Monday OT: July 15 - The Zebulon Pike Expedition
July 15 is the 196th day of the Gregorian Calendar year,
Sweetmorn, Confusion 50, 3185 YOLD (discordian),
And let us not forget 13.0.6.11.17 by the Mayan Long Count
Dunno much about Mistah Zebulon Pike, and less abut his crew, but they sallied forth from Fort Bellefontaine on this day 1n 1806 to "explore the west", or, more correctly to ascertain what it was that Jefferson bought with his Louisiana Purchase. At least, that's the official story. They were a military expedition, just in case somebody didn't feel overmuch like being "explored". One the way, they spotted but failed to summit "Pike's Peak".It seems that they informed assorted Indian tribes that they were now ruled by the US, no doubt pleasing them greatly, and managed to get seriously lost as well. Not lost as in "geez boss, where are we?" but lost as in "well my, my, my, looks we're down in "Mexico" guys." Keep in mind that this wasn't exactly Terra Incognita that they were "exploring", Indians were still present in moderate numbers, along with assorted trappers and such, and it had been explored by the Spanish and French starting some 200 years earlier.I'll let the wiki, an often reliable source of official narratives, tell the tale. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pike_Expedition)
Pike's company made several errors and ended up in Spanish territory in present-day Southern Colorado, where the Americans built a fort to survive the winter. Captured by the Spanish and taken into Mexico in February, their travels through present-day New Mexico, Mexico, and Texas provided Pike with important data about Spanish military strength and civilian populations. Although he and most of his men were released because the nations were not at war, some of his soldiers were held in Mexican prisons for years, despite US objections.
and, further on:
Pike next intended to travel to the headwaters of the Red River and head downstream to the Mississippi and relative safety in the lowlands. But, the company had gotten confused in its bearings, and they made several blundering steps trying to find the river. They were not equipped for a mountain expedition, nor for hard winter weather. Heading north, the party found the South Fork of the Platte River and, following it upstream, came to what they thought were the headwaters of the Red. Turning back downstream, they returned to the point at which they had left the Arkansas originally. They had executed a large loop, taking weeks of precious travel time.
Hungry, cold, and exhausted, the party headed south over the mountains. Several men were left behind as they dropped from fatigue, but Pike doggedly pressed on. By January 30, he and the ten men still with him came to the Rio Grande at a point near Alamosa in present-day southern Colorado and then part of the Spanish empire. Pike mistook the Rio Grande for the Red River he had been seeking. Here, he built a fort and attempted to collect the rest of his men, who were strewn across miles of mountains behind him.
Mandatory digression uno: The magnetic compass was invented at least as early as 206 BCE by the Chinese but its first recorded use in Europe and the Islamic world didn't occur until around 1190 CE. It was, nontheless, de rigeur for "explorers" by the 1800s.
Mandatory digression dos: The southwestern boundary of the Louisiana Purchase flirted with the Tejas-Oklahoma border, but ran through and included most of the Tejas panhandle before turning north in NE New Mexico. However, in every treaty addressing this "parcel", including the one wherein Spain ceded it back to France just weeks before the purchase that border was somewhat ill defined. Team Jefferson, oddly enough, held that it should be the Rio Grande, where by magikal coincidence, Pike and crew wound up and built their fort after the miraculous failure of both their early magnetic GPS and Polaris, the pole star, to give them any clue as to their whereabouts and direction of travel. It is amazing how often these freaky coincidences occur whenever the US is involved in, a party to, or part of something, truly amazing.
Narrative crushing quibble the first: They were not "Captured by the Spanish and taken into Mexico..."; Mexico did not exist in 1806. Pike's army detachment invaded Nuevo España, which lasted until the Grito de Dolores on 09-16-1810. Nuevo España was intimately aware of the parcel in question and its historical presumptive borders and was probably being apprised of Pike's wanderings by locals and possibly scouts. They were, after all, not all that far from Santa Fe, founded in 1610 and most likely very interested in US army troops wandering around in their neighborhood. The responsible parties on at least the Spanish side may be presumed to have been very well versed in cartography, the use of the compass, the basics of celestial navigation and time keeping, etc. For the record: Nuevo España was home to the first printing shop, first university, first public park, and first public library in the Americas, all dating from the 1500s except the library which dates to 1646. It was a prime colony of one of the greatest empires in history, which, as it faded was being brought into Napolean Bonaparte's hegemony. Its governance was in the hands of folks not easily fooled, swindled or robbed.
