Is this the reason for all the anti-China hate lately?
I've been puzzled by the amount of anti-China propaganda, until I read this.
The pandemic only accelerated the timeline. The Health Silk Road will run in parallel to the multiple overland Silk Road corridors and the Maritime Silk Road.
In a graphic demonstration of soft power, so far China has offered Covid-19-related equipment and medical help to no fewer than 89 nations – and counting.That covers Africa (especially South Africa, Namibia and Kenya, with Alibaba in fact announcing it will send help to all African nations); Latin America (Brazil, Argentina, Venezuela, Peru); the arc from East Asia to Southwest Asia; and Europe...
A Health Silk Road is already in effect when we see China, Russia – and Cuba with its first-class health system – sending teams of doctors and virologists as well as planes with medical equipment to Italy, and China sending drugs, test kits and supplies to illegally sanctioned Iran.
China immediately understood what was at stake as it saw Covid-19 ravage many hot points of world-famous Made in Italy.
China has helped 89 countries during the pandemic, while we've helped...(check notes)...no one.
China is making us look bad.
Not only are we not helping anyone, we are actively hurting those countries that help other countries.
WASHINGTON has come under fire for blocking much-needed medical supplies from reaching Cuba for a second time, with Swiss groups branding the six-decade-long economic blockade “a criminal act.”The aid had been collected by the Swiss solidarity group MediCuba Switzerland and had been intended for Covid-19 patients on the socialist island.
...
Because of the blockade Cuba is unable to receive vital medical supplies needed to stop the spread of the Covid-19 pandemic including ventilators and masks along with fuel and food for its people.
That'll teach those Cuban doctors!
Just the other day the world witnessed something rarely seen.
Venezuela has received refining materials via plane shipment from Iran to help it start the catalytic cracking unit at the 310,000 barrels-per-day Cardon refinery, which is necessary to produce gasoline, an official said on Thursday.The shipments mark a new stage in cooperation between the two OPEC nations that are both facing crippling U.S. sanctions, with their levels of oil production and exports declining in recent years due in part to the pressure from Washington.
Meanwhile Europe has defied U.S. sanctions for the first time.
France, Germany and the United Kingdom confirm that INSTEX has successfully concluded its first transaction, facilitating the export of medical goods from Europe to Iran. INSTEX and its Iranian counterpart STFI will work on more transactions and enhancing the mechanism. pic.twitter.com/0z4KJwDjuw
— GermanForeignOffice (@GermanyDiplo) March 31, 2020
Comments
China has even helped the US
It has now sent 2.4 billion face masks to America - 7 masks per person. China has also sent 1,255 ventilators to Los Angeles and 1,000 to New York City.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJ81HY_M-zI]
Bullshit?
I'm unable to find any evidence of your claim that China donated 2.4 billion masks to the United States. There is this, however:
And this:
Also, on April 11, NY Times reported that China ceased shipments of medical supplies due to quality issues. On April 16, Wall Street Journal reported that 2.4 million (NOT billion) face masks are stuck in warehouses in China and can't reach the United States because of Chinese export restrictions.
Please explain your post. As far as I can tell, it's totally false and should be deleted.
So now Biden is trying to one-up Trump on sinophobia
To mock Bernie Sanders: Least consequential election in American history. This one is up there with Obama versus Romney or Kerry versus Bush Junior.
“When there's no fight over programme, the election becomes a casting exercise. Trump's win is the unstoppable consequence of this situation.” - Jean-Luc Melanchon
2004 meant the world to me
In the Land of the Blind, the One-Eyed Man is declared mentally ill for describing colors.
Yes Virginia, there is a Global Banking Conspiracy!
2004 was a bad year for everyone
“When there's no fight over programme, the election becomes a casting exercise. Trump's win is the unstoppable consequence of this situation.” - Jean-Luc Melanchon
Gore rolling over first
I watched this live when it was happening and couldn't get over how bored he looked while listening to people from the black caucus.
No democrat stood against the theft either. Including our pal Joe. Anyone know where Bernie was then?
Was Humpty Dumpty pushed?
Bernie was still in the House
so it wasn't on his watch.
There is no justice. There can be no peace.
Thanks
I was leaning that way, but I wasn't sure. Just. One. Senator.
Was Humpty Dumpty pushed?
Unbelievable
In the Land of the Blind, the One-Eyed Man is declared mentally ill for describing colors.
Yes Virginia, there is a Global Banking Conspiracy!
Been seeing stories
about China’s medical gifts to other countries being defective. I don’t read them, just check the headline, because it does seem like China is this season’s Russia as far as a ”Monster Abroad” goes. A lot of anti-Chinese stories around; not that the CCP isn’t evil and insane. But then again, what Elite anywhere isn’t?
Orwell: Where's the omelette?
Just looked up
To answer the essays title: Trump’s faction of billionaires has a preference for war with China, and apparently that’s the ruling view now.
Orwell: Where's the omelette?
Dup post deleted jp
Orwell: Where's the omelette?
The Chinese people like their socialist government
Over 800 million people have been lifted out of poverty in China since 1990. Xi Jinping expects to eliminate poverty completely by the end of 2020. He has always maintained a very close relationship with the Chinese people unlike his western counterparts.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aee70NLVIr4]
We should leave them be and not try to push our phony western style democracy on them.
China is rapidly outstripping the US in high tech infrastructure projects and is doing the same in dozens of countries all around the world. This is why China is America's existential enemy. But, the US doesn't have a hope in hell of preventing or countering this global socioeconomic shift short of global war - which America would lose badly. The much vaunted U.S. Pacific Fleet is nothing but holes in the water waiting to be filled.
So how did we get in this unenviable position? Martin Luther King spelled it out in 1964: "A nation that continues year after year to spend more money on military defense than on programs of social uplift is approaching spiritual death."
That’s the part that was missing when Germany reunified
“If you like your socialism [= the good parts of the old East German system that were genuinely beneficial to ordinary working-class people] you can keep your socialism.”
You miss the Stasi?
I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.
What has the Stasi got to do with socialized
pensions, health care and education? Last I looked there was no Stasi in Canada.
To you, socialism automatically means an East German type Stasi?
Why would you think that?
And why would you think I or anyone nowadays would view the Stasi as one of the East German system’s “good parts”?
Because you deplored reunification
I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.
@The Voice In the Wilderness
.
What the hell? Do you have a link to a comment(s) by lotlizard that proves your statement?
Your bias is showing again. If lotlizard asked you how many people you shot this weekend in Chicago, would you get the irony? I certainly would.
Hehe
I want my wall back.
There were folks on both sides that could relate, for different reasons of course.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
Really? That‘s your interpretation of what I said above?
I don’t believe it. It seems more likely that you know very well what was meant, but have some reason for not approaching discussion with me in good faith.
Yes, really
good faith? i see there is no reason to continue this conversation.
I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.
One thing that scares me shitless about them:
In related and very recent news, though, this charming and optimistic (even, dare I say it..."American"?!) story: https://thediplomat.com/2020/04/in-milk-tea-we-trust-how-a-thai-chinese-...
In the Land of the Blind, the One-Eyed Man is declared mentally ill for describing colors.
Yes Virginia, there is a Global Banking Conspiracy!
The US has it's very own version
of "Social Credit Scores" as Snowden has revealed.
Here's an example of America's Spider Query tracking personal cell phones:
These very same phones are used for our audio/visual communication with one another, purchases of goods and services and a dozen other things. Once this data will be fed into the coming AI computers, THEY WILL KNOW, before you do, when you need to have a shit. Of course it will just be a number, but that is sufficient. Computers handle numbers better. Scan your face, a number comes up. Then, pardon the pun, one can say in all honesty that "Your number is up".
Facial recognition in the US? Yep. We got that covered.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yet_MxwPBNc]
The problem is that we do not know how deep this surveillance goes nor what the PTB are doing with the massive amount of data they are collecting about each and every citizen.
But the new generation doesn't even seem to care about this. They are texting the most intimate details of their lives to one another w/o realizing big data is collecting it all. Fifteen year old kids sending pictures of their tits and dicks to one another to be kept on file forever.
"Whataboutism" isn't exculpatory
The whys and hows of America's shabby government have little to do with whether and how China's is bad (or not).
Honestly, as an American, if I have some hobson's choice on this I'll take America's over China's. They're both terrible, but ours is less likely to be terrible domestically, on the whole (even though it's still pretty bad). I can only afford so much time and money fighting an oppressive oligarchy, and it's easier (domestically speaking) to fight America's than China's.
I wasn't trying to be exculpatory
I just stated the both countries are on the same path (as are many other nations in this wired world). It's a fact of life you will not be able to avoid. I also stated that the new generation, both in China and the US, don't seem to value privacy as much as us older folks do. Maybe it is because you don't miss what you never had?
Relatively few people in the US under 25 think deeply about their government as long as they can get an education (more important for the average Chinese), earn enough to go to the mall and party at the club/beach/lake. The Chinese have similar feelings about their government. The one big difference is the Chinese, with their new found wealth, like to not only travel within China but to foreign nations as well. Reminds me of the 50's and 60's in America - get an education, a new job, a new home, a new car and the freedom to travel on your holidays. Money spent by Chinese tourists traveling around the world is now double that of Americans in $US.
Law abiding citizen's of both countries fare about the same vis-à-vis the state. The big difference is when one runs afoul of the law. The 2020 incarceration rate (per 100,00) in the US is #1 at 737 while China is #13 at 116. The US rate is almost 6.5 times larger. China understands that poverty and lack of education are the main factors in crime so it is why they are going to such great lengths to ameliorate them.
I don't think many Americans truly understand China and the tremendous changes that have taken place in the last 3 decades. The one thing that seems to prevent this is American notions of superiority - the result of over a century and a half of womb to tomb inculcation of American Exceptionalism which prevents many from looking at the rest of the world in a balanced and fair manner.
But this is changing:
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIK5PmkOEvA]
Did y'all catch this down thread?
https://moderaterebels.com/transcript-economics-american-imperialism-mic...
Video or transcript.
“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”
Yes I did.
The Chinese are having their American 1950's and 1960's right now.
That is what terrifies me most of all
WHAT DO WE DO?!?
I WILL NOT accept this as the new normal. I WILL NOT allow 20 years to nullify all that people have fought so hard for for the prior 250. I WILL NOT live as a docile piece of cattle.
In the Land of the Blind, the One-Eyed Man is declared mentally ill for describing colors.
Yes Virginia, there is a Global Banking Conspiracy!
Yes, and the German people
Orwell: Where's the omelette?
Ever heard of Godwin's Law?
How about glass houses and rocks?
Where do you think "der Führer" got the funds and expertise to rebuild the destitute and destroyed post WWI Germany and bring 70 million out of poverty with restored cultural pride?
Hitler could never have come to power without the tacit approval and financial/technical support of the wealthy American industrialists and bankers in the 1920's to 1940's. All done while the US government turned a blind eye. BTW, if you have ever read Mein Kampf you will find that Hitler held US manufacturing expertise in very high esteem and tried to emulate it to great success (with considerable assistance from US companies). He also wrote that one of the important reasons Germany lost WWI was because their propaganda was very crude and coarse. He proposed the Nazi party should employ the powerful techniques developed in America by Edward Bernays Crystallizing Public Opinion (1923) and Propaganda (1928) to make the German people proud of themselves and their country. Goebbels didn't invent propaganda, he just read Bernays' books at Hitler's request.
The following is a fascinating account of this collusion with Hitler and the Nazi party:
Here's more:
"The Devil's Chessboard"
Only a fool lets someone else tell him who his enemy is. Assata Shakur
jeezum crow;
your vast knowledge and research abilities are epic. (not to mention your RAM memory banks.)
on next day edit: i'd actually meant this for CB, but yours, as well.
Thinking of the U.S. as a humanitarian nation is absurd.
Opposite Day c.1984.
The definition of “humanitarian” is
not
“ …and when we destroy nature, we diminish our capacity to sense the divine,and understand who God is, and what our own potential is and duties are as human beings.- RFK jr. 8/26/2024
You ever hear about
Dude Xi and the CCP are insane. I know Chinese in the US who won’t say anything bad about Xi, but watch their faces turn to disgust at his mention. Fuck, Bill Gates and Musk are materially successful and bat shit crazy. But let's continue this discussion after you’ve held up a sign in Beijing “The CCP is bad.” Oh, wait, ...
Orwell: Where's the omelette?
And America has never persecuted
Only a fool lets someone else tell him who his enemy is. Assata Shakur
Not to mention the many times our government
has used bio weapons or chemicals on us just to see how they work. Who actually released the anthrax while could was pondering the patriot act? The few senators who weren't on board with sure got on board pretty darn quickly after that.
Was Humpty Dumpty pushed?
You were the one to bring up Hitler and apply
it incorrectly to China. Xi's rise to power in China is not comparable to Hitler's rise in Germany. If anything, it was diametrically opposite to pre-WWII Germany. The US has tried for untold decades to keep China from developing and also schemed to make Chinese citizens antagonistic to their government.
'I personally know someone who hates Xi so he must be a bad person.' is not an argument.
If you want to understand how and why Xi rose to the position of General Secretary in China and why he is so popular, can watch the three part Time of Xi on YouTube. Here's a synopsis. You can Google for the videos if you are curious.
80% of Chinese students who are studying in the US now return home to China because there are greater opportunities since Xi's reforms. Especially with the Belt and Road Initiative gaining momentum in the ASEAN countries, Central Asia, Middle East, Africa and South America. China's soft power has now eclipsed America's.
Since WWII, the US invited students from all over the world to study in American colleges and universities. Upon graduation, these foreign students were given lucrative incentives to remain and become landed immigrants. This resulted in a massive "brain drain" into the US - countries like Russia, Iran, China, eastern Europe, Middle East and Africa - to the detriment of many of these countries. This is why the US became the economic and innovative powerhouse of the world.
But times have changed. These foreign students are now returning in greater and greater numbers to their countries of origin. Is this unfair to America? No. These students invariable paid full tuition and the schools have come to rely on this funding. If it stops then American students will have to pay the full costs making education even more unattainable for most.
BTW, the impact of this reversal of fortune will be felt all over the world to the detriment of the US. Maybe we can call it payback time?
Do you know what a unicorn is?
Chinese report counts 206 unicorns. That's more than America
As a final comment. I don't judge another country what it does internally as long as the majority of their citizens have no problems with it. Hey! That's kinda of democratic don't you think?
Well, I disagree on two counts:
They may be paying full freight, but it is incorrect to assume that there is an inexhaustible supply of advanced scientific education. Taking money to educate the nationals of other countries means there is less space in those institutions for Americans. (The same thing is happening, by the way, between US states. Flagship state universities, which have been inexorably stripped of their state subsidies for undergraduate education, are happy to attract rich out-of-state students who will pay full-freight while occupying limited-availability spots. Meanwhile, in-state students are shunted off to the less prestigious and less expensive secondary campuses.)
What I think is that I am happy to judge any country according to how it treats various subpopulations, regardless of whether they are a majority or minority; and also, according to how its theoretically "internal" conduct affects the rest of the planet. Moreover, the "majority" defense loses even more credibility in a context where access to information is being actively suppressed, rendering the opinion of the majority an object of questionable merit.
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
Will let you and the
My view is the Chinese gov't went in CYA mode at the outset until they could figure things out, but realized they had a major health crisis on their hands that could be traced back to Chinese bio lab sources. My pure guess is that the virus was accidentally released from a bio lab in Wuhan that may also have been involved in bioweapon research. I don't know whether the lab was connected to the gov't.
Since that early too-slow-by-far start, when the virus could have been nipped in the bud with prompt action, the Chinese gov't has done far better at controlling the spread over there than of course stupid Trump has here. So, at best a mixed bag for Xi -- but oh, what might have been with a quick initial response.
As to your one cite above on the links to US businesses and major figures, I'm not familiar with any JPK association with Euro fascist gov'ts. Your cite goes to an old article which doesn't carry an author's name that I could see. Much nonsense has been written about JPK, mostly bc the family decided not to respond for many yrs (a decision they recently came to regret). I wouldn't put him in the same pro-Nazi league as Lindbergh or Henry Ford or any kind of pro-Nazi or pro-fascist league. He was a pro-FDR Democrat and capitalist too interested in keeping the US out of the looming Euro war, and interested too in his business and making money for his large family. He had great political ambitions for his sons, which would have come to naught in any fascist regime here, which he thought possible once the inevitable Nazi conquering of England occurred.
Dr. Li was never arrested.
He was made to sign a paper at the police station that he had made a mistake by officials of local city/provincial government (since fired) and released to go back to work. He had sent messages on WeChat that he believed the SARS virus was spreading in Wuhan. That was NOT correct. The Chinese government had yet to determine what the outbreak of unusual pneumonia was caused by and an investigation was already underway. The Chinese people knew what SARS was from the previous epidemic in 2002. The last thing the Chinese government needed was a panic reaction at this time. They had to determine exactly what was going on.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-Fy80yHYQo]
More videos by Nathan Rich about the situation in Wuhan. He covers every aspect of it.
Guesses are worth shit and only serve to obfuscate and muddy the waters. There is zero evidence the Wuhan BSL-4 lab (built with the help of the French) was working on bio-weapons. They were studying coronaviruses because that is why the lab was built in the first place. To understand how these viruses function and how they can be controlled.
How much faster could China have responded?
Timeline of the 2019–20 coronavirus pandemic in January 2020
They didn't know what they were actually facing until mid January. Then they had to decide what to do in a province with 72 million inhabitants. And it had to be done in secret, otherwise thousands would have left before and spread the virus throughout China. On Jan 20 the Chinese government shut down the city of Wuhan (11 million). Many Western media called this a human rights violation. On the 23 of January, construction started on one of two special purpose hospitals were started. These were designed specifically for communicable disease. Unlike normal hospitals where the air pressure is positive to keep germs out, these hospitals had negative pressure in the wards to keep viruses from spreading to other areas in the hospital.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWp6vSHFG4M]
The Dark Side Of Joseph P. Kennedy Sr., The Patriarch Of The Kennedy Family
Joseph P. Kennedy: Controversial Ambassador to Great Britain
Joseph Kennedy and the Jews
[video:https://www.aim.org/aim-column/profiles-in-treason-joseph-kennedy-tyler-...
We'll have to agree to
As for JPK, none of your cites shows anything connecting him to any Euro fascist gov'ts or anything resembling that, and there is an anti-JPK tone in all of them.
The best source for JPK info, good solid research and not speculation, rumors and hearsay gossip, is by historian David Nasaw who was the first biographer to be allowed by the family to go into the large JPK archives at the Kennedy Library. For a lot of the negative stories and rumors, it's interesting that Nasaw found that most started years after his death (convenient to avoid lawsuits) and were often sourced back to dubious characters and their ex-wives. I don't recall him writing about any JPK association with any Euro fascist gov't, and that would have been a huge find, repeated in all the major book reviews.
On the anti-semitism question, Nasaw takes a nuanced view, takes account of JPK's harsh comments and the times and the attitudes of many of the upper class then, including FDR. I wasn't aware that JPK had been interested in the late 30s in negotiating an escape for many Euro Jews via one of the Brit colonies in Africa, as he knew the Brits would close off Palestine to Jewish immigration.
In any case, the Nasaw bio (Patriarch) is now the gold standard for reliable info on JPK, someone whose character has been unfairly tarnished over the years by all sorts of profit-seeking hack writers and propagandists dealing in rumor and hearsay.
I don't believe you are reading the links I supplied
Please tell me what information was deliberately covered up and kept secret. I have been personally following this since early January.
Keep in mind that the earliest cases were only discovered retrospectively because the virus had not been sequenced until Jan 10.
That's their government propaganda
The Chinese government is incredibly repressive and at least as violently inhuman as our own government--the primary difference is their violence is turned inward, in service of their oppressive government, whereas ours is turned outward in an (perhaps doomed) attempt at keeping everyone in check with fear.
Believe what you want
huawei's 5G phones enter into it, too.
trump's banned them in the US (dinnae work), but there are any number of...confused people who believe that i) china listens thru back doors in the software (including this administration, and ii) that the EMF radiation by 5G towers is causing cornonvirus.
on the other hand, i've read that the biggest chich with hauwe's products are that the NSA can't break the encryption. as to that i can't really say. but i sure do Love the Idea.
but china and russia are emerging as Great Power Competitors, and 'we can't have that', can we?
Much as I oppose
sanctions in general, and think the US is shooting itself in the foot with its abuse of them...
I really don't get what the issue is with that Swiss group. It's not like Cuba has no international trade - if they want to contribute needed goods then why not simply buy and send them?
If they want to contribute money and they think the Cuban system is not corrupt then what's to stop them from trotting down to the Cuban Embassy and just handing them cash?
The "issue" with that Swiss group
Helms-Burton lawsuits gives US citizens a cause of action against U.S. and non-U.S. third parties “trafficking” in that property in Cuba. Specifically, the Act allows plaintiffs in many cases to seek treble damages against any person [potentially including non-profit corporations] currently profiting from the expropriated property.
In addition, organizations sending goods to Cuba are liable for huge fines under the various sanctions acts.
It's the sanctions on
non-US third parties that tends to annoy non-US third parties.
Yes about 3rd parties.
They are rightfully pissed off when the planet's bully attacks them. Our entire sanction and embargo regime is messed up beyond all repair and needs to be dismantled and discarded.
that's exactly what they tried to do
Whatever bank the Swiss used to purchase the goods
(even if they took cash out to do this) would be fined millions of dollars and/or cut off from the US controlled Swift (Society for Worldwide Interbank Financial Telecommunication). The bank could then no longer clear checks or do any other banking with any other banks in the world who are connected to the global Swift system. Also, no banks in the world connected to Swift are allowed to receive money from Cuba.
It's next to impossible to fight the allegations. So, most banks just pay the penalties.
Thanks, people
for the clarifications.
Yes, the US truly is pissing off people around the world with this stuff (FATCA another egregious example).
I bought some Iranian dates from the Brazilian bodega today - wonder how many millions I can be fined for that?
'One, Two, Many Alternatives to SWIFT!'
I also think US debt is part of the issue
The last few years they have been selling USD to buy gold but none the less it might explain some of the animosity...
Much older comparison with other countries...
Michael Hudson explains it well
https://moderaterebels.com/transcript-economics-american-imperialism-mic...
Here's the China part cued up
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paUgY6SGlgY&t=26m24s]
“Until justice rolls down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream.”
I'm extremely skeptical of anything the Chinese government does
or says, for very similar reasons that I'm skeptical of our own government.
China's ascendance is definitely not a good thing for America, and it's certainly not a good thing for its own people. Their government is worse, domestically, than ours is, by orders of magnitude and in many aspects in ways that Americans can scarcely conceive.
There are plenty of very good reasons to both despise and fear a rising China. The world is no better off, and in many ways would be much worse off, with China as the top power--and America would definitely suffer under that scenario. I'm not particularly excited about that possibility.
Based on what?
China has been the richest most powerful nation on Earth, as recently as the early 19th century.
They never threatened America, Europe, or even India
Based on this?
Invasion of Tibet in 1950; Tibetan Uprising of 1959; War with India in 1962 (Sino-Indian War).
Your examples don't prove anything
I said "They never threatened America, Europe, or even India."
The War with India in 1962 (Sino-Indian War) was border skirmish.
Right, no threats against India for a short while.
8/4/2017 - "If war breaks out, the Liberation Army will use its thunderous might to deliver a painful lesson to India," the Global Times (part of the Chinese Communist Party's People's Daily newspaper empire) said on Friday. "The Modi government should understand the powerful delivery capabilities and overwhelming firepower of the Liberation Army."
And...?
Oh, you mean verbal threats.
My bad. I meant IRL threats.
You know I remember Saddam made similar threats against us.
The 19th century was a long time ago
and while "authoritarian" describes China's government, it's a bit...sterile...to do the conditions there justice.
In addition to what edg noted, China right now is engaged in international warfare just like America--but they use economic force abroad and reserve their violent police powers for their own citizens.
They aren't giving "loans" to desperate countries abroad, like in Africa (where, incidentally, they are also expanding their military presence) or building huge (and possibly/probably poorly constructed rail lines) for anyone's benefit but the China's.
One should apply the same skeptical eye to any country that seeks to be a dominant power as we do to America.
The 19th century wasn't a long time ago to China
They've been the most powerful nation on Earth several times, but unlike America they never tried to conquer the world.
But they don't seek to be a dominant power as we do to America because America doesn't reserve their violent police powers for their own citizens.
Huh?
Maybe you are technically correct. China (to be specific the CCP) doesn't want to be "a" dominant power, they want and fully intend to become "the" dominant power.
Uh huh
I'll wait on your proof
It's amazing how difficult it is
...to make that profound point about China inside the US. USians cannot fathom a powerful people who do not wish to invade another nation and steal all their stuff.
Impossible to make that point about Persians, too.
There's even a perfect historical example
Imagine bringing 100,000 soldiers with you and NOT invading
You might want to talk to
the Vietnamese...
Well that proves it then!
In 4,000 years of history they managed to conquer Vietnam and Korea.
London and New York are obviously next.
The greatness of civilizations ebb and flow.
.
We live in a world where no nation wants to live under the punishing fist of a "Top Power." No one wants to live under a dictatorship that must believe it is exceptional. Dictators always grow insane and corrupt with power. They start killing and seizing the wealth of others. They bring chaos and fear to the realm. Although US civilization has only a very brief history compared to other nations, Americans seem recognize the terrible cycle that begins when a single, powerful, ruling entity rises to the top — and forces its selfish will on all those below. Such structures have always ended in destruction and tragedy, and a century of suffering.
In the 21st century world, there are 40 developed nations with well-functioning civilizations. The three superpower will constitute a multipolar world. They will form a cooperative counsel to oversee the peace but will not take sides, and will rescue nations in crisis. The First Principle, however, is to support a global Vision where all nations are lifted into a self-sustainable world. Three is a perfect number for checks and balances and for displays of altruism. The superpower's own governments will remain separate, each participating at the UN, where all nations interact and solve problems.
Currently, the rest of the world is watching the last empire lurch and thrash on the global stage in its death throes. They have witnessed the unspeakable inhumanity of the deadly sanctions that the US continues to force on target nations, who are struggling with the Pandemic. The US blocks needed medicines and supplies, gloating over the ensuing death and tragedy. In the 21st century, no nation will put up with the United States as a self-appointed dictator. They are now freeing themselves of Dollar hegemony. They saw the Dollar debased and distributed to the wealthiest and most corrupt of the American oligarchs, who have run off with it. The one percent don't want to live in a dystopia, where the population is armed and angry. Capitalist America without a safety net for citizens, where the homeless are hunted by a virus plague, will become a place no one would wish on themselves.
There is a new vision in the world. All nations living sustainably, enjoying the variety of cultures and trading with one another on the modern infrastructure that China is building to connect them all. They will prune their populations and live without desperation, in peace.
This China worship is as misplaced and dangerous
as democrats' worship of their party.
This:
is dangerously naive. China's already projected its authoritarian influence by economic means. It has even meddled in America's domestic sphere by economically punishing companies and organizations that do not follow their rules with respect to censorship and praise of China. There is no scenario in which China has the influence you describe that includes peoples of nations living without fear of the government or China's operatives.
Funny,
that's how a lot of people in other countries look at the US.
China worship? Seriously?
This is a little harsh don't you think? I don't see anyone doing anything close to this. Maybe you might want to question why you believe what you do and see if it's because who is telling you about China.
Every time this country decides it's going to war it starts off with a massive propaganda campaign against them first so people will get on board with it. Nukes and mushrooms clouds ringing any bells?
Was Humpty Dumpty pushed?
I deal with China regularly
as part of my job. As in, directly with citizens and government officials there.
It may be harsh, but I just don’t see how anyone could view China in a positive light as presented in the quote in my comment. They aren’t interested in building the world up, they’re interested in having the influence (and using it, in many ways similarly to the US) and prestige that comes with being a world power.
@snoopydawg Not harsh -
Bay Area Lefty is just paying attention as far as I can tell. There are a few people posting whose essays might as well be titled:
"How I Learned to Love Authoritarianism and President Xi and Stopped Worrying About Concentration Camps, Mass Murder, Environmental Devastation, Social Credit Scores, Repression of Ethnic Minorities and Religion, Organ Harvesting, Total Surveillance, Soft Imperialism..."
Etc.
Just because the crumbling American Empire has huge issues doesn't mean the CCP and those who would happily impose the above sort of thing on US deserve a pass.
And just because our own warmonger types are trying to gin up conflict doesn't mean the Chinese leadership don't have their own agenda to pull something similar.
The Military Industrial Complex
needs an enemy large enough to warrant exponential growth in defense spending. Russia evaporated as such because Mueller became a laughing stock and the Ukrainian people elected an outsider likely to expose the fact that we overthrew their government in 2014, not Russia.
The pandemic and the collapse of fracking distract us from the urgent need to modernize our nuclear weapons. So China becomes the new enemy.
I agree with those who focus on the fact that China is a dictatorship. It's not a socialist democracy like Norway or Finland. But I also agree that their dictatorial shutdown of Wuhan, vastly more serious than California's, probably saved half a billion lives.
As for Allan Dulles, not only did U.S. corporations and banks fuel and fund the German war effort before WWII, they did so for the duration of the war, and Allan Dulles was the attorney for those companies, before as well as during the war. Facsism was his life's work, and the CIA is his legacy.
We independents aren’t the ones who “worship” China’s methods
Don’t take us counter-suggestible dissenters from mainstream narratives at c99 to task as supposedly bedazzled by China!
If anyone thinks Chinese methods worth emulating, it’s the 0.01% and their neoliberal / neocon “ideology and narrative fusion centers” including Silicon Valley and elite media like The Atlantic.
https://medium.com/@caityjohnstone/narrative-managers-argue-china-like-i...
I haven’t forgotten Obama’s close associate Cass Sunstein and his ideas about managing the thoughts and behavior of the unwashed masses through “nudging” and “cognitive infiltration” …
Facebook is already this kind of huge Skinner box where Mark Zuckerberg can conduct unlimited experiments and A/B trials to see what we, the pigeons, can be induced to peck, er, click on, next. With the Deep State looking over his shoulder …
As I understand it
there are many progressives opposed to various Israeli policies or even Israel's existence who claim that being Anti-Zionist does not make one Anti-Semitic.
Fine, I get that.
But how then is it that opposition to the rule or policies of the Communist Party of China somehow makes one "Anti-Chinese"?
Purpose of Sinophobia?
I suspect the covid is man-made or a "gain-of-function" disease. The latter is taking a virus in the wild and strengthening it to make it more powerful, make it able to jump species, et al. I don't have any proof for this specific virus, but it is being used politically around the globe in a predictable manner.
The purpose of the China-hating may well be for control of Africa's many resources, as well as get rid of as many Africans as possible. Why? The ruling class doesn't need them. There are too many people in the world, so why not wipe out these people or those people. And there are plenty of racists in the ruling class who wouldn't mind dark-skinned people "disappearing".
Designing a virus to be deadlier for certain groups over others is possible with the knowledge available today. There is a pool of northern Europeans (whites) that have a natural immunity to HIV. Why? I would suggest that it originally was not the intention, but rather a happy coincidence for the ruling racists or the viral creators working for the ruling racists. But that was almost fifty years ago that HIV appeared. Knowledge of viral functioning has grown exponentially.
Someone said yesterday that we are being prepared for the next wave of covid. Suppose that the next wave of covid is enhanced and better targeted to attack Africans. It could be devastating.
Just saying.
The problem being, virologists are pretty sure
that HIV first emerged in African populations about 100 years ago, crossing over from the chimpanzee Simian Immunodeficiency Virus, SIV. We know it was circulating 60 years ago, because two different strains have been found in blood/tissue samples taken from patients in Africa in 1959 and 1960. Samples taken more recently in central Africa (especially Kinshasa) show significant genetic diversity, indicating that the virus has had plenty of time to mutate. Phylogenetic analysis suggests that the virus was well-established in Kinshasa and spreading out into Africa by 1940.
Meanwhile, at the time the observable AIDS pandemic began in the west, we barely even had the tools to find it, much less engineer it. And by the way, in the late 80s there were cranks and denialists -- including one very high-profile virologist -- who insisted that HIV was not the cause.
And there's now a new (rare) strain that appears to have evolved independently of the one that, we believe, jumped from chimpanzee a century ago. The new strain appears to be derived from a gorilla version of SIV rather than chimp.
The earth is a multibillion-year-old sphere.
The Nazis killed millions of Jews.
On 9/11/01 a Boeing 757 (AA77) flew into the Pentagon.
AGCC is happening.
If you cannot accept these facts, I cannot fake an interest in any of your opinions.
Imo the "China hating"
doesn't have anything to do with China's recent medical support efforts "making us look bad" or anything about Africa, where China has lately been more involved (and so why design a virus intended to attack China's new host country allies?)
It probably is just some rustling up of a scapegoat by Trump and his political team in order to always have it available to blame if the political heat on Trump over his pathetic virus response gets too accepted here. They always want to be able to play the China card, though even Trump isn't dumb enough to escalate it too much to bring us to the brink of war. He has few cards to play bc of his own gross incompetence in the matter, so it is an easy, convenient and necessary one.