@mimi a spycraft term of art, fits the site pretty much all along.

@Dhyerwolf I would LOVE to see what DOV and BBB have to say about this.

But no way in hell am I clicking over there.

They are even further gone than I had realized.

@Dhyerwolf

I'm glad you made it out! Next time, bring protection - if you ever do that again.

They are even further gone than I had realized.

@Raggedy Ann
but getting there.

TOP hasn't reached bottom yet, but they're giving it their best shot! Thanks for posting this.

@native lightyears ahead of us. There was an ad on a Google search I did, that I didn't even see, that made -- not only me, but six people I met with that day in person -- vote Not-Hilary.

or like CNN, haven't got a clue about what they're doing. Russian media are beating them badly at their own game. RT for example, is actually paying its critics to spout idiotic anti-Russian nonsense on Russian TV (about $8700 to $12000 dollars each month), all so that the audience can laugh at them! Modern-day Russia is definitely not like the Soviet Union.

The main difference was this: if the Soviet went out of their way to prevent western propaganda from reaching the Soviet people, the Russians are nowadays doing the exact opposite: they are going out of their way to make sure that western propaganda is immediately translated and beamed into every single Russian household.

By now, you must have heard about the CNN report about how the evil Russkies used Pokemon to destabilize and subvert the US. If not, here it is: (...report...)

In Russia this report was in instant mega-success: the video was translated and rebroadcasted on every single TV channel. Margarita Simonian, the brilliant director of Russia Today, was asked during a live show “be truthful and confess – what is your relationship with Pokemon, do they work for you?” to which she replied “I feed them” – the audience burst in laughter.

"One of the techniques regularly used on Russian talkshows is to show a short report about the latest crazy nonsense coming out of the United States or Europe and then ask a pro-US guests to react to it. The “liberals” (in the Russian political meaning of this word, that is a hopelessly naïve pro-western person who loves to trash everything Russian and who hates Putin and those who support him) are intensely embarrassed and usually either simply admit that this is crazy nonsense or try to find some crazy nonsense in the Russian media (and there is plenty of that too) to show that “we are just as bad”. Needless to say, no matter what escape route is chosen, the “liberal” ends up looking like a total idiot or a traitor."

USA propaganda mills are so far behind the times, it's actually kind of funny.

http://www.unz.com/tsaker/re-visiting-russian-counter-propaganda-methods/

@snoopydawg
and start freaking out about Socialists in our midst. Expel them! OK, but then they get even more scared of Russia, and start seeing Russians under everybody's bed. Pretty soon they get the two things mixed up, so anybody who doesn't support Clinton must be a Russian stooge. Even if they don't know it. And finally along comes that Trump character, who gets transformed into being a Russian agent too! An Enemy of the State for sure. Lucky thing we've got the CIA and FBI to warn us about these types. Hell, they're even warning us about ourselves! What a relief to be so well guarded.

Isn't that the site that fought all through the primaries about how blacks could make up their own minds on who they voted for?
Did not one of these idiots realize that the BLM protests started in 2014 in Ferguson after Michael Brown was killed? And that this was before anyone had declared that they were running for president? Oh wait, maybe Putin just knew that HerHeinous was going to run so he got the jump on this. Yeah that's it.

But wait, it gets better. Putin even infiltrated ToP and maybe some of the members here were Putin's puppets too. Think I am kidding? Good gawd, I wish I was.

When will the administrators of this site tell us how dailykos was also infiltrated by these Russian trolls? They seem to be awfully quiet, but it would make a lot of sense for Russian operatives to target a site like this to divide the left.
Texas Lefty Oct 20 · 08:08:37 AM
Reply
recommend 7

Frankly I think that had a lot to do with the purge a while back.
cordgrass

@WaterLily
Guess full time doesn't pay the bills so she went to Kos, who "turned her out" like every good pimp does.

Check out the Kos article's author.

Staff writer for @dailykos. Diversity practitioner. Adjunct professor. Part-time yogi. BlogHer Voice of the Year honoree.

You cannot make this shit up.

@Big Al I don't always have a chance to stay current with her essays, but IIRC, she has mostly written him off -- or at least has warned her readers that he's politically neutered.

I don't know that I've seen anything specific regarding his buy-in (genuine or not) to the Russia BS. Now I'm interested enough to look.

Regarding his Russian propaganda? I think she used to be a big supporter.

@Big Al The Deep State has Digested both Trump and Sanders

It’s been excruciating to watch the man we progressive rebels lifted up last year praise the White Helmets, advance establishment lies about Russia and Syria, and spit on the Palestinian people with greater and greater intensity since that gut-wrenching day he endorsed bloodthirsty oligarch Hillary Clinton for Commander-in-Chief of the most powerful military force in the history of civilization.

And

In a recent video which I openly admit to not being emotionally capable of finishing, Sanders monologued bald-faced lies straight into the camera, calling Assad a dictator who has “murdered hundreds of thousands of his own people,” saying that there is “no longer a debate” as to whether Russia manipulated the 2016 election “in a heavy duty way,” and that “no one now denies” such a thing happened and may continue to happen in America’s 2018 elections. We need to be perfectly clear: these are lies. Sanders knows that they are lies. There is no basis whatsoever for the assertion that Assad has “murdered” the hundreds of thousands of people who have perished in the war between the Syrian government and CIA-backed radical jihadists and terrorist factions that has ravaged his country. There is no basis whatsoever for saying that there is “no debate” that Russia interfered in the US elections in a significant way when we have to this day not be shown one single shred of proof that Russians hacked Democratic party emails and shared them with WikiLeaks.
Sanders is stating these things as though they are facts, and they are not. He is lying. He knows that he is lying. His lies have potentially world-ending consequences as they are used to manufacture consent for dangerous escalations with a nuclear superpower. Yesterday Sanders posted another video asking his followers, “Need a break from Russia? Join me for a conversation with comedian Larry Wilmore.” Yes, Bernie, I do fucking need a break from fucking Russia. No I will not be watching anything with Larry fucking Wilmore.

I don't know if the above violates fair use rights? I hope not ...

Regarding his Russian propaganda? I think she used to be a big supporter.

@Ellen North You make a compelling argument. And its implications are more frightening than a clown in a sewer.

So much of it makes sense: all of those "liberals" (many of my friends included) who now happily embrace the likes of McCain and Dumbya just because they "speak truth to" the Cheeto. (Of course, it's always prefaced by, "I never thought I'd agree with [insert name of odious Republican here], but ..."

Which tells me this particular psy-op is working.

Ellen, I hope you'll consider a dedicated essay on this, so that the argument (and supporting evidence) you make here doesn't get buried. This is worthy of much more discussion, IMHO.

Having got back on to read the rest of the Twitter thread, (now that there's room on there to get on, as there wasn't last night) my suspicions have solidified.

Markos must know the reaction that this bizarrely insane DNC strategy - especially in this phrasing - and the expressed pathological tendencies implicit within it would elicit and how many more people would swear off the Dems forever in revulsion, well before the next election. This is obviously (either snark/possible revenge? or) propaganda intended to ensure that the Dems get crushed by the Repubs in the next election - which is, importantly, I believe, not Presidential.

But taken in conjunction with the DNC purge and corporate Super Delegates, I am now reasonably certain that the purpose is to ensure that no matter what damage Trump and the merry bands of Bush League neocons, crazed billionaires and others running government does, the Dems will lose the next election in a landslide, this, under the Two-Corporate-Party Trap ongoing scam, giving the Repubs the majority required for a Constitutional Convention, and thereby changing from using the now-altered document (doubtless minus the Bill of Rights and anything mentioning 'we, the people' or implying that government might have any responsibility toward the country or people, such as Congress maintaining roads or the Post Office, so that they can 'Constitutionally' do as they please without international outcry,) as toilet paper, to even more freely and directly using the American people and country as flushable toilet paper.

Then, assuming that the game of the selection process is still being continued, with the Repubs taking the blame for enacting the most destructive joint Party corporate interest/billionaire objectives, Hillary can more plausibly Have Her Turn in the next Presidential selection.

Her and the Dems will, of course, be helpless against the Repubs and, in this scenario, there's no longer even any pretense to be made of anyone - other than Those Who Matter in the top fraction of the 1% - having any rights to not be upheld in the majority-corrupt Supreme Court.

But the American people can, while the scam's still required to keep them quiet, continue to be kept busily running back and forth between the two corporate/billionaire cats-paws, still voting for evil every time, while being clawed more deeply every time.

If another and actually democratic Party cannot be assembled in time, as seems likely, I'd suggest that what's available be researched to find those most suitable outside the Corporate Party and a National Strategic Vote be organized, also strongly urging voting only for non-corporate Progressives, together with an organized demand for citizen oversight of the entire electoral process to try to limit cheating.

There are far more Indies than either Dems or Repubs (even without adding in dissatisfied voters/non-voters from either wing of the Two-Faced Corporate Party) and as far as actual potential votes go, there should, at least theoretically, be plenty to assure a majority of votes for any party they'd coalescence behind, and the drastic reduction of seats for the corporate parties in each ensuing election.

But, obviously, in any such scenario, the voter suppression and electoral cheating must be addressed, and the corporate and corporate-captured once-left media blackout and smear campaigns be taken into account, as must the hostile take-over of the internet, the snowballing censorship and propaganda.

If, for example, there was any sign of Bernie considering another Presidential run, a massive smear campaign and media blackout would be immediately implemented, also thereby shutting out the painfully gained corporate media access to gently remind the American people that their government should be working for, not against, them and their country.

And the Psychopaths and Parasites That Be are evidently concerned about this, that being why they try so (often laughably) hard to discredit Bernie, Progressives and the concept of democracy (a Russian plot! US cops even have a right to murder citizens as they please! So there! People just should try harder not to be non-White/Poor, if they actually mind being police-murdered for breathing!) and even their own false advertising about American 'democracy' and the guaranteed Constitutional rights a few enlightened Founders fought so hard to include against the efforts of those deeply self-interested among their numbers.

But any effort to organize a Strategic Vote would need to be heavily promoted and conducted on the internet - on which a great deal of censorship is in the process of being implemented.

Which also means a lot of legwork, pamphleteering and such, in all States, needs to be organized. Fast.

And there have also been great propaganda efforts to quash the energy and hopes of not only Progressives but everyone frantic to vote for the chance of an improved life in a democracy, successfully leaving many feeling suckered - not necessarily by the interloping and globally powerful corporate/billionaire/lackey faction who cheated the entire US PTB-threatened world of Bernie's win, but instead often blaming Bernie himself for not being Rambo and single-handedly taking out a global octopus by spitting defiance at the DNC Coronation and wasting all chances at rousing the public consciousness by immediately trying to run Indie, in an utterly rigged system, against the corporate machine.

And many - even more than were already previously 'there' already - have simply decided to simply not vote in that thoroughly rigged system.

Thing is, there needs to be enough continuous fuss and voiced determination to vote against both wings of the Corporate Party and enough agitation for citizen oversight to make cheating even more obvious.

And it must also be made obvious that the results of evident cheating will never again be left to stand as a 'done deal' by the general public.

Can the so-carefully propaganda-divided Americans actually get together to literally fight for their lives, their country and government and the achievement of starting an actual democracy, at long last?

If we look at the citizen self-organizing done in the interest of getting a chance of the policies Bernie espouses being enacted, it would certainly seem so.

Can so-carefully propaganda-quashed Americans actually get it together to make a start at trying to initiate this?

Maybe if the more-aware people thought about what's likely to occur if they don't even try and just keep going with the toilet flow...

It's certainly a lot harder now than it would have been earlier, but will there be any chance at all after the next election, with that Repub majority required for a Constitutional white-out looking increasingly more likely, with the functionality of the internet doubtless completely gone for any useful purpose, with only State-approved propaganda 'legal' and the fascist gloves completely off?

There's a bunch of very nasty (and rapidly economy/health/life-destroying) stuff apparent now and more and worse coming, as has been predicted for some time by many, including some highly respected thinkers and writers, many of the effects of which having been already shown in previous history, and which has been survived because limited and/or quelled in time. Much of what's likely to occur, if not stopped now, is not likely to be survivable by most or even any of us.

But pacific mass protest, widespread boycotts of the most-criminal corporations while the people still have any money at all, to withhold in order to make them hurt, Strategically Voting for a non-corporate, of-the-people Party and against the corporate parties and pro-active actions regarding the notorious American Selectoral system all seems imperative to me.

Even some people on this very site, with the information available to us, sometimes still speak of America being 'in danger of' becoming wholly fascist, when full-blown fascism - a blatantly military/corporate lawless State stripping inalienable rights from its own people, on the pretext of keeping them safe, using a single, if horrific, incident in a heavily militarized country not subject to invasion, in order to use them and the country's resources to more fully implement a planned global corporate/military/economic hostile take-over - was very obviously implemented under Bush 2, via 9/11, with conditioning toward universal public acceptance of any abusive public/private or other State intrusion of privacy and basic human rights under that same pretense of 'safety' exported around the world, despite this failing to catch any non-FBI/State-initiated 'terrorists'.

It's been made obvious that this is all to watch us and to keep us, the people of the world, under control while we're being fleeced, poisoned and dispossessed by those who have already stolen much of the money and power of the people of America and various of the people of the world, in case any of us pacifically object before they've taken it all, from us all.

Just watched another great Jimmy Dore; in case anyone hasn't seen this yet:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AuCfmGyeAyM

Primary Cheater Donna Brazile Appointed To Rules Committee
The Jimmy Dore Show
Published on 22 Oct 2017

Primary Cheater Donna Brazile Appointed To Rules Committee

And also recorded while 'normalizing' pay-to-play access for donor cash and attempting to lump that in with giving activists - typically fighting for, rather than, like the donors, against - the citizens who their office actually exists to represent - access...

America needs regime change - starting now.

@MrWebster hand behind Kos agenda is plain. Remember he claimed to be tightening up the site and aiming to attract more of the Black and Latino demographics, as well as the youth.
But he just basically shat them out. To further the Dem Leadership, er, Losership, plan. A plan that curiously avoids any actual appeal to voters who aren't in the Cult.

This attack on black activists was bound to happen eventually. It started last year with Hillary and her claim that Putin was behind anti-fracking protests. The NYTimes published a straight piece about last year June or so that accused Putin of instigating anti-TPP opinions. It was clear from previous versions of McCarthyism that Russia would used to squash and marginalize any sort of dissent against the establishment. Putin was recently accused of being behind the Catalonia independence movement.

So basically white democrats are throwing black activists under the bus to further the Russia-gate narrative. Getting Trump through Russia accusations is more important than racial issues effecting their most loyal base.

This theme is reaching beyond TOP. It is reaching main stream credibility through articles like this in the Atlantic.

The History of Russian Involvement in America's Race Wars
https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2017/10/russia-faceboo...

Also, found this. An article about a State department memo that listed out the Soviet propaganda they were spewing about race in 1963. Looking at what State thought was "propaganda" would hardly be questioned as untrue by current beliefs.

The democrats will end up shooting themselves in the foot with their largest most loyal base if they keep this shit up. Black establishment leadership will not be able to stem the resentment this will cause with younger black activists.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_vault/2013/07/09/civil_rights_coverage_ho...