Russia Defaulted on its Debt
for the first time in a hundred years. Russia claims to have tried but the US and England have tightened the embargo on finance.
Russia still has $600 billion in gold and foreign currency, half in Russia and half unavailable outside the country. I think the international community should use the $300 billion they have to work on rebuilding Ukraine.
This kind of ruins Russia's credit rating for years. Russia was a poor country before the war. They mostly exported oil and gas. Oh, and G7 agreed on some sort of cap on what they will pay for Russian petro to keep Russia from profiting from it's war pushing up the price of oil.
Other than Russia making small territorial gains it's hard to say how the war is going. One would think that eventually the modern weapons Ukraine is receiving from the free world would give Ukraine an advantage, but who knows. Russia is using a lot of conventional artillery.
Today Russia used one of it's remaining accurate weapons, a missle, to hit a shopping area, what value that has I don't know.
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/russian-forces-turn-sights-lysychan...
Comments
So we should give them the Venezuela treatment
They could have paid off the debt easily, even after we stole $300 billion, but we blocked them from access to the financial system.
It's ironic that we feel it's ok to decide what to do with someone else's money, even after Afghanis starve by the thousands because of the billions we stole from them.
As for deciding how much we will pay for Russian gas and oil, that's not how capitalism works. What'll happen is India and China will buy Russian energy at a discount and then resell it to Europe at full price.
@gjohnsit We give them much worse
We give them much worse than the Venezuela treatment. We use economics to punish them for murdering tens of thousands and destroying multiple cities. When we are in a conflict with someone, and we have their money, we keep it. Yes we kept taliban money, they reneged on the peace agreement. We take yachts, we take bank accounts, we ought to just start arresting oligarchs but all of them have already left Russia anyway.
When Russia leaves Ukraine, we can consider what they should do for reparations, depending they might get some back, or maybe not.
Re:
Where is our economic punishment for destroying multiple cities and killing hundreds of thousands of people? We've done far worse than Russia (go ahead and challenge me on this, if you dare).
Hold that!! Who says we are in a conflict with Russia? Has there been a AUMF passed in Congress? Has Russia attacked a NATO member? Exactly what sort of conflict are you talking about?
This is important. You need to explain this.
Under what laws? Exactly what banking law did Russia break? What American law did Russia break?
If you can't name the law then this is theft.
We invaded their nation, killed tens of thousands of civilians, committed countless war crimes, and now we are causing a famine that will kill thousands of children. Who is the bigger criminal? What is the moral thing to do here?
So we are the world cop that tells other people what to do, while not living/acting by those same standards. Gee, do you think that might cause some resentment?
@gjohnsit I have little time
I have little time for ridiculousness. If you posed one nutty question I might reply but the wholesale crazy is too much. I work and have a life.
Theft is okay when we do it right?
I find it curious that Russia has oligarchs that have no say in their government whilst we only have billionaires who tell our government what they want them to do. Yeah Russian oligarchs once has a say in how things went, but that was right after the USSR collapsed and Clinton and his billionaire friends were robbing Russia blind until Putin put a stop to their thievery.
Yeah because we refused the payment that they made
If you owed the bank money and you paid it back, but they refused to take it would you accept being told that you are in default?
Good grief man. America owes $30 trillion and if anyone thinks that we have any intentions of paying it off needs to get their head examined. All this is going to do is make more countries run away from the US dollar. It’s already happening.
and they aren't real popular
You mean after decades of anti-Russia propaganda
people have a negative opinion of Russia?
You don't say?
@gjohnsit No actually people had
No actually people had a pretty good opinion of Russia. Look at the chart. Things took a dive when Russia started murdering Chechens, and Georgians, Russians, and now Ukrainians. Russia isn't much in the news until they invaded Ukraine in 14 to take part of the country, and now attempted to take the whole thing.
Your chart doesn't cover that
Your chart starts at 2007. The Chechen wars started in the 1990's.
And like I said, there's been anti-Russia propaganda since long before I was born. It never stopped.
No small coincidence - Russia has always refused to bow down to the West.
All that propaganda was not affecting tourism...
