Open Thread - Thurs 24 Aug 2023: A Greco-Roman Tidbit
A Greco-Roman Tidbit:
One of the more famous Emperors of Rome was Hadrian or, more properly, Caesar Traianus Hadrianus Augustus (born Publius Aelius Hadrianus). He had a hellenistic view of the Roman Empire, as a commonwealth, and spent most of his reign of 20+ years traveling about the Empire. He really liked and admired Greece, and showed such admiration by setting up building and improvement projects in Greece and creating a federation of Greek cities.
One of the things Hadrian did while Emperor is build a water supply system for the Greek city of Athens. It was, eventually, called Hadrian's aqueduct. It was mostly underground, tunneled through solid rock. Hadrian had a reservoir built to serve water to the aqueduct. It's known as Hadrian's reservoir, of course. It too is underground.
Hadrian's Reservoir (at least part of it) now. Image from https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/hadrians-reservoir by gus619USA Atlas Obscura Member/User
This water system, and the reservoir, was used for almost 1500 years! The Turks in the Ottoman Empire let the aqueduct and reservoir deteriorate from the mid-1400s when they controlled Athens. When Athens was liberated from the Turks in the early 1820s, the water supply situation was desperate. The wells, which had replaced the aqueduct system, were not enough. In the 1840s the Greeks started to construct a new water system and found the old Roman system and reservoir. They repaired it, and started to use it again. The reservoir now has a modern outdoor movie theater above it. Obviously, it is not used for drinking water anymore.
But the Greek government, and the Athens Water Supply and Sewerage Company (EYDAP) is trying to put the reservoir and aqueduct back into use for irrigation water. The huge system is 1900 years old! Much of the water which runs through it is drained straight into the ocean, it can't be used for drinking. EYDAP and the government are working on restoring both the functionality and the glory of this almost 2000 year old water system.
Reduce, REUSE, Recycle. See, everyone can do it :).
And that's my little tidbit for this Open Thread. It's not a lot, and is certainly but a drop of water in the aqueduct of Hadrian's life. I'm trying to get my scholastic side going again and thought I'd start with something small but related to my major point of knowledge, which is the Roman army in northern Britain; this includes the Roman walls, one of which was also built by Hadrian. And I ended up talking about my scholastic jump-start here, of course . So there we are! What's up with you? What's news? Whatcha learning? What's pissing you off, or making you happy?
Comments
Hello Everyone!
Hey, hey! And Hi, Hi! Hope all is well in your part of the world, and with you, today!
It has been a stressful couple of days here. There was a brush/forest fire that started Tuesday night/Wednesday morning. It was about 1 mile from my parent's house, which is surrounded by state forests, with the Olympic National Park on one side. The fire departments did a good job and the fire was out quickly. Still, it scared the crap out of my mother (dad was too into his dementia to know), so I dealt with all of that, interfaced with the fire department, found out information about the fire online for mom and so on. Stressful.
I know sometimes it's not, but I really, really hope y'alls week has not been as stressful as mine! Tell us what's going on and what you are learning and discovering by leaving a comment. Love them!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
We are in a drought
We vacationed last week, and while driving through Louisiana, traffic was slowed by fire trucks putting out brush fires twice. On the return drive, we notice an area that had recently sustained a brush fire.
In my county here in Texas, we have had 2 brush fires, one burning up 200 acres.
I visited Hadrian' Wall in England, but the Hadrian structures in Athens weren't mentioned and were not routed on the tour. Dammit.
I guess I am learning how to lessen my stress. I passed on 2 divorce cases yesterday. I gave them a referral. Let some other attorney listen to how awful and controlling their husbands were for 20 years of marriage.
Thanks for the OT, Sima. Scholastics matter!
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
We've a drought too
but not nearly as bad as yours. All of the state is in a 'drought advisory' and parts of the state are in 'drought emergencies'. My parents are in drought emergency. Who knew? They are on the fringe of the rain forest (which has had no rain for a while).
Your temps are insane. I could not do that. Here, it's been hot, and then, really weird, but cool. Like end of September cool, in August. There are roadside brush fires happening all around here as well. Maybe it's just what to expect now, bleh.
Hadrian's Wall - learned to love it when I lived in Newcastle, right by Wallsend! Glad you got to visit it. When I visited Athens, a LONG time ago, (I was 13!) I think we got to see Hadrian's reservoir. I know we got to see the underground parts in the Olympic Village. It was part of the schooling/teaching we were getting.
Lessening the stress is good! Keep it up! Have a great weekend and thanks so much for stopping by!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
We hit
99 a couple of days ago, which was a record for the date. But a break is coming- the extra moisture from Hilary is adding into our usual monsoonal flow, so tomorrow is going to be *wet*. All at once, of course, so it'll all run off and flood things, instead of soaking in, like it did in May.
The current forecast calls for basically an inch of rain tomorrow- which is pretty unprecedented for these parts in August. We're already way ahead of our normal annual rainfall, with 17.36" YTD against 14.48" average. If this pattern keeps up into the snow season, it is going to get *interesting* around here.
Everybody else, stay cool- while we inflate our lifejackets...
Twice bitten, permanently shy.
Gads, that's a lot of rain.
I hope it doesn't flood! Floods suck, as I'm sure you know. But then, so do droughts, heh. We are cooler than normal right now, hit the mid 40's last night. I mean, in August? Sheez. That's late September temps for around here.
Anyway, keep as cool as you can, and as dry as you can. I really hope there are no floods, but monsoons do that Thanks for stopping by and giving us an update!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Hi Sima
I was talking with someone today who was contemplating the advantages of all the disadvantages. He asked himself what would be more advantageous, flood, drought or fire. His conclusion was either was less risky and destructive than fire. I almost can't believe we are subject to these thoughts. How sad.
I gotta agree with your friend..
It's not something I've thought about much, earthquakes have scared me more, but fire, yea. Fire :(. Drought sucks and it will be worse than say, fire with rain right after (lots of regrowth), but fire seems more dangerous and everything just goes in it, so fast, so fast.
I hope you are doing well! I am much better now that the fire is out!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Good morning Sima, et. y'all. One thing or another, stuff
keeps on coming up. High temps here too and still haven't made it to the coast, but today is the day. We were going to picnic, but instead we will hit a fish/chowder/seafood joint next to a small harbor. If it is crowded, we'll get it for take out and walk down to the beach with it (& a bottle of grenache) and picnic. That section of the coast is supposed to only get up to 67 today, compared to at least 70 here at our place right now. Wherever we eat, we will do some walking in the sand and some walking on a coastal multi-use trail. Heh, I can even claim that it is Doctors orders, so we have to go and indulge.
The Ukies deny involvement in l'afaire Pregozin. Does that mean that they for sure did it?
Biden blames it on Putin, which implicates the US, prolly the CIA who P duped big time not too long ago. It's like one of those logic puzzles. (Members of tribes A an B always lie, and ...) But then again, also, too, is Biden even in the loop? Would it matter if he were? Will this be another Nordstream? Note how once the US alleged that they had intel that the Ukies were going to do such a thing that was somehow accepted as not only evidentiary, but as proof that the Ukies really did do it, and not the prime suspect, which was the US which was the source of said tale implicating the Ukies, once they had failed with their tale that the Rus did it? How did everybody get so fookin' gullible so quickly?
It is garbage pick-up day on our block. Will they somehow gather up and eliminate this week's mainstream news feed? It would really help my mood and attitude.
be well and have a good one
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Empathize with you, EL
Covered our tomatoes with thin white gauze curtain material and they survived very well, although those not covered were burnt badly.
Simplicious has a good read on the Pregozin debacle. His take is nobody really knows what's going on or even if he actually perished.
And Bidone hasn't a clue where he takes a crap.
We will know what didn't happen when the 17 Intel agencies get their story straight.
Why does no one ever question why we have 17 Intel agencies?
Are 16 of them that incompetent?
Neither Russia nor China is our enemy.
Neither Iran nor Venezuela are threatening America.
Cuba is a dead horse, stop beating it.
Budgets -
We have some allegedly pure Intel agencies, then somebody with a much more mundane function creates an internal one to investigate some criminality particular to their principle function. Now they have an extra line item for their next budget request. Other agencies notice and soon everybody who can half-ways justify one has one.
be well and have a good one
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
They are like a plague n/t
In far too many ways, great metaphor
be well and have a good one
edit: fixed typo
That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --
Row cover...
and shade cloth, rock. We've rolls of it still, from our CSA days. I like using row cover when it's warm during the day, but gets down to freezing at night (like we are approaching soon, maybe??). That way the beans and other warm loving plants survive a bit longer and make a better crop!
This is so true: 'And Bidone hasn't a clue where he takes a crap.' He's not even a capable front piece for the powers that rule things. And yet, here we are...
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
The walk, food, at the beach sound great!
Like you said, doctor's orders!
As for l'afaire Pregozin, I dunno who did it. I distrust them all, like you do. I don't have a TV so I don't see the mainstream media and TPTB viewpoints on things as much. That means they all sound nuts when I do see/hear those viewpoints. The lies are so obvious, the glaring areas where details are missing are very visible, the way we are being manipulated is obvious. I think you've experienced this too. As you said, it's a stream of garbage.
I hope you had a great day at the beach, where it was cooler, nicer, good food, great walk!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Fascinating stuff, Sima
I'm a history buff too. Especially new revelations with older times, even ancient Dino times.
Advances in research technology is always finding new info.
Congratulations to the Indian people on a fabulous moon landing and new info to come with what they find at the south pole.
Thanks for linking the current Greek governments efforts with the new human endeavor; reduce, repair, repurpose, reuse, or recycle.
The Five Rs.
Have a great day!
Neither Russia nor China is our enemy.
Neither Iran nor Venezuela are threatening America.
Cuba is a dead horse, stop beating it.
Or, as any old
New Englander will tell ya,
Speaking as a true believer in the "right to repair", of course.
Twice bitten, permanently shy.
Good points
Incidentally, whatever happened to that "Right to Repair" legislation?
Did that quietly get memory-holed?
Neither Russia nor China is our enemy.
Neither Iran nor Venezuela are threatening America.
Cuba is a dead horse, stop beating it.
It'll go
nowhere, if it hasn't already been withdrawn. Planned obsolescence is too much a part of modern business planning, along with removal of ownership entirely (looking at you Microsoft, with your whole SaaS thing). The criminalization of repair is inevitable: repair eats into the profitability implied by eternally-required replacement.
Shit As A Service, leased to you, not sold; with monthly squeeze payments required ad infinitum. Faugh.
Not a fan.
Twice bitten, permanently shy.
Planned obsolescence is celebrating its 100 year anniversary
https://www.sierraclub.org/sierra/2021-4-fall/material-world/built-not-l....
Some of the Right to Repair Legislation is...
going through in various states, like New York about repairs to electronics. BUT... John Deere did a deal about tractors, etc, with the American Farm Bureau Federation. The farmer's can repair the machines BUT in return that board will NOT support legislation for right to repair. So yea, it's been memory-holed. Here's an article from last Jan about it https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/09/tech/deere-tractors-farmer-repair/index.html.
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
THe 5 R's..
Exactly! Thanks for stopping by, and hope you had a great day too! It's cool up here in Kitsap, but I think it's still hot where you are? Anyway, have a great weekend!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Unbelievable propaganda
Crux, never heard of it till now. Okay the channel is from someone in India. This came up when I put Korea news in to the google search bar. That means it's getting pumped. The pitch is two fold. First, portray Yoon as the great military leader. Second, blame his administration's total lack of preparedness for each and every disaster that has occurred since he took office, on the public at large rather than on his incompetence. The Itaewon disaster, with over a hundred fifty deaths. Two major flooding events resulting in deaths. The Scouting International Jamboree, which demonstrated the administration's corruption and complete inability to manage the logistics for such a gathering. The drone incursions by North Korea over the DMZ into South Korea right up and into the prohibited zone around the presidential office in Seoul. Failed military responses intended as shows of force in response to North Korean missile tests, etc. Chosun Ilbo's reporting on the Yoon administration is almost invariably propaganda. The video is slightly out of date because the North Korean satellite launch attempt, such as it was, had already taken place.
I don't expect any government to manage untoward events without a failure here and there but Yoon's administration is completely incompetent. This is because they are not really interested in the national welfare, but their own careers, financial advancement, and the agenda of the US and Japan. The biggest threat to Korean national security and the safety of Korean people is the incompetence and corruption of this president, and his throwback advisers, ministers, and directors, from the corrupt and discredited Lee Myung-bak administration. Yoon just pardoned a bunch of corporate criminals from their prison terms for corruption, embezzlement, and so on. He claimed he did this to "improve the economy." I don't think anything will fix the damage to the Korean economy during his administration while he continues to adopt US economic and trade goals, and damages South Korea's major ties to the Chinese economy.
There have been a series of political events in response to Yoon's support for the Kishida government's non-transparent release of contaminated radioactive waste water from Fukushima. So the video above is a distraction from that as well. Yoon is still trying to milk the Camp David nonsense to get some political traction, it's simply not working. Here's a video in Korean of college students doing some civil disobedience in the Japanese Embassy in Seoul. You don't need to understand Korean to see the action and get what is going on. There were also small demos outside the Japanese consulate in Pusan, and at the beach in Jeju Island. Sixteen of the demonstrators at the embassy in Seoul were arrested for criminal trespass. I understand that at least one got to the eighth floor. Conservative newspapers say it was an attempt to trespass in the embassy. I don't know the layout, but it looks to me like they got into all the common areas. Korean students play an important role in political developments in South Korea, it's a tradition, both in modern times and during the earlier dynasties.
The evening before in front of the National Assembly in Yoido, democratic assemblyman and party members led by Lee Jae-myung, currently being persecuted by the administration held a candlelight vigil in the rain, to rally against the Japanese Fukushima dumping into the Pacific. Lee Jae-myung addressed the rally. I also saw a video of my favorite analyst of Japanese affairs Hosaka Yuji, give a presentation on Japanese impunity and disregard for its own citizens and international community. It was good to see him, standing publicly with the leader of the Korean opposition.
I learned also that a 3 and half minute commercial promoting the Japanese dumping of radioactive waste water into the Pacific was produced by the Yoon administration at a
one millionabout 700,000 dollar taxpayer expense, accenting Yoon's function as a front man for the Japanese administration. Yoon also approveda one billion wonabout 70 million dollar subsidy ostensibly to offset the anticipated market losses to businesses and livelihood's impacted by Fukushima dumping. I didn't hear of any legislative vote approving this expenditure.I'll be interested to see the demos this weekend. The anti-Fukushima demo is supposed to go from Samgakchi plaza, a few hundred meters from Yongsan where the presidential office is, to Gwangwhamun plaza, where the famous statue of Admiral Yi and the US embassy is located.
Great analysis of Camp David in Hankyoreh interview of elder statesman Moon Chung-in -
US, Japan came out of Camp David with clear gains, Korea with more risks, says scholar
https://english.hani.co.kr/arti/english_edition/e_national/1105680.html
Thanks for the OT Sima. My wife and I got into a great conversation stimulated by your post about the Roman aqueducts. I studied European architecture once upon a time, my wife has actually spent a lot of time in Europe more recently as a tourist with her friends visiting famous sites like it.
(edited for spelling/ numerical mistakes)
語必忠信 行必正直
Not sure if this fits but here it is anyway.
It's so serious
It would have been better to give both Koreas an alternative to block politics, traditionally, Korea right up until colonization by Japan had tried to triangulate. Now with Cold War 2.0 we're back to "block politics." Just what the doctor ordered for the war industry. Good job, Curt Campbell! Blinken and the rest of the crew are a wrecking crew.
I found this amusing-
語必忠信 行必正直
That reminds me off this.
You read my mind.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Rahm has always looked like
...he just ate a radioactive fish.
OMG, I'm laughing so hard at this comment!
Thanks!!!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
I laughed out loud
Too funny, and too damn sad too!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Putin wins again
Japan’s import of grain from Russia grows by 5,679% in July — report
From what some pundit said, nobody is going to eat fish from fishers close to the radioactive water release. Japan is stocking up on Russian grain anticipating food shortages. I read that Russia has thee largest fresh water fishery in the world. Maybe Japan others will start importing that protein source from Russia.
But then again, the US may insist that Japanese people eat less for the Ukraine.
They might consider
the old "frying pan and fire" parable. There is a lot of fresh water in the old Soviet Union, yes. But a lot of that took a real beating during the cold war, betwen the nuclear arms race and all of the unfortunate experimentation with chemical and biological agents. It'd be sad for them to exchange the seafood from the Pacific for freshwater fish from anywhere within 750 miles of Mayak or Khyshtym, or anywhere near the river Techa...
Twice bitten, permanently shy.
Remarkable trade figures
I just heard the South Korean prime minister say, a group of their scientists would hang around with the IAEA rep to get an understanding of what the discharge monitoring process entailed. I doubt if they'll have any unchaperoned access to raw testing data, that hasn't already gotten the KEPCO and Japanese government seal of approval. One can always hope. So his public statement was our scientists say its safe so nothing for the public to worry about.
Frankly I wish I would see more economic data and analysis with attrribution to the causes of the economic slowdown especially with concern to the countries in Northeast Asia. What changes are from the covid hangover? What changes are from US sanctions on Russia? China? etc. For a while discussions about the potential impact of the "decoupling" were common. Now? I've lost the bubble.
語必忠信 行必正直
Thank you for the very good
summary and analysis of what's going on with Yoon and South Korea. It was a very good read. I learn so much from your comments! I want to join in the protests about the release of the radioactive water from Fukushima. I completely support them. But, nothing here in the PacNW about it. Until the radioactive sealife start washing up on the shores, of course.
Glad you and your wife enjoyed this post about the aqueducts. It's an interesting topic! Have a great weekend, and thanks again for teaching me so much!
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Always the consummate diplomat so I went to his twitter page
to see Blinken's response to BRICS expansion.
First the details.
https://www.aljazeera.com/economy/2023/8/24/saudi-arabia-iran-to-join-br...
Back to Blinken's twitter page and this is all that I could find.
US press no show at BRIC meeting?
BRICS definitely has a cooler-looking presence
...than your run-of-the-mill geopolitical trade organization..
Are they just ignoring BRICS?
It sure seems like it.
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so
Putin speaks with regards to Prigozhin.
What the media hides.@narrative_hole
Good news from the dermo:
The upper lip spot was pre-cancer, thus frozen, not sliced. Same with 3 very new and tiny moles around my eyes. One tiny mole on my top eyelid was removed by a slice. It took only a few minutes, and my fear of repeated trips to the doc's office was eliminated. Over, done, very little tissue removed, no follow ups required. No scarring expected.
There is a 17% cance of rain tonight, and I see some dark clouds in the distance. If it happens, it will benefit the town 17 miles away, not this one.
Dammit.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
Glad to hear the good news...
And that nothing was very dire, with no scarring and no follow-ups. Yes!!!
Hoping the rain, if it happens, benefits your town too. Maybe your town is a bit like mine, it rains all around, but not right here a lot of the time... For us, it's because we are in a mountain's rain shadow.
If you're poor now, my friend, then you'll stay poor.
These days, only the rich get given more. -- Martial book 5:81, c. AD 100 or so
Nothing ever changes -- Sima, c. AD 2020 or so