Rachel on the NYT story: Vladimir Putin is offering bounties for scalps of US troops

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You would think that at some point people who have bought into the Russia Gate propaganda would hit the breaks as the stories continued to get more out there wouldn't you? Think again. I cannot believe the comments I am seeing on this story.

Hey can anyone think of a reason this story would come up right now? Think hard...think about what is happening in Afghanistan right now with our 20 year old war.... think about peace talks.

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The Liberal Moonbat's picture

I really don't understand the RussiaGate thing well enough to argue whether it was real or not (and I'm soooo truly exhausted - my life was not meant to be wasted on politics; it's my duty, but I hate it and I'm not even very good at it); I made an offhand comment somewhere not too long ago about it being hokum, but the reaction I got was negative - not mean or persecutory or anything, but people were reasonably confident I was wrong.

Can someone point me to some discrete body of work to direct others to when the issue arises?

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7 users have voted.

In the Land of the Blind, the one-eyed man is declared insane when he speaks of colors.

snoopydawg's picture

@The Liberal Moonbat

Even before Hillary lost to Trump she, Obama and intelligent agencies were saying that Russia was interfering with the election and that they hacked into the DNC’s computers and gave the files to Wikileaks. Plus she hired a company called Fusion gps to hire Chris Steele to dig up stuff on Trump’s campaign which was used to get FISA warrants on people in it. Plus the FBI was investigating Trump on false pretenses.

All of that lead to the Mueller investigation that went on and on and on and on and.....until he finally released his report that said, NO TRUMP DID NOT COLLUDE WITH RUSSIA to win the election. Mueller was asleep through most of the testimony in front of congress and...bottom line is that it was cooked up for a few reasons. One- if Hillary won it would have restarted the Cold War. If Trump won it would keep him from playing nice with Russia as he said he wanted to during his campaign. Lots of other tangents went from there.

But instead of it going away after Mueller released his report the power that be keeps bringing it out to outrage the masses who bought into it heart and soul. Don’t believe me? Look over at daily kos and see what they are saying about this. Sane folks would be yukking it up in the isles and rotfltho. They aren’t doing that.

This is so simple it’s like 1st grade math. If you really want to know what it’s about you can put Russia Gate in the search bar and see what we’ve written about it. Trust me we have done a great job debunking it and it’s amazing how many players are involved in it.

Rachel Moscow Maddow was its biggest propagandandist and she is still at it hence this essay. Historians will look back on this and call it the biggest mass Psyops ever done on the American people.

This is one of Rachel’s best propaganda scam. The 2nd place was when she told her fans that Russia was going to hack into Vermont’s electric grid and cut off the power to people in the middle of winter. 3 cheers for that one.

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20 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

OzoneTom's picture

@snoopydawg
A message saying "still believe that Russia is not evil?"

Somehow making the leap from a years-old observation that the Maddow/DNC Russia obsession was a distraction from a failed bungled campaign and badly flawed 2016 candidate, to American deaths last year in a country we invaded and have occupied for twenty years now.

A period in which many scores of Russians have been killed as a direct action by the United States it's allies and proxies.

As soon as I hear anyone spout Russiagate BS as if it were factual, I immediately have to assume that they are either a liar attempting to mislead, or are badly uninformed and intellectually lazy.

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13 users have voted.
Lookout's picture

@The Liberal Moonbat

Most recently, Mate revealed a bombshell that Crowdstrike, the firm behind the accusation that Russia hacked and stole DNC emails, admitted to Congress that it had no direct evidence that Russia actually stole the emails or infiltrated DNC servers.

Thanks in part to the global pandemic that has been dominating headlines, the revelation was not picked up by corporate media, the same corporate media, that for the past four years, worked diligently to convince the American public that Russia interfered in the 2016 elections to help Donald Trump.

The mass hysteria caused by Russiagate since 2016 caused so much paranoia that the American public became convinced that Russia was corrupting and manipulating the American political system. However, very little evidence was presented to the back that claim. In fact, the most famous claim published by the New York Times and the Associated Press in 2017 was that “all intelligence agencies agree Russia hacked our elections.” These same news organizations would later retract that claim yet they still continued to peddle that narrative.

Mate wrote in The Nation that,

In the process, they overlooked countervailing evidence and diverted anti-Trump energies into fervent speculation and prolonged anticipation. So long as Mueller was on the case, it was possible to believe that “The Walls Are Closing In” on the traitor/puppet/asset in the White House. The long-awaited completion of Mueller’s probe, and the release of his redacted report, reveals this narrative—and the expectations it fueled—to be unfounded.”

Most recently, however, previously sealed FBI documents “indicate close contacts between Israel and the Trump campaign and that the Mueller investigation found evidence of Israeli involvement, but largely redacted it.” This was largely ignored by the same outlets peddling Russiagate.

Mate argues, “the real Russiagate scandal is the damage it has done to our democratic system and media.”

https://www.mintpressnews.com/podcast-aaron-mate-russiagate-liberals-bus...

Matt Taibbi has also debunked it. Here they are together...
https://www.commondreams.org/views/2019/03/30/matt-taibbi-and-aaron-mate...

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16 users have voted.

“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”

snoopydawg's picture

@Lookout

This is hilarious as all get out. It shows how many times the media said that THIS is what will take Trump out of the White House. You can only laugh at both the media and the people who are still saying that. Okay, THIS is going to be the scandal that boots him out. Trust me on this!

Yes Mate has done an excellent job of debunking this, and yet here we still are. I haven't read the NYT article in full yet, but here's a small excerpt.

The Trump administration has been deliberating for months about what to do about a stunning intelligence assessment.

American intelligence officials have concluded that a Russian military intelligence unit secretly offered bounties to Taliban-linked militants for killing coalition forces in Afghanistan — including targeting American troops — amid the peace talks to end the long-running war there, according to officials briefed on the matter.

Ah yes the unknown intelligence sources that weren't authorized to talk about it and yet they did anyway.

The United States concluded months ago that the Russian unit, which has been linked to assassination attempts and other covert operations in Europe intended to destabilize the West or take revenge on turncoats, had covertly offered rewards for successful attacks last year.

Any involvement with the Taliban that resulted in the deaths of American troops would also be a huge escalation of Russia’s so-called hybrid war against the United States, a strategy of destabilizing adversaries through a combination of such tactics as cyberattacks, the spread of fake news and covert and deniable military operations.

The Kremlin had not been made aware of the accusations, said Dmitry Peskov, the press secretary for President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia. “If someone makes them, we’ll respond,” Mr. Peskov said.

Right on time:

While some of his closest advisers, like Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, have counseled more hawkish policies toward Russia, Mr. Trump has adopted an accommodating stance toward Moscow.

So how many soldiers have been killed? Surely if Russia is putting bounties on them the number of deaths would be soaring right?

Though coalition troops suffered a spate of combat casualties last summer and early fall, only a few have since been killed. Four Americans were killed in combat in early 2020, but the Taliban have not attacked American positions since a February agreement.

The Liberal Moonbat this was another fake story to further the agenda that Russia is doing bad things here and in Europe to destabilize countries.

The officials briefed on the matter said the government had assessed the operation to be the handiwork of Unit 29155, an arm of Russia’s military intelligence agency, known widely as the G.R.U. The unit is linked to the March 2018 nerve agent poisoning in Salisbury, England, of Sergei Skripal, a former G.R.U. officer who had worked for British intelligence and then defected, and his daughter.

American intelligence officials say the G.R.U. was at the center of Moscow’s covert efforts to interfere in the 2016 presidential election. In the months before that election, American officials say, two G.R.U. cyberunits, known as 26165 and 74455, hacked into Democratic Party servers and then used WikiLeaks to publish embarrassing internal communications.

In part because those efforts were aimed at helping tilt the election in Mr. Trump’s favor, his handling of issues related to Russia and Mr. Putin has come under particular scrutiny. The special counsel investigation found that the Trump campaign welcomed Russia’s intervention and expected to benefit from it, but found insufficient evidence to establish that his associates had engaged in any criminal conspiracy with Moscow.

As to this:

his handling of issues related to Russia and Mr. Putin has come under particular scrutiny.

Trump has been harsher on Russia than Obama ever was when it comes to sanctions. Obama refused to send lethal weapons to Ukraine because of how Russia would react. Trump finally did. And right now Trump is pulling 9,500 troops out of Germany and sending them to Poland to join the other NATO forces building up on Russia's border. But hey let's still pretend that Trump is Putin's puppet and doing his bidding. I can lots of reasons why Putin would want NATO troops on his border can't you?

And guess who is now pushing the crap that Russia actually changed the votes? Harry Reid. After 3 1/2 years he is just now coming out with this? But then I have seen many people all over the net believing that Russia hacked the election, not just interfered with it by posting Jesus ads on Facebook and tell men not to BEAT it.

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9 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

edg's picture

@snoopydawg

All the alleged Russian units that had cute Bear names like Fancy Bear and Cozy Bear now have nondescript 5 digit numbers. How the mighty have fallen.

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7 users have voted.
wendy davis's picture

@snoopydawg

to click into the CIA Times piece through caitlin's link at RT.com. it took 3 'journalists' to make it up: Charlie Savage, Eric Schmitt and Michael Schwirtz

i'll add these brilliant excerpts:

Islamist militants, or armed criminal elements closely associated with them, are believed to have collected some bounty money, the officials said. Twenty Americans were killed in combat in Afghanistan in 2019, but it was not clear which killings were under suspicion.

Any involvement with the Taliban that resulted in the deaths of American troops would also be a huge escalation of Russia’s so-called hybrid war against the United States, a strategy of destabilizing adversaries through a combination of such tactics as cyberattacks, the spread of fake news and covert and deniable military operations [CIA vault 7?}.

and just for the Ha Ha Ha fun of it:

Spokespeople at the National Security Council, the Pentagon, the State Department and the C.I.A. declined to comment.

and yes, you've indicated, the rest reads like this:

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snoopydawg's picture

@wendy davis

and people are replying with the Taliban doesn’t need to be paid by Russia to kill the troops that invaded their country. This is so damn silly and yet you should read what people are saying about it.

Trending soon: #TrumpTreason

The video about the walls closing in on Trump is one you can easily watch and I hope you do because it’s so damn funny. 3 years of the media saying that he’s going down...

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6 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

wendy davis's picture

@snoopydawg

well. almost all of it. till my belly got vertigo. ; ) but what in the world of carmen sandiego are 'the blue check twits'?

#TrumpTreason: kewl. and they had their change to impeach him; what did they choose? ukraine-gate!

my stars! actual thunder in the west! wooot! can we get a few drops? oh, f me; it sounds like hail on the skylights.

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snoopydawg's picture

@wendy davis

It seems most likely that they follow the media talking points or establishment ones. Most media bots have one as do congress critters. Greenwald might but I’d have to check.

Most people that believe the Russian propaganda believes that it’s not just Trump who is Putin’s puppet. Moscow Mitch McConnell. Leningrad Lindsay Graham is one. 9 republicans spent a 4th of July in Moscow so they are too. But they seriously believe that Russia is telling them what to do and they do and the rest of congress has no problem with republicans being subservient to Russia. This is how full blown insane Russia Gate has driven some people. Look at daily kos' coverage on this and read the comments. No seriously take a gander there and see for yourself.

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5 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

@The Liberal Moonbat

to complement Snoopdawg's -

One is that the Flynn prosecution was part of Russiagate in a sense as it also played on supposedly compromising Russia connections he was supposed to have and attempted to portray as sinister and/or illegal what were entirely legitimate interactions that Flynn had with some of the Russian leadership during the transition period.

Plus, it was known that Flynn intended to audit the intelligence community and that he knew where to dig for bodies - maybe literally. So, preventing him from becoming National Security Advisor was one goal, that would hopefully contribute to taking Trump down, too.

Another point is that Russiagate was only one aspect or instance of surveillance and prosecutorial powers being abuse under the Obama administration. When Admiral Mike Rogers came in as head of the NSA he discovered that private contractors at the FBI had access to raw NSA intelligence that was only supposed to be made available for specific, terror or national security related investigations after getting a warrant from the FISA court.

Rogers shut that down, and (IIRC) warned Trump about what was going on.

It seems that under Obama the illegal spying was used to target people regarded as political enemies. The case of Sharyl Atkisson is instructive - an operation against her was conducted by a task force in Baltimore headed by Rod Rosenstein - who was effective head of the DOJ during the Mueller investigation. One of the defendants in Atkisson's case against the government is connected to Crowdstrike, which is connected to Hillary and the DNC's "hacked" server, which is connected to...

Atkisson was a rising MSM star until she insisted on pursuing real journalism on topics like Fast and Furious and Benghazi. They dumped her and she, apparently, made the Obama administration's enemies list - could be that there are a lot more victims of the sort of abuse she endured out there.

Atkisson case info from her website

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wendy davis's picture

@Blue Republic

are able to rattle this history off the tops of your heads...is mind-boggling to me. any of it i once knew has evaporated like a two-minute rain from a sidewalk when the sun comes out.

and yet my media files are full of photos of at least most of the key players.

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6 users have voted.
snoopydawg's picture

@Blue Republic

Here is an article on how and when Obama, Biden, Rice and Comey decided to target Flynn for talking to his counterpart in Russia during the transition. You know like every incoming administration had done. This is damning news and yet the media has not touched it. In fact this is being treated as conspiracy theory.

