@lotlizard

be well and have a good one

edit, changed hody to howdy

so clearly it’s all good as far as our U.S. government and political class is concerned.

https://english.khamenei.ir/news/2171/Legion-of-Merit-awarded-to-the-one...

@ban nock

though I'm not convinced that there is any certainty as to Malaysia Air in that the forces attacking the people of Donetsk had the exact same BUK SAMs. The case of Iran Air 655 is different, however, as the ships own equipment confirmed civilian as did another vessels captain who said he was astounded when the Vincennes announced it was going to attack what was obviously a civilian aircraft. There are also other reasons to believe that it was intentional. There is the fact that the Captain perjured himself as to most of the relevant details, such as his ship's position, the planes position and path, it's altitude, and other things, which is something of a tell, as is the fact that he was well beyond the duty station he had been assigned.

We will never know, though for the captain there was no downside, and he got a medal for it, so it is hard to say there is no upside. Remember, we considered Iran an enemy at the time, and ever since, and were supporting and supplying it's then enemy Iraq.

be well and have a good one

Things with aircraft happen real fast. Often it's one person's decision, often very hastily made. The list of aircraft shot down in areas of conflict is very long, I copied and pasted a couple of the large civilian aircraft shot down. Wiki has a long list. No one would think either the Soviet Union, nor their proxy army in Donetsk nor the US would purposefully shoot down an airliner full of civilians. There is no upside.

I once took a flight from BKK to Phnom Phen which is very few miles and normally such a short flight would be mostly taking off and landing. At the time there were no routes by land open. The aircraft took off to altitude then descended in very tight circles right down into Phnom Phen worried about the very meager AA of the Khmer Rouge which was mostly just 50 cal, no heat seeking rockets but I guess one never knows..

Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 was a regularly scheduled flight from Amsterdam Airport Schiphol, Netherlands to Kuala Lumpur International Airport, Malaysia. On 17 July 2014, the Boeing 777-200ER (registered 9M-MRD) operating the flight was hit by a Soviet-made Buk surface-to-air missile fired by pro-Russian Donetsk separatists. All 283 passengers and 15 crew were killed, including 80 children. The Joint Investigation Team claimed the missile was operated by Russian-backed rebels near Donetsk, Ukraine during the Battle in Shakhtarsk Raion.[55] Russian President Vladimir Putin denied accusations of Russian involvement.[56] At the time, the shootdown was Ukraine's deadliest aviation disaster and the deadliest aviation disaster involving the Boeing 777.[57]

And most remember Korean Air Lines Flight 007 was a Korean Air Lines Boeing 747 civilian airliner shot down by a Soviet Air Force Sukhoi Su-15TM interceptor on 1 September 1983, near Moneron Island just west of Sakhalin Island, after it strayed into Soviet airspace. 269 passengers and crew, including US congressman Larry McDonald, were aboard KAL 007; there were no survivors. An official investigation concluded that the course deviation was likely caused by pilot error in configuring the air navigation system.[30

@dystopian

Thanks for reminding us of this war crime EL. It is another one of the "U.S. Liberty" type events that we just don't get reminded of enough. It was inexcusable. It is a war crime that no amount of 'whatabouthimism's can justify.

There is lots of evidence the Malaysia 17 shoot down was by the Ukranians, not the Russians or the separatists. It has just been ignored by the tribunal which was jury-rigged. Just like the findings of Assad using gas, Saddam having WMD and Al-Quaeda connections, Gulf of Tonkin, The Maine, etc, ad. infinitum.

thanks!