Explain it like I'm five
Submitted by bondibox on Sun, 08/21/2022 - 6:32pm
FYI—Student debt cancelation isn’t paid for by the taxpayers, the federal government is the lender.
It’s costlier for the government to hold on to the debt.
— Nina Turner (@ninaturner) August 21, 2022
WHAT?
Comments
I believe I understand
But you can't explain that in a tweet.
It IS paid by the taxpayer but it doesn't have to be. It can be retired by the Fed in the exact same way the Fed monetizes treasuries now.
As for the costlier comment it depends on whether she means that interest rates will keep rising, thus seeing the bonds behind the debt fall in value. Or that the debt holding back economic growth potential. Both could be true
That's all I've got
Well that's a start...
But cancelling the debt doesn't cancel the bonds, does it? Cause now we're back to G W Bush's "Worthless IOU's" statement. The federal government is the guarantor of those bonds, and if they say the people they loaned the money to have defaulted and now the bonds don't have to be repaid ... that would destroy "the full faith and credit" of the U.S. government.
“He may not have gotten the words out but the thoughts were great.”
@bondibox no it wouldn't.
no it wouldn't.
Ask her to explain it.
Tax payers always pay. That means, the middle class. Rich have legal tax loop holes, poor don't pay taxes, it is always we middle class. Always.
Just like we will be saddled with the new inflation fighting bill costs.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
"the poor don't pay taxes"?
How do I say it? Oh, that's a myth. The poor pay their landlord's property taxes. The poor pay sales taxes. Gig workers pay SE tax. (double FICA) Car registration "fees" are a tax. Walk to work? Then pay gas tax. Your phone and water bills have a long list of taxes. In the 90s when I made $20 - 23k I paid 22% just off of my 1040 (the same as Bill Clinton) In 1982, when I was a student making $10k working part time to cover rent I don't remember what I paid, but I remember that it was twice as much as I paid in 81 on the same income thanks to Reagan's "tax cut".
"Middle class" liberals look down at the poor, shaking their heads at how "they don't understand that Social Security is so good for them". In 82 I made $10,000 and paid $1500 just in SE taxes. Try it sometime and see if you can get to 65.
On to Biden since 1973
I was referring to
federal income taxes.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Then you are only referring to a subset of the poor
"welfare recipients" who are in reality a smaller group than most people think, and retirees who live on nothing but Social Security, who are a much larger group than people think. Sorry to come on so harshly, I just took the chance to point that out. Mostly I was ranting about FICA, especially the SE tax, which killed me when I was working poor. Now that I am in my mid 60s and disabled I have received already far more than I paid in SE taxes, but I will also never get back all that I had to do without thanks to that same SE tax.
On to Biden since 1973
And as long as I'm at it
another of my peeves is the myth that "the buyer pays corporate taxes". The price of everything is set by "the sweet spot" - the highest price that the seller can charge before he loses more money from loss of sales than he gains from excessive pricing. And a corollary to that is the myth that competition lowers prices - your competitor will always raise his price rather than you lower yours. (though taxes may lower the sweet spot on, say, luxury cars, lower sales on luxury cars may raise the amount available to spend on cheaper cars, thus raising the sweet spot on them) Low corporate taxes do nothing but raise consumption, which may raise total tax revenue, but only at a terrible social and ecological cost.
On to Biden since 1973
Discussing corporate taxes in this context
...has been misleading the financially uneducated American People for more than a century.
The concept of Taxes should be set aside to the very end of this discussion, if by some rare miracle, the corporation declares taxable income.
Taxes do not come into the business equation and taxes are only paid on the purest of extreme excess profits. Taxes are NOT calculated on the multibillion dollar corporate revenues that are quoted to drive up stock prices.
From the total corporate revenues all expenses are deducted FIRST — all costs for production, all costs for labor (including the $32 million pad to the CEO) and business expenses and overhead, and rents, all perks, parties, entertainment, insurance, marketing, travel, company cars, airplanes, retreats, decor, obscene bonuses, kickbacks, donations, advertising, plus investments in the name of the corporation, all expansions to the size of the business, increases in supplies on hand, virtual depreciation of corporate-owned properties, fixtures, furniture, factories, and equipment. And procurement of other businesses. Plus all planed dividends paid to shareholders.
AFTER ALL THAT is deducted from corporate income/revenues, what is left is money the corporations could not think of a way to spend because it had already splurged on everything the corporation could possible need or want. What is left is excess money the corporation took in — (which could be considered wage-theft in some circles). This is what is taxed — at the lowest rates in history, Those taxes charged do not negatively affect the business, does not affect the cost of the product to the consumer, or anything else connected to the corporation. It is a windfall.
Let's all get on the same page.
IMAGINE if you woke up the day after a US Presidential Election and headlines around the the world blared, "The Majority of Americans Refused to Vote in US Presidential Election! What Does this Mean?"
You've said it better than I could
thanks
On to Biden since 1973
minor quibble
Not deductible for federal income tax purposes.
be well and have a good one
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
The Poor Always Pay More for Everything
My esteemed Senator, and Medicare Fraudster, Rick Scott wants everyone to pay at least $1.00 in income tax. What a joke. It would probably cost the governent at least $10.00 to collect this tax and would cost the poor person close to $100.00 because they would have to go to Jackson-Hewitt, located in most Walmart Stores to have their taxes done.
For a five year old mind
should be included in primary education texts.
Cut taxes for the rich (who can afford said taxes)
make the rest of us (who can least afford it) pay.
Is corruption even mentioned in primary indoctrination?
Maybe about the 'bad guys' de jour, but here? No, never happens.
Shucks.