Open Thread for Wed 11 DEC 24 ~ group thought

Submitted by QMS on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 5:00am

flock-birds-flying-fog-with-sun-them_1315819-4293-471925671.jpg

Watching a flock of birds out the window, changing direction in the sky. Almost as one.
The left-behinds had to circle around to rejoin the mass. A parable of our times? Guess it is
safer in the aggregate for most. Tend to fly off like the lost wanderer these days.

The illusion of group thinking assumes a piercing of individual thought. How can we think
alike unless there is an overarching programming involved? Is it inherent or external
manipulation? One wonders..

Chime in with your thoughts on whatever topic rings your bell. Open dialogue is the way.

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Submitted by Lookout on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 7:28am

mass media propaganda...

has impeded people's critical thinking skills.

For those unfamiliar with...
The Crisis of Mass Formation Psychosis - Dr. Mattias Desmet, Ghent University (1 hour)
There are three steps to mass formation psychosis, and signs point to the fact that we are living through the very last stage. In this week's conversation, Ghent University's Dr. Mattias Desmet lays out his psychological theory of mass hypnosis, by which entire societies go insane and fall prey to totalitarianism
00:00:43 What is the distinction between Dictatorship and Totalitarianism?
00:04:21 The center of mass in a totalitarian society is the crowd
00:09:21 How an extreme minority creates a majority
00:15:44 Why does the internet drive the hive mind?
00:19:56 Losing touch with the natural world
00:22:24 Technology isn't free
00:24:28 The three steps to chaos
00:28:57 The difference between the community and the collective
00:30:35 Reaping antisocial rewards
00:32:07 Total hypnosis requires a single voice
00:36:46 How foundational ethics come to be rewritten
00:38:31 The importance of dissenting voices
00:39:37 The dramatic consequences of silence
00:42:31 Warring totalitarian factions
00:44:56 Is there cause for optimism?
00:47:15 Solving the problem of atomization
00:48:03 How totalitarian movements fall apart
00:51:21 There is always a new crisis
00:54:11 Technocratic Totalitarianism
00:55:45 The Pitfalls of Mechanistic Thinking
00:58:26 Reality cannot be rationally apprehended
01:02:29 Closing thoughts

COVID is a prime example of how easily mass psychosis can be engineered. Or how about the west cheering on Al Quaeda now having its own state in former Syria. And on and on...

However, more and more people are seeing through the scam...at least I hope.

keep thinking.jpg

Thanks for the OT!

—

“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”

Submitted by QMS on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 7:56am

The importance of dissenting voices

@Lookout
.
good morning Lookout
looks to be a good overview of the topic
thanks for sharing it!
we are getting hammered today
winds gusting to 50, 2 to 3 inches rain
hope the internet stays connected

cheers

—

question everything

Submitted by JtC on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 8:52am

A good example...

the danger of group thought, the slaughter taking place in Syria right now.

Kurds, Christians, Alawites, Palestinians, genocide is the new normal in the Mideast.

Submitted by QMS on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 9:14am

Yes, and the elimination of individual cultures

@JtC
.
for the sake of some ill-defined
global order is not in our best
interests

thanks for resonating

—

question everything

Submitted by snoopydawg on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 10:09am

The Big Dawg blames the media for Hellabitch's loss

Former US President Bill Clinton has blamed “mainstream media” coverage of Hillary Clinton’s email controversy for her loss in the 2016 presidential election to Donald Trump. The 42nd American president took aim at media outlets for their focus on his wife’s controversial use of a private email server for official correspondence instead of a protected, government-controlled one during her time as US secretary of state between 2009 and 2013.

I dunno…I don’t think that the media would have covered her use of her private email server if she had obeyed the rules and hadn’t used it.

But let us go back and remember why Comey wrote that letter to congress just 11 days before the election. The NYC FBI office found bad sexual activity on the server that they had access to and they wanted to spill the beans about it. They found them many months before, but Comey didn’t bother to look at them….

Long story short. I don’t remember the media talking about the possible kiddie porn, but you know me and my memory. They also didn’t mention how many countries might have had access to them either. Well except the media did blame Russia for hacking into it and giving them to Wikileaks…

—

The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.
~Hannah Arendt

Submitted by usefewersyllables on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 10:51am

It is clear

@snoopydawg

that the politicians (the Clintons foremost among them) have come to expect, and even assume, a completely compliant and controlled media: a media collective that runs only stories with positive propaganda value, at least to their way of thinking. Period, end of statement, full stop.

When they don't get that, they get all pissy and pouty, and probably have their blue meanies go shake down whoever isn't playing along to their satisfaction.

Consequently, it is my conclusion that the only media outlets that matter are the ones that have as many overpaid politiwhores angry at them as is humanly possible. And the very best of those would make as many red ones "haz a sad" as they do blue ones.

They are a dying breed. There just isn't enough sunlight around, these days. And the less there is, the darker it will get. Democracy died in the darkness a long time ago: I want to see some of these (redacted) go down, and go down hard.

Perhaps the stopped clock represented by the Trump 2.0 Revenge Tour might find that even it can be right twice a day. That would be a sunny day.

—

Twice bitten, permanently shy.

Submitted by Marie1 on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 11:34am

but, but, you all said

@snoopydawg
HRC lost because of Putin-Russia and put the US through three years of hell looking for the data to prove it.

HRC lost because of the policies she's championed, her hypocrisy, and her sneakiness. IOW, she's not likeable or trustworthy. Because the DNC/Dem Party fixed the primaries. She lost to Donald Fing Trump the only GOP nominee that Bill & Co thought she'd trounce.

Submitted by snoopydawg on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 12:08pm

No I never said that

@Marie1

HRC lost because of Putin-Russia and put the US through three years of hell looking for the data to prove it.

I knew that she lost because Americans rejected her and her heinous policies and actions. Giving speeches to banks and getting paid lots of money just before she announced her candidacy and told us that she would rein in the banks.

I know what I said and you can look through my comments and see for yourself. I doubt anyone else here fell for Russia Russia Russia either. We spent lots of ink here debunking everything regarding Russia gate. Use the search and read our essays on it.

It was democrats, the intelligence agencies, etc that made up false stories showing that Russia did it. We debunked those falsehoods too.

Maybe you are thinking of daily kos and the shitlibs who still believe everything about Russia gate.

—

Submitted by mimi on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 11:25am

My highshool teacher for the German language always said

Thinking hurts ... so we don't.

Right?

—

https://www.euronews.com/live

Submitted by QMS on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 11:34am

using your brain in unfamiliar ways

@mimi
.
can cause discomfort
a calloused mind hardly
notices

cheers

—

question everything

Submitted by enhydra lutris on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 12:10pm

Hola Cap'n Q, t. al. It looks as if a Rus airfield in the

Rostov region was attacked with 6 ATACM missiles originating in the Ukiestan territory at around 11 am Kiev time today. This, of course, required involvement of US and/or NATO peeps and constitutes an attack on the Rus by the US-NATO agglomeration. The Rus defense ministry promises a response.

Comedy time, per RT - https://www.rt.com/news/609153-west-syria-revoluton-fears/

Western and Arab countries are reportedly concerned that the fall of the Assad government in Syria could mean that more hardline Islamist forces could attempt to seize power in the country, according to Reuters.

Over the weekend, opposition forces led by Hayat Tahrir-al-Sham (HTS) jihadist militants seized control over major cities including Damascus, and deposed former President Bashar Assad, who left the country and has been granted asylum in Russia.

However, according to several diplomats and analysts who have spoken to Reuters, the US, Israel, and other Arab powers in the region fear that the lack of a clear authority in Syria could lead to instability and extremism.

Also lab leak in Australia - https://www.rt.com/news/609163-australia-deadly-virus-missing/

BEST OF ALL:

Bill Clinton blames ‘mainstream media’ for Hillary’s defeat to Trump

https://www.rt.com/news/609189-bill-clinton-hillary-election-defeat/

World News
Business
India
Africa
RT Features
Analysis
Opinion
Entertainment
Shows
Projects
Ukraine strikes Russia with US-made ATACMS missiles
11 Dec, 2024 10:42
HomeWorld News
Bill Clinton blames ‘mainstream media’ for Hillary’s defeat to Trump
The US has accused Russia of meddling in the 2016 presidential campaign, but has failed to provide evidence
Bill Clinton blames ‘mainstream media’ for Hillary’s defeat to Trump
Former US President Bill Clinton. © Eugene Gologursky/Getty Images for The New York Times
Former US President Bill Clinton has blamed “mainstream media” coverage of Hillary Clinton’s email controversy for her loss in the 2016 presidential election to Donald Trump. Democrats have also for years accused Russia of helping Trump defeat Clinton, despite no evidence ever been found to back the allegations.

In an interview with MSNBC that aired on Monday, the former president discussed an excerpt from his book, ‘Citizen: My Life After The White House’, published in November, highlighting the “rage” he felt after Hillary Clinton lost to Trump, despite polls predicting her victory.

The 42nd American president took aim at media outlets for their focus on his wife’s controversial use of a private email server for official correspondence instead of a protected, government-controlled one, during her time as US secretary of state between 2009 and 2013.

Clinton, who in his book described the 2016 election as the “darkest election possible in the United States,” claimed the media blew the email scandal out of proportion.

“It’s easier for us to know what happened in 2016 in some ways than what happened in 2024 in terms of all of it because in 2016 you had two highly unusual things,” the former president told MSNBC’s Joe Scarborough.

“First of all, the mainstream media told the American people repeatedly that the biggest issue was Hillary’s emails – that’s what they said, not just Fox.”

CBS News admits to editing Harris interviewREAD MORE: CBS News admits to editing Harris interview
The narrative about Hillary Clinton’s emails made the headlines in the later stages of the 2016 campaign, casting a shadow over the Democratic candidate. At the time, US intelligence agencies claimed that Russia hacked the email of senior Democrats as part of a wide-ranging operation to damage Clinton’s campaign and assist Trump.

“When in fact, even the Trump State Department said she neither sent nor received a single solitary email on her personal device marked classified,” the former president noted, insisting that his wife “followed the rule that then existed, the rules were changed after she left office.”

Democrats have blamed Clinton’s loss to Trump on ‘Russian meddling’, triggering years of speculation about ‘collusion’ between the Republican candidate and the Kremlin.

Their claim that Trump had ties with Moscow was based on a ‘dossier’ fabricated by a British spy. From there, Democrats insinuated that WikiLeaks’ publishing of internal Democratic National Committee documents and personal emails of Clinton’s campaign manager had something to do with Moscow, while ‘Russian bots and trolls’ posted ‘misinformation’ on social media, which somehow undermined the election.

The FBI investigated Clinton for using a private email server for her correspondence as secretary of state and concluded that she and her team had been “extremely careless,” but found no evidence of foreign intrusion.

RT says "you can share this story on social media", so I am doing so

be well and have a good one

—

That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

Submitted by QMS on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 12:18pm

Old slick willie

@enhydra lutris
deflecting blame
at least he didn't
blame it on the
deplorables

Rostov region was attacked with 6 ATACM missiles originating in the Ukiestan territory at around 11 am Kiev time today. This, of course, required involvement of US and/or NATO peeps and constitutes an attack on the Rus by the US-NATO agglomeration. The Rus defense ministry promises a response. Comedy time, per RT - https://www.rt.com/news/609153-west-syria-revoluton-fears/ Western and Arab countries are reportedly concerned that the fall of the Assad government in Syria could mean that more hardline Islamist forces could attempt to seize power in the country, according to Reuters. Over the weekend, opposition forces led by Hayat Tahrir-al-Sham (HTS) jihadist militants seized control over major cities including Damascus, and deposed former President Bashar Assad, who left the country and has been granted asylum in Russia. However, according to several diplomats and analysts who have spoken to Reuters, the US, Israel, and other Arab powers in the region fear that the lack of a clear authority in Syria could lead to instability and extremism. Also lab leak in Australia - https://www.rt.com/news/609163-australia-deadly-virus-missing/ BEST OF ALL: Bill Clinton blames ‘mainstream media’ for Hillary’s defeat to Trump https://www.rt.com/news/609189-bill-clinton-hillary-election-defeat/ World News Business India Africa RT Features Analysis Opinion Entertainment Shows Projects Ukraine strikes Russia with US-made ATACMS missiles 11 Dec, 2024 10:42 HomeWorld News Bill Clinton blames ‘mainstream media’ for Hillary’s defeat to Trump The US has accused Russia of meddling in the 2016 presidential campaign, but has failed to provide evidence Bill Clinton blames ‘mainstream media’ for Hillary’s defeat to Trump Former US President Bill Clinton. © Eugene Gologursky/Getty Images for The New York Times Former US President Bill Clinton has blamed “mainstream media” coverage of Hillary Clinton’s email controversy for her loss in the 2016 presidential election to Donald Trump. Democrats have also for years accused Russia of helping Trump defeat Clinton, despite no evidence ever been found to back the allegations. In an interview with MSNBC that aired on Monday, the former president discussed an excerpt from his book, ‘Citizen: My Life After The White House’, published in November, highlighting the “rage” he felt after Hillary Clinton lost to Trump, despite polls predicting her victory. The 42nd American president took aim at media outlets for their focus on his wife’s controversial use of a private email server for official correspondence instead of a protected, government-controlled one, during her time as US secretary of state between 2009 and 2013. Clinton, who in his book described the 2016 election as the “darkest election possible in the United States,” claimed the media blew the email scandal out of proportion. “It’s easier for us to know what happened in 2016 in some ways than what happened in 2024 in terms of all of it because in 2016 you had two highly unusual things,” the former president told MSNBC’s Joe Scarborough. “First of all, the mainstream media told the American people repeatedly that the biggest issue was Hillary’s emails – that’s what they said, not just Fox.” CBS News admits to editing Harris interviewREAD MORE: CBS News admits to editing Harris interview The narrative about Hillary Clinton’s emails made the headlines in the later stages of the 2016 campaign, casting a shadow over the Democratic candidate. At the time, US intelligence agencies claimed that Russia hacked the email of senior Democrats as part of a wide-ranging operation to damage Clinton’s campaign and assist Trump. “When in fact, even the Trump State Department said she neither sent nor received a single solitary email on her personal device marked classified,” the former president noted, insisting that his wife “followed the rule that then existed, the rules were changed after she left office.” Democrats have blamed Clinton’s loss to Trump on ‘Russian meddling’, triggering years of speculation about ‘collusion’ between the Republican candidate and the Kremlin. Their claim that Trump had ties with Moscow was based on a ‘dossier’ fabricated by a British spy. From there, Democrats insinuated that WikiLeaks’ publishing of internal Democratic National Committee documents and personal emails of Clinton’s campaign manager had something to do with Moscow, while ‘Russian bots and trolls’ posted ‘misinformation’ on social media, which somehow undermined the election. The FBI investigated Clinton for using a private email server for her correspondence as secretary of state and concluded that she and her team had been “extremely careless,” but found no evidence of foreign intrusion. RT says "you can share this story on social media", so I am doing so be well and have a good one

—

question everything

Submitted by mimi on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 1:14pm

are these social media really social ... or terribly unsocial?

@enhydra lutris
And I even don't know or use social media. I don't say it is their fault, but I can't say that I don't blame them.

Rostov region was attacked with 6 ATACM missiles originating in the Ukiestan territory at around 11 am Kiev time today. This, of course, required involvement of US and/or NATO peeps and constitutes an attack on the Rus by the US-NATO agglomeration. The Rus defense ministry promises a response. Comedy time, per RT - https://www.rt.com/news/609153-west-syria-revoluton-fears/ Western and Arab countries are reportedly concerned that the fall of the Assad government in Syria could mean that more hardline Islamist forces could attempt to seize power in the country, according to Reuters. Over the weekend, opposition forces led by Hayat Tahrir-al-Sham (HTS) jihadist militants seized control over major cities including Damascus, and deposed former President Bashar Assad, who left the country and has been granted asylum in Russia. However, according to several diplomats and analysts who have spoken to Reuters, the US, Israel, and other Arab powers in the region fear that the lack of a clear authority in Syria could lead to instability and extremism. Also lab leak in Australia - https://www.rt.com/news/609163-australia-deadly-virus-missing/ BEST OF ALL: Bill Clinton blames ‘mainstream media’ for Hillary’s defeat to Trump https://www.rt.com/news/609189-bill-clinton-hillary-election-defeat/ World News Business India Africa RT Features Analysis Opinion Entertainment Shows Projects Ukraine strikes Russia with US-made ATACMS missiles 11 Dec, 2024 10:42 HomeWorld News Bill Clinton blames ‘mainstream media’ for Hillary’s defeat to Trump The US has accused Russia of meddling in the 2016 presidential campaign, but has failed to provide evidence Bill Clinton blames ‘mainstream media’ for Hillary’s defeat to Trump Former US President Bill Clinton. © Eugene Gologursky/Getty Images for The New York Times Former US President Bill Clinton has blamed “mainstream media” coverage of Hillary Clinton’s email controversy for her loss in the 2016 presidential election to Donald Trump. Democrats have also for years accused Russia of helping Trump defeat Clinton, despite no evidence ever been found to back the allegations. In an interview with MSNBC that aired on Monday, the former president discussed an excerpt from his book, ‘Citizen: My Life After The White House’, published in November, highlighting the “rage” he felt after Hillary Clinton lost to Trump, despite polls predicting her victory. The 42nd American president took aim at media outlets for their focus on his wife’s controversial use of a private email server for official correspondence instead of a protected, government-controlled one, during her time as US secretary of state between 2009 and 2013. Clinton, who in his book described the 2016 election as the “darkest election possible in the United States,” claimed the media blew the email scandal out of proportion. “It’s easier for us to know what happened in 2016 in some ways than what happened in 2024 in terms of all of it because in 2016 you had two highly unusual things,” the former president told MSNBC’s Joe Scarborough. “First of all, the mainstream media told the American people repeatedly that the biggest issue was Hillary’s emails – that’s what they said, not just Fox.” CBS News admits to editing Harris interviewREAD MORE: CBS News admits to editing Harris interview The narrative about Hillary Clinton’s emails made the headlines in the later stages of the 2016 campaign, casting a shadow over the Democratic candidate. At the time, US intelligence agencies claimed that Russia hacked the email of senior Democrats as part of a wide-ranging operation to damage Clinton’s campaign and assist Trump. “When in fact, even the Trump State Department said she neither sent nor received a single solitary email on her personal device marked classified,” the former president noted, insisting that his wife “followed the rule that then existed, the rules were changed after she left office.” Democrats have blamed Clinton’s loss to Trump on ‘Russian meddling’, triggering years of speculation about ‘collusion’ between the Republican candidate and the Kremlin. Their claim that Trump had ties with Moscow was based on a ‘dossier’ fabricated by a British spy. From there, Democrats insinuated that WikiLeaks’ publishing of internal Democratic National Committee documents and personal emails of Clinton’s campaign manager had something to do with Moscow, while ‘Russian bots and trolls’ posted ‘misinformation’ on social media, which somehow undermined the election. The FBI investigated Clinton for using a private email server for her correspondence as secretary of state and concluded that she and her team had been “extremely careless,” but found no evidence of foreign intrusion. RT says "you can share this story on social media", so I am doing so be well and have a good one

—

https://www.euronews.com/live

Submitted by enhydra lutris on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 2:30pm

Hi mimi. Everything depends on definitions. By some

@mimi

interpretations, Caucus 99 prcent is "social media", so I figured I have permission to post it here.

be well and have a good one

—

That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

Submitted by soryang on Wed, 12/11/2024 - 2:29pm

US Strategy to Encircle China in Jeopardy?

South Korea Political Crisis: Is US Strategy to Encircle China in Jeopardy?

Amanda Yee, KJ Noh and Tim Shorrock place the recent events in geopolitical and historical context. It's long at one hour from the 6 min mark, but it's probably the best overview I've seen yet. If you have time. When I saw I couldn't reach the video from a link on X. I felt like I should post the link before the video disappears.

—

語必忠信行必正直