What's the Message, Mr. Gardiner?
An open thread dedicated to discussing books, movies, and tv shows we love. And occasionally some politics.
Star Wars, Loss Leaders, and the Democratic Party
I said last week that George Lucas had a record of disappointing his fans, yet getting them to return for more, that was only outdone in American culture by the Democratic Party.
I was just trying to be funny, while also insulting my current least-favorite institution, but it made me start to think about why people, including me, kept coming back for more Star Wars episodes. I'd been disappointed at the end of the saga with Return of the Jedi, and then, after 16 years, had been disappointed again with The Phantom Menace. Why did I buy a ticket to see Attack of the Clones (god knows, the title itself should have warned me away)? And after Attack of the Clones, in which Lucas, bored perhaps with trashing the genre of science fiction, irritatingly took up trashing the genre of detective fiction as well (that really steamed me, since I love detective movies and could see the horrible ham-handed attempt to evoke Bogart's Philip Marlowe, perhaps, or another of the great detective heroes working their street connections)
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iy3yoSwBA_c]
why, in the name of all that's holy, did I go back to see Revenge of the Sith?
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4l5eZp8Ae9c]
I kept hoping it would get better. Why?
Well, for the same reason that I hoped the Democratic party would get better when I was trying to reform it under Howard Dean (and even, to some extent, under Kerry, who had, in late November 2004, finally woken up to the fact that things had gone terribly wrong in this country). Seriously, after growing up under the Democratic party of the 80s, who spent most of their time whimpering under Reagan, after seeing the rise of the corporate Clintons who'd sell their grandmother for more money and power, after watching the utterly shameful abandonment of African-American voters (and really, all voters) in both 2000 and 2004--didn't I know that I wasn't going to get anything good out of the Democratic party? Why did I think it was going to get better?
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qcQ1XM-Oqk]
The more I thought about the Democratic Party and George Lucas, the more familiar the feeling of continually disappointed expectation became. It reminded me of my relationship with my former best friend. We met in college, and formed an incredibly strong bond, as was often the way with young feminist women in the 80s. We had such a close relationship that I assumed we'd be friends until one of us died (or perhaps beyond, as I occasionally thought in my more mystic moments). About 11 years later, our relationship started to fall apart, and, like a dodo-head, I wouldn't accept it. I kept plugging away, thinking surely we could salvage this.
I kept thinking it would get better. Why?
Because it had been so good once.
That's the answer. That's why so many of us kept going back to Lucas, hoping for a return to the glory days of Star Wars and The Empire Strikes Back. We couldn't believe that a story that began so well could decline into crap and actually stay there. There was goodness there; there was something we loved; where did it go?
That's why I kept trying, for about ten years, to save a relationship long dead. There was goodness there; there was something I loved; where did it go?
That's why so many of us kept going back to the Democratic party, hoping for a return to the glory days of the New Deal and the Great Society. We couldn't believe that a party that had brought us this:
There are two ways of viewing the Government's duty in matters affecting economic and social life. The first sees to it that a favored few are helped and hopes that some of their prosperity will leak through, sift through, to labor, to the farmer, to the small business man. That theory belongs to the party of Toryism, and I had hoped that most of the Tories left this country in 1776
But it is not and never will be the theory of the Democratic Party. This is no time for fear, for reaction or for timidity. Here and now I invite those nominal Republicans who find that their conscience cannot be squared with the groping and the failure of their party leaders to join hands with us; here and now, in equal measure, I warn those nominal Democrats who squint at the future with their faces turned toward the past, and who feel no responsibility to the demands of the new time, that they are out of step with their Party.
And this:
And even this!
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmlcLNA8Zhc]
(Yes, I know everybody hates the sweater speech, and thinks Carter is crap, but in fact, what he was saying about energy was true, and he was saying it because he was worried about the welfare of the nation. Truth + concern for the well being of the nation puts him ahead of most Democrats prominent since 1988).
Anyway, we couldn't believe that the Party that had related to us in that way, and had made, at least some of the time, an honest effort to improve the well-being of the country, could possibly be turned permanently into this:
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3ooMrgXido]
Or this:
http://www.truth-out.org/opinion/item/15100-democrats-share-the-blame-fo...
Or, Jesus Christ dancing on a toadstool, this:
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBLNohqquRk]
Then I started thinking about the concept of a loss leader.
loss-lead·er
(noun)
a product sold at a loss to attract customers.
Traditionally, a "loss leader" is a great deal you offer the customer in order to get them to buy more goods or services from you. It's a bit before my time, but apparently the Chevy Corvette was intended to be a loss leader--they assumed men wouldn't be able to afford it and would buy a lower-priced Chevy of some other model. (It turned out they loved it and bought it in droves). This is a subjective perception, so I could be wrong, but I believe the concept of the loss leader has expanded in our current era to include YouTube and Pandora offering you free service with few commercial interruptions at first. Then the incidence of commercials increases, making the desire to pay for the ad-free content more and more intense.
Now, I don't actually believe that the FDR and the Dems, back in the 30s and 40s, thought to themselves "Hey, if we just do some good things for the little people for 25 years or so, we'll be able to be total bastards for the rest of the party's existence, giving the wealthy elites everything they want and riding the biggest gravy train in the world!" anymore than I believe that Lucas said to himself "All I have to do is make two good movies, and those idiots will keep coming back forever." But it's pretty plausible that Lucas did say after the fact "I never have to do anything for the rest of my life but recycle some Star Wars imagery and characters through some shabby, sub-par narratives and those bozos will keep coming back." And it's very plausible that the Democrats know that we're so attached to the historical past of FDR and Huey Long, JFK and RFK, that we'll keep coming back, like idiots, to try to reclaim old glory--
or, like me with my former best friend, to reclaim old loyalty and affection.
One day, after trying to pin her down to a lunch date for three weeks, I just let go.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=de8h27wsxpY]
I recommend it.
Small addendum: that video clip was in the back of my mind the whole time we were conceiving of this website.
Thanks for being here guys. I'm glad you're in the bus with me.
Comments
Great analogies
today, CSTS! At some point, you have to give up after being constantly disappointed. The people of the Rust Belt got tired of being taken for granted and disappointed by the Democratic party. I experienced a similar thing with a high school friend too. It took a long time for me to realize what it was and then I cut my losses. I grew but she never did. Moving on, even if it does not prove to be better, is still better than being suspended in a negative situation.
Update on the Pinnacle Mountain / Table Rock fire in South Carolina where it borders on Transylvania County, North Carolina. We spend a significant amount of time here in Brevard (Transylvania County) but we are not under any threat of fire, just smoke. The fire is not the largest of the Carolina fires, but it now encompasses about 6,000 acres with over 200 fire fighters working to contain the blaze. As of today, it is only about 35% contained. The northern border of the fire is where crews are having a difficult time containing it. At one point, the fire had spread into Transylvania County, NC and nearby residents were very concerned about a further spread of the fire into residential areas. This area is normally a rain forest with parts of the county averaging over 90 inches per year, but I cannot remember the last significant rain this year. Normally we get rain several days each week, but the drought has been extensive and has been a contributor to the spread of these wild fires.
Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
Thank you, gulfgal!
I am deeply concerned about the fires where you are; you live in an area much beloved by me. Hoping for the best.
We are getting a little rain here tonight. I'd like to think it's part of a trend.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
I'm having lunch with my brother today
And he, a NYC Clinton supporter, is no doubt going to want to discuss politics. I've been generic with my responses all through the election, but part of me fears that once he finds out I voted for Jill Stein, he may never speak to me again. Hell, he didn't even want to come home for Thanksgiving because he's mad at our state for going Trump...
I'm trying to get into the frame of mind where I'm okay with however this turns out, but I just hate when this kind of crap makes a holiday more tense and stressful than holidays already are.
It's so weird, this distance between me and everyone I know except for my husband (who saw this duopoly crapfest for what it was several years before I did). They love me and all, but they don't understand how I could possibly NOT vote for Clinton because, you know, Trump is sooooo dangerous. *sigh* its a tough place to be. But I just can't pretend I don't see it anymore. I can't. And it really makes for a huge chasm between me and everyone I love.
So grateful for this site. My equilibrium has been sorely tested over the course of this election, but this place has been a touchstone of sanity in the vortex of insanity created by that bizarre nexus of team red, team blue (not really different teams), and the corporate media. I feel like it turned everyone around me into Stepford wives and I'm in the corner screaming "wake up!"
The ultimate irony? One of them is actually walking around in a WOKE t-shirt.
Just make it clear that no one
owns your vote but you. Praise him for having the courage of his convictions to support Clinton and that you hope he feels the same about your support for Stein. Walk in his shoes and then offer him yours.
Have a lovely holiday!
"The “jumpers” reminded us that one day we will all face only one choice and that is how we will die, not how we will live." Chris Hedges on 9/11
This is good advice.
Hopefully it will work with the brother.
My sister on the other hand is just so aghast that anyone could have not voted for Clinton that I am unable to do this.
She is truly in a fragile place. I have determined that this is not a battle worth fighting unless I want to risk her never talking to me again.
Yaldabaoth, Saklas I'm calling you. Samael. You're not alone. I said, you're not alone, in your darkness. You're not alone, baby. You're not alone. "Original Sinsuality" Tori Amos
Isn't this how it used to be with our Republican relatives?
This is freaking eerie.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
That's a beautiful sentiment, for sure, and
well stated: it is exactly the way things should play out in a rational world. However, the way it is going to play out for many, many people will more closely resemble the old standup comedian version:
"Never criticize a man until you've walked a mile in their shoes. Then you're a mile away from them, and they have no shoes...".
The cracks that have appeared in families and in society at large from this campaign and election aren't going to be easy to wallpaper over. It makes me sort of glad (in a bittersweet way, of course) that my wife and I don't do family for the holidays any more. I'd rather have a holiday than more ulcers, though, and trying to break bread with a rabid partisan attack dog would drive me right out of the room, into my car, and down the road. No smiley, regrettably...
All the best to everybody, and try to bring the Hippocratic oath to family interactions: "Do no harm". And when that becomes untenable, preservation of your sanity should probably matter most.
Gratitude
Probably sounds corny as hell, but when someone tries to draw me into the conversation, I refuse. Suggest the conversation I'd be willing to have is one of Gratitude. What are we grateful for, what can we do better, next....
The election is over. Many of us tried to say how we felt about the Clintons going back to the White House, not much listening. Maybe the words "Move On" apply now?
I will have no one for TG "celebration"
but I keep floating messages of Don't Panic and learn to coexist with the people geographically closest to you. Neighbors. Try to set up local bartering or trading, like (last month) a bunch of zucchini for a bunch of persimmons. Set up informal cooperatives, and protect those closest to you. If we are still alive, it's all good.
Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.
returning to an abusive relationship
Why do go back to an abusive party? It may be in our genes:
Looks like the demorats will remain rats...guess I'll stay Green.
All the best to all of you!
“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”
I am so grateful for this bus
I am so grateful for this bus.
Me too!
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
I just got back from my first PT appointment, post-concussion
My vestibular system is screwed up (again). Seeing same therapist as two years ago, for much the same issues, which apparently were re-activated due to the concussion. Yay, same exercises. No more falling is the plan. And getting the whole eye/body space positioning right. Or left.
For those of you having a large meal tomorrow, it's just me and the dog. Which is fine, I have gall bladder issues, and meat is off the menu. Plus, crappy weather coming in again. Have a good day!
Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.
A dog
is a very fine companion for any meal!
Enjoy the day.
Sorry for the repetition but: "The longer I live and the more I
see of the world and its people, the more I like my dog"...attributed to Pascal
"The justness of individual land right is not justifiable to those to whom the land by right of first claim collectively belonged"
Somewhat conversely, the longer we live,
the more dogs we have! They mostly have had their good points.
Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.
I feel for anyone trying to avoid heated
political discussion over a family dinner table, when nobody will shut up about it. The media is whipping up the furor. It is in our faces, in our heads.
I have not had a single argument over Trump with my blue collar pals. One well-off Dem pal was miffed at me, but called me the morning after the election to say Hillary was a very shitty candidate. She is no longer upset at me for my Stein vote.
I am going to cook an enormous meal for me and my brother. We will likely have some friends show up to eat. The talk will be about football, and all our friends who are recently dead, currently dying, and we will raise our glasses to them, and go see them in the hospital or hospice.
Any political talk will be in jest.
Since the primary began, Clinton supporters treated anyone with a different opinion as traitors. I have never experienced that before. I was not hated because I didn't vote for Reagan, or because I didn't support Hillary back in 2008. I am stunned by the cult behavior. It is irrational.
All I can hope for is that the Clintons all go to their swanky retreat and stay there.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Are you kidding?!?
You're thanking US!?! Wow, when I was advocating the Bern on lof and getting pummeled by the $hillboughts and becoming more desperate by the day to find a site of like-minded individuals that I COULD COMMUNICATE WITH? Well, you were here, and I don't remember who left the link, but here I am. Grateful EVERY DAMN DAY that I am, too!
Hence, my Astonishment that You are thanking us for coming along for the ride! I'm just glad you had the vehicle and stopped to pick up this wayfarer.
And I really do enjoy the company!
THANK YOU!!!
peace
Ya got to be a Spirit, cain't be no Ghost. . .
Explain Bldg #7. . . still waiting. . .
If you’ve ever wondered whether you would have complied in 1930’s Germany,
Now you know. . .
sign at protest march
You're welcome!
And sure, I'm thanking you, because, like a D&D campaign, it's an interactive work in progress.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
While we are all in a thankful mood,
please consider making a contribution to the site.
We should do all we can to keep the place rockin' it.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Nice OT, CSTS, thanks mucho. Interesting insights, and
plenty of room to keep expanding on the thought process. For example, how much is it the idea of not giving up?
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Um, how do you mean?
Clarify the question?
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Sorry for the dalay. All of one's life one is constantly
told to persevere, to keep trying, to find the one little tweak that will bring success at the venture at hand. In reading your essay, one thing that popped into the back of my mind was to what extent are we conditioned to keep hammering away at lost causes and to what extent is that a factor in Sisyphean behavior.
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Excellent question!
Very important, but also can-of-wormsish. Likely to lead into the vexed question of American optimism. One of us should write about this.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Good pre-Thanksgiving Day, all ...
I hope you all, despite all the unhappy things that may surround your thoughts, can find something that is helping you to not despair and have some hope. There is a saying in German that says that nothing is eaten as hot as it is cooked. That's may be how to approach Mr. Trump. the post election exhaustions and the future.
I am greeting you from over the pond, a move and trip and exercize and experience that taught me once again, that in order to grasp things you have to experience them in real time and real space, NOT online.
I still try to read the EB, though I can't get used to the fact that when I am timewise in the mood to log on here and read my "EBs" you are all still busy with other mid-day stuff. Time zone gaps are killing me.
I hope to be back. Giving up, new beginnings and all that stuff, are mostly illusions since one tries them out. You know how tiring it is to be asked by strangers and others all the time of why the Americans have voted for Trump? I try to answer something, but it is hard. Nobody understands the real reasons. Folks here seem to be very confused about the US and pretty "miffed" to say it gently.
I try not to think about it ... the only way to not get down.
May God help us all because we don't know what we are doing, especially in these times.
Happy Thanksgiving Feasts at the dinner table tomorrow ! And thanks to the regulars to keep writing.
https://www.euronews.com/live
Thanks for a very thought
Thanks for a very thought-provoking essay. I can really relate to the losing friends part. In my case people I was very close to became very religious (in one case a young woman stricken with cancer whose missionary mother came to care for her and made her feel that her secular life was an abomination with a slight undercurrent hint that it led to her cancer - horrid!), and I remember yelling and punching the sofa cushions as an outlet for my anger and despair that this new religious focus would ruin our friendship, which it did.
I'm very much for religious freedom, but what I feared is that her entire social life would become church-related activities, and it did. As an agnostic I feel very uncomfortable in those settings because I was raised as a fundamentalist Baptist who completely rejected that view. She and I drifted apart because she kept inviting me to church events, social gatherings because she knew not to even suggest services, but eventually we ended up going to a couple of secular movies together before drifting apart completely.
Meanwhile, I see the Forward Together / Moral Mondays movement led by the NC NAACP and in particular Rev. Barber as one of the most promising templates for a fusion politics encompassing the economic and social justice views of MLK, Jr. Ironic, isn't it?
My Democrat mother (who joined the party after realizing as an adult that everything Republicans had said about Eleanor Roosevelt had been a lie and then that Republicans lie about a lot of things) is very depressed about the election, and last week I upset her by saying some random nugget of negativity about Hillary during a phone call. I really shouldn't have, but it just slipped out. She was raised in a very racist household, which has led to estrangement from her family as we have mixed-race people in our close extended family, one grandchild of hers and two great-grandchildren, so she can't bear to even confront the idea that the Clintons are opportunistically-racist, which is not the subject I mentioned because that would be far too hurtful. It doesn't help that right after the election a white male accosted her verbally when she was eating alone in a restaurant, possibly emboldened by Trump's election. She thinks so. I love my mother more than I care about making any further attempts to change her mind about the Party, and if I could get next to the man that hurt her feelings and sense of personal safety so badly, I'd have a hard time not kicking him in his evil ass.
Left a little somethin'-somethin' in the "tip jar." Happy Thanksgiving to CSTS and everybody here!
Edited to add that my ill-timed comment to my mother was before I knew about the restaurant encounter she had, but I still should have been more sensitive based on past experience alone.
That's a tough one, NC.
I haven't talked about it with my mother.
During the campaign, she said once "Isn't it cute how we think we still have a democracy," so I know she sees some of what's going on--yet she's still interested in watching the Dem convention, listening to their speeches, and she thinks the right wingers ARE deplorable. So, well, I don't know.
I agree about putting personal relationships before politics, mainly because I'll be damned in Hillary freaking Clinton ends a relationship I have with someone I love.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Best of luck dealing with
Best of luck dealing with your various propaganda-created family issues and I do hope they sort out! Awful when one has to walk on eggs, unable to mention facts, to one's nearest and dearest!
I'm actually beginning to wonder if there are paid trolls walking around, verbally and otherwise assaulting women, the way trolls were paid to create violence at Trump rallies and before that, to troll Bernie supporters... if the corporate media makes a big story of this down the road, I'll wonder even more. If this is the case, they may wait until enough incidents occur that actual women will come forward, having learnt from other, less plausible Black Flag/astro-turf propaganda attempts. The point is, I'd suspect, to create a feeling of helplessness and panic, so that people will accept any methods used to purportedly help the situation, as with the massive breaches of Constitutional rights denied people over 9/11 and terrorist excuses. And as with the corporate coup in progress.
Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.
A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.
Hey, y'all
I am sorry for the lack of response today. I'm living in two houses right now; sleeping in one, but the internet connectivity is in the other. Usually I can get over here long enough to set what I've written up to publish and to answer some comments, but today one of my partners fell ill and I spent a big chunk of the day taking her to get her labs done, go to the doc, etc.
She's gonna be OK, but as a diabetic, she has to take infections seriously--so I didn't get over here until 8:30 at night.
It won't be like this forever; in about 5-6 weeks the remodel will be done and we'll be entirely moved in!
So thanks for your patience, everybody.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Warmest wishes to you, CTCS
and appreciation for being able to find you and your visitors here and in the larger site straightforwardly thinking out loud. I owe a great debt to you and so many here now for putting together a place where my thoughts fit, where analysis of events is not regarded with puzzlement, withdrawal, or incomprehension, and where I can sometimes bring in a bit to add. May the signal always be alive.
Thanks!
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
I can relate to this:
My commute is 1500 miles . . .
everybody hates the sweater speech, and thinks Carter is crap
I am not a part of "everybody" apparently. This speech among many signaled that Carter either was listening to people like me or was thinking like people like me.
Well, I'm not either, but I was a child.
It had a huge impact on me. I still walk around the house turning out lights and turning down the thermostat because of him.
Also the first person I ever heard say the words "human rights."
That part of his legacy is not bad at all.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver