Well You Knew These Would Happen?
Trump is determined to return the US to its number one spot as the worlds biggest polluter.
Donald Trump has signed executive orders to allow construction of the Dakota Access and Keystone XL oil pipelines, a move certain to anger environmentalists and Native Americans.
Trump’s move provoked an immediate backlash. Bernie Sanders, Democratic senator for Vermont, said: “Millions of people came together all over this country to stop the Keystone XL and Dakota Access pipelines and say we must transform our energy system away from fossil fuels to renewable energy. Today, President Trump ignored the voices of millions and put the short-term profits of the fossil fuel industry ahead of the future of our planet.
These first hundred days promise to be quite something, got to love those executive orders. TPP may be trashed in principle, but Trump will only increase Corporate Power within the US and I'm sure any new "NAFTA" will be tar sands friendly.
The era of Goldman Sachs and the Oligarchy has been solidified.
Israel has taken Trump to mean
Israel has approved a plan to construct 2,500 new settlement homes in the occupied West Bank, two days after the country accepted building permits for more than 500 settler homes in occupied East Jerusalem.
Israeli Defence Minister Avigdor Lieberman said in a statement on Tuesday that he and Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu agreed on the approval "in response to housing needs".
Funny how it's the Defence Minister doing the talking, but when you add this
Newly inaugurated US President Donald Trump is about to reverse an historical course that has been in the making for 100 years.
The inexperienced, demagogic politician hardly understands the danger that lies in his decision to move the American embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem. If he goes through with this, he is likely to unleash an episode of chaos in an already volatile region.
It looks like our wars in the Middle East could get a real boost, the MIC will be pleased. Jobs!
Volatile = good for business. The mercenaries will be dancing in the streets shortly. Jobs!
The thinking goes if we have the pipelines then the Middle East can go to hell [even more so].
I wonder what BS is on the agenda tomorrow?
This may come to a head faster than even I thought it would.
The US as an isolationist aggressor, a cocktail best served in hell.
Comments
Yes. Here's comes the ugly of uglies.
"I can't understand why people are frightened of new ideas. I'm frightened of the old ones."
John Cage
It will be truly fugly
Not a Trump fanboy,
but I'll give him credit when it's due. TPP was horrific. Thank god he killed. And fuck Obama for threatening us with it.
But you are right everything else he stands for is looking like a Dumpster Fire for the planet, US workers, and world peace.
Donnie The #ShitHole Douchebag. Fake Friend to the Working Class. Real Asshole.
I wonder what the replacement of TPP will be
He'll need something to help him with the foreign banks that hold many of his debts
So, where are all those
C99ers who voted so proudly for Trump, today? You sure stuck it to the Democrats with these pipelines that are going to be horrible for the Environment and that we always knew Trump would approve. Congratulations, you're so smart. Way to go!
just use common sense...
Not many if any
The Dems got rid of me awhile ago, so I wrote in Bernie Sanders in VT
@common sense dem The TPP would have
The TPP would have allowed horrific corporate pollution with no legal recourse. I do not recall Clinton campaigning on stopping the pipelines. I do recall her position on fracking being really pro-fracking, damn the consequences.
Your comment about C99ers is insulting as hell and does nothing to engender rational discussion.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
What?
Which website has been feeding you that propaganda?
You are going to have to be more fact-based if you want to make a presence here. C99'ers don't go off half-cocked with emotionalized misinformation.
I'm not aware of a single regular on this site who voted for Trump. You can regale us for voting for Stein, for not voting or for not voting for the anointed one, but you cannot prove in any way that anyone here voted for Trump.
Maybe someone did. If so, they didn't tell us.
If you look at the facts,
you will realize it was the DNC and the Clintons who gave us Trump. The evidence is clear, if you choose to look at it. Most of the evidence is in the DNC emails that were leaked (not hacked) to wikileaks.
Absolutely they couldn't put a candidate that could
beat a caricature of the odious elite.
@LaFeminista Because she IS the
Because she IS the odious elite. Not caricatured, straight-up realistic portraiture.
Kinda like being offered a choice between Norman Osborn and the Green Goblin.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
I might argue
Hillary fawns before the elite
Trump is a paid up member.
@LaFeminista Oh, they're
Oh, they're really both the elite, at this point, but Donald is the elite caricaturing itself because it can.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Trump? You must be on the wrong site, try again.
To thine own self be true.
@common sense dem I imagine they're in the
I imagine they're in the United States, where we're denied any choices that do not serve the oil barons. Or the weaponsmakers. Or the banks.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
This shows your lack of awareness of C-99
If you think you can come over from The Orange Stain and accuse those who didn't vote for the corrupt unethical queen's crowning of supporting the election of Trump you are sadly mistaken...
