Would the Person who Deleted Hillary's Emails -- Please Stand Up
Back on Sep 23, 2015, cbsnews.com reported that Hillary Clinton had deleted about half of her Secretary of State emails, because they were "personal" in nature.
Clinton turned over about half of the 60 thousand emails that were on her server, after telling the State Department that the emails she deleted -- about 30,000 -- were personal.
Wow 30,000 emails of the personal variety (or 50% of them). THAT's a lot of "goofing off" at work!
But you know, "Hillary Knows How to Get Stuff Done!"™
You see, Hillary had had a 20-minute news conference to explain what the meaning of "personal" is. And why SHE went to such pains to make that determination (30,000 times).
Clinton: It ‘might have been smarter’ to use a State Dept. e-mail account
by Anne Gearan and Philip Rucker, washingtonpost.com -- March 10, 2015
[...]
In her 20-minute news conference, Clinton said she had deleted e-mails that she believed were “within the scope of my personal privacy” — including, she said, correspondence about daughter Chelsea’s wedding, her mother Dorothy’s funeral, her yoga routines and family vacations. [That's a LOT of Vacations!]Clinton defended having made herself the arbiter of which e-mails to keep for archival purposes and which to delete.
“For any government employee, it is that government employee’s responsibility to determine what’s personal and what’s work-related,” Clinton said. She added, “No one wants their personal e-mails made public, and I think most people understand that and respect that privacy . . . I had no reason to save them.”
SOOO, Hillary is the Decider -- and the "Deleter" in Chief ...
Aah, wait a second, check that -- it really was Hillary's Lawyers who were the Deciders -- and the real Deleters. Hillary went for a long, long jog, instead of getting in their way that weekend ...
Clinton Says She Let Lawyers Decide Whether Emails Were Work or Personal
by Laura Meckler, wsj.com -- Sept. 27, 2015
Former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said Sunday that she didn’t personally review her emails to determine which related to work and which were personal before turning them over to the State Department, but relied on her attorneys to make the proper determinations.
Asked on NBC whether it was possible that work-related emails were wrongly deleted from her personal server, she replied that the process was “exhaustive” but that she didn’t personally participate.
“I didn’t look at them,” she said. “I wanted them to be as clear in their process as possible. I didn’t want to be looking over their shoulder. If they thought it was work-related, it would go to the State Department. If not, then it would not.”
[...]
"I know nothing! I see nothing!" ... that's Lawyer stuff, don't you know.
And this just in today, the Clinton legal team, has just geared up with some heavy-weight DC-connected Attorney, in order to protect the rights of her "editorial/deletion" staff ... whoever they might be ...
Clinton aides unite on FBI legal strategy
by Rachael Bade, politico.com -- 04/01/16
[...]
The united front suggests they plan to tell investigators the same story — although legal experts say the joint strategy presents its own risks, should the interests of the four aides begin to diverge as the probe moves ahead.The quartet includes Clinton’s former chief of staff Cheryl Mills, who counseled Clinton politically and legally; deputy chief of staff Jake Sullivan, whom sources say authored a number of emails to Clinton that are now considered “top secret”; Heather Samuelson, Mills’ deputy who initially sorted Clinton’s work-related emails from personal messages that were then deleted; and Reines, who served as Clinton’s spokesman and also used personal email for work purposes at State.
Now, that's what you call circling the wagons, getting your ducks in a row, and presenting a united front -- all rolled up into one.
Notice that sole Clinton staffer Heather Samuelson, who is being tagged with the Email sort-and-purge operation, today. Funny that, considering that Samuelson was only the "bit-player" (ie the Helper) in the deletion operation, according to more detailed reports last fall:
Meet the Clinton insider who screened Hillary's emails
by Rachael Bade, politico.com -- 09/04/2015
[...]
But Clinton-related sources said that Kendall and Mills, not Samuelson, ultimately made the determinations about which emails should be preserved before Clinton decided to delete the rest.
