The real Ukraine Gate story - with Hillary's involvement

Ukrainian efforts to sabotage Trump backfire

Donald Trump wasn’t the only presidential candidate whose campaign was boosted by officials of a former Soviet bloc country.

Ukrainian government officials tried to help Hillary Clinton and undermine Trump by publicly questioning his fitness for office. They also disseminated documents implicating a top Trump aide in corruption and suggested they were investigating the matter, only to back away after the election. And they helped Clinton’s allies research damaging information on Trump and his advisers, a Politico investigation found.

A Ukrainian-American operative who was consulting for the Democratic National Committee met with top officials in the Ukrainian Embassy in Washington in an effort to expose ties between Trump, top campaign aide Paul Manafort and Russia, according to people with direct knowledge of the situation.

The Ukrainian efforts had an impact in the race, helping to force Manafort’s resignation and advancing the narrative that Trump’s campaign was deeply connected to Ukraine’s foe to the east, Russia. But they were far less concerted or centrally directed than Russia’s alleged hacking and dissemination of Democratic emails.

Russia’s effort was personally directed by Russian President Vladimir Putin, involved the country’s military and foreign intelligence services, according to U.S. intelligence officials. They reportedly briefed Trump last week on the possibility that Russian operatives might have compromising information on the president-elect. And at a Senate hearing last week on the hacking, Director of National Intelligence James Clapper said “I don't think we've ever encountered a more aggressive or direct campaign to interfere in our election process than we've seen in this case.”

There’s little evidence of such a top-down effort by Ukraine. Longtime observers suggest that the rampant corruption, factionalism and economic struggles plaguing the country — not to mention its ongoing strife with Russia — would render it unable to pull off an ambitious covert interference campaign in another country’s election. And President Petro Poroshenko’s administration, along with the Ukrainian Embassy in Washington, insists that Ukraine stayed neutral in the race.

Yet Politico’s investigation found evidence of Ukrainian government involvement in the race that appears to strain diplomatic protocol dictating that governments refrain from engaging in one another’s elections.

....
“Things seem to be going from bad to worse for Ukraine,” said David A. Merkel, a senior fellow at the Atlantic Council who helped oversee U.S. relations with Russia and Ukraine while working in George W. Bush’s State Department and National Security Council.

Merkel, who has served as an election observer in Ukrainian presidential elections dating back to 1993, noted there’s some irony in Ukraine and Russia taking opposite sides in the 2016 presidential race, given that past Ukrainian elections were widely viewed in Washington’s foreign policy community as proxy wars between the U.S. and Russia.

“Now, it seems that a U.S. election may have been seen as a surrogate battle by those in Kiev and Moscow,” Merkel said.

Apparently the protests just popped up out of the blue without any help from the USA, Vicky Nuland and the IMF as well as the other list of governments agencies that work during a color revolution.

The Ukrainian antipathy for Trump’s team — and alignment with Clinton’s — can be traced back to late 2013. That’s when the country’s president, Viktor Yanukovych, whom Manafort had been advising, abruptly backed out of a European Union pact linked to anti-corruption reforms. Instead, Yanukovych entered into a multibillion-dollar bailout agreement with Russia, sparking protests across Ukraine and prompting Yanukovych to flee the country to Russia under Putin’s protection.

In the ensuing crisis, Russian troops moved into the Ukrainian territory of Crimea, and Manafort dropped off the radar.

Manafort’s work for Yanukovych caught the attention of a veteran Democratic operative named Alexandra Chalupa, who had worked in the White House Office of Public Liaison during the Clinton administration. Chalupa went on to work as a staffer, then as a consultant, for Democratic National Committee. The DNC paid her $412,000 from 2004 to June 2016, according to Federal Election Commission records, though she also was paid by other clients during that time, including Democratic campaigns and the DNC’s arm for engaging expatriate Democrats around the world.

A daughter of Ukrainian immigrants who maintains strong ties to the Ukrainian-American diaspora and the U.S. Embassy in Ukraine, Chalupa, a lawyer by training, in 2014 was doing pro bono work for another client interested in the Ukrainian crisis and began researching Manafort’s role in Yanukovych’s rise, as well as his ties to the pro-Russian oligarchs who funded Yanukovych’s political party.

In an interview this month, Chalupa told Politico she had developed a network of sources in Kiev and Washington, including investigative journalists, government officials and private intelligence operatives. While her consulting work at the DNC this past election cycle centered on mobilizing ethnic communities — including Ukrainian-Americans — she said that, when Trump’s unlikely presidential campaign began surging in late 2015, she began focusing more on the research, and expanded it to include Trump’s ties to Russia, as well.

She occasionally shared her findings with officials from the DNC and Clinton’s campaign, Chalupa said. In January 2016 — months before Manafort had taken any role in Trump’s campaign — Chalupa told a senior DNC official that, when it came to Trump’s campaign, “I felt there was a Russia connection,” Chalupa recalled. “And that, if there was, that we can expect Paul Manafort to be involved in this election,” said Chalupa, who at the time also was warning leaders in the Ukrainian-American community that Manafort was “Putin’s political brain for manipulating U.S. foreign policy and elections.

....

A former DNC staffer described the exchange as an “informal conversation,” saying “‘briefing’ makes it sound way too formal,” and adding, “We were not directing or driving her work on this.” Yet, the former DNC staffer and the operative familiar with the situation agreed that with the DNC’s encouragement, Chalupa asked embassy staff to try to arrange an interview in which Poroshenko might discuss Manafort’s ties to Yanukovych.

While the embassy declined that request, officials there became “helpful” in Chalupa’s efforts, she said, explaining that she traded information and leads with them. “If I asked a question, they would provide guidance, or if there was someone I needed to follow up with.” But she stressed, “There were no documents given, nothing like that.”

Chalupa said the (Ukrainian) embassy also worked directly with reporters researching Trump, Manafort and Russia to point them in the right directions. She added, though, “they were being very protective and not speaking to the press as much as they should have. I think they were being careful because their situation was that they had to be very, very careful because they could not pick sides. It’s a political issue, and they didn’t want to get involved politically because they couldn’t."

Chalupa said the embassy also worked directly with reporters researching Trump, Manafort and Russia to point them in the right directions. She added, though, “they were being very protective and not speaking to the press as much as they should have. I think they were being careful because their situation was that they had to be very, very careful because they could not pick sides. It’s a political issue, and they didn’t want to get involved politically because they couldn’t.”

....
But Andrii Telizhenko, who worked as a political officer in the Ukrainian Embassy under Shulyar, said she instructed him to help Chalupa research connections between Trump, Manafort and Russia. “Oksana said that if I had any information, or knew other people who did, then I should contact Chalupa,” recalled Telizhenko, who is now a political consultant in Kiev. “They were coordinating an investigation with the Hillary team on Paul Manafort with Alexandra Chalupa,” he said, adding “Oksana was keeping it all quiet,” but “the embassy worked very closely with” Chalupa.

In fact, sources familiar with the effort say that Shulyar specifically called Telizhenko into a meeting with Chalupa to provide an update on an American media outlet’s ongoing investigation into Manafort.

Telizhenko recalled that Chalupa told him and Shulyar that, “If we can get enough information on Paul [Manafort] or Trump’s involvement with Russia, she can get a hearing in Congress by September.”

....
Chalupa, though, indicated in an email that was later hacked and released by WikiLeaks that the Open World Leadership Center “put me on the program to speak specifically about Paul Manafort.”

In the email, which was sent in early May to then-DNC communications director Luis Miranda, Chalupa noted that she had extended an invitation to the Library of Congress forum to veteran Washington investigative reporter Michael Isikoff. (Isikoff is the reporter who published the Steele dossier) Two days before the event, he had published a story for Yahoo News revealing the unraveling of a $26 million deal between Manafort and a Russian oligarch related to a telecommunications venture in Ukraine. And Chalupa wrote in the email she’d been “working with for the past few weeks” with Isikoff “and connected him to the Ukrainians” at the event.

Isikoff, who accompanied Chalupa to a reception at the Ukrainian Embassy immediately after the Library of Congress event, declined to comment.

....
A DNC official stressed that Chalupa was a consultant paid to do outreach for the party’s political department, not a researcher. She undertook her investigations into Trump, Manafort and Russia on her own, and the party did not incorporate her findings in its dossiers on the subjects, the official said, stressing that the DNC had been building robust research books on Trump and his ties to Russia long before Chalupa began sounding alarms.

Beyond any efforts to sabotage Trump, Ukrainian officials didn’t exactly extend a hand of friendship to the GOP nominee during the campaign.

I recommend reading this article at its source to get the full story. And read it with a large grain of salt because it goes out of its way to paint Russia as the bigger boogeyman, but the truth about what Hillary, the DNC and Fusion GPS sneaks out.

But wait there's more to the story...

Ukrainian Embassy confirms DNC contractor solicited Trump dirt in 2016

The boomerang from the Democratic Party’s failed attempt to connect Donald Trump to Russia’s 2016 election meddling is picking up speed, and its flight path crosses right through Moscow’s pesky neighbor, Ukraine. That is where there is growing evidence a foreign power was asked, and in some cases tried, to help Hillary Clinton.

In its most detailed account yet, the Ukrainian Embassy in Washington says a Democratic National Committee (DNC) insider during the 2016 election solicited dirt on Donald Trump’s campaign chairman and even tried to enlist the country's president to help.

In written answers to questions, Ambassador Valeriy Chaly's office says DNC contractor Alexandra Chalupa sought information from the Ukrainian government on Paul Manafort’s dealings inside the country in hopes of forcing the issue before Congress.

Chalupa later tried to arrange for Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko to comment on Manafort’s Russian ties on a U.S. visit during the 2016 campaign, the ambassador said.

Chaly says that, at the time of the contacts in 2016, the embassy knew Chalupa primarily as a Ukrainian American activist and learned only later of her ties to the DNC. He says the embassy considered her requests an inappropriate solicitation of interference in the U.S. election.

....
Nellie Ohr, wife of senior U.S. Justice Department official Bruce Ohr, acknowledged in congressional testimony that, while working for the Clinton-hired research firm Fusion GPS, she researched Trump's and Manafort’s ties to Russia and learned that Leshchenko, the Ukrainian lawmaker, was providing dirt to Fusion.

Fusion also paid British intelligence operative Christopher Steele, whose anti-Trump dossier the FBI used as primary evidence to support its request to spy on Trump campaign adviser Carter Page.

In addition, I wrote last month that the Obama White House invited Ukrainian law enforcement officials to a meeting in January 2016 as Trump rose in the polls on his improbable path to the presidency. The meeting led to U.S. requests to the Ukrainians to help investigate Manafort, setting in motion a series of events that led to the Ukrainians leaking the documents about Manafort in May 2016.

The creation of Russia Gate and all of its connections to Hillary's campaign and the DNC and FBI is one thing that Trump and Rudy are looking into with Ukraine. This was originally why Rudy went there in the first place. Hey..could it be there interest in this and its ties to the people in Obama's administration that is causing some people to loose sleep at night and that is why the democrats are finally pulling out their impeachment card? Might be..stay tuned. What did Obama know and when did he learn about it?

There have been numerous essays written about Russia Gate since its inception by many members here and it would be great to have them all located in a single essay. Here is list of many of them from the search results, but if your essay is not listed contact me. If anyone is interested in this you can message me your essays and I will put it together. We have done some excellent work here on this and it seems that we have been out in front of this and have debunked Russia Gate, the numerous times the FBI tried to entrap people in Trump's campaign and the many players involved with it as well as the Mueller farce.

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snoopydawg's picture

Moon of Alabama has a great write-up on this and on Pelosi's decision to open an impeachment inquiry that has no teeth to it.

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The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.
~Hannah Arendt

Wally's picture

@snoopydawg

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snoopydawg's picture

These once-secret memos cast doubt on Joe Biden's Ukraine story

Former Vice President Joe Biden, now a 2020 Democratic presidential contender, has locked into a specific story about the controversy in Ukraine.

He insists that, in spring 2016, he strong-armed Ukraine to fire its chief prosecutor solely because Biden believed that official was corrupt and inept, not because the Ukrainian was investigating a natural gas company, Burisma Holdings, that hired Biden's son, Hunter, into a lucrative job.

There’s just one problem.

Hundreds of pages of never-released memos and documents — many from inside the American team helping Burisma to stave off its legal troubles — conflict with Biden’s narrative.

And they raise the troubling prospect that U.S. officials may have painted a false picture in Ukraine that helped ease Burisma’s legal troubles and stop prosecutors’ plans to interview Hunter Biden during the 2016 U.S. presidential election.

For instance, Burisma’s American legal representatives met with Ukrainian officials just days after Biden forced the firing of the country’s chief prosecutor and offered “an apology for dissemination of false information by U.S. representatives and public figures” about the Ukrainian prosecutors, according to the Ukrainian government’s official memo of the meeting. The effort to secure that meeting began the same day the prosecutor's firing was announced.

In addition, Burisma’s American team offered to introduce Ukrainian prosecutors to Obama administration officials to make amends, according to that memo and the American legal team’s internal emails.

The memos raise troubling questions:

1.) If the Ukraine prosecutor’s firing involved only his alleged corruption and ineptitude, why did Burisma's American legal team refer to those allegations as “false information?"

2.) If the firing had nothing to do with the Burisma case, as Biden has adamantly claimed, why would Burisma’s American lawyers contact the replacement prosecutor within hours of the termination and urgently seek a meeting in Ukraine to discuss the case?
...
I have sued the State Department for any records related to that meeting. The reason is simple: There is both a public interest and an ethics question to knowing if Hunter Biden and his team sought State’s assistance while his father was vice president.

The controversy ignited anew earlier this year when I disclosed that Joe Biden admitted during a 2018 videotaped speech that, as vice president in March 2016, he threatened to cancel $1 billion in U.S. loan guarantees, to pressure Ukraine’s then-President Petro Poroshenko to fire Shokin.

At the time, Shokin’s office was investigating Burisma. Shokin told me he was making plans to question Hunter Biden about $3 million in fees that Biden and his partner, Archer, collected from Burisma through their American firm. Documents seized by the FBI in an unrelated case confirm the payments, which in many months totaled more than $166,000.
...
In a newly sworn affidavit prepared for a European court, Shokin testified that when he was fired in March 2016, he was told the reason was that Biden was unhappy about the Burisma investigation. “The truth is that I was forced out because I was leading a wide-ranging corruption probe into Burisma Holdings, a natural gas firm active in Ukraine and Joe Biden’s son, Hunter Biden, was a member of the Board of Directors,” Shokin testified.

Read this. Stay tuned. Normon Solomon has been taking apart Russia Gate from the beginning too.

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The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.
~Hannah Arendt

is that no matter who is in charge, finding out how our government operates is akin to lifting up a rock and observing what's crawling around out of sight.

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enhydra lutris's picture

very good idea. May I suggest that it also include stuff relating to the coup in Ukraine as well.

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That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

Azazello's picture

[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TwuLQJ6cMuQ width:500 height:300]

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We wanted decent healthcare, a living wage and free college.
The Democrats gave us Biden and war instead.

@Azazello video!

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"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981

Roy Blakeley's picture

@Azazello We are living through an attempted CIA coup to remove Trump. As bad as Trump is, I find the attempted, CIA-engineered removal of Trump much, much worse. The msm and pseudo-left media are all in on this and just plain lying about what Trump said and Biden did. You have to read the original documents these days. Never trust the media narratives.

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Unabashed Liberal's picture

@Roy Blakeley

against '8' in my own federal suit. Nothing matters more than "evidence"--which I documented in spades.

Also, it probably didn't hurt my case that my first line 'super' literally melted down at one point--very much like Colonel Nathan R Jessup did during cross examination in the movie "A Few Good Men.".

Biggrin

Mollie

“Dogs have given us their absolute all. We are the center of their universe. We are the focus of their love and faith and trust. They serve us in return for scraps. It is without a doubt the best deal man has ever made.” ~~Roger Caras

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Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.

snoopydawg's picture

@Roy Blakeley

Russian farce started. It was his hands that wrote the iC brief where he tried to insist that all 17 intelligence agencies agreed that Russia did the deed. It wasn't 17. It was 3 people from 3 agencies, but to this day people still say that it was all of them.

Then Brennan went to CNN where he kept throwing out accusations against Trump. And of course it was Obama's whole justice department and others that were all involved with trying to get Trump removed from office. Susan Rice illegally unmasked 200 people that had been wiretapped and at first they built their case for the possibility that Trump lost but didn't accept the election results. Then when he won they took it off in another direction. People in Ukraine were involved with gathering information and that is what Hillary, Obama and Brennan don't want to see the light of day. If Durham and Barr get to take it all the way to the top we will see hearings that put Watergate to shame.

And the woman who was at the Trump tower meeting Natalia Veselnitskaya met with Simpson of Fusion GPS right after it and she has ties to the FSB the successor to the KGB. Oh what a tangled web that has been woven. The strings are starting to unravel..

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The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.
~Hannah Arendt

snoopydawg's picture

@Azazello

Bingo!

The creation of Russia Gate and all of its connections to Hillary's campaign and the DNC and FBI is one thing that Trump and Rudy are looking into with Ukraine.

The FBI never investigated the DNC servers that CrowdStrike said was hacked by Russia nor did Mueller look into this too see if Russia had indeed done the deed. But remember that Podesta was who made up the idea to blame the leak on Russia to keep people from focusing on how Hillary and the DNC rigged the primary. It worked. And to this day people think that is just CT. The primary was run fair and square.

The GossipBlower. Excellent. The minute I heard that the WB was a CIA agent I knew that it was bunk. Why isn't congress subpoenaing the people who actually had the thoughts that something happened. Hearsay!

BTW.... if people didn't know the first article was written in 2017 long before this GossipBlower complaint came out. There have been many articles written about the DNC and Hillary as well as ByeDone's threat to Ukraine years before. This gives this more weight imo.. And once again members here have seen through this new farce while others are thinking that this is the scandal that will finally bring Trump down. The 200th or so.. am I right? lol

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The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.
~Hannah Arendt

Unabashed Liberal's picture

@snoopydawg

last night--and, I was going on what the conservative media has had to say about "investigating the investigators" since the Durham investigation was launched.

It's the only thing that makes sense. This move is clearly done out of desperation (on part of the Dems). Note that the MSM has messaged that there must be 'swift action' on this matter. IOW, they want to make sure that the can have a silencing effect on either Durham's investigation, or, how it is perceived, once it ends.

IMO, the biggest concern is for 'O's' fate.

I say this, because conservatives have been salivating over the possibility that US Attorney John Durham's "investigation of the investigators" might nab 'O' and Biden. (regarding the use of the Steele in the FISA Court)

IMO, it's obvious as the nose on our faces, the Dem Deep State wants to either shut down, or, delegitimize Durham's findings.

BTW, best wishes to your dear Abby. Sending beau coup positive energy her way!

Give rose

Mollie

“Dogs have given us their absolute all. We are the center of their universe. We are the focus of their love and faith and trust. They serve us in return for scraps. It is without a doubt the best deal man has ever made.” ~~Roger Caras

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Everyone thinks they have the best dog, and none of them are wrong.

edg's picture

There's solid evidence and proof that Ukraine interfered in the U.S. election by working against Trump. There's the specious claim of a private company co-founded by a Russia-hating Clinton supporter that Russia threw the election to Trump. It's obvious what we should believe. Russiagate!!

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The only thing that's changed since is that Mueller eventually pulled the plug when it became obvious there is more hard evidence to indict Hillary and the DNC for collusion with Ukraine in attempted election tampering than Trump's fumbling with Russia. That just wouldn't do.

Here's how it read last August: https://caucus99percent.com/content/ukrainian-meddling-16-election-led-m...

Ukrainian Meddling in the '16 Election Led to the Manafort Take-Down
Submitted by leveymg on Fri, 08/24/2018 - 5:39pm

The take-down of Trump Campaign Manager Paul Manafort was the culmination of a years-long foreign espionage and disinformation program by the Ukrainian government coordinated with the Democratic National Committee and elements of British Intelligence. This operation tied together a former MI-6 officer, Christopher Steele, with a Ukrainian-American DNC operative named Alexandra Chalupa and the Poroshenko regime that seized power in Kiev in the violent CIA and U.S. State Department backed 2014 coup.

The most damaging allegations against Manafort that led to his dismissal in August 2016 as Donald Trump’s campaign manager — that he had secretly accepted $12.7 million in cash kickbacks from the Ukrainian Kremlin-backed “Party of Regions” – were a fraud. Manafort’s signatures shown in a “Black Ledger” showing secret cash payments to him were never proved and the charges later recanted by the Ukrainian anti-corruption officer who originally made them. But, that occurred nearly a year later, after a series of events leading to appointment of a Special Prosecutor in the United States, and a New Cold War hysteria plunged the U.S. government and public into the most divisive political confrontation since the McCarthy era.

I. FBI lacked corroboration for Page wiretap; Manafort accusation justified FISA warrant

Perhaps most significantly at the time, these falsified charges against Manafort also found their way into the Steele Dossier, where they served as a basis for a FISA warrant application justifying FBI spying on the Trump Campaign, an inquisition that continues to intensify to this day.

MORE
[ . . . ]

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snoopydawg's picture

@leveymg

Hopefully people who didn't see this when posted will read it cuz it is a brilliant write up off not just Manafort's role and persecution, but how it ties Hillary into what was happening there.

Evidence of real Ukrainian collusion with the Clinton Campaign is the very real and, from the evidence to date, far more substantial dopple-ganger of the propaganda and political dirty tricks alleged to have been used by Russia to meddle in the 2016 Presidential election. Yet, key facts about Manafort and Ukraine continue to be falsified and obscured by the major U.S. corporate media.

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The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.
~Hannah Arendt

@snoopydawg @snoopydawg In a folksy question and answer style "report", the network downplayed the Ukrainian influence and disinformation operation as insignificant compared to what was being described then as a massive Putin-led intervention on behalf of Trump.

See, Did Ukraine try to interfere in the 2016 election on Clinton's behalf? July 13, 2017 / 6:00 AM / CBS News https://www.cbsnews.com/news/did-ukraine-try-to-interfere-in-the-2016-el...

Does this Democratic effort constitute collusion with Ukraine?

Depends on how you define collusion. However, as Vogel pointed out in his story, it's not really the same thing as what the Russian government apparently did to help the Trump campaign.

How so?

Well, for one thing, Ukraine is so rife with corruption and internal divisions that Kiev wouldn't really be able to assist the Clinton campaign all the much. Or, rather, they certainly couldn't match what U.S. intelligence agencies believe Russia was doing.

According to U.S. intelligence, Russia was involved in a multifaceted influence campaign personally supervised by President Vladimir Putin, and which utilized Russia's vast intelligence apparatus. Ukraine, a poor and disjointed country, wouldn't be able to compete on those terms even if they wanted to.
So we're comparing apples and oranges here?

Well, yes and no. The first major difference between the Ukrainian and Russian efforts, of course, is that only Russia can be viewed as a "hostile foreign power." Ukraine may be a foreign country, but it's not a powerful one, and is in some ways a de facto American and NATO ally in countering Russian aggression.

The second big difference, as conservative columnist Ed Morrissey pointed out this week, is that the Democrats appeared to take pains to keep all this business away from the Clinton campaign. "If nothing else, the Clinton machine understood the need for firewalls between negative-research efforts and the candidate," Morrissey writes over at The Week.

Still, it's deeply unusual for an American campaign to be working with foreign assets like this, regardless of whether it's Ukraine or Russia.
Is it unprecedented?

Not quite. Republican presidential candidate Richard Nixon has long been accused of trying to torpedo the 1968 Paris Peace Talks with the help of foreign nationals. Alternatively, Democratic Sen. Ted Kennedy may have worked backchannels in a fruitless attempt to get the Soviet government to help his party in the 1984 elections.
But it's still weird, right?

You bet. Although the Russian efforts to interfere in last year's election were almost certainly more sophisticated and worrying than anything the Ukrainians and the DNC pulled off, we don't expect campaigns to behave this way. Or, rather, we didn't before 2016.

In retrospect, this CBS "News report" provides a fascinating study in inversion of reality, as the Russian operation turned out to be dwarfed in complexity and impact by the DNC-Ukrainian-Isikoff operation that was just a corner of the far larger DNC-FBI-MI6-Steele production to elect the Annointed One. The Steele Memo ended up not only knocking off Manaforte but justified FISA warrants and direct FBI-CIA surveillance of the Trump Campaign and White House that continues to this day. Russiagate has consumed, divide and dumbfound much of the country. The CIA is center stage driving Presidential impeachment. Again, but this time it's out in the open, and the spooks aren't even trying to do this regime change through proprietaries and cutouts. They simply won't let it go away, even after the Mueller Report fizzled.

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snoopydawg's picture

@leveymg

and I made a note of it. It's so funny how even when the media finally covers something they have to disqualify it with "Russia was worse though!"

he network downplayed the Ukrainian influence and disinformation operation as insignificant compared to what was being described then as a massive Putin-led intervention on behalf of Trump.

And this..

Well, for one thing, Ukraine is so rife with corruption and internal divisions that Kiev wouldn't really be able to assist the Clinton campaign all the much. Or, rather, they certainly couldn't match what U.S. intelligence agencies believe Russia was doing.

No one has ever offered definitive proof of what they say happened. Even Brennan's first report stated that he believes...

But what Hillary et all did is definitely bigger than anything Russia did because it was the whole crux of Russia Gate's creation. That the FBI was involved in Ukraine should be looked into because aren't they just supposed to work in the USA.

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The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.
~Hannah Arendt

@snoopydawg at work, and the CIA has always operated as a church with special anointed powers to a priestly class with a vow of secrecy. Facts mean no more to these people than they do to other True Believers.

As to your last comment, since the late 1930s, the FBI has operated "foreign legates" (resident offices) in cities abroad. The Bureau's foreign operations are not nearly as alarming as the CIA's domestic operations, which are a direct violation of the Agency's 1947 Charter. Even Harry Truman was afraid that if allowed to operate inside the U.S., it would become an "American Gestapo." Well, he got that one right.

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snoopydawg's picture

@leveymg

there too. Thanks. "American Gestapo." And why not? We have had the American Nazis working here since operation paper or as auto correct wants to write operation lipstick.

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The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.
~Hannah Arendt