and sometimes they switch.

They are power seekers whose goal is to enrich themselves. Anyone who wants power enough to get it is one of those people. Normal human beings rebel against doing what's necessary to gain that power.

Any 3rd party that gets strong enough to challenge for power would get taken over by those who want power for themselves...or get corrupted by the power.

If we look at this not as the United States of America but as the American Empire (which includes multinational corporations) we can see that most elections are only for show. The exceptions would be for local offices in small towns.

In a way the idea of building a third party is another diversion. It'll keep us occupied while the dirty work gets done.

Still, it might be a longshot but I don't disparage anyone who works for that. Maybe I'm wrong and maybe a third party could fix things.

I'm tired of that bullshit because they can't make a sound decision if it saved their asses.

I appreciate the point that their decisions are sound enough when it comes to lining their own pockets and accumulating more power, but our "leaders" are conducting themselves in a way that seems more a satire of a greed-and-corruption saturated system than a real government, media and industry. They act determined to bring the people to the boil of revolt.

i agree with you that the current system will not be the vehicle for creating the sort of society that we need and want.

perhaps the best way to get started on a new one is to start with some founding documents. you know, some sort of statement of why the current government is stupid, intolerable, corrupt and needs to be replaced, followed by a statement about the sort of world that the current governance is preventing that needs to spring into existence.

then after that is done, some sort of blueprint of goals and governance would be handy.

just a suggestion.

Our system is set up to make third parties fail. For a third party to succeed, that means one of the two major parties must first collapse.

Here is where I think we need to put our time and effort into in no particular order:

1. Mandatory paper ballots and elimination of e-voting machines

Until this happens we cannot trust the result of any election. I fully expect the e-voting machine to flip the vote to Hillary in key states she needs to win an electoral college victory. Anyone who believes we have free and fair elections is living in a fantasy land. Those billionaire donors of Hillary paid good money to support her. They are not going to see their investment turn south.

2. Overturn Citizens United and Corporate Personhood through Amendment

Until this happens, it won't matter who we vote for because the game is rigged to favor candidates backed by big money donors. This is why I support Move to Amend.

3. Change the way we vote from winner take all to proportional voting.

This is the only way to ensure that voices outside the two main parties get represented. I personally favor this system, proposed by Fair Vote, but I am open to anything other than our current system that under-represents real human being and over-represents rich people and corporations.

4. Support Protest Movement of all Kinds

From Black Lives Matter to the NODAPL Standing Rock Sioux to Stop the TPP we need people on the ground and with the money supporting protests, civil disobedience actions and demonstrations against what our corporate overlords want our government to do for them (and do against us). The more we support people who are passionately behind one issue, the more they will be willing to support those of us who care more deeply about other issues. Call it the reciprocity principle.

5. Build and Support Alternative Progressive Media

This is an obvious one. As long as corporate controlled media is the main source of news (i.e., information), as well as the main editor of what gets covered and what does not, the less free the rest of us become.

Building a third party movement is not high on my list right now because I do not think it will succeed in the absence of one of the Big Two collapsing. And even then, the risk that it will be infiltrated and taken over by corporate influence is too high under our current political system that values money and power over free speech and human rights, and which requires a first past the post electoral system. I'm not going to tell others how they should invest their time and resources, and if working on a third party is what they want to do, more power to them. But that's not what I see as the best use of my time, nor the most likely path to success.

We need to define short term goals, interim goals and long term goals.

Getting 5% of the vote gets matching federal funds. Once that threshold is crossed getting 15% in polls gets a seat at the presidential debate table.

The Green Party is unquestionably on track to achieve both of those goals by 2020. That is the most effective short term goal I know of. We don't abandon interim goals outside the two party system. We work on them in conjunction with getting a seat at the presidential debate table.

Our long term goal is survival of the human species. We may have time to get there. We may not. Time will tell.

Yeah. Tell me something I don't already know.

In your words...
"What's my solution if not a third party? I don't have a solution."

But go ahead. Throw rocks from the cheap seats at people who plan to vote for a third party candidate. They at least are doing Something, Anything to try to throw the corrupt bums out.

I'm doing Something. I'm voting Green.

and we need a revolution. A mass fucking uprising! A total revolt against the oligarchy and the corporations and the status quo. But how do we bring it about?