The evolution of DKOS to DHRC and its consequences for C99
Yesterday I wrote a short diary at DKOS about the evolution of DKOS to DHRC. Today I build on this diary and think about some possible consequences for C99.
For years, I considered DKOS the best US source of critical and thought-provoking articles on climate change, science, education, politics and much more. However, in the last two month, I observed a radical change, which is connected to Kos’ March15th edict. Basically, the edict put everyone who criticizes H. Clinton under a general suspicion of being right-wing. If the interpretation is that the diary is ‘malicious’, then the diarist can be banned. Because ‘malicious’ is a highly flexible category (authoritarian governments such as Erdogan’s government in Turkey use such categories to suppress free press and free speech), essentially everyone who criticizes Clinton can be excluded from the DailyKos community. As a consequence, an increasing number of long-term diarists, is banned from DailyKos. Many of those diarists wrote great, thought-provoking articles.
Instead of this older diarists (many can be found here or on reddit now), an increasing number of new diarists have emerged, who write marketing-style pro-Clinton and kitchen-sink-style anti-Sanders diaries. An eye-opening example for me was a diarist who joined Daily-Kos two days ago and published today a “Hillary-is-so-nice-diary” that has a Clinton-campaign marketing flavor. (My critical comment to this diary was flagged and is now invisible). Noam Chomsky would call the evolution of DKOS to DHRC a nice example of “manufacturing consent”.
Some thoughts about DKOS' development and its consequences for c99:
(1) Moulitsas has lost all credibility. His manufacturing-consent tactics are the same tactics as the ones used by the Clintons and the US political establishment (REP and DEM).
(2) DKOS rapidly loses its use as a progressive platform and this is irreversible, because of Moulitsas ownership of DKOS. Because of the new Clinton marketing people on the website, one can expect that the day will come that great diaries such as the BNR won't make it to the rec list or will not stay there not for long.
(3) These developments might hurt, but they are healthy nevertheless, because Moulitsas' and the establishment's masks fall and it becomes easier to understand how the oligarchy works - and to develop counter strategies.
(4) The true value of DKOS was not the site, the site is only a tool. The true value was its progressive community of brilliant diarists. This progressive community cannot be controlled by controlling the media tool (this is what Moulitsas tries), because the community can create a new progressive media tool.
(5) C99, the reddit kossacks for Sanders, the BNR website (and others) can serve as the new progressive media platforms BUT
(6) They all should be as interconnected as possible and they all need to develop concerning their functions and features in order to be as attractive to DKOS exiles/other progressives as possible. Concretely this means
(7) I think we need to have the BNR each morning here and find a way that this means no further work for Liepar D.
(8) This would give the BNR well-deserved more readers and we do not have to go to DKOS anymore to read it, some progressive readers would come here to read it-- so it's a (yuuuge) win-win
(9) If possible we should find a way to directly interconnect posts here and on the subreddit kossacks for Sanders
(10) El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido. Vamos Bernie!
Please add further thoughts or critisize if you disagree!
Comments
I worry that JtC has created a monster we can't feed.
Not the mean sort of monster, but sweet Goliath that eats bandwidth by the wheelbarrowful.
There are plenty of "hard read" sites that function very well without the embed-video feature. (Not to mention that a 50~60+ comment stream full of embeds slows the load time to a crawl (even on fiber -- like moi.)
We have scores of the best writers from DK and elsewhere, and we should encourage them to write, and help network their writings. My concern is for JtC and indirectly C99P. Last month's surge from sleepy village to boom town is bound to bring with it the attendant problems of logistics--in the case of a website--feeding the beast.
In this vein, I'd suggest posting a link to videos with a title, and if the embedded video is included in the comment or essay, then perhaps a "Please click on this link instead of launching the video from here" notation that would become the SOP for the site.
Improve the Resilience Resource Library by adding your links.
Vote Smart - Just the Facts - 40,000 politicians by name or zipcode
As far as I understand these things
the bandwidth cost of an embedded video falls on the original website where its hosted - in other words if a Youtube video is embedded here the bandwidth used is Google's (because they own Youtube) and not JtC's
“To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.” -Voltaire
I believe you are correct here.
I believe you are correct here.
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
The only difference between embedded vs out-linked videos
is the way the browser renders them. For out-linked videos, the browser fetches the page rendering information from the original site where the video is hosted, and then "draws" that page with the video player accordingly. For embedded videos, the browser renders the video player directly embedded within the page from the referring site, but the video player "object" requests the video data directly from the host video site. The difference in bandwidth is negligible either way.
If c99 were providing the bandwidth for videos, the site would be using 1000x its current bytes, or more.
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
Thanks for putting my concerns to rest, UR. n/t
Improve the Resilience Resource Library by adding your links.
Vote Smart - Just the Facts - 40,000 politicians by name or zipcode
Well, I wasn't going to mention this, but
A few nights ago I tried to get on C99 several times and kept getting a message that said something to the effect of there too many people already logged in. I went elsewhere for a bit before coming back and trying again. Then I got in with no problem.
I don't usually go online at night - it's a leftover from my old dial-up days when the connection was fer shit after 6 pm. So I can't say if this is a common problem or not. But it wasn't my connection or the net. This seemed to have something to do with the allowable number of people logged into the site.
