Still in deep du du

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Late last year I penned an open thread (https://caucus99percent.com/content/salt-earth) calling attention to the Ukranian artillery and missile attacks on the Zaporishzhia Nuclear Power Plant in the farmland known as the Black Soil belt of chernozen earth and the dangers of contaminating it with irradiation.
While the Russian forces now control it and the surrounding countryside, a new source of contamination has been pro-offered by the United Kingdom in the form of Depleted uranium munitions in artillery shells supplied with the dozen or so Challenger main battle tanks being supplied to the Ukraine forces.
The heavy metal uranium penetrates steel armor easily but creates a toxic dust that settles in the lungs or contaminates the soil, which the plants (food) take up and transfer to human (or other living organisms) and cause havoc with many organs and causes mutations in DNA.
The Du is low in radioactivity and can barely pass through the skin, but it's toxicity is extreme when it is consumed or inhaled.
It is not known how long it would remain in the soil, possibly until it is all consumed or inhaled and carried to the grave somewhere else and ultimately dispersed.
Du used in Iraq and Syria by US forces are still showing up in highly elevated incidences of cancer and birth defects with no lessening.
Again, poisoning some of the finest and richest growing medium on the planet is, in my view, a true crime against humanity.
The big losers would be Blackrock and the Big Ag corporations that have swooped in and looted Ukrainian farmland for pennies on the dollar.
But on second thought, they would probably still grow crops on it and peddle it world-wide as perfectly healthy foodstuffs. Eventually, that would disperse it more widely.
And they would spin it as an environmental cleanup to benefit mankind. A special kind of evil.
If you read the labels on food packaging to see what you're eating, eventually you will want to know what your food is grown in.
Like Wouldsman, I will continue to manufacture my own growing medium.
The thread is open. What's on your mind?

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ggersh's picture

who responds to the D's march to war by calling out
the MIC/MSM/Nazi's in a speech against it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAfM4bgdu5E

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I never knew that the term "Never Again" only pertained to
those born Jewish

"Antisemite used to be someone who didn't like Jews
now it's someone who Jews don't like"

Heard from Margaret Kimberley

earthling1's picture

@ggersh
I'm going to add Iverson to my list to watch for.
Really sad that only three others voted with the Maine senator. But the Protect the Guard movement looks promising.
Thanks for the link.

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Neither Russia nor China is our enemy.
Neither Iran nor Venezuela are threatening America.
Cuba is a dead horse, stop beating it.

When I read this statement "The big losers would be Blackrock and the Big Ag corporations that have swooped in and looted Ukrainian farmland for pennies on the dollar."

If a gov't has taken steps to make the investment that was made by the corporation worthless, can a corporation sue the gov't for that value of that investment? When I was wandering thru my old abode I saw that there were a few cases scattered around the US that were trying to use the Takings Clause to fight the EPA. Totally ridiculous claim but knowing how wonderful our scotus is, I have no doubt ...

Anyway, could those multi-national corps get restitution? Hey, I know I stole it but I'm entitled to all the investment I made in the theft. If memory serves, I think a big change made during the coup was an amendment to the ukr constitution to allow foreign ownership of sovereign territory.

How's that Fried(?) guy doing?

On a different, semi-related thought, I'm halfway thru "Don't Look Up". It's too distressing to deal with in one sitting.

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earthling1's picture

@exindy
did change their laws to allow the sales of sovereign land to private entities, primarily to skim money under the guise of funding the war machine.
If Russia takes control of the farmlands they will have recovered their $300 billion stolen from them and served a devastating blow to the people who would have benefited the most from the plundering of Ukraine.
Which is why the Nazis will have no problem leaving those farmlands poisoned for a thousand years as they are pushed back to the Galician border.
The "Takings Clause" will have to be negotiated with the victor. The "Rules Based Order" will no longer prevail.
Hopefully.
IMHO

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Neither Russia nor China is our enemy.
Neither Iran nor Venezuela are threatening America.
Cuba is a dead horse, stop beating it.

soryang's picture

Allows people to make claims against the US for non-combat injuries, property loss, etc., and is limited generally to 100k. My understanding is that it is a limited waiver of sovereign immunity. I don't know what the UK law is. Injuries from radioactivity from DU or the destruction of a nuclear reactor by artillery, bombing, missile or otherwise, in a combat zone, aren't payable imo, because they are the foreseeable result of intentional acts by the sovereign. Of course, one could come up with a war crime theory of liability, but I doubt that would ever fly in the US or UK.

10 U.S. Code § 2733 - Property loss; personal injury or death: incident to noncombat activities of Department of Army, Navy, or Air Force

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/2733

Note- I'm not a practicing lawyer. This doesn't constitute legal advice for any purpose.

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語必忠信 行必正直

earthling1's picture

@soryang
that General Motors sued and won a suit against the US government after WWII to recover damages resulting from the bombing of it's German plants, which were building military vehicles for the German Army.
That may have sparked the legislation limiting the awards.
Thanks for the post.

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10 users have voted.

Neither Russia nor China is our enemy.
Neither Iran nor Venezuela are threatening America.
Cuba is a dead horse, stop beating it.

soryang's picture

@earthling1

I didn't know about GM getting a recovery. That's interesting. I read a history book once a long time ago, that focused on US corporate support of the German war effort. I didn't realize that they actually received reparations.

I was thinking about adding this point to my post: That if one wanted more than a 100k, they could request a special bill from the legislature to extend the waiver of sovereign immunity. So given the pliability of Congress to corporate requests maybe this could be a possibility in even more general terms.

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語必忠信 行必正直

Radiation poisoned crops, genetically grown to withstand expression, will be sent to the
starving masses in Africa. They will eventually get sick and die from it. Blackrock
profits two ways: Selling contaminated grains and killing the poor. Win-win.

Like to see food labelling include radium, toxic chemicals and other poisons in their
ingredients. Wink

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earthling1's picture

@QMS
But Corporate America will gladly step forward.
For the stockholders, you see.

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Neither Russia nor China is our enemy.
Neither Iran nor Venezuela are threatening America.
Cuba is a dead horse, stop beating it.

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8 users have voted.

I wonder why???

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soryang's picture

@humphrey @humphrey ...since the failed summit at Hanoi in Feb. 2019. Thanks John Bolton. North Korea made a crucial error of judgement by conducting missile tests during the South Korean presidential election campaign in 2022. This in effect played right into far right candidate Yoon's hands, enabling him to play the national security issue, to get elected president, by a very small margin. Yoon had expressed the desire to jettison the Sept 2018 military agreement with North Korea in Jan 22, during the campaign. That is what he has been doing lately, and at the same, allowing the US to discard whatever remained of the agreements Trump reached with Kim Jong-un in Singapore.

US-ROK huge military ground and air exercises, bringing B-52s and B1-bs to the peninsula, along with US Carrier Strike Group visits, and an SSN at one point, all violate the Singapore understandings. The US and Yoon's response is essentially a childish "he did it first mommy." Who is going to break the vicious cycle of escalation? These as everyone notices are the biggest US-RoK military exercises in five years. The ROK Navy is even participating in naval maneuvers which include Japanese forces.

The appropriateness and the effectiveness of this US-ROK response is questionable at best. I listened to analyst Kim Jong-tae's presentation on this topic two days ago. He pointed out that there really is no effective military response to threats of nuclear war beyond the nuclear deterrent itself. The missile threats from North Korea, as claimed, (they may not be perfected yet) including cruise missiles, with very low profiles, and shorter ranged ballistic missiles with flat apogees and variable guidance, are really not effectively defensible. This is why talk of so called preemptive strikes are in vogue on the US/allied side. But North Korea solid fueled ballistic missiles fired from silos or mobile platforms are not all going to be stopped or intercepted. More likely they can be fired before they are detected and responded to.

Rather than a tit for tat escalatory response, there needs to be a standdown in military activity, and overtures for negotiations that can be looked upon with some credibility. The problem is that this sort of approach is not only unacceptable politically in the US, but also for South Korea's Yoon. Yoon doesn't know how to walk something back, and has zero diplomatic leverage over the US or Japan. Instead he keeps doubling down on moves, military and diplomatic that only provoke North Korea to greater excesses.

I listened to an excellent analysis of Yoon as a leader the other day. He is not an experienced politician. His knowledge of foreign affairs is virtually non-existent. He is at one and the same time accustomed to giving orders, and doesn't negotiate. Yet he is completely dependent on his advisors particularly on one foreign policy advisor educated in the US. He is vindictive if not sadistic. He enjoys seeing his political opponents suffer. He is oriented to threats and revenge in his execution of duties. His constant reference to his personal philosophy of "courage" as the key to life, really belies a lack of confidence, fear of foreign powers, including so called allies, like the US, and definitely North Korea. Because of his personal history and wariness of US commitment, he is inappropriately submissive to Japan. He is above all, the wrong leader at wrong time for South Korea.

Fox Mar 24

South Korean President Yoon Suk Yeol promised on Friday to punish North Korea for the communist nation's recent series of "provocations."

"North Korea is advancing its nuclear weapons day by day and conducting missile provocations with unprecedented intensity," said Yoon.

He made the comments at the Daejeon national cemetery to commemorate the anniversary of West Sea Defense Day — a holiday in honor of servicemen who lost their lives defending the maritime border with North Korea.

https://www.foxnews.com/world/south-korean-president-i-will-make-sure-no...