"Tourism in Russia has seen rapid growth since the late Soviet times, first domestic tourism and then international tourism as well. Rich cultural heritage and natural variety place Russia among the most popular tourist destinations in the world. Not including Crimea, the country contains 23 UNESCO World Heritage Sites, while many more are on UNESCO's tentative lists.[1]
Major tourist routes in Russia include a travel around the Golden Ring of ancient cities, cruises on the big rivers including the Volga, and long journeys on the Trans-Siberian Railway. Diverse regions and ethnic cultures of Russia offer different foods and souvenirs, and show a great variety of traditions, including Russian Maslenitsa, Tatar Sabantuy, or Siberian shamanist rituals. In 2013, Russia was visited by 33 million tourists, making it the ninth-most visited country in the world and the seventh-most visited in Europe.[2]"
"Russia has always refused to bow to the West". What do you mean by this? Look at all the US based companies that Russia welcomed into its economy that have now been forced to flee. Look at all the science that was shared between the two countries that is now is jeopardy. Russia hasn't even begun to see the effects of Putin's antiquated quest for dominionism in eastern Europe.
Here's a surprise.... people don't like rulers who turn neighboring countries into wastelands of devastation and despair. At least most people don't. Why do you think the US is so hated in the world? Putin has thrown us a cover gift.
But hey, we forced him to do it- right?
"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin
@Fishtroller 02
there's Russia's refusal to adhere to Napoleon's continental system. The Crimean war. Bolshevism. The entire Cold War. Do I need to go on?
right. It isn't like NATO has ringed Russia with military bases.
Putin didn't need to invade Ukraine. But if you think surrounding Russia with military bases pointing missiles at them isn't going to make them paranoid then you don't understand Russia
@gjohnsit Chart in my
Chart in my comments below. Year by year popularity of Russia as quantified by Pew.
And their popularity has taken a dive
I guess they polled all the large economies that are also democracies. The countries where Russia was most liked have seen the largest declines. I know it's all a big conspiracy, and everyone in the world has somehow been hoodwinked with propaganda and lies and what not. And some beared blogger posting from a coffee shop in Poland has the true unvarnished true story, but still.
@ban nock It isn't that the entire
It isn't that the entire world has fallen victim to propaganda. Just the western alliance, all of who show up in your poll. What about the other 80% of the global population? How does China feel about Russia right now? Considering that America has made it clear that if we can topple Ru then we are coming for them next? And India? How might they feel? Considering they are getting Ru crude at 72$ per barrel while the west is paying nearly double? I bet they like their friendly neighbor.
And African nations that are about to get hit with famine due to western sanctions?
Russia is awash in cash right now. All of the western sanctions have just been one big shooting oneself in the foot party. Is there a new analogy to be made? Fish in a barrel shooting themselves in the foot? The more we sanction Ru the more commodity prices rise. The more commodity prices rise the better off commodity producing countries (Ru) are going to do. One day America will beg Russia to pay off these debts that they surely can afford to pay. Ru will just tell them "as soon as the sanctions are removed".
@wouldsman Hard to say how people
Hard to say how people in a dictatorship think, remember, I lived in China. They have pretty strict censorship, and a few million in concentration camps.
Everyone loves cheap oil, and anyone buying from Russia can demand a discount. Because Russia can't sell it's oil for full price. There's an embargo.
Did you visit Xinjiang when you were in China?
What proof do you have for the comment: "a few million in concentration camps"? I have been studying China since the early 1990's and I can categorically state you are completely wrong.
What is the purpose of this propaganda PSYOP about China you are spreading here?
STOP spreading the propaganda! Here's more information about the Uighur's for you:
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMV77NV2JNc]
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y30SZSSzXRk]
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ve4cwf458k4]
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKhIUfuPdo4]
Great stuff!
n/t
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Russia has more than doubled earnings
from oil and gas sales despite giving 'discounts' to friendly countries like India and China (so they don't suffer as much as the G7).
Think of it this way: Seriously.
The best chance for your own personal survival, is knowing the underlying facts in this situation. You have fully digested the official narratives and the opinions of others — but these have left you with no sign of defensive strategy or advanced intelligence, and none of the factual constraints that come with foreknowledge.
Not one of the parties involved are completely free to act. Find out why that is. Learn how to recognize which events on the horizon are going to significally affect your life over the next few months. Show yourself the respect you deserve. Learn the exact chronology of the decisive events that led — step-by-step — to the war you have been witnessing. In doing so, you will realize that there are specific dangers coming your way. With an informed mind, you will be able to analyze, accurately, what you are observing, and you will be able to anticipate approaching dangers long before the people around you do. You will discover actions you can take along the way to avert danger. Now, trust yourself. Opportunities to protect yourself and those you care for will present themselves — while they still remain available.
The following recitation of factual events can be an immense resource for those who would control their own destiny.
Main presentation begins at 10:54
@Pluto's Republic Rest of the world is
Rest of the world is uninformed and only conspiracy theorists know the truth? Na, I'll stay ignorant thanks.
HAH!
At least you’re aware and honest about it!
Staying Ignorant, I mean.
Let us know how that works out for you
Ya got to be a Spirit, cain't be no Ghost. . .
Explain Bldg #7. . . still waiting. . .
If you’ve ever wondered whether you would have complied in 1930’s Germany,
Now you know. . .
sign at protest march
Mearsheimer was spot on regarding the Israel lobby in the US
https://www.amazon.com/Israel-Lobby-U-S-Foreign-Policy/dp/0374531501
But this statement is pretty weak...."He argues that the crisis is largely the result of the West’s efforts to turn Ukraine into a Western bulwark on Russia’s border. Russian leaders viewed that outcome as an existential threat that had to be thwarted. While Vladimir Putin is certainly responsible for invading Ukraine and for Russia’s conduct in the war, Prof. Mearsheimer states that he does not believe Putin is an expansionist bent on creating a greater Russia."
Russia has been just as interfering world wide as the US, particularly in the cyber world. The fact that the US and other countries were trying to nudge Ukraine towards aligning with the west is no different than Russia threatening Norway etc. against it. Or the heavy influence that Israel wages on our government to favor Israel. Ukraine is a sovereign country If it chooses a side, that is their right. And for Mearsheimer to wave away concern over Russia's expansionist yearnings after Crimea and now Ukraine, when that's just downright three monkeys stuff.
"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin
Just a nudge huh?
Let’s just forget about Obama’s brutal coup in Ukraine in 2014 where his Nazi pals burned people alive because they weren’t in favor of the coup. I find it weird that people refuse to see how Ukraine has been killing its own citizens in the Donbas for the last 8 years and even though Zelensky won the election with over 70% of the vote because he promised to uphold the Minsk amendment. Instead over 40,000 Ukrainians have been killed since the agreement was signed. When he tried to tell the Nazis that we have been training and arming since the coup they told him to shut up or they would kill him. Plenty of mainstream media have written about that as well as the Nazi problem there. Lots of people have provided you with links that back this up, but apparently you just ignored them.
As for Ukraine having the right to let NATO put missiles in Ukraine no it doesn’t. They had treaties with Russia on that and Russia insists they be upheld.
America would not tolerate Russia overthrowing Mexico's government and giving them weapons to that could threaten its security so why should Russia have to allow it? If you don’t see how that’s a threat to them you are being willfully blind to it.
Cyber attacks? Can you link one that says Russia did it or are you talking about the DNC computer hack Hillary blamed on Russia? If so it never happened and the head of crowdstrike admitted it to Adam Schiff during a hearing in 2017, but Schiff kept lying about it until the proof was released.
This is a NATO proxy war with Russia and we have boots on the ground inside Ukraine. Biden lied when he said he wouldn’t do it and once again there is going to be a huge buildup of troops in Europe that they are doing which threatens Russia’s security. We should be in the streets over this, but instead most people have drunk the anti Russia koolaid they’ve been fed since Hillary lost. Sad that people know the government and media mouthpieces lies to them about why we must march off to war, but believe that this time is different. Democrats have been manufacturing consent for war against Russia and republicans have been playing along because the defense industries demand that they do.
Edit for clarity.
You forgot to throw in the kitchen sink.
"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin
No clouds in your sky?
Once again refusing to debate facts and just a pithy remark. I guess that’s all you can do when you are wrong about things over and over. If you don’t bother to read responses you will remain ignorant.
All you have got in your bag is insults.
and arrogant claims of always being "right". So all you will get is responses from those who agree with you. It's a small world after all.
"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin
Why don’t you tell me what I’ve gotten wrong then?
Do you deny that we overthrew Ukraine’s government in 2014 and selected a president that would do our bidding?
Do you deny that Ukraine has been killing ethnic Russians in the Donbas since then?
Do you deny that there are some nasty Nazis embedded in Ukraine’s military and that they have our support?
Do you deny that putting NATO forces in countries surrounding Russia for the last 3 decades is a threat to their security? They’ve been doing that LONG before Russia went into Ukraine.
I am trying to get you to debate the facts, but instead you ignore what you want and pretend that you are a victim of people not playing nice with you. I’m not trying to be arrogant as you say and I have no problem being wrong as I often am. You post stuff you think is right and when others debate your facts you refuse to address them like you are now.
