to Show 355: The Giant Pool of Money (and transcript). Short blurb on the website:

A special program about the housing crisis produced in a special collaboration with NPR News. We explain it all to you. What does the housing crisis have to do with the turmoil on Wall Street? Why did banks make half-million dollar loans to people without jobs or income? And why is everyone talking so much about the 1930s?

Quick Summary: the economic meltdown was not the fault of evil poor people who had been taking out mortgages that they could not afford. No, the meltdown was caused by a financial industry that was creatively coming up with a great new way FOR THEM to make money. One of their great ideas was to invent something called the “No Income No Asset” loan, or NINA. TAL’s Alex Blumberg says: “People in the industry called it a liar's loan. They expected people to lie.” Think about that for a minute. Then think about it again.

Here’s a quote from the show,

Now that same week, a few days earlier, across the river in Brooklyn, I went to a completely different kind of gathering. It was not black tie. It was put on by the Neighborhood Assistance Corporation of America. It was people on the opposite side of the mortgage crisis, people facing foreclosure, trying to figure out how to keep their homes.

I met this one guy, Richard. He's a marine. He's this big guy, over six feet tall. And when he came back from Iraq a few years ago, he bought one of these fancy new mortgages with an adjustable rate. Recently his rate reset. It has gone up by more than $2,000 a month. And he has fallen behind on his payments.

Richard

It got to the point where-- one point, my son had $7,000 in a CD. And I had to break it. And I mean that really hurt, because I was saving that money for his college. I mean, I put $2,000 back. But it's like you can't have a future. They put you in a situation where, after a while, you're going to fail. It's hard.

The idea of a father having to resort to taking money put aside for his child’s education ... what else can I say?

I now understand that the crash came about because Wall Street types and bankers and insurance guys were doing brave, new, and often fraudulent things because it was very, very lucrative for them to do so. As it turns out, part of the deal was that innocent lives happened to be destroyed. Too bad, so sad. Only they're really not sad at all. Families like mine were merely collateral damage, and will be again in the future if sufficient reforms aren't enacted to ensure that "it never happens again".

The root cause of the crisis, IMHO, was the fact that bankers started to behave in a radically different way toward mortgages. “Back in the day” one would apply for a mortgage, and then wait ever so nervously for the bankers to “approve your loan”. The waiting was awful. You see, if they didn’t think you were financially strong enough, they would deny the loan and you wouldn’t get the house. And that was because the bankers had skin in the game.

Then, something happened so that liar’s loans became possible. All of a sudden, you didn’t have to be financially strong to get a house anymore, and the loans were set up in such a way that you could actually lie on them, get it?, and you would STILL BE APPROVED FOR THE LOAN! And that was because, and most of us didn’t even know or realize this, bankers no longer had skin in the game. And even better, the bankers MADE MONEY when selling the loans, and so they truly, sincerely, did not give a shit whether or not the loan made any sense at all. In fact, they had a financial incentive to sell bad loans.

Can you guess what happens next? Tons and tons of people who were not qualified to be getting loans were getting loans. What could possibly go wrong?

Why were bankers behaving in a radically different way toward mortgages? I think it was this new thing called a CDO, which is kind of a very hi-tech and complex financial instrument, that most normal folks don’t have the math skills to understand (and even those who do still have problems).

These CDOs have been called "the engine that powered the mortgage supply chain" for nonprime mortgages,[7] and are credited with giving lenders greater incentive to make non-prime loans[8] leading up to the 2007-9 subprime mortgage crisis.

It’s all quite complicated, but the subject of “risk” seems to have been approached in a significant new way, and the banks starting taking out insurance policies on the crappy loans that they were making in order to “protect themselves”. AIG sold that insurance but they screwed up massively, didn’t calculate the risk properly, and failed.

When AIG fell down, all the banks who had insurance policies with AIG were like dominoes ready to all fall down too, because now those lovely insurance policies were essentially worth crap. And all of the bad loans that the financial giants had been making came back to haunt them in a very bad way. It was really fucking scary. But now it’s all just a distant memory and nobody seems to even care.