Did Obama/Biden Lie? Strzok's Newly Discovered FBI Notes Reignite "Obamagate"

The belated discovery of disgraced FBI agent Peter Strzok’s January 2017 notes raises troubling new questions about whether President Obama and Vice President Joe Biden were coordinating efforts during their final days in office to investigate Trump national security adviser Michael Flynn — even as the FBI wanted to shut down the case

Investigators will need to secure testimony from Strzok, fired two years ago from the FBI, to be certain of the exact meaning and intent of his one paragraph of notes, which were made public in court on Wednesday.

But they appear to illuminate an extraordinary high-level effort by outgoing Obama-era officials during the first weekend of January to find a way to sustain a counterintelligence investigation of Flynn in the absence of any evidence of wrongdoing.

The Justice Department says the notes were written between Jan. 3-5, 2017, the very weekend the FBI agent who had investigated Flynn’s ties to Russia for five months recommended the case be closed because there was “no derogatory” evidence that he committed a crime or posed a counterintelligence threat. FBI supervisors overruled the agent's recommendation.

Strzok’s notes appear to quote then-FBI Director James Comey as suggesting that Flynn’s intercepted calls with Russian ambassador Sergey Kislyak “appear legit,” bolstering other recently disclosed evidence showing the bureau saw nothing wrong with Flynn’s behavior.

Read the article for the rest and the tweet that shows Strzok's notes with Biden saying they can go after Flynn for the Logan act. Biden is denying he was involved at all.

The justice department dropped all charges against Trump when more and more damning info came out on how there never were any reasons to charge him. The FBI admitted that they wanted to catch Flynn in a lie when they questioned him. Flynn had no idea that he had been wiretapped, but Stzok and Page had the transcripts of the call. Flynn thought he was helping, not being set up. Who remembers exactly what they said on a call months ago? Hell I see comments I made in the morning and have no recollection of writing them. I'd be screwed 6 ways to Sunday if I had to remember stuff.

So after the charges were dropped the judge on the case refused to allow it and it went to the appeals court who said yes the JD has the right to drop charges. The judge is going to appeal the decision. He also told Flynn that he was a traitor to his country during the proceedings. Wow. Just wow. But that is what comes from years and years of constant bombardment of propaganda.

All of this is going to be ammo for Trump to use against Biden. TLM- this is why they tried to impeach Trump for the Ukraine phone call. Biden, his son and Schiff and many other dems had their hands in the money being used after Obama's brutal coup in Ukraine. As for those bitching about Trump propping up neo Nazis here in the US, Obama et all knew damn well that the Ukraine fighters we propped up were from the same group of Nazis we fought during WWII. Again Obama gets a pass for doing something heinous. Scandal free administration by left buttock.

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9 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

The Liberal Moonbat's picture

@snoopydawg ...but it is just exhausting. I WANT to know what is true. Heck, I NEED to know what is true. It's my fanatic-ascetic-purist-perfectionist personality...but I've been putting my own hopes, dreams, ambitions, talents and pursuit of happiness on the shelf for most of 16 years because of this. I honestly don't know what to do. I cannot live in this world. I have too much knowledge, too little power, and for all I know the fact that the visual processing problems I have been diagnosed with in the past seem to be acting up now could be some kind of unconscious defense mechanism.

I can't take it anymore. I don't know what to do.

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2 users have voted.

In the Land of the Blind, the one-eyed man is declared insane when he speaks of colors.

@The Liberal Moonbat of the strategy of our owners so finding out what IS really honest to God true is not an easy task. Take heart, it is hard to find out the truth and you are not alone in being confused. Confusion sows fear and our owners have used fear since inception to divide and conquer and to get many of us to simply throw up our hands and give up. The fact that you're out here on this site shows me though, that while you are exhausted, as we all are, you cannot just give up and you have not. And that is a good thing. Hard to do, yes, and not for the faint of heart which again, you aren't since you're still trying. We may not win the fight for truth but in the end we can all look ourselves in the mirror and know we did what little we could do to counter their lies, confusion and FEAR.

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7 users have voted.

Only a fool lets someone else tell him who his enemy is. Assata Shakur

The Liberal Moonbat's picture

@lizzyh7 The good news, such as it is, is that there is no need to win "the fight for truth". The truth ALWAYS wins - it just doesn't give a shit about any of us. Those who lie ALWAYS lose in the end - it's just a question of how many innocents and superior possibilities they are allowed to murder before their chickens finally come home to the only roost in which they belong. Evil may excel at making Good lose over and over, but it can never, ever win. Only that which is grounded in truth is sustainable - and that is why the moral arc of the universe does indeed tend toward Justice.

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4 users have voted.

In the Land of the Blind, the one-eyed man is declared insane when he speaks of colors.

studentofearth's picture

@The Liberal Moonbat Guilt eats at one's soul and health. If you have personally, deliberately acted in a manner to harm others or life on earth, do not do it in the future. Guilt is simply feeling bad with no positive action.

Prioritize your shelter, food, water, air and health, both physical and mental. Slowly expand the stability to those close to you, then to community and outward.

At times the best we can do is to provide witness and not forget the truth. If truth is not forgotten it moves forward into the future, sometimes hidden for awhile. If being a witness is stressful at the moment, simply give encouragement and acknowledgement to others. They also get overwhelmed at times.

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5 users have voted.

Still yourself, deep water can absorb many disturbances with minimal reaction.
--When the opening appears release yourself.

@snoopydawg

- good explication, good article by John Solomon - who has been plugging away at this for years now.

In this I/V Sydney Powell - Flynn's lawyer - discusses some of the same events/issues plus what they have still not received from the FBI/DOJ and where she sees this going.

Powell's books are pretty high up on my "to read" list. One is apparently scathing about Andrew Weissman - real head of the "Mueller" investigation. Now he is out raising money for Biden...

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4 users have voted.
snoopydawg's picture

@Blue Republic

He knew everything from the very beginning because as we are learning he was directly involved in getting the investigation into Flynn on the Logan act started. Solomon has been very informative on me keeping up with all the ins and outs of Russia Gate, what happened in Ukraine during the 2016 election and the people tied to Hillary helping her get dirt on Manafort and others in Trump's campaign. And every tidbit in between.

This is from 45 days ago and yet the media is barely touching it. Stephanopholas did ask Biden what he knew about the meeting that I posted an article about above, but Biden said he knew nothing about it. Uh yeah Joe you did. It was your idea to go after Flynn with the Logan act for something every incoming presidential team has done. Reagan of course worked with Iran against the sitting president when he asked them to keep the hostages until after the election. Funny how he got to skate on that.

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4 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

@Blue Republic If the Obama admin illegally spied on her, it is a separate matter, and as I'm not familiar with the details, I have no opinion on that. For now, I would no more cite Attkisson as a source for anything than I would bellingcrap.

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1 user has voted.

One of the reasons normal Americans did not jump into Russiagate was that it lacked the drama and dead Americans as 9-11. There was no tangible act which horrified Americans and consumed the entire country. Well, Russia was not starving Americans, taking away their jobs, shutting off massive electrical grids, etc. No they messed with an American election with bad memes. I thought that the Deep State would try to set up a false flag operation to create a "Russian 9-11".

Now the Deep State, military, neocons, etc can claim that Russians are killing Americans in Afganistan. Now, nothing drastic and huge like 9-11 but good enough to change the narrative arch in a very dangerous way. No need for a false flag--just put a lie out there.

Now literally any retailation will be justified including military ones. The timing of this claim looks to have been thought out very carefully. It undermines Trump in an election year, it undermines peace talks in Afganistan, it undermines nuclear arms treaty talks, and it pretty much supports the worst war-provoking sanctions that the Deep State wants to impose on Russia which are being discussed in Congress. It also serves to marginalize the BLM movement by claiming it was started by the Russians which state propagandists have been pushing. It could justify any attack on Nord Stream2 to stop its completion. What's not to like about it from a waromongering point of view.

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15 users have voted.
snoopydawg's picture

@MrWebster

There was no tangible act which horrified Americans and consumed the entire country.

Just kidding.

BINGO.

As for Nord Stream2 guess who they want to supply gas to Europe? Come on give it your best shot...
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.
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Okay. Burisma. Surprise. Yep that company that Hunter Biden was on the board of and daddy Biden ran interference for when the Ukraine prosecutor was looking into his roll on the board of directors.

I love how smart members of this site are! Kudos.

No need for a false flag--just put a lie out there.

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13 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

wendy davis's picture

@MrWebster

foreign ministry seems to agree with you. from RT.com:

On Saturday, the Russian Foreign Ministry dismissed the NYT story as “fake information.”
This unsophisticated plant clearly illustrates the low intellectual abilities of the propagandists from US intelligence, who, instead of inventing something more plausible, resort to conjuring up such nonsense.

“Then again, what else can one expect from intelligence services that have bungled the 20-year war in Afghanistan,” the ministry said.
Moscow has suggested that this misinformation was “planted” because the US may be against Russia “assisting” in peace talks between the Taliban and the internationally-recognised government in Kabul.

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11 users have voted.

I have no doubt that Rachel had an orgasm while reading the NYTIMES article.

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11 users have voted.
snoopydawg's picture

@humphrey

She did look very excited didn’t she? More Russian propaganda porn for Rachel. Good lord how will she feel in a few decades when she realizes that she sold out any principals she had and pushed Russia Gate on to a gullible people?

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9 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

wendy davis's picture

@snoopydawg

i was relieved it was just one minute long. the epic intensity of her True Believer Faith was terrifying to behold. did the CIA Times actually name Putin himself and 'taking scalps' as she did?

the irony is, of course, that the coalition partners actually DID pay the taliban to guard their supply lines, and US GI's were paid to guard the opium poppy fields. now the taliban were the group that made the trains run on time, picked up the garbage, etc. but al qaeda was a whole different animal, wasn't it?

but seriously, rachel needs to be treated for mental illness. what inner demons of her own is all this Paranoid Belief in anti-russian agitprop a cover for (displacement)?

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7 users have voted.

@snoopydawg she will one day realize who she is? The mind doesn't work that way. Psychic investment in the crazy is a one-way path.

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6 users have voted.
The Liberal Moonbat's picture

https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/hgesqi/russia_secretly_offer...

It's WMDs all over again.
Any source(s) that can shut this down?

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4 users have voted.

In the Land of the Blind, the one-eyed man is declared insane when he speaks of colors.

snoopydawg's picture

@The Liberal Moonbat

There have been many people that have debunked every aspect of Russia Gate from the beginning, but they are not asked to talk about it on shows like Maddow or MSDNC. Mate and Greenwald have become pariahs of the left because they won't swallow the BS. Again if you want to see our coverage of this and I hope you will look at how involved this charade has been. There were so many key players that we wrote about. One other big thing that came from RG is the censorship that is cropping up. Fake news accusations got Google, FB and Twit to change their algorithms to keep traffic from going to alternative websites that tell the truth. Up to 90% had been decreased on some sites. Plus we started seeing people being banned from social media starting with Alex Jones. I wrote about that as well as how the Atlantic Council was working with FB. THE AC is full of NATO members and gets some of its funding from the government. Nice way to get around the 1st amendment.

If you really want to know about this then we have done the work for you. All you have to do now is read it.

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8 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

The Liberal Moonbat's picture

@snoopydawg Like most people, I cannot afford to spend my whole life on the front lines of a losing battle against the Ministry of Truth. Politics makes me miserable, okay??? I am driven by demoniac taskmasters to remain involved in this, not any kind of desire or calling. I am a literal political junkie, and I need to start cutting back before it ruins any more of my only life. Can you PLEASE just point me out to a few SPECIFIC, RIGOROUS sources (books, specific individual experts, articles that can't just be dismissed as "editorials" or obscure cranks) that I can also direct others to? I wouldn't even know where to start looking. I KNOW how research is done, and I take it seriously; telling me to "just look it up" doesn't cut it.

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1 user has voted.

In the Land of the Blind, the one-eyed man is declared insane when he speaks of colors.

snoopydawg's picture

@The Liberal Moonbat

Put Russia Gate in the search bar up on the left and see what comes up. We have done extensive work on this since it started and it there for you to browse at your leisure. Follow the links others have posted here.

Russia Gate has been pure unadulterated bullshit and it is really amazing how many people believe it. Especially this last story. Did you read the NYT article on this? See my excerpts and commentary. It's up to you to read what we have written.

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3 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

The Liberal Moonbat's picture

@snoopydawg Okay, I understand better what you were saying now, and that is a step forward...it's just that (and I could be wrong) even though I believe most of what I read on this site, it doesn't feel like a source that will command the confidence of others. I was hoping for something/someone/somewhere I could point to that the sort of people I'd be engaged with in an adversarial (but not hopelessly so) manner would regard as credible experts - something that can change the minds of those otherwise not inclined to believe me.

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0 users have voted.

In the Land of the Blind, the one-eyed man is declared insane when he speaks of colors.

snoopydawg's picture

@The Liberal Moonbat

I seriously have no idea where to point you. You can find slanted sources on any site. I trust the ones I use. I thought you wanted to learn more about it not change others minds?

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1 user has voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

The Liberal Moonbat's picture

@snoopydawg I brought this up because I casually mentioned RussiaGate being baloney somewhere else, and when people thought I was full of it I realized I wasn't at all equipped to argue the case.

One of the worst experiences of my life involved someone saying I "[didn't] know what [I was] talking about" - when in fact I was the only person in the room who did. It seems to have been clinically traumatic, and I've been completely obsessed with being able to win arguments ever since. Maybe I'll share the story sometime.

"Of all men's miseries the bitterest is this: to know so much and to have control over nothing."
- Herodotus

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In the Land of the Blind, the one-eyed man is declared insane when he speaks of colors.

snoopydawg's picture

@The Liberal Moonbat

People who believe in it will laugh at your sources and you will not change anyone’s minds about it. I don’t know why you would want to take on that stress if you are already stressed out.

Did you watch the video or read any of the links posted here? Good places to start. But whenever you do read something like this nyt article here’s what you should look for. Weasel words described in this article. People are still saying that all 17 intelligence agencies agreed that Russia interfered with the election. Brennan’s words are "we believe" just like this article points out.

https://www.rt.com/op-ed/493089-times-afghanistan-russia-bounties/

Read what the people who believe heart and soul are saying about this story. DK has plenty of diarrhea diaries to choose from. Sumner has been the front page diarist writing about everything Russia Gate. It’s gaslighting at its finest. Also read Caitlin’s essay Wendy linked to.

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"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

snoopydawg's picture

@The Liberal Moonbat

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2 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

@snoopydawg to watch that tomorrow.
Thanks for the video.

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@The Liberal Moonbat but there is no Book of Truths source. Particularly not on current politics and foreign affairs. Finding the solid ground, the most correct facts, and eliminating all the garbage takes time which is why truths emerge most reliably in books. (Long-form journalism is mostly a thing of the past back when The New Yorker was an excellent source for facts a very good writing.) Books that for the most part are ignored. In addition to truth, those books also teach one how to be rigorous in thinking and critiquing. A few that I view as essential for today are:

Overthrow -- Stephen Kinzer
The Devil's Chessboard -- David Talbot
Shock Doctrine - Naomi Klein

Blowback, Sorrows of Empire, and Nemesis (a trilogy) by Chalmers Johnson. While I could acknowledge that Johnson was smart, I loathed him back in the 1960s when he appeared on PBS talk panels supporting the Vietnam War. I was a high school kid that read whatever books on Vietnam that I could find (there were that many), and understood more about the situation than a Cal professor (and while not known then, a CIA advisor; a handicap that I didn't have). It was only much later that Johnson learned how wrong he'd been and his trilogy is partially his mea culpa.

At the moment for me, the most reliable reporters and well thought out opinion writers are Aaron Mate, Max Blumenthal, Matt Taibbi, Caitlyn Johnstone. Consortium News is another good source -- will always miss Robert Parry, but check out the archives for his articles to see clear reporting. Maybe start with The Rise of the New McCarthyism from 26 September 2017.

A tip on debating/arguing with others - refuse to debate beliefs, including believing in the beliefs of others. For example, "intelligence sources believe Russia is paying jihadists to kill US soldiers." Whenever US intell uses the word "believe," is means they have no facts that can support the conclusion. Those that don't know that are too ignorant to debate.

Not many people engage in fair debates. Sticking to facts that can't be refuted and avoiding emotionality. We all tend to get a bit too wrapped up in convincing others of our position. As I rarely convince anyone of anything, I've had to learn not to debate and settle for succinctly stating my position and walk away. If I've done my homework, I have to be satisfied with knowing that I got it right but it's not going to change anything.

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Lookout's picture

might be one reason for the timing.
https://kashmirobserver.net/2020/06/23/russia-rules-out-mediation-in-ind...

Another might be the success of his WWII celebration
https://futurefastforward.com/2020/06/20/vladimir-putin-the-real-lessons...

I'm so sorry the US has become the warmongering terrorist of the world.

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12 users have voted.

“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”

viewer. I can not believe the change in her. She appears to be manic. I mean seriously ... you can see it in her eyes.
Wow she has become quite dangerous to honest journalism.

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13 users have voted.

"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin

@Fishtroller 02 She was always manic and had that crazy in her eyes. It's just that when it was directed at the Bush Administration and Republicans it fit too seamlessly with how liberals were thinking in those days and therefore, wasn't seen for what it was. I saw it in 2007 and from that point on, dismissed her as anyone that I would ever pay any attention to again.

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wendy davis's picture

@emptywheel reTweeted:

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@wendy davis became so popular at dKos. She was always too boring and crazy for me to bother reading.

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she was always a Democratic Party polemicist and never a rational and objective journalist. She only played one during the GWB era, which wasn't that hard to do, and filled a slot for a woman in that role. She's much too young to have been a classic Cold War Warrior, but not too young to be a Clintonista Democrat.

Seeing the world through the lens of the classic Cold War always led to becoming batshit crazy. The revised Cold War (post USSR and post Yeltsin) is equally poisonous. Instead of a commie under every bed, they see the hand of Russia/Putin in everything that doesn't go the neoliberalcon way. Just as the old Cold War warriors couldn't imagine that the people in any country could act autonomously to oust a ruthless dictator, monarch, or colonial power without active support from the USSR, Clintonistas can't imagine being defeated in any sphere without Russia/Putin active support. Lack of evidence for Russia/Putin activities doesn't dissuade them from their belief.

While it wouldn't be unwarranted for Russia to back anti-US Muslim warriors in Afghanistan,
it's not consistent with Putin's style. It's more like US duplicitous, short-term think. Like US backing AQ spin-offs in Libya and Syria to oust Ghaddafi and Assad and confident that once they've done the dirty deed, the US can crush those AQ spin-offs. Unlike the US, Russia/Putin has no interest in strengthening any Muslim terrorist operation anywhere, and particularly not near the RF. And the calculation would seem to be no different for China.

Cui bono? A long list and not worth the effort to speculate about.

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@Marie from Max Blumenthal:

'Caesar' Sanctions

How did I miss this anti-Assad, blue-garbed, anonymous, Syrian defector testifying before Congress in 2014? Better optics than "Curveball," but out of the same playbook at that and Nyirah. Members of Congress must be some of the most ignorant and stupid people on earth to keep falling for these nat-sec stunts.

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snoopydawg's picture

@Marie

What we are doing to the Syrian people is depraved as what we are doing in Yemen. It is deliberate genocide and it is being done with the blessings of congress. That they deliberately do things that cause famons and deaths is something I will never understand. These people have done nothing to our country except live on resources we want and has a leader who isn't our pliant puppet. We are also doing this to Venezuelans.

Sorry I can't think of how to spell famons right. Starving people. Little help please?

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"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

@snoopydawg

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snoopydawg's picture

@Marie

Argh mornings with this brain.

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"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

wendy davis's picture

more legs than fifty spideees. trending on twitter is 'russia denies'...etc.

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@wendy davis in hazmat garb in front of photographers?

Who's the 2020 Judith Miller for the NYTimes?

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wendy davis's picture

@Marie @Marie

able to read the piece. but pretty soon it'll be: 'It's the same outfit that shot down Flight MH17 over Ukraine!!!!'

actually, i'd collected some (then) wild new stories on ukraine on one word document or other, but i'd imagine by now they're pretty dated. but some f them were about bags of cash as bribes for burisma, denials, the georgian bad penny president in & out of office in georgia (twice) & favor in ukraine (ach, i'd had to look him up: Mikheil Saakashvili.

fancy this: the kyiv post is behind a paywall now. i loved it that once amy goodman had 'journalist' christopehr miller on her show, lol.

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snoopydawg's picture

@wendy davis

ICYMI. The article throws every little bit from RG into the mix. It's pure garbage and yet people will buy into it.

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4 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

wendy davis's picture

@Marie

Charlie Savage, Eric Schmitt and Michael Schwirtz (i got in via RT.com)

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The US thoroughly hacked Yeltsin's reelection in Russia in the 90s. He didn't stand a chance, polling in the teens. The US sent an election team and tons of money and got Yeltsin re-elected, a drunk going about the task of destroying Russia. In Afghanistan Russia (S.U.) had come to the aid of a secular government being challenged by religious head-chopping fanatics. The US sent money and weapons, including surface to air missiles to the Mujahadeen. The purpose of that money and weapons was to kill Russian (Soviet) Men and Women in uniform and depose a secular government that respected human rights and replace it with an extremist theocracy. Girls were banned from schools and if they did try to walk to school our "clients" threw acid in their faces. So Russia would be more than justified in doing the claimed actions against the US. But they didn't. Because they are built around negotiation and compromise and peace. That should be obvious if you follow their history since the founding of the Russian Federation. Russians view these claims as a total absurdity. I think it was Gorbachev who said that "We are going to do something terrible to you," he noted. "You will no longer have an enemy.." Well, we just can't accept that. Russia understands this well and has positioned herself around a dangerous irrational US. Nonetheless the US will continue its policy to hack at Russia in every way possible. The majority of the people of the world see this as it is and correctly believe that the US is the biggest threat to peace. I see a Biden presidency as a far greater threat to world peace and security, once his neocon advisors get their hands on power along with Maddow egging them on.

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Capitalism has always been the rule of the people by the oligarchs. You only have two choices, eliminate them or restrict their power.

k9disc's picture

https://nationalinterest.org/feature/vladimir-putin-real-lessons-75th-an...

Yet other states have preferred to forget the agreements carrying signatures of the Nazis and Western politicians, not to mention giving legal or political assessments of such cooperation, including the silent acquiescence – or even direct abetment – of some European politicians in the barbarous plans of the Nazis. It will suffice to remember the cynical phrase said by Polish Ambassador to Germany J. Lipski during his conversation with Hitler on 20 September 1938: "…for solving the Jewish problem, we [the Poles] will build in his honor … a splendid monument in Warsaw."

Neglecting the lessons of history inevitably leads to a harsh payback. We will firmly uphold the truth based on documented historical facts. We will continue to be honest and impartial about the events of World War II. This includes a large-scale project to establish Russia's largest collection of archival records, film and photo materials about the history of World War II and the pre‑war period.

Today as well, our position remains unchanged – there can be no excuse for the criminal acts of Nazi collaborators, there is no statute of limitations for them. It is therefore bewildering that in certain countries those who are smirched with cooperation with the Nazis are suddenly equated with the Second World War veterans. I believe that it is unacceptable to equate liberators with occupants. And I can only regard the glorification of Nazi collaborators as a betrayal of the memory of our fathers and grandfathers. A betrayal of the ideals that united peoples in the fight against Nazism.

Historical revisionism, the manifestations of which we now observe in the West, and primarily with regard to the subject of the Second World War and its outcome, is dangerous because it grossly and cynically distorts the understanding of the principles of peaceful development, laid down at the Yalta and San Francisco conferences in 1945. The major historic achievement of Yalta and other decisions of that time is the agreement to create a mechanism that would allow the leading powers to remain within the framework of diplomacy in resolving their differences.

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“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu

edg's picture

The US funded and armed the Mujahedin in the 1980s and helped kill 15,000 Soviet soldiers. It should be obvious to any sane person who the real killer is.

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@edg And really, we haven't been for a long damned time. The rest of the world knows who the real killers are, while American's wave that flag and bleat on about the land of the free, the rest of the world looks on in disgust, rightly so. People here are more worried about who is wearing a mask than about the murderous nature of their own damned country. While they bitch on and on about their neighbor and Russia and whatever other moronic shit gins up their outrage, they don't worry about being ripped off over and over again by our owners, they still think our owners care about them. Not a sane country, one with it's head so far up its proverbial ass it will never be able to see reality, nor does it want to.

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Only a fool lets someone else tell him who his enemy is. Assata Shakur

@lizzyh7

While they bitch on and on about their neighbor and Russia and whatever other moronic shit gins up their outrage, they don't worry about being ripped off over and over again by our owners, they still think our owners care about them.

Especially like "whatever other moronic shit gins up their outrage,"

A third of the country is in slop heaven with the tweeter-in-chief spewing out moronic shit that turns on their outrage meter 24/7.

Maddow does the same for another third of the country.

The remaining third just wants all of them to go away.

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snoopydawg's picture

to lie to us by spreading propaganda. Blue check Twit is pushing the outrage on this. Read any of the replies to any of the tweets posted here and see how people are reacting.

Trump is not doing anything to protect the troops. He is trying to bring them home. Or out of Afghanistan at least. The longest US war has been forgotten by the media, but now that there is a peace treaty on the table the knives are out to undermine it. So much for supporting the troops you A'holes.

Beside how do people know that Trump has not done anything? Are they all flies on the wall? Or is it that this is so outrageous that any person with a brain would stop and question if this is actually happening? How can people believe that congress would be okay with other members and the president being beholden to Russia? ANd if he is then why didn't democrats impeach him for that? Oh they tried getting him through Mueller, but one reason Mueller didn't say much during the congressional hearings on this is because he drew the line on perjury. Think about that. But Schiff perjured himself over and over on the record. See?

https://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2020/05/24/who-deserves-impeachme...

Dumbass comments:

I wouldn’t be surprised if Putin is paying IMPOTUS for every American who dies of COVID19.

ToP comment:

Kneeing during the national anthem=not supporting troops. Allowing foreign government's to place bounties on American soldiers=supporting the troops.

Umm yeah and any curiosity about where they are going? You know like Poland on Russia's border that would be not what Putin wants?

He rewarded Putin. Took troops out of Germany and begged to get him in the G7.

I am appalled at how people have swallowed the whole RG scam from the beginning just because Obama told them it happened and then Hillary took it an ran.

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8 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

"Reporters from the New York Times and the Washington Post were called up by unnamed 'officials' and told to write that Russia pays some Afghans to kill U.S. soldiers in Afghanistan. There is zero evidence that the claim is true. The Taliban spokesman denies it. The numbers of U.S. soldiers killed in Afghanistan is minimal. The alleged sources of the claims are criminals the U.S. has taken as prisoners in Afghanistan.

All that nonsense is again used to press against Trump's wish for better relations with Russia. Imagine - Trump was told about these nonsensical claims and he did nothing about it!

The same intelligence services and 'officials' previously paid bounties to bring innocent prisoners to Guantanamo Bay, tortured them until they made false confessions and lied about it. The same intelligence services and 'officials' lied about WMD in Iraq. The same 'intelligence officials' paid and pay Jihadis disguised as 'Syrian rebels' to kill Russian and Syrian troops which defend their countries.

The journalistic standards at the New York Times and Washington Post must be below zero to publish such nonsense without requesting real evidence. The press release like stories below from anti-Trump/anti-Russian sources have nothing to do with 'great reporting' but are pure stenography...."
https://www.moonofalabama.org/2020/06/evidence-free-press-release-claims...

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snoopydawg's picture

@aliasalias

The same intelligence services and 'officials' previously paid bounties to bring innocent prisoners to Guantanamo Bay, tortured them until they made false confessions and lied about it. The same intelligence services and 'officials' lied about WMD in Iraq. The same 'intelligence officials' paid and pay Jihadis disguised as 'Syrian rebels' to kill Russian and Syrian troops which defend their countries.

As usual pot/kettle. But one story is true while the other is pure grade A bullshit.

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6 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

@snoopydawg I don't know why but I now get...
Error 524 Ray ID: 5aa265ee6f501386 • 2020-06-27 21:54:38 UTC
A timeout occurred
And I've tried over and over, oh well maybe it'll get straightened out in a while.

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wendy davis's picture

@aliasalias

but here it is: To Keep Russiagate Alive 'Officials' Make New Claims Without Providing Evidence, june 27, 2020

at his juke joint ya have to click on the time code that's underlined.

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snoopydawg's picture

@aliasalias

The Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs said in a statement that the story, “illustrates the low intellectual abilities of propagandists from the American intelligence, who instead of inventing something more reliable have to come up with such nonsense... However, what else can be expected from intelligence, which miserably failed the twenty-year war in Afghanistan”

The Taliban denied any involvement.

Guess the CIA doesn't want to bring the troops that are guarding the poppy fields home or how else would they fund their black ops? But expect the democrats to jump on this and make lots of noise, but oh noes they can't impeach Trump for it because reasons and it's too close to the election. They say they will rely on voters to throw him out and if he wins reeelection well here is more cannon fodder for them for the next 4 years.

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9 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

Shahryar's picture

I ask my friends "what did the Russians actually do in 2016?"
they say "they ran Facebook ads"
I ask "what ads? Did you see any? Do you recall any?"
they say "come on, everyone knows they did"

It makes me sad.

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@Shahryar on masturbation, and get them to confess if they personally found it persuasive.
I think 'Yosemite Sam' was/is closer to the American mindset.

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@Shahryar @Shahryar I think they sent out some mean tweets also. Devestated Hillary in the upper midwest.

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@Shahryar is almost complete. They don't see nuance, details, or God forbid demand actual substance to a story anymore, they swallow it whole and they stick to the simple sound bite answer. And they double down when questioned and do not ever give a coherent argument. It is sad, and horrifying. People who used to think a bit now don't even bother, and they're fucking proud of that! I find myself saying over and over and over again, this is the SAME MEDIA that lied us into two wars! Admittedly so now, that isn't some wild CT BS, they admitted it! And yet supposedly sane people believe them now, wholeheartedly. On both "sides" too.

It makes me want to slam my head against the wall most days, although I am getting better at letting go of some of the anger. Which CIA guy was it that said "our disinformation campaign will be complete when everything the American public believes is a LIE?" I have that quote written somewhere and keep meaning to print the thing and hang it on a wall in my house. It is true, and it seems to me their mission is complete. They've worked hard at it for a long time but it's finally come to fruition.

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9 users have voted.

Only a fool lets someone else tell him who his enemy is. Assata Shakur

wendy davis's picture

@lizzyh7

CIA director william casey in a meeting with ronald reagan in the roosevelt room in 1981.

former CIA director & mob boss mike pompeo was proud to holler: 'We lie,We cheat, We steal'.

john brennan must have made some memorable quotes, himself. ; )

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wendy davis's picture

@Shahryar

the picture, to say the truth, but 3 programs i did finally track down in WikiLeaks' publication of the CIA's Vault 7 demonstrated that it was snap to obscure the senders of emails, hacks, and what have you. if you'd pay me $1.99 i could go find that post and show you what i'd found. ; )

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wendy davis's picture

@wendy davis

and her i was tryin' to save up for a new pair of haflinger clogs, as my glue job dinnae work. ; )

from ‘CIA Incompetence Led to WikiLeaks’ Vault 7 Publications’, 6/20/2020

related to above:

i followed a few seemingly false trails as the cia program that crates false flags, from Umbrage to Hive...but finally saw Marble in a video. see what you think; i'm quite a luddite.

Marble Framework 31 March, 2017

Today, March 31st 2017, WikiLeaks releases Vault 7 "Marble" -- 676 source code files for the CIA's secret anti-forensic Marble Framework. Marble is used to hamper forensic investigators and anti-virus companies from attributing viruses, trojans and hacking attacks to the CIA.
Marble does this by hiding ("obfuscating") text fragments used in CIA malware from visual inspection. This is the digital equivallent of a specalized CIA tool to place covers over the english language text on U.S. produced weapons systems before giving them to insurgents secretly backed by the CIA.

Marble forms part of the CIA's anti-forensics approach and the CIA's Core Library of malware code. It is "[D]esigned to allow for flexible and easy-to-use obfuscation" as "string obfuscation algorithms (especially those that are unique) are often used to link malware to a specific developer or development shop."

The Marble source code also includes a deobfuscator to reverse CIA text obfuscation. Combined with the revealed obfuscation techniques, a pattern or signature emerges which can assist forensic investigators attribute previous hacking attacks and viruses to the CIA. Marble was in use at the CIA during 2016. It reached 1.0 in 2015.

The source code shows that Marble has test examples not just in English but also in Chinese, Russian, Korean, Arabic and Farsi. This would permit a forensic attribution double game, for example by pretending that the spoken language of the malware creator was not American English, but Chinese, but then showing attempts to conceal the use of Chinese, drawing forensic investigators even more strongly to the wrong conclusion, --- but there are other possibilities, such as hiding fake error messages.

The Marble Framework is used for obfuscation only and does not contain any vulnerabilties or exploits by itself.

Ed Schultz at RT (2027) had mentioned Hive in regard to Kaspersky Lab in moscow, but a former CIA said: Nah, the agents wouldn't do anything illegal...i'll go look and see if i can make any sense of Hive.

separate comment:

i looked for Umbrage on the cia vault 7 list

and discovered i'd had to do an internal search. it popped up in several related parts, but it was far beyond my ken, so i bingled externally for it and found:

‘WikiLeaks: CIA hacking group 'UMBRAGE' stockpiled techniques from other hackers’, march 2017, usatoday.com

A division of the Central Intelligence Agency stockpiled hacking techniques culled from other hackers, giving the agency the ability to leave behind the "fingerprints" of the outside hackers when it broke into electronic devices, the anti-secrecy group WikiLeaks alleges as it released thousands of documents Tuesday.
.............................
The documents also suggest that one of the agency’s divisions – the Remote Development Branch’s UMBRAGE Group – may have been cataloguing hacking methods from outside hackers, including in Russia, that would have allowed the agency to mask their identity by employing the method during espionage.