On the one hand YEA! But I can see a problem in the future.
Meddle not in the affairs of Dragons - For thou art crunchy and good with ketchup
at night
Which really sucked, because it forced you online using all peak hours. Ancient days ago, Internet access cost more during these times; fortunately, not so now.
I respectfully submit that you're going to need to break this habit, and not just for c99p, either. If your current internet access is DSL, it's at its shittiest during peak hours and improves markedly at off-peak times -- the exact polar opposite of your dial-up experience. So I suggest you give it a try!
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
People are correct that embedding videos is fine. However...
...uploading your images to this site does use additional server space and bandwidth. You can help the site by hosting your images on a free site like imgur.com and using the imgur direct link when you click on the "insert image" icon rather than uploading from your hard drive. It only takes an extra minute or so. Maybe I'll write a how-to essay with step-by-step instructions for the technically challenged.
Technically challenged image poster here. So, I went to imgur
signed up and linked an image from my file. Please help me out here with the next step.
once you have the image stored online somewhere...
then its easy, go view your image where ever you put it online. copy that URL .
Then us the 'insert/edit image' button on the top left of these comment boxes, put in the url, adjust the size as needed and post it.
I use a size of 420-315 (hehehe 420) for youtube music vids, but you can experiment with size until your happy with it.
Is this what you were looking for?
With their hearts they turned to each others heart for refuge
In troubled years that came before the deluge
*Jackson Browne, 1974, Before the Deluge https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7SX-HFcSIoU
A problem with being technically inept is that the instructions
are not always easy to understand :^D. I've posted several pictures here that are stored on my computer, but not wanting to slow down the system and make viewing the site tedious, I thought if the pictures were stored off line w a link it would be less stress on the website. So I tried following yr directions, copied the url, went to insert image and that's when I got lost. Seems it wants me to download an image from my file which gets me back to where I was before I put the image on http://imgur.com/dEN437w. Hope you're not fallingoffyrchairrollingonthefloorlauging, cause I'm getting a headache just thinking about it.
Here you go!
You can just paste that imgur link in instead of using browse: (I am uploading this screen cap here, sorry... butits not really a keeper
Its actually easier to paste in the link then navigate to your file to upload one.
et voila!
This should be your image above... but in preview it wasnt showing for me! Turns out you have to add .jpg after the main imgur link - or else right-click on the pic in imgur and select "Copy image address" - so the link I pasted into the image URL field was actually: http://i.imgur.com/dEN437w.jpg
Thank you. I wil print this out so I can refer to it next
time I try it. Is that the size that automatically appears or do I have to put some numbers in the width height slots to get to be that size. And I'm thinking I should call one of the grandkids to come over and just hook it up for me, like I usually do.
Of course this isn't my decision but re point 7
I do hope this comes to pass. I only go to the other place to rec and read the BNR though no longer retweet it. Fingers crossed we can make this happen.
If BNR has its own Web site, perhaps we should commit
to going there to read it? Maybe we should check with Liepar and see if he is seeking traffic for there.
Please check out Pet Vet Help, consider joining us to help pets, and follow me @ElenaCarlena on Twitter! Thank you.
I think what happened quite
I think what happened quite often in the past is that Liepar did not have time to post the BNR on his website and on DKOS, so he posted on DKOS only. As a consequence, many readers - including me -went to DKOS to read the BNR. Now, with DKOS evolution towards the dark side, many readers hesitate to go there -again including myself.
Liepar is doing a fantastic job but has limited time, therefore I wondered whether it is possible that we can help him to post it here (while he still has the BNR on his site, DKOs and other sites) without him having additional work. I thought that this must be possible in the digital era. Of course, only if he is happy with this.
The establishment is powerful. If we want to change this world, we have to unite first. El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido.
His web site with bnr
Is often not current.
I wish it were...
The BNR is posted
at the bernienewsroundup.com though it is sometimes a day or so late. i do not want to split the BNR itself into too many sites at the moment (though I understand the urge for me to move it over here) as we are currently having the highest impact week after week on dkos despite the 'establishment opposition. Not to mention after 300+ days of doing something its kind of become fun being a thorn in the side over there. i ask that people bookmark my dkos name and at least go rec the BNR (only giving dkos itself one 'hit'... certainly no worse than putting up with Joe S to see Sanders interviewed on Morning Joe.
The BNR website has the function for people to read/sign up/comment/post their own threads/etc. etc. People are more than welcome to use it if they avoid dkos, but do to timing it is sometimes not as current as my everyday morning edition.
Many thanks for your great work with the BNR!
The basic idea was to give as much readers as possible the chance to read the BNR and, therefore, copy it daily from DKOS and cross-post it here at c99. At the same time, with every BNR cross-posted, some of us wanted to encourage readers at c99 to rec. the BNR at DKOS, so that the BNR's position is strengthened there (against the backdrop of the recent surge of Clinton-clones and recent bann/exodus of progressives).
But I understand, if you want to continue as you do now. I will continue to rec the BNR every day. Please drop a message if you change your mind.
