Why did Corbyn do so well and Bernie fall short? Paper Ballots
There are a number of reason why Jeremy Corbyn and the Labour Party in England did so well in the recent UK election, compared to Bernie Sanders failed attempt to win the Democratic Primary, but today I want to focus on just one. In the UK electronic voting machines are not in place. They use paper ballots. It should come as no surprise, therefore, that many UK pols are pushing for e-voting machines for the next election.
Britain’s Outdated Voting System Risks Leaving Millions Voiceless in the EU Referendum
Our outdated voting system also risks disenfranchising overseas voters. More than one million Britons living in other EU countries will be directly impacted by a leave vote yet it would be hard to invent a harder way for them to cast their ballot. The Electoral Commission is now warning those abroad that there may not be enough time for postal ballots to make it back in time instead suggesting they vote by proxy.
Secondly, pen and paper ballots are the slowest to process, easiest to manipulate and therefore most at risk of fraud and error. The elections in May offered a scary glimpse of what we can expect on 23 June - missing votes, insecure paper votes and unintentionally spoilt ballots. In a tight, nationwide vote count fraud and error at the margins could have a significant impact on the outcome.
Yes, those pesky paper ballots which are so ripe for fraud and error. And they turn off young people. Not like in the United Sates where e-voting has been around for over a decade. Right?
From the Executive Summary of "Democracy Lost: A Report on the Fatally Flawed 2016 Democratic Primaries"
The widespread and illegal efforts to manipulate the election results in the 2016 Democratic Party primaries are not the only visible indications of election fraud. EJUSA has also identified irregular patterns in precinct-level Democratic vote tallies which are strongly suggestive of electronic voting machine tampering. In all eleven primaries where discrepancies between exit polling and official results exceeded the margin of error, the discrepancy favored Hillary Clinton. Democracy Lost treats the controversy over exit polling discrepancies with in-depth argumentation and statistical regression analysis.
Exit polling has been used throughout the world as a means to verify election results. The United States Agency for International Development (USAID) stated in their 2015 booklet “Assessing and Verifying Election Results,” [e]xit polls are powerful analytical tools … [a] discrepancy between the votes reported by voters and official results may suggest that results have been manipulated.” [...]Many US states use touch-screen computer voting systems that do not even generate a papertrail. Almost all ballots, whether paper or not, are counted by computers. All counting is non-transparent and inaccessible for verification by the public. The few states that audit the computer counts by hand only examine a tiny percentage of the ballots and even this count is not performed according to proper statistical procedures. In other words, the results of our elections, based on computer counts, are largely unverified.
It seems that some people in Britain recognize the dangers that e-voting machine pose to the integrity of their elections. For example, read the following from "Why we don't have electronic voting" in The Telegraph:
Let's think it through. We're talking about an IT system that needs to do the following: verify the identity of around 50 million users within a 15 hour period; register their votes, but anonymously so that no connection can *ever* be made between verified identity and vote cast; store the data behind those votes in a fashion that allows independent verification and checking after election, and in a form that absolutely cannot be altered or manipulated after the fact; and do all this without any scope whatever for hacking, penetration or even just crashing during the voting period.
Just to be clear, failing even slightly on any one of those things will undermine one of the foundations of our system of governance, acceptance of the democratic legitimacy of our government.
It's ironic in the extreme that we continue to use easily hackable, unverifiable and non-transparent voting machines in large parts of our country. The latest leaked NSA report on Russian interference in the 2016 election, which provided no proof that Russia hacked into our voting systems, did clearly identify this as a major problem for the integrity of US elections by pointing out how easy it is for someone with even modest hacking skills to break into the software that controls voter registration systems.
According to [Jake Williams, founder of computer security firm Rendition Infosec and formerly of the NSA’s Tailored Access Operations hacking team] if this type of [spearphishing] attack [described in the NSA report] were successful, the perpetrator would possess “unlimited” capacity for siphoning away items of interest. “Once the user opens up that email [attachment],” Williams explained, “the attacker has all the same capabilities that the user does.” Vikram Thakur, a senior research manager at Symantec’s Security Response Team, told The Intercept that in cases like this the “quantity of exfiltrated data is only limited by the controls put in place by network administrators.” Data theft of this variety is typically encrypted, meaning anyone observing an infected network wouldn’t be able to see what exactly was being removed but should certainly be able to tell something was afoot, Williams added. Overall, the method is one of “medium sophistication,” Williams said, one that “practically any hacker can pull off.”