The joint exercises by the South Korean and US militaries, which wrapped up on Thursday, was met by North Korea with various demonstrations of its nuclear capabilities. North Korea unveiled a series of new nuclear-capable weapons, from submarine-launched cruise missiles (SLCM) to nuclear torpedoes.

As North Korea ratchets up its nuclear threat by developing a variety of launch vehicles to neutralize South Korea and the US’ extended deterrence, tensions on the Korean Peninsula and the arms race are growing exceedingly precarious.

In response to the Freedom Shield drill held from March 13 to March 23, North Korea unveiled several new strategic weapons. Starting with an SLCM on March 12, it claimed to have launched and detonated a short-range ballistic missile (SRBM) and a cruise missile in the air, 600-800 meters above its target, on March 19 and March 22.

The aerial detonation of nuclear warheads is intended to maximize the kill radius; the atomic bomb dropped on Hiroshima during World War II had a blast altitude of 570 meters.

On March 21-23, North Korea claimed that it conducted underwater explosion tests on an “unmanned underwater nuclear attack craft,” which appears to be an underwater drone-type nuclear torpedo.

https://english.hani.co.kr/arti/english_edition/english_editorials/10853...

Nothing is going to "neutralize US extended deterrence." This is a straw man. North Korea is trying to neutralize the US-ROK conventional threat which is far superior to their own, with threats of a nuclear response.

Kim Jong-tae referred to US strategic bombers sent to the Korean peninsula as "spectacle" more than anything else, because they were obsolete in terms of the modern battlefield anywhere else. They are provocative that's about it. Their presence is eliciting the very responses that they purportedly deter.

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語必忠信 行必正直

And it will be okay if that land is polluted with depleted uranium? That is of course if NATO is deliberating giving the shells to ensure the lands conquered by the Russians have been poisoned. I am only a Certified CNN Armchair Warrior of Rank Major, but one strength, maybe thee strength is that the rounds can penetrate armor. One pundit opined that one rarely sees tank on tank engagements as that is old war tactics. The Russians in particular use stand off weapons like tank fire, missiles, artillery shells, thermo-rockets, drones, fire from helicopters/jets., etc to take Ukrainian armor at a distance.

It looks like the tanks are the new next-in-line wonder weapon which will turn the war against Russia.

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@MrWebster

introducing DU onto the battlefield, via UK poodles, desensitizes the news
consuming public to accept the idea of "safe nukes".
As in the tactical nukes which O'bomber developed for just such occasions.

Pretty sure the RF has anticipated this eventual development and has plans
for a response. Our brain-dead leaders care not about the human or
environmental consequences. It's all about showing who's boss.

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and thanks for bringing this subject front and center. War is just so anti environment. Two older friends of mine have recently shared stories of their service related illnesses. Both 'nam and both agent orange. Here we (and THEY- the 'namese) are still dealing with this 40 plus years later. Millions of lives ruined with toxic weaponry. And now the DU. Birth defects, cancer, etc. The Russkies have been wise enough to shelve their inventory of DU out of concern for their own infantrymen. May we have the decency to come to our senses and do the same someday.... Not holding my breathe.

The garden was be you ti full yesterday. I split wood just outside the fence for a few hours. The maple syrup operation that I help support had 14 55 gallon drums of finished product as of last night. I hauled 4 gallons up to Bryant Lake Bowl (Minneapolis hipster dining and bowling) for the enjoyment of their customers. I split wood but stayed out of the garden. Too muddy still. But soon. So soon. Sand Hill cranes have returned. Eagles are on the nest. Snow geese and Canada geese.
Why oh why do we have to ruin all of this. I bet rural Ukraine is a beautiful as any country boy would want to see. Fertile fields. Waterfowl. Do they have wild turkey? Pheasants? Quail? Maybe chukar?
Come on humanity. We can do better. Quit shi##ing in your own garden.

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@wouldsman "Control the food, and you control the world." It has been a war tactic since forever.
No telling what harm to the food chain all those unexploded bombs still around in Laos and Cambodia. Places you are not safe to walk, much less farm.
I remember a guide educating our tour about the potato's importance in Poland. Since Poland is flat, and invaders could sweep it from any direction, including the sea coast, that the invaders made it a point to run their armies over crops. The one crop that survived the horses' hooves was potatoes.
Now, it is permanent, or at the very least, long term soil contamination. The US didn't hesitate to ruin Japan's soil, or Viet Nam's, and they do not give a shit if Russians starve en masse.
Excuse me. I gotta go wave a flag for a few minutes.

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"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981

earthling1's picture

@wouldsman
and environment are two words never used in the same sentence (I sort of broke them up here).
I've not heard much more about the Hawaiian water table poisoned by the US Navy.
Memory holed.
A local base, Camp Boneville, has been closed for decades, but the hazardous waste and chemical saturation of the soil is still rampant and seeping deeper into the ground.
The Army has pawned it off to the City of Vancouver for free, wheee! to develop into a park.
Us taxpayers get to pay for the cleanup.
DU is the new Agent Orange.
And now, mystery spikes in cancer with Airmen and ground crews servicing the aircraft.
Pathetic.

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Neither Russia nor China is our enemy.
Neither Iran nor Venezuela are threatening America.
Cuba is a dead horse, stop beating it.

earthling1's picture

@earthling1
On edit.

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Neither Russia nor China is our enemy.
Neither Iran nor Venezuela are threatening America.
Cuba is a dead horse, stop beating it.

@earthling1

Hope it works better than the 'super-funs' we have here.
Military, industry and other major polluters just poop and fly.
Leave the mess for the rest of us to clean up.

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mhagle's picture

But anyway.

Grim conversation . . . destroying the soil and all.

Here is a video that is exciting IMO. Big ag done right (without the greed factor).

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Marilyn

"Make dirt, not war." eyo

earthling1's picture

@mhagle
and can't stream.
But will watch it tomorrow when I get back to civilization.
Thanks for posting it. I always want to see better gardens and homes. Heh.

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Neither Russia nor China is our enemy.
Neither Iran nor Venezuela are threatening America.
Cuba is a dead horse, stop beating it.

mhagle's picture

@earthling1

Their greenhouses are amazing. And they grow crops in the desert. And naturally, they are sharing this information with other countries like Egypt and Saudi Arabia.

We could learn much from China. Xi got his start as a farmer. In the early 90s, he was part of a delegation that came to Iowa. He stayed with a farm family in Iowa and they still keep in touch. I really admire him.

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Marilyn

"Make dirt, not war." eyo

@mhagle Marilyn, thanks for sharing that video. I like that they are growing non traditionally colored tomatoes in China. Mostly in America everyone wants a perfectly red tomato. I like the yellow red striated ones the best. When you see yellow in tomatoes it indicates high levels of carotene.
The tomatoes that I grow are part of a breeding project bringing old heirloom variety benefits back into modern tomatoes. The breeder uses my garden as a test plot for his work. You can see lots more about the variety on a FB page called 'Frogsleap Farm'. Do a search and include "tomato" in the search or you might end up at a winery page.

Interesting to know that about Xi- his farm background. And his trip to Iowa. I think communist countries (whether currently so or in the past) have learned some solid lessons about food sovereignty. USSR had the Holmodor. China had its famine during the Mao years. Cuba had great challenges when sanctions went into effect. Venezuela has struggled under sanctions. (At a recent report back of peace activists) VZ visitors shared that VZ is now producing 96% of their own food.
When I see the kinds of operations in the US, like the one in your video, I assume the worst. Capitalists trying to squeeze out another penny of profits. When I see it in anti imperialist countries I assume the best. Anti imperialists trying to squeeze out another calorie for the needs of the masses. Here is too hoping that viewpoint is accurate. Cheers.

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mhagle's picture

@wouldsman

I watched another video recently that talked about how food security is a big issue for China. A year ago or so, I saw a video that talked about Cuba becoming resilient. They grow food everywhere. On rooftops, in vacant lots. Also, they started using oxen in farming again.

It seems that communism has evolved into something mostly lovely. Xi says that the most important thing in life is to take care of the people. Wow. No one says that here, except maybe for Bernie who is so limited in his influence.

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Marilyn

"Make dirt, not war." eyo

Cassiodorus's picture

-- appears to be about less and less the longer it drags on. I am reminded, as I've said before, of the Aesop fable of the man who killed the goose who laid the golden eggs. Douglas Macgregor thought, last I heard, that the Russians were waiting for the mud beneath Ukraine to harden (basically, summertime) before they begin the offensive that will end Ukraine as a nation-state. I can't find the link. I guess such an invasion is supposed to coincide with some point at which the US government runs out of ammunition with which it can feed the war.

Meanwhile, Jeffrey Sonnenfeld has been telling everyone that the Russian economy is on the verge of collapse because all of the companies are leaving. Thing is, he's been saying this since July of last year, and there's been very little movement in the war, though there's apparently been a lot of death. How much death is also a matter of great dispute.

There's lots of information fog out there now.

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"But in America particularly, a deep worry is now consciously gnawing the ruling class—they can see it, feel it: that the American Empire is on its last legs, close to collapse."-- Simplicius

https://sputniknews.com/20230328/chris-busby-europe-may-face-cancer-birt...

Chris Busby: Europe May Face Cancer, Birth Defects Akin to Fallujah if Kiev Uses Depleted Uranium

The use of uranium ammunition pushed by the UK will cause irreversible harm to the health of the military and civilian population of Ukraine and beyond, the Russian Defense Ministry has warned. Dr Chris Busby, the scientific secretary of the European Committee on Radiation Risk, told Sputnik that Moscow's fears are completely justified.

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