The majority of us were Sanders Supporters, and we watched in horror at the scale of the corruption, and lack of ethics displayed by Hillary "The Mad Bomber" Clinton's Campaign, The
DemocRATicParty, The DNC, and the Hillbots, as they waged a campaign of Voter Suppression and Election Fraud to win the Democratic Primaries & Caucuses. That was where Trump won the election!You might as well face the music that a candidate of the oligarchy didn't stand a chance in this election cycle and the efforts of the people that were involved in getting Her Majesty to her Coronation are directly responsible for us having President Trump...
I voted for Bernie in the primary and Jill Stein in the election, my not voting for your turd in no way makes me complaisant for the election of President Donald Trump...
Now skedaddle and go write something about how The Russians Hacked The Election or something equally stupid...
#DemExit
I'm the only person standing between Richard Nixon and the White House."
~John F. Kennedy~
Economic: -9.13, Social: -7.28,
@common sense dem Actually--
Actually--
Shouldn't this rejoinder be going the other way?
I mean, shouldn't it be US saying to YOU: "Way to go with your selection of that incredibly shitty candidate who thought that the Pied Piper Strategy was a good idea."
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
For the second time in a row I voted for Dr. Jill Stein
As far as our 'Democrats' go both of my Democratic Senators, Patty Murray and Maria Cantwell, recently voted against the Sanders-Klobuchar amendment that would allow the US to by cheaper medicine.Cory Booker got the most negative publicity over it but Patty Murray gets three times as much from the pharmaceutical industry as Booker.
Fwiw they both also strongly supported the TPP and voted for 'fast tracking' it and the problem is that I could go on about many other examples but another thing that should not be forgotten is that they had no problem with Obama's blatant attack on Social Security with his Cat Food Commissions,Patty Murray even chaired the last effort in the Super Cat Food Commission. SS survived but tax cuts also survived.
What about the 'leader' of the Party ,Obama? This should never be forgotten by all seniors (and future ones)....http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/09/obamas-long-battle-cut-social-sec...
Obama has built 10 times the equivalent of the KeystoneXL
pipeline capacity in his 8 years in office. He once bragged at the end of his first term that the US has built enough pipeline to go around the world during his tenure.
US oil production has increased 88% during Obama's presidency. This is the largest domestic oil production increase during any presidency in U.S. history.
Obama has outdone Sarah's "Drill baby, drill" tenfold.
Yes, you should.
I voted for Stein
But if I had to, I'd have voted for Trump. And I'd actually be more proud of that vote today than I would have been when I cast it, because a Trump presidency is having a tangible effect: people are actually willing to stand up and protest again, something that seemed to vanish under Obama.
Obomba killed the anti-war movement
Indeed
How could Obama be a warmonger? He's a democrat. And black. And other random irrelevant things that have nothing to do with war and military. And if HRC was elected, they'd just replace "black" with "woman" on that list, and continue to ignore our ever growing war march across the globe.
There are peace talks in Syria
that's something we we wouldn't have had with Hillary.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
@common sense dem Cheer up. Hillary may get
Cheer up. Hillary may get her cold war with Russia anyway. And last I heard her position on the pipeline was that the protesters and workers should both be kept safe while the workers finished building the pipeline. Incrementally.
I don't take that shit from my brother,
and I sure as hell won't take it from some clown who hides behind an alias.
My vote is MY business. Not yours. If you don't like it, suck it up and try harder next time. Oh, and try to field and support a candidate who isn't a walking pile of toxic sludge. (That goes for the Republicans too!
)
There is no justice. There can be no peace.
When god wants to destroy a nation.
The American people are stuck in an untenable situation. We are in a lose/lose situation no matter what we do. The only option is picking how we lose. Yah, no TPP but in return Trump destroys the environment. (I think Hillary would have found that on second thought, TPP wasn't such a bad deal after-all. Maybe some future tweeks is all we need once we finish the limited nuclear war with Russia.)
When god wants is looking at options for destroying a society or civilization, She no longer sends angels to turn everything into salt the Old School way. Nope, She lets the society or civilization decide on whether it survive or die depending on the choices it makes. Believe or not believe science about global warming. Elect or not elect certain leaders. From my point of view, when humans look back and ask how in the hell we got to the wasteland, Bernie's defeat will be recognized as maybe the biggest event that lead to cataclysm. Bernie certainly would not have been a perfect or holy leader, but he would have walked us back from a pit of destruction that Trump and Clinton were offering in their own unique ways.
But just in case, if two sorta angelic looking people ask for directions to gop and dem headquarters, point the way, run like hell in the opposite direction, and don't look back.
Bernie would have been good, bloody shame in my mind
that the Dems rejected him for a neo-liberal and warmonger
Disaster capitalism under Trump & Water Protectors to die?
Naomi Klein wrote "The Shock Doctrine" a decade ago. Trumpism making it alive and well. Article by her today
GET READY FOR THE FIRST SHOCKS OF TRUMP’S DISASTER CAPITALISM
How long will it be until Water Protectors are murdered? I have been waiting for this for a few months. Now with the law proposed in ND, you can run over someone and not get charged. Or will they die from injuries? Or just be shot dead with rubber bullets or smoke bombs. We are such a compassionate murdering country. And of course, President Trump could send out the drones for a precision murder like we do around the globe.
For sure it's going to be spectacular.
I'm now convinced that Trump will be the greatest president
ever. He has to be because there are so many smart people saying what great things he's already doing, like stopping the TPP and extinguishing the possibility of war with Russia.
I'm confused a little as to why he hasn't been given the Nobel Peace prize yet, he has single handedly stopped a nuclear war between Russia and the U.S.
I've decided to stop writing essays for awhile for that reason. I think it's best to just sit back and see what else Trump does, give him a chance like all the smart people are saying. Just to explain why I won't be around as much.
@Big Al (shrug) Would you have
(shrug) Would you have preferred your pipelines with the TPP and an increased likelihood of nuclear war, or without?
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@Big Al It's taken as a given
It's taken as a given among most people on this site that it was the "choice" itself (between Hillary and Trump) that was the problem.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Understand,
actually I'm referring to a number of sites (not this one) and people I've read for many years who are saying that Trump is actually different, that he's really going against the deep state.
I'm big enough to admit when I'm wrong.
Except I'm not
@Big Al Even if Trump were
Even if Trump were everything his fans want him to be (he's not), and even if he went into the Oval Office intending to fight the Deep State, there's no fucking way that would last. I'd go so far as to say that the Oval Office is not the best place from which to fight the Deep State because they concentrate a lot of their forces there. If someone genuinely wanted to fight from there, they'd have to have the mentality of an intelligence operative; actual CIA training would be helpful. You'd need to have the training w/out the (lack of)morality which usually accompanies it, which probably means either a whistleblower or a candidate advised by whistleblowers.
This is all a fantasy, of course, but if someone were going to approach the Presidency w/an eye toward fighting the PTB, you'd have to trick them real good first. You'd have to make them think you were one of them, totally on board with their plans, and you'd have to have the credentials to make that good. Once you got in, you'd essentially plan your own defeat and build it into your plan so it could have secondary effects that would advance your goals when they took you down. You'd want to have a VP who was on the same page with you, perhaps someone who could be the one to take you down once you'd pissed the PTB off enough with your actions, and take over, leaving them thinking they'd won and now had "their guy" in the driver's seat at last. It would become evident later that they didn't have their guy in the driver's seat, and there's only so many times you can hand the baton off when you're fighting such an asymmetrical fight, but what that would do is buy a certain amount of time to accomplish a few goals. The question is: what goals could you accomplish in a few years with the power of the Presidency alone?
Depends, I suppose on how radical you want to become and whether any of the military is on your side or not.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
@Cant Stop the Macedonian Signal Edward Snowden for
Edward Snowden for President? Is he 35 yet? /s
(I have no idea about his views on anything but privacy.)
Of course he may have to become a Russian citizen to stay alive.
Julian Assange is unfortunately not eligible -
He's Aussie-born. On the other hand we have some home-grown possibilities - probably have to discount Chelsea Manning because "ex-felon", but maybe one of those who had to live half-lives in the shadows for fear of their own Government.
There is no justice. There can be no peace.
Still not sure war with Russia
is off the table, what with the continued arms and troop buildup on Russia's west borders. Expect to see tension with China, too. We want the oil in their waters. You can't get away with the same shit against the next two most powerful nuclear powers, especially at the same time!
There is no such thing as TMI. It can always be held in reserve for extortion.
I put forth my hypothesis some time ago,
sticking with it. But the number and kind of people who are falling for this has me doubting myself. I think I'll stick to my guns.
Sounds like snark to me
Prefer having enough light in the room to read darkness going darker.
Keystone threatens the Ogallala aquifer
The Keystone XL is the pipeline that will carry the bitumen from the Canadian tar sands to the US gulf coast. It will go through the Native American Ogallala aquifer.
Canadian PM talked about phasing out the tar sands and he got a big backlash from the oil interests in Canada. But the truth is, the planet cannot afford the tar sands. And the price of oil will determine their expansion. When the price goes down the very expensive extraction of the bitumen starts to bleed money.
Tar Sands expert: Andrew Nikiforuk
Expanding Tar Sands Will Kill Paris Targets and Climate Stability, Report Finds
The ill-informed Trump thinks his signature is enough to make the bitumen flow. The people of Kalamazoo are still cleaning up after the bitumen oil spill in 2010. He has just declared war on the planet.
(The tar sands are 71% foreign owned with the largest owner being the USA, so they are not really Canadian except for the location.)
To thine own self be true.
Tar sands possible the most polluting source of
fossil fuels ever to be exploited, never mind the alien wasteland that the mining leaves behind.
Coal remains in the #1 spot for carbon
The US remains the number two producer (BTW, it has the world's largest reserves) and the number two consumer of coal in the world.
Now here's the bad news.
Consumption of the world's resources are not going to stop anytime soon. Three-quarters of the world's population have yet to catch up with America's consumption. What is the solution? "We got ours so fuck you?" These problems are going to increase in the future.
Most of the strife currently going on in every corner of the world right now is due to socio-economic disparity - NOT f'ing shit cliches like "freedom" and "democracy".
@MarilynW Here we go again.
Here we go again.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Correction: Keystone XL goes to Nebraska
and then there's another pipeline to the Gulf Coast.
To thine own self be true.
The bitumen also won't flow w/o American diluent
Diluent is the condensate produced when "drying" natural gas produced by fracking so the gas can be used for commercial purposes.
Canada’s Oil Exports Are Dead Without U.S. Shale Production
The interesting thing about Trump & the TPP,
regardless of all else that can be said about Trump, and regardless of the fact that we're all sure there's another shoe gonna drop somewhere so that "rejecting TPP" gets turned into something that will bite us in the ass--
I can't think of a Democratic president that has done as much as that for the working class. My memories of Carter are a bit dim except on environmental stuff and the Iran hostage crisis and the malaise speech. I've heard he was pro-business; I was a little young to understand that stuff at the time...but I take it from people I respect that he wasn't good for labor.
Even if he was, he left in 1980, and it's been all downhill from there.
So what I'm saying is that Trump just did more for the working class than any Democratic president has done for them for 36 years at least, and maybe more like 50. Even though we all know he doesn't really give a shit, and even though it's gonna come back to bite us in the ass somehow--think about it. When's the last time a President did anything comparable for workers?
Obamacare? Lily Ledbetter? I'm scraping the bottom of the barrel here. There were a couple good pieces of legislation in the early 90s (91 and 93: the Americans with Disabilities Act and the Family Medical Leave Act)--should I be grateful to Bill Clinton for not vetoing the one that went through in '93? That's the best I can come up with here.
I'm not saying Trump is good. I'm saying, as shit as he is, he just did better than any Democratic president in the past 35 years, and maybe more.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
I'm not sure "better" is the word I would have chosen
efficient perhaps.
@LaFeminista OK, here's my question:
OK, here's my question:
Which president of the past 45 years has done anything as good for labor as getting us out of the TPP? And what was the good thing they did?
That's what I asked myself, and I'm seriously coming up blank. I don't think Lily Ledbetter and Obamacare cut it. Certainly I can't come up with one thing Bill Clinton did that was any good, unless it's NOT vetoing Kennedy's Family Medical Leave Act.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
TPP has never been ratified
It's easy to stop something that does not exist.
NAFTA on the other hand will be the trial balloon.
wow, that was
really a bad dodge.
You are so biased that you can't give credit when it is due.
Admit it, if BO or HRC had stopped the TPP, you likely would have been ecstatic. Further, I would wager that most of the writers who supported the withdrawal of TPP would also be ecstatic.
But they aren't. They are far too busy looking a gift horse in the mouth, something they wouldn't do had a dem withdrawn the TPP.
You, like many other writers, point to 'dangerous' situations without even acknowledging that the 'dangerous' situations already existed with the BO administration. Like this one: "The US as an isolationist aggressor, a cocktail best served in hell." You imply that Trump, if he does start more wars, is somehow different from past administrations who have waged war for decades and decades.
And what about the pipeline? BO was for it before he decided to be against it. Plenty of dems were for it. And who knows where HRC would have landed. Yet you have all of this vitriol directed at Trump, as if some how it all started with Trump.
Well, it didn't all start with Trump.
At a minimum, writers should note, where applicable, that like BO, or like HRC, or like many presidents before, Trump is doing blah, blah, blah.
dfarrah
@dfarrah I don't trust
I don't trust Trump as far as I could throw him, for reasons different from those of most people here--
I remember Trump from my pro wrestling fan days. There's no way in hell I would ever trust that guy. He's almost certainly playing just about everybody. I mean, for god's sakes, he's a multi-millionaire slum lord casino owner who has done, basically, the same thing Vince McMahon has done and commodified his "I'm a horrible rich guy" persona.
That said, I don't decide whether an action is good or bad based on who's doing it. Pulling us out of the TPP is a good thing, a better thing than any of the last three Democratic presidents have done. That said, of course I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop, obviously, not just because of Trump's character, which sucks, but also because of the nature of US politics, which also sucks.
But I'm getting a weird feeling that it's somehow automatically bad to say that a Republican did a good thing, or automatically bad to say that Trump did a good thing. I don't make decisions that way. I don't choose my team and then decide what I think and say based on who my team is, and who my team isn't. Being out of TPP is good. Trump did it. Given that he's a shithead, probably there's some new ugly scheme involved in pulling out of the TPP which sets up more poisonous bullshit to come. I won't be surprised when that scheme becomes evident. But it's not evident yet, and the current observable reality is that Trump did a good thing.
Trump doing one good thing doesn't imply that Trump is a good man. Trump doing one good thing more for the working class than Obama or Bill Clinton doesn't imply that he's a good man either. It implies that US politics has been a fucking wasteland of greed and sociopathy for at least 36 years, and that Democrats have been total crap since I graduated from high school (at least; some people think they've been crap since I was born in 1968.)
I'm totally uninterested in criticizing Trump or protesting against him. We are way beyond that. What we should be criticizing is the system that gave us Hillary vs Trump as our "choice."
EDIT: it just occurred to me that maybe this shouldn't have been a response to dfarrah, with whom I'm more or less in agreement.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
PS I dont like executive orders by any President
They are dictats and as such should be null and void.
Same thing goes for signing statements.
I'm no fan of dictatorships or anything approaching them.
I have argued for reduced executive power for many years rather than the expansion of the same.
LBJ comes to mind
His foreign policy was terrible but on the home front he was up there close to one of his heroes, FDR.
@aliasalias I agree about LBJ. That
I agree about LBJ. That's why I said in the last 45 years.
I'm thinking from about 1971/2 to the present.
Carter, Clinton, Obama.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
Keystone Pipeline.
Civics question: tRump's cabinet has not been totally confirmed. Exactly how does the 'hold' on Keystone become moot? thanks. Rec'd!!
Inner and Outer Space: the Final Frontiers.
The widespreed use of fracking within the US has
ALREADY caused more damage to the environment than the Canadian tar sands.
The US remains the largest consumer of hydrocarbons on a per capita basis of all the major countries. If the entire population of the world were to live like Americans, we would require 5 earths to cover the ecological footprint. This current deficit is made up with foreign imports, much of it backed up with US military might. Basically, the rest of the world is supporting America's standard of living (much like it had in the now defunct English empire).
Porter Ranch carbon footprint vs. Deepwater Horizon disaster
wiki says
so I don't know for sure. Porter Ranch has wealth, the governor's sister on Sempra's board, blah blah blah. Mitigation for thee not for me.
Leave it in the ground, that's what I say. Then all can bitch about high cost of fuel again, see how that works? Great!
Voting for Stein in a swing State
was almost as bad as voting for Trump. All of the progressive purism you want to spew doesn't change the fact that you have helped this neanderthal deliver two pipelines right into to our environment. Keep telling yourself that voting for Hillary was just as bad or that the lesser of two evils is still evil. Good luck with that. When Trump throws someone you love off of Obamacare, we'll see how well you're liking that argument. No common sense.
just use common sense...
Nominating the unelectable Hillary Clinton gave us Trump
The Democratic Party failed miserably and lacked so much as a hint of common sense when they insisted on handing the nomination to the Clintons. You were warned again and again.
Democrats: "No, she's inevitable!" "She can't lose!" "Best candidate evah in the history of the world!" "Battle tested for decades! She's tough as nails! A sure fire winner, we tells ya!"
Well, your inevitable one couldn't manage to beat even the worst opponent imaginable. She was that bad!
Now you make excuses and point fingers and blame everyone but yourselves for this atrocity.
Time to get real mr/ms "common sense" -- Democrats better start listening. Keep pushing losers and you will keep on losing.
@CS in AZ You left out all the
You left out all the down ticket help she was going to provide. It was a historic opportunity to take back the senate, and with a candidate like Trump maybe even the house.
Nothing helps down ticket Democrats like telling suburban Republicans "Vote for Hillary and save your party from Trump." Apparently a lot of them did. Just not enough.
Common sense dem...
all three of your comments here so far have been self righteous chastisement of c99ers for not voting for Hillary. Is this your sole purpose for joining here?
hear here
sounding like a scoundrel that one. maybe out of his league, blaming us for trump? don't think so. just go away please.
question everything
Amen
Is it time yet?
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqkowVU5mZI]
I'm the only person standing between Richard Nixon and the White House."
~John F. Kennedy~
Economic: -9.13, Social: -7.28,
When it comes to picking the lessor of 2 evils...
It was a known evil with her support of fracking, pipelines, regime changes in Honduras, Iraq, Libya, Syria, and Ukraine just to name a few, and ready to take on Russia, Iran, China, North Korea, for wetting the mad bomber whistle...
Throw in Arms Sales to our 9/11 attackers in return for a modest contribution to the Clinton
FoundationMoney Laundry, and we have civilians in Yemen with F-15's dropping cluster bombs on them, these same 9/11 attackers also are fundingModerateISIS Rebels in Syria attempting to overthrow the AssadRegimeGovernment...Perhaps you don't realize that the US is in Syria on behalf of the Wall Street Banks and Corporations that are poised to profit from a Gas Pipeline to the EU, proposed by the predominantly Sunni Moslem nations of Kuwait, Qatar, and our 9/11 Attackers the Saudis, across the predominantly Shiite Moslem country of Syria whose Assad
RegimeGovernment turned down this pipeline...Of course Syria's neighbor the predominantly Shiite Moslem nation of Iran has an interest at keeping the warmongers from taking another stepping stone in the turbulent region and seeing the Sunni Coffers filled with more gold to fund their dominance in the region...