Bout those prisoners: It seems hardly likely that the government of Nuevo España, after capturing Pike and his troops and discussing things with the US, would release all but a few and hold some seemingly random selection on a whim or somesuch. By the official narrative, all of the troops were hungry and there were stragglers. Soldiers during the era at issue relied heavily upon foraging, especially when the supply train was outrun. It is virtually certain that there were foragers, both among the stragglers, and official foraging details sent out under orders. It is more than likely that some such incidents would've qualified as depradations upon the locals insofar as the troops were in a foreign country subject to foreign dominion and control.
center> -
Twenty years of schooling and they put you on the day shift, look out kid, ...
On this day in history:
1799 – The Rosetta Stone was found which then became a key to translating Egytian hieroglyphics
1806 – The Pike expedition set forth, putatively to "explore" parts of the Louisiana purchase.
1815 – Napoleon Bonaparte surrendered.
1834 – The Spanish Inquisition was officially disbanded after over 350 years, heh, wink, wink, nudge, nudge.
2003 – AOL Time Warner disbanded Netscape. The Mozilla Foundation was established on the same day.
Born this day in:
1606 – Rembrandt, painter
1796 – Thomas Bulfinch, mythologist
1858 – Emmeline Pankhurst, political activist and suffragist
1919 – Iris Murdoch, novelist and philosopher
1930 – Jacques Derrida, philosopher
1944 – Millie Jackson, singer and songwriter
1945 – Peter Lewis, singer, songwriter, and guitarist
1946 – Linda Ronstadt, singer, songwriter, producer, and actress
1947 – Roky Erickson, singer, songwriter, and musician
1951 – Gregory Isaacs, singer and songwriter
1952 – Marky Ramone, drummer and songwriter
1956 – Joe Satriani, singer, songwriter, and guitarist
Died this day in:
1015 – Vladimir the Great, Grand prince of Kievan Rus'
1904 – Anton Chekhov, playwright and short story writer
1982 – Bill Justis, saxophonist, songwriter, and producer
Holidays, Holy Days, Festivals, Feast Days, Days of Recognition, and such:
Feast of Vladimir the Great (Eastern Orthodox; Catholic Church)
Music goes here, iirc, well,
The Spanish word for beutiful is Linda, and her voice certainly was. I suspect that she will get the rest of the air time, and, in honor of Captain Pike's brief stay in Neuvo España,maybe some from Canciones de mi Padre --
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Image is summit of Pike's Peak
It's an open thread, so do your thing
Comments
Good morning, el ~~
Thanks for the Linda Ronstadt concert! She's one if my all time faves!
These gringo pendejos made life miserable for the native dwellers. Thanks for the history lesson.
Have a great week, folks!
"The “jumpers” reminded us that one day we will all face only one choice and that is how we will die, not how we will live." Chris Hedges on 9/11
Hola RA. Linda is a big favorite or mine too, amazingly
versatile, she even did a great album with the Nelson Riddle Orchestra.
We gringos massively mistreated for natives everywhere, but the Spanish weren't too easy on them either, to say the least.
Some Jazzy Linda:
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Report from Netroots Nation — “Elizabeth Warren reigns” (RCP)
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2019/07/14/few_2020_dems_addr...
good morning lot. It seems that, depending on who you read,
a wide assortment are zooming or booming or blooming right now, from Kamala to Biden with Warren at least trying to be more or less honest getting some props too. This is, of course, from the self-styled party leftists, ya know, conservadems. This is where I wish I had a voice clip of Nina Simone saying "go slow, that's what they say".
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Three Myths Liberals Tell Themselves About Capitalism
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yUvCJHnMNs]
And here's Linda Ronstadt on The Simpsons:
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCl-HXllGI0]
Modern education is little more than toeing the line for the capitalist pigs.
Guerrilla Liberalism won't liberate the US or the world from the iron fist of capital.
Good morning Aspie, thanks. Now you have me curious
about that Simpsons clip, damn.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
“Gov’t that tortures journalists bans RT from media conference”
https://caitlinjohnstone.com/2019/07/09/government-that-tortures-journal...