At the end of the day, the banks got bailed out, and even got fat bonuses (within a year? Or at the end of that year? I forget), meanwhile many, many, many completely innocent people got massively hurt. People like me. And as far as I can tell, most people who want to vote for HRC don’t really give a shit about the people who got so massively hurt when humpty dumpty fell off the wall, because OMG, Hillary is so completely awesome and if you disagree you are just a hater!!!

Unless significant reforms are made to the financial industry to prevent this situation from happening again, IT WILL HAPPEN AGAIN, and more innocent people will see their lives crushed.

I fail to understand how so many Democrats can feel that discussion of this issue is completely inappropriate for the 2016 elections and the Democratic primary. What has happened to the soul of the Democratic Party? My answer: it got massively infected by a nasty bacterial infection called Clintonitis.

OTHER USEFUL LINKS

The Nation: Hillary Clinton is Whitewashing the Financial Catastrophe

She has a plan that she claims will reform Wall Street—but she’s deflecting responsibility from old friends and donors in the industry.

Hillary Clinton Will Need to Face Facts: Her Husband Allowed Wall Street to Run Wild

Bill Clinton oversaw the repeal of Glass-Steagall, which played a key role in the 2008 fiasco.

NYT: "Harvard Poll of Millennials Finds Integrity Means More Than Experience"; prefer Bernie Sanders

Ben Carson and Donald J. Trump are locked in a statistical dead heat for the youth vote, while Senator Bernie Sanders enjoys a 41 percent-to-35 percent advantage over Hillary Clinton. The likely millennial voters said that “integrity, levelheadedness and authenticity,” and not political experience, were the attributes they were looking for as they made their choice for president.

[WARNING! Daily Kos] My concern about HRC: Oligarchy in America (call me Nostradamus, lol, I wrote this Oct 27, 2015, before the outrage called the 2016 primary had even begun. Man, I fucking hate it when I turn out to be right. FYI, I plan to port this diary over to c99, so if you have "taken the oath" to avoid TOP, please be patient with me).

In this diary I have tried to describe, respectfully, the elephant that terrifies me. I'd like to understand why it doesn't terrify everyone here ... I am sincerely worried that if Clinton is elected the oligarchs will increase their power, possibly to the point that elections even cease because they have been reduced to democracy theater. I have a child. What will become of her in a world ruled essentially by a new aristocracy? In such a world, she will likely be a serf because the serfs are many and the nobles are few. I am horrified. I cannot believe that this is all actually happening in my lifetime …

When I reflect a bit, I realize that the overlords benefit in an almost Orwellian way when discussion on this topic is stifled. Remember Newspeak in the novel "Nineteen Eighty-Four"? It was a carefully constructed language designed to control the thoughts of the people. The idea was that if you limit a person's ability to talk about something, you also limit that person's ability to even think about that something. If we never discuss the state of democracy in America, most people won't think about it; as a result won't they lose their grasp of what democracy actually is, and what it even looks like? If that happens, can't it be taken away more easily? Is it possible democracy has already been lost? I admire Sanders greatly for having the courage to OPENLY AND FREQUENTLY talk about this issue

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Older and Wiser Now's picture

I will be away for a bit, but will be back later to respond to any comments. In the mean time, feel free to discuss without me.

Best, ~OaWN

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~OaWN

Hawkfish's picture

Most of this crap is not that hard to understand. The problem is that the salesmen on Wall Street keep making up new names for stuff. They even mock this tendency at the end of the movie by referencing the latest thing called a "bespoke tranche opportunity". In plain English, they just mean that they hand picked (bespoke) a bunch of mortgages (the tranche) and want to sell it to you quickly before it starts to smell (opportunity).

A CDO is just where you create an entity (basically a company) to own the loans and sells shares in it to fund the purchase of the loans. Sort of like a mutual fund. They just keep doing this stuff in more and more layers, giving it different names each time, but really it's not as complex as they make it out to be. The connections can get complex, but the components are pretty straightforward.

The worst part is that they fool themselves. Greedy is bad, but greedy and stupid is even worse...

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We can’t save the world by playing by the rules, because the rules have to be changed.
- Greta Thunberg

Amanda Matthews's picture

J.P. Morgan Chief James Dimon Sounds Alarm on Car Loans
By EMILY GLAZER and ANNAMARIA ANDRIOTIS
Updated June 2, 2016 7:04 p.m. ET

Executive says bank is ‘very careful’ in auto-lending market

***
J.P. Morgan Chase & Co. Chief Executive James Dimon on Thursday called the auto-lending market “a little stretched,” the latest warning about a part of the economy that has boomed this decade.

The head of the nation’s largest bank by assets said that the $1 trillion auto-loan market, which has grown along with the economy, falling unemployment and a recent decline in gasoline prices, may not remain a bright spot for long.

“Someone is going to get hurt,” he said. “It won’t be us.”

*
Mr. Dimon said that while he doesn’t see an auto-market downturn as imminent, he does see increased risk due to higher default rates from increased subprime lending, the growing use of longer repayment periods for borrowers and the potential for used-car prices to drop in coming years, which could hurt the value of lenders’ collateral when borrowers default.

The volume of car loans held by subprime consumers increased by 11% in the first quarter compared with the same period a year before, outpacing the 9% increase for customers with high credit scores, according to Experian.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/j-p-morgan-chief-james-dimon-sounds-alarm-on...

***

Wall Street’s Latest Scam: Subprime Auto Loans
OCTOBER 21, 2014 BY JOHN LAWRENCE
http://sandiegofreepress.org/2014/10/wall-streets-latest-scam-subprime-a...

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I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks

Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa

Older and Wiser Now's picture

and informative.

When you truly cannot understand what the nice man in the nice suit is selling, it's really best not to buy instead of assuming that they are smart and you can/should trust them. They WANT you to trust them, that's why they are willing to pay extra for the suit.

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~OaWN

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elenacarlena's picture

the banks. Then most homeowners would choose to pay up their mortgages and keep their homes. But if not or if they're too far into foreclosure and/or if the banks refuse to work with them, then screw the banks and keep the money.

But they also should have done something about predatory interest rates. What kind of level-headed Marine would buy a house requiring an additional $2000 per month? Maybe he lives in a high-priced area, but around here you can easily get a nice 3-bedroom for less than $1000 per month fixed rate, so that would be a mansion. I'm sure many people of modest means knew better than to buy mansions, so interest and fees must have been horrendous.

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SmartAleq's picture

They wrote those liar's loans and their spiel to the prospective homeowner was "Well, your credit is a little dodgy but we want to help you so we have this thing called an adjustable rate mortgage. We hook you up with five years at an artifically low interest rate, then after that it goes up to this totally usurious rate but if you repair your credit during that time you'll have no problem refinancing we swearz and we're totes sure you'll be able to do this, sign here." Then they'd do a 90/10 mortgage and a second mortgage for the 10% down payment through their own lending arm at a higher rate of interest than the main loan, all of which was to come due at the same time as the ARM went to the ridiculous interest rate. The bank collected on the second mortgage with interest, then when the ARM went nuclear the homeowners discovered that they were stuck with that loan because nobody--NOBODY--would rewrite their loan, not for love nor money. And their payments ballooned, they went into foreclosure and at one point we had an explosion of homeless people while we also had a glut of foreclosures standing empty--at one point there were 19 empty foreclosures for every homeless person in America.

So you can't blame the home buyers--they went to an expert, as we ALL do, and were lied to and sold a bill of goods and cheated and ruined and those poor bastards will never be able to finance another house in their lives--but those lenders sure made a fuckton on those loans and CDOs and then on selling those foreclosed properties to hedge funds who in turn rent them out at exorbitant rates to homeless bastards who have no other options. It's not the poor people's fault they were used and tossed out like snot rags.

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"Nothing's wrong, son, look at the news!" -- Firesign Theater

elenacarlena's picture

then I miswrote. I'm saying that I know nobody of modest means was buying mansions, especially someone like a level-headed ex-Marine. Maybe not literally nobody, but few people would take a chance on refinancing by buying way more house than they need. You might stretch yourself to buy a house at all when in the past you couldn't afford it, but you wouldn't volunteer for multiple thousands per month. So if a regular decent house would run you approximately $1000 per month, where does the additional $2000 per month on an ARM come from (in addition to whatever they were already paying on the mortgage)? It has to be interest, fees, a bunch of BS that should never have been allowed; and once it was, when the foreclosures became an issue and the banks looked ready to collapse, the government should have stepped in and said, "No, you can't charge that, here's what the new mortgage payments are going to be," just erased all the banks' overcharging BS and if they didn't like it, tough, they blew themselves up, there should be consequences.

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Older and Wiser Now's picture

the overall situation, and ARM's were one of them.

And I didn't really mean to be saying "this" or "that" was THE REASON, I was trying to give a higher level frame to the overall situation. To me, the most compelling bit is that once upon a time, the bankers had skin in the game and thus would not make loans to those who were not reasonably qualified. But then that changed.

Someone had gotten the bright idea that instead of holding those mortgages themselves, they could slice and dice, and repackage and SELL them - kind of like hamburger, as Matt Taibbi has described it - to other parties, who actually had an "appetite for risk" because the market had been so bullish for so long. Since the bankers weren't "eating their own dog food" - they were creating a product to be consumed by others - they didn't mind mixing in a little (or A LOT) of horse-meat into the recipe.

The bankers fundamentally changed their business model, but most of us didn't realize it, and I think that part is key. We had a belief that a banker would never make a loan to someone who wasn't qualified, that would be crazy, because under the old model IT WOULD have in fact been crazy. They had skin in the game back then, and so they WOULD have lost money. But in the new model, they didn't have any intention of keeping the loans, and so the risk of non-payment was NO LONGER AN ISSUE THEY THEMSELVES needed to worry about, the risk was being passed on to others. And the reality was that they others who bought the loans A) didn't quite understand what they were buying, and B) were deceived by ratings agencies who were willing to deceptively label horse-meat as 96% lean, triple-A quality ground chuck.

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~OaWN

TheOtherMaven's picture

Horse is rather nutritious, actually, although eating horse meat is unthinkable in most of the Western world (what? Eat Trigger? Silver? My Friend Flicka? No way!).

No, what they're mixing in is anonymous road kill, left to rot in the sun until somebody scrapes it up.

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There is no justice. There can be no peace.

predictable greed. Everything else is a symptom or a consequence.

The Clinton White House should have urged Democratic Senators to filibuster/block the Commodities Futures Modernization Act of 2000, which left crap mortgages derivatives unregulated. It should have done the same with the Financial Services Modernization Act of 1999, which allowed banks to speculate. Instead, it lobbied Democrats hard to vote in favor of both bills. Greenspan also lobbied hard for both bills. Once those bills passed, the economy was a goner. It was only a matter of time. And guess what? No one repealed them.

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MsGrin's picture

That's one way to make sure folks are less eligible to re-finance b/c of credit lines they don't even know they have (and which guaranteed they'd pay higher interest for the life of their loans).

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'What we are left with is an agency mandated to ensure transparency and disclosure that is actually working to keep the public in the dark' - Ann M. Ravel, former FEC member

Older and Wiser Now's picture

situations that no longer make sense, and yet they try to shame the little guys in fulfilling the terms of their loans, even when the terms are highly unfavorable to them.

It does indeed depend on where you are living in the US - the cost of real estate in CA is especially outrageous, of course. The guy might have squeaked into a situation and was finally able to buy the home ... and then simply as an auto-pilot response, was doing everything he could to keep it.

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~OaWN

I always used the following explanation to get people to understand the financial shenanigans that went down in the 2000s that led up to the 2007-2009 crash.

One facet was something called Credit Default Swaps (Swaps). Swaps were a "finanacial innovation" thought up by the big bankers, insurance, and mortgage companies. They are insurance policies against loan defaults.

Let's say you bought a house and took out a loan for $200,000 from Bank A. This was a subprime loan where the interest rate would start out very low, and then spike in the future after a certain number of years. Of course, Bank A would be worried that you might default on the loan after the interest rates spike, so they would take out insurance against that possibility from another bank--say Bank TOP, for $200,000 in Swaps. Bank A would pay Bank TOP a monthly fee for the insurance policy and Bank TOP would pay Bank A $200,000 if you defaulted. By making a number of these Swap policies, Bank TOP would make a nice profitable income via these fees so that they looked profitable.

However, under the "innovative" rules of the time, Bank TOP didn't need to have that $200,000 in capital to back up its Swap policies. In fact, it didn't need to have any money at all! Also, Bank A would ask other banks to insure the same mortgage loan, so, Bank DNC would also insure your loan for $200,000 (which they didn't have in capital), and Bank Switzerland would also insure your loan for $200,000 (which they don't have to have on hand). What happened was that many loans would end up having many such Swaps insuring the loan--so your $200,000 loan might be insured for $1,000,000 via multiple banks/insurers/mortgage companies. That $1,000,000 doesn't have to exist anywhere.

Bank A would be making similar Swap arrangements for loans that other banks made. A good, steady source of income.

But, during the course of business, Bank A would realize--hey, if you default on your mortgage, instead of getting interest on $200,000, they'd get a $1,000,000 payout! So, Bank A would make these subprime rates more and more onerous over time so that more people default, and they'd get more money!

This went on for some time, and around 2007, the Swap market was insuring loans (home, business, etc.) to the tune of $60 trillion. That money did not exist anywhere at all. The money wasn't real. There really isn't that much money in the world. But the debt that would need to be paid out by banks if everyone started defaulting was real--a legal obligation. So, when things turned south, banks suddenly owed trillions of dollars that they couldn't pay.

So, the government stepped in in various ways--with our taxpayer money--to bail them out. Direct loans to banks, quantitative easing, etc. They didn't pay off $60 trillion. But they did do enough to stop the drop, to the tune of trillions of dollars (I seem to remember the number $4 trillion being tossed around), and life went on. But not much changed in the financial innovation sector.

This was made possible partly by the repeal of Glass Steagall, which made a rule that banks couldn't get involved in insurance or speculative investments, and that banks, insurance companies, and investment companies had to be separate. This was also made possible by the complete lack of regulation around Swaps.

Swaps were only one part of the crisis, but they were a big part. There were other financial "innovations" that went bad and had their own far-reaching effects. Banks were TRYING to sign up people who they knew would not be able to pay the subprime mortgages when the rates spiked, because it would mean a lot of money for them once the mortgage purchaser defaulted. (Insurance payout!)

Often, people don't really understand how this all went down, or why. Although there are a couple new regulations in place (banks have to have a higher percentage of capital versus their potential obligations, for example), these are in no way adequate to handle a large recession or depression. I hope this example clarifies for some at least one aspect of what went down and how these "innovations" take place.

There is now more fake money out there being played with than in 2007. Nothing has really changed. The next time things go bad, it will likely be a bigger crisis, and at some point the government won't be able to handle it.

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Older and Wiser Now's picture

The precise details are important, but IMHO they can be rather mind-numbing to many people. This might sound confusing, but with this essay I wasn't trying to say THIS was important and THAT wasn't ... I was trying to put an explanation out there that "normal" people could actually understand (if that makes sense).

I didn't go into the exact details about how the repeal of Glass-Steagall came into it, but it was key because Glass-Steagall would have prevented the ability of the banks to go into the resale business. The banks took boring, stodgy old mortgages and TURNED THEM INTO AN INGREDIENT for a brand new product that was then sold to others. And that was the core issue ... under Glass-Steagall, they would have had to "eat their own dog food" (i.e. hold their own loans, as they had always done in the past) and thus would not have had an incentive to sell mortgages to folks who were not qualified to buy them.

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~OaWN

travelerxxx's picture

Thanks for this, OWN. Your essay is something we could direct folks to when they comment that they don't really understand the causes of the Great Recession.

I studied the GR and came to the same conclusions as you have presented. In the process, I found numerous online sites that were following the situation and were able to teach a layman about the economics involved. One of the best sites is one linked to the left on C99, Naked Capitalism. I found that I was forced to head out of my comfort zone in my search for accurate information. Sometimes I wound up at right-wing leaning sites, but only those who detested corruption.

For instance, I had discovered Karl Denninger long before Santelli's rant on the floor of the Chicago Board of Trade. I found myself at Mish's place, patrick.net, The Big Picture, etc. All of this was before the genesis of the Tea Party. Denninger had framed the Tea Party long before Santelli, so I was in on it early. I remember going to a couple of early local Tea Party meetings in my area. The first few were very bipartisan affairs, and also very multi-racial. Many of us did not consider the movement in those early days to be right-wing. That changed almost immediately. I recall the second meeting I attended. The confederate flags suddenly showed up. When they did show up, I remember leaving in disgust. Walking away with me were all the people of color who had come. It was a big wake up call for us. Later, even Denninger denounced the Tea Party when they started misdirecting the blame for the recession.

My primary reason in voting for Obama was that he convinced me that he would go after the Wall Street firms that had crashed our economy, and also the changes in law that allowed it to happen. I knew within a week that I had made a mistake. In fact, I suspected it the night of the election. That night, when leaving the celebration in Chicago, some reporter shouted some question at Obama (don't remember the question and it doesn't matter). It was his reply that got me. His answer to the reporter was one sentence: "I'm going to surprise a lot of people." I never forgot that he said that, so I realized when he started naming his cabinet members exactly what he was talking about. All his promises during the campaign were what he later referred to as, "...just campaign rhetoric." He actually said that. I've tried to find video of each of these statement he made (all on camera), but have never been able to dig them up.

Anyway, I'm rambling.... Thanks again for your thoughtful and accurate essay.

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Older and Wiser Now's picture

and thank you for sharing the names of sites and places that have been helpful to you. For me, that episode of This American Life was simply amazing, and apparently it has had that same effect on many other people too. The folks who produced it went on to produce another podcast called Planet Money that I've listened to for a long time - I find that they know how to take complex financial situations and translate them into terms that laymen can actually understand. Sometimes, I disagree with what they are saying, but I find them to be well intentioned; sometimes reasonable people can disagree.

Obama has been such a disappointment. Turns out that he was simply another snake oil salesman, a Bill Clinton version II. He looked like one thing, but in truth was something very different ...

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~OaWN

jwa13's picture

when he named Geithner Treasury Secretary. GEITHNER!!! talk about foxes & henhouses --

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When Cicero had finished speaking, the people said “How well he spoke”.
When Demosthenes had finished speaking, the people said “Let us march”.

The next time things go bad, it will likely be a bigger crisis, and at some point the government won't be able to handle it.

I think you mean "-at some point the government will squeeze the taxpayers again for the benefit of their wealthy donors, but no more blood will come out."

Is it time to re-examine Communism yet? Just curious.

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"Capitalism is the extraordinary belief that the nastiest of men for the nastiest of motives will somehow work for the benefit of all."
- John Maynard Keynes

thanatokephaloides's picture

Is it time to re-examine Communism yet? Just curious.

It's time to re-examine Anarcho-Socialism, which we haven't really done since the end of the Spanish Civil War.

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"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar

"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides

You pretty much capture it!

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travelerxxx's picture

From: The San Diego Free Press - The Bail-In: How You and Your Money Will Be Parted During the Next Banking Crisis

However, instead of taking money from the government (taxpayers), the principal has been established that the next source of money for profligate banks will be your deposit accounts. Yeah, that’s right, the money to stabilize the banking sector during the next crisis will come out of your savings and checking accounts.

Just in case you've forgotten, the "Frank" in Dodd-Frank is the illustrious Democrat, Barney Frank. That's Democrat, as in Party of the People, as in Home of FDR. At least, that's what the sign above the door says...

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This should be widely spread around so that people actually still having any shift their money into Credit Unions before the next crash, expected pretty much momentarily...

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Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.

A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.

Whenever you hear that, there is badness going on.

I mean really--if there is one place "innovation" shouldn't happen it's in finance. Maybe with regard to technology is okay--but even then, not really. Most stock trades are now performed by machines to the benefit of companies and to the detriment of individual shareholders. Another "financial innovation" that is probably doing citizens more harm than good.

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Older and Wiser Now's picture

Your words remind me of an account of some journalist who was granted the opportunity to be a passenger in one of these newfangled, driver-less cars. They said that the experience was TREMENDOUSLY BORING, and then added that when one stops and thinks about it, that's exactly what you'd want it to be. You don't WANT to be a passenger on an exciting ride, because exciting ultimately means a bit dangerous ... and that is not what a sane passenger should be looking to buy.

Financial innovation is really just a way to describe a clever solution that allows the masters of the universe to make their own money off of other people's money, instead of doing the hard work to actually earn it for themselves.

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~OaWN

Moody's and Fitch etc, rated these credit default swaps highly. This allowed the banks to go deeper and deeper into their scam while their rating agencies committed fraud by saying all is well.

We still have credit swaps....why ? What is the purpose of these "instruments" except to obfuscate the real value of any given loan ? It's BS created by very smart and fraudulent actors.

Meanwhile, Big Banks Frank and her heinous are very confident there are no more economic shenanigans going on. I call bull shit. Just like Moody's gets paid by banks to rate banks, Clinton/Frank et al get paid by banks to regulate banks. Gee, what could possibly go wrong ?

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ggersh's picture

the deregulation of derivatives. Brooksley Born tried to put the kabosh on it. If I remember correctly Brooksley Born told Summers, Greenspan, and Rubin that you shouldn't deregulate derivatives, they gave her the big middle finger and the rest is history.

https://www.congress.gov/bill/106th-congress/house-bill/5660you couldn't buy the p

Now to find out who really profited and knew what was coming we only need to know who bought the "puts" on Bear Stearns, cause up until the crash, the exchange wouldn't allow the strike on BSC puts to be where they where, i.e. you were able to buy puts that were way out of the money so the profit from them would be quite ginourmous.

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I never knew that the term "Never Again" only pertained to
those born Jewish

"Antisemite used to be someone who didn't like Jews
now it's someone who Jews don't like"

Heard from Margaret Kimberley

lotlizard's picture

http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/frances-oldham-kelsey-canadian-doctor-and-...

But unlike Dr. Kelsey, no one in politics or government would support Brooksley Born, so she was unable to save the country from evil as Dr. Kelsey did.

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ggersh's picture

would go to jail for whistleblowing, everything is upside down.

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I never knew that the term "Never Again" only pertained to
those born Jewish

"Antisemite used to be someone who didn't like Jews
now it's someone who Jews don't like"

Heard from Margaret Kimberley

riverlover's picture

How now (brown cow) to hedge against the looming Bigger One? Withdraw enough from savings (lol) to bury in the back yard for a rainy day? Invent another shadow bank industry? Learn barter, of course. I am still not good at that, on the learning curve now.

Damn, my turnip crop ( as others) failed this year, but I am no recognized Farmer so did not buy crop insurance, which this year would been a good investment locally, as we now qualify (farmers only) for drought relief. MY "crop" here is firewood, 20 acres of trees, enough downfall that I have local pickers, who I tolerate, but net no write-off for my generosity. I carry enough liability insurance that I could absorb an injury by tree...

Still carrying a HELOC, paying down slowly, as the interest rate is 3.25%, and the tax deduction is there. I could not pay off the little bugger without bankruptcy. Very invested in real estate, over-exposed there. And I have a $400K fraud lawsuit about the smaller half of that, in another country, so Jubilee would be no help. And the Big Re-assortment looms large.

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Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.

Older and Wiser Now's picture

One piece of wisdom is to watch what insiders are doing for clues - if they are buying, consider buying. If they are selling, consider selling. There is a certain logic to that.

Seems to me that most of the big players are holding tons and tons of cash, rather than investing it. Why? I think that's the $64,000 question. Seems to me that they are apparently expecting a huge crash of some kind, right? And that makes me very nervous.

I personally would rather have my money invested in tangibles ... things that are real. But money is really just a concept, this thing that in itself doesn't have value except for the value that we all collectively agree to give it. My own two cents is that holding real estate would be a good thing to be doing these days ... but that's just my two cents. In the end, if the global economy crashes in some 2008 Version II scenario, at least you'll have a place to live and raise a bit of your own food. What frustrates me is that if something big DOES happen, it will seem obvious in hindsight what we all SHOULD have been doing, but it's not so easy trying to anticipate just what that is from our current vantage point though.

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~OaWN

MsGrin's picture

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'What we are left with is an agency mandated to ensure transparency and disclosure that is actually working to keep the public in the dark' - Ann M. Ravel, former FEC member

Older and Wiser Now's picture

You know, I think you are now actually to "blame" for it twice, lol. I think I wrote it in the first place because YOU had another diary on the rec list that I wanted to support ... in fact, didn't you write a piece related to either the first or second item on my "Other Reading" list? I edited one of them to take out a reference to TOP and point to the main source itself (to minimize links to TOP), but now I'm forgetting which one. And thanks again for all of the great writing you've been doing over here! Every time I see your name on an essay over here, I keep thinking "Hey! I know HER!" and about the great Women for Bernie group. Go Sister Go!

The leaked audio story, man, it pisses me off so much.

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~OaWN