The establishment is powerful. If we want to change this world, we have to unite first. El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido.
Hey LD
I'm so glad to be able to thank you for all your work posting the BNR. I means a great deal to me and many others as I'm sure you know.
Last week or so you mentioned the progressive wing site, and asked for ideas. One thing I think would be nice is a clearing house of progressive sites. People ask me "where can I go to get the real news?". I start naming sites but it would be helpful if there was a central location.
I've compiled all the sites from this diary and the comments, plus added some of my own.
http://caucus99percent.com/content/lunch-time-reading-which-websites-do-...
Even if there was just a Bernie section. People tell me Bernie has no specifics. I ask them if they've visited feeelthebern.org No they never heard of it. This, in many ways, is a war with main stream media. We need to make it easy for non-techies to find out things. I would be happy to help in any way.
Here's another cool media project that you might want to promote on BNR. There is a movement to print a paper this week to distribute around the NY.
http://www.truthdig.com/eartotheground/item/occupy_activists_launch_batt...
So again thank you for all your work. You are an inspiration!
“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”
I have offered
to cross post it here. I have offered to do the coding and post it, and gotten so much pushback from readers who want him to keep the influence at GOS, and from LD - who basically said "It's all publicly available" but wants to be able to do it himself - that I gave up.
The four hours I spent coding the first one a few weeks ago was chalked up to learning how to post here to begin with and never actually posted.
I HAVE been posting the LTE's from LoneStarMike and Don midwest and a few other people that are posted in comments though.
Love of power is a puppet string. - Makana, Fire is Ours
Hi MCUDemocracyFan...
check out this browser extension, EasyCopy, I guarantee it will be your best friend. You will be able to highlight, copy all text and images to your browser, then paste it all directly into our editor, and your done! The whole process can be accomplished in a matter of minutes. EasyCopy is amazing, I kid you not, check it out.
It lifts all HTML code and images and videos and will transfer them here in one fell swoop.
I think your comment cut off.
There's no extension linked.
Love of power is a puppet string. - Makana, Fire is Ours
You're right MCUDemocracyFan...
I missed an quotation mark in the code. Thanks.
Thanks for your post, I did
Thanks for your post, I did not know that. But maybe thinks have changed, because the situation at DHRC becomes inreasingly unbearable and we might be able to offer Liepar reccs at DKOS from ex-DKOS users who are now here.
Would you still be onboard to help with the cross posting?
The establishment is powerful. If we want to change this world, we have to unite first. El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido.
Was Markos cloned from PM Erdogan's rectal cells?
The one difference is that Erdogan has wolves howling nearby, wolves that aim to feast on the carnage they create. ISIS, Kurds, Syria, Iraq, Iran, and its sometime friendemy, Greece.
Little fingered Kos only sees enemies in his dreams, and even those are idiots who have no clue how inevitable Clinton is, and how she and only she can win the presidency. An actual factual debate on issues scares him, because in a battle of wits, he would be the one fighting unarmed.
If you look over his recent postings analyzed them in detail, parsed their logic, and searched for an underlying theme and argument, most readers would be struck just how shallow his arguments are.
I was always struck by how a lame article by him would result in hundreds of recs and many dozen fawning responses thanking him for the site. I was also struck by how many of the articles were fairly insubstantial, a serious surprise to me, given how he was continually praised as a liberal lion, a seer, a leader.
And then there were his TV appearances. Each time his voice was aired, I was aghast at how stilted, how lame and inarticulate his arguments were - that is, when he was making some argument. In answer to a tough question, he often responded with pap. There was actual dissonance going on there. If this guy is the liberal star, how could he be so seemingly uninformed, inarticulate, and unconvincing in person? The best that could be said about his TV appearances was that they were an overall waste of time.
It was not that the media was against him, to the contrary, the media actively sought new stars, new voices,someone that could encapsulate the liberal movement, explain it and move it forward. But Kos was certainly not the person to do it. He just doesn't have enough talent.
Which brings me to this: your argument is spot on. It was not Kos that grew and became a power. It was other writers, other thinkers who made that place what it was. And now, he is actively chasing them away, and filling the place with mindless twits and praise filled syncophants.
Thanks Pastor and ScholarZ!
Between you, you have perfectly captured the situation over there, and the fraud that is kos-the-liberal-wizard. We can and will do much better.
Great, great writing, both.
Thanks! I always liked to
Thanks! I always liked to read your great diaries there. Many thanks for them!
The establishment is powerful. If we want to change this world, we have to unite first. El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido.
To the best of my knowledge
the underpinning for all of his arguments relied solely on the inevitability of Clinton. In essence, it is a faith-based belief set. His "math" also relied on the axiom of her inevitability.
More disturbing than that, however, is his rejection of actual reality. The actual history of Hillary Clinton must be edited and abridged until it fit into the narrative. Facts which argued against the narrative were not to be mentioned. Sure Hillary lied us into a war in Libya but saying so might make her look bad so please don't discuss that. Sure Hillary was directly responsible for mass incarceration and child poverty but again, that might hurt the inevitability of her by causing people to actually weigh her merits. It is incontrovertible that she has lied in the past and her and her surrogates have created an entire campaign out of lies and deception. But again, let's not call her a liar.
