"But What about ISIS"? or ALL WAR IS A LIE

Most of the left, not to mention the right, are falling again for the false narratives, lies and propaganda coming from our government, the Trump regime, and the oligarchy owned and controlled media regarding the supposed ceasefire in Syria, agreements with Russia and Trump's decisions and actions in "fighting terrorism".

No wonder the antiwar movement is almost dead during a period of unprecedented war.

The latest example, a propaganda piece by the outlandish propaganda outlet the Washington Post, is that Trump "has decided to halt the CIA's covert programme to equip and train certain rebel groups fighting the government of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad, two US officials said, a move sought by Assad ally Russia."

First of all, this is being reported by one of the top propaganda outlets of the U.S. government and controlling oligarchy. It is purposeful propaganda meant to continue the false narratives of the fake war OF terror and the U.S. led war against Syria, which is not nor never has been a civil war, for God's sake. The number one reason to automatically dismiss it is that the war OF terror, this "crusade that is going to take awhile" started by Bush and the neocons after the false flag attack on 9/11, is a fraud. It is all a lie and all based on lies. The Washington Post article is a lie. ALL WAR IS A LIE.

(Notice the "rebel groups against Assad" thing, that is propaganda.)

There is no sense in dissecting it any further.

And secondly, who believes anything the government says about what the CIA does or doesn't do? Just because they say the CIA is going to stop aiding certain so called "rebel" groups, do you think the CIA is going to leave Syria and go on vacation, say, to Venezuela?

Washington Post, CIA, Trump, why believe this shit? They don't tell us the truth.

I know many on the left have been reminded repeatedly that ALL WAR IS A LIE, and many acknowledge that premise then turn around and discuss the actions taken by our government and presidents, like this supposed move by Trump, like he and they are actually making strategic moves and taking strategic actions against terrorism.

There is no fucking war on terrorism. That is all bullshit based on the lies of 9/11. It is a war OF terror being waged by the U.S. ruling class with a side of Great Zionist Israel throw in for good measure, against the rest of the world for power, wealth and control. Their stated goal is to create the New American Century (and Zionist Israel's to create Greater Israel), to make and maintain the U.S. as the sole "exceptional" nation on earth with the right to do anything it wants anywhere it wants. The terrorism has been created, manufactured, organized, funded, trained, staffed, armed, and moved like pieces on a chessboard by the U.S., Israel, Saudi Arabia, Qatar and others to be able to take down countries and governments for power, wealth and geopolitical controls.

The ruling classes of the world, led by our own, are playing the ultimate game for power and wealth using terrorism to justify their actions to the extremely ignorant and trained public. There is no progress, no rays of hope and everything the government and corporate media tell you is nothing but lies. Come on man, take George Carlin a little more literally will ya.

That said, what are we going to do about ISIS?

I remember years ago saying these exact same things at the democratic party Daily Kos blog, billed as a home for progressives. In the comments under the essay, someone asked that question, "but what are we going to do about ISIS?" Frankly I couldn't believe the stupidity but it continues Full Monty today. like you know undressed and straight at attention right in your fucking face.

Another example is this idea being floated for a mercenary army to take over from the U.S. military in the Afghanistan war, another completely fake and manufactured war for ruling class geopolitical purposes. After 16 years of war in Afghanistan, the longest war in U.S. history outside of the genocidal Indian wars and the concurrent war OF terror, it should be abundantly obvious that it is not about fighting terrorism, the Taliban, Al Qaeda, or ISIS, and that it's not about winning any fucking war. it's basically a de facto occupation of Afghanistan which is a vital area for the entire imperialist project.

I don't know, people like to keep it simple. I thought. K.I.S.S., keep it simple stupid. There are books for dummies on about everything. People like that. But somehow, ALL WAR IS A LIE, doesn't seem to penetrate the frontal lobe for the war OF terror like it might with other wars. The nebulous act of terrorism combined with the continued false flags by our governments along with the constant media brainwashing keeps the people, including the vast majority of the left, unable to find the necessary clarity to totally reject it.

Donald Trump, like Obama before him, based his entire foreign policy wad on the war OF terror and ISIS (Al Qaeda with Obama). That proved early in his presidential run, not that proof was needed, that he was just as much a deceiver and liar as Obama and Clinton, just as in on the inside secret that is the war OF terror and 9/11, and fully in on the scam. He's not that stupid, he knows exactly what the deal is with the war OF terror and did when he was running for president. His focus on ISIS proves it. Crediting him with anything to me is nuts. He's on their side, he is one of them. None of these fuckers should be credited with anything except mass murder and immoral and cruel imperialist mayhem.

"ISIS is a State-Sponsored Militant Proxy - Not an Independent Organization 

ISIS is first and foremost a proxy military organization, created by and for the state sponsors that fuel it politically, financially, and militarily. As revealed in a 2012 US Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) document (PDF), these include the United States itself, its European partners, NATO-member Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, and Jordan, as well as Israel.

The summation of ISIS' fighting capacity stems from a torrent of cash, weapons, supplies, and military protection provided to the group, particularly in the establishment of safe havens within Turkey, Jordan, and the Israeli-occupied Golan Heights where Syria and its allies are unable to strike."

http://landdestroyer.blogspot.com/search/label/Syria

People need to wake up man. Year after fucking year since 2001 our government has been waging military and economic war against the rest of the planet, bombing, blackmailing, stealing, cheating, and murdering it's way to cementing it's status as the sole superpower on the planet.
None of it has to do with fighting terrorism, democracy, our supposed freedoms or keeping us safe. None of it.

Smedley Butler, how many times have I talked about Smedley? To me, what he said was the end of the story, we don't need anything else to proceed to the Revolution. But even with that for most people it becomes, well that was then, this is now, things are different. No, that was then and now. It's that simple.

Reject everything about the war OF terror.

I spent thirty-three years and four months in active military service as a member of this country's most agile military force, the Marine Corps. I served in all commissioned ranks from Second Lieutenant to Major-General. And during that period, I spent most of my time being a high class muscle-man for Big Business, for Wall Street and for the Bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism.”
― Smedley D. Butler

Share
up
0 users have voted.

Comments

k9disc's picture

Perhaps we should try to lay out the structure and connections of the corporate war cartels.

How many of the fortune 500 are all over perpetual war?

Shit, the CEO of Exxon stepped right from the boardroom into the head of the State Department, and Democrats didn't bat an eye.

How many hidden corporate warmongers are there amongst the corporate war cartel?

Ad budgets, lobbying connections, investment holdings... Shouldn't be too hard to "connect those dots", and the people are primed for dot connection after 10 months of Russian CT exposure.

Seriously, I think this would be a tremendous meme and a powerful tool to cut through the corporate and government propaganda.

up
0 users have voted.

“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu

Big Al's picture

@k9disc it's getting the message out that is the problem. And getting it out against the overwhelming propaganda and lifetime conditioning most of the public has been subjected to.

Somebody needs to organize the revolution.

up
0 users have voted.
k9disc's picture

I know it's out there, but it's not very compelling, and it was put together in the previous political alignment's format.

The current political realignment and fake news fracas is just screaming for some recycled political thought.

In fact, recycling political thought is probably the first step to getting some kind of non-market based solutions in the pipeline.

And I've been around for a very long time, 20 years politically active online, and there are only a few well thought out and well framed systemic critiques out there.

Pirates & Emperors
the L-Curve
MAN (YT)
and a few more.

I think the one that snoopydawg posted in this thread, I think, is super compelling.

So I kind of agree with you, but think you're giving up on good work too quick because it didn't fit the zeitgeist.

@Big Al

up
0 users have voted.

“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu

@Big Al

how could that be done?

bernie raised huge amounts of money from progressives in 2016.
down the toilet, imo.

how much media time can you buy for 200 million dollars?
how much truth would it take?

smedley butler on primetime for weeks!
reruns!

up
0 users have voted.

@irishking

Look at how they pick and choose super bowl ads, not to mention how Bernie's run for President couldn't get the time of day from the msm.

up
0 users have voted.

"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon

k9disc's picture

Democrats and progressives will continue to pay for it and believe the corporate media.

It's asinine, if you ask me. We should be lampooning the corporate media instead of following them and giving them money.

@dkmich

up
0 users have voted.

“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu

@irishking

read from CIA-approved scripts that tell a story only children might believe is real. The roles are well-rehearsed and played with such conviction, people often think the drama they present is a true and faithful image of the world. Little do the people know, how carefully it's crafted, or what might be the dark and painful pathways that the plot of this adventure story has in store.

up
0 users have voted.

native

snoopydawg's picture

@native in this video, he has given the proof we need to see that the media has taken their marching orders from TPTB and are fully complicit in spreading the Russian propaganda spiel.

Watch Keith's antics in this video and tell me his actions aren't fake.

Keith repeating his talking points, but with style

Was his spiel against the Bush administration real or was this part of the media farce back then too?

up
0 users have voted.

Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.

CB's picture

@snoopydawg
It goes well with mainstream cable programming - The Slutty Housewives of Rich America or Following Kardashian's Ass.

up
0 users have voted.

@snoopydawg
who doesn't know the first thing about foreign affairs. He takes himself far too seriously to be at all funny, and he just looks silly riding on that high horse of his.

up
0 users have voted.

native

CB's picture

@native
Nothing will get traction unless it is approved. The US public is arguably the most propagandized and controlled population the world has ever experienced.

Most here in C99 watched it happen in real time at DKos as the (supposed) anti-war democrats were converted to war-mongers, literally lusting for regime change foreign policy while dumbly accepting watered down/neutered domestic policy in complete contrast to election promises. All done within a few months of the election under the rubric of Obama playing "11th dimensional politics" - ie a childlike belief that "Papa Obama" and "Momma Clinton" know what is best for us. It was fucking sickening to watch. This kind of shit continues at that site until this very day. It is now a part of the problem, not the solution. Very few free thinkers now left there. In this respect, DKos is a microcosm of the nation.

The American Empire and its Media

Largely unbeknownst to the public, many media executives and top journalists of almost all major U.S. news outlets, political and business magazines, public broadcasters and press agencies have long been members of the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR).

Established in 1921 as a private, bipartisan organization, the CFR and its close to 5000 elite members have for decades shaped U.S. foreign policy and public discourse about it. As one Council member famously explained, the goal has indeed been to establish an “empire”, albeit a “benevolent” one.

Based on official membership rosters, the following illustration for the first time depicts the extensive media network of the CFR and its two main international affiliate organizations: the Bilderberg Group (covering the U.S. and Europe) and the Trilateral Commission (covering North America, Europe and East Asia), both established by Council leaders to foster elite cooperation at the international level.
...
In his famous article about “The American Establishment”, political columnist Richard H. Rovere noted: “The directors of the CFR make up a sort of Presidium for that part of the Establishment that guides our destiny as a nation. () [I]t rarely fails to get one of its members, or at least one of its allies, into the White House. In fact, it generally is able to see to it that both nominees are men acceptable to it.”
...
It was not until the 2016 election that the Council couldn’t, apparently, prevail. At any rate, not yet.

cfr-media-network-hd-spr.png

up
0 users have voted.
snoopydawg's picture

@CB what you wrote about how we watched as DK changed from being against wars and regime change, many people on that site changed just because who was the president.
Joe wrote a diary there a few years ago stating that Obama needs to be held accountable for his use of drones, and too many people agreed with Obama's actions.

The silly meme that "drones save American soldier's lives totally misses the point of what authority gave him the right to use them in the first place.

We also saw how they adjusted their thinking from not voting for Her because of her Iraq war vote, to denying that she was a warmonger, even though her record showed that she was, and not minding that she was saying she would create a no fly zone over Syria which would need to have 70,000 troops inside Syria for it to work. This is what she told bank CEOs during one of her paid speeches. Accusing her of being a warmonger was decided to be right wing talking points. Like the right wing has any problems with our bogus war of terror.

We saw how Rachel changed from being against wars to not even covering them when Obama did the same things as Bush did.

The article on the CFR is very interesting. I wasn't aware of how far their hands reached.

up
0 users have voted.

Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.

snoopydawg's picture

@CB
but in the foreign media too. We saw proof of this on 9/11 when the person who worked for the BBC was on air live and told everyone that building 7 had collapsed 20 minutes before it did.
While she was telling us this, the building was still standing in the background.
This was a dead giveaway that showed that even the foreign media was in on the game.

up
0 users have voted.

Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.

@CB is Fox on that roster? It's too tiny on my tiny screen for me to tell. Recognize other logos tho.

up
0 users have voted.
CB's picture

@gustogirl
You can get a close view here. It can be magnified to be able to read individual names.
https://swisspropaganda.files.wordpress.com/2017/07/cfr-media-network-hd...

up
0 users have voted.
Pricknick's picture

on.
No stop switch. No dead mans circuit. That red octagon sign don't mean shit no more.
Sit back and enjoy the ride. You hardly had to pay to enter.
America. She's a beauty.
[video:https://youtu.be/mQ_k_VG6Syc]

up
0 users have voted.

Regardless of the path in life I chose, I realize it's always forward, never straight.

CB's picture

in 2004 that discusses the historical background in detail. I highly recommend viewing these in order to understand the roots of terrorism.

The Power of Nightmares: The Rise of the Politics of Fear is a BBC television documentary series by Adam Curtis.

Part 1. 'Baby It's Cold Outside'

The first part of the series explains the origins of Islamism and neoconservatism. It shows Egyptian civil servant Sayyid Qutb, depicted as the founder of modern Islamist thinking, visiting the U.S. to learn about its education system, then becoming disgusted at what he judged as the corruption of morals and virtues in western society through individualism. When he returns to Egypt, he is disturbed by westernisation under Gamal Abdel Nasser and becomes convinced that in order to save his own society, it must be completely restructured along the lines of Islamic law while still using western technology. He then becomes convinced that his vision can only be accomplished through use of an elite "vanguard" to lead a revolution against the established order. Qutb becomes a leader of the Muslim Brotherhood and, after being tortured in one of Nasser's jails, comes to believe that western-influenced leaders can be justifiably killed to remove their corruption. Qutb is executed in 1966, but he influences Ayman al-Zawahiri, the future mentor of Osama bin Laden, to start his own secret Islamist group. Inspired by the 1979 Iranian revolution, Zawahiri and his allies assassinate Egyptian president Anwar Al-Sadat in 1981 in the hopes of starting their own revolution. However, the revolution does not materialise, and Zawahiri comes to believe that a majority of Muslims have been corrupted, not only by their western-inspired leaders, but Muslims themselves have been affected by jahilliyah and thus may be legitimate targets of violence if they refuse to join his cause. They continued to believe that a vanguard was necessary to rise up and overthrow the corrupt regime and replace it with a 'pure' Islamist state.

Part 2. 'The Phantom Victory'

In the second part, Islamist factions, rapidly falling under the more radical influence of Zawahiri and his rich Saudi acolyte Osama bin Laden, join the neoconservative-influenced Reagan administration to combat the Soviet Union's invasion of Afghanistan. When the Soviets eventually pull out of Afghanistan, and when the Eastern Bloc begins to collapse in 1989, both the Islamists and the neoconservatives believe they are the primary architects of the "Evil Empire's" defeat. Curtis argues that the Soviet Union was on the verge of collapsing anyway. However, the Islamists see it quite differently. In their triumph, they believe they have the power to create 'pure' Islamic states in Egypt and Algeria. Attempts to create such Islamic states are blocked by force. The Islamists then try to foment revolutions in Egypt and Algeria by using terrorism to scare the people into rising up against their leaders. But the people are terrified by the violence, and the Algerian government exploits that fear as a way to hang on to power. In the end, the Islamists declare the entire populations of the countries to be thoroughly contaminated by western values. Finally, in Algeria, they begin to turn on each other, each believing that members of other terrorist groups are not true Muslims.

In America, neoconservative aspirations to use the United States' military power to further destroy evildoers are thrown off track by the election of George H. W. Bush to the presidency, followed by the election in 1992 of Bill Clinton which left them totally out of power. The neoconservatives, along with their conservative Christian allies, attempt to demonize Clinton throughout his presidency with various real and fabricated stories of corruption and immorality. To their disappointment, the American people do not turn against Clinton. Meanwhile, Islamist attempts at revolution end in massive bloodshed, leaving the Islamists without popular support. Zawahiri and bin Laden flee to the relative safety of Afghanistan and declare a new strategy. To fight Western-inspired moral decay, they must deal a blow to its source: the United States.

Part 3. 'The Shadows in the Cave'

The neoconservatives use the September 11 attacks, with al-Fadl's description of al-Qaeda, to launch the War on Terror.

The final part addresses the actual rise of al-Qaeda. Curtis argues that, after their failed revolutions, bin Laden and Zawahiri had little or no popular support, let alone a serious complex organisation of terrorists, and were dependent on independent operatives to carry out their new call for jihad. However, the film argues that in order to prosecute bin Laden in absentia for the 1998 U.S. embassy bombings, U.S. prosecutors had to prove that he is the head of a criminal organisation responsible for the bombings. They find a former associate of bin Laden, Jamal al-Fadl, and pay him to testify that bin Laden is the head of a massive terrorist organisation called "al-Qaeda". With the September 11 attacks, neoconservatives in the new Republican administration of George W. Bush use this invented concept of an organisation to justify another crusade against a new enemy, culminating in the launch of the War on Terror.

After the American invasion of Afghanistan fails to uproot the alleged terrorist organisation, the Bush administration focuses inwards, searching unsuccessfully for terrorist sleeper cells in America. In 2003, they extend the War on Terror to a war on general perceived evils with the invasion of Iraq. The ideas and tactics also spread to the United Kingdom, where Tony Blair uses the threat of terrorism to give him a new moral authority. The repercussions of the neoconservative strategy are also explored, with an investigation of indefinitely-detained terrorist suspects in Guantanamo Bay, many allegedly taken on the word of the anti-Taliban Northern Alliance without actual investigation on the part of the United States military, and other forms of "preemption" against non-existent and unlikely threats made simply on the grounds that the parties involved had the potential to become a threat. Curtis specifically attempts to allay fears of a dirty bomb attack, and concludes by reassuring viewers that politicians will eventually have to concede that some threats are exaggerated and others have no foundation in reality. He says, "In an age when all the grand ideas have lost credibility, fear of a phantom enemy is all the politicians have left to maintain their power."

up
0 users have voted.
Azazello's picture

@CB
This doc. has been on my list for ages but I hadn't thought to search YouTube.

up
0 users have voted.

We wanted decent healthcare, a living wage and free college.
The Democrats gave us Biden and war instead.

Alphalop's picture

@CB Added that to my watch later list, sounds incredibly interesting and informative.

up
0 users have voted.

"I used to vote Republican & Democrat, I also used to shit my pants. Eventually I got smart enough to stop doing both things." -Me

CB's picture

in the destruction of Syria. They set the timetable by controlling the type and quantity of weapons that flowed into the so-called "rebels" hands. They knew from the beginning that the FSA was working hand-in-hand with Al Nusra (Al Qaeda in Syria) and that the weapons would be transferred. But this gave them plausible deniability.

Because there was no faction suitable to take charge of the country and control the border with Israel with the fall of Assad due to extensive squabbles and disagreements between different expats and defecting military leaders, the plan went to option B. Dole out weapons and financial support to warring factions that would literally destroy the infrastructure and very fabric of the country so it would not be capable of projecting power outside its borders for generations to come. The US has an extensive history of doing just this when they can't get a suitable regime into power. This is discussed in the video below.

At the end of the interview there is an implied threat about using WMD's. I believe this was going to be a false flag event in order to force Uncle Sam's hand to take Assad out like what was done in Libya. Fortunately it failed to materialize thanks to Russian statesmanship. This was about the time that Putin understood fully what the US was doing in Syria and that he would have to involve the Russian military to prevent another complete destruction and collapse of Syria like what was done to Libya.

up
0 users have voted.
snoopydawg's picture

we left them most of our military equipment when we left Iraq after the status of forces agreement was up.
Then they were attacked by a ragtag force that had inferior weapons, but the Iraqi military ran away and let them capture their equipment. This was the tell that the meme of training Iraq's military was another farce.
How many times did this repeat in not only Iraq, but in Syria too?
Yep. Total bullshit that the military is actually fighting the "terrorists"
They aren't terrorists if our country and our allies are funding, arming and training them.
@CB

up
0 users have voted.

Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.

CB's picture

he understands the real problem. It is that the US that has directly created ISIS with its foreign policies.

Is it no wonder why the US Deep State considers Putin an existential enemy and needs to demonize him? He speaks truth to global power.

up
0 users have voted.
snoopydawg's picture

@CB here.
The things he said makes total sense and I wonder if people actually heard what he said, would that change anything about how people view him?

He shamed Obama into finally bombing the ISIS convoys that were miles long and taking oil into Turkey to sell it to Israel.
I'm pretty sure that our government could place restrictions on our allies, especially Israel. All that needs to be done is tell them that if they don't keep buying oil from ISIS, we will cut off the billions we give them every year.
This same thing can be done to the Saudis. If they don't quit their abominable human rights abuses, we won't sell them weapons, continue to refuel their jets for their bombing of Yemen and countless other ways to control our allies. The fact that they don't, shows that they don't care about what they are doing.

If those media people had shown this interview, they would be accused of repeating Putin's talking points. Just like Jill Stein is doing when she said that this Russian interference with the election is a smoke screen for why Her lost the election.
This is a diary on ToP today.
Jill also said that the DNC had been exposed for rigging the primary for Her, but the Herbots say that there is no proof of this in the emails that Wikileaks released.

Sigh. The denial there is very deep. I can't wait to see what happens when this Russian crap explodes.

up
0 users have voted.

Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.

Pluto's Republic's picture

@snoopydawg

It will expose the NaziCons embedded in our own government, who set the ridiculous US policy toward Russia for the past 70 years. If the American people weren't so fatally brainwashed, I think they would be inspired to hire some lawyers and get their country back.

up
0 users have voted.

____________________

The political system is what it is because the People are who they are. — Plato

@snoopydawg based on historical behavior, I'm inclined to believe the US has no power over Israel at all. In fact, the reverse may be true.

In addition, it's starting to look like the Saudi's might have something over on us too. Since 9/11 their influence seems to have grown. Am I imagining this?

up
0 users have voted.
snoopydawg's picture

@gustogirl
the Bush administration knew that the Saudis were involved with the "attacks" because the FBI found evidence that they were funding them and helping with finding places to live. This was uncovered years before the attacks. Otta, whose passport was found near the towers (very interesting, don't you think that it survived the fires and the building demolition crashing down?
Bandar "Bush" was pictured with George and Dick on a balcony the day after and they were all smiles. I can imagine the conversation.
Sibel Edmonds is under a gag order for what she knows. I'm surprised that she's still alive.
Many members of congress were aware of the Saudis involvement because of the 28 pages that were left out of the 9/11 report. Even after they were declassified and everyone found out about their involvement, the incident went away quickly.
The people who read or heard about this, didn't make much of an uproar about it. The media may have covered it for a day or two, then it hasn't been mentioned since. Neither has the trial that the families who lost members have brought against the Saudis.

As for Israel's control over our government, I agree with you. No one can get elected to congress unless they swear fealty to Israel and how many of them have dual citizenship? I know that Rahm Emmanuel does as does Lieberman and maybe Schumer.

up
0 users have voted.

Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.

detroitmechworks's picture

I am sick and tired of being told that my opposition to war is "Racist" and "Sexist".

It comes up over and over again. I can't talk about the Saudis, my experience with the Iraqis or anything else, because apparently my personal experience with a religion is to be ignored in favor of the massaged, focus tested, liberated women who "Choose" to wear burquas, and embrace Islam. Apparently I'm supposed to cheer when my feminist allies shout "Allah Akbar!" because it shows solidarity.

I am tired of it. I honestly do not like Islam. Same way I don't like most Christians. Same way I loathe right wing reactionary Jews who want to kill every Palestinian on principle. Religion can be toxic, and claiming that some are above criticism drives me nuts.

Nothing pissed me off more than watching the "left" and "right" come together to worship at the bedside of McCain the Warmonger. Everything is forgiven because of the random vagaries of genetics. He'll go down in history as a great statesman... because everything is forgiven because of disease. Even my SO disagrees with me on this because of the "Need" to show respect to those with deadly illnesses. I suppose I am supposed to like Pol Pot because he died of a Heart Attack.

So, Yeah, I've probably pissed off quite a few people right now, and I do not apologize and will not apologize for it. This is me. I cannot allow myself to fall into self-censorship again, and won't do it.

up
0 users have voted.

I do not pretend I know what I do not know.

CB's picture

@detroitmechworks
"Yes. It is an unfortunate and deadly disease. But, in McCain's case, he at least deserved it. Maybe it's God's way of saying 'You've done enough killing and destruction in the world for one man'?"

That's tough to deny or argue with if you are a 'true believer'.

up
0 users have voted.

@CB God is calling him home. A bit late, in my view, but who am I to question God?

up
0 users have voted.

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981

@on the cusp

as a humble bumble bee, and finally get a chance to do some good in the world.

up
0 users have voted.

native

@native God really needs a do over with the Maverick.

up
0 users have voted.

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981

@CB

what God is saying tend to stir up a lot of trouble. And the more certain they are, the more trouble they cause. But I guess a plurality of mankind feels the need to be loyal to some kind of higher authority or other. Be it some moral or legal or scriptural code, or some set of beliefs held in common. Human beings find it hard to even communicate, let alone cooperate, unless they are grounded in a community of shared belief. But the various passions of the human heart are not easy to codify. And to me it seems remarkable that we are even able to get along together as well as we do.

Today I drove a couple hundred miles across interstate highways and two-lane blacktops, and then through a crowded city. Literally inches away from a high speed death all the way, with my life depending totally on the skill and willingness of total strangers to obey a common set of rules.

up
0 users have voted.

native

@native an outsized sense of their own power from an invisible and unprovable source.

up
0 users have voted.

@detroitmechworks @detroitmechworks I think any religion that dictates murder is a religion past it's sell by date.
I agree with you.
Like you, I do not self-censor well.

up
0 users have voted.

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981

Pluto's Republic's picture

@detroitmechworks

So, Yeah, I've probably pissed off quite a few people right now, and I do not apologize and will not apologize for it. This is me. I cannot allow myself to fall into self-censorship again, and won't do it.

Generally, you speak for me.

So, don't self-censor. You're savin' me keystrokes here.

up
0 users have voted.

____________________

The political system is what it is because the People are who they are. — Plato
snoopydawg's picture

@detroitmechworks this religious crap has been taken out of context to fit any narrative people want to give to it.
Especially when people say, "Gawd bless America".
For what reason should Gawd bless this country?
For the genocide of the Native Americans, its history of slavery, and everything else that this country has done to other countries and their citizens?
The way they treat the poor, Blacks and everyone else who they don't think deserves to be alive?
Hell no! I'm with Rev. Wright on this.
McCain's life has been full of killing and denying people the right to live with dignity, so why should I be sad that he's finally going to shuffle off this mortal plain?
I was happy when Reagan lost his mind before he died, and will be just as happy now that McCain isn't in a position to create more misery and deaths.

This Jesus that everyone says they follow and worship had very few rules. This is the one I try to do,
"Love one another". Anything that deviates from this is hypocrisy and has nothing to do with religion. It's a way for people to excuse their actions.

up
0 users have voted.

Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.

@snoopydawg in general. There is the implicit assumption that the speaker is able to command God to bless whosoever he wishes.

A better phrasing, if one is a believer, would be "may God bless you".

up
0 users have voted.
k9disc's picture

beltway consultants is not a successful political tactic from the Left.

We're a complete non-starter for the corporate media.

What if Bernie would have given his $228M to 1000 YT Hosts each host would have made $22,800 dollars. That's a minimum wage gig for voicing your values.

The problem with the Left is that we refuse to take money for our political action. That's why Heritage and AEI clobber us. They've got 20 dudes hanging out in DC doing political activism for a living. We don't do that, at all. We donate our time pushing the Sisyphean boulder up the corporate hill - "Nah, I'll do it for free in my spare time..."

A lack of imagination killed Bernie. He was almost there, but he fell into the gaping maw of "respectable" media.

$228M invested and paying out dividends to activists would be still paying off, and most likely would be paying off for years with wise financial managment.

Sad that he gave it away to his nemesis, the corporate media. They used it to pad their pockets and eviscerate his political veracity.

Getting the message out is NOT the problem. The problem is crafting the message.

And I do know that this runs directly into the Democratic Party's excuse machine. Messaging is important, it's the most important thing after declaring your values.

Democrats are in search of a marketing message, not a values message -- there's a huge difference. It's the difference between the pulpit and PR. We all know the score there...

up
0 users have voted.

“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu

Pluto's Republic's picture

@k9disc

The slogans and messaging I've seen so far are neither marketing nor values.

I'd call them obfuscation.

I've been trying to figure it out:

https://caucus99percent.com/comment/281672#comment-281672

Perhaps the Party is trying to hide their values and market generic words.

up
0 users have voted.

____________________

The political system is what it is because the People are who they are. — Plato
k9disc's picture

My point is that Bernie, while making a splash in the big kids pool, did nothing but make it worse. He gave the corporate media $200M -- he funded his nemesis.

I'd say that an example of good messaging was Bernie's speeches. A less good example would be his debate performances. He fell into the same problem that the Democrats fall into:

If Hillary and the DNC were really so bad, wouldn't a stand up guy like Bernie be fighting them?

It's the same as AGW and Healthcare -- Democrats pretend to believe that AGW is THE issue of our time, and then suggest market based solutions, low fueld prices, and "all of the above" energy policy.

On healthcare, it's a right, every American needs it. Now Go shop for it!

Those messages, Bernie's debate schtick included, belie the values that they pretend to believe in.

I mentioned some other well framed stuff above:
Pirates & Emperors
the L-Curve
MAN (YT)
and a few more...

@Pluto's Republic

up
0 users have voted.

“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu

Pluto's Republic's picture

@k9disc @k9disc

Thinking you were making a point about the difference between a values message and a marketing message.

Getting the message out is NOT the problem. The problem is crafting the message.

And I do know that this runs directly into the Democratic Party's excuse machine. Messaging is important, it's the most important thing after declaring your values.

Democrats are in search of a marketing message, not a values message -- there's a huge difference. It's the difference between the pulpit and PR. We all know the score there...

Now you seem to be saying that activist time and campaign resources should be spent on high-intensity marketing (including one on one). The political message should be hard core and unyielding (universal health care or fuck you). And selling the message should be handled more like a smart business transaction than a political movement. The buyer gets a great value.

Since everything in the US is being pushed into the privatized marketplace, including government services, we need to conquer that battlefield. Politicians market their votes. Lobbyists buy and sell them. Leftist activists should receive time or performance-based pay for marketing our political positions. We need to recognize that political views are products in a highly competitive marketplace. We need to package them as if they had great value, and get paid for doing the selling.

When the going gets neoliberal, the left turns pro.

We have boldness and genius. We can easily beat those tools at their own game.

Does that sound right?

up
0 users have voted.

____________________

The political system is what it is because the People are who they are. — Plato
k9disc's picture

@Pluto's Republic

Now you seem to be saying that activist time and campaign resources should be spent on high-intensity marketing (including one on one). The political message should be hard core and unyielding (universal health care or fuck you). And selling the message should be handled more like a smart business transaction than a political movement. The buyer gets a great value.

I think you're on the right track, but your comment is just ladened with money and transactional metaphor.

Since everything in the US is being pushed into the privatized marketplace, including government services, we need to conquer that battlefield.

We need to change the battlefield entirely.

Public policy often makes for a terrible business plan, and vice versa. When all we get presented to us is a business plan, you can bet we're getting screwed on public policy.

21st century politicians and big business are allied against the common man and small enterprise. Big business sponsors political talent and political talent provide the policy and political spectacle that keeps the rabble off the business' ass and keeps the upstart businesses weak. They are in league against us.

American Politics has nothing to do with public policy. It is all business, baby. Let the buyer beware. Rubes to be fleeced as far as the eye can see.

What will they give for clean water? How much will they pay to use roads to drive to work? What is the price for life saving medicine? This corporate sponsored public policy creates unhealthy, extortive markets that pervert business and create terrible incentives. As such they cannot work to make life better for the American Citizen. They are only good for extracting money from our wallets and propping up failed and struggling business models. The end.

Politicians market their votes. Lobbyists buy and sell them.

Now you're talking. That is how it works. And it's ugly and runs counter to what we believe government should be.

I think, perhaps we should make our arguments against them paint a stark, business-like picture. Give the raw, transactional and monetary framework that they slap onto healthcare by avoiding healthy citizens altogether and focusing on the minutiae of ROI, cost, copays, etc.

Notice that the Market gets "sick" and sick Americans are consumers of health care. That ain't no accident, kid. That's the kind of messaging I'm talking about. When the Establishment talks about things they like they use humanizing and value ladened language. They frame the market as a lifeform and make lifeforms into numbers on a spreadsheet. I find it hideous.

Leftist activists should receive time or performance-based pay for marketing our political positions. We need to recognize that political views are products in a highly competitive marketplace. We need to package them as if they had great value, and get paid for doing the selling.

While this is correct, it does little to move me emotionally or to connect me with the plan. The money language just completely falls flat and it winds up sounding like a scheme.

"Leftist activist do not have support required for challenging the Establishment and pushing ideas that are focused on helping Americans.

Right Wing Think Tanks have monetary and political support from Big Corporate & the Oligarchs, the corporate media, and big time political players. You know, all the people tearing America apart, destroying the planet, and harming the American citizen.

Left Wing activism and Leftist political thought are absolutely critical to halting our 40 year rightward slide. A slide that has left us with a tattered constitution and all the freedom one can afford. You want to leave that up to volunteerism and part time organization?

Halting this slide and protecting America from corporate fraud and abuse is mission critical. It's a full time job. We need to create jobs and provide monetary and organizational support for talented activists.

The success of Right Wing think tanks has nothing to do with the quality of their ideas, their ideas have little popular support, they are successful because they have enough organizational and monetary support to make their activism a full time gig.

When the going gets neoliberal, the left turns pro.

We have boldness and genius. We can easily beat those tools at their own game.

Yes. Biggrin

@Pluto's Republic

up
0 users have voted.

“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu

snoopydawg's picture

@Pluto's Republic
wait until you see Trump's infrastructure budget. He wants to spend a trillion dollars on it, but most of the money is going to go to private companies. This is what Chicago did with its toll roads and parking meters.
The Saudis bought the toll roads for pennies on the dollar, as usual, and then raised the cost of tolls.
Citibank or Chase bought the parking meters for the same deal and of course raised the price.
Now Chicago will have much less money for its budgets going forward for decades because it won't have the steady stream of income each year.
This is what Trump wants to do for all of America. Obviously this wasn't his idea. The right wing think tanks have wanted this done for decades.
I'm just surprised that Obama didn't do it first. But maybe he had given the banks enough for one presidency.

up
0 users have voted.

Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.

I am seeing lots of high school grads joining the military. Imagine being 18 and you have no memory of life without a war on terror.

up
0 users have voted.

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981

Pluto's Republic's picture

@on the cusp

….in high schools. I just saw a documentary on Reuters about it. Kids brains are softer and easier to program.

up
0 users have voted.

____________________

The political system is what it is because the People are who they are. — Plato
snoopydawg's picture

@Pluto's Republic they go. The military has taken over almost every sporting events since 9/11/2001.
People now sing "Gawd bless America" during the 7th inning stretch instead of "take me out to the ballgame"
The 100 foot American flag is stretched out on the fields while people sing the "Star Spangled Banner"
The military has invaded NASCAR and jets fly over most outdoor games.
I imagine that the amount of money spent on the military propaganda could be better spent on many, many other things that this country needs money for.
I would love to see the money used to fund the inadequately underfunded social programs and anything left over should go to the education budget.

up
0 users have voted.

Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.

snoopydawg's picture

@Pluto's Republic
that are created by military think tanks. As you stated, they are easier to mold if they get them young enough.
These kids might grow up to be drone operators, or the operators of robotic soldiers. I think this is where the military is going to be going to in the future. Why the hell not? People are fragile beings and their bodies and minds are too fragile and money needs to be wasted on them to make them better instead of going to buying more equipment and devices that can easily rain down deaths and destruction on whatever new enemy that they create and make up.

Sure the kids will develop PTSD, but there are always other kids who will take their places.
Think Ender's game, only the battlefield will be on this planet. For now anyway.

up
0 users have voted.

Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.

Strife Delivery's picture

The American people don't give a damn about war. Hell, they often love it. Kill brown people, Muslims, Asians, Communists, scary people, others. The American people are amazingly a fearful people, easily misled to believe everyone is coming to kill them in their bed.

What was our last major war resistance movement? What...Vietnam? And why's that? I'd partially say cause of the draft. If you FORCE people to go to fight the wars, well, people don't seem to like that. So they stopped that. With that, so too does any concern about the actual war. It's not some altruistic concern that America is slaughtering millions of people, it's that people don't want to be forced to go fight it. Once the threat is gone, they stop caring.

Basically you can kill tens of millions of people, just make sure I don't have to go there.

up
0 users have voted.
Pluto's Republic's picture

@Strife Delivery

None of this can be addressed from inside the US. We need more courageous people like Edward Snowden, who are willing to take it to the world and get the ball rolling. Books need to be written and published that propose smart solutions — like base closures, sanctions, and abandonment of the US dollar. An off-shore think tank with great talents who can never return, again. Heros. Humanitarians.

The future is counting on us.

up
0 users have voted.

____________________

The political system is what it is because the People are who they are. — Plato
snoopydawg's picture

@Strife Delivery
it was televised live so that people could see the death and destruction that the USA brought to the Iraqi people because their leader met with the boogeyman. Oops. Apparently this was a lie. Our bad.
Good thing that we found out the truth before we killed a million or more Iraqis and destroyed their country.
What's that? Again, my bad.

up
0 users have voted.

Which AIPAC/MIC/pharma/bank bought politician are you going to vote for? Don’t be surprised when nothing changes.

Big Al's picture

@Strife Delivery against war and are active to semi-active on blogs, like this one, but still can't get their heads out of the corporate media and duopoly political system long enough to understand that the war in Syria isn't a civil war. Or that Trump and Mattis are not on our side, no matter what the deep state says. I've seen it for years, too many on the left who talk the game simply can't break free like I described above.

up
0 users have voted.
Strife Delivery's picture

@Big Al No hope on Mattis, the man if I recall who said that we are just getting started in Afghanistan right? 16 years there and we are just getting started? Yikes.

Regarding Trump, he liked to talk a good game during the election but well he talks a lot about quite a lot of things. The probability of him stopping anything in the Middle East was quite low. The only "hope" (I use that word lightly here) from Trump was hopefully to not escalate us further with Russia. But in the end perhaps the neocons will get their war with Russia, I don't know.

Regarding Syria, it's frightening how major events just pass by the American consciousness. Various media organizations lied to us, getting their marching orders from the government. Iraq for instance is a clear sign of us being lied to. And yet, people just gobble up anything and everything. Because it is always a case of this one being different. "Yeah Iraq was bad but well this one is totally true now." I grew up during all these wars; being in elementary school I didn't really understand some of this. I didn't really get the point of Iraq because thought Afghanistan was about all the terrorist garbage. Turns out if I remember right like 70% of people believed Iraq did 9/11. So being in elementary school and then middle school, I was just confused and didn't get it; I didn't know what information I was missing. Ultimately, the problem was at the time knowing the right info, aka not going to corporate media garbage to get said information. This is turning into a long story here now ha, sorry about that ha.

up
0 users have voted.
Meteor Man's picture

And fantastic comments too. Bookmarked for later. Nothing to add except sorry I missed the discussion.

up
0 users have voted.

"They'll say we're disturbing the peace, but there is no peace. What really bothers them is that we are disturbing the war." Howard Zinn