Do we leave?
I've seen plenty of people saying they'll be leaving the Donkey Party behind after this November. It's something I've been considering myself, though honestly I never really identified as a Dem even though I've been registered and voting as one since 2008. But I've seen others point out that us folk of the more progressive persuasion leaving the party is exactly what the Clintons and their establishment minions are trying to achieve. That there makes me hesitate, and wonder what would become of the party of stubborn mules if we did a mass exodus? Its membership numbers would definitely take a hit, sure, but that party seems to be more interested in donor money than membership totals anyway, so we likely wouldn't see them change in any way other than sprinting to the right as opposed to a briskly paced jog.
What then happens to the more progressive and liberal elected officials of the party? I'm guessing that those in states where elections are open to independents or NPP voters will be fine, but any who are in a closed off election will most definitely be replaced (we've already seen the Mules trying to do so with certain elected officials this year). The alternative is that we stay in order to attempt to keep that from happening, and maybe get a few more progressives in office, but given that it seems the Mules will eagerly rig an election to undermine progressives from getting power, one has to wonder if that's even a viable alternative.
There's always the possibility that we can create a new party, one that is functional and can beat both the Mules and the Repungants. That will take time I'm sure, and a lot of effort, but all things worth doing require gratuitous amounts of both anyway. I do wonder, though, if it's possible to build a new party while registered as a member of an existing party.
Thoughts and opinions? I'd like to hear them below.
Have a beautiful weekend everyone!
Comments
Hi Thaumlord-Exelbirth,
I hope you have a beautiful weekend!
I don't think it matters what you are registered as anymore, unless you have to change parties for closed primaries.
I'm anxiously awaiting the convention to see what Bernie has up his sleeve. I'm not really sure what we need to do at this point except promote him like crazy and get the word out about Hillarys' misdeeds.
'Well, I've wrestled with reality for thirty five years, Doctor, and I’m happy to state I finally won out over it." Elwood P. Dowd "
As the saying goes,
the party left me. I am an Independent, who always did the lesser of evils. This time, the argument isn't working. If it was, I'd have to say Hillary. I am waiting to see what Bernie does too. If it isn't Bernie, I have Green or Trump.
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
I have voted for
John Anderson, Ross Perot, Ralph Nader (twice), Cynthia McKinney, and Jill Stein. It seems like there might be someone missing in there. I have never voted for the Democratic or Republican nominees. So I have nothing to leave behind, except a bad taste in my mouth this time around, for switching to the Dems to vote for Bernie.
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
Kucinich?
I love Denis but can never spell his name
"Love One Another" ~ George Harrison
If I remember right, he always ran as a Dem
Had he won the nomination, I would have voted for him, but I don't think I've ever voted in a Dem primary before. Maybe...
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
Leaving it behind is a personal choice.
You need to go deep inside yourself for the answer. I've been an indie for a dozen years. I registered dem to vote in my June 7th primary, but will go back to indie because I do not identify with the dem party any longer. To me, calls for a new party might be an answer. These things are easily corrupted, though, so care must be taken in how they are birthed. Look at our 200+yo constitution. We are interpreting it by today's standards. Whatever is created must remain a dynamic document that can change with society, appropriately.
"The “jumpers” reminded us that one day we will all face only one choice and that is how we will die, not how we will live." Chris Hedges on 9/11
I didn't have a "choice"
as far as I'm concerned the Democratic Party can rot. It's the same puppet master as the Rapepublicans. I see no difference in the corruption of either party.
I had no choice. I was registered as a Democrat, at the same address for ten years here and still didn't get to vote because of voter fraud. Got my registration changed to non-affiliated just a few days before the deadline. I had even checked it at the DMV and just in April.
There is no elections... it's all fraud. There should be more outrage at this but Americans are gullible sheep.
If anyone here thinks that there is actual voting going on... I have a bridge to sell them.
Sorry... I'm really pissed off. Me and my veteran husband couldn't vote. I have to pay taxes from a job that Feds will raid. More and more I'm an American DESPITE America.
"Love One Another" ~ George Harrison
I think you may be talking about me--
And you're right, it does give me a bit of pause knowing that Hillary et al so clearly want us to leave.
However, I know what staying looks like, and unless somebody has a new strategy that we haven't used in the past 30-40 years that they want to suggest, I'm in favor of leaving.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
I'm for
starting a new party. If we could take what Bernie's campaigning on and let it morph on it's own, I believe a new party could capture all the Dems that are supporting Bernie, much if not most of the Indies and a big chunk of Repubs. In other words, we could have a viable/winning 3rd party sooner than later. Maybe it's platform would have to make small changes/concessions to be all inclusive but I sincerely believe we could have a party that represents the poor and whats left of the middle class...
I'm waiting for the People's Summit
to see what they come up with.
Life is strong. I'm weak, but Life is strong.
Apparently I'm among 'birds of a feather'
I never was a Democrat.
I'm a a progressive Independent who hung out with socialists
and now live in a deep red state (so won't I even vote in November).
The day after the convention if they shove HRC down our throats.
That is all.
Bottom line
The Democratic Party will fight tooth and nail to stop progressives from having any influence - therefore they are the enemy and the question of whether we should leave answers itself.
“To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.” -Voltaire
Discrediting FDR’s New Deal as Jim Crow, as an anti-Bernie ploy.
Dems in a pickle
We have closed primaries here...
...so I'll stay a registered Dem at least until the mid-terms.I will be joining the Working Families Party .
Solidarity
I love the name
The Working Families Party.
Life is strong. I'm weak, but Life is strong.
Another good one...
...was the original Farmers-Labor Party.
It's notable and promising that Bernie has won an overwhelming majority of rural counties.It is possible that we could generate that level of solidarity again.
Solidarity
The idea of "starting a new party"
is that of actually having some political power. You have no power if you are a Democrat, and all of the nice things they've allowed you to say and all of the nice things they've said for you have merely contributed to the illusion that you do have power, when in fact you don't. Perhaps after the primaries are over the Democrats will create some new rules to keep things like the Sanders campaign or Tim Canova's challenge to Debbie Wasserman-Schultz from happening again. I wouldn't be surprised. They created superdelegates, after all, to keep phenomena such as the McGovern candidacy of 1972 from happening again.
In this era of capitalism the Powers That Be are completely uninterested in providing you with anything, and would like to see you reduced to the status of cheap slaves as quickly as possible, and preferably without any of your complaints, about which they share a common contempt. Given that the major sources of wealth in productive exploitation (what Jason W. Moore calls "cheap nature") have been pretty-much tapped out, and that the system is likely, soon, to devolve into a sort of kleptocracy where parasitism will be all that's left of capitalism, Bernie Sanders' plea for a reversion to an earlier stage of the system in which social democracy is possible appears obsolete.
In fact, the capitalist system as a whole has maybe thirty years left, and they're likely to be quite painful, full of your local equivalent to, say, the Fort McMurray fire, except everywhere and not just in Alberta. The philosopher Isabelle Stengers writes of a "global New Orleans," referring to Hurricane Katrina, in the same vein. In this regard, when we support Sanders, we are trading on his humanism rather than supporting any of the more half-baked ends of his policy ideas. It's better to be obsolete and nice than obsolete and malevolent. We should hope for a party that recognizes today's reality; but an obsolete and nice party may have to do, and the Democratic Party isn't the former party, nor is it the latter one.
“When there's no fight over programme, the election becomes a casting exercise. Trump's win is the unstoppable consequence of this situation.” - Jean-Luc Melanchon
The trick is...
to figure out the most intelligent way to play it going forward. To advocate for the wholesale abandonment of the Democratic Party is, in my view, a mistake. It is precisely because Bernie Sanders chose to run as a Democrat that he is causing so much discomfiture within the political establishment. He has received far more media coverage and voter support, as well as generated more enthusiasm and energy, than would have ever been possible if he'd chosen to run as an independent or minor party candidate. Additionally, running as a Democrat afforded him the ability to directly confront Hillary Clinton -- and by extension, neoliberal orthodoxy -- on a debate platform, and offer a compelling critique that has resonated in the minds and hearts of millions.
On the other hand, the DP is hardly a basket in which one wants to put all of his or her eggs. The long and short of it is that the nominating process is a hopelessly rigged game, in which only one outcome is realistically possible -- namely, the selection of a candidate who's committed to preserving the status quo. And I'm quite sure, despite all the brave talk, that Bernie had absolutely no illusions about that going in. The core purpose of his candidacy was not to win the Presidency, which although certainly desirable was an unattainable goal, but to bring attention to the issues he cares about, and rally support for a major political upheaval -- one that has the potential to dismantle the current toxic system that is effectively hard-wired to exclusively serve the interests of the privileged few, while at every turn seeking to undermine, sabotage and betray the interests of the powerless many. And I think on this level, he has succeeded quite admirably.
For all these reasons, I truly hope that some other bold and uncompromising progressive candidate picks up where Bernie left off and mounts a challenge to either Hillary Clinton, should she win the presidency, or else whatever triangulating, neoliberal corporate tool the DNC puts forward as its candidate in 2020. The progressive cause is served by the heightened media exposure and direct confrontation with party orthodoxy afforded a candidate running under the DP banner. However, that's not enough, by a long shot. To be truly effective, there has to be a meaningful "or else" contingency attached an insurgent campaign. To my mind, that is the biggest single failure of Bernie's candidacy. It's understandable that Bernie himself has to represent himself as a party loyalist committed to supporting the party nominee. But this doesn't apply to the ordinary citizens who support him, or even necessarily to the people working on his campaign.
What's missing, in a nutshell, is a credible alternative political entity that Sanders supporters could rally to instead of having to line up behind a right-wing, neoliberal candidate who unapologetically advocates for more of the same. Regrettably, I don't think the Green Party is the answer, as it is perceived as being too narrowly focused and too uncompromising. The only third party movement that really stands a chance is one focused squarely on bread-and-butter issues that directly affect those on the middle and lower rungs of the economic ladder. From what I've recently been reading, my own view is that the newly formed United Progressive Party has a lot more potential for moving from the fringes to the mainstream than does the Green Party.
At any rate, let's just imagine that this new party had been formed four years ago, instead of just this past October, and through dint of hard work and determination had managed to gain ballot access in 40 or so states. And further imagine they had a reasonably credible presidential candidate in place, perhaps someone like former Salt Lake City mayor Rocky Anderson. People now supporting Sanders could say, reasonably: "We'd like to support the Democratic candidate, but our ultimate allegiance is to our ideals and our political ethos, not to any individual. And we certainly will not support a candidate who not only does not support our agenda, but is actively and aggressively hostile to it. If such an individual is nominated to be the Democratic Party standard bearer, we will strongly recommend that Bernie's supporters transfer their allegiance to the United Progressive Party, and its candidate Mr. Anderson."
Well, too late for 2016, unfortunately, but not too late for 2020 and beyond. To simply desert the Democratic Party en masse makes it too easy for the political establishment and corporate media to ignore and marginalize progressive voices. And yet, to exclusively tie our fortunes to such a deeply corrupt, dishonest and undemocratic institution in effect renders us mere "useful idiots", who help advance an agenda that is antithetical to our values and our interests. So as far as I'm concerned, the best way forward is to split the difference. Going forward, rather than "Bernie or Bust", it should instead be "Bernie or - Plan B".
inactive account
I already left
I left in 2011 after swallowing the bottom up change bait and then getting the switch. I joined the Working Families Party which proved to be another spin off of the donkey elephant duopoly. After I switched a recruiter for the WPF out in front of our upscale 'progressive' grocery store told me they were looking to register more Dem. centrist's. After a heated argument with the slimy dude I once again was party less.
I don't care what Hillary the Hun and The Third Way formerly known as the DlC wants 'ideological purist' lefties like me to do. Why should I? Fear? After the Bush regime followed by the empty suit pocket full of hope who gives a shit about which party of rabid power hungry asshole's with guns and money wins. It's absurd to identify with, vote for or support any of them.
I'm an indie and will stay one. At 43 % and rising why should we the people dance to the partisan oligarchy's tune of global fear and loathing. It's not like any of them are going to do a damn thing to restore some semblance of democracy, justice, equality or any of the self evident truths and universal inalienable rights.
The Democratic Party is deader then a door nail and complicit with the Republicans to boot. A political party is a means to an end. The end being democratic representation and upholding the rule of law. As Nancy said our laws and principles are unenforceable pieces of paper. Supporting or remaining a Democrat is extortion not voting. No thanks. What a mockery of a representational republic let alone a democracy this country has become. '
'I vote for Pizza' said the skateboarder who refused to register Democratic or vote for Obama. His housemates all supported Obama and signed on in 2007 when I was canvasing and registering Dems. for OFA. This young'un was right pizza is a much better choice. I'll vote but never again out of fear of the RW and never again because the Dems. are the lesser evil. They are not they are the more effective same evil.
where's my habeas corpus?
http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/declaration_transcript.html
Never was a member, been Indie since I could vote
Simpler in Vermont I admit
I Left In 1980
I've written about that in detail, so I won't do so again.
Like many here, I was willing to continue to vote for Democrats in the GE, but the only one I ever supported who won was Slick Willie.
I will bear that shame to my grave.
Vowing To Oppose Everything Trump Attempts.
Might Have Your Answer
"I do wonder, though, if it's possible to build a new party while registered as a member of an existing party."
In 1996, I attended the Reform Party Convention. After what Perot did in the 1992 Campaign, I was willing to support Richard Lamm, which got me lots of stern looks from the Perotistas. Perot himself even said to Lamm on stage, "You're a brave man."
What made that Convention notable, however, was that the majority of the attendees were headed to San Diego to attend the Republican Convention once the Reform Convention ended. All they cared about was that they had someone to support whose name wasn't Bill Clinton.
So as I see it, one can build a new party while belonging to another. You just can't be registered for both.
Vowing To Oppose Everything Trump Attempts.
I don't think it matters.
If there were a party that had traditional Democratic values with a core belief that governments are formed to benefit the people and make their lives better — I would join that Party. I'd join it largely for the cache of belonging to the cadre of Earth's evolved humans.
But there is no such party.
And voting can no longer be taken seriously as a means of political change.
That political solution has been kabuki for nearly half-a-century.
Even Einstein predicted that government would go rogue if media monopolies were allowed to form.
“What better way to enslave a man than to give him the vote and tell him he's free.” —Albert Camus
My first post!
My first post!
I grew disenfranchised from the Democrats years ago. I kept voting for them along with the occasional independent for 30+ years. I'm glad Sanders decided to run,if anything,it has revealed the true nature of the party to a greater amount of people. To certain extent,I do feel a bit vindicated. Having said that,I never signed up at the GOS in all of those years. I first encountered the site in its earliest days when Steve Gilliard was there. I left about the first time when Armando was banned. What an ass. I was banned from FDL when I had taken umbrage to Jane's joining with Grover Norquist. I also grew tired of many of the lefty bloggers when they began setting off my BS detector incessantly. Y'all know which ones,specifically those repeating the DNC mantra at the moment.
Has anyone noticed when Thomas Frank's book,What's The Matter With Kansas, came out,every blogger was extolling its virtue? Since Listen Liberal was released/published.....Nada....Crickets......More crickets....
Just an fyi,my moniker is a nod to the lp from the band Brand X.
It's good to be here,and it's good to know I'm not alone in my disenfranchisement.
Congrats on your first post!
And welcome to c99% - the site of civil discourse from any and all points of view.
Only connect. - E.M. Forster
I like x
saw them a few times at the Whisky when we lived in Hollywood. I too had to leave LA. Welcome to c99%. Nice first post.