Markos no more encapsulates the liberal movement than Jeb Bush does. I think I need to do more facebook links to this site to help grow it's audience.
A lot of wanderers in the U.S. political desert recognize that all the duopoly has to offer is a choice of mirages. Come, let us trudge towards empty expanse of sand #1, littered with the bleached bones of Deaniacs and Hope and Changers.
-- lotlizard
I like the idea of coordinating the sites, different sites for
different purposes, so we can go where we need/want to be with some degree of efficiency so we don't spend all day online; yet all get increased traffic. I'll be interested to see what we come up with in this vein.
I also recommend Facebook for those not already on it. You can keep your personal information to a minimum. I gave them a fake birth date. They just need a "real name" and a real email address and maybe a real cellphone number (I don't remember if I gave them that, but if so they swear not to share it); you can create a new email for free at Google gmail. Then friend each other. A lot of interesting articles come across my FB thread.
Please check out Pet Vet Help, consider joining us to help pets, and follow me @ElenaCarlena on Twitter! Thank you.
I like the coordination idea
very much.
On the other point, there are some of us who Absolutely will not Facebook. Even when some friends and family rely on it. The little you say you have to give them, plus who you network with and what you write and when and what you link to and the other sites you visit (which they track) is in itself a trove of information for affiliated marketers, as well as potentially other compilers of dossiers. I understand that the convenience, for some, outweighs that consideration; other users have no concept how such information can be used, misused, misinterpreted. And some of us are still employed and do not want our work and off-work identities co-mingled any more than we can help. Staying off Facebook does not guarantee privacy, yet some are unwilling to offer the Panopticon more grist than necessary. To each their own.
Euterpe2
Facebook.
I am registered on the site cos it's the only way I can communicate with some old friends. After that, forget it!! It has always felt too nosey for me.
Inner and Outer Space: the Final Frontiers.
Agree about the BNR ...
BNR is the only reason I go to TOP any more. It's the only reason that most of us who still go do so. Getting BNR over here (with NO extra effort on LieparDestin's part) means that a whole bunch of us could dispense with that site completely.
On the flip side, my impression is that LieparDestin feels very committed to keeping his BNR presence at TOP. So bringing it over here would drive down his recommends, and hence, his ability to stay on the wreck list for long periods. I would hate to do that to someone as selfless and passionate as LD. I figure that a 5 minute trip to TOP to rec the BNR for LD's sake is a small thing to do for him.
"Long term: first the rich get mean, then the poor get mean, and the rest is history." My brother Rob.
i agree, Pat, if LD can handle being at TOP, then I am willing
to go over there once a day to rec up his work. I also quickly rec all the other Bernie diaries. I'm in 3 Bernie groups so it doesn't take me long to do that, maybe 5 or 10 minutes at the most.
And I strictly boycott the comments so don't have to listen to the mindless chorus of the oligarchy's sycophants.
Never be deceived that the rich will allow you to vote away their wealth.-Lucy Parsons
So just got back from rec'ing Bernie diaries at DK
Took only 10 minutes and would have taken less, but I stopped to watch a very funny SnL Skit about Hillary and 7 straight losses:
"Hillary Addresses her Losing Streak as Race in NY Heats Up. Updated w/Coney Island Rally Live Stream" By igualdad
http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/4/10/1513420/-Hillary-Addresses-her...
For those who can handle the trip each day to TOP, I think it's a good idea to rec Bernie diaries over there. First because it pisses off the Hillarybots, and second because it gives support to the brave Bernie Sanders supporters who are still left over there.
Never be deceived that the rich will allow you to vote away their wealth.-Lucy Parsons
i go to DKOS
to post the BNR, read what Meteor Blades, Tomp P, OPOL, and some others have written. Other than that I avoid most candidate diaries and all of the frontpage. Its still fairly enjoyable that way. I appreciate those willing to go visit TOP to give me recs, understand their frustration with me for not venturing other places with the BNR, and look forward to the journeys ahead. I will use C99% for everyday blogging that I used to do at DKOS, and also will be doing my own thin at the progressivewing.com soon as well.
To counter the disadvantages,
To counter the disadvantages, I think many are happy to go to TOS to recommend the BNR and other great diaries. I do it each day.
But staying there for longer and attempting to discuss with the Clinton marketing people seems to me a waste of time. I would rather discuss the BNR here.
The establishment is powerful. If we want to change this world, we have to unite first. El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido.
We will be having...
a site audit done within the next couple of weeks. This will tell us what needs to be done to improve site performance. I suspect a couple of issues in the site architecture and database that are leading to sporadic slowdowns and occasional errors. The audit will tell the tale. Once all of that is ironed out, we can determine to add more bandwidth or not. But most assuredly, as the membership grows the need for more bandwidth grows and as long as we can raise the funds bandwidth is not an issue.
But first, right now we are in the middle of a big site improvement, the comment replies notification system, the feature everyone has been clamoring for. That should be completed tomorrow (Mon.) or Tuesday, I'll make an announcement when it's completed. After that we'll tackle the site audit, more site improvements and upgrades. These are all costly endeavors.