[...]On Thursday, Mills testified that employees for Denver-based IT firm Platte River Networks — which housed Clinton's server until the FBI took hold of it — initially pulled emails off the server and sent them to Clinton's legal team. Samuelson did the initial sift through of the documents, pulling ones she thought were federal records. In that regard, she initially determined which should be preserved -- though Kendall and Mills ultimately signed off on what Clinton sent State.
Clinton deleted the rest of her emails from her computer, wiping it clean.
Well, not "clean" enough apparently ... dang those NSA tech-guys ... eh Hillary?
The most intriguing thing about the FBI recovering Hillary Clinton's deleted emails
by Natasha Bertrand, businessinsider.com -- Sep. 23, 2015
The FBI has been able to recover deleted emails from former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton's personal server, a source close to the investigation told Bloomberg.
And intriguingly, agents sifting through the emails Clinton said were "personal" in nature have reportedly handed some over to investigators -- indicating that they are relevant in at least some way to the FBI's ongoing investigation.
[...]
SOOO, those mysteriously deleted emails "by no one/everyone" (except HRC) -- were NOT all of the "personal" variety afterall.
Ooops! Their bad.
So far, with respect to, those deleted/undeleted, work/personal emails:
22 Hillary Clinton Emails Dubbed Top Secret, according to NPR
Wonder who is going to take the ultimate blame for Hillary's Record-system of "convenience"?
Any virtual Wagers, anyone ... on who's gonna end up paying the price for this non-FOIAble, non-official System of Clinton's?
Bueller? Anyone?
Comments
I confess
I deleted Hillary's emails.
I had a little bit too much to drink one night and decided, "Hey, why not delete some of Hillary's emails."
Maybe it wasn't the right thing to do, but I had a lot of fun doing it.
LOL
No!
I was the mystery Deleter! It was me. (... maybe)
Thanks for the great laugh, gjohnsit. You Spartacus rabble-rousing you.
Oh, please... It was I... Antonio...
who deleted the Emails of my paramour... the lovely and talented Hillary...
You simply do not know her passion as she chafed under the yoke of marriage to that philander... she ached for true romance and I, Antonio, was only too happy to oblige for a modest fee...
You see, in those emails she and I... well, I am not a gentleman to kiss and tell... but suffice to say that we spent many a pleasant hour while she regaled me with what she would rather be doing than covering for that Obama man, who was not half the man that she truly deserved...
Sincerly,
Antonio, Gentleman Companion.
I do not pretend I know what I do not know.
Well, that would explain
20 emails a day average (see downthread).
Stay on track. Stay in lane. Don't throw rocks.
Don't be a coward
Step forward for the good of the country, Roger Clinton!!!!
GradySeasons
"The nightlife ain't no good life, but it's my life."
Thanks for the update
There is no greater victory than beating the Third Way.
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
yw dkmich
that is my hope,
that the Thirdway and the DNC,
go the way of the DINO-saurs.
Bill Clinton?
...
Gëzuar!!
from a reasonably stable genius.
Well,
Bill was quite busy making the international SOS rounds,
speaking everywhere to insure all that "personal" loot made it to the coffers.
Still, he might of had the Server password: 2EZOughtBaLaw
Tidbit from Politico
Thank for this diary. Seems to me the tidbit that Reines also used personal e-mail for work, is an extra problem for Hillary. It means that they have to treat the offenses the same to some extent. You can imagine, if they are going to decline to prosecute Clinton because her behavior "doesn't rise to the criminal level", as a matter of prosecutorial discretion, then they will have to lower their standard for Reines as well, and that might lower the standard of the investigation too much for the players, thus compelling them to indict Clinton as well. Just a thought.
GradySeasons
"The nightlife ain't no good life, but it's my life."
The thing is...
It wasn't just one person.
Sure, I can go through my Thunderbird account on my computer and delete crap.
But this would take organization and people.
