How Would a Hillary Adminstration Deal with Non-Violent Dissent? Ask Ray McGovern
Lest we forget, this is what happened to Ray McGovern in 2011, when he stood up and silently turned his back on then Secretary of State Hillary Clinton as she gave a speech regarding internet freedom in 2011:
During Hillary Clinton's speech Ray McGovern: @raymcgovern was violently arrested for standing up & turning his backhttps://t.co/S68yW3Me9F
— #ForThePeople (@BernieVolunteer) June 11, 2016
You can read the full transcript of his interview by Amy Goodman of Democracy Now at this link. The Intro to the transcript reads as follows:
This week, U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton gave a major address calling for internet freedom around the world. As Clinton condemned the Egyptian and Iranian governments for arresting and beating protesters, former U.S. Army and CIA officer Ray McGovern was violently ejected from the audience and arrested after he stood up and turned his back in a silent protest of America’s foreign policy. Ray McGovern joins us from Washington, D.C.
Comments
That interview was compelling:
If you need to know why HRC should not be President, watch the video, then think about what she will direct her goons to do when (if) she is elected. Ray McGovern has guts. He still speaks out against Medusa. More power to him.
I recal briefly meeting Ray at the Iraq War protest march
in 2005. Very nice man, as I recall.
"You can't just leave those who created the problem in charge of the solution."---Tyree Scott
The OP actually describes the Clinton's arrogance to perfection.
Trump is a buffoon who's arrogance is base on ignorance (money doesn't guarantee smarts) . Clinton's arrogance is based in her own true belief that she is above the rules.
Which is worse? Someone who is ignorantly petty and mean or someone who is intelligently petty and mean and calculating?
EDIT: Was going to take the ' out of the word Clinton's in my subject line, but now I think not because that arrogance I'm talking about surely belongs to her.
I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks
Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa
From that graphic that LSM did, Trump is dangerously
incoherent while Clinton is coherently dangerous. It's almost certain that Clinton will 'win' this election. Lots more unnecessary death on the way.
"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." - JFK | "The more I see of the moneyed peoples, the more I understand the guillotine." - G. B. Shaw Bernie/Tulsi 2020
Don't be so sure about Hillary
The Trump campaign reminds me way too much of Reagan, except that Trump is cleverer than Reagan and Hillary is loathed while Carter was seen as a failure. Both Reagan and Trump are racists, but racism is more virulent today.
There are two theories on how Hillary can win - first, that she convinces enough good government independents to vote for her and her minority support. Sure, 80, even 90% of Bernie's indies will hold their noses, but that 10, 20% is millions of votes, and as for her minority white knights, who says they will be allowed to vote? The second theory is election fraud. Against the Republicans? Just ask President Tilden how much good election fraud did for him? (for those who don't know, Hayes won anyway by stealing more votes than Tilden)
On to Biden since 1973
tRump is slightly brighter than reagan was, but reagan
was a professional pitchman and that's what made all the difference. None of reagan's ideas were his ideas, he was the front man that delivered his lines to his audience on behalf of his employers. It was those employers that had the ideas and the agenda, and in that, without Bernie, we are even more screwed this time.
Clinton/tRump or tRump/Clinton makes no difference as they both work to deliver the same things to the same people.
My take
Trump says things to get attention.
Hillary says little she believes, and does things that get people killed and make money for her and her "friends."
Who would make the more dangerous President at 3 am in the morning?
"You can't just leave those who created the problem in charge of the solution."---Tyree Scott
Hillary
IMHO.
Plus, I think if Trump won, he would very likely be a one term president. I personally think we could survive that. Hillary is far more dangerous because she knows exactly what she is doing.
A Trump presidency would not only rally the progressive base to fight even more vigorously; it would probably help us grow in numbers. A Hillary presidency could pacify just enough of the people to prevent us from making much headway for truly positive, progressive change.
Barring a major screw up on her part, we might end up with 8 years of Clinton shenanigans.
Yaldabaoth, Saklas I'm calling you. Samael. You're not alone. I said, you're not alone, in your darkness. You're not alone, baby. You're not alone. "Original Sinsuality" Tori Amos
She has no respect for service
to any master but herself.
This is a Feudal attitude, and Hillary exemplifies it.
I do not pretend I know what I do not know.
The H & D Show
Aren't they a lovely couple? And the great thing is, regardless of which one you vote for, you still get almost all of the others policies.
inactive account
Great. Now I need brain bleach!