Site growth and functionality takes money, something c99p did not have before the great migration. Your donations will help make this site the best that it can be, and the site management is dedicated to that result as well. We, the management, will strive to make c99p a top tier blog site.
Personally, I've not encountered
any performance problems here. Ironically, it's DK that performs so painfully slow for me that I often exit before even scrolling through the landing page.
Anyway, thanks for the cozy place to hang out in! Please keep up the great work!
"The real power is in the hands of small groups of people and I don't think they have titles. -- Bob Dylan"
exactly, the site was never slow for me neither /nt
Strangely, since I've left DK
the few times I've been vack its been hella slow - like the page takes forever to load and freezes onscreen.
I never experienced that when I actually spent time there, so I don't know if they are going through something right now - but its super slow. Luckily, that no longer affects me at all ;p
But C99 has been great!
I have not had problems with cc99.
GOS is another story entirely. It crashes my browser (and my laptop) on a regular basis, locks up my computer for 10+ minutes at a time, etc. if I have more than a few tabs open and sometimes only one or two.
cc99 on the other hand is as gentle as AO3. I can have pretty much the entire site open in different tabs with no noticeable impact on my computer's performance.
Kudos to you guys for that. That is awesome.
Love of power is a puppet string. - Makana, Fire is Ours
great, I wonder about the donation thingy ...
one thing I observed in my own attitudes towards donating (I can't donate a lot, but a bit)
is that I think it would help to know how much the site needs per month to function well and compensate at least a little bit your work.
Then an item like a metering button that shows how much has been donated in the month to reach that goal. If people see what is needed they would be more inclined to donate to meet the goal, if the goal is met others might wait til the next month to donate.
I don't like much to not know how much money is needed to "make the trains be on time" and pay the train engineer and the conductor. (We could have a public poll about how much train engineers and conductors should be paid.
What is so bad to be public with the money needed (provided it remains a non-for profit site) each month and be able to watch, if enough has been donated?
Makes a lot of sense, mimi.
An interesting model could be developed somewhat along those lines.
"The real power is in the hands of small groups of people and I don't think they have titles. -- Bob Dylan"
Funding.
They do that type of fundraising on certain highly successful Music stations. Example: Atlantic Sound Factory. Live365 folded (sob!), but the smart, modern ones took off from that launching pad.
Inner and Outer Space: the Final Frontiers.
Thanks JtC!
Let me first thank you, for your great work regarding this site! Fantastic that you are further improving it!
What do you think about the issue of 'importing' the BNR here each day. If Liepar would agree to this, would that be possible without an extra investment of time for him?
The establishment is powerful. If we want to change this world, we have to unite first. El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido.
Yes...
we'd love to have the BNR here daily, but that's up to Lieper.
Transitioning a diary from there to here is very easy to do with this little gem. It would be a simple matter of copy/pasting the text and images from DKos into our editor. The whole process would only take minutes
Creating a win-win for Liepar
Then it seems to me that getting the BNR here daily depends on creating a win-win for Liepar and the readers here.
It should not happen that having the BNR here daily leads to a reduction of recs on DKOS.
But if a sufficiently high number of eX-Dkos diarists here commits to going there for a minute to rec it , the BNR should not lose recs there. On the contrary, it might even lead to a longer survival of the BNR on DKOS, as the exodus continues and increases.
Additionally Liepar might find some new readers here.
Does this makes sense?
The establishment is powerful. If we want to change this world, we have to unite first. El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido.
Heh ... it not only makes sense, ScholarZ ...
... but is exactly what I was thinking. See below ... great minds and all that!
"Long term: first the rich get mean, then the poor get mean, and the rest is history." My brother Rob.
Cool!
Cool!
How do we make it happen?
Do you know about a good way to contact Liepar?
The establishment is powerful. If we want to change this world, we have to unite first. El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido.
Well ...
I would say that we should consult with JtC first. Would he be the one who would bring the BNR over?? Will somebody else? Is this a good time to start something like that what with a bunch of site changes pending? Once all that's settled, I would think whoever volunteers to take care of this daily would be the logical soul to contact LD with our little proposal. In fact, if I recall correctly, someone from here may have already at least broached the subject with LD. JtC would know ...
Hmmm. Does a site admin have to do this sort of thing? Can anybody??
"Long term: first the rich get mean, then the poor get mean, and the rest is history." My brother Rob.
A friend of Liepar D commented below
orlbucfan:
"All you have to do is call up the BNR. You ask LieparDestin to contact you. Tell him how to do it and he will. Use me if you need a reference. Markos and posse do not mess with the BNR. I have been onboard with the BNR since LD with the help of LSM, Don midwest, OLinda, RaggetyAnn got it started. It's a great info site for Berniacs. "
I sent her a private message.
Well JtC said that would be happy if the BNR would be here daily, but that we need Liepar's ok.
So, I reckon, if we get Liepar's ok, we just get a small team together and do it. The audiacy of sharing
The establishment is powerful. If we want to change this world, we have to unite first. El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido.
Hah! Audacity indeed!
I'm not all that great at computer stuff ... but there's nothing I can't learn (eventually).
So count me in if I can help in any way, ScholarZ!
