Indicting Roger Stone, Mueller Shows Link Between Trump Campaign and WikiLeaks
??what’s the grounds for this indictment? Hell, just call it ‘oppo research’ like the Clinton Creature does.
Indicting Roger Stone, Mueller Shows Link Between Trump Campaign and WikiLeaks
WASHINGTON — The special counsel, Robert S. Mueller III, revealed on Friday the most direct link yet between the Trump campaign’s and WikiLeaks’ parallel efforts to use Democratic Party material stolen by Russians to damage the election campaign of Hillary Clinton.
In an indictment unsealed Friday, the special counsel disclosed evidence that a top campaign official in 2016 dispatched Roger J. Stone, a longtime adviser to President Trump, to get information from WikiLeaks about the thousands of hacked Democratic emails. The effort began well after it was widely reported that Russian intelligence operatives were behind the theft, which was part of Moscow’s broad campaign to sabotage the 2016 president election.
The indictment makes no mention of whether Mr. Trump played a role in the coordination, though Mr. Mueller did leave a curious clue about how high in the campaign the effort reached: A senior campaign official “was directed” by an unnamed person to contact Mr. Stone about additional WikiLeaks releases that might damage the Clinton campaign, according to the court document.
Mr. Stone was charged with seven counts, including obstruction of an official proceeding, making false statements and witness tampering. Mr. Mueller did not say that Mr. Stone’s interactions with WikiLeaks were illegal, nor that the Trump campaign engaged in a criminal conspiracy with the organization.
F.B.I. agents arrested Mr. Stone before dawn, appearing at his Fort Lauderdale, Fla., home with ballistic vests and guns drawn. Agents typically use those tactics as a precaution to secure possible evidence and protect themselves in case a suspect fights arrest. Prosecutors sealed details of the case because they feared that public disclosure would increase the risk of Mr. Stone fleeing or destroying or tampering with evidence, according to court documents.
*
The indictment is the first in months by Mr. Mueller, who is investigating Russia’s interference in the 2016 election and possible coordination with Trump campaign associates. Citing details in emails and other forms of communications, the indictment suggested that Mr. Trump’s campaign knew about additional stolen emails before they were released and asked Mr. Stone to find out about them.
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/25/us/politics/roger-stone-trump-mueller...
I don’t see a’crime’ here. Does this mean that ANYONE asking questions about the Clinton Creature or the Dims sneaky underhanded acts they might have pulled off is a criminal? It’s fine for them to gin up a coup to hijack an election or a presidential administration, but anyone who exposed or tried to expose those liars is a criminal?
This country is screwed.
EDIT: forgot link to indictment
https://int.nyt.com/data/documenthelper/586-roger-stone-indictment/d34c7...
Comments
They're really stretching
From the article:
Translation: They ain't got nothing.
What Stone is being charged with are "process crimes": interfering with an investigation, lying to the FBI.
I'm not a fan of Bill Clinton, but this is the same tactic the Republicans used with him. Getting a BJ from Monica was not illegal. Lying under oath about it was.
"Don't go back to sleep ... Don't go back to sleep ... Don't go back to sleep."
~Rumi
"If you want revolution, be it."
~Caitlin Johnstone
But it’s all BS. Stone had nothing to do with
the Clinton Creature’s emails getting out. But they need someone to prosecute for it because the plan is to demonize anyone who might have let the cat out of the bag and to ensure no one gets down to what the emails SAID.
No one EVER talks about that.
I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks
Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa
On occasion
I've tried to point that out in discussions on FB, by describing the contents of the emails, which are available for anyone to read at the Wikileaks website.
The response is: "Those are Russian talking points! You're a Russian troll!"
"Don't go back to sleep ... Don't go back to sleep ... Don't go back to sleep."
~Rumi
"If you want revolution, be it."
~Caitlin Johnstone
Not meaning to be an arrogant jerk BUT
if I wanted intelligent conversation, that’s the last place I’d go.
I have an account. I have no personal info posted and rarely look at it. I do post if I run across any derogatory but truthful stuff about Fuckerburg or other propaganda.
Oh shit! Do you think they might have ME pegged as one of those dirty Rooskies, do ya?
I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks
Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa
Facebook is a strange place (or thing?)
that's for sure. I rarely post anything personal, and no photos of myself. My avatar pic is my cat.
(One of the people who said I was a Russian troll found that amusing. They went to my FB page, saw the cat pics and the cat-related posts, and said "At least the Russians have a sense of humor!" I swear I'm not making this up.)
Anyway, the main value of FB for me is keeping in contact with extended family and friends. During the 2016 election, local and regional Bernie groups used it for various purposes. It sure helped me to understand firsthand what Correct the Record and its ilk are all about.
For the 2020 season, I'm not sure what my involvement on Facebook will be. It can really wear on one's spirit, being immersed in the ignorance and depravities of the American psyche.
"Don't go back to sleep ... Don't go back to sleep ... Don't go back to sleep."
~Rumi
"If you want revolution, be it."
~Caitlin Johnstone
Well, we can see first
hand what people are posting on facebook.
Mass insanity.
dfarrah
@Amanda Matthews You bet! A year
You bet! A year ago I discovered I'd been banned from Facebook. My crime was not using it and occasionally bitching about it in my very rare posts. I am way into Linux and the free software movement https://www.fsf.org/ and devices that don't track you. -- Cheers
Do not let the plutocrats divide us!
Exactly
Which is why THIS makes NO sense:
Why would he have to "get" the information from WikiLeaks when WikiLeaks made the emails public for everyone to read?
Also, maybe these idiots need a remedial lesson in the English language. WikiLeaks is called WikiLeaks for a reason. It's not WikiHacked.
There is always Music amongst the trees in the Garden, but our hearts must be very quiet to hear it. ~ Minnie Aumonier
This started as a spat between two aging political celebrities.
You find some clues on this page:
https://stonecoldtruth.com/roger-stone-corsi-statement-devoid-of-logic/
Also Stone has a newsfeed, devoted to himself that offers insight. He's been waiting for over a year to be arrested or indicted. For this arbiter of "the fashionable man," it could be the jewel in his crown.
https://stonecoldtruth.com/news/
Basically, Corsi and Stone were dueling in the media about who had the best contacts and the most insider sources to the Russian Hoax. (Alex Jones figures into some of this.) This all took place on their blogs and on the radio back in 2016. (Hint: Neither one has a clue about the transfer of documents to Wikileaks.) It's all quite silly. I'm surprised Mueller would mess around with either of them.
[edit = corrected link]
____________________
The political system is what it is because the People are who they are. — Plato
What people are forgetting is that Wikileaks was telling us
that they had Hillary's emails and were going to be releasing them soon. So wouldn't that mean that people knew what was going to happen?
And just like I thought, Mueller has to make shit up to continue with this farce. The emails were not stolen from the DNC computers. The only people who said that they were was CrowdStrike, a private company who wouldn't let the FBI look at the DNC computers. The FBI did not get a warrant or try other means to do so. So all Mueller has to base his report on about this is CrowdStrike whose owner is very anti Putin.
This happened after Trump told Russia to do that right? You know when he said, "Russia if you find Hillary's missing emails let us know." This was after congress found out that she deleted 30,000 of them after they told her to turn them into them.
One report I've seen on this is that Stone told someone to go to visit Assange in the Ecuadorian embassy. If this happened then I'm sure that Mueller has proof right? Or maybe that's what Manafort was doing when he visited Assange 3 times although there is no evidence of him doing that either.
Marcy Wheeler thinks that person was Gates. Why? Hell if I know how she came up with this.
This country is screwed. So many people are saying things that are totally and blatantly false and no one calls them on it. The kos kids are notorious for doing that. I'll see an article quoted that states the morning sky was blue and the wind was calm and the diarist states that it was a dark and stormy night. And then the echo chamber repeats it.
BTW. Sweden had definite proof of Assange sexually assaulting two women, he was charged with rape and other false crap and no one calls the person who wrote that out. I know.. I should quit reading there, but it's like driving by an accident. You can't help but look at it.
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.
And you leave there thinking PT Barnum
was the all-time master of understatement and subtlety. And he vastly underestimated the timing of those births.
I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks
Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa
Ha
He sure did didn't he? People there immediately fell for the Russian propaganda after Her lost. I'm still wondering if anyone else had blamed their loss on Russia what they would be thinking about it? Romney, McCain or even Bernie. I'm sure that they would see it for what it is. But what ticks me off is that Mueller is lying about what actually happened and he is making stuff up that never did. And the kos kids are saying that he has integrity and toes the line and ... when the truth is he is as bent as they come!
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.
What really upsets me are his methods
He looks for some incident, real OR imagined, and starts prying. It doesn’t even have to be related to RUSSIAN!!! Actually it never does, does it? Mueller questions people and Lord help them if they mix up a day or a date. He then starts his foul blackmail scheme of “I’ll Indict you for (fill in the blank) unless...” That’s Star Chamber bullshit right there. Manafort should be grateful that they didn’t Gitmo his sleazy crooked ass.
I am so surprised that so many people don’t understand and refuse to see that these ‘interviews’ are a set-up? There has to have evidence of a crime before you start tearing lives, or in this case, the country, apart. And they are ignoring the bigger crimes involving Obama, the Clinton Creature, the DNC, a number of really dishonest organizations and people, and the ‘intelligence’ community. Particularly that last one.
I really would like to know who devised this horrible scheme.
EDIT: fixed set-up
I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks
Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa
It's my understanding that Mueller's appointment was
illegal because as you said there wasn't a crime committed for him to investigate. Collusion is not a crime and that was the original charge of his investigation. The FBI illegally spied on his campaign after they had the U.K. spying on him first. But what did they actually find out before the FBI got involved? This is why Trump needs to release the declassified FISA warrants. Carter Page was supposedly the first person who they got a warrant on, but he wasn't involved with the Trump campaign at the time IIRC. Plus wasn't he working with the FBI to try to find something on Trump?
And since the FISA warrant to spy on Trump was gotten from using the Steele dossier that Hillary paid for every person that Mueller has charged has come from information that was obtained illegally. This is the fruit of the poisonous tree issue that usually gets cases thrown out.
I really would like to know who devised this horrible scheme.
I'm thinking it was Hillary, Obama, his justice department and the CIA and FBI that did it. The why was just in case he won.
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.
Mueller = fascism.
It is just that simple.
And people were in hysteria over Trump.
I can't believe that Sessions didn't start anything related to HRC and her law breaking.
The entire upper level of the FBI, CIA, etc., needs to be cleaned out.
dfarrah
This
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.
"material stolen by Russians"
Just heard an interview on NPR with a former Obama DOJ lawyer who stated as fact-
"material which we know was stolen by the Russians..."
This "lawyer", who must know better, went on to speak about the careful case Mueller has built showing the noncrime of "collusion".
None of this was challenged in any way by the NPR mouthpiece.
boy howdy.
"Truth lives all around me, but it's just beyond my grasp." -Country Joe
NPR has become a waste of time.
I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks
Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa
What people seem to lose track of
...is that Mueller's investigation exists only to cover up the real crimes that were actually committed during the 2016 elections. Those crimes pertain to the conspiracy to sabotage the 2016 election, launched by the Obama administration in order to assure Trump's defeat. It was a conspiracy that included the FBI, the DOJ, the West Wing, several heads of Intelligence agencies, and the State Department. I am amazed that they thought Hillary could win; and I'm amazed that their sabotage failed so spectacularly. I am also amazed that they actually believed the tripe in the Steele Dossier; such utter garbage spewed out of his UK operation. The Russian hustlers who came up with all those garbage stories made a lot of money from it. Wouldn't be a bit surprised if the Skripals were involved.
Hillary's loss left everyone very exposed. The conspirators must have been shocked to discover that there was no collusion between Trump and Russia. Then, the conspirators are left with the preposterous Steele Dossier they paid for. Thus began the hasty and exaggerated distortion of the Russian Hoax, for which Mueller is methodically going back and laying the groundwork. His pretend investigation is firmly rooted into modern statecraft as usual, since 1920, wherein nations tinker around the edges of each other's elections.
The obvious sad truth is that Mueller is busy uncovering and prosecuting miscellaneous old crimes that have absolutely nothing to do with Trump's alleged collusion with Russia. That's because there was no such collusion. So, Mueller toils away, weaving a messy and expensive web of innuendo and anti-climactic indictments that cause despair among the Democrats. Nothing will ever come of it and it; soon it will all be classified and forgotten. A cover-up gravestone that marks the burial spot of the constitutional crimes that took place.
There are plenty of people who know this. People throughout the government and media; people in governments all over the world, are aware of what took place. Even Donald Trump knows what happened, and he has the classified documents to prove it. As long as the American people remain clueless, it will just blow over. And perhaps that is just as well.
Very soon an economic disaster will be upon us, and it will take all of our energy to figure out who to blame for it. That's the next big thing. Make a plan, go local, get involved. Time better spent, I'd say.
____________________
The political system is what it is because the People are who they are. — Plato
I don't think anyone here has missed that, Pluto
Granted the Hillbots certainly did, but then they thought she would have been a great president just like Obama was. And not only Mueller is covering up the crimes of the Obama administration, but so is Huber who was supposed to be getting to the bottom of the bogus FBI investigation into Hillary's private email server. The IG report that came out last year showed how they protected her from prosecution.
You're right that Donald knows damn well that this is fake because he has the evidence that proves it. He was going to release it until he was told that if he did he would expose the fact that our allies in Britain were spying on him.
Stone wouldn't have been charged today for whatever reason if Mueller hadn't made this whole thing up. Anytime it's reported that the Russians hacked the DNC computers you know that everything else that follows is bogus.
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.
Certainly not the people that read here.
Although the investigations are so convoluted and psychotic that I get pulled in, as if it was a real thing.
Right about Huber. They have such contempt for the American people.
____________________
The political system is what it is because the People are who they are. — Plato
Does anyone else wonder about Steele
and what he’s up to now? We need to know did Steele outright lie, was he lied to, or both. I’m going with both. REGARDLESS, to be willing to join in a conspiracy to derail the campaign and administration of Trump is an act of hubris and corruption and I for one want to see that SOB tarred and feathered.
What will probably happen is he’ll get millions on a book deal.
I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks
Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa
Steele is being busy in court because he is being sued
for what he wrote about people either in his dossier or on websites. Then there's his connections to the Skripals and possibly why they were poisoned. Dad Skripal was apparently involved in the dossier and might have been going back on it.
Hillary's BFF Sydney Bluementhol told Steele a lot of the things in the dossier or he'd tell him who he should call for information about Trump. The Clintons were up to their eyeballs in creating it. This goes a tad bit further than opposition research don't you think?
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.
@Pluto's Republic I'm new here but ...
I'm new here but ...
You are saying stuff with great certainty and no supporting evidence. The very definition of echo-chamber, fake news. I thought caucus99 was supposed to have some rigor.
You may have lots of info that everyone on this thread seems to just know ... but I don't see any support for your arguments.
Do not let the plutocrats divide us!
A lot of the evidence to back Pluto up
has been posted here numerous times through the two years of this insanity of Russia Russia Russia Russia. Many people have been following this since it's creation and have posted many links and articles on it that shows that it was Hillary's people and the Obama administration and justice department that really are guilty of many things.
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.
Post-truth justice
The claim that the DNC emails were stolen by Russians is beyond the pale. There is no evidence of that. Yet it is at the crux of all of this. Crowdstrike's unsubstantiated extraordinary claim, for which they have no evidence. As Binney, Snowden, and McGovern have made clear, if it was a hack, it is easy to show us without showing us anything we should not see. They would have the hack. They don't because there was not one. They are still using the word even though they know that is not accurate. It is a grand con job by the biggest crooks and spooks of them all.
We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.
Look deep into nature, and then you will understand everything better.
both - Albert Einstein
Only Presidential candidates owned by enemies are criminal
This a response to the OP
The "hope" in my userid is for equal treatment under the law. American institutions are our only hope, and the only thing that makes us "great". The campaign behavior WAS criminal because they coordinated with our enemies to win. Yes that's illegal. There seems a skepticism about the Russia investigation on this site. It's a legitimate investigation that Trump brought on himself by firing Comey. That's not a deep-state conspiracy ... that's a logical consequence.
Trump's greatest evil is the demeaning and destruction of our institutions, whether they be the New York Times, the FBI, the 9th Circuit court of Appeals, or our local voter registrar.
I knew about his seedy Russia connections when I read a New Yorker article three years ago. https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/07/25/donald-trumps-ghostwriter-...
He won't share his taxes because they probably document all the oligarchs who loaned him money when banks wouldn't.
I read a good article that suggests that impeachment isn't really about removing from office, but about getting to the bottom of shady behavior (high crimes and misdemeanors). I was opposed to impeachment (since the Senate won't convict) but I see the point now. It is an INSTITUTIONAL method for figuring out the facts.
We are all losing faith in our institutions ... we have to save them though, not burn them down -- it's the criminals (Trump, PharmaBro, Milken, Cheney, Koch's) who want to burn them down so that they are not accountable for their crimes.
I really appreciate the discussion on this site ... there is honest give and take on opinions that are neither Republican nor Democrat. It gives me ... hope.
Do not let the plutocrats divide us!
Russia is our enemy?
I did not know that was the case in 2016. I remember Putin and Obama entered a treaty for reduction of nuclear arms.
I am quite certain Sec. of State Clinton did not approve our uranium sale to an enemy. Or her husband receiving $500k in speaking fees from an enemy.
I am quite certain Trump the Business Tycoon thought he could latch on to the capitalist train that roars through Russia.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
“There seems a skepticism about the Russia investigation on
this site”.Ya think?
What’s happening is people are sick of listening to straight up liars declare that we’re so damn stupid that 13 farking telemarketers made us not vote for the Clinton Creature. And anyone who supports that idea or any of the myriad offshoots it’s inspired can go pound sand. The minute it was found out that the Obama administration, the Clinton Creature and her campaign, the DNC, and the ‘intelligence’ community were the ones using fake info and lying on FISA court apps, the whole shooting match should have been shut down and a whole new investigation started. One against the fore-mentioned list of seditionists who tried to derail Trump’s campaign and when that went South, to really go for broke to discredit his administration and call him an agent of Putin, that he was acting under Putin’s orders. Basically calling him a traitor. And as we know, they used the Clinton Dossier to kick the whole scheme into gear. That is an attempt at a ‘soft’ coup. A usurpation of a duly elected ruler. This isn’t El Salvador, Chile, or Honduras. In this country, one who’s government is based on the premise that it exists “of the people, by the people, and for the people”, that was pure betrayal. We didn’t end up with Cheetolini because he was a “good” candidate and a swell guy. We ended up with Trump because the Dims choughed up that human hairball that is the Clinton Creature and thought she could possibly win. Not ANYTHING The Great Orange Menace did.
Yeah, there’s skepticism. Go figure.
I'm tired of this back-slapping "Isn't humanity neat?" bullshit. We're a virus with shoes, okay? That's all we are. - Bill Hicks
Politics is the entertainment branch of industry. - Frank Zappa
@Snoop -- It's about truth.
@Snoop -- It's about truth. From your comments I gather that you must like some of Trump's policies and so are frustrated that he is mired in non-stop scandal. I felt the same frustration that Bill Clinton couldn't do his job because he was impeached for lying about sex. I feel your pain, but Trump brought it on himself, just as BillC brought his troubles on HIMself.
There is overwhelming evidence that Trump is a corrupt, selfish man with the ethics of a mafia don and thus I think this is a case of unpleasant truth rather than a plan to get the President. Of course he'd have fewer enemies if he didn't treat everyone who isn't in his base with utter contempt.
How do I know if Steele is telling the truth? I have to read journalists. If I get alternate sites from caucus99 I will read them, but I still think that the big newspapers try to get the story correct -- they don't just make s--t up.
From the WaPo there is this:
Link is here:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/hero-or-hired-gun-how-a-british-...
I don't dispute Hillary took advantage of Steele to try to smear her opponent, but she didn't start him out, and the fact that she paid him doesn't automatically mean the stuff is wrong.
I dig your Zappa quote BTW. Frank was a very smart man and a great composer!
Do not let the plutocrats divide us!
Nope
You couldn't be more wrong about this. I despise Trump and his policies and what he is doing just as much as I do Obama and what that Empty Suit did to the country and us during his tenure.
If this was true then Mueller would have released the evidence that showed without a doubt that Trump colluded with Vlad to steal the election from Hillary. It's been two years already and the people who he has charged were said to have lied to him, congress or the FBI. Not one person is charged for working with Russia. Not one.
Manafort was charged for tax fraud and not registering as a foreign lobbyist, but Tony Podesta would be guilty of the same things if Mueller cared to look. Or maybe it's because the Clintons are protecting him.
You are making a lot of assumptions about what people here are saying without knowing the background of what this site has posted during this bogus investigation.
As for the Washington Post. This site is part of the propaganda show that Americans have been exposed to for far too long.
Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.