Or are you still waiting for the kitchen sink? How was that helpful?
Do I deny....do I deny..... do I deny...
I'm not on a witness stand here. AND, in case you didn't read it carefully, I told you that you would get responses only from those who agree with you. Or maybe those who have the patience to wallow through all the tons of "facts" you throw at them all in one big narrative. That's not me either.
Oh, I noticed that you and your friend are doing your little loud whispering about me in the hallways. It's so childish. You expect me to respect your postings when you pull that stuff?
"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin
Good lord
Just say that you can’t refute the facts then instead of giving non answers like you did here again.
I’m not whispering. I’m calling out your refusal to debate the facts that you keep ignoring and that your opinions are based on propaganda and manufactured consent for hating Putin/Russia and for the NATO buildup instead of seeing how that is pushing the world towards nuclear war. Ukraine will not win this conflict even though we’ve been arming them for 8 years and throwing billions at them which mostly goes to the defense companies. The more weapons sent to Ukraine the longer this goes on and more people from both sides die. And Ukraine loses anyway and it’s all for what?
The facts surrounding Crimea and its Russian population
...are even more compelling. But, in the end, I do not believe that informing Americans about their foreign wars is a good idea at all. I don't know how others here see it, but this is merely a tiny forum where we often discuss the elaborate historical and logistic details of world events, as we see it. We are not out recruiting participants. There is no reason to push the information we discuss upon others. The things we say will not change anything, Nor will it change the outcome of domestic elections.
In the many years I've been involved in geopolitics, I have never found it to be a topic worth discussing with most Americans. The geographical isolation of the US is a powerful force. It protects most Americans from the wrenching harshness of self-reflection. I have always been openly envious of this protection, which doesn't extend to me. It never has. In the US, domestic politics is the ticket! Political Party talk is always hot. That's where the energy is and where the media is focused. Thankfully, US domestic politics doesn't seem to stun and horrify the majority of Americans.
But it's not all fun and games for them, either. God knows, the challenges in the US are seriously daunting and intensifying, and I think Americans are feeling pretty stressed out about about it. I can't prove it, but I have a hunch that Americans, in their collective awareness, sense they cannot vote their way out of the political diminishing of their rights and wellbeing. And no one is going to rescue them if they are swallowed by the misery.
Ukraine is basically a featured event in the War of the Month Club that excites the "Russia Russia Russia" lobe of the American brain. In other US forums that I visit, I read the nuance-free reactions of outrage as a healthy form of stress relief. The commenters clearly feel some sense of empowerment or control over the events in Ukraine, a political control they do not feel when they face the rise of the American Taliban at home.
I say, let them savor the trembling righteousness of their inner warrior — as they hand over the last of this years' budget for infrastructure, climate mitigation, and Covid-related health care and social relief. They passed that $40 billion to the Military Industrial Complex, who promise the American people they will supply Ukraine with the weapons they need to continue fighting and dying for their freedom to host a NATO strike force on the Russian border — to be installed after they finish executing the population the ethnic Russian speakers who live in the area and pose a security threat to NATO. (I would never post this reality in the forums I visit.) I understand how much they know about the situation and what they are feeling — I generally pass along the reminder that this, too, shall pass.
And it will pass. Sooner than we think. No point in bringing up the fact that an identical proxy war is shaping up in China, with Taiwan playing the part of Ukraine. If Americans are truly blessed, they may never see it coming.
Yep….
Democrats told their own big lie about the Russia stolen 2016 election even though HerHeinous got 3 million more votes than Trump and too many people swallowed it hook, line and sinker and even after Mueller said that there was no evidence of Trump working with Russia people still believe he did. Democrats even dragged Mueller in front of them to clarify that he found no evidence and yet people still believe everything democrats told them. There’s that Goebbells line on propaganda…tell a big enough lie over and over and eventually people will believe it.
Democrats rode Trump’s buttocks for 2 years about his China xenophobia, but soon they will have to start manufacturing consent for war because they are pushing Taiwan into an attempt to break away from China. And I’m betting that those who were once against the China xenophobia will just forget about it and do what is expected of them. We’ve seen it happen time and time again.
Shitlibs are cheering that NATO is increasing its troop size in Europe instead of being horrified that it could lead to nuclear war. But it’s exciting their anti Russia lobes as you said so nicely.
Shitlibs are only anti war when it’s republican presidents doing them. Obama lied about Libya and Syria just like Bush lied about Iraq and Afghanistan. And gosh darn it we couldn’t leave Afghanistan because of the women and children, but they don’t seem to have a problem with Biden starving those same women and children or leaving them with no money for earthquake recovery. Hell it’s hardly been covered on the media.
Americans should be telling Biden to try for peace with Russia because this time if war breaks out I doubt that our distance from Russia is going to be much good. Some insane and evil congress members think that we can just use smaller nuclear weapons and it won’t end life on earth. I don’t think we should take the chance, but they aren’t listening to me.
Obviously Putin is terrified by the actions of the US and it's
poodles!
Another Zelensky Lie Debunked!
I know you want to stay ignorant so please ignore this:
Regardless of the path in life I chose, I realize it's always forward, never straight.
seems like the collateral damage was caused
by the Russian missile that destroyed a munitions warehouse located nearby.
Another stash of western supplied ordinance "hidden" in a residential area.
Zelensky lied and people died. The theme of this dirty little war.
question everything
Not so...
It was an asphalt factory. The mall received a direct hit. Sometimes having tons of security cameras in an area is beneficial. The Russians targeted the mall. The rest of their claims about the incident are false. Watch the video.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ukraine-news-video-debunk-russia-lies-missi...
"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin
Just when I thought that conversations on C99
were moving away from the rancor, we see commenters accusing those they disagree with of being "ignorant".
This serves no one, particularly this "community".
Make your arguments, provide your evidence, take your stands, but please cut out the name calling.
"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin
He said it himself
thereby opening the door.
Regardless of the path in life I chose, I realize it's always forward, never straight.
Oh, well that makes it OK!
"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin
Just when
I get to feeling like I’m
the dumbest rock in the box
I get tumbled right
Out of the box
Brilliant!
Ya got to be a Spirit, cain't be no Ghost. . .
Explain Bldg #7. . . still waiting. . .
If you’ve ever wondered whether you would have complied in 1930’s Germany,
Now you know. . .
sign at protest march
Another joke post
From @ban nock
Thanks!
“We may not be able to change the system, but we can make the system irrelevant in our lives and in the lives of those around us.”—John Beckett
So Russia didn't need to invade Ukraine, but it's OK
to do so because .... why, exactly? NATO has missiles pointed at his country?
It looks to me like Putin is proving to the world that NATO's concerns about Russia are justified. He is the aggressor. He attacked a sovereign country in an obscenely horrible manner, which continues daily. And now it appears that NATO's potential expansion is simply self defense.
He is quite ruthless, not only towards other countries, but towards his own people. His "strategic thinking" however, in terms of Ukraine, etc. is revealing that he actually is pretty dumb.
I feel sad for the Russian people. They will pay for this for generations.
"Without the right to offend, freedom of speech does not exist." Taslima Nasrin
Sure it is
What is your excuse for NATO expansion on to Russia’s borders for decades before Russia went into Ukraine? Gawd nothing like fixing the facts to suit your narrative.
Self defense? Good lord.
Your comment shows
an appalling lack of the historical background about was has occurred in Ukraine since it's government was overthrown by the US government in 2014!
Here's part of that answer:
The US installed government of Ukraine had become an existential threat to Russia. The Russian people realize this. Putin enjoys the support 83% of the Russian population.
Have you ever studied Russian history at all or are you just making suppositions from the current plethora of propaganda from western media?
Fish is being fed the ‘facts' she’s repeating
It’s easier for her to do that than actually learn what this conflict is about. It wouldn’t be hard for her to do since we have been putting them in front of her. I gave her this same information but she complained that I didn’t give her a kitchen sink for some reason.
Gonzalo's take is interesting...
Russian Default Hurts The West—Not Russia 9.5 min
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrTjdW_3U1M]
Just like the western sanctions backfired...
“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”
The NYT
headline yesterday read, "Russia appears to have defaulted on debt payment for the fist time since 1918".
I am not a subscriber and couldn't read their dribble, but got enough from the headline that they did not say more than it merely appears to be fact, but not reported as fact.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
After the dissolution of the USSR
Russia took over the repayment of ALL the lend-lease payments to the US and other western nations that had accrued to the various ex-Soviet countries from WWII.
The following shows that Russia, under Putin, has been one of the most fiscally responsible countries in the world (another is China under Xi!).
The US, with a long and sordid history of outright theft of many foreign nation's wealth, is now attempting to create a false default of Russia's foreign debt.