Gëzuar!!
from a reasonably stable genius.
how many emails is that per day?
she was Secretary of State for 4 years, January 20th 2009 to February 1 2013. So that's 1473 days. 30,000 personal emails would be 20 per day. Although you figure she had other emails on other servers. But let's say 20 emails a day about Chelsea's wedding and her vacations.
I dunno. That seems like a lot. It's not a totally crazy number and I understand she knows a lot of people but I can see why some people don't believe it. And, frankly, I didn't know until I read this diary that she deleted half of what was on there. I thought it was like 5%.
I know, Right?
I occasionally write a personal email from work, even though it's frowned upon, "and only allowed on breaks".
That amounts to 1 or 2 emails per Month, tops!
I cannot fathom how 50% of my emails could be of the "personal" variety,
unless I was running some quid-pro-quo donation generating operation on the side. Hmmm?
thanks for the math calcs, Shahryar
Sorry, but that's really not a lot
for anyone whose social life is mostly run through email.
I have currently just over 50,500 emails on my server, from the last 6 years. I have no idea how many I've deleted in that time, tons. Most of the remaining ones are not work-related because I archive work-related email with much more alacrity than I do personal email; the latter just hangs around until I go on a big deletion binge. I'm a horrible pack rat. Most of this email does not take a lot of time to handle, because I just read it, I don't reply to it. But I do reply probably to at least 20 a day, most of which are short, but a couple tend to be longish -- I have a far-flung network of friends. I spend probably an hour to 1.5 hours a day on email. It used to be more; I am less involved now.
"Personal" isn't just individual exchanges with family members and friends, it's also small email groups of friends who talk about all sorts of stuff among each other. It's email lists from my makerspace, various activism groups, local politics, a couple of book groups, notifications from Twitter and other social media, and from various blogs and forums I am interested in. My Twitter notifications alone from today are more than 50. (And I am not popular, I just had a little fun with Bernie hashtags.)
And I have nowhere the volume of social connection HRC must have. So, no, this does not strike me as a lot. It covers a period of 4 years, right? Actually, that seems quite low. I am guessing she is not subscribed to a lot of hobby email lists, but she is bound to have a lot more back-and-forth about arranging events and thank you notes and the like.
I am so glad you are following up on this!
I think Benghazi has made people wary of yet another foolish Clinton scandal.
But This email business has legs.
I can't wrap my head around an attorney who would click the delete button. WTF????
Attorneys ADVISE. They don't TAMPER WITH EVIDENCE.
God Almighty, I tell my clients to use snail mail and NEVER send me emails which, under certain circumstances, can be revealed to the opposition, unless it is information they do not consider harmful to their case!
I am a solo practitioner in Texas, state level, not federal, with an office in a town of 800 people (unless my neighbor's mother in law died), and I take these precautions.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
in my post earlier today
user Euterpe2 explained there are very strong "legal reasons" for them NOT to do this:
I keep meaning to check to see how many emails
I have still in my main account to see how it compares to 30,000+ personal emails in four years.
To accumulate that many emails in four years, at least 21 needed to be sent/received every single day including weekends and holidays. I do not know about anyone else, but I do not know near enough people to receive that many personal emails.
Meanwhile, thanks for the update. I have a few questions (as always).
Did the people who were making the decisions about what was work related have the necessary clearances to read anything that was on the SOS's computer? How is it that it was okay for these people to read personal eails when HRC claims a right to privacy?
A question that keeps bugging me but may have no relevance at all is why was the server set up in the NY house rather than the DC house? I have not seen anything mentioned about this and am just curious.
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.--Aristotle
If there is no struggle there is no progress.--Frederick Douglass
good questions
not sure if her staff has "security clearance" of not,
but that would seem very unlikely for her Lawyers to have.
Of course, the way the story keeps changing,
I expect them to say soon: "That those Emails deleted themselves"
... you know like how those cones, all arranged themselves on the GW Bridge, in New Jersey.
It's one of those paradoxical mysteries.
Seems like a strange job for lawyers.