You had to plant the idea of Donald and Hillary coupling (read: having sex) in this essay, didn't you?
Now I need some brain bleach.....
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
Her double standards at the DoS
I hate to use Fox news, but I can't find any other outlets. It is obvious to anyone who looks SHE is special. You may bow.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/03/06/exclusive-internal-cable-from...
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/03/06/clintons-personal-email-use-d...
Bernieorbust!
“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”
We know it, already happening, she is steamrolling her way
to Lead Us All. For her gratification. Lord (non-religious here) help us, especially any who protest.
Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.
That was just disgusting. People are worried that Trump may
be a fascist while ignoring all the evidence that Hillary is an aspiring Feudal Overlord....
She doesn't want constituents, she wants serfs.
You don't gotta answer to serfs...
"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me
Ray got material from Hillary's emails
Ray has a suit related to the incident. As I recall it is against George Washington University.
He did a discovery process to see if the Scty of State had any documents related to the incident. They said that they had none.
Then Hillary emails were published
Well, Sidney Blumenthal had written a couple of emails to Hillary as I recall asking Hillary or he staff to reach out to Ray. They never did.
I tried to find the article at Ray's web site, but a quick look failed to find the reference.
There are lots of articles about emails, drones, interviews, etc on Ray's web site
http://raymcgovern.com/
I'm encouraged by the new leaks since May 9 after reading
this predictive analysis --
http://www.ninaillingworth.com/2016/06/01/the-foggy-bottom-of-clintons-m...
The author calls her writing style 'Gonzo Lite' and it is a dense, longish read, but well worth it. In May 1 article, Nina analyzes the main players in the Server Drama (ie, Obama, Atty Gen Lynch, FBI's Comey, etc) then games out how each faces a series of choices they have to make regarding possible indictment as both government representatives (their legal constraints) and and as political (electoral) players. She also games out the best timing(s) for various moments, ir, what moment(s) are best for Comey/Lynch to move toward indictment.
Nina sees Obama on the horns of a dilemma: He *must* allow indictment, and he *can't* allow indictment. To traverse this, he must give HRC full-throated support, then allow enough new information to enter the news stream to make if self-evident that Obama has no choice but to let an indictment begin. At some point HRC will leave the race (or, more likely, will be forced out), whereupon Obama will take the exceptional step of granting a pre-emptive pardon (unless another device presents itself), so that Obama can still be seen as 'protecting/supporting' HRC. The the Dem Party will parachute in HRc's replacement (Nina thinks Biden/Warren will be likely). (I have omitted Nina's mentions of Bernie, and much else. One point I must include is that at some point, per Nina's scenario, Obama will have to have a long talk with Bernie to explain these plans and discuss how O/Dems would like Bernie to behave during all this.)
One week after Nina published this (May 8), Obama had a big day (1) endorsing HRC, (2) meeting with Bernie and (3) meeting with Atty Gen Lynch. On May 9, WSJ released the first damning new info about what was on HRC's server; the WSJ story was covered on Reuters the same day, bringing it out from behind the WSJ paywall. (I read Nina's article on May 9, and clicked on my next open link to read the Reuters' coverage. Whoa, I thought. Obama fullfilled Nina's 'new leaks' prediction really fast!)
I've lost count of how many new leaks there have been, but I think it's been 3-4 that I've seen, in the four days between May 9 and today, May 12.
Here's what is different about the recent spate of new links: Up til May 9, the leaks (including the State OIG's report, which demonstrated Hillary's duplicity) were, for the most part, about how her server violated FOIA and Federal records-retention laws and regulations. Beginning May 9, the leaks (which are being placed in a wide array of media so a wide array of demographics will find the leaks reported on the media they trust) have dealt with violations of the laws/regs that deal with maintaining sensitive government documents securely -- ie, with Espionage Act offenses. (Which many of us learned about during the 2010-11 Wikileaks era, and even more of us learned about during the 2013 Summer of Snowden.)
One of the very coolest aspect of the Espionage Act, in this context, is not necessary to prove 'intent'; it is enough to show 'negligence' -- which the State OIG's report has already done.
Stock up on popcorn!
A second on that link
I'd like to second that suggestion that folks read this article by Nina Illingworth, "The Foggy Bottom of Clinton’s Muddy Waters." It's quite a piece ... clear, well though out, well cited. Again, here is the link:
http://www.ninaillingworth.com/2016/06/01/the-foggy-bottom-of-clintons-m...
Read it, people. Longish, but worth it.
Wow!
Just fucking wowww. That was a great read. Thanks much!