“With UMBRAGE and related projects the CIA cannot only increase its total number of attack types, but also misdirect attribution by leaving behind the ‘fingerprints’ of the groups that the attack techniques were stolen from,” Wikileaks said in a statement.

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wendy davis's picture

@wendy davis

find the above CIA vault 7 programs useful, you might want to save them.

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Shahryar's picture

CNN is reporting that it's been reported by the Times. So now the next organization can say 'as reported by the New York Times and verified by CNN...'

CNN, bah! They also 'verified' that Bernie said something when they really verified that Liz Warren told some people something.

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wendy davis's picture

@Shahryar

not the proverbial Circular firing squad.

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2 users have voted.
wendy davis's picture

seems he's burned out and has a boatload of guest posts. but y'all will be tickled witless (maybe even wickled titless as the brits say) by this:

Caitlin Johnstone: It is the US intelligence’s job to lie to you. NYT’s Afghan bounty story is CIA press release disguised as news',
27 Jun, 2020, RT.com

Whenever one sees a news headline ending in “US Intelligence Says”, one should always mentally replace everything that comes before it with “Blah blah blah we’re probably lying.”

“Russia Secretly Offered Afghan Militants Bounties to Kill Troops, US Intelligence Says”, blares the latest viral headline from the New York Times. NYT’s unnamed sources allege that the GRU “secretly offered bounties to Taliban-linked militants for killing coalition forces in Afghanistan — including targeting American troops”, and that the Trump administration has known this for months.

To be clear, this is journalistic malpractice. Mainstream media outlets which publish anonymous intelligence claims with no proof are just publishing CIA press releases disguised as news. They’re just telling you to believe what sociopathic intelligence agencies want you to believe under the false guise of impartial and responsible reporting. This practice has become ubiquitous throughout mainstream news publications, but that doesn’t make it any less immoral.

In a post-Iraq-invasion world, the only correct response to unproven anonymous claims about a rival government by intelligence agencies from the US or its allies is to assume that they are lying until you are provided with a mountain of independently verifiable evidence to the contrary. The US has far too extensive a record of lying about these things for any other response to ever be justified as rational, and its intelligence agencies consistently play a foundational role in those lies.

Voices outside the mainstream-narrative control matrix have been calling these accusations what they are: baseless, lacking in credibility, and not reflective of anything other than fair play, even if true.

“Same old story: alleged intelligence ops IMPOSSIBLE to verify, leaked to the press which reports them quoting ANONYMOUS officials,” tweeted journalist Stefania Maurizi.

the rest is here.

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6 users have voted.
Bob In Portland's picture

One of the major tactics by the US in its challenge to conquer the world is to use segments of the population, religious minorities, the rich, whatever, to fight on the side of whatever the Americans want. Name a war where we didn't spend money on death squads, military units, weapons, to get others to die in place of Johnny from Iowa.

In this case the US "intelligence" is telling us that Russia is paying Afghans to kill American soldiers. But Afghans have been killing the invaders for two decades. For free.

You can go back to the Maine and the Spanish American War, but our "intelligence" generated lies just keep coming. Remember the commies on Grenada threatening American medical students? Didn't happen. Remember the Gulf of Tonkin? They didn't attack us, we attacked them. Another lie. Saddam's weapons of mass destruction? Nothing. Remember that we invaded Afghanistan to catch former CIA employee Osama bin Laden, whose family elders were business partners of the Bushes. Bin Laden needed weekly dialysis to stay alive. There are no dialysis machines, or the electricity to run them, in the caves of Tora Bora. If Osama was actually alive he would have to be in, at least, a small Pakistani city, like where we found him, if that was even true. After invading to catch Osama we've stayed for two decades.

Not that I ever want to say something that might be interpreted as friendly to Trump. But his diplomatic team has been trying to withdraw our troops from Afghanistan. Even that is too much peace for the neoliberal Democrats.

I was hoping that Biden would just keep his mouth shut until the election.

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8 users have voted.

(remember him, the UN weapons inspector that tried to tell Americans that there were no WMD in Iraq) NYT takes anti-Russian hysteria to new level ...

Ritter adds a lot of information that I was unaware of. Midway into his conclusions:

It does not take a rocket scientist to read between the lines of the New York Times’ thinly sourced report. The NDS, with or without CIA knowledge or consent, generated detainee-based intelligence reports designed to create and sustain a narrative that would be supportive of US military forces remaining in Afghanistan past 2021. The CIA case officer(s) handling these reports dutifully submit cables back to CIA Headquarters which provide the gist of the allegations — that Russia has placed a bounty on US soldiers. But there is no corroboration, nothing that would allow this raw “intelligence” to be turned into a product worthy of the name.

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snoopydawg's picture

@Marie

The Lincoln project put out a heinous ad on this bogus story. I excerpted more of Ritter's article that you posted here.

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2 users have voted.

"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

structure? I would consider Vladimir Putin too smart than to get his hands dirty with petty mob hits. He would want the appearance of plausible deniability, after all. On the other hand, given Putin's approval rating plunge this year (due to his Trumpian mishandling of the Covid-19 pandemic), reigniting the Cold War would distract his people.

Except, the incident happened last year, and they briefed The Donald back in March but, like anything not about him and containing words of more than one syllable, it slipped his mind. ("Trump huge! Trump STRONG!") Putin also has the Saudi head-choppers to worry about; they spent March trying to cut each other's throats by crashing the oil market and hence, their national income. So maybe I overestimated Putin's intelligence after all? (Maybe he did it to troll the Russia deniers?)

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snoopydawg's picture

@SancheLlewellyn

Do you mean the ones who don’t buy into the Russian propaganda nonsense? Have you read the article in full and seen how little evidence there is in it to back up what it’s accusing Russia of doing?

Also you might be interested in this essay by Caitlin who spells out the lack of anything close to the truth in it.

https://caitlinjohnstone.com/2020/06/28/this-russia-afghanistan-story-is...

The Ritter article that Marie posted above is worth a read too.

The Taliban has denied it and why anyone would believe that they need to be paid to kill the people who invaded their country is mind boggling to me. They are working with Trump on a peace treaty plus Russia is working with us on a new nuclear weapons treaty. Lots of money would be left on the table if peace broke out.

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"It seems to me that the problem is that group party interests, in this case, are placed above the interests of the entire society and the interests of people,"

wendy davis's picture

@snoopydawg

at least chuck schumer's on the case! '' Senator Schumer calls for ‘tough sanctions’ against Moscow amid new wave of anti-Russian hysteria… again'
, 28 Jun, 2020, RT.com

Whew! go get 'em , chuckles!

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