I wonder what the "guidelines were in order to determine what was personal and what was work-related. With so many emails to go through, I wonder if they just used key words to do a search and then delete anything that had those words. For example, they could search using "yoga" as a key word and just delete anything without reading it that contained that word. Not being a really trusting person myself, I can see sentences in an email that contain both yoga and Benghazi?
LOL I sure wish my emails could monitor themselves. It would save me a lot of work.
Has anyone checked the White House lawn lately for crop circles?
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.--Aristotle
If there is no struggle there is no progress.--Frederick Douglass
thank you, thank you, that's what I kept thinking
"Did the people who were making the decisions about what was work related have the necessary clearances ..."
I can only speculate,
But based on having the same level of clearance myself, once (TS/SCI), I would say, "Highly unlikely".
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
I'm a bit skeptical about this whole e-mail thing.
It would be interesting if there was something there, but it appears that it may turn out to be a whole lot of nothing. Sure, Hillary doesn't do herself any favors acting like she has something to hide. It could be something embarrassing, something that could be used against her during the election, or maybe evidence of criminal activity.
Well,
you can bet the GOP won't treat it
like a whole lot of nothing, in the upcoming General Election,
assuming HRC gets the gig.
Of course. Those folks suffer from Hillary Derangement Syndrome.
And they'll throw everything at her, true or not, at her in the GE. My only issue is getting into a right-wing manufactured conspiracy.
It would be nice if there was something juicy in those e-mails, though.
I wonder, what's the difference...
Between "Hillary Derangement Syndrome"
and
"REALLY don't like lying, cheating, say anything, superPAC funded, Foundation Abusing, Censoring, and Warmongering people"
The answer of course is, whether or not you're on TOP.
I do not pretend I know what I do not know.
I'm talkin about what goes the right.
Whitewater, Vince Foster, Travelgate, Benghazi, etc.
I don't wanna obsess about these e-mails like rabid conservatives obsess about Hillary.
If there is something there that reveals something (most likely evidence of influence peddling), then great. It'll reveal the kind of person we perceive her to be.
At this point...
considering how Hillary and her defenders like to scream about them in order to show "Proof" that every valid attack is in fact "A Vast Right Wing Conspiracy" to destroy her and Bill personally...
I ain't ruling anything out.
True Irony would be if those Emails proved that Bill and Hillary in fact had Vince Foster killed in order to cover up the secret Whitewater deals to finance a shady travel deal in Libya, which necessitated a second cover up by enabling an attack on the embassy in order to take out the last witnesses.
See, I can have a sense of humor too!
I do not pretend I know what I do not know.
That would make a conspiracy theorist's day.
If you can find that kind of smoking gun within the e-mails, it would be a conspiracy theorist's wet dream and a Clintonista's worst nightmare. Clinton supporters would look like real assholes.
Imagine if they found an e-mail to Bill from Hill that states, "If we can't over come Sanders, we'll deal with him like we did with Vince Foster."
Picture this
What about the picture of Bill on the grassy knoll?
well
it's the Clinton Foundation "work" -- that goes above and beyond the normal duties of Secretary of State:
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/emails-suggest-hillary-helped-clinton-...
http://www.judicialwatch.org/press-room/press-releases/judicial-watch-ju...
And there's this, from user veganmark:
Those things qualify as "more". To me anyways.
What would be the point
Of there being dot gov email if people working for the government weren't required to use it?
Stay on track. Stay in lane. Don't throw rocks.
Their point is
to keep Clinton Foundation correspondence out of the Public Eye,
and the SOS "business" far from any Freedom of Information requests.
I understand
My point was that if using this server was optional, there would be no point in its existing. People could just have 27 different gmail addresses like the rest of us. I am making an oblique argument against Clinton's believing she had any choice in the matter.
Stay on track. Stay in lane. Don't throw rocks.
Double post.
Conflict of Interest is the BIG worry - not security IMHO
The fact she recommended to President Obama that we involve ourselves in the Libyan situation knowing that a personal friend had business interests there that would be affected positively in a fiduciary sense by such a intervention...these are things that non secure emails could reveal.
And unlike Rosemary Woods' gap whose 17 minutes are gone forever...emails and other digital bits have a habit of hanging around in the strangest places.
FEEL THE BERN: "But such is the irresistible nature of truth, that all it asks, and all it wants, is the liberty of appearing." - Thomas Paine
"Here I Stand, I can do no other." - Attributed to Martin Luther, 1521
It is strange that categories of people
are behaving badly.
Staffers. Check.
It. Check.
Lawyers. Check.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Yep
SOS International Outreach
Check!
(dang that confusing Reply/Add link)
Nixon did nothing
He just deleted some personal tape recordings, so he didn't resign. The Watergate Committee said, OK, whatever. So Gerald Ford had a couple terms, and Republican Presidents ever since. The Supremes.. well, no abortions, and segregated schools, just as Gawd intended.
Yep
SOS International Outreach
Check!
When
the Laws no longer apply
those breaking them -- have officially jumped some shark somewhere.
If only the sharks, would catch on,
like they did in the journalism-matters days of Nixon.
This is Fridge Nuking quality...
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Arib8uWMWsM]
The Person doing it, not even understanding WHY it's incredibly idiotic.
I do not pretend I know what I do not know.
thanks dmw
Hadn't seen that before.
Kind of feels like the rough couple of days, I had last week.
lol
It's notorious.
Effectively killed the Indiana Jones Franchise.
And there had been some GREAT stuff outside of the movies...
The "Young Indiana Jones Chronicles" were incredibly well done, and Ford had even appeared in them.
Then they pulled this.
In the whole time this was happening, the huge amounts of set up, etc... you'd think ONE person would have said. "Uh, Sir, this is a really, stupid idea for a movie scene..."
I do not pretend I know what I do not know.
She's in deep
This thing has legs and tentacles, in spades.
I hope this ends up
every bit as ugly for Hillary as it appears it should.
Thanks, jamess, excellent as always!
couldn't happen
to a more deserving Status quo, Say Anything,
power-grabber.
Question
Do HRC's lawyers have security clearance? There was supposed to be classified information on that server, right, or am I just confused?
Good question, Winglioness
I doubt the HRC brain-trust thought of it,
before they played the Sgt Schultz Lawyers-did-it Card.
Cue dated security clearances...
with suspiciously wet ink.
I do not pretend I know what I do not know.
.
http://www.politico.com/story/2015/08/hillary-clinton-lawyer-top-secret-...
Stay on track. Stay in lane. Don't throw rocks.
thanks, so Kendal had a security clearance
but what of the lady who actually read all the emails, one of the gang of four
I'm increasingly suspicious
That there is much fiction here. Why, I can't guess. But there is too much that doesn't make sense.
Stay on track. Stay in lane. Don't throw rocks.
When the story keeps changing...
I know my kids are bullshitting.
So, parental gut reaction?
Ok, this is bullshit, Hillary. Just tell me what you did, and stop trying to pretend you're smarter than me.
I do not pretend I know what I do not know.
Sorry, at first I read that
he had just a TS...but later he says also an SCI clearance. Missed that. Later still it points out that
Or Hillary's basement.
"I’m a human being, first and foremost, and as such I’m for whoever and whatever benefits humanity as a whole.” —Malcolm X
And these normally high-paid lawyers
sat around a computer reading emails with their cups of coffee and donuts? This is all beginning to sound like a really bad novel...with a worse sequel.
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.--Aristotle
If there is no struggle there is no progress.--Frederick Douglass
a really bad novel...with a worse sequel
that was a typical made-for-TV movie. And this might turn out to be one. Shorter in TV-time than the Watergate Hearings, but equally popcorn drama. Watch for tidbit dropping.
Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.
Wonder who network execs
will bribe to play the parts. Will the campaign figure in as a side story? Will the movie have to be watched in fast forward to cover almost two years of investigations? Will Kissinger make a cameo appearance. Stay tuned!
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.--Aristotle
If there is no struggle there is no progress.--Frederick Douglass
i'm not sure i believe any of the official stories
i used to do doc review, and often 200 emails a day was about the pace you could read emails (with attachments).
i sat in a huge room with 50 - 100 attorneys/lawyers/paralegals
60,000 emails (30,000 released, 30,000 deleted) divided by 200 = 300 work days
one person for 300 days, or 30 people for two weeks, or even four people for two months - JUST doing doc review ... to sort HRC emails, all with security clearances?
who actually did the grunt work of reading all those emails is what gnaws at me (being a grunt myself)
I wondered that as well...
How do you review 30,000 emails unless you're doing it in bulk? And if you're doing that, you're not reviewing it at all.
What I don't get, though, is why would you even say you deleted that many? What's the point?
That's a good question
Stay on track. Stay in lane. Don't throw rocks.
What do you bet the deletes involve the Foundation payola?
I mean, really, four years and she and Bill aren't colluding in concert?
Improve the Resilience Resource Library by adding your links.
Vote Smart - Just the Facts - 40,000 politicians by name or zipcode
Bingo!
that kind of history, under the guise of the Secretary of State,
would be worth deleting.
And probably very easy to identify too -- 30,000 times.
The elephant in the room
“How the Obama State Department waived hundreds of ethical conflicts that allowed the Clintons and their businesses to accept money from foreign entities and corporations seeking influence boggles the mind."
Yo Hill! AB just saved your sorry ass from the grey bar hotel!
It was SPAM!
Now that would believable!
AB'd email you his address so you can send your generous appreciation consideration, but you might delete it. So instead AB'll send it by USPS, Registered, Return Receipt Requested. (You know, so there aren't any slip-ups.)
CU on the Vineyard, Babe.
Luv,
AB
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I was pondering the many accounts of who read the emails
First it was Hillary, then it was her aides, then it was her aides with the lawyers and finally she settled on her attorneys.
Who ever it was, outside of being completely HRC, did not have clearance to read TOP SECRET, which they had to when they determined the email was personal or work related.
It's no wonder she settled on her Attorneys, Attorney/Client privilege. IANAL, this takes care of Hillary, but as Officers of the Court; if her Attorneys read the emails and deleted some, them and the Associates who read them could be in trouble for knowingly committing a crime.
Either way, she has either lied to the FBI, the State Department or to Congress.
Just my opinion and I would like to be corrected where I am wrong.
That's why
I wrote this piece -- to document all the different versions of the story.
It seems they finally landed on the "shield" of Attorney-Client privilege (which casts incredulity on the prior versions).
But you raise some very good questions Crucian, which I hope the FBI takes seriously.
Those were public records, belonging to the State Dept National Archives.
Unless her lawyers were sworn representatives of the State, I doubt they had the "legal standing" to do what they did
ie. destroy public records -- as the recovery operation, has been showing.
Clinton's 'damn' emails!
Clinton's experience is that of a very savvy lawyer, who's dodged political bullets for 2.5 decades. Her original sin, foregoing a state.gov email account in favor of a private, Chappaqua-based one begs the question: How did she get away with it and why would she need it? I think her explanation was that she couldn't use her Blackberry, so crickets. Huh? What kind of splaining is that? It's as bad as "I took $347,000 from Goldman Sachs because that's what they offered." Wasn't State suspicious when none of the Hillary documents were found during FOIA requests from journalists? This stinks and a little berdie tells me that commingling top secret emails with plans for Chelsea's wedding has something to do with the Clinton Foundation and foreign governments.
There's this
from upthread,
from user veganmark:
Why would you use your SoS
Why would you use your SoS email to plan your daughter's wedding? Doesn't she have a gmail account for that crap? I have a work email and 5 personal emails. I manage to keep them straight with no cross over. I'm told Hillary is a very intelligent individual so how come she couldn't?
JerseyGirl