"Long term: first the rich get mean, then the poor get mean, and the rest is history." My brother Rob.
Many thanks, Pat!
Looks like Liepar wants to keep it as it is at the moment.
Well, I still think that the idea is good, we will see what happens. Tomorrow is another day to try to unite the progressives - if the progressives allow us to try it
The establishment is powerful. If we want to change this world, we have to unite first. El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido.
Perhaps this could be negotiated with LieparD.
He might agree to let us copy his work over here if we assure him that those of us who now make a daily trip to TOP to rec the BNR will continue to do so? I would absolutely agree to those terms on my end.
EDIT: Perhaps each edition of the BNR brought over here could start with a note encouraging readers to make that quick trip to TOS to rec the BNR there?
"Long term: first the rich get mean, then the poor get mean, and the rest is history." My brother Rob.
I humbly suggest
that the time will come that the number of recs a piece receives on DK will no longer matter. For many, that time has already come.
I understand (and applaud) the desire to support good work. But continuing to give DK free content and free traffic is more than a bit akin to giving aid and comfort to the enemy. The mask is off. That site is part of the problem, not the solution.
I would suggest that instead of encouraging people to go there, we encourage people to come here. I fear there's nothing to be gained from howling in the echo chamber that has become DK.
I'm not trying to be critical. Do as you see fit. Just offering an unsolicited opinion.
"The real power is in the hands of small groups of people and I don't think they have titles. -- Bob Dylan"
OK ... but remember ...
The BNR is not a permanent thing. It's only temporary as long as Bernie's campaign lasts ... or at least that was my impression. At that point, I believe LieparDestin will have spruced up a new permanent site OFF of TOP. And at that point none of us would feel like we had to go back to TOP for anything.
I totally agree with you that we need to knock off the constant TOP references! But we are talking doing a temporary favor for a worthy individual who would be giving us directly his amazing content in return. Seems fair to me!
"Long term: first the rich get mean, then the poor get mean, and the rest is history." My brother Rob.
JtC: costly in what sense?
Are you paying a contractor for this stuff?
I used to be a web developer. I can possibly find time to help out with some coding, including db optimization, if it turns out that's needed.
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
Yes...
I don't have the time. General maintenance of this site has gone from a part-time hobby to a full time job.
I'll be contacting you after the audit, thanks for the offer.
Need money ?
Maybe you could get a grant from the Clinton Foundation, if you could, you know, agree to some editorial tweaks.
We wanted decent healthcare, a living wage and free college.
The Democrats gave us Biden and war instead.
Nah...
I'd rather starve.
I like the Bernie model, let the 99ers fund it and to hell with the corrupt. Of the 99, for the 99 and by the 99.
But I do discern your snarkitude.
I'm willing to help out too,
if there's anything that fits my skill-set. Mostly deep server-side stuff, cross-platform C, etc. Decent db-optimization, solid python/java/.NET. No front-end stuff like HTML. (Well, I *can* do it but I usually loathe front-end work.)
I suggest fighting the narcissistic pull.
As the local founders have made explicit, c99 is not about dailyKos; similarly, dailyKos is not about c99.
There is, and always will be, stuff happening at dailyKos that will be cool and essentially irreproducible, here or anywhere else. GunFAIL, for example, is not about to migrate to c99, now or ever.
While some old and revered names from GOS have hiked over here, the reality is that even now, only a small fraction of the writers who made TOP interesting have made their way to c99, and most of them never will. The sudden influx of ready-made bloggers notwithstanding, the organic development of a broad array of unique, characteristic, compelling c99 voices is still going to take years to mature.
In another essay here, someone quoted a chicagominx comment from dkos:
Though her observation may seem ludicrous to some folks here (particularly, I imagine, folks who were here before, say, 8 weeks or so ago), when contrasted with the Time Square bustle of TOP, c99 remains pretty bucolic. It's not yet nearly a place where someone can go as one's daily jumping-off point to the entire array of news sources reporting What's Going On. It may or may not ever get there; for myself, I may or may not hang around long enough to care. What I think should be obvious, though, is that anyone who really wants to see c99 become that kind of go-to resource would serve that desire best by never writing another word about the dKos-v-c99 tension/contrast/whatever, and invest 100% of their bloggo-psychic energy in creating for c99 the kind of content that will render the meta-conversation moot.
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
Yes...
the constant Koscentric essays are disheartening, but we, the founders, went through it also and because of that we do understand the angst. So we give room for the necessary weaning period, and I have to admit that it is slowly getting better.
About that comment by chicagominx, that doesn't bother me, actually it is a tell that we are being noticed and viewed as a threat by some. Some folks have a lot invested in the DKos status quo and will lash out at any venue that challenges that condition. DKos has a long history of that behavior, FDL comes to mind. I really wouldn't expect chicagominx or any other sycophants to give a glowing review of c99p. Besides if they did come here and just visited the front page alone, then they are missing the vibrancy of the community content page. I see comments like hers regularly and let them roll off my back like water off of a duck. I see it as a barometer of our success as truth tellers and being a thorn in the side of "that that should not change". It's all part and parcel of the blogging thing.