"I can't understand why people are frightened of new ideas. I'm frightened of the old ones."
John Cage
June?
You keep saying May. Don't you mean June?
The article was published June 1st.
Yaldabaoth, Saklas I'm calling you. Samael. You're not alone. I said, you're not alone, in your darkness. You're not alone, baby. You're not alone. "Original Sinsuality" Tori Amos
Thanks, Steven D. I'm a big fan of Ray McGovern's
but I hadn't heard about the back-turning incident of the govt's response.
I do remember reading a speech that HR had just made overseas, about the USA's 'exceptionalism' in the areas of Free Speech and Internet Freedom -- and I remember cursing her under my breath as a lying bitch, because I had been reading heavily about America's attacks on Wikileaks, Asssange, and the (still-unknown?) Manning. Hillary had placed herself at the head of the pack of hounds baying for Assange's blood (as she did later with Snowden).
Although the earlier reports about HRC's server focused on FOIA-related issues, I had learned enough from those earlier years to recognize the the mere existence of her unprotected server, open to anybody who cared to look, was in and of itself a violation (actually, a number of violations) of the Espionage Act. I must admit that when I recognized that, I discovered in my self a kind of quiet, sharp-toothed glee that must be 'schadenfruede'. And I must admit that that sharp-toothed part of myself really does want to see her in an orange jumpsuit for a long, long time.
This kinda puts a whole new perspective on why she went so hard
core after those whistle blowers for leaking documents.
She probably has a ton of them to hide herself and is paranoid someone may get their hands on them and leak those as well and wanted people too terrified to even contemplate doing so in the future.
I wonder how that's working out for her?
"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me
Good point, Alphalop, I hadn't considered that!
I hadn't considered the possibility then that HRC was so rabid re: Wikileaks because, having her server, she felt the need to pre-emptively protect herself. (Of course, We The People only learned about her server fairly recently, so her server wasn't part of the discussion in 2010-11.)
I don't know how well you remember the Wikileaks era, but heads were exploding all over DC, particularly at State and in the military, who had been caught with their pants down and ferociously demonized the pants-downers. In addition to the videos of air troops slaughtering civilians, the then-unknown Manning also leaked a huge tranche of State emails, with Wikileaks setting free and enormous amount of information to researchers.
(BTW, about your name: It makes me think of lop-eared bunnies. Does your name have any connection to lop-ears?)
Thanks, lol! No, It stands for "Lazy Overweight Police"
A slang term the inmates had for us.
So I figured the best way to undermine the intent was to own the word and make a mockery of it at the same time, "I am not a Lop, I am their king!" I think was my first response and it just sorta evolved from there.
"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me
OK, I get it -- you're the Alppa LOP -- cute!
(but I still like the bunnies better!)
Yeah, you are not the first on here to have that take on it...
I said in another thread that the stories or ideas that people come up with to explain my name are so much more interesting than the reality of it.
"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me
Do you mean June 9-12?
'Well, I've wrestled with reality for thirty five years, Doctor, and I’m happy to state I finally won out over it." Elwood P. Dowd "
If this is to me, magicsister, about leaks May 9-12, yes.
Yes, the 'new' leaks touching on the secure storage of sensitive national documents, which falls under the Espionage Act, started on May 9, beginning with the WSJ's leak about sensitive State emails about whether or not allow particular drone strikes to go forward were stored on (and sent on from? iirc) Clinton's unprotected server. This is getting serious -- it's like making troop movements available in time of war. And (I'm not certain but) I seem to recollect than names of in-country State staff, or assets, were (or could have been) included in (some of) the sensitive emails. (I'm qualifying so many bits because several leaks have come forward since Thurs, and I've read several reports on some of them, so details from different reports are likely to be blurring together in my mind right now. But as for the shift in leak content from FOIA to sensitive document protection (Espionage Act), that's been very clear.)
Sociopathic Behavior
Hillary's ultra-calm demeanor throughout this despicable incident put me in mind of the behavior of President Park of South Korea. While delivering a speech, an assassin struck, accidentally shooting and killing Park's wife. Park calmly continued to finish his speech, without stopping to inquire after his wife.
Mark F. McCarty
Ray is a hero of mine
got to meet him, several times. Once with Col Ann Wright.
I have said it time and time again that protesting Hillary was always more dangerous than protesting Cheney.
"Love One Another" ~ George Harrison
Just don't go bird shooting with him
LOL
"You can't just leave those who created the problem in charge of the solution."---Tyree Scott