Mirowski on neo-liberalism v. neo-classical economics v. libertarians

Submitted by Tony Wikrent on Sun, 04/16/2017 - 11:33pm

I listened to this earlier today, and thought so highly of it that, voila: here it is for you to consider giving it a hearing yourself. It is two years old, but, believe me, this is one of those interviews that will remain timeless, unfortunately, for many, many years.

Pay especially close attention as Mirowski explains how social media today is pushing people into developing a neoliberal personae without any class identity.

Philip Mirowski is the co-editor, with Dieter Plewhe, of what is by far the best expose of the Mont Pelerin Society and the creation and promotion of neoliberalism, The Road from Mont Pèlerin: The Making of the Neoliberal Thought Collective (Harvard University Press, 2009).

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Comments

Submitted by eyo on Mon, 04/17/2017 - 9:29am

Hurts like hell when people support Facebook

but I don't take it personally, every one has reasons. No need to list them.

Every page view on Facebook and Google equates to homelessness and poverty in the Bay Area, it is an OpenSecret. There is nothing one can do about an entire death-based economy (sixth largest!), except refuse to buy what it is selling. Deploying modern-day Goebbels tactics is very disgusting, in my view. If folks want to complain about election interference, first look at Facebook, then Google, then go outside to Russia and beyond, whatever floats the boat. Just don't ignore what is right in front of you. Thanks.

Peace & Love
Love & Happiness

Submitted by Alligator Ed on Mon, 04/17/2017 - 11:05am

The anatomy and physiology and theology of neoliberalism

explained. First, I am most grateful for this post. My education in neoliberalism (NL) was immensely broadened. My prior understanding of NL was that entrepreneurs make laws and systems to favor entrepreneurs. This is basically true but far from the whole story.

My initial impression from this remarkable interview is the "Market is All-Knowing God" and you (we) can never hope to understand the infinite wisdom of the market. If A market concept fails, God will provide, with some assistance from us mere mortals, a new market, structured somewhat differently.

Case in point is Obamacare and the Republicans transparent remarketing of a failed market system.

A corollary of this Market-Knows_All philosop[hy, as Mirowski mention, is that society exists as an outgrowth of NL/market forces. The individual has no value as an individual except to provide "better" marketing solutions. Thus the individual has otherwise no value (except as consumers). This explains the amoral philosophy so-evident in NL. HRC was not only amoral, but immoral as well. She and Obama are the most prominent promoters of NL, but they have lots of company.

The organizational and long-term planning of the NLs is well-explained. The aim is the long game attainment of ultimate goals. The near-term gain is confusion, followed by the mid-term game of "re-education". The establishment Dems have no long term game plan except to grab as much money for themselves and ignore the people. In other words, they manifest this NL disdain for individuality.

The structure of the developmental processes of NLs as described by Mirowski is, as he noted, totally absent from the Left. This explains why the grassroots organizations are astroturfed--because they do not have well-disciplined strategy for any but the short-term.

In order to combat the extensive NL establishment, by which I mean the think tanks and institutes, a counter organizational strategy must be established. But will that counter organization duplicate the NL techniques or will it be sui generis? A crude analogy would be either the two competing entities be Godzilla 1 versus Godzilla 2--or would it be Godzilla versus Mothra?

The Libertarian part didn't sink in very well, but it seems that Libertarians with their hands-off-the-market philosophy would make them useful idiots for NLs.

Please provide the URL for this video. I need to watch it more. Thank you.

Submitted by ChezJfrey on Mon, 04/17/2017 - 11:59am

Same here

@Alligator Ed

First, I am most grateful for this post. My education in neoliberalism (NL) was immensely broadened.

I felt the same way. The broadcast was illuminating and packed with valuable conversation to prompt further reading and discovery.

explained. First, I am most grateful for this post. My education in neoliberalism (NL) was immensely broadened. My prior understanding of NL was that entrepreneurs make laws and systems to favor entrepreneurs. This is basically true but far from the whole story. My initial impression from this remarkable interview is the "Market is All-Knowing God" and you (we) can never hope to understand the infinite wisdom of the market. If A market concept fails, God will provide, with some assistance from us mere mortals, a new market, structured somewhat differently. Case in point is Obamacare and the Republicans transparent remarketing of a failed market system. A corollary of this Market-Knows_All philosop[hy, as Mirowski mention, is that society exists as an outgrowth of NL/market forces. The individual has no value as an individual except to provide "better" marketing solutions. Thus the individual has otherwise no value (except as consumers). This explains the amoral philosophy so-evident in NL. HRC was not only amoral, but immoral as well. She and Obama are the most prominent promoters of NL, but they have lots of company. The organizational and long-term planning of the NLs is well-explained. The aim is the long game attainment of ultimate goals. The near-term gain is confusion, followed by the mid-term game of "re-education". The establishment Dems have no long term game plan except to grab as much money for themselves and ignore the people. In other words, they manifest this NL disdain for individuality. The structure of the developmental processes of NLs as described by Mirowski is, as he noted, totally absent from the Left. This explains why the grassroots organizations are astroturfed--because they do not have well-disciplined strategy for any but the short-term. In order to combat the extensive NL establishment, by which I mean the think tanks and institutes, a counter organizational strategy must be established. But will that counter organization duplicate the NL techniques or will it be sui generis? A crude analogy would be either the two competing entities be Godzilla 1 versus Godzilla 2--or would it be Godzilla versus Mothra? The Libertarian part didn't sink in very well, but it seems that Libertarians with their hands-off-the-market philosophy would make them useful idiots for NLs. Please provide the URL for this video. I need to watch it more. Thank you.

Submitted by TheOtherMaven on Mon, 04/17/2017 - 9:33pm

Godzilla viersus Ghidorah

@Alligator Ed
Mothra is one of the good guys (gals), and only takes action when she or her singing twin spokesgirls are threatened.

explained. First, I am most grateful for this post. My education in neoliberalism (NL) was immensely broadened. My prior understanding of NL was that entrepreneurs make laws and systems to favor entrepreneurs. This is basically true but far from the whole story. My initial impression from this remarkable interview is the "Market is All-Knowing God" and you (we) can never hope to understand the infinite wisdom of the market. If A market concept fails, God will provide, with some assistance from us mere mortals, a new market, structured somewhat differently. Case in point is Obamacare and the Republicans transparent remarketing of a failed market system. A corollary of this Market-Knows_All philosop[hy, as Mirowski mention, is that society exists as an outgrowth of NL/market forces. The individual has no value as an individual except to provide "better" marketing solutions. Thus the individual has otherwise no value (except as consumers). This explains the amoral philosophy so-evident in NL. HRC was not only amoral, but immoral as well. She and Obama are the most prominent promoters of NL, but they have lots of company. The organizational and long-term planning of the NLs is well-explained. The aim is the long game attainment of ultimate goals. The near-term gain is confusion, followed by the mid-term game of "re-education". The establishment Dems have no long term game plan except to grab as much money for themselves and ignore the people. In other words, they manifest this NL disdain for individuality. The structure of the developmental processes of NLs as described by Mirowski is, as he noted, totally absent from the Left. This explains why the grassroots organizations are astroturfed--because they do not have well-disciplined strategy for any but the short-term. In order to combat the extensive NL establishment, by which I mean the think tanks and institutes, a counter organizational strategy must be established. But will that counter organization duplicate the NL techniques or will it be sui generis? A crude analogy would be either the two competing entities be Godzilla 1 versus Godzilla 2--or would it be Godzilla versus Mothra? The Libertarian part didn't sink in very well, but it seems that Libertarians with their hands-off-the-market philosophy would make them useful idiots for NLs. Please provide the URL for this video. I need to watch it more. Thank you.

—

There is no justice. There can be no peace.

Submitted by CB on Mon, 04/17/2017 - 11:14am

There is one thing that this video failed to address

This is the connection between the rise and spread of neoliberism and the concurrent rise and spread in socioeconomic disparity.

Here's a good response to Philip Mirowski from Chris Hedges and author John Ralston Saul on how neoliberism has completely failed to live up to its promise.

Published on Oct 26, 2015

In this episode of Days of Revolt, host Chris Hedges and author John Ralston Saul discuss neoliberalism as an ideology, the breakdown of that ideology, and what comes next. The two draw parallels between historic systems of power and the current corporatism that exists in the West today, and unveil the tactics used by both to control language and collective memory.

Submitted by Alligator Ed on Mon, 04/17/2017 - 2:37pm

Mr. Saul gave me a more advanced understanding

@CB but an understanding I would not have had if not for the Mirowski video. Saul believes as I do, following this brief informal education, that the neoliberals/neoconservatives are members of a religion (the Market is God). Like members of a religion, they have created or deformed normal language into mystical chants (read P.R.) and rituals (e.g., pseudo-elections--doesn't matter who gets elected). The purpose of this is not to educate but to obfuscate. Why else did the Catholic Church keep the mass in Latin until only very recently?

Like some religions, the NLs are not uncomfortable with human sacrifice (homelessness, drug addiction, death). If we are in the interregnum, quo vadis? The establishment (not the philosophers/ideologues) remain unaware of the pending storm, they will do nothing to head it off, because as Saul observantly noted, the acolytes are unprepared for change. The example of Solon is enlightening. However in modern day USA, the CIA would make short work of him--probably by poisoning him with polonium and then blaming the Russians.

Submitted by CB on Mon, 04/17/2017 - 4:52pm

I have to agree with you

@Alligator Ed
BTW, I've always considered the neo-cons and the neo-libs to be different sides of the same coin. They work in tandem - the enforcer and the bag man - like a globalized mafioso.

Submitted by Alligator Ed on Mon, 04/17/2017 - 4:11pm

YouTube put my newfound NL liberalism to work today

Only a few minutes ago, while watching Tucker Carlson, who is in my mind one of the best interviewers on TV (Larry King is another), I came across a ludicrous rant of a Social Justice Warrior snowflake. This lawyer tries to defend the violent and vile acts of a predacious convicted sex offender by claiming that deportation is a violation of the entire class of illegal immigrants, including those who have not been convicted of any other crime except being here.

Her arguments strengthen the dislike many Americans have against attorneys. In general I do not share this belief but in this case an exception is warranted.

According Mirowski, NL diminish the individual's identity and therefore value. The flip side of this is to diminish the deterrent acts of the legal code upon society which of course is composed of individuals.

Snowflakes like this attorney are mouthpieces of the NL philosophy of demeaning individual worth. They have no idea about the destructiveness of their approaches to the fabric of society. Perhaps this self-righteous attorney should experience some sexual predation personally--let us then see how compassionate she is when the tables are turned on her.