We want to be c99p and let DKos be DKos. We are interested in advancing view points that are stifled elsewhere, we are interested in the voice of the 99percent, and to hell with what anyone else thinks of us.
Sure, I get that people want to grieve.
And maybe it's not much of a BFD to me because I left dKos 3 months before I wandered into this place.
However, the important part of my comment was the final sentence. The larger problem isn't that writing about dKos on c99 clutters up the essays list; the larger problem is that writing about dKos on c99 distracts the authors from writing content that functionally makes this site a compelling destination..
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
Yet it does make the place feel friendly
to brand-new immigrants or explorers from TOP. Thanks for your patience.
Euterpe2
Maybe there could be another
category, beneath "Community Content", for the GOD refugees.
You mean like agnostics, atheists & former Mormons?
Baby steps, my dear Untimely ... baby steps.
You are way out ahead of most of us. But have no fear ... we'll be nipping at your heels soon ...
"Long term: first the rich get mean, then the poor get mean, and the rest is history." My brother Rob.
one c99 trick
It took me a couple of weeks here to figure out that the Evening Blues was like an online news paper - covering many more topics than I found over at TOP... and in sections just like a paper. UntimelyRippd may not have explored the site very well.
When you move in a new community, it never is just like your old one. You have to spend time hanging around and getting to know folks. I'm glad it isn't the objective of the c99 to be like TOP. Other than the BNR I dislike the tone and censorship and will not participate at TOP.
My interest is in building a movement, not supporting a party which road blocks and inhibits the people movement to promote corporate greed.
“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”
The thrill is gone.
I still occasionally click in over at DHRC (out of respect for Meteor Blades and Hunter, mostly). But, each time it gets more sad and painful. I read the titles and don't even have enough interest to open them. It was a nice trip while it lasted, but it's over now. It feels like for 11 years, I was watching a great cake bake. Then, when a candidate finally came along who was worth placing at the top, the whole cake fell apart. Whatever happened to Markos is beyond my comprehension, and the other HRC kiss-ups are just plain mean. It's nice to have a kinder place to come.
It's going to be even more gone --
as readers desert that place and come HERE!
Bring them here!!!
'French theory is a product of US cultural imperialism." -- Gabriel Rockhill
Moving the Movement
I haven't been feeling up to writing diaries lately. I think my anxiety has been too high and I suffer from anxiety issues so it is what it is. But my plan, and I would suggest others follow this model, is that if you have a good diary to post that you write it here (though I love the kossacks site on reddit, it's more focused on Sanders whereas I see c99 as more inclusive). Then, post an intro/summary of your diary to DK and link here for people to finish reading. The logic is simple:
Now, proceed with caution since if done well this could seriously drive up traffic her and cause issues for JtC. And we want to make sure that content is consistent with the goals and mission of this site. But I think this is a good problem to have of sorts. I know I have to make another financial contribution here as well and will soon. I have not contributed enough on any front here. And I hope others are constantly thinking about that too.
ETA: My solution with the plethora of DK post-redux diaries is I try not to recommend (thumbs up) most of them. There isn't enough content here yet that they are fully buried without recs. So consider not recommending DK diaries and pushing substance diaries to the "Community Featured" list. I wish that list wasn't buried at the bottom btw. I understand the logic but just from simple web design perspective, the shorter list of featured items should be above the longer list of recent items.
I know it looks weird at the bottom
It's to do perhaps less with logic than with the displeasure felt by some about how some people develop fan clubs and wind up on rec lists on a regular basis, and that this doesn't accurately reflect the quality of their writing vs. that of others. I say this not to diss people who get a lot of recs, but more because of remembering beautifully written pieces being buried with minimal attention at DK, simply because the author was less well known. Rec lists tend to be self-reinforcing. I can understand the feelings here of some who would like to do away with the whole thing entirely, and giving it a position of less prominence was a calculated compromise and, I think, the best one.
I agree on not reccing pieces that are about DK, and limiting one's expressions of approval to the comments, though people here are as unwieldy cats to be herded as any. I understand the attraction of these pieces only too well, and I also understand the dangers of becoming a blog that is mostly about criticizing another blog. It inhibits growing a unique identity, which c99p was apparently doing perfectly well before the Sanders campaign came along. But I don't know what one can do without becoming authoritarian, other than setting the example of what you would like to see.
Stay on track. Stay in lane. Don't throw rocks.
Being quite new here, I think I understand the Before aspect
of the smallish group and knew that I had to research what was happenin' here.
And then the flood, one of whom was me. Some of you tolerate the venting (exhaling, inhaling?) that us battered survivors have done. And increased the village. Thank you.
Now that I am in a new ship and the other one is bobbing farther away, we do have to pick up those in the water. I am not so sure that there has to be more advertising at TOP, it's been almost 2 months since the Proclamation was given. Most of the leapers will get done with the upset, in time the swimmers will if they want and realize that this is not a replication, but a larger view of life. That's my hope. I hope others feel similarly.
I am feeling mellow, I got a new puppy on Friday; she gives me diversion and a micro-purpose.
Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.
I totally get it and agree
I totally get it and agree with your comment. And yes, I don't think it can be forced. But perhaps we can work towards a community consensus. If a plurality of folks agreed that would probably be enough to diminish the presence of DK diaries on the community featured list.
I assumed the "new" diarists are sock puppets
Based on a previous c99 post, I assumed that the apparently new diarists at DKos were actually sock puppets in a desperate effort to maintain the illusion that the level of activity over there hasn't slowed down.
"We've done the impossible, and that makes us mighty."
I'm a little concerned
that some people see C99P as "the Bernie site" rather than "the alternative site to GOS".
Then, if Bernie loses, they will just drift back to GOS.
Not me
I'm sick of Markos. Have been for years. Told myself I needed to go there to get my stuff read. Well, that was just my narcissism talking.
If anything I will go to DKos only to encourage others to leave via private messages.
"You can't just leave those who created the problem in charge of the solution."---Tyree Scott
Same here. 100%
Plus, the abusive behavior at GOS won't stop after the nomination or the inauguration. Officially endorsing abuse of those outside the accepted bubble isn't the kind of thing that's retractable.
The danger exists...
... but the challenge is then to develop this site towards a progressive platform. For this you need to get the progressive community exiled from DKOS here and a good technical development of this site (I think JTC works on that). Furthermore, I think you need progressive rules governing this site: a common ownership, no censoring etc.
I have some knowledge about organizational innovation and development. I think getting the BNR here and improving the networking between progressives would be a good step forward towards avoiding what you are concerned about.
What do you think about the BNR idea? Do you know about a good way to contact Liepar?
The establishment is powerful. If we want to change this world, we have to unite first. El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido.
BNR
All you have to do is call up the BNR. You ask LieparDestin to contact you. Tell him how to do it and he will. Use me if you need a reference. Markos and posse do not mess with the BNR. I have been onboard with the BNR since LD with the help of LSM, Don midwest, OLinda, RaggetyAnn got it started. It's a great info site for Berniacs.
Inner and Outer Space: the Final Frontiers.
Many thanks!
I will write you a private message.
The establishment is powerful. If we want to change this world, we have to unite first. El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido.
I'm not so sure g...
I too share your concern but the more I see the more I'm convinced that it will be totally insufferable at certain sites if Hillary Clinton wins the nomination, even more so than now, if that's possible. There will be no room for Hillary critique. Sure some folks may go back, but they'll have to bow in fealty.
They can drift back
And participate in non-political groups. Those are the grout that holds that place together in some ways. The same thing happens here, it's just new is all.
Stay on track. Stay in lane. Don't throw rocks.
I feel ya
If some want to "kiss the ring" they are welcome to leave. We're all adults here and have to live with our choices.
both would be not what I believe the founders
of C99p had in mind.
This to be a "Bernie site" for the long run would be a "death sentence" imo. To be "the alternative site to GOS" is also really not what I hope this site to become in the long term future.
Why this site is seen to be related to the GOS site as being its alternative for the foreseeable future, I don't know. Though this site has evolved out of GOS site's former writers, it doesn't mean (to me at least) that this site is simply defined as being an alternative outlet. I think this site will stay on his own feet and not be anymore defined through its writers' past on the GOS.
The essence to me would be to get as much the best information out of the content and discussions about the content as one can get. For example I miss something like MB's essays or collections of articles about environmental issues, (though the EB does already do a fine job to have an extra section for that) or MB's state blogs collections.
I have to admit that I hope the "grieving period" and the "oh, I might get banned from the GOS" diaries would (please) slowly fade away. It's a vulnerability to be attached to always see everything in comparison or even competition to the GOS.
I might just underestimate how much it has hurt the amazing writers, who felt the time has come to move away from the GOS. So much freely donated work for what seems to have become the wrong platform. I do understand the pain. But one has to go on and leave the past behind.
To drift back to the GOS is weak, as GOS is a platform that is not compatible with many of its best current or former writers' journalistic ethics. To go there for the "larger exposure" is something one shouldn't fall for. Steady good writing, diverse issues, free discussions etc will do its magic on this site over time as well. No need to "drift back", imo.
I am lucky
I am lucky that I am not so attached emotionally to DHRC, as I was a reader only and unregistered for a long time.
For me I treat DHRC not much different from some corporate websites. You might find some people there, who are interested in progressive ideas. Therefore, one might want to post sometimes there. At the same time, as you say, you are in danger to support the system of using freely donated work for the wrong platform and the profit of an unethical owner.
My personal solution out of this contradiction is to mostly avoid DHRC, but indvidually support some great writers there who try to diffuse the good message (i.e. Bernie's
).
The establishment is powerful. If we want to change this world, we have to unite first. El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido.
If this were a "Bernie site" --
then Bernie will have won the primaries!
'French theory is a product of US cultural imperialism." -- Gabriel Rockhill
About 10% of all wrecklisted diaries more than a year old
are by diarists who are currently banned. March 15 was the endgame to a transformation that has been going on for years.
I think if you keep at it, The GOS can be beaten. Compared to other boycotts and exoduses, this one looks different, and I've been keeping track of this stuff a fling time, at least since my first ban in 2012. I'm rooting for you!
"Then I read this: Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand. I read every word of that piece of sh*t and I'm never reading again !"- Officer Barbrady
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