Jill Stein in Colorado - Cheers and Coloradocare Controversy
The text from my friend read: Hey want to go see Jill Stein in FoCO tonite?" I was curious about the Green Presidential candidate, and so we drove down to hear Stein speak on the back patio of Avogadro's Number, a trendy restaurant/bar in college-town Fort Collins, Colorado.
(Below: Arn Menconi, Jill Stein, from the Arn Menconi for Senate FB page)
Stein fired up the standing-room only crowd of children, activists, college students, and aging baby boomers. I was more impressed than I wanted to be by Stein's energetic and well-informed oratory, and found myself in agreement with 90% of her policies.
You can view a video of Stein's speech in Fort Collins here. and of her rally in Denver here (through Menconi's Facebook page)
Here is a link to a Facebook video of Stein's speech in Denver, in which she "sort of" endorsed Coloradocare.
Stein was introduced by Arn Menconi, who is competing for one of Colorado's US Senate seats, against moderate Third Way Democrat Michael Bennet. Menconi is also a dynamic candidate, and I think that he would serve our state at least as well as Bennet. I'll vote for Menconi, who is a better option than corporate-congresscritter Bennet or religious zealot Darryl Glenn, the GOP nominee.
Coloradocare Controversy
While in Colorado, Stein had interviewed with a local paper, the Colorado Independent, and declined to endorse Colorado's pioneering single-payer health plan ballot initiative 69, also known as ColoradoCare.
Coloradocare will be on the fall election ballot; if it passes, Colorado will gradually transition to a true single payer health care system. It has a formidable list of adversaries, however; Koch -funded Advancing Colorado, insurance-industry funded "Coloradans for Coloradans", and now progressive organizations NARAL and ProgressNowColorado, as well as various unions and Democratic lawmakers. So Stein had some rather strange bedfellows in her waffling on Coloradocare.
Bernie Sanders, Noam Chomsky, and comedian Seth Myers are among the national figures who have endorsed Coloradocare. Coloradocare is the brainchild of Senator and Doctor Irene Aguilar, who wrote a vigorous defense and fact-check of the ballot initiative in Coloradopols.
Menconi enthusiastically endorsed Coloradocare, and after a tense 24 hours of Facebook frenzy, on August 28, 2016, at her rally in Denver, Stein gave a lukewarm endorsement of Coloradocare, saying that it shows why we need a public health option at the Federal level. This is certainly true; however, it is also true that this is unlikely to happen under a Hillary Clinton administration, whatever HRC's current talking points are. If Obama sidestepped the public option, I think it unlikely that Clinton will do better. However, our Bernie revolution may be able to mobilize and create the momentum we need.
I was impressed by, and at the same time, quite disappointed by Stein's political tap-dancing on the issue of Colorado's homegrown public health initiative. Dr. Stein is a polished and energetic orator, and I like her politics. She also has less elected-official experience than I do - hey, I've been PTA President twice! It's hard to endorse someone when I'm not sure that they're competent to handle the job.
At this point, I plan to vote for Arn Menconi for US Senate; That is a race with a safe Democratic margin in Colorado. However, I won't know who I will ink in for President until my ballot is sitting on my kitchen table in front of me.
Comments
Competent to do the job?
Compared to mentally impaired Reagan or to intellectuslly deficient Bush?
The only ability required is the ability to hire sharp staffers. What special expertise is required to be a U.S. President? Do you think it is more difficult than managing a 7/11?
"They'll say we're disturbing the peace, but there is no peace. What really bothers them is that we are disturbing the war." Howard Zinn
There's a bit more to Presidenting
than hiring sharp staffers. One expects a thorough knowledge of political gamesmanship, and government processes. Bernie had it.
Hillary, Trump and Johnson do not have it, unless you
consider being dishonest and cutthroat political gamesmanship. I'd rather not vote for that crap.
Jill Stein is not going to be President. Hillary will. So, Stein's degree of gamesmanship is pretty much irrelevant anyway.
However, a healthy increase in Green Party votes will say a lot about the direction voters want the nation to go. If you want the nation to keep going further and further right, then vote for one of the other three.
If you want you vote to say that you'd prefer the country to go left, vote for Stein. Besides, given the electoral college, your vote for Hillary may help Hillary become President only if you are in a purple state and the polls for that state are close around November 1. And even then, it probably won't matter. In your state (Colorado) and Virginia for example, the Hillary campaign is so confident, they've already pulled out. So, the issue is not how many political games Stein can play, but whether you want to use your vote simply to add to Hillary's landslide or if you want your vote to say you'd prefer someone to Hillary's left next time.
I'm not sure anyone in Washington DC actually gives a crap about which direction we want the country to go, but using our vote to make a statement is about all we can do.
we need a competent businessman who has many businesses to run t
he United States.
voting green is a wasted vote.
Vote Trump.
He'll keep our jobs in America.
Vote Cthulhu!!!
Donnie The #ShitHole Douchebag. Fake Friend to the Working Class. Real Asshole.
Ctuhulh, not Stein? Writing in can be problematic, especially
at the top of the ticket. For example, although I have not checked this, a Californian told me that writing in for President invalidates the entire ballot. Besides, Stein is the least of all evils whose names have been put forward. (I'm too literal, I know.)
Ok you shamed me into fixing that image
Here ya go.
Donnie The #ShitHole Douchebag. Fake Friend to the Working Class. Real Asshole.
Thanks! Great job!
He's run many businesses into bankruptcy.
We seem to have been blessed with an influx of Republicans over the weekend. At least, I'm assuming there's more than one of you.
But, if Hillary is way too far right for this crowd, I'm thinking you may be wasting your time, trying to persuade us to vote for a Republican. Some will vote for Trump, just to block Hillary in a purple state if polls are close, but that requires no persuasion. It's simply a strategic vote based on numbers.
Competent businessman? He's a media-savvy showman but not
a particularly skilled businessman: http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2016/jun/21/hillary-c...
If he'd invested his inheritance on index funds instead of some of the failing businesses he did, he'd have been $10 billion richer today than he is: http://www.moneytalksnews.com/why-youre-probably-better-investing-than-d...
Clinton has a record as an untrustworthy, say-anything, ego- and power-driven warmonger with a highly questionable (to be kind) family foundation that may qualify her for jail under RICO statute, though she'll never do time. Trump's an ego-driven blowhard, also a documented liar, who's beholden to some different interests.
Running a country as if it were a company is a simplistic notion long pushed by the right with its "balanced budget" and "makers, not takers" memes. It's also inappropriate and downright idiotic--an attempt to redirect blame for what hurts regular people away from those who are blameworthy. Countries flourish and help their citizens by not balancing their books and instead by putting $ into social safety nets and job-creating programs. And unlike companies, countries issue their own fiat currencies, altering the importance of balance sheets.
What would keep jobs in America and create a host of new ones is for the US government to create a new WPA, similar to Roosevelt's, and put people to work on critical infrastructure jobs across the country. There's no shortage of need.
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society." --Jiddu Krishnamurti
There was another Jill Stein hit diary today on DK
By one of the new members who joined this year.
I don't know how many hit diaries I've seen written about her there, but what's the point of writing them unless they think some of Hillary's supporters are going to vote for her? Unless some of the members who stayed but are only lurking are thinking of voting for Jill. I am pretty sure that most of the members left there are in the Hillary camp.
I only skimmed the diary, but I'm sure that if anyone defended Jill they would have been HR'd into oblivion.
But this seems to be a pattern on other progressive websites, make sure that there is an anti Jill essay written daily.
There were problems with running a campaign of Joy while committing a genocide? Who could have guessed?
Harris is unburdened of speaking going forward.
My intent was not to write a "hit piece"
I wrote that Jill exceeded my low expectations - she is a good orator, sharp and good on politics. I was disappointed that she had not thoroughly researched and taken a position on Coloradocare, which peaked into a huge leftist-splitting controversy the week before she spoke here. I didn't repeat the "anti science, anti-vaxxer" slurs, which I had investigated and found to be bogus, and have pushed back on in the pro-HRC blogs I frequent.
If Stein wanted to come down against Coloradocare, fine - she could have joined the Koch brothers, the insurance industry, and the Democrats allied to them. That is what the right wing press said that she did,and they're all crowing about it. That would be just another blow dealt to our health plan. But she kind of tried to have it both ways and straddle the issue, which was disappointing.
I'm a reluctant HRC voter, following my candidate (Bernie Sanders) instructions and working within the Democratic party for change. In my view, we need both inside and outside pressure for change. I like that Jill Stein's candidacy will be articulating progressive positions and pushing the mainstream candidate to the left, which was one of Bernie's main contributions.
But I also wrote that I won't know how I'll vote on the Presidential ticket until my ballot is in front of me on the kitchen table - about six weeks from now. (Colorado is an all-mail ballot election, and ballots drop Oct 15 or so).
You seem to be leaning far more toward Hillary than Stein.
Nothing is wrong with that. It is what it is.
As far as being informed, at one point before she announced, Hillary had over 200 people, quite a few at Stiglitz level, on her economic advisory team alone. And she's basically been running since at least 1992. That makes it relatively easy to be informed. Stein does not have the money for that. However, again, Stein's job performance as President is an issue only if Stein has a real shot at being elected. All indicators so far are that we are basically discussing only whether your vote will add to Hillary's landslide, indicating you are happy with the status quo and Hillary, or whether your vote will say you would like the country to go left of Hillary.
That is the dilemma....
whether to cast my meager vote as a bulwark against Trump and for a center-left candidate, or to cast it as a symbolic protest vote for someone with progressive policies.
That's the same dilemma everyone on here has. Most get around it by demonizing Clinton.
It's why I won't know how to cast my Pres vote until I see the little arrows on my ballot with my own eyes.
Ok regarding "Stein's Competency"
I really don't expect her to get a lot done as president. There are 500+ Sociopathic members of congress that will undoubtedly be out to block everything she proposes. But if she does nothing else beyond vetoing every awful bill coming out of congress, it will be 4 years of relief from the onslaught of the Oligarchs.
It's time to throw sand in the gears of this machine speeding us along to bankruptcy, mass murder, and ecological Armageddