Clinton apparatchiks between administrations and cabinet posts.
As far as I can tell from doing a bit of reading, the Foundation works something like a brokerage or middle man matching corporations and philanthropy or projects under the guise of philanthropy. I'm not saying they haven't done good things, but it is really really hard to tell from their website exactly what "commitments" have been fulfilled and to what benefit and to whose advantage? Often it seems like a way to marry no-bid contracts in developing markets. One thing I have learned from reading about the Foundation and TPP, etc. is that cornering "developing markets" gets the Masters of the Universe way more excited than sales increases of dribs and drabs from incremental growth in built out, developed markets.
It also seems like the WJC and the Clinton Foundation made a complete hash out of Haiti. A simple person like me would think that basic housing, food, education and infrastructure would have greater importance than luxury hotels and business parks in terms of priority for the rebuilding.
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" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "
You would need to find someone familiar with grant writing becasue it uses a language all its own.
I have been on the grant writing end and know that like with any kind of writing, there has to be a firm purpose in mind and that you need to address the audience in a language they understand. The first step is always the research of which grants your organization has the best chance with as it helps cut down on the "no" factor.
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We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.--Aristotle
If there is no struggle there is no progress.--Frederick Douglass
I have spent my adult life running non profits....
You have to become a charity... Have a board of directors. A mission statement and a proven record that you can accomplish what you say you will ... And the. You have to do mountains of paperwork and wait for approval
And if you are lucky to get certification and even get a grant or two you must justify every penny and how it is used
an easy solution...that it would take a lot of work.
Second, a 501(c) does not have to be a charity. There are 29 different types of nonprofit organizations and even more once you step outside of the 501 designation.
A 501(c)(4) organization is a social welfare organization, such as a civic organization or a neighborhood association. An organization is considered by the IRS to be operated exclusively for the promotion of social welfare if it is primarily engaged in promoting the common good and general welfare of the people of the community.[59][66] Net earnings must be exclusively used for charitable, educational, or recreational purposes.[67]
Allowed activities
501(c)(4) organizations may inform the public on controversial subjects and attempt to influence legislation relevant to its program[68] and, unlike 501(c)(3) organizations, they may also participate in political campaigns and elections, as long as their primary activity is the promotion of social welfare and related to the organization's purpose.[69][70]
The income tax exemption for 501(c)(4) organizations applies to most of their operations, but income spent on political activities—generally the advocacy of a particular candidate in an election—is taxable.[71] An "action" organization generally qualifies as a 501(c)(4) organization.[72] An "action" organization is one whose activities substantially include, or are exclusively,[73] direct or grassroots lobbying related to advocacy for or against legislation or proposing, supporting, or opposing legislation that is related to its purpose.[74]
A 501(c)(4) organization may directly or indirectly support or oppose a candidate for public office as long as such activities are not a substantial amount of its activities.[59][75]
While I did not run non-profits, I spent the majority of my working life working for them, mostly being involved in grant writing, editing, writing and publishing various manuals and newsletters, supervising volunteers and coordinating activities.
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We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.--Aristotle
If there is no struggle there is no progress.--Frederick Douglass
to be clearer. There are a lot of different designations for them with education of various types being the emphasis.
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We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.--Aristotle
If there is no struggle there is no progress.--Frederick Douglass
a paid, yearly subscription is the question at hand. I think setting up once-a-year subscriptions works best because once a year is like pulling a Band Aide off quickly. Monthly involves 12 painful tugs. They should be on two levels: $25.00 if income below $30,000 or $50.00 if income above $30,000. Give newcomers first month free to see if they like the site, then they must join.
Begging periodically for contributions burns you out and gets you nothing, but REQUIRING up front payment keeps you going. A GoFundMe campaign will get you cash to take the pressure off and give you time to set up a subscriptions system. Good luck, whatever you decide to do.
disregards low income people for whom $25 a month would be an impossible burden.
My only income is $736/month from Social Security Retirement. That comes to $8832/year -- well below poverty level. Your suggested $25/month would reduce my income by $300/year, leaving $8532/year. I do not feel I could safely commit $25/month to *anything* non-essential.
I have been considering donating regularly to groups like Brand New Congress and/or OR, and I would like to contribute regularly to our wonderful local Food Bank or its outreach sites. My limit for any regular donation would have to be no more than $3-$5/month.
I am not writing this to complain, but just to insert some reality about low-income people into this discussion, insofar as it is about fundraising. I'm sure there are others besides myself here who could only give minimal amounts, if anything at all. Although I'm sure other categories of users face these issues, I am mainly concerned for the impact of required, regular fees on Elder Women and disabled people
about rectifying the 'new rules' ruckus there, because some women at KFS had been savagely attacked with MSM-type gynophobic spittle-flecked hatred during the recent upheaval there.
Here's the resolution of the incident here that I referred to at KFS:
First I want to note that I did not say, suggest, or imply that c99 was 'harboring' MSM proponents. Your use of the word 'harboring' implies that I was maliciously spreading unfounded gossip, an implication which is untrue. I did talk about my recent experience here with one MSM proponent, and the aftermath of that incident. To summarize that incident:
I asked the Mods to check out the MSM memes someone had posted as a comment. The link is to JtC's intervention with that user. JtC's response was that (paraphrased) it was the consensus among the mods that MSM memes could not be considered 'civil discourse' and thus were unwelcome here at c99. JtC also warned the MSM proponent to stop it. The user doubled down on presenting MSM ideology, writing another 2-3 comments in that thread, after JtC's warning.
The other thing I wrote in the KFS comment you refer to is that since that incident, I've noticed that a few users here (1-3 users) have started to show up with an off-topic reply to a comment of mine; these comments appear to have no use other than to disparage me and portray me as mean-spirited and untrustworthy.
So here you are, Shiz, making a wildly off-topic comment, and that comment's function appears to be only to disparage me and make me seem untrustworthy. Hmmm. Your comment seems to be walkin' like a duck, Shiz.
I'm not going to report this to the mods tonight, but only because I don't want to bum out JTC's evening, just when he's getting so much positive reinforcement from the community.
MSM propagandists show up anywhere on the Internet where they can post comments. At least one (and possibly 'some') have shown up here. JtC, in consensus with all the mods, have made it clear that MSM-speech cannot be considered 'civil discourse', that such speech is unwelcome at c99, and that Admin is willing to take action against such speech.
talking shit about c99p on KFS, and that pissed me off. I clearly read the comment 100% wrong, and I would like to apologize, but I highly doubt that you'd be willing to accept any sort of apology from me, given your comment above.
If you want to report me to Admin, go for it. I was most definitely in the wrong, but your comment above was really over the top. Jesus Christ.
We got along famously on Dkos and I have always respected you as a writer and a commenter. I'd also like to point out that I would never suggest that anyone who can't afford it should donate to c99p, ever. That's inhumane and cruel, and pretty much goes against my entire value system as a human being.
I hope we can somehow find a way to rectify this, CroneWit. I don't know what to say. If you want to, please message me and we can talk more there.
However, I object to your characterization of my reply to you as 'over the top'. It is thorough and factual. Since you saw fit to interrupt a happy celebration of community with an off-topic comment that appears to have no purpose other than to disparage me and make me appear untrustworthy (not credible) to the community, and since your comment would receive a lot of exposure in this diary, I felt obligated to respond with the truth about my actions and my experiences during the last month.
I did not 'talk shit about c99' at KFS. I used my experience here, in response to women who had described being attacked by MSM shit at Kfs, to begin to address the fact that MSM-types (and their copycats) are all over the Internet spreading their MSM-memes, and to suggest that political-discussion sites will have to confront and discuss whether MSM rhetoric is acceptable as 'civil discourse' on our sites. I summarized and posted the link to JtC's perfect position statement to the effect that 'MSM speech cannot be considered 'civil discourse' and thus is unwelcome at c99.
So rather than 'talking shit about c99', I was showing KFS' readers that *c99 is the first Left site to face and appropriately deal with MSM-type hate-speech against women*.
I urge you, Shiz, to go read JtC's perfect wording of c99's position on MSM speech. Then please take a few minutes to read the comments by the MSM-talker. (If that link is wrong somehow, please let me know and i'll edit it. I'm working with a new device and haven't mastered some of the basics yet.)
I'm willing to consider this matter settled, Shiz, if you do. If you wnt to continue this discussion, I'd rather continue it in pubic view, where you began it.
I should probably keep quiet and stay out of this, but I feel I need to stand with Shiz here. First, this:
Since you saw fit to interrupt a happy celebration of community with an off-topic comment
Actually, it was you, cronewit, who chose to disrupt a good discussion on brainstorming fundraising ideas by disparaging someone's idea for a subscription fee of $25 a year ($2.08 per month), claiming it was "disregarding low income people" who couldn't afford $300 a year. What?
When your error was politely pointed out, you doubled down with a snide comment about "doing the math" which continued the misrepresentation of the proposal. You refused to acknowledge you'd got it wrong, and you still haven't.
Shiz said she didn't like your negative statements about this place on another site, and therefore saw your tossing out this inexplicable, nonsensical complaint as suspect. Not really off topic, since your counterfactual negativity was rather bizarre.
In response, you suggested that Shiz herself is somehow connected with "MSM" (whatever that is) supporters who are following and harassing you here. Which is, absolutely, over the top!
And now I suppose I'll also be accused of being part of some evil cabal on here! Lol, yeah me an Shiz, we loves the "MSM" -- and seriously, what are you referring to? Do you mean MRA? (Men's rights activists) If so, you are very wrong, I've seen none of that on here. Someone even got chastised for a Matrix movie reference about taking the red pill, since apparently some MRA morons have stolen that phrase.
Telling people on other sites that such jokers are harassing you on here qualifies as talking shit about this place, in my book. And suggesting that Shiz is one of them is just as disconnected from reality as your statement that $25 per year = $300 per year.
That's pretty much what I was driving at. I didn't think it needed to be pointed out that I'm most certainly not a Men's Rights Activist (lol), but perhaps it does. That part was absolutely over the top.
And you are correct, I did think that CroneWit was interrupting the happy celebration with the "disregarding low income people" bullshit, because I highly doubt the admins of this place would ever be willing to institute a policy like that. I don't think JtC and Joe would be down with that at all, and I'm not, either.
Thanks again, man. Your comment means a great deal to me.
First, regarding my possible math error: Writerisres' comment appeared to me to mention both yearly and monthly ways of giving, but did not mention clearly which mode he was recommending. The 'first month free' bit made it look to me as though s/he was suggesting a $25/month fee after the first free month. Since the language remains unclear, and its author did not reply to clarify my understanding, I didn't see a need to apologize. But since you feel i made a willfully egregious statement, the best I can offer is this: I may have misunderstood the author's intent and based my math of $25 x 12 =$300. If I am in error and the author meant yearly donations, not monthly, then my math was indeed wrong, and I apologize. (Please note that the first actual fundraiser asked for pledges of a stated amount monthly, and that most of the pledges made were for $25.)
http://caucus99percent.com/comment/154886#comment-154886
a paid, yearly subscription is the question at hand. I think setting up once-a-year subscriptions works best because once a year is like pulling a Band Aide off quickly. Monthly involves 12 painful tugs. They should be on two levels: $25.00 if income below $30,000 or $50.00 if income above $30,000. Give newcomers first month free to see if they like the site, then they must join.
Given my possibly mistaken reading of Writerinres' comment and my accurate math on what I understood the author to be suggesting, I felt obligated to speak up for c99's low-income readers, many of whom are elder women and/or handicapped so they would be considered in any structured way of giving that might be decided on so their situations would not be disregarded. Up to that point in the thread, no one had spoken a word on how to include low-income people in the financial-support aspect of c99, and that was already bothering me. Although your math of $25/12 = $2.08/month is correct, your cavalier assumption that poor folks can manage that shows a lack of awareness and/or a disregard for the monetary lives of the really poor. I am living well below the poverty level now, even with my Social Security Retirement funds, and for over 15 years I lived without even that, due to health issues. I had to worry, for 15 years, whether of not I would be able to buy toilet paper the next month; when the occasional salesman would come to my door saying 'For only $25 you can have . . ..' I would cut them off and tell them that If I was lucky enough to come across $25, the first things I'd buy would be cat food and toilet paper, then maybe do a load of laundry at the laundromat. I understand how precious and vital a small sum like $2 -- let alone the enormous sum of $25 in one month -- can be for poor folks. People who are lucky enough to consider $25 a negligible amount that anybody can afford don't understand poor folk's lives.
Regarding the rest of your comment:
Shiz had spelled out 'Men's Rights Movement' in her comment and I didn't see a need to spell it out again. And yes, MRM types like to refer to themselves as 'activists', while imo that name grants them a dignity they don't deserve.
I did not, as you claim, suggest that "Shiz herself is somehow connected with "MSM" '. I reported some strange, off-topic replies to comments that I had received in the week since I had an actual run-in with an actual MSM-type here. I commented that those strange comments fit a pattern, and commented that Shiz' off-topic comment matched that pattern:
http://caucus99percent.com/comment/155383#comment-155383
The other thing I wrote in the KFS comment you refer to is that since that incident, I've noticed that a few users here (1-3 users) have started to show up with an off-topic reply to a comment of mine; these comments appear to have no use other than to disparage me and portray me as mean-spirited and untrustworthy.
So here you are, Shiz, making a wildly off-topic comment, and that comment's function appears to be only to disparage me and make me seem untrustworthy. Hmmm. Your comment seems to be walkin' like a duck, Shiz.
My one slightly snarky comment to Shiz was the 'walkin' like a duck' part, and as far as I know that passes as mild banter here and does not rise to the level of 'un-civil discourse'.
Well, the post in which it took place had a small readership, but some others saw the guy's MSM guy's comments and commented. I posted the link to JtC's comment (in Mod mode) in response to the request for mod review I had requested, per site rules. I guess the link wasn't good enough for you, so I'll post JtC's whole comment:
yes it is true that member's have the privilege of speaking their mind here, with the caveat that that speech is held within parameters of civil and respectful discourse. It is the consensus of the admins/mods that MRM does not fall within those parameters.
Regard this as a warning, if this is seen again, appropriate measures will be taken
Although the entire post and its thread is still publicly available and can be reached through that link, Ill post only the links to MSM guy's comments and omit their text here, because readers might find his text offensive. Links with MSM content below:
Telling people on other sites that such jokers are harassing you on here qualifies as talking shit about this place, in my book.
I don't agree with your book. MSM guys live on the Internet, and love to disrupt websites and to attack and/or disparage women, gay men, and straight men the see as 'misandrist'. Over at KFS, a number of MSM types (from other subreddits) have been carrying on such attacks for months, although these MSM practices have not been spoken about until today (that post/thread has since been hidden by mods as too incendiary). This action by MSM-types (and/or their copycats) added immense pressure on the mods, who had to try to field it; that added pressure caused some of the mods to leave (others left for other reasons). These attacks have also begun making women KFSers to begin feeling unsafe at KFS, where many c99ers read and cross-post -- and MSM types are devoted to driving women off the Internet and into silence.
I used my recent experience here (documented above) for these purposes: (1) To address the fact that MSM types are everywhere online and have shown themselves at c99 as well as at KFS; (2) that we (users of these sites, as well as 'the Left' in general) would need to face this fact soon, and develop positions and methods for dealing with it; and (3) sharing the perfect position established by JtC in consensus with all the mods.
In my book, I do not consider my actions as 'talking shit' about c99. I consider my actions to be joining my experience here to that of folks on KFS, so we can all face this unpleasant reality together and work together to minimize its effect in our political discourse.
That is all I'm going to write in reply to you comment, CS in AZ, and except for this one brief mention I will not be addressing the myriad disparaging adjectives and hyperbolic misrepresentation you have applied to me, nor will I be addressing the fact that you called me two kinds of liar. Most readers here are well-enough schooled in use of those tactics from our days at dKos.
Shiz had spelled out 'Men's Rights Movement' in her comment and I didn't see a need to spell it out again. And yes, MRM types like to refer to themselves as 'activists', while imo that name grants them a dignity they don't deserve.
OK, but you keep using the nickname for the mainstream media (MSM), which is making your comments super confusing.
I did not, as you claim, suggest that "Shiz herself is somehow connected with "MSM" '. I reported some strange, off-topic replies to comments that I had received in the week since I had an actual run-in with an actual MSM-type here. I commented that those strange comments fit a pattern, and commented that Shiz' off-topic comment matched that pattern:
Right, great, thanks for admitting that. What you specifically said was:
The other thing I wrote in the KFS comment you refer to is that since that incident, I've noticed that a few users here (1-3 users) have started to show up with an off-topic reply to a comment of mine; these comments appear to have no use other than to disparage me and portray me as mean-spirited and untrustworthy.
So here you are, Shiz, making a wildly off-topic comment, and that comment's function appears to be only to disparage me and make me seem untrustworthy. Hmmm. Your comment seems to be walkin' like a duck, Shiz.
This isn't "mild banter", CroneWit, nice Donald Trump-esque explanation. You are essentially accusing me of being in on the some grand plan to "disparage" you and make you seem "mean-spirited and untrustworthy". And then you threatened to contact admin because you apparently think there is a big conspiracy between me and a coupla assholes MRA guys I've never met or talked to before. (I am going to use "MRA" from now on, for confusion's sake.)
Oy. I am SO done with this conversation. Let's just steer clear of each other.
about my using 'MSM' instead of 'MRM'(Men's Rights Movement'). I can only chalk that error up to age and brain damage. I won't go back and correct it in this thread, since it is a large part of your arguments against me. But yes, I was wrong in using MSM instead of MRM.
I will say again that I did not 'accuse' you of *anything*. Your comment has the same structure as the other odd, off-topic, disparaging replies I began receiving after the run-in with MRM guy. I have never even said that those other odd comments were from MRM people -- I have only noted that (1) they began after the run-in and (2) that MRM types do this kind of harassment. Each of those statements are factually true. I am not even certain that those other comments are actually from MRM types -- if this was a detective or cop show, these facts would be still considered 'circumstantial' or 'possible coincidence?', but they would be on the whiteboard as points to consider.
I have explained myself to you three time now, yet you choose to remain committed to your angry emotional reality as fact. You continue to disparage me, calling me a liar and now saying that I am rotten to the core, not to be believed in anything, Trump-like.
So here's a question for you: If my comment on KFS disturbed you so much, why didn't you reply to me there, instead of here?
(That's a real question, and I'd like an answer, please.)
MY MAIN POINT ALL ALONG HAS BEEN:
If you had questioned me there, my reply would have been the same: That we (with 'we' being both women and political discussion/activism sites) face a common enemy (MRM-type attackers) that we have been ignoring, and that we in our discussion sites need to face the fact of that enemy's existence and develop policies and methods of protecting ourselves from those attacks; and that JtC/c99 had already provided a model policy.
If you can come out of rant mode for a moment and would like to enter into civil political discourse about that one paraqgraph above, please do. Do you agree or disagree with that paragraph? If you disagree, what specifically do you disagree with, and why? Do you see anything non-factual or erroneous in that paragraph?
I've long believed that political -discussion sites like KFS, c99 will pored over by future scholars working on the PhD theses, and that the social dynamics of our sites will be as important to them as our political actions. In the interests of those future scholars, I am posting the full text of the comment at KFS that so enraged Shiz. I am posting the full text of my KFS comment as a replu to my comment http://caucus99percent.com/comment/156093#comment-156093 (and mentioning this because at time c99 still often posts a Reply as a new Comment).
My comment at KFS regarding MRM-types, mentioning my one experrience of MRM-speech at c99:
There are some members/proponents of the 'Men's Rights Movement' (MSM) posting as progressives and trying to shape the agendas and the levels of acceptable language on our sites. One appeared a few weeks back at c99. I called him out to Admin over there -- c99 prefers that suspected trolls be reported to Mods, not attacked/responded to in the threads by other members. C99 Admin made a consensus statement saying that MRM memes do not qualify as 'civil discourse' and so do not fit at c99. (I can provide links if you want, but not today). [I was using a new mouseless device, and hadn't learned the basics like cut/paste on it yet. I posted JtC's link in a comment in Mass Southpaw's post, 'Enough', which has since been deleted.]
I felt that the Admin statement was kind of a win, but since then I find that when I post a comment, the same 1-3 people show up to sag [sic: slag] me and to create the impression that I am cruel and negative/disruptive. This has had a chilling effect on my commenting there.
Imo, I'd like hate-speech against women to be as verbten [sic: verboten] as hate-speech against POC of LGBT people. Imo, even if a person makes good contributions in other areas of discourse, his misogynist mindset colors all of his thinking by its acceptance of dehumanizing others.
I have highlighted the parts of my comment that appear to be what enraged Shiz. I have also corrected a couple of typos, in [] using square brackets, as I was taught is proper. In comments here, I mis-rememberd where I included the link to JtC's reprimand of the MRM-user. And, as is obvious, I began mixing up 'MRM' with 'MSM' in this first comment -- again, I can only explain this as a result of brain damage and age. I continued misusing 'MSM' for 'MRM' in the other 11 (eleven) comments in that thread, but the people I conversed with understood that I meant 'MRM', based on the content of their replies.
If readers click on the link to my first KFS comment, then scroll up two comments Past Mass Southpaw's comment to the one above that), they will find a very cogent description of the kind of harassment a number of KFS women had been subjected to by MRM-types since the site opened. Much of the thread above that comment contained similar complaints. So, as I said in the comment that should be directly above this one, my intent in my first comment at KFS was:
http://caucus99percent.com/comment/156093#comment-156093
MY MAIN POINT ALL ALONG HAS BEEN:
If you had questioned me there, my reply would have been the same: That we (with 'we' being both women and political discussion/activism sites) face a common enemy (MRM-type attackers) that we have been ignoring, and that we in our discussion sites need to face the fact of that enemy's existence and develop policies and methods of protecting ourselves from those attacks; and that JtC/c99 had already provided a model policy.
I have now made the documentation of these events as complete as I can, so a reader will not find it necessary to travel to different pages.
I read the whole fuckin' thing and realized you meant exactly the opposite of what I thought you meant, which is why I apologized.
That being said, I really reject the rest of what you wrote. I'm not involved with any MRA bullshit, and I have never seen the commenter in the above-linked thread before. To accuse me of being somehow involved with them is supremely over-the-top, and I'm being nice because I was wrong and owed you an apology.
I assume you mean "MRA" and not "MSM", but I can assure you, I'm not part of the mainstream media, either.
Second: Please read my reply to CS in AZ for fuller treatment of your second point. I at no point "accused you of being somehow involved" with MSM-types. I stated, accurately, that your off-topic comment to me shared the same format and structure as the odd, off-topic, disparaging comments I have been receiving here since the run-in with the MSM guy a month ago. I said that your comment was 'walkin' like a duck' as a bantering way of saying it 'behaved' like those other comments. So, whether you believe it or not, there is nothing to "reject"; I did not say or accuse you of being 'involved' with MSM types --
Third: "I assume you mean "MRA" and not "MSM" ": In your initial comment Shiz, you wrote out 'Men's Rights Movement', so you obviously were clearly understanding who I was speaking about. MSM guys like to style themselves as 'activists', but I will not dignify them with that term.
I know many of us shop with Amazon, and if we had a C99P bookmarkable link to use that could generate quite a bit.
For example, I just had to spend over 2k building a new system, almost all on Amazon. Even if you only got 3% of my purchases a year that would probably add up.
It's not obtrusive as it can just be a link in the New Members section that people can bookmark for their future purchases and as long as they use the bookmark any purchases made within 24 hours get credited to the site.
Also, I am still down to do that auction fundraiser whenever as well.
If I had the tech skills I would buy this place in a minute, but the last language I did any programming in was FreeBSD and I really have no desire to learn a new coding skill set anymore.
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"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me
I've been running current since forever. Too bad it's not more popular.
I probably have some of the necessary skills (I'm a DevOps guy) but I have a full-time job, plus I know nothing about Drupal. And PHP, ugh. I have to fix / enhance PHP code here and there, but the language and the libraries leave me unimpressed
paid. Not possible on a small site having trouble paying even its admin, of course, but without content a Web site is nothing. Posting is a lot of work, don't discourage volunteers.
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Please check out Pet Vet Help, consider joining us to help pets, and follow me @ElenaCarlena on Twitter! Thank you.
You don't see me complaining about not getting paid for the work I do here, while I keep a day job as a "professor" at a for-profit, private university "teaching" online without any control over curricular content. I won't talk about what my day job actually pays.
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The ruling classes need an extra party to make the rest of us feel as if we participate in democracy. That's what the Democrats are for. They make the US more durable than the Soviet Union was.
Some years ago I remember being told about academic journals that would charge you for the privilege of publishing with them. That's right: you create the content, then you pay the publisher to publish it. And when you send them the money you don't even know whether or not any eyeballs will actually look at what you did. Maybe finding the eyeballs is your job too. Perhaps the journal owners needed the money to cover the costs of putting out the content, which is certainly understandable. Most academic journals get their money from coercing the libraries into forking over big institutional subscription fees. My stuff can currently be read (with more coming next month!) at one of those.
I don't think JtC can do that with c99%. With a website there is of course the possibility of advertising, though. Part of me wishes to cite the Buddhist goal of "nonattachment" when I read all this discussion about money.
The problem of course is that no source of money is guaranteed under capitalism, unless you're standing right next to the good folks at the Federal Reserve giving the orders to print the stuff out. No capitalist economy will ever guarantee everyone a job that pays enough. I'm not saying it's not worth it to try to get that, though. I'm definitely not concern trolling the Sanders movement here. But money is a faith-based scam; the ability to force other people to work for you manufactured as a commodity (see e.g. the Investopedia entry for "seigniorage.")
In the meantime there's working for free, which offers great opportunities because they can't control your labor (see e.g. Marx's 1844 manuscripts, the sections on "alienation"), but then without money it's up to you to find a source of nourishment (hopefully outside of the factory farming business) and a way of avoiding heatstroke or hypothermia while catching the minimum daily requirement for sleep.
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The ruling classes need an extra party to make the rest of us feel as if we participate in democracy. That's what the Democrats are for. They make the US more durable than the Soviet Union was.
Btw, have you seen the new Margaret Atwood novel on the stands at your local Barnes & Noble? I guess she wants to get us to think some more about how deeply we're going to be screwed under the existing order.
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The ruling classes need an extra party to make the rest of us feel as if we participate in democracy. That's what the Democrats are for. They make the US more durable than the Soviet Union was.
With that book. First she was publishing it in installments, which I happily bought, all four of them. Then she did not publish an installment in a looong while but when she did it was part of a full book. I feel that I had to pay twice since I really wanted to find out the ending. Oh, well. Have been holding that in for a while. Phew! Feel lighter now.
in order to provide you with a secure yearly income for your full-time job managing this site. We need a group of people who provide the funds in an up-front yearly/quarterly/semi-anual payment.
It looks as if there would not be enough people capable or willing to do it to reach the amount needed. But without such a secured guaranteed fund, there would be no security for you. Pledges are great, but they can be broken any day. I tell you today I pledge a monthly fee of 30.00 dollars and can stop it nilly-willy, if I don't want to do or really can't do it anymore. That's not a secure income for a full-time job. No employer can do that with their employees. Your employer could go bankrupt and lay you off, or he could fire you, because he thinks you did a lousy job. But no employer can not pay you your salary, just because his wife tells him, she wants something and he just needs the money of your salary to satisfee his wife's desires. So ... I think a small subscription fee to participate as a member is not something that would exclude those members, who can't afford a $3.00 to $5.00 monthly fee. There are enough people who can afford to pay a higher monthly fee to cover those, who can't pay $3.00 to $5.00.
I wished there would be a mechanism to tip or pay something to the few great writers of series here. I am with you that those writers should be paid. But how? I do believe that payments for writers need to be volunteer payments by the readers, as long as the site doesn't generate enough revenue that the "owners and the editorial board" can decide to pay them.
I remember times at TOP where some writers flooded the site with their diaries and quite frankly some of those I wouldn't tip or recommend or pay a money tip for. Others, on the other hand, I wished one could pay for. But the decision, if that should happen, I think should be a split decision between the owners of this site and the readers of this site.. Because we do not want to become dependent on unreliable tips by readers or ideological decisions of the editorial board or owners of the site. I have no idea how this could be set up.
I am still convinced, like a couple of people have written here, that being a member here should be subscription fee based. A very, very small fee. Most people CAN afford to pay a $3.00 to $5.00 monthly fee.
And those, who can't will get sponsored by those, who can afford a higher monthly fee. Nobody really would get excluded who wants to be a member.
I certainly do understand how frustrating and exhausting it must be, and I know you've been inundated with new people over the past months and have to be under extreme pressure to deal with it basically alone.
This life raft has come to be very important to me very quickly, and I'm sure I'm not alone! I don't know how to deal with it suddenly sinking.
Please think about letting more people help you! I understand it's hard to trust giving over some of the work and tasks to others, but many of us have a lot more time than we do money, and could help keep it afloat. The election will be over in 3 months, things will calm down... I know I'm pleading- sorry! Just want there to be an answer, not ready to accept this.
Everybody needs to walk away sometimes, but it doesn't necessarily have to be for good.
But if you decide it does, then all I can say is thanks for the ride man. I've had a blast.
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The current working assumption appears to be that our Shroedinger's Cat system is still alive. But what if we all suspect it's not, and the real problem is we just can't bring ourselves to open the box?
I think it's real, but to tell you the truth it's such a cool shot I don't really care.
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The current working assumption appears to be that our Shroedinger's Cat system is still alive. But what if we all suspect it's not, and the real problem is we just can't bring ourselves to open the box?
I suggest that you select a few volunteers whom you trust to manage the day-to-day operations; hire (with donations) a dedicated fund-raiser; and YOU (JtC) would function as the Factum-Factotum -- overseeing the general direction of the site, and marshaling resources, to be directed as necessary.
I have been a donor in the past; if you decide to broaden the scope of C99, I am in again -- $100 here --
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When Cicero had finished speaking, the people said “How well he spoke”.
When Demosthenes had finished speaking, the people said “Let us march”.
to hire someone, then I would like that someone to be me. I would love to run this site full time if the compensation is there. Someone has to do and it might as well be me.
Delegating the work I do here means giving full admin privileges to several people, in essence, giving them the run of the site. That is highly risky. They need to know what they are doing and be totally trustworthy.
there's probably 200-300 people or more that have registered here but have never logged in for whatever reasons.
Someone a couple of months ago did the math and figured out that if enough members signed up for a monthly installment plan at $5.00 per month that it would possibly generate enough funds. There was a fundraiser to get folks to do just that. We had about 10 people sign up for that plan. That type of plan would work if enough people would buy in. Many folks just don't have the money to spare and I'm very sensitive to that fact and don't want to pressure folks too much.
You're numbers are great and would do the trick if enough folks would buy in.
I am going to need a shitload of approvals for this. Basically, I want to use the names of many key, regular members here who also have a following of their own (as a way to promote the site), but only if they're OK with it.
I'd also willing to wager that Joe would like a say in how this thing is written, but it's a start, anyway.
And, FYI, I am fucking broke, but I would find a way to pay $50.00 for a lifetime membership.
but once you get it set up, we can post the link on our ally sites KFS, WOTB, and TPW. That should be 2000+ people who don't participate here? Of course, we can also invite them to participate. C99 is indispensable.
can use my name if you like, FWIW (ec or Elena Carlena). Not to mention the stalkers who follow my every word with fiery hatred in their hearts. All publicity is good publicity, right? Maybe it adds up to a few thousand who read me across all media. If you do use my name, I would like to see what you're going to say about me before the final edition, please.
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and will do more in a few months. I just started a new job, and if all goes as I hope it will, I should be able to donate up to $75 a month beginning this Spring
Some people could do more than $5 a month, some can't swing even that, but together we can make this happen. what will it take, on a monthly basis, for us, the members, to "buy the site" and hire you and keep the technology running? Alphalop has offered to donate items to sell to raise funds, but said he was waiting for direction or an ok to set something up. Probably others could do that too. There are ways - but it needs to be a coordinated and focused ongoing effort. If people can't volunteer to help you admin the site, a team could volunteer to work on building and maintaining funding streams instead.
I guard monthly recurring payments like the plague so I've opted for 1-offs as they occurred to me. But you've been a lot more forthright about the situation in this thread and I can see the obvious need for something a bit more stable. I'm reconsidering what I can and will safely commit to as a monthly. What helps is information... much of which has flowed out in this thread.
$5/mo is an attainable figure for us. I had no idea that such a thing would actually be helpful.
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A lot of wanderers in the U.S. political desert recognize that all the duopoly has to offer is a choice of mirages. Come, let us trudge towards empty expanse of sand #1, littered with the bleached bones of Deaniacs and Hope and Changers.
-- lotlizard
at TOP, I'll add my voice to verify that $5 donors are very valuable. There are a lot more $5 and $10 donors than any other amounts, so they add up. Consider if 1000 people make $5 automated monthly pledges, that's virtually no pain to many wallets and $5000/month (minus fees) longterm that the site can count on, allowing for planning in advance, etc.
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We will generate the funds! We can do it! I feel better --- Johnny, I hope you feel better! You kinda answered my questions, kinda, sorta. I get the sense that c99 is your baby --- a baby you dearly love! Well, I also sense that you gotta lotta folks who love this/your/our baby!
Can we have another fund raiser to tide you over while you look at ad possibilities?
Can we figure out ways to get more hits to the site? (I can talk my 3 adult children into 'hitting' the site once in a while for the sake of ad revenue lol).
I have been under the impression that you wanted to keep it small and manageable. I think once you got hit with refugees, it got bigger too fast. One of the biggest problems with start ups is trying to manage rapid growth.
If you feel that you can manage if it can pay you a living wage, then maybe we should figure out how to get it there.
But I don't want you to feel like we are pressuring you. It's just that you've got it running with a good 'vibe' and we do appreciate that about this site. Do what is best for you, though, not what WE think is best for you. lol
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We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when we are afraid of the light.
--Plato
I would cut my business down to a very small percentage if the income was enough to keep me going here. I would love to do that.
This site is the way it is because of the special blend that Joe and I and the moderators have worked our butts off to develop, if that were to change I'm not sure the site would be the same.
Believe me, this is my baby and it tears me up having to be in this spot.
As in would that cover the server costs and future upgrades or any software that is or will be needed?
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We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.--Aristotle
If there is no struggle there is no progress.--Frederick Douglass
on a GoFundMe, that would carry you for the next year. Hell, even if we could get half that, that would buy you enough time to do something to make the situation more bearable.
... there are processing fees involved. GoFundMe charges about 8% per transaction. See this website for other options. The only free alternative that I know of is people contributing through the 'Family and Friends' option on PayPal - through which the recipient gets 100% of the donation.
JtC knows that I'm always loathe to toot my own horn, but I probably organized more fundraisers (incredible amount of work involved behind the scenes) and helped to raise more money than anyone in the history of DK, particularly in the past five years. One idea would be to have a "Fundraising Blogathon" over a couple of weeks during which a number of c99% members contribute personal essays on why it's necessary to raise funds for this blog.
I'll certainly help here and contribute what I can. This website needs to stay online and grow.
We got ya covered buddy! You just keep on keepin on the wonderful way you are wayin c99 --- it's all going to work out just fine --- I just feel it in my bones
Now, you go get some rest --- "close your eyes and relax...try not to turn on to problems that upset you..." ( I think that's from "Jesus Christ Superstar")
Donation. Those who can, do it right away so JtC can see how much. Minimum sounds like it is $4,000 a month we need to bring in to hire him. Let's get going!
And maybe it is better to send directly. PayPal keeps a certain amount as a fee.
How about a nag screen. Make cookies expire early, and make them wait a minute or 5 before they can submit posts unless they donate a certain amount every month.
There's a reason that very few websites (percentage-wise) are successful. Even if money isn't the goal, money must be made in order to just keep the damn thing running. For people who want to be together, and share ideas towards a common goal, a website is a real luxury. JtC has done an insane job of keeping this thing hopping through a large uptick in usage, and it's very, VERY commendable. But it's also not surprising that he has had enough. It's too damn much work for a couple of guys.
Not that I am an expert on Drupal, but I have been an IT guy for a long time, which has led to my amazement that JtC has kept up the pace for this site. Something has to give, even if someone else takes over the site, that work doesn't go away. I have some (hopefully not too blunt) suggestions, which, of course, can be taken or left:
First? Ads. Run a normal ad load for a month. All of us readers should agree not to use an ad blocker, and just see what the income is for a month. Of course, everyone hates ads, but remember, this site is a luxury. Ads would be a small price to pay. The good news is that ads are much more customizable now, as I'm pretty sure you can restrict the sources and types of ads these days, at least via Google.
Here's what is MOST important to me about this site: the people and the cause. Or really, the people and their causes. The site is great, but it's not the reason I'm here. I'm here because I like the company, and I assume most are here for that reason. There's a reason people are flocking to aggregation sites like reddit: it's a beautiful thing to not have to fuck with IT shit when all you really want to do is connect with people you like.
What I'm getting at is, is there a reasonable site that handles all of the hardware/software headaches, so we can just get to what we do: writing and communicating, with the same mod structure, people, rules, etc.? Reddit is an example, but doesn't have to be the answer. I found medium.com to be a wonderful site for writing blog material. In fact, I did a sample one back when the reddit site started up, and we were searching out solutions. Here the sample, I thought it was very nice, and easy to write within: medium example link Now, I don't think (though am unsure) that medium is the entire answer, but could be part of it? I dunno.
Bottom line, this is too good of a group of folks to not stay together. This site is wonderful, but if it's not sustainable, then it would be crazy to break it up over damn technology.
Just some thoughts. (By the way, sorry I've been scarce. Kind of hit a wall after the primary fraud, and had to veg out for awhile. I've been reading regularly, however.)
Thanks, JtC and Joe for all you've done. It's a great place.
First? Ads. Run a normal ad load for a month. All of us readers should agree not to use an ad blocker, and just see what the income is for a month. Of course, everyone hates ads, but remember, this site is a luxury. Ads would be a small price to pay.
I'd turn off my ad blockers for this good cause! (Besides, they don't block much anyway lol)
We could start with the "go fund me" that shiz is working on while jtc is checking out ad possibilities.
Here's what is MOST important to me about this site: the people and the cause. Or really, the people and their causes.
There are so few places that don't have drama. You mentioned reddit. Well, in the past week I had my fill of drama over there. I almost stopped going but keep hoping that the crap stops. Seriously. I spent about 10 hours this week going through posts and counter posts trying to figure out what the h#ll was happening. People that I recognize from TOP are getting into more flame wars than being a berner in a shillary diary in April this year. (Felt like I was in the movie Network with all of the competing liberal groups yelling at each other.) I couldn't even comment because not a whole lot of it made sense to me (as if someone mixed up 10 completely different cut jigsaw puzzles, pulled out a random 500 pieces, and asked me to make a picture out of it).
Then I come here and I see/feel/hear sanity. When I noticed the 'for sale' sign, I almost cried!
I didn't check out your link to the other website yet (I'm still ranting). But I absolutely agree with this:
Bottom line, this is too good of a group of folks to not stay together. This site is wonderful, but if it's not sustainable, then it would be crazy to break it up over damn technology.
Thanks, geebeebee, for your thought out reaction.
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We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when we are afraid of the light.
--Plato
The fight was having them. I almost jumped into it, but I've recently only made things worse when I've tried to help. Over the years, I've come to think of it as a split that manifests along the J and P division (MBTI). We're especially vulnerable during that first downtime after a battle. Judgers want to maintain focus and perceivers want to take a step back for a broader perspective. The J sees the P as being aloof, not really caring. The P sees the J as reckless. The fact is that we need each other.
Mass Southpaw has a stickied post up about repairs, and there have been other good posts the last few days about it. Bottom line, the objectionable 'new rules' have been rescinded.
One of the issues we were having there, aside from the mod rules, was the culture difference between the kossacks & the redditors (largely ex /sfp people). I swear, those redditors are the most paranoid people; there's a boogeyman behind every screen name and action that leads straight back to Hillary. I briefly looked into wayofthebern the day after the big blowup at /kfs, and it was full of that nonsense, and I decided: enough! As much as I liked /kfs, I don't think it's worth the aggravation of dealing with the redditors there.
has been influenced by refugees from other sub-reddits. Most of them young and new to activism and politics in an election year that has been off the charts in terms of the blatant corruption and manipulation that we are all witnessing in real time and trying to make sense of. But there is also a dynamic young people bring into any enterprise that equally heartens me. And it's been my experience that when engaged about the dubious content politely, they've been pleasant enough. Perhaps my more maternal long view of their impulsive "paranoia" is foolishly indulgent in the sense that I feel youth can always benefit from a good example, a little patience, and occassional direction here and there.
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There is always Music amongst the trees in the Garden, but our hearts must be very quiet to hear it. ~ Minnie Aumonier
"First? Ads. Run a normal ad load for a month. All of us readers should agree not to use an ad blocker, and just see what the income is for a month. Of course, everyone hates ads, but remember, this site is a luxury. Ads would be a small price to pay."
That's not how ads work...
In the case of Google Adsense the ad would actually have to be clicked on, and in the case of regular site users if they regularly clicked on ads, it may be deemed "Click Fraud" and the publisher's account would be closed with loss of payment...
Amazon would probably be fine for site users to click, and get the cookie before making a purchase on Amazon, and the C-99 account would then be credited with the sale and get the commission...
It is not a case of not using an ad blocker and being paid for the ad to show up...
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I'm the only person standing between Richard Nixon and the White House."
~John F. Kennedy~
Economic: -9.13, Social: -7.28,
I can't schedule reoccurring donations. Sometimes the money will be there and sometimes not.
But what would help me is having an official Donation Day on the 4th of every month. That is the day I am most able to give $5. For some, an additional day on the 16th would be good.
Then I am reminded to donate on a day I probably can. It will be small but it will be something.
my school loans). Anyway, five bucks on the third isn't going to sink or save me. I have my own personal Ponzi scheme going. I always end up borrowing and then I have to borrow to pay back the original lenders. Especially for utilities. But I digress...
I think $5 a month should be doable. Like I said, it's not enough to sink OR save me from financial ruin because I'm already there. And it would be worth it.
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I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks
Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa
JtC, as you know, I haven't been participating here (hardly at all), and barely even comment at Daily Kos more than a couple of times per week now. (No diaries.) But, while it may be little more than wishful thinking (okay, I'm being a little too conservative stating that, but it's not that far from the truth), I think we should have a talk. At your convenience this weekend (Saturday? Sunday?), send me an email (bobswern@earthlink.net), and I'll respond with my phone number and related contact info.
Couple of basic questions, and a very brief statement first:
1.) You're currently at BlueHost, according to WhoIs. Would a "real," Drupal managed services/dedicated server setup, with the MSP's staff there truly backing you up, be an interesting option to look at; and, then to keep you engaged? (I realize this would just be a small/modest part of a bigger/doable "solution," for you. There's more to my thinking than just this one aspect of overcoming the hurdles you're now facing to enable you to continue managing this site.)
2.) Could you send me along some background about your PHP/MySQL skillset(s) and related business-sector experience? (Please include some sort of summary, if not a resume. Even just 2-3 paragraphs about your I.T. business sector experience, if there's no recent resumé? Whom you've worked for? What types of businesses have you worked with/for utilizing your PHP/MySQL skills?)
3.) Currently running a VERY intense MySQL/PHP SaaS platform. Looking for a couple of people right now. But, skillset must meet fairly high/stringent specialization requirements.
At best, this is a stretch. So, don't get your hopes up. But, in the unlikely chance that there might be some synergy, let's at least have a conversation. I'd forever regret NOT reaching out and making this comment at this juncture, seeing as how I've always been a YUUUGE fan of both your and Joe's efforts, in general. (I think you guys already know that; but I haven't been showing up here to reinforce that truth, so shame on me. Again, I'm not going to beat myself up over that, since I've had a brutally busy summer, and I'm only a few years younger than you.)
--Bob
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"Freedom is something that dies unless it's used." --Hunter S. Thompson
Comments
RI
yeah, little ole rhode island is corrupt as hell, I live here and I know
question everything
The Clinton Foundation is a 501(c)(3). Read it and weep.
Bottom of the page, right-hand side, https://www.clintonfoundation.org/
They claim 87% of the money goes to program services. Right, and I'm the Pope.
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It seems to function at least partially as a place to park
Clinton apparatchiks between administrations and cabinet posts.
As far as I can tell from doing a bit of reading, the Foundation works something like a brokerage or middle man matching corporations and philanthropy or projects under the guise of philanthropy. I'm not saying they haven't done good things, but it is really really hard to tell from their website exactly what "commitments" have been fulfilled and to what benefit and to whose advantage? Often it seems like a way to marry no-bid contracts in developing markets. One thing I have learned from reading about the Foundation and TPP, etc. is that cornering "developing markets" gets the Masters of the Universe way more excited than sales increases of dribs and drabs from incremental growth in built out, developed markets.
It also seems like the WJC and the Clinton Foundation made a complete hash out of Haiti. A simple person like me would think that basic housing, food, education and infrastructure would have greater importance than luxury hotels and business parks in terms of priority for the rebuilding.
" “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR "
I haven't fact checked it, but I have read that as much as
96% of the budget goes to salaries, which should be on that little graphic as "management and general," not "program services".
As I understand the way nonprofits are supposed to work, that would be enough to lose their nonprofit status, if not be a source of criminal charges.
But of course different "rules" for the big and little people.
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Yes, I think Charity Navigator said that
I remember reading that something like only 5% was going to actual charities.
Yup
and that is an absolute disgrace. Just being named after a prominent politico should be a disqualification from (3) status in and og itself.
“To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.” -Voltaire
Which is why I said this:
I have been on the grant writing end and know that like with any kind of writing, there has to be a firm purpose in mind and that you need to address the audience in a language they understand. The first step is always the research of which grants your organization has the best chance with as it helps cut down on the "no" factor.
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.--Aristotle
If there is no struggle there is no progress.--Frederick Douglass
It's not so easy to become a 501(c)3
I have spent my adult life running non profits....
You have to become a charity... Have a board of directors. A mission statement and a proven record that you can accomplish what you say you will ... And the. You have to do mountains of paperwork and wait for approval
And if you are lucky to get certification and even get a grant or two you must justify every penny and how it is used
And this is a full time job
Orwell was an optimist
First, in my comment I did say that this was not
an easy solution...that it would take a lot of work.
Second, a 501(c) does not have to be a charity. There are 29 different types of nonprofit organizations and even more once you step outside of the 501 designation.
Example:
While I did not run non-profits, I spent the majority of my working life working for them, mostly being involved in grant writing, editing, writing and publishing various manuals and newsletters, supervising volunteers and coordinating activities.
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.--Aristotle
If there is no struggle there is no progress.--Frederick Douglass
I thought you said (c) 3. Yes (4) has different criteria BUT I
Think the entire (c) delineation may have been jettisoned last year... At least in NY
Not sure... The change was happening as I was re retiring
Orwell was an optimist
I should have just used the word nonprofit
to be clearer. There are a lot of different designations for them with education of various types being the emphasis.
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.--Aristotle
If there is no struggle there is no progress.--Frederick Douglass
Give what and when you can, versus
a paid, yearly subscription is the question at hand. I think setting up once-a-year subscriptions works best because once a year is like pulling a Band Aide off quickly. Monthly involves 12 painful tugs. They should be on two levels: $25.00 if income below $30,000 or $50.00 if income above $30,000. Give newcomers first month free to see if they like the site, then they must join.
Begging periodically for contributions burns you out and gets you nothing, but REQUIRING up front payment keeps you going. A GoFundMe campaign will get you cash to take the pressure off and give you time to set up a subscriptions system. Good luck, whatever you decide to do.
Writerinres, your two-level giving plan
disregards low income people for whom $25 a month would be an impossible burden.
My only income is $736/month from Social Security Retirement. That comes to $8832/year -- well below poverty level. Your suggested $25/month would reduce my income by $300/year, leaving $8532/year. I do not feel I could safely commit $25/month to *anything* non-essential.
I have been considering donating regularly to groups like Brand New Congress and/or OR, and I would like to contribute regularly to our wonderful local Food Bank or its outreach sites. My limit for any regular donation would have to be no more than $3-$5/month.
I am not writing this to complain, but just to insert some reality about low-income people into this discussion, insofar as it is about fundraising. I'm sure there are others besides myself here who could only give minimal amounts, if anything at all. Although I'm sure other categories of users face these issues, I am mainly concerned for the impact of required, regular fees on Elder Women and disabled people
His plan is per year not per month.
Yes, pro left; I did the math: $25x12=300/year
No $25 per year.
I don't like that comment you left yesterday
on Kossacks_for_Sanders suggesting that c99p is harboring some Men's Rights Movement activists.
So excuse me if I take your concern with a grain of salt.
I miss Colorado.
It was relevant to the discussion on KFS
about rectifying the 'new rules' ruckus there, because some women at KFS had been savagely attacked with MSM-type gynophobic spittle-flecked hatred during the recent upheaval there.
Here's the resolution of the incident here that I referred to at KFS:
Comment from JTC as Mod: http://caucus99percent.com/comment/134981#comment-134981
First I want to note that I did not say, suggest, or imply that c99 was 'harboring' MSM proponents. Your use of the word 'harboring' implies that I was maliciously spreading unfounded gossip, an implication which is untrue. I did talk about my recent experience here with one MSM proponent, and the aftermath of that incident. To summarize that incident:
I asked the Mods to check out the MSM memes someone had posted as a comment. The link is to JtC's intervention with that user. JtC's response was that (paraphrased) it was the consensus among the mods that MSM memes could not be considered 'civil discourse' and thus were unwelcome here at c99. JtC also warned the MSM proponent to stop it. The user doubled down on presenting MSM ideology, writing another 2-3 comments in that thread, after JtC's warning.
The other thing I wrote in the KFS comment you refer to is that since that incident, I've noticed that a few users here (1-3 users) have started to show up with an off-topic reply to a comment of mine; these comments appear to have no use other than to disparage me and portray me as mean-spirited and untrustworthy.
So here you are, Shiz, making a wildly off-topic comment, and that comment's function appears to be only to disparage me and make me seem untrustworthy. Hmmm. Your comment seems to be walkin' like a duck, Shiz.
I'm not going to report this to the mods tonight, but only because I don't want to bum out JTC's evening, just when he's getting so much positive reinforcement from the community.
MSM propagandists show up anywhere on the Internet where they can post comments. At least one (and possibly 'some') have shown up here. JtC, in consensus with all the mods, have made it clear that MSM-speech cannot be considered 'civil discourse', that such speech is unwelcome at c99, and that Admin is willing to take action against such speech.
Yes, it did read to me like you were
talking shit about c99p on KFS, and that pissed me off. I clearly read the comment 100% wrong, and I would like to apologize, but I highly doubt that you'd be willing to accept any sort of apology from me, given your comment above.
If you want to report me to Admin, go for it. I was most definitely in the wrong, but your comment above was really over the top. Jesus Christ.
We got along famously on Dkos and I have always respected you as a writer and a commenter. I'd also like to point out that I would never suggest that anyone who can't afford it should donate to c99p, ever. That's inhumane and cruel, and pretty much goes against my entire value system as a human being.
I hope we can somehow find a way to rectify this, CroneWit. I don't know what to say. If you want to, please message me and we can talk more there.
I miss Colorado.
Shiz: re your fist &B second comments here:
Shiz, I appreciate your apology.
However, I object to your characterization of my reply to you as 'over the top'. It is thorough and factual. Since you saw fit to interrupt a happy celebration of community with an off-topic comment that appears to have no purpose other than to disparage me and make me appear untrustworthy (not credible) to the community, and since your comment would receive a lot of exposure in this diary, I felt obligated to respond with the truth about my actions and my experiences during the last month.
I did not 'talk shit about c99' at KFS. I used my experience here, in response to women who had described being attacked by MSM shit at Kfs, to begin to address the fact that MSM-types (and their copycats) are all over the Internet spreading their MSM-memes, and to suggest that political-discussion sites will have to confront and discuss whether MSM rhetoric is acceptable as 'civil discourse' on our sites. I summarized and posted the link to JtC's perfect position statement to the effect that 'MSM speech cannot be considered 'civil discourse' and thus is unwelcome at c99.
So rather than 'talking shit about c99', I was showing KFS' readers that *c99 is the first Left site to face and appropriately deal with MSM-type hate-speech against women*.
I urge you, Shiz, to go read JtC's perfect wording of c99's position on MSM speech. Then please take a few minutes to read the comments by the MSM-talker. (If that link is wrong somehow, please let me know and i'll edit it. I'm working with a new device and haven't mastered some of the basics yet.)
I'm willing to consider this matter settled, Shiz, if you do. If you wnt to continue this discussion, I'd rather continue it in pubic view, where you began it.
Oh my
I should probably keep quiet and stay out of this, but I feel I need to stand with Shiz here. First, this:
Actually, it was you, cronewit, who chose to disrupt a good discussion on brainstorming fundraising ideas by disparaging someone's idea for a subscription fee of $25 a year ($2.08 per month), claiming it was "disregarding low income people" who couldn't afford $300 a year. What?
When your error was politely pointed out, you doubled down with a snide comment about "doing the math" which continued the misrepresentation of the proposal. You refused to acknowledge you'd got it wrong, and you still haven't.
Shiz said she didn't like your negative statements about this place on another site, and therefore saw your tossing out this inexplicable, nonsensical complaint as suspect. Not really off topic, since your counterfactual negativity was rather bizarre.
In response, you suggested that Shiz herself is somehow connected with "MSM" (whatever that is) supporters who are following and harassing you here. Which is, absolutely, over the top!
And now I suppose I'll also be accused of being part of some evil cabal on here! Lol, yeah me an Shiz, we loves the "MSM" -- and seriously, what are you referring to? Do you mean MRA? (Men's rights activists) If so, you are very wrong, I've seen none of that on here. Someone even got chastised for a Matrix movie reference about taking the red pill, since apparently some MRA morons have stolen that phrase.
Telling people on other sites that such jokers are harassing you on here qualifies as talking shit about this place, in my book. And suggesting that Shiz is one of them is just as disconnected from reality as your statement that $25 per year = $300 per year.
Thank you very much, CS.
That's pretty much what I was driving at. I didn't think it needed to be pointed out that I'm most certainly not a Men's Rights Activist (lol), but perhaps it does. That part was absolutely over the top.
And you are correct, I did think that CroneWit was interrupting the happy celebration with the "disregarding low income people" bullshit, because I highly doubt the admins of this place would ever be willing to institute a policy like that. I don't think JtC and Joe would be down with that at all, and I'm not, either.
Thanks again, man. Your comment means a great deal to me.
I miss Colorado.
CS in AZ. replying to you will take a lot of quotes.
First, regarding my possible math error: Writerisres' comment appeared to me to mention both yearly and monthly ways of giving, but did not mention clearly which mode he was recommending. The 'first month free' bit made it look to me as though s/he was suggesting a $25/month fee after the first free month. Since the language remains unclear, and its author did not reply to clarify my understanding, I didn't see a need to apologize. But since you feel i made a willfully egregious statement, the best I can offer is this: I may have misunderstood the author's intent and based my math of $25 x 12 =$300. If I am in error and the author meant yearly donations, not monthly, then my math was indeed wrong, and I apologize. (Please note that the first actual fundraiser asked for pledges of a stated amount monthly, and that most of the pledges made were for $25.)
Given my possibly mistaken reading of Writerinres' comment and my accurate math on what I understood the author to be suggesting, I felt obligated to speak up for c99's low-income readers, many of whom are elder women and/or handicapped so they would be considered in any structured way of giving that might be decided on so their situations would not be disregarded. Up to that point in the thread, no one had spoken a word on how to include low-income people in the financial-support aspect of c99, and that was already bothering me. Although your math of $25/12 = $2.08/month is correct, your cavalier assumption that poor folks can manage that shows a lack of awareness and/or a disregard for the monetary lives of the really poor. I am living well below the poverty level now, even with my Social Security Retirement funds, and for over 15 years I lived without even that, due to health issues. I had to worry, for 15 years, whether of not I would be able to buy toilet paper the next month; when the occasional salesman would come to my door saying 'For only $25 you can have . . ..' I would cut them off and tell them that If I was lucky enough to come across $25, the first things I'd buy would be cat food and toilet paper, then maybe do a load of laundry at the laundromat. I understand how precious and vital a small sum like $2 -- let alone the enormous sum of $25 in one month -- can be for poor folks. People who are lucky enough to consider $25 a negligible amount that anybody can afford don't understand poor folk's lives.
Regarding the rest of your comment:
Shiz had spelled out 'Men's Rights Movement' in her comment and I didn't see a need to spell it out again. And yes, MRM types like to refer to themselves as 'activists', while imo that name grants them a dignity they don't deserve.
I did not, as you claim, suggest that "Shiz herself is somehow connected with "MSM" '. I reported some strange, off-topic replies to comments that I had received in the week since I had an actual run-in with an actual MSM-type here. I commented that those strange comments fit a pattern, and commented that Shiz' off-topic comment matched that pattern:
My one slightly snarky comment to Shiz was the 'walkin' like a duck' part, and as far as I know that passes as mild banter here and does not rise to the level of 'un-civil discourse'.
You state:
http://caucus99percent.com/comment/155709#comment-155709
what are you referring to? Do you mean MRA? (Men's rights activists) If so, you are very wrong, I've seen none of that on here.
Well, the post in which it took place had a small readership, but some others saw the guy's MSM guy's comments and commented. I posted the link to JtC's comment (in Mod mode) in response to the request for mod review I had requested, per site rules. I guess the link wasn't good enough for you, so I'll post JtC's whole comment:
Although the entire post and its thread is still publicly available and can be reached through that link, Ill post only the links to MSM guy's comments and omit their text here, because readers might find his text offensive. Links with MSM content below:
You wrote:
I don't agree with your book. MSM guys live on the Internet, and love to disrupt websites and to attack and/or disparage women, gay men, and straight men the see as 'misandrist'. Over at KFS, a number of MSM types (from other subreddits) have been carrying on such attacks for months, although these MSM practices have not been spoken about until today (that post/thread has since been hidden by mods as too incendiary). This action by MSM-types (and/or their copycats) added immense pressure on the mods, who had to try to field it; that added pressure caused some of the mods to leave (others left for other reasons). These attacks have also begun making women KFSers to begin feeling unsafe at KFS, where many c99ers read and cross-post -- and MSM types are devoted to driving women off the Internet and into silence.
I used my recent experience here (documented above) for these purposes: (1) To address the fact that MSM types are everywhere online and have shown themselves at c99 as well as at KFS; (2) that we (users of these sites, as well as 'the Left' in general) would need to face this fact soon, and develop positions and methods for dealing with it; and (3) sharing the perfect position established by JtC in consensus with all the mods.
In my book, I do not consider my actions as 'talking shit' about c99. I consider my actions to be joining my experience here to that of folks on KFS, so we can all face this unpleasant reality together and work together to minimize its effect in our political discourse.
That is all I'm going to write in reply to you comment, CS in AZ, and except for this one brief mention I will not be addressing the myriad disparaging adjectives and hyperbolic misrepresentation you have applied to me, nor will I be addressing the fact that you called me two kinds of liar. Most readers here are well-enough schooled in use of those tactics from our days at dKos.
Bull. Effing. Shit.
You wrote:
OK, but you keep using the nickname for the mainstream media (MSM), which is making your comments super confusing.
Right, great, thanks for admitting that. What you specifically said was:
This isn't "mild banter", CroneWit, nice Donald Trump-esque explanation. You are essentially accusing me of being in on the some grand plan to "disparage" you and make you seem "mean-spirited and untrustworthy". And then you threatened to contact admin because you apparently think there is a big conspiracy between me and a coupla assholes MRA guys I've never met or talked to before. (I am going to use "MRA" from now on, for confusion's sake.)
Oy. I am SO done with this conversation. Let's just steer clear of each other.
Good day.
I miss Colorado.
Last night I realized you were right
about my using 'MSM' instead of 'MRM'(Men's Rights Movement'). I can only chalk that error up to age and brain damage. I won't go back and correct it in this thread, since it is a large part of your arguments against me. But yes, I was wrong in using MSM instead of MRM.
I will say again that I did not 'accuse' you of *anything*. Your comment has the same structure as the other odd, off-topic, disparaging replies I began receiving after the run-in with MRM guy. I have never even said that those other odd comments were from MRM people -- I have only noted that (1) they began after the run-in and (2) that MRM types do this kind of harassment. Each of those statements are factually true. I am not even certain that those other comments are actually from MRM types -- if this was a detective or cop show, these facts would be still considered 'circumstantial' or 'possible coincidence?', but they would be on the whiteboard as points to consider.
I have explained myself to you three time now, yet you choose to remain committed to your angry emotional reality as fact. You continue to disparage me, calling me a liar and now saying that I am rotten to the core, not to be believed in anything, Trump-like.
So here's a question for you: If my comment on KFS disturbed you so much, why didn't you reply to me there, instead of here?
(That's a real question, and I'd like an answer, please.)
MY MAIN POINT ALL ALONG HAS BEEN:
If you had questioned me there, my reply would have been the same: That we (with 'we' being both women and political discussion/activism sites) face a common enemy (MRM-type attackers) that we have been ignoring, and that we in our discussion sites need to face the fact of that enemy's existence and develop policies and methods of protecting ourselves from those attacks; and that JtC/c99 had already provided a model policy.
If you can come out of rant mode for a moment and would like to enter into civil political discourse about that one paraqgraph above, please do. Do you agree or disagree with that paragraph? If you disagree, what specifically do you disagree with, and why? Do you see anything non-factual or erroneous in that paragraph?
My comment at KFS that Shiz objected to: full text
I've long believed that political -discussion sites like KFS, c99 will pored over by future scholars working on the PhD theses, and that the social dynamics of our sites will be as important to them as our political actions. In the interests of those future scholars, I am posting the full text of the comment at KFS that so enraged Shiz. I am posting the full text of my KFS comment as a replu to my comment http://caucus99percent.com/comment/156093#comment-156093 (and mentioning this because at time c99 still often posts a Reply as a new Comment).
I have highlighted the parts of my comment that appear to be what enraged Shiz. I have also corrected a couple of typos, in [] using square brackets, as I was taught is proper. In comments here, I mis-rememberd where I included the link to JtC's reprimand of the MRM-user. And, as is obvious, I began mixing up 'MRM' with 'MSM' in this first comment -- again, I can only explain this as a result of brain damage and age. I continued misusing 'MSM' for 'MRM' in the other 11 (eleven) comments in that thread, but the people I conversed with understood that I meant 'MRM', based on the content of their replies.
If readers click on the link to my first KFS comment, then scroll up two comments Past Mass Southpaw's comment to the one above that), they will find a very cogent description of the kind of harassment a number of KFS women had been subjected to by MRM-types since the site opened. Much of the thread above that comment contained similar complaints. So, as I said in the comment that should be directly above this one, my intent in my first comment at KFS was:
I have now made the documentation of these events as complete as I can, so a reader will not find it necessary to travel to different pages.
(no subject)
https://www.euronews.com/live
I did read the link, hence my apology.
I read the whole fuckin' thing and realized you meant exactly the opposite of what I thought you meant, which is why I apologized.
That being said, I really reject the rest of what you wrote. I'm not involved with any MRA bullshit, and I have never seen the commenter in the above-linked thread before. To accuse me of being somehow involved with them is supremely over-the-top, and I'm being nice because I was wrong and owed you an apology.
I assume you mean "MRA" and not "MSM", but I can assure you, I'm not part of the mainstream media, either.
I miss Colorado.
Shiz, please chill.
First: I told you I appreciated your apology.
Second: Please read my reply to CS in AZ for fuller treatment of your second point. I at no point "accused you of being somehow involved" with MSM-types. I stated, accurately, that your off-topic comment to me shared the same format and structure as the odd, off-topic, disparaging comments I have been receiving here since the run-in with the MSM guy a month ago. I said that your comment was 'walkin' like a duck' as a bantering way of saying it 'behaved' like those other comments. So, whether you believe it or not, there is nothing to "reject"; I did not say or accuse you of being 'involved' with MSM types --
Third: "I assume you mean "MRA" and not "MSM" ": In your initial comment Shiz, you wrote out 'Men's Rights Movement', so you obviously were clearly understanding who I was speaking about. MSM guys like to style themselves as 'activists', but I will not dignify them with that term.
Have you given any thought to that Amazon link I was talking
with you about a month or so ago?
I know many of us shop with Amazon, and if we had a C99P bookmarkable link to use that could generate quite a bit.
For example, I just had to spend over 2k building a new system, almost all on Amazon. Even if you only got 3% of my purchases a year that would probably add up.
It's not obtrusive as it can just be a link in the New Members section that people can bookmark for their future purchases and as long as they use the bookmark any purchases made within 24 hours get credited to the site.
Also, I am still down to do that auction fundraiser whenever as well.
If I had the tech skills I would buy this place in a minute, but the last language I did any programming in was FreeBSD and I really have no desire to learn a new coding skill set anymore.
"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me
I'll talk...
with you later in a PM.
FreeBSD is great
I've been running current since forever. Too bad it's not more popular.
I probably have some of the necessary skills (I'm a DevOps guy) but I have a full-time job, plus I know nothing about Drupal. And PHP, ugh. I have to fix / enhance PHP code here and there, but the language and the libraries leave me unimpressed
Charge a fee
Not huge like Morningstar's $200 but $5 or $10 per year for posting privileges. Let everyone read for free but pay to post.
I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.
No. People who provide free content should actually be getting
paid. Not possible on a small site having trouble paying even its admin, of course, but without content a Web site is nothing. Posting is a lot of work, don't discourage volunteers.
Please check out Pet Vet Help, consider joining us to help pets, and follow me @ElenaCarlena on Twitter! Thank you.
Right.
You don't see me complaining about not getting paid for the work I do here, while I keep a day job as a "professor" at a for-profit, private university "teaching" online without any control over curricular content. I won't talk about what my day job actually pays.
The ruling classes need an extra party to make the rest of us feel as if we participate in democracy. That's what the Democrats are for. They make the US more durable than the Soviet Union was.
I hope I don't come across as complaining at all, I do it out of
love. But if I were asked to pay for donating content, I think I would not be happy.
Please check out Pet Vet Help, consider joining us to help pets, and follow me @ElenaCarlena on Twitter! Thank you.
You don't. I'm complaining.
Some years ago I remember being told about academic journals that would charge you for the privilege of publishing with them. That's right: you create the content, then you pay the publisher to publish it. And when you send them the money you don't even know whether or not any eyeballs will actually look at what you did. Maybe finding the eyeballs is your job too. Perhaps the journal owners needed the money to cover the costs of putting out the content, which is certainly understandable. Most academic journals get their money from coercing the libraries into forking over big institutional subscription fees. My stuff can currently be read (with more coming next month!) at one of those.
I don't think JtC can do that with c99%. With a website there is of course the possibility of advertising, though. Part of me wishes to cite the Buddhist goal of "nonattachment" when I read all this discussion about money.
The problem of course is that no source of money is guaranteed under capitalism, unless you're standing right next to the good folks at the Federal Reserve giving the orders to print the stuff out. No capitalist economy will ever guarantee everyone a job that pays enough. I'm not saying it's not worth it to try to get that, though. I'm definitely not concern trolling the Sanders movement here. But money is a faith-based scam; the ability to force other people to work for you manufactured as a commodity (see e.g. the Investopedia entry for "seigniorage.")
In the meantime there's working for free, which offers great opportunities because they can't control your labor (see e.g. Marx's 1844 manuscripts, the sections on "alienation"), but then without money it's up to you to find a source of nourishment (hopefully outside of the factory farming business) and a way of avoiding heatstroke or hypothermia while catching the minimum daily requirement for sleep.
The ruling classes need an extra party to make the rest of us feel as if we participate in democracy. That's what the Democrats are for. They make the US more durable than the Soviet Union was.
Hey Cass...
asking writers to pay to publish here? Nope, not going to happen, no way. If anything the writers should be payed.
Thanks JtC!
Btw, have you seen the new Margaret Atwood novel on the stands at your local Barnes & Noble? I guess she wants to get us to think some more about how deeply we're going to be screwed under the existing order.
The ruling classes need an extra party to make the rest of us feel as if we participate in democracy. That's what the Democrats are for. They make the US more durable than the Soviet Union was.
Thanks for the link...
to the review, looks very interesting.
Off topic: but Margaret Atwood screwed readers
With that book. First she was publishing it in installments, which I happily bought, all four of them. Then she did not publish an installment in a looong while but when she did it was part of a full book. I feel that I had to pay twice since I really wanted to find out the ending. Oh, well. Have been holding that in for a while. Phew! Feel lighter now.
Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur.
I think a compromise would be helpful
in order to provide you with a secure yearly income for your full-time job managing this site. We need a group of people who provide the funds in an up-front yearly/quarterly/semi-anual payment.
It looks as if there would not be enough people capable or willing to do it to reach the amount needed. But without such a secured guaranteed fund, there would be no security for you. Pledges are great, but they can be broken any day. I tell you today I pledge a monthly fee of 30.00 dollars and can stop it nilly-willy, if I don't want to do or really can't do it anymore. That's not a secure income for a full-time job. No employer can do that with their employees. Your employer could go bankrupt and lay you off, or he could fire you, because he thinks you did a lousy job. But no employer can not pay you your salary, just because his wife tells him, she wants something and he just needs the money of your salary to satisfee his wife's desires. So ... I think a small subscription fee to participate as a member is not something that would exclude those members, who can't afford a $3.00 to $5.00 monthly fee. There are enough people who can afford to pay a higher monthly fee to cover those, who can't pay $3.00 to $5.00.
I wished there would be a mechanism to tip or pay something to the few great writers of series here. I am with you that those writers should be paid. But how? I do believe that payments for writers need to be volunteer payments by the readers, as long as the site doesn't generate enough revenue that the "owners and the editorial board" can decide to pay them.
I remember times at TOP where some writers flooded the site with their diaries and quite frankly some of those I wouldn't tip or recommend or pay a money tip for. Others, on the other hand, I wished one could pay for. But the decision, if that should happen, I think should be a split decision between the owners of this site and the readers of this site.. Because we do not want to become dependent on unreliable tips by readers or ideological decisions of the editorial board or owners of the site. I have no idea how this could be set up.
I am still convinced, like a couple of people have written here, that being a member here should be subscription fee based. A very, very small fee. Most people CAN afford to pay a $3.00 to $5.00 monthly fee.
And those, who can't will get sponsored by those, who can afford a higher monthly fee. Nobody really would get excluded who wants to be a member.
https://www.euronews.com/live
Being paid would be nice, but as Einstein reluctantly
pointed out in his Theory of Relativity, progressives not getting paid for their writing is a physical law of the universe.
Thank you for explaining more about what's happening
I certainly do understand how frustrating and exhausting it must be, and I know you've been inundated with new people over the past months and have to be under extreme pressure to deal with it basically alone.
This life raft has come to be very important to me very quickly, and I'm sure I'm not alone! I don't know how to deal with it suddenly sinking.
Please think about letting more people help you! I understand it's hard to trust giving over some of the work and tasks to others, but many of us have a lot more time than we do money, and could help keep it afloat. The election will be over in 3 months, things will calm down... I know I'm pleading- sorry! Just want there to be an answer, not ready to accept this.
Blogger Burnout is a serious thing.
Everybody needs to walk away sometimes, but it doesn't necessarily have to be for good.
But if you decide it does, then all I can say is thanks for the ride man. I've had a blast.
The current working assumption appears to be that our Shroedinger's Cat system is still alive. But what if we all suspect it's not, and the real problem is we just can't bring ourselves to open the box?
Fantastic photo!
Is that real, or photoshopped?
I don't know.
I think it's real, but to tell you the truth it's such a cool shot I don't really care.
The current working assumption appears to be that our Shroedinger's Cat system is still alive. But what if we all suspect it's not, and the real problem is we just can't bring ourselves to open the box?
-- delegate.
I suggest that you select a few volunteers whom you trust to manage the day-to-day operations; hire (with donations) a dedicated fund-raiser; and YOU (JtC) would function as the Factum-Factotum -- overseeing the general direction of the site, and marshaling resources, to be directed as necessary.
I have been a donor in the past; if you decide to broaden the scope of C99, I am in again -- $100 here --
When Cicero had finished speaking, the people said “How well he spoke”.
When Demosthenes had finished speaking, the people said “Let us march”.
If we can generate enough funds...
to hire someone, then I would like that someone to be me. I would love to run this site full time if the compensation is there. Someone has to do and it might as well be me.
Delegating the work I do here means giving full admin privileges to several people, in essence, giving them the run of the site. That is highly risky. They need to know what they are doing and be totally trustworthy.
So I just did some math.
There are over 2200 members here now. 2000 X 50 = $100,000.
I'm just sayin' ...
I miss Colorado.
I'd say...
there's probably 200-300 people or more that have registered here but have never logged in for whatever reasons.
Someone a couple of months ago did the math and figured out that if enough members signed up for a monthly installment plan at $5.00 per month that it would possibly generate enough funds. There was a fundraiser to get folks to do just that. We had about 10 people sign up for that plan. That type of plan would work if enough people would buy in. Many folks just don't have the money to spare and I'm very sensitive to that fact and don't want to pressure folks too much.
You're numbers are great and would do the trick if enough folks would buy in.
I am writing the Go Fund Me thing right now, lol.
I am going to need a shitload of approvals for this. Basically, I want to use the names of many key, regular members here who also have a following of their own (as a way to promote the site), but only if they're OK with it.
I'd also willing to wager that Joe would like a say in how this thing is written, but it's a start, anyway.
And, FYI, I am fucking broke, but I would find a way to pay $50.00 for a lifetime membership.
I miss Colorado.
I have a large FB following
That is very political. I'd be willing to fundraiser for this site on my FB feed.
There is always Music amongst the trees in the Garden, but our hearts must be very quiet to hear it. ~ Minnie Aumonier
Perfect, thanks!
Unfortunately, I don't really have a big social media following. I don't do Twitter and limit Facebook to people I know, lol.
I do belong to a couple of political groups that wouldn't necessarily mind if I posted about the fundraiser.
My "big" following was on TOP and, ya know, I'm pretty sure that's out as a fundraising tool now.
I miss Colorado.
A lot of overlapping membership...
but once you get it set up, we can post the link on our ally sites KFS, WOTB, and TPW. That should be 2000+ people who don't participate here? Of course, we can also invite them to participate. C99 is indispensable.
Shiz, as always, you fucking rock!
Ha! Wouldn't TOP be surprised
If we popped over there for some cash for this place. Lol!
PM me and I can give you my email address and when you have something ready you can send it to me.
Thanks!
There is always Music amongst the trees in the Garden, but our hearts must be very quiet to hear it. ~ Minnie Aumonier
My Twitter feed is similar
I would also appeal on my FB feed, though that would generate far fewer responses.
I have hundreds of followers, not that that's yuge. But you
can use my name if you like, FWIW (ec or Elena Carlena). Not to mention the stalkers who follow my every word with fiery hatred in their hearts. All publicity is good publicity, right? Maybe it adds up to a few thousand who read me across all media. If you do use my name, I would like to see what you're going to say about me before the final edition, please.
Please check out Pet Vet Help, consider joining us to help pets, and follow me @ElenaCarlena on Twitter! Thank you.
I would be able to commit to $20.00 a month right now ---
and will do more in a few months. I just started a new job, and if all goes as I hope it will, I should be able to donate up to $75 a month beginning this Spring
How many is enough?
Some people could do more than $5 a month, some can't swing even that, but together we can make this happen. what will it take, on a monthly basis, for us, the members, to "buy the site" and hire you and keep the technology running? Alphalop has offered to donate items to sell to raise funds, but said he was waiting for direction or an ok to set something up. Probably others could do that too. There are ways - but it needs to be a coordinated and focused ongoing effort. If people can't volunteer to help you admin the site, a team could volunteer to work on building and maintaining funding streams instead.
I missed that.
Could someone post the link?
Just a thought
I guard monthly recurring payments like the plague so I've opted for 1-offs as they occurred to me. But you've been a lot more forthright about the situation in this thread and I can see the obvious need for something a bit more stable. I'm reconsidering what I can and will safely commit to as a monthly. What helps is information... much of which has flowed out in this thread.
$5/mo is an attainable figure for us. I had no idea that such a thing would actually be helpful.
A lot of wanderers in the U.S. political desert recognize that all the duopoly has to offer is a choice of mirages. Come, let us trudge towards empty expanse of sand #1, littered with the bleached bones of Deaniacs and Hope and Changers.
-- lotlizard
As someone who has helped out with a lot of fundraisers
at TOP, I'll add my voice to verify that $5 donors are very valuable. There are a lot more $5 and $10 donors than any other amounts, so they add up. Consider if 1000 people make $5 automated monthly pledges, that's virtually no pain to many wallets and $5000/month (minus fees) longterm that the site can count on, allowing for planning in advance, etc.
Please check out Pet Vet Help, consider joining us to help pets, and follow me @ElenaCarlena on Twitter! Thank you.
Well, speakin for myself, consider yourself hired!
We will generate the funds! We can do it! I feel better --- Johnny, I hope you feel better! You kinda answered my questions, kinda, sorta. I get the sense that c99 is your baby --- a baby you dearly love! Well, I also sense that you gotta lotta folks who love this/your/our baby!
Everything is going to be ok!
If you can switch out your other job to keep this one
then can we figure out how to do that?
Can we have another fund raiser to tide you over while you look at ad possibilities?
Can we figure out ways to get more hits to the site? (I can talk my 3 adult children into 'hitting' the site once in a while for the sake of ad revenue lol).
I have been under the impression that you wanted to keep it small and manageable. I think once you got hit with refugees, it got bigger too fast. One of the biggest problems with start ups is trying to manage rapid growth.
If you feel that you can manage if it can pay you a living wage, then maybe we should figure out how to get it there.
But I don't want you to feel like we are pressuring you. It's just that you've got it running with a good 'vibe' and we do appreciate that about this site. Do what is best for you, though, not what WE think is best for you. lol
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when we are afraid of the light.
--Plato
Absolutely...
I would cut my business down to a very small percentage if the income was enough to keep me going here. I would love to do that.
This site is the way it is because of the special blend that Joe and I and the moderators have worked our butts off to develop, if that were to change I'm not sure the site would be the same.
Believe me, this is my baby and it tears me up having to be in this spot.
If we had an idea on the $$ necessary to keep the site
under your stewardship we can brainstorm a plan. Several good ideas have already been posted.
Still yourself, deep water can absorb many disturbances with minimal reaction.
--When the opening appears release yourself.
OK...
bottom line: $4,000.00 a month or $50,000.00 per year to come even close to what I can knock down with my business. Thus lies the brick wall.
Is that inclusive?
As in would that cover the server costs and future upgrades or any software that is or will be needed?
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.--Aristotle
If there is no struggle there is no progress.--Frederick Douglass
yes...
that would include operating costs.
So if we could raise 50k
on a GoFundMe, that would carry you for the next year. Hell, even if we could get half that, that would buy you enough time to do something to make the situation more bearable.
Yes...
to both.
... we can do this --
When Cicero had finished speaking, the people said “How well he spoke”.
When Demosthenes had finished speaking, the people said “Let us march”.
Whether We Choose GoFundMe, Or Another Fundraising Site
... there are processing fees involved. GoFundMe charges about 8% per transaction. See this website for other options. The only free alternative that I know of is people contributing through the 'Family and Friends' option on PayPal - through which the recipient gets 100% of the donation.
JtC knows that I'm always loathe to toot my own horn, but I probably organized more fundraisers (incredible amount of work involved behind the scenes) and helped to raise more money than anyone in the history of DK, particularly in the past five years. One idea would be to have a "Fundraising Blogathon" over a couple of weeks during which a number of c99% members contribute personal essays on why it's necessary to raise funds for this blog.
I'll certainly help here and contribute what I can. This website needs to stay online and grow.
A riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma
you can't
put the baby up for adoption. That would be Wrong.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUVpP2h3dpQ]
All shall be well!
We got ya covered buddy! You just keep on keepin on the wonderful way you are wayin c99 --- it's all going to work out just fine --- I just feel it in my bones
Now, you go get some rest --- "close your eyes and relax...try not to turn on to problems that upset you..." ( I think that's from "Jesus Christ Superstar")
I'll Raise my monthly
Donation. Those who can, do it right away so JtC can see how much. Minimum sounds like it is $4,000 a month we need to bring in to hire him. Let's get going!
And maybe it is better to send directly. PayPal keeps a certain amount as a fee.
How about a nag screen. Make
How about a nag screen. Make cookies expire early, and make them wait a minute or 5 before they can submit posts unless they donate a certain amount every month.
Websites are brutal.
There's a reason that very few websites (percentage-wise) are successful. Even if money isn't the goal, money must be made in order to just keep the damn thing running. For people who want to be together, and share ideas towards a common goal, a website is a real luxury. JtC has done an insane job of keeping this thing hopping through a large uptick in usage, and it's very, VERY commendable. But it's also not surprising that he has had enough. It's too damn much work for a couple of guys.
Not that I am an expert on Drupal, but I have been an IT guy for a long time, which has led to my amazement that JtC has kept up the pace for this site. Something has to give, even if someone else takes over the site, that work doesn't go away. I have some (hopefully not too blunt) suggestions, which, of course, can be taken or left:
First? Ads. Run a normal ad load for a month. All of us readers should agree not to use an ad blocker, and just see what the income is for a month. Of course, everyone hates ads, but remember, this site is a luxury. Ads would be a small price to pay. The good news is that ads are much more customizable now, as I'm pretty sure you can restrict the sources and types of ads these days, at least via Google.
Here's what is MOST important to me about this site: the people and the cause. Or really, the people and their causes. The site is great, but it's not the reason I'm here. I'm here because I like the company, and I assume most are here for that reason. There's a reason people are flocking to aggregation sites like reddit: it's a beautiful thing to not have to fuck with IT shit when all you really want to do is connect with people you like.
What I'm getting at is, is there a reasonable site that handles all of the hardware/software headaches, so we can just get to what we do: writing and communicating, with the same mod structure, people, rules, etc.? Reddit is an example, but doesn't have to be the answer. I found medium.com to be a wonderful site for writing blog material. In fact, I did a sample one back when the reddit site started up, and we were searching out solutions. Here the sample, I thought it was very nice, and easy to write within: medium example link Now, I don't think (though am unsure) that medium is the entire answer, but could be part of it? I dunno.
Bottom line, this is too good of a group of folks to not stay together. This site is wonderful, but if it's not sustainable, then it would be crazy to break it up over damn technology.
Just some thoughts. (By the way, sorry I've been scarce. Kind of hit a wall after the primary fraud, and had to veg out for awhile. I've been reading regularly, however.)
Thanks, JtC and Joe for all you've done. It's a great place.
Great input!
I'd turn off my ad blockers for this good cause! (Besides, they don't block much anyway lol)
We could start with the "go fund me" that shiz is working on while jtc is checking out ad possibilities.
There are so few places that don't have drama. You mentioned reddit. Well, in the past week I had my fill of drama over there. I almost stopped going but keep hoping that the crap stops. Seriously. I spent about 10 hours this week going through posts and counter posts trying to figure out what the h#ll was happening. People that I recognize from TOP are getting into more flame wars than being a berner in a shillary diary in April this year. (Felt like I was in the movie Network with all of the competing liberal groups yelling at each other.) I couldn't even comment because not a whole lot of it made sense to me (as if someone mixed up 10 completely different cut jigsaw puzzles, pulled out a random 500 pieces, and asked me to make a picture out of it).
Then I come here and I see/feel/hear sanity. When I noticed the 'for sale' sign, I almost cried!
I didn't check out your link to the other website yet (I'm still ranting). But I absolutely agree with this:
Thanks, geebeebee, for your thought out reaction.
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when we are afraid of the light.
--Plato
The sad thing is that they weren't even having a fight.
The fight was having them. I almost jumped into it, but I've recently only made things worse when I've tried to help. Over the years, I've come to think of it as a split that manifests along the J and P division (MBTI). We're especially vulnerable during that first downtime after a battle. Judgers want to maintain focus and perceivers want to take a step back for a broader perspective. The J sees the P as being aloof, not really caring. The P sees the J as reckless. The fact is that we need each other.
SquirmyRoo, solid rebuilding is going on at KFS.
Mass Southpaw has a stickied post up about repairs, and there have been other good posts the last few days about it. Bottom line, the objectionable 'new rules' have been rescinded.
I can't bring myself to go back there.
One of the issues we were having there, aside from the mod rules, was the culture difference between the kossacks & the redditors (largely ex /sfp people). I swear, those redditors are the most paranoid people; there's a boogeyman behind every screen name and action that leads straight back to Hillary. I briefly looked into wayofthebern the day after the big blowup at /kfs, and it was full of that nonsense, and I decided: enough! As much as I liked /kfs, I don't think it's worth the aggravation of dealing with the redditors there.
OK, its up to you. Just FYI.
It's true, some of the content
has been influenced by refugees from other sub-reddits. Most of them young and new to activism and politics in an election year that has been off the charts in terms of the blatant corruption and manipulation that we are all witnessing in real time and trying to make sense of. But there is also a dynamic young people bring into any enterprise that equally heartens me. And it's been my experience that when engaged about the dubious content politely, they've been pleasant enough. Perhaps my more maternal long view of their impulsive "paranoia" is foolishly indulgent in the sense that I feel youth can always benefit from a good example, a little patience, and occassional direction here and there.
There is always Music amongst the trees in the Garden, but our hearts must be very quiet to hear it. ~ Minnie Aumonier
First of all...
That's not how ads work...
In the case of Google Adsense the ad would actually have to be clicked on, and in the case of regular site users if they regularly clicked on ads, it may be deemed "Click Fraud" and the publisher's account would be closed with loss of payment...
Amazon would probably be fine for site users to click, and get the cookie before making a purchase on Amazon, and the C-99 account would then be credited with the sale and get the commission...
It is not a case of not using an ad blocker and being paid for the ad to show up...
I'm the only person standing between Richard Nixon and the White House."
~John F. Kennedy~
Economic: -9.13, Social: -7.28,
Damn.
"Just call me Hillbilly Dem(exit)."
-H/T to Wavey Davey
Maybe/Probably most of us are poor ... but ...
I can't schedule reoccurring donations. Sometimes the money will be there and sometimes not.
But what would help me is having an official Donation Day on the 4th of every month. That is the day I am most able to give $5. For some, an additional day on the 16th would be good.
Then I am reminded to donate on a day I probably can. It will be small but it will be something.
Marilyn
"Make dirt, not war." eyo
I get $971 (but they're going to start whacking me for
my school loans). Anyway, five bucks on the third isn't going to sink or save me. I have my own personal Ponzi scheme going. I always end up borrowing and then I have to borrow to pay back the original lenders. Especially for utilities. But I digress...
I think $5 a month should be doable. Like I said, it's not enough to sink OR save me from financial ruin because I'm already there. And it would be worth it.
I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks
Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa
Damn! Well, it's definitely a longshot, but contact me...
JtC, as you know, I haven't been participating here (hardly at all), and barely even comment at Daily Kos more than a couple of times per week now. (No diaries.) But, while it may be little more than wishful thinking (okay, I'm being a little too conservative stating that, but it's not that far from the truth), I think we should have a talk. At your convenience this weekend (Saturday? Sunday?), send me an email (bobswern@earthlink.net), and I'll respond with my phone number and related contact info.
Couple of basic questions, and a very brief statement first:
1.) You're currently at BlueHost, according to WhoIs. Would a "real," Drupal managed services/dedicated server setup, with the MSP's staff there truly backing you up, be an interesting option to look at; and, then to keep you engaged? (I realize this would just be a small/modest part of a bigger/doable "solution," for you. There's more to my thinking than just this one aspect of overcoming the hurdles you're now facing to enable you to continue managing this site.)
2.) Could you send me along some background about your PHP/MySQL skillset(s) and related business-sector experience? (Please include some sort of summary, if not a resume. Even just 2-3 paragraphs about your I.T. business sector experience, if there's no recent resumé? Whom you've worked for? What types of businesses have you worked with/for utilizing your PHP/MySQL skills?)
3.) Currently running a VERY intense MySQL/PHP SaaS platform. Looking for a couple of people right now. But, skillset must meet fairly high/stringent specialization requirements.
At best, this is a stretch. So, don't get your hopes up. But, in the unlikely chance that there might be some synergy, let's at least have a conversation. I'd forever regret NOT reaching out and making this comment at this juncture, seeing as how I've always been a YUUUGE fan of both your and Joe's efforts, in general. (I think you guys already know that; but I haven't been showing up here to reinforce that truth, so shame on me. Again, I'm not going to beat myself up over that, since I've had a brutally busy summer, and I'm only a few years younger than you.)
--Bob
"Freedom is something that dies unless it's used." --Hunter S. Thompson
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