Russia is currently the the largest gas supplier to the EU so they have an interest as well, but we are hitting them on 2 fronts with the expansion of that organization which was left unneeded with the dismantling of the USSR, the North Atlantic Treaty Organization which has now expanded right to the borders of Mother Russia itself. Even if it took a Clinton State Department US Led
RevolutionCoup to overthrow the Democratically Elected Government of Ukraine installing a NeoNazi Government in its place to accomplish the NATO Expansion...Cry all you want about Russia annexing Crimea, which has been under Russian Rule Since 1783, and is home of the Russian Black Sea Fleet and access to the Mediterranean Sea...
This list is only starting but since you have ventured outside of the Hillary Coronation Echo Chamber perhaps you are just learning of these many inconvenient truths about your pitifully weak candidate that erroneously elevated Donald Trump to front runner in a deeply flawed Pied Piper Strategy...
VS Trump a virtually unknown in world affairs other than he likes Eastern European Wives and said on a Billy Bush Fratboy Tour that he like to grab a pussy...
Yea rather than pick the obvious lessor of 2 evils, the one that wasn't likely to attempt Mutually Assured Destruction, I voted for Jill Stein...
Now kindly Phuck Off and go back under your bridge where you can safely watch and listen perhaps learn something. If you venture out much more reciting stupid NeoLiberal Third Way Propaganda I'm sure you'll see a cleanup in Aisle 8 because you can stay for intelligent discussion but we don't stand for turd dropping...
I'm the only person standing between Richard Nixon and the White House."
~John F. Kennedy~
Economic: -9.13, Social: -7.28,
@common sense dem Do you have any concern
Do you have any concern for my loved ones who couldn't afford the Obamacare premiums and paid a penalty for their poverty?
Are you being paid to be insulting, or you just that much a righteous neoliberal?
Down in the comments, you mention progressive purists bringing down all this Trump disaster to folks with common sense.
Don't expect liberals to be liberal except on occasions when it is inconvenient. To us, that is not common sense. That is, to us, immoral and unjust.
By now, you should understand that we are hard-wired to be fair and just.
Every single election.
Go into that "incremental" dark night, and rage, rage against it elsewhere.
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." ---- William Casey, CIA Director, 1981
@common sense dem Some people here did
Some people here did feel it was necessary to vote for Hillary out of fear of Trump. Now we want to discuss solutions for real problems we are facing with people who also care about this country, the world, and all people. The saber-rattling against Russia has made me, for one, wonder if supporting Hillary was a good decision. I do not want war with Russia, especially nuclear war.
Russia probably did hack the DNC computers, along with hackers from China, Australia, Israel, Mexico, Great Britain, a few American high schools, and maybe even Grenada. The DNC cyber-security provisions were incredibly incompetent. There is no evidence that Russia gave any information from the DNC to Wikileaks. People associated with Wikileaks said the emails did not come from a Russian source. The DNC is a private organization, not a US government agency. An 'attack' on the DNC by Russia is NOT an attack on the United States. If the DNC emails leaked to Wikileaks were so innocuous how could they cause anyone to decide not to vote for Hillary? Are Dems now claiming that the emails show that Hillary is a terrible person or something?
This site makes it possible for people to exchange ideas about how to address the very real problems we are facing. I know I feel more welcome here than on another site where I get insulted for thinking it is wrong to drone-murder a 16-year-old America kid who has never even been accused of any crime other than being the son of his father. At the other site I was insulted and even called a racist for saying that poor white kids in Appalachia should be given help, too. At the other site I got tired of hearing that everything Republicans do should be obstructed, even if it is good for the country.
I want what is best for this country and for all people, whether they live in the US or not. People on this site seem to share this wish, no matter who they voted for.
Who the heck are you
to criticize how someone else voted? MYOB, and stop trying mind ours, please.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
@dervish Well SAID!
Well SAID!
http://popkey.co/m/DDkG-clapping-clap-applause-good-old+school
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
WTF ! I left DailyKos because of this sort of Crap
, Fuck you and the horse you rode in on:
Barry has been a disaster,
just ask all the Dem governors and members of state legislators.
And this editorial cartoon says it without a single word.
http://www.heraldextra.com/news/opinion/cartoons/cartoon-obama-walks-awa...
Dear Dems: You lost the WH, Senate, House, dozens of governors, state level SOS and AG and about 1,000 state legislative seats. Maybe...you're doing something wrong.
What the cartoon doesn't show is that it was Obama who
flew the plane into the ground just before he ejected.
Obama's real legacy;
House, senate and presidency in GOP hands. Middle East and North Africa in flames. Eastern Europe in crisis. Relations with China and Russia in worse shape than under Bush. Record number of bombings ever in "peacetime".
I sure hope we never get another Nobel Prize winner for president again.
The TPP was already dead.
He's merely making political capital like is so called job saving posturing with Carrier Inc. That was a done deal as well.
"I can't understand why people are frightened of new ideas. I'm frightened of the old ones."
John Cage
I think Hillary would have resurrected it. Her corporate
sponsors were the ones who wrote the damn thing in secret in the first place. She knew all about it and even called it the "gold standard" of trade agreements. Just more triangulation to cover up her private/public persona.
She may have very well tried
but if the congress she presided over had the same profile as what we have today, it would have stayed dead. She'd have to rewrite a lot of it to get it through. Primarily the clauses surrendering federal, states and individual rights, to be decided by corporate arbitrators without recourse. That was the big deal breaker.
"I can't understand why people are frightened of new ideas. I'm frightened of the old ones."
John Cage
@sojourns Unfortunately, the
Unfortunately, the TPP has (edit: been) signed by all traitors/conspirators concerned and not dead. Please bear in mind that twice before, it has been claimed by lying Dems to be dead - while both times Obama was (edit: just afterward found to have been) pushing to have it quietly shoved through... And there are other such corporate coups in line, as well...
Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.
A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.
@"common sense" dem --
No Drumpf voter here. OTOH, also didn't vote for The $Hill (based on the tone of your comment, I presume that you were in the tank for The $Hill, and are down on anyone who was not) --
BTW, how does "common sense" require a vote for The $Hill? We knew EXACTLY what we were going to get with her, and it would not have been pretty. On most issues, NO ONE knows what The Drumpf is going to do. The Repug congressional caucus is terrified of him, and I (personally) view that as a good thing --
When Cicero had finished speaking, the people said “How well he spoke”.
When Demosthenes had finished speaking, the people said “Let us march”.
This is common sense
Since you and others are (unbelievably) not sure what Trump is going to do, here you go:
-Appoint one or more far right, anti-choice Supreme Court Justices
-Approve Keystone XL and Dakota Pipelines and others
-Leaves millions of poor Americans without affordable health care who have it now
-Cut hundreds of billions in taxes for the wealthy few
-Eventually defund Planned Parenthood (perhaps once he gets a few more red state GOP Senators after mid-terms)
-Expel a large number of our undocumented brothers and sisters and spend millions building a ridiculous wall on our southern border
-Gut civil rights enforcement
Any questions? How's that Stein support looking now?
just use common sense...
And yet even with all that...
It's STILL better than having the Clinton's back in the White House.
A lot better than your Hillary support. Not only did your awful candidate lose to Trump, but she earned that privilege by fucking over the one guy who would have handed Trump his lunch.
And yet here you are lecturing the rest of us on common sense? Thanks for nothing pal.
The current working assumption appears to be that our Shroedinger's Cat system is still alive. But what if we all suspect it's not, and the real problem is we just can't bring ourselves to open the box?
What makes you so sure the Stein voters would have
voted for Hillary? Frankly, I believe many would have just stayed home. The balance would split between the 'same-old, same-old', the 'fuck you' or another 'protest' candidate.
If you look closely at their platform, Hillary had very little to offer the Green Party members.
You don't seem to have learned a fucking thing from this election. STOP blaming Hillary's loss on external factors. She and her campaign staff lost the election on their own merits (or lack thereof). Hillary triangulated herself into a corner and she carried too much baggage from her 2 1/2 decades of insider politicking. She was the wrong candidate for the times. Her "deplorables" comment spewed out at one of her fucking interminable fund raisers was the final nail in her coffin. The second part of her comments nails Obama's performance for his two terms. The people wanted change.
Here's how Hillary lost. People did not like her or her baggage.
So, if you really want to win,
GET A BETTER CANDIDATE NEXT TIME
.@CB... So, if you really
If I may add the obvious: not a lying, cheating corporate representative actively working not only against the public interest but against the survival of life on the planet for massive personal gain because a pathologically greedy couple well past retirement age can't be satisfied with the hundred million or whatever it is they've accumulated from their corporate/multi-millionaire/billionaire paymasters for their previously destructive actively working not only against the public interest but against the survival of life on the planet for massive personal gain.
Psychopathy is not a political position, whether labeled 'conservatism', 'centrism' or 'left'.
A tin labeled 'coffee' may be a can of worms or pathology identified by a lack of empathy/willingness to harm others to achieve personal desires.
LOL!
You're really too much!
Stein support looks great, in retrospect. Clinton would have been as bad as Trump, or possibly worse if her bellicosity resulted in another war. We really had no legitimate choice in this election, thanks to the DNC.
"Obama promised transparency, but Assange is the one who brought it."
what you don't seem to understand
. . . is that for many of us on this site, Bernie was the compromise candidate. He was always too pro-war and pro-defense spending for me, but I was willing to change from Indy to Dem (temporarily) to vote for him in the primary. To me, I was doing what was best for the country and its people. I'm a pragmatist and very strategic with my voting.
Many of us warned you and other "commonsense" dems that Clinton was unelectable, especially against Trump. But you ignored us and looked the other way as she and her machine manipulated the primary and the MSM in so many ways, and handed her the nomination.
I don't owe the Dem party a single thing. You cannot assume you have my vote ever. You have to earn it, and your team did everything possible to lose my support. Congrats! This is on you. You nominated probably the only candidate in the country who could lose to Donald Trump. And you have the nerve to blame Stein voters? Until you acknowledge your own party's mistakes, nothing will change.
I've never voted for a Clinton, and I'm proud of that fact. I have zero regrets about my vote.
There is no justice in America, but it is the fight for justice that sustains you.
--Amiri Baraka
I was told that $hillary didn't need my vote...
In the primary race I supported Bernie as he was the candidate that this former democrat of 42 years had been waiting his entire life for a chance to vote for. When I questioned the integrity, corruption, and ethics, of $hillary and her "Government for Hire" to the highest bidder at the Secretary of State office, I was called an insulting barrage of names that were unrelated to anything this progressive had been in his entire life...
You know the ones, you had them on your Correct The Record copy and paste list for replies on social media to Sanders supporters, Racist, Misogynist, Homophobe, Blah, Blah, Blah...
You then tried justifying speaking fees to the 1% as being okay because she was a celebrity and not a public servant subject to ethics, and denying acceptance of payola to the Clinton
Foundation CharityMoney Laundry in return for favors from the State Department saying there was no Quid Pro Quo despite being Blatantly Obvious Except To The Oblivious. The skinny was Shillary had everything I was Against in a candidate and Bernie had everything I wanted in a candidate...You then said, that "$hillary doesn't need your vote, for every one of you we lose we have 2 Republicans waiting to vote for her." Well that made it easy didn't it! I didn't have to compromise my beliefs and take one for the team voting for $hillary to save the country from the evil Trump...
Now you come here chastising me for voting for Jill Stein?
I'm going to say this as nicely as I can...
Phuck Off and Don't Let The Door Hit Ya Where The Good Lord Split Ya...
I'm the only person standing between Richard Nixon and the White House."
~John F. Kennedy~
Economic: -9.13, Social: -7.28,
"How's that Stein support looking now?" pretty pretty good!
California overrun by plutocracy, Vote Hillary!
LOL memories of who was that, Thumb? I remember liking Thumb's vote hillary campaign, it was funny. Thanks for the entertaining troll.
Peace
When will the US realize it isn't thinking outside of the box?
Then what … ?
Of course the consequences will be hard to swallow for most of us living in North-America!
Just saying ... !
@common sense dem Obama put in enough pipeline to go around the
world during his first term. He also fast tracked the Keystone Southern from Cushing to the coast During his term he increased US production of oil by 88% - more than any other president in history.
Any republican president would have
restored the pipelines. Hillary Clinton would have restored the pipelines. She loves the oil and gas industry. Don't be dumb. By the way, very few here, I believe, actually voted for Trump, If you paid attention, you'd see that he is generally reviled on a daily basis by both essayists and commentators.
"I can't understand why people are frightened of new ideas. I'm frightened of the old ones."
John Cage
My goodness-- you actually believe
that you are in a position to condescend. I am a Stein voter formerly Sanders until Clinton fucked him over. If Clinton had attained the presidency, she would have been crippled from day one. Drumpf is already being sued; Clinton would be under impeachment hearings within weeks and more congressional investigation. You have no idea how deep the corruption made manifest by her and her family runs. Have you noticed that the Clinton Foundation is closing it's doors completely? Why do you think that is? Time to break out the commercial shredding machines. It was pay to play politics, plain and simple; and now with no seat with which to grant favors, all the players have withdrawn their support. The single largest global grifting con ever pulled off. You can bet the Clinton's aren't done with the law yet, though Hillary may very well die from one of her various maladies before the slow wheels of justice do what is deemed necessary.
That's what we would have gotten with Clinton.
Bernie Sanders offered a once in a lifetime (my lifetime anyway) opportunity to push for real change but all the wussy middle manager types, pretend progressive social justice warriors, so easily brainwashed, fearful of all sorts of imaginary monsters when it comes to backing a truly progressive platform, of course, found the "incremental" approach the only course viable. Along with all of those who voted for Clinton for no other reason than she is a female. I understand that the heart wants what the heart wants, but politics is no place for emo influenced rationalizations. Unfortunately, that will never go away, especially since the wide spread use of critical thinking is at an all time low.
"I can't understand why people are frightened of new ideas. I'm frightened of the old ones."
John Cage
@sojourns This pretty much sums it
This pretty much sums it up:
My goodness-- you actually believe
that you are in a position to condescend.
"More for Gore or the son of a drug lord--None of the above, fuck it, cut the cord."
--Zack de la Rocha
"I tell you I'll have nothing to do with the place...The roof of that hall is made of bones."
-- Fiver
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