We haven't had a clean election since before these e-voting machines were installed. It's highly likely John Kerry lost the election to Bush in 2004 due to the hacking of e-voting machines in Ohio. No one can say with any degree of certainty that our elections have been valid for some time, thanks in large part to the widespread use of e-voting machines. Until we return to paper ballots and rid ourselves of these infernal e-voting machines, our election results cannot be trusted, and anyone who has faith that our votes are counted accurately is deluding themselves.
Comments
Paper Ballots is as the retort to the RussiaGate CTers.
I'm trying out the line "Hey, I don't KNOW if you're right, but if you are, the only way to address the problem is paper ballots." It seems to be working and THAT is actually something the crazies can get their teeth into and implement. It's not like their Dem leaders are pointing any of them in any useful direction right now, so we might as well try.
Yes, the one good thing that may come out of
Russiagate. Maybe.
"You can't just leave those who created the problem in charge of the solution."---Tyree Scott
If nothing else it helps avoiding the conversation with them.
Which is a blessed blessing in and of itself
Not only is that a reason,
however I see it as starting to plant the paper ballots seed. Get others to start seeing the value in paper ballots with hand counting. I'm going to use your idea and respond to others accordingly. Great suggestion.
"The “jumpers” reminded us that one day we will all face only one choice and that is how we will die, not how we will live." Chris Hedges on 9/11
At the very least it starts a conversation.
"If our elections are so vulnerable to outside hacking, why is no one pushing for moving back to paper?"
Idolizing a politician is like believing the stripper really likes you.
That is another delicious corollary that impeaches the DEM
leadership.... Nice one
Any time somebody tells me to "Just Trust Me"...
I immediately feel the urge to check my wallet.
Then Count my fingers,
Then My close Relatives.
I find it amazing that with all the ways they "Legally" manipulate the vote, through gerrymandering, etc...
That isn't enough for the PTB.
Honestly, I feel the urge to reread "The Stainless Steel Rat For President"
https://www.amazon.com/Stainless-Steel-Rat-President/dp/1441881387
At this point, lying, cheating and stealing from and to the PTB seems to be the best solution. After all, it's what they do to us. (However, I draw the line at violence against persons. Property, however... I am much more flexible.)
I do not pretend I know what I do not know.
Holy Shit! The Stainless Steel Rat... Flashback to the 80s!
Super cool. Can't wait to check out the link.
“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu
I do enjoy Harry Harrison.
Unfortunately, he's one of those authors that helped ensconce the "Noble Mercenary" in the SF canon. Good stories, of course, but still one of those little things that rubs me the wrong way.
However, his absolute scathing take on the military in "The Stainless Steel Rat Gets Drafted" is one of the most hilarious takes on the weaknesses of the way the US military is run.
I do not pretend I know what I do not know.
Yea, Super Bummed at How the Canon of my Old Sci Fi
favs has been so ugly and damaging to our culture, particularly the space faring future stuff. I watch a lot of Star Trek shows, I do digital wallpaper while working, and love Roddenberry's morality. It would be nice to think that's how we go in the future. But Star Trek is the exception to the rule. It's morality is grandfathered in due to it's pre-corporate cultural strength. Even this franchise is getting updated to remove those socialist and non-capitalist elements.
Also interesting how few of the Fantasy novels and series have been pushed out into pop culture, despite the compelling content and characters.
The only ones that seem to make it out are the ones where the young protagonist is royalty, a friend of royalty, or otherwise socially special. The fantasy stories that have the orphan kitchen rat come out of nowhere to save the day seem to be off limits.
“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu
SF culture
While the media serving the Science Fiction (SF) culture becomes ever more enamored with Horror.
(I'm a Fantasy fan and resent the fuck out of Horror taking the joint over!)
Not a fan of Star Wars, are you?
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
I Loved It as a Kid. Not So Much Anymore...
Many of those instances, too.
Completely agree on the Horror taking over Sci-Fi. So many great stories out there, and we can't see any of them for want of gut-spilling gore-fests in space™.
On the side, the Expanse is a pretty interesting story.
“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu
I'm with Sir Alec Guinness on that one.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfEw5H_LSoQ]
Of course, when I grew up and saw older films, I understood a lot more about why it was a rather... bland story.
Even when ROTJ came out, I had that uneasy feeling that some of this story... really SUCKED.
I do not pretend I know what I do not know.
Living in a World of Secondhand Childhood Banalities. Whoa...
Guinness sounds like a friggin' prophet here.
Never heard anything of this before. One would think it would be a fairly large cultural story -- it's got it all for a inter-generational social argument.
“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu
His retirement journal was incredibly good.
He published his journal shortly before his death, and what was fascinating was how much Guinness enjoyed Australian Cinema. In particular, he expressed a great fondness for this film:
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dtfxf3FFx4]
A film that was phenomenally good, romantic, and extremely tolerant of differing cultures, and what happens when entrenched power is challenged.
Honestly, the film is a great allegory for how politics goes in America.
I do not pretend I know what I do not know.
Great film
One of my faves.
"You can't just leave those who created the problem in charge of the solution."---Tyree Scott
Man, Google is Spooky...
This was in my YT list on the right side of the page:
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xw0IR6fJlV0]
I like Mark Hamill now.
“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu
Ironically, the medium that the MSM rails against...
video games, used to be MUCH better about the "Everyman" hero, as opposed to the "Chosen One" narrative.
Unfortunately, as time has gone on, and more and more focus groups get involved with narrative direction, the plots have started falling into line.
Indies are better, and the profit lines of the big companies is already falling into the toilet recently (50% drops in sales for major releases), so maybe they'll actually fill a desired market again instead of trying to manufacture desire for a story nobody wants anymore.
I do not pretend I know what I do not know.
Interesting thought on the SF canon:
"Even this franchise is getting updated to remove those socialist and non-capitalist elements." That's what rubs me the wrong way with the newer SciFi shows like The Expanse, Dark Matter, and KillJoys is they all seem to revolve around corporations running everything. There are no governments of, by and for the people. It's all about profit. It's the normalization of corporatocracy. Even so, I do like the shows a lot. It'll be interesting to see how Star Trek Discovery handles this in the fall.
"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." - JFK | "The more I see of the moneyed peoples, the more I understand the guillotine." - G. B. Shaw Bernie/Tulsi 2020
I Look at the Expanse as an Extrapolation of Our System.
Warts and all. I find it a great allegory for where we're going -- exactly what Sci-Fi is supposed to be.
I watch Dark Matter, and like it, but it's a bit more ugly -- one part martyr part vigilante -- and every human for her or himself.
I also think that the Expanse pushes the futility of such decision making processes.
Mars, the show on National Geo, the docudrama that mixes the contemporary and future science is far more problematic than any of them. The way they treated public ridicule and lost profits as some kind of sacrosanct line to never be crossed was completely gross.
"We've got trillions invested. If this fails, the endeavor is over. The public relations and lost profits will kill this global endeavor."
It SCREAMS of negative liberty and an apathetic future.
“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu
Rupert Murdoch, through Fox, owns at least 67% of Nat Geo TV
And in 2015 Murdoch completed the slow-motion media coup by buying the magazine as well.
https://www.salon.com/2015/09/10/rupert_murdoch_just_bought_national_geo...
http://reverbpress.com/business/rupert-murdoch-national-geographic-layoffs/
The National Geographic “brand” doesn’t stand for what people might think it does. Certainly the TV channel hasn’t for many years. Like the Wall Street Journal, Nat Geo is now just another Murdoch property.
They are making plausible predictions.
Or warnings ala 1984 and Brave New World.
(actually in High school, the boys all thought Huxley was describing Utopia - free sex and drugs - Wow!)
I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.
high school boys
Some who were high school boys in those days knew better!
"US govt/military = bad. Russian govt/military = bad. Any politician wanting power = bad. Anyone wielding power = bad." --Shahryar
"All power corrupts absolutely!" -- thanatokephaloides
Not in my school!
Of course, 90+% of us were "deplorables".
I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.
"Trust Me" is NYC area conman's favorite colloquialism.
Which is why you hear the super goon Drumpf use it frequently.
Immediately renders me skeptical of the person using it too.
"If I should ever die, God forbid, let this be my epitaph:
THE ONLY PROOF HE NEEDED
FOR THE EXISTENCE OF GOD
WAS MUSIC"
- Kurt Vonnegut
I Completely Believe "Trust Me" In Certain Situations.
"Trust Me... You don't want that happening to you," is completely believable. I trust them.
There are a few of these situations, usually revolving around ugly personal experience that I find this language completely valid and trustworthy. Political and economic speech, not so much, or more aptly, not at all.
“Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” ~ Sun Tzu
I remember back in the fiasco of 2000
One of the first refrains we heard is that we now have to move to electronic voting. It was a transparent lie even then, and as fate would have it, a Bush related company got Florida's contract.
Paper ballots are the only way to prevent the fraudsters from stealing an election.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
Does anyone think that any of these issues with hackable
e-voting machines will be addressed before 2018, 2020? I certainly don't. The neoliberalcons will have none of this democracy bullshit.
"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." - JFK | "The more I see of the moneyed peoples, the more I understand the guillotine." - G. B. Shaw Bernie/Tulsi 2020
Not a chance.
The flaws are intentionally baked into the system. Hacking is just a tool both sides use when they need. If this current brouhaha was really about hacking, the discussion would be about making our voting more secure, not ramping up the Cold War again.
Idolizing a politician is like believing the stripper really likes you.
Moreover, per Sane Progressive's
excellent analysis in her "Bipartisan Destruction of the Election System" here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FN-cYCjAAXI -- unless I'm not understanding properly -- the conduct of presidential elections is now completely in the purview of the Department of Homeland Security. From premises, equipment, and records to ballots and personnel.
My sense is that no voting of the Corbyn kind will happen here.
Thanks for the essay, Steven. Elephant in the room, isn't it?
Was watching British tv coverage of the election online, and they showed actual live footage in the background of big halls filled with voter counters, along with shots of boxes of ballots being physically hauled in to this big room. Transparency.
Look forward to reading the whole thing when I get a minute. In the meantime, while I'm thinking of it, just wanted to drop this here for folks who may not have seen this, apropos to your essay about how easy it is to flip votes on electronic voting machines:
"If I should ever die, God forbid, let this be my epitaph:
THE ONLY PROOF HE NEEDED
FOR THE EXISTENCE OF GOD
WAS MUSIC"
- Kurt Vonnegut
Why isn't Hillary demanding paper ballots?
Seriously, how come the people who are screaming, "Russian hacking! Russian hacking! Russian hacking!" all the time aren't demanding paper ballots to make it impossible to hack ballots?
Hillary: Making sure women get a bigger piece of the middle-class pie that her neoliberal, DLC, pro-Wall Street, pro-Pentagon, pro-TPP, Republican-lite economic policies are designed to shrink.
because if she had paper ballots she couldn't
whine and shout and blame other persons to have hacked the elections and caused her to lose. She needs a way to blame her loss at someone or on something.
I like the smell and sound and sight of people hanging over huge piles of paper ballots and count them, count them again and get them checked. Feels good.
https://www.euronews.com/live
Besides, how could she have cheated Bernie out
of the nomination if the data base can't be hacked?
"The object of persecution is persecution. The object of torture is torture. The object of power is power. Now do you begin to understand me?" ~Orwell, "1984"
Ellis makes her case; Specifics Still Lacking in CDP Vote Review
speaking of frauds, the California Democratic Party chair election results were challenged by Kim Ellis, the "loser" by 60 or so votes who then asked to review the ballots. Good on her for not giving in to their b.s. bully tactics, that's what I say, Imagine if Gore had that kind of nerve instead of cap&trade profits, or if Bernie contested instead of buying a vacation house and going on book tour.
The corporate Ds fear a private investigation I wonder why? After finding some irregularities, Ellis says:
http://www.theliberaloc.com/2017/06/06/ellis-makes-her-case-specifics-still-lacking-in-cdp-vote-review/comment-page-1/
I downloaded a PDF of that statement from here
https://voteforkimberly.com/wp-content/uploads/Preliminary-Ballot-Review-Memo_06.05.17.pdf
thanks
Gore...Kerry...
I've often wondered if they'd managed to swing 2008 to McCain/Palin, would Obama have rolled over? Same for 2012. Given he didn't even try to push anything he was elected to do, I can't imagine much of a fight there either.
And Bernie, what ever happened to that guy I voted for in the primary?
Idolizing a politician is like believing the stripper really likes you.
Hmm. The paper ballots answer surprised me.
I think by the time you get around to votes counting, you've already been rung out of everything that's possible. Your chances to be heard were suffocated months and months earlier. And, any kind of counting system can be rigged, which is why exit polls are the world standard for verifying the vote.
I'm not saying that paper ballots aren't better, but certain policies and people will be cut out of the race and never see a ballot finish, regardless of how dear they are to voters. And those who do make it to ballot… well, you need to take a second look at them. Take Kerry. I am convinced voter fraud was used against him in 2004, but he was just another bait and switch Neocon. He went to prep school with all the Neocons testifying and asking questions in hearings last week. That's why he was allowed on the ballot in the first place, and why he surrendered so easily. Had he won, the antiwar movement would have immediately died and the situation might have gotten much worse. The Obama effect would take hold. The "Democrat" comes in with two wars going on, and he leaves with seven underway and not a peep of protest from the Democratic faithful.
The disappointment and lack of political progress and justice that people feel about the outcome of voting in US elections are structural flaws that are either written into our ancient constitution, or omitted because they hadn't been invented yet. That means that subsequent systems were established afterward by partisan political appointees channeling the founders (SCOTUS) and then carved into settled law.
Seems to me these are the traps that block the government from the people:
A primary structural flaw is the two party system and the subsequent requirements that make third parties physically impossible to mount. The UK simply has more choices and voters can find real representation or create new parties on the fly. Government is nuanced to see to the needs and hear the voices of most citizens. Decisions are negotiated consensus, not a winner take all horror-show.
The US does not have a federal election or centralized voting laws. Nor is the US as a whole a democracy. That thing that looks like a federal election is actually 50 war-lord states weighing in on the budget, foreign policy, and immigration — after they decide who gets to vote, where and when they vote, how the votes will be recorded, and which ones will be counted. The states decide what is most convenient voting method for their purposes.
None of the states really want to be a nation with the other states. They don't want to pay for sick people in other states, or support education in states that use heathen text books. They don't want their taxes used on infrastructure projects in other states. They don't want federal laws that interfere with their state's social and civic "traditions." It's settled psychology and deliberate social programming.
I think the people want to act nationally, but there's little support for that. As for Presidents, this time it only took three months for the Deep State to take over the White House and start a new cold war.
I'm hopeful that Americans will accept the physical realities of the system they live in and build a plan from there. It would be very empowering if people had a shared vision of what they want rather than what they don't want. IMO, of course.
Populations don’t like wars. They have to be lied into it.
That means we can be “truthed” into peace. — Julian Assange
Not having to vote for a plethora of officers/judges
you've never heard of, on a set voting day, also helps.
The electoral ballot in the UK is pretty simple. A few boxes, and you plonk down your 'X'.
Gëzuar!!
from a reasonably stable genius.
I always turn in a blank Cook county judicial ballot.
It has something like 110 names on it and I have no idea whether they are good judges or not. If they are bad judges why aren't they impeached? Maybe only members of the bar should vote for them.
My wife always marks no for all of them. Other people mark yes for all of them. i just put the blank sheet into the vote tallier and it beeps "Undervote!". I tell the election judge to hit "override".
Once I marked No for four judges that the Chicago9 tribune had recommended against for things like rarely showing up for work, screaming and throwing things at attorneys and the like. i.e. unprofessional behavior. still, the court system should deal with that without the input of bewildered citizens. Maybe in rural counties with four or five judges, the voters know them. Not in Cook county with four million inhabitants and more than one hundred judges.
I've seen lots of changes. What doesn't change is people. Same old hairless apes.
By the way Steven,
actually there were 9 states where Kerry "lost" but the exit polls said he won.
On to Biden since 1973
Mail in ballots. I'm surprised that the Oregon and Washington
experiments, which are vote at home, take your time, on paper, experiments gone well, have not been mentioned. Voter fraud in these states, does not exist.
Many more people are voting by absentee ballots which also tend to be paper. Counting in public? Well, that is another step.
Oh and in many countries a special voting day or voting on a weekend, change the access dynamics.
This isn't rocket science. Actually, it's paper and ball point pen and an easier time to vote. Plus one person, one vote.
You may choose to look the other way, but you can never say again you did not know. ~ William Wiberforce
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