Europe pushes back against Russia sanctions
Submitted by gjohnsit on Fri, 06/16/2017 - 1:41pm
This won't go over well at TOP.
It appears that Germany has had enough with America's Russia sanctions.
Germany threatened on Friday to retaliate against the United States if new sanctions on Russia being proposed by the U.S. Senate end up penalizing German firms.
The Senate bill, approved on Thursday by a margin of 98-2, includes new sanctions against Russia and Iran. Crucially, it foresees punitive measures against entities that provide material support to Russia in building energy export pipelines.
Berlin fears that could pave the way for fines against German and European firms involved in Nord Stream 2, a project to build a pipeline carrying Russian gas across the Baltic.
Austria also slammed the new sanctions.
Hungary, Bulgaria, Czech Republic, and Greece already opposed Russian sanctions.
So will Dems in Washington start an international trade war with our allies in Europe just so they can continue to push the Russia! Russia! Russia! meme in the hopes of distracting us away from everything else, such as our disastrous wars?
Also, does the fact the sanctions aren't working make a difference?
Comments
Everyone knows
that the US is the worlds bully.
People are finally standing up to it.
I want a Pony!
Yes, we are forcing them to cross the street to avoid the bully
No country can rest easy, knowing that any number of psychos in his circle -- or even an obvious misunderstanding, could convince the U.S. President to attack them tomorrow.
I'm impressed with Germany
Go Angie!
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
Spine for their corporations?
"You can't just leave those who created the problem in charge of the solution."---Tyree Scott
They didn't show any for Volkswagen,
I hope that this is the beginning of a larger trend, because if the EU isn't on board with our plans, we're going to quickly find that empire is unsustainable. We may have to go back to making and selling things for a living.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
In other words
" In the beginning, the universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry, and is generally considered to have been a bad move. -- Douglas Adams, The Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy "
Independence from FIRE
Independence from FIRE (Finance, Insurance and Real Estate)? Sounds like heaven! Bring on that heavenly independence from hell FIRE!
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
@Steven D Yeah, that's why they
And it ain't this shield:
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Big Oil
being in conflict with Big War would possibly be unique for the last century. But I do see this too, that Rex Tillerson, i.e. Exxon in Russia, is groveling as Secretary of State under the pressure from Clapper and associates, the war machine. But he's there to make the case that blowing up life on earth would be bad for business. He's surrounded by maniacs, by truly insane people in the military industrial part of the MIC.
Tillerson looks frightened. But ultimately I think he's there to keep the psychopaths from destroying life on earth. It's a pretty big job, as it turns out.
Trump was cruel to her in the US and on his recent trip
To:
I sensed she was very hurt at the G-7, where she was betrayed. Trump lives in a headspace where he was exercising the Art of the Deal — putting America first and NATO at the bottom. He's been stringing Europe along — all in his mind. He blurts what's on his mind. (In reality, his Deep State Neocon handlers won't let that happen. The US will continue it's reign of global terror toward supreme Empire.)
But I also sensed, for the first time, Angela Merkel's femininity. She's a physicist and essentially the leader of Europe, but I don't think any of these geopolitical geniuses have factored in that she is a woman. A German woman (holistically) scorned on the world stage.
I have a pretty good idea what could happen next…. if it was me running the show.
IMAGINE if you woke up the day after a US Presidential Election and headlines around the the world blared, "The Majority of Americans Refused to Vote in US Presidential Election! What Does this Mean?"
Half my family is German.
I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.
Are they standing up to us for the right reasons?
It seems that they are standing up to us because the sanctions might penalize their firms.
I suppose that it's a start that they are saying that the sanctions might hurt their profits, but I wish that they were or had been standing to us because of our human rights abuses and our destroying country after country in our never ending quest for foreign resources.
The Nuremberg laws are very clear on when a country can take action against another country. But as usual, the winner gets to write the rules. Sigh.
There were problems with running a campaign of Joy while committing a genocide? Who could have guessed?
Harris is unburdened of speaking going forward.
Standing up to us
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
With so many countries suffering from not having enough money
for their citizens who are falling further and further behind, how much longer are other countries going to be able to afford to keep spending massive amounts of money on wars of choice. Sooner than later they are going to have to address the damage from climate change. And the more they push austerity on people, there are going to be more attacks like the one where the congress members got shot.
People can only take so much suffering until they snap.
Two shootings in the same day is going to be more frequent.
I am not defending the person who shot the congress members. However, I do understand how a person can snap if they are pushed too far. How many people are worried that the republicans are going to destroy our social programs and have no where to go? They are doing this in the dark behind closed doors and democrats aren't in a position to block the republicans. Hell, they might not even try if they had the numbers to do so.
There were problems with running a campaign of Joy while committing a genocide? Who could have guessed?
Harris is unburdened of speaking going forward.
What do you want ?
I can walk to Russia, I can't walk to United States (unfortunately). Russia is our neighbor, US is our "beacon of hope" over there in the "land of the shiny city on a hill". Hope is a fine thingy, but staying warm comes first.
Russia and Germany could sanction United States for trading their oil and gas with Canada and Latin America. How dare they do that? I guess because they can walk over to their neighbors there. Sorry forgot that.
With apologies to Sarah Palin, she thought walking over to Russia is a possibility.
Brrr... it's cold out there in the world. Let's keep us warm and friendly with each other.
https://www.euronews.com/live
Right you are, mimi.
To top that sentiment, it's pretty clear that Putin is pained by the damage the sanctions are having on certain European nations. These leaders know one another as people. There is a close regard among many of them. Often their eyes hold apologies for what they must do to each other. Not always, but often enough to notice.
And right you are about the oil trade. Germany would dearly love to buy oil from Iran with Euros. That's unmentioned, but it is in the room. Particularly galling to Germany is the fact that the US recently fined Deutsche Bank $10 billion for continuing to do business with Russia. That number would essentially bankrupt Europe's most powerful bank when it is called. Does the US keep the money to benefit its own finance oligarchs? Does anyone need to ask?
It's only going to take one straw to break that camel's back.
IMAGINE if you woke up the day after a US Presidential Election and headlines around the the world blared, "The Majority of Americans Refused to Vote in US Presidential Election! What Does this Mean?"
I will never understand how this country gets to
dictate terms to a foreign business or corporations. How can we fine Deutsche Bank for doing business with Russia? Don't they get to determine for themselves who they do business with?
What is more asinine with the fine is that it's $10 billion for doing this, yet, the banks here that fraudulently helped crash the global economy were only fined millions.
The bank that was caught laundering drug money was also only fined millions.
I very tired of reading about the hypocrisy of our government.
They overthrew the Ukrainian government and they have the gall to tell people that Russia is being aggressive? SMDH!
There were problems with running a campaign of Joy while committing a genocide? Who could have guessed?
Harris is unburdened of speaking going forward.
I didn't follow and understand the things
the Deutsche Bank did, but heard they did very dirty business, may be not with Russia, but with Americans.
I am tired to get headaches over Trump, Deutsche Bank, Russia.
https://www.euronews.com/live
I fully expect, and actually want
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
walk over to Russia
For her, at certain times of year and under the right conditions, it might have been.
She's from Alaska.
Little Diomede Island is in Alaska. Big Diomede Island is in Russia. They are less than 5 km apart.
If the pack ice is with you in winter, you can walk between the two..... it's not legal, but you can.....
From Wikipedia:
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
I guess she got cold feet ... :-)
and would understand it's a nice thing to stay warm and therefore not sanction Russia...
lol. Thanks for this.
https://www.euronews.com/live
@snoopydawg Exactly so.
The strongest interests opposing a US war with Russia are the oil corporations.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Re: US is the World's Bully
Interesting!
Maybe we could enact sanctions against Germany for having persons who are in business with Russians. And China. And then us.
Woohoo!
We've got the embargo against Cuba back too!
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
Was it Roosevelt who went after the war profiteers
during WWII? When was it decided that profiting from wars was acceptable? Or was that a one time fluke just like when Bush1 put the savings and loan critters in prison?
Halliburton was slinking around in the shadows until the Iraq war looked too profitable for them to stay in the shadows. On top of that, they got no bid contracts and became even more profitable.
The banks got away with crashing the global economy, ruining people's lives and continuing on their merry way and continued doing whatever the hell they wanted.
There were problems with running a campaign of Joy while committing a genocide? Who could have guessed?
Harris is unburdened of speaking going forward.
I was researching Empire just last night
Hi:
Profiteering is the primary motive of Imperialism, and in the US that's been going on in earnest for well over a century. It's been funded entirely by America's poor and middle class, due to drastic tax cuts on high bracket income received by the wealthy — from 93 percent to less than 30 percent, effectively. Those tax cuts decimated the net worth of the American people.
I ran across this editorial drawing, which tells the story of US war profiteering post WWII:
But, after awhile, capitalism only works when there are continuous wars spurring private industry to produce items that are meant to be blown up, depreciated, or consumed. And the beauty part is there's a generous single-payer buyer: the Federal government. The sky's the limit. We are all defense contractors, now. Seriously.
I believe that cartoon may be the most accurate depiction of the US economy that I have seen to date.
IMAGINE if you woke up the day after a US Presidential Election and headlines around the the world blared, "The Majority of Americans Refused to Vote in US Presidential Election! What Does this Mean?"
Well at least the Marshall Plan worked, didn't it?
I mean, Western Europe and Japan did very well in partnership with the USA, after the war. Especially compared to the Communist nations. Nothing like that is operating in the MENA though.
native
@native I agree that the
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Sorry
The USA and UK already had the dominance. Their troops were in every continental country.
The Marshall Plan was partly humanitarian but it became law because US corporations profited. Broke and demolished Europe couldn't buy from the USA, so the US government gave them money to rebuild so that they could buy.
Marshall Plan was not about military dominance. Europe was already conquered. MP was about economics.
I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.
Great article.
And good point.
Tax cuts have devastated the poor and middle class and the republicans aren't done with the devastation of these two classes. They have been working behind closed doors deciding how to cut the tax rates for the rich and the corporations. We know that the corporations are nowhere close to paying 35% in taxes.
GE, Apple, Boeing and many, many others don't pay a cent in taxes and yet they get tax refunds on top of that. They are keeping their money off shore so they don't have to pay taxes on it.
They got a tax holiday in 2010(?) which let them bring their money back here and not have to pay the tax rates for doing it. And they are asking for another holiday for $3.2 billion.
Trump and the republicans are also working on gutting our social programs and giving money for them to their masters. Trump wants to eliminate LIHEAP which is the program that helps people with their gas and electricity bills. How fucking cruel is that? Let granny, grandpa and the disabled freeze to death so rich people can buy a new car, house or yacht. Gawd! People who are on these programs are stressed enough already because there is such they are already stretched to the limit of their money. Just once I'd like every damn member of congress to have to live in my body and try to survive on this amount of money.
They also want to cut SNAP because they think that we buy the wrong type of food. I bet they spend more for one meal than I get for the whole month.
Just can't wrap my head around the cruelty of those assholes.
There were problems with running a campaign of Joy while committing a genocide? Who could have guessed?
Harris is unburdened of speaking going forward.
US capitalist system cartoons
That cartoon's grandfather:
source
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
@Linda Wood Yeah, let's penalize
I take my pleasures where I can find them.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Sanctions hurt the citizens not the decision makers, anyways.
It's an old tool in international bargaining, and has long outlasted any usefulness it may have had.
The US is going to have to work with the UN and other international groups to get things done or become a rather large island.
You may choose to look the other way, but you can never say again you did not know. ~ William Wiberforce
If you can donate, please! POP Money is available for bank-to-bank transfers. Email JtC to make a monthly donation.
Dang!! And they said it not so nicely. But Merkel hates Trump!
That was an amazing announcement in its utter bluntness. No polite diplomatic talk. Right to their point that they believed the US was trying to force out the Russians and have Europe buy their natural gas from American suppliers.
But saw this article, and get this--economically insane. The blogger says the Senate should get a Darwin Award for what the sanctions contained. Here is a sample:
https://marknesop.wordpress.com/2017/06/15/flirting-with-disaster/
Flirting With Disaster
Plus the author notes that the Russians could simply drop the price which would sink any hope of an American LNG monopoly in Europe.
Given what the article said, in many ways the Europeans will be committing near economic suicide if they totally cut off Russian gas.
I imagine that the sanctions will not be enforced and will be mostly symbolic.
Exactly.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
The debate in the House should be popcorn worthy.
Long, long overdue.
The rest of the globe needs to stand up and tell the US where to put it. Now the asshole in chief is undoing the agreement with Cuba because, what else, he can do a better deal.
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
@dkmich As always, I have mighty
On the one hand, I'm delighted.
On the other, I'm terrified that we're 'opening relations' with them something like this:
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Regarding this:
I say go for it! But do they understand that there is virtually no way that the US can win a trade war of that nature? Even if they go into full meltdown mode and impede the SWIFT system, the blowback will ultimately cripple them, not the other parties.
Complete and utter idiots wield the reins of power, what else is new?
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
But
Russia's president tried to make Clinton unpopular with the American people. Which is more important?
The sooner the dollar collapses the better
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
The only US Senators that opposed the new sanctions
were Rand Paul and Bernie Sanders. The rest can go pound sand.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
Wie man in den Wald hineinruft, so schallt es heraus ...
Merkel sharpens attack on US sanctions against Russia
I like the fact that Merkel (CDU) backs Gabriel (SPD). Me think the lady has had it.
Oh well, as long as these are only trade wars ... Germany won't threaten to
bomb, err, to be a disloyal US- ally, promised .../sThe G20 in Hamburg will be a disaster in the making. Rest assured the "Hamburgers" won't forgive this occupation to come.
Police, demonstrators prepare for G20 summit in Hamburg
Hamburg is a beautiful city. Too pretty to be messed with.
https://www.euronews.com/live
Bill still has to go to the House of Representatives.
Will be entertaining as I am sure that the most rabid anti-Russian senators like McCain will accuse House members of Russian collusion.
Stay tuned.
And there it is. Just what many have said
Interests, not people are what is important to her. So any hope that she might quit backing the US and its global march of terror will continue.
Plus the bullshit excuse for the sanctions! Russia did not interfere with the election and it isn't being aggressive and attacking Ukraine, and so far no one has shown any proof that the Trump administration colluded with them. All I have seen is speculation and innuendos from the very agencies that have lied to us for decades.
Seriously, why are people willing to believe the FBI, the CIA or any of the agencies whose jobs are to lie to us?
Thanks Mimi for the article. There used to be a time when people saw through their propaganda, especially people who considered themselves 'liberals'.
There were problems with running a campaign of Joy while committing a genocide? Who could have guessed?
Harris is unburdened of speaking going forward.
yes, sure, snoopydawg
most people are no saints, no heroes and quite cowardly hiding behind the need of diplomatic language among political circles. It's already a relief if they are not too phony in their US support. Merkel and Gabriel are pro-Europeans and love good trade among the EU countries especially. Merkel's and Gabriel's remarks I think really represent general feelings of the German population vis a vis Trump and their feelings have not so much to do with us (German companies) not making enough profits, I think, but with a sort of disgust over how Trump behaves. He can't undo what he did. (ah may be not, who knows what kind of idiots get bamboozled by him).
Most little people I hear over here are just blunt and say, if the US can't sell their cars here and are mad about it, then they should produce better cars. It's arrogant, but honestly felt like that. And yes, I believe lots of people here really can't stand Trump. We are not used to tweeting shout-outs from American Presidents. I think it's more a matter of behavior. Trump crossed lines. Whereas formerly German politicians tried to be docile and gentile with their US counterparts to convince the German electorate of their intention to have great relations with our former liberator and protector, may be now they are at a point where they think, opposing the US is the thing to do, because the population itself just doesn't like Trump's America and his followers. Of course, that's the anti-Americanism you see in it most probably.
And no, they won't as strongly oppose the US for their illegal wars and their human rights violations. But may be, if one European leader has the guts to oppose strongly and openly, others will follow, because frankly it's not acceptable at all. So far EU and Germany have been a failure in uniting and standing up against US human rights abuses and violations of international war laws. It's a shame. They are all working in cahoots with each other.
I dunno. We have always been a bunch of headless chicken running around when Mr. President and his crew comes along and plays the nice, charming, freedom and democracy loving villain.
And if they sounded a bit "over the top" to our ears, oh well, then they just shrug it off and say "only in America" and they "try to not think about it". So far it worked. With Trump it doesn't.
https://www.euronews.com/live
@mimi Is Trump smart enough
After all, it wasn't very long ago that Trump and Tillerson didn't want sanctions.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Duplicate comment
Apparently I'm of two minds, but thankfully, they think alike.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
Just a side note--dems not okay to put sanctions on Cuba
I thought it ironic that dems lambasting Trump over sanctions based on human rights accusations, but support sanctions on Putin for violating human rights.
Me personally, I am in favor of trade (non-military) as I do believe that it makes for more peaceful international relationships. And the end result of sanctions never seems to work. Half a million Iraqi children dead, Russian economy growing, etc.
Gjohnsit, you're a machine...
Thank you so much for all you give to us.
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
@dkmich Ain't that the truth?
gjohnsit is just a blogging beast.
And he is handsome! lol! just had to toss that in to make him blush!
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Fuck the EU. Uncle Sam calls the shots in Europe
As long as Merkel is in charge, Germany will grovel and bend to Uncle Sam's desires. There's been a pimp/whore relationship between the two for a decade. She may mumble and grumble but come nightfall, she will be out on the street.
I think of the word "vassal"
And "vassal" is such an important distinction, that not using the word to modify most US allies misinforms the world every time it is omitted.
These vassals remain sovereign on their current lands only on conditions of homage and allegiance to the US.
Cuba seeks to become a vassal. The Philippines and Turkey are slipping off into dangerous territory. It's conceivable the US will intervene and remove their sovereignty, after sanctions have destroyed their economies. The people become refugees and migrants.
I could see Australia in that kind of trouble some day.
Vassals have no powerful protectors. The US is their Overlord, and they comply. The US recognizes no equals or peers.
If a vassal or "evil-axis" state has nuclear weapons, the game changes. It makes sense to become nuclear capable, if you don't want to be treated as a vassal of the US. They can even gain the upper hand, as in the case of Israel, and Pakistan to a lesser extent.
That's the way it appears to work, I'd say.
IMAGINE if you woke up the day after a US Presidential Election and headlines around the the world blared, "The Majority of Americans Refused to Vote in US Presidential Election! What Does this Mean?"
There aren't many states with true sovereignty
Brazil and many other Latin American states are largely sovereign, but if they seriously cross purposes with the US they can expect the hammer to fall.
South Africa is largely sovereign, I believe, and Switzerland.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."