Also:
Could the Apollo 11 moon landing be duplicated today? “Lots of luck with that” (LA Times)
Good morning again lot. I'm a couple of weeks behind on my
Caitlin, so thanks for the link.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Well they peeked at the peak anyway
Off to catch up on my chores before it gets too hot. Starting the garden fence rebuild this week. Have a good one y'all.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mr03En-8fH8]
“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”
Hola Lookout. "America the Beautiful" was written in reaction
to the view from the top, the view that ol' Zeb never saw. Pike county Misery, fwiw, had some weirdness, uncertainty and revisions as to its borders too, having been much large at inception than it is today. Heh.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Your quibbles,
narrative crushing and all, peak my interest on the Pike scenario.
That path Pike and company so seemingly innocently wandered along, or "explored" has led us to where we are today.
Same path.
It makes one wonder if there is another way.
Is acquisitiveness, control, domination, or just plain greed necessary for success?
Today our southern border is the picture of violence and horror....in my country....in our country....How did we get to this unbelievable spot? Incremental steps and here we are.
Nothing innocent about that.
Good morning rand. Manifest destiny, imperialism, and the
like seemingly must ever lead to where and what we are. "Incrementalism" is no change at all, especially in times of crisis. It gets one nowhere.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Black Agenda Report sums up the Dems’ Russiagate nothingburger
in two posts:
Freedom Rider: Time for Russiagate to end
Muellergate, a Report review: Who cooked up the “Russiagate” conspiracy?
Las cigarras have been kind of quiet
down here this year. Not as many as usual, not as much buzzing, not as many dried carcasses on the ground. I hope we're not losing another insect species to climate change.
Here's a map of Spanish and Portuguese land claims in the Americas ca. 1790, courtesy of Wikimedia.
Looking at the extent of these claims, we have to wonder just how legitimate they were, possession being 9/10 of the law and all.
We wanted decent healthcare, a living wage and free college.
The Democrats gave us Biden and war instead.
Pope Alexander VI divided the Earth between Spain and
Portugal in response to conflicts between the two countries arising from Columbus’ voyages. This is a simplification of a complex issue, but this is basically what happened. So if it’s OK which the Pope, I guess it’s OK to dispossess, enslave and murder native peoples. They weren’t killing people, they were saving souls. Same rationale for enslaving African people.
"The object of persecution is persecution. The object of torture is torture. The object of power is power. Now do you begin to understand me?" ~Orwell, "1984"
Yes exactly.
So when we talk about the Southwestern U.S., the Spanish Crown, their successors the Mexican Republic, and the idea that "we" took "their" land,
we are allowed to ask, "Just how is it that it was "theirs" in the first place ?"
We wanted decent healthcare, a living wage and free college.
The Democrats gave us Biden and war instead.
Hola LOL. Papal decrees and ugly doctrines, plus treaties,
but definitely some major Bull. The "pacification" of those lands, however, was another matter.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Spain and Portugal’s motto was “Move fast and break things”
kinda like Facebook, eh? . . . Amazing how fast the master class can amass huge empires when there’s no one to stop ’em . . .
https://spectrum.ieee.org/at-work/innovation/facebook-philosophy-move-fa...
Hackers at an imperial hackathon, hacking history, hacking geography, hacking limbs off the tree of the human race . . . Progress, baby!
So in 1790, Sarah Palin could see Madrid from her place? ;-) n/t
Buenos dias, compadre. Well, to me that would be good,
a respite, though some claim to like the noise and drone of the little monsters (cigarras).
Claims are a bit like dibs, of questionable meaning and staying power. Drake claimed S.F., and other Brits claimed chunks further north, but Russia-russia-russia actually had forts and settlements along the Pacific coast from Sonoma County north, but the natives, of course, were out and about all over the place and drove the Spanish out of some areas. Geronimo, for sure, would call some of those claims premature. Thanks for the great map.
OTOH:
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Love that tune,
but I believe that the legendary Aztlan was actually located in Chihuahua state and not East L.A., the Mexica being Chichimecs who migrated south. Similarly, the Apache homeland was originally the southern plains. They were pushed westward off of "their" land by the expanding Comanche empire. Contested ground, that's the phrase a lot of people use when describing the history of the Southwest and it surely was that. Whose land is it ? Whoever can successfully occupy it and defend their claim against rivals.
We wanted decent healthcare, a living wage and free college.
The Democrats gave us Biden and war instead.
contested ground
Ah, you mean like every other human-habitable square millimeter of land on our Planet!
When Texans tell me that Colorado Springs, Colorado was once part of Texas, I gently remind them that the Comanche held sway there well after Texas became a State (and was haircut at 36 degrees 30 minutes North latitude so it could enter as a Slave State).
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
Full agreement on all counts, more or less, but not fully
happy with the "he with the most powerful army owns everything" ideology implicit therein. That may be history's predominant ethical paradigm, but I personally find it flawed as to the idea that legitimacy comes out of the barrel of a gun.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Dem leader: legitimacy comes from ethno-nationalism & religion
https://www.commondreams.org/news/2018/03/07/schumer-denounced-absolutel...
Disgusting. Don't know where to start; so much irrationality
in such a short time.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
"Canciones di mi Padre"
was not only a labor of love for Ronstadt, but such a wonderful music collection. I really enjoyed the jaunty little drinking song she sang with her niece. Just wants to make you get up and sing along while you're drinking your Tequila, eh?
Heck, I love the song for the costumes alone.
As far as drinking songs go, you can't go wrong with Tom Waits. Definitely not a jaunty tune but ya gotta admire any songwriter who manages to rhyme vermouth with Naugahyde booth.
Thanks for the OT and the Linda Ronstadt songs. It's been too long. Have a great day everyone! Stay cool..
[video:https://youtu.be/1TRmdkdmYI8]
There is always Music amongst the trees in the Garden, but our hearts must be very quiet to hear it. ~ Minnie Aumonier
Oops, my reply got disconnected and is down below a few
messages down.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Pike's Peak: an irony
The mountain that Zebulon Pike said would never be climbed -- and that now bears his name -- is actually the easiest of Colorado's "fourteeners" to summit. This was true even before Fred Barr completed the trail which bears his name (Barr Trail) in 1921, and it is still true today.
After all, Pikes Peak isn't climbed; it's hiked. (Or, today, railroaded or driven.)
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
Last I heard, the "trek" to the top takes about 8 minutes.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
the trek to the top
That's the Pikes Peak Auto Hill Climb Race. Try driving the Peak like that apart from the Hill Climb, and you'll find yourself either an involuntary guest of El Paso County, Memorial or Penrose Hospitals, or the Coroner's Office! (Yes, even approved practice runs for the Hill Climb have resulted in death and serious injury; it's not something to be taken trivially!)
The speed limit for us unwashed masses in standard unwashed-masses cars is 20 MPH, yielding a transit time of roughly 3 - 4 hours from the toll booth at Cascade.
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
morning el
et al
going hiking, packing...
Band tailed pigeons are scarce now. Saw none yesterday and only one this morning. Saw and heard two Peregrines yesterday. Hear often the Red shouldered. See from time to time feathers from an attack.
All good on the western front. Have a good one...
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buenas tardes magi, have a good hike.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Good afternoon Anja. Couldn't help but think of the comment
to your latest column that I lost. I mentioned pairing right bank Bordeaux reds with hot-dogs and other picnic foods. I'm sitting here eating a just grilled Millers(tm) all beef dinner frank on a Semifreddi ciabatta roll with Gala apple slices and some Ravenswood "Rosato", which is some kind of blush that has a bit of a bite. I'll have to check the label later.
Thanks for the music.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
I love imagining that :)
Thanks for the pairing idea, and the visual...
There is always Music amongst the trees in the Garden, but our hearts must be very quiet to hear it. ~ Minnie Aumonier
Monetery The First Capital
A book I inherited from grandpa, I have a copy signed by the author: California, It's Romance and History
So I guess time itself is over now because that tree is long gone, like a turkey through the corn.
Monterey was on my mind yesterday, 35 years since I was certified to breath underwater. Monterey Bay was full of kelp, and it was so thick off Salt Point for the free dive test, we had to swim around to find a clear patch and not get tangled up. My grandparents and parents generations fucked up California bigly. I couldn't stop my generation and now the kelp forest is gone and the Pacific is polluted beyond belief. Sorry about that.
July 15, 1984
I am wearing a carp t-shirt in the photo on the other side, and a big smile. heh
PEACE
Heh, thanks.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --