Some brief thoughts on The Elephant in the Room
Having just read gjohnsit's essay, I don't wish to contest his carefully reasoned and factually based argument. That would be an act of stupidity, because as there is one thing I've learned is never get into an argument with someone smarter than yourself.
What I do want to say is this. The biggest issue for me is that regardless of whether you agree with gjohnsit or not, we have a failure to communicate problem in this country. And in my mind, that problem is based in large part on the fact that we live in a highly segregated society, even more than 50 years after the accomplishments of the Civil Rights movement.
To be blunt, for many of us, our friends, the people with whom we associate when not at work, and the communities in which we live, are segregated along racial, ethnic, religious and political lines. We often don't talk to, or socialize with, those who are different from us.
The easiest divide at which to to point is racial segregation, especially between African Americans and that amorphous collection of people we call white, but that is far from the only segregation I see. There exists in many towns and cities across this country, segregation along class lines. Working class neighborhoods and professional class neighborhoods, and the most segregated of all, those 1 percent and above in their gated neighborhoods. And of course it doesn't stop there.
When I was younger, back in the early 80's I lived for a time in the Capitol Hill district of Denver, Colorado. At that time it was known as Denver's gay ghetto. That's where one found the largest gay nightclub in Denver. Residents in apartment buildings there were disproportionately gay men and women, compared to the rest of the city. Nearby Cheeseman Park was well known to be a favored cruising are for gay men. Some homophobic people even called it Faggot Park. People who were uncomfortable with LGBT people moved out, which accelerated the increase in the gay population of the area.
That's just one example of how we choose to self-segregate. We don't have two Americas, as John Edwards once claimed, we have multiple ones, and though some of us cross swords online, in real life or "meat space" we keep our distance. We don't mix with those "other" people much. We live in our own bubbles. This community itself is one such bubble. I'm not calling out any individuals here, because this is a systemic problem in America. Perhaps the internet has acerbated this self segregation. I don't know.
My point being, that "reality" for most people is a matter of perception. And we tend to listen and speak to those who reside in our bubble, who hold our world view, or at least share some aspect of commonality, such as the color of our skin.
To my mind, most of our problems today will not be solved by continuing this pattern of engaging primarily with people of our own kind. We all need to make more of an effort to meet and engage with those people who are different from us, and most importantly spend the time to listen to what they have to say. We don't have to agree with their views on every issue or accept that their perspective on the world is the right one, but we have to at least be willing to acknowledge that difference and hear them out, and be open to what they are telling us.
A little humility and the willingness to hear others out rather than simply tell them our views and why we are correct, can go a long way. We live in a country where trust is at an all time low, and suspicion and anger at others, be they law enforcement, black people, white people, religious people, etc. is at an all time high.
That's all. Time for me to leave and attend church. An African American church. See you all later.
Comments
I liked your suggestion
on your last video that we attend an African American church. And you are following through. Good.
In my small town in Texas, there is the Olive Grove Baptist Church. It is way off the beaten path, so I didn't even know it existed for a long time. Racism is a widely accepted "christian" practice here. I am not sure what their reaction would be to a strange white woman attending.
I hope you will talk or write about your experience today.
Thanks.
Marilyn
"Make dirt, not war." eyo
The church was warm and welcoming
as I expected since I had been there before after the Charleston massacre. Got a lot of hugs.
I had hoped to meet with people afterwards at a refreshment/post church event like my UU church holds, but unfortunately they didn't have one planned today.
"You can't just leave those who created the problem in charge of the solution."---Tyree Scott
Cool
When I was a teacher my kids were all shapes, sizes, colors, histories . . . colleagues too. I enjoyed being in a non-segregated setting.
Racism existed, especially in the rural Texas schools. But kids are not born racist. Like the song (South Pacific), they have to be carefully taught. Especially when they are smaller, they all play together happily. As a high school teacher, some kids were suspicious of this old white woman at first. Pretty quick they figured that I liked and respected them.
I don't know how you can be a teacher and be racist. All kids have pure hearts . . . at least deep inside. They respond to respect.
You are correct that we are too segregated. My family, we are sort of hermits. It would take a bunch of courage for me to go to a church where I don't know anyone, but maybe it is what I need to do.
Marilyn
"Make dirt, not war." eyo
You have a good point
I think segregation has gotten even worse because people are more isolated than ever these days. There is no real sense of community in many places.
So when they turn on the TV or go online they find psuedo-communities tailored for their opinions and prejudices. It reinforces what they already think.
The neoliberal propaganda fosters isolation & zero-sum thinking
The focus now, from grade school on up is on competition, not cooperation. It's on compulsion rather than persuasion in politics and foreign affairs and in policing. It isn't on valuing everyone as an individual or on sharing the goodies. Sad.
You are so painfully right,
You are so painfully right, all conditioning for the dog-eat-dog, every-man-for-himself, bullies rule the schoolyard mentality necessary to maintain an abusive relationship of the wealthiest over everyone else.
If Americans realized, as does Bernie, that all Americans are citizens together and that globally we are all humans together, perhaps such carefully designed and often propaganda-inflicted/supported divisions in virtually every area would collapse and we could all come together for democracy in each of our own countries. Apart from those with psychopathic qualities, as humans, we all share far more in common than wherever we may differ in our perceptions and beliefs.
One of my favorite quotes ever: The people united will never be defeated. It Berns, to light my soul with hope.
Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.
A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.
Competition in Texas schools is crazy . . .
They even have calculator competitions.
I was a vocal music teacher and I believe their UIL competitive contests ruined vocal music programs. Only very large schools have choir because in order to exist they need students who will only focus on their program. They require strong commitments from the students so they can win.
There is no such thing as singing for fun.
The whole society here reflects it.
Marilyn
"Make dirt, not war." eyo
In my series on neo-liberalism
I wrote about the idea that the defining characteristic of neo-liberalism is competition. It was in part 1 of the series of what has been thus far a nine week series, I used a personal story as an example of how neo-liberalism has invaded our lives at every level. In my case, it was a change in paradigm of how we who worked in local government were being trained in how we should be operating in the future.
The fallout of this new paradigm ended up being very destructive, not only to us as employees, but also to the public that we were supposed to be serving.
The idea that our education system is based upon the same paradigm is unconscionable and is destructive to young minds who should be experiencing the joy of learning, but instead have become pawns in a very high stakes game of competition.
Do I hear the sound of guillotines being constructed?
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." ~ President John F. Kennedy
Focused on competition
yet there are no such things as winners and losers. Trophies for all and such. Any individuality must be quashed by reminding kids that they are no more special than any other kid in any way possible. The way kids are raised now is a complete mess.
Extremely important comment.
We don't talk to, associate with, those who are different--
has anybody noticed how hard it is to talk to, associate with, anybody at all?
How hard it is even to get people to come over for dinner?
We've got an assault on time and mind going on which is exhausting people. The exhausted isolate themselves.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
I agree with your points, but....
Politics is another area of segregation that should be added your list. If not, we'd all be at top.
I don't think the problem is engaging with your own. I think it is natural for people to want to be with those they have things in common with. I think the problem is the lack of humility and open-mindedness that inflict so many. I'm right, you're wrong! This gets compounded when someone is also forced to conform to the "other. I'd would love it if the US split up into smaller, more philosophically homogeneous countries. We could get at least 7 out of what we mushed into one.
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon
Yes to this:
"A little humility and the willingness to hear others out rather than simply tell them our views and why we are correct, can go a long way."
For reasons that are not relevant now, I have been friended on FB by quite a few youngish African-Americans since the beginning of July. This has given me the opportunity to "listen in" on a lot of conversations. To be completely honest, sometimes my feelings have been hurt and I have wanted to scream back that I am not racist, have always been a liberal and furthermore, I am not even white! (I am a light skinned Latina.) Then I remember that I don't have to worry about my sons being racially profiled when they are walking or driving down the street and shut my pie-hole and listen. There is a lot to be learned.
Now, if only I could have more patience with those with different political views...or not. I am not that evolved yet.
Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur.
I suspect that the real
I suspect that the real problem with political leanings being such an obstacle to understanding is the fact that what was once Conservatism has been taken over on a global basis by a pathological corporate culture.
What we term right-wing (hate) radio, in example, as we know is a propaganda campaign essentially 'normalizing' psychopathic traits drilled into the vulnerable via fear/hate fight/flight reflexive emotional manipulation physically shutting down their brain's ability to reason. Brainwashing and disinformation campaigns aren't actually what I'd consider to be reasonably a political issue, merely a control/programming issue instilling psychopathic traits into what would otherwise be normal human beings.
Personally, I have a low tolerance for cruelty and callousness; incorporating these into 'political stances' won't make me accept such tendencies as healthy or acceptable.
But as liberals, we do tend to feel that we ought to try to understand the viewpoints of others and it can take some time to realize that we cannot understand a lack of empathy or the sort of enjoyment/release some get from the misery of vulnerable others, not just because it's alien to or sickens us but because such negative qualities have been overall weeded out since so anti-survival to herd animals co-dependent on each others cooperation and, in our case, making true civilization impossible and ultimately fatal to our race, when psychopathic personalities are permitted to gain power over societies and especially control of weapons of mass destruction.
A psychopathic society is a dead-ended and doomed one. I don't want to be able to understand the incapacities of those challenged by a lack of empathy and other human feelings and concerned only with their own self-interests to the point where harm to others is, at best, incidental or even an enjoyable exercise of power - and I don't have to try.
My parents were Conservative until the Party became obviously warped, then Liberal until betrayed by their corruption - but without the partisan propaganda soaking much of the US population, it was not the Party but what they stood for and would do for or against the public interest which the public service exists to serve that mattered, which is as it should be.
Take away the corporate PR barrage and how many artificial divisions and other problems gradually evaporate as the light soaks in?
Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.
A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.
Oh yes to that first sentence
I have parents who are, or used to be, Tea Baggers. My mother is dead now, so I no longer have to fight that battle with her, but my stepmom still claims Republican. I have tried telling her over and over and over again that the party she thinks is Republican is no longer any such thing. And for the most part, she does see that, but every once in a while that stunning naivete shows its face and she comes out with some damned right wing trope that sends me right back to intractable anger - I just cannot understand how she can be so dumb with that shit sometimes, when I know she damned well knows better! But your comment is perfect - she still thinks this IS the Republican party, just like she still thinks the "news" is really news and not outright lies. And for her, back in the day, the news mostly was news, so it is easier for her to pooh-pooh all my talk about the corporate lies as just the ravings of her willful stepdaughter.
Of course, now that I've been telling her about Shillary and just how bad she is, can I really be surprised my stepmom is totally confused now?! How to get that through, well, still working on that. She hates Shillary enough that she's maybe going to vote for the Rump, and while I sympathize with that idea of a 'protest' vote, she'll only be hurting herself if she does that. She's 75 and not really up to playing all this multi-dimensional chess these bastards are playing and a big part of that is not her age, but the brainwashing from all that Corporate PR. Yes, without that mess, I think more of us would agree than disagree, on most things too.
Only a fool lets someone else tell him who his enemy is. Assata Shakur
Must add globalization.
I grew up in and around Detroit when the Big 3 automakers built cars there and employed people of all races in their factories. Whites had to work the assembly line cheek and jowl with blacks and people became accustomed to each other even if not best friends. Once America started dismantling its manufacturing base, this was no longer true. Factories moved to low wage areas seeking increased profits and the American multicultural blue collar workforce became a thing of the past.
Yup, and in our race to the bottom
we're now pitting people who have those lousy jobs against people that have none, making even that lousy job better than nothing and one more thing to fight over. And with the Corporate Propaganda screaming away 24/7, that message of fighting off everyone else has taken hold while the real criminals laugh all the way to the bank. Divide and conquer.
Only a fool lets someone else tell him who his enemy is. Assata Shakur
A HS friend, later journalist wrote a book: The Big Sort
It might be simplistic but what he argued then has gotten worse. We live/interact with similar people. Makes life easier.
Cynical me hear Her Majesty talk about going to a black church before KY primary and a white church had been invited to co-service (sound set-up??). Kumbayas rang out. Joy to the world!
Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.
Sunday is the most segregated day of the week
People are comfortable with the local/neighborhood traditions they grew up with. NOBODY can cook your favorite meal like Mom.
On the vision thing:
Anais Nin https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anaïs_Nin
"They'll say we're disturbing the peace, but there is no peace. What really bothers them is that we are disturbing the war." Howard Zinn
If you're talking about race, class, or partisan affiliation,
I agree; if you're talking about certain ideological differences, I don't agree.
The reason this place is called caucus99percent is that my original idea was to have something called Caucus on DK. My idea was that people who agree should have a space where they can talk to each other and decide what to DO. The debates would be on strategy, tactics rather than on fundamental principles (instead of "I support Obamacare; Medicare for All is a pipe dream!" it would be "I support Medicare for All and I think we're gonna get it state by state." "Well, I support Medicare for all, and I think we'll get it via Constitutional Amendment!" Markos nixed the idea by saying a bunch of contemptuous stuff about how people shouldn't be protected from disagreement, failing to note that the Blue Dog Caucus, for example, doesn't have to endure me disrupting their meetings with performance art about the relationship of GDP to wages. They get to close the door, talk to others of like mind, and make plans. We need to do that too.
Given how disorganized and demoralized opposition to the status quo is in this country, it's the last time that we should reach out and talk to those who disagree with us on fundamental principles. We need a space where those of us who share those principles can vent, heal, plan, and assess our resources.
Customarily those places are now referred to as echo chambers or bubbles; I tend to see them as temporary or semi-permanent autonomous zones.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Important distinction.
A truth of the nuclear age/climate change: we can no longer have endless war and survive on this planet. Oh sh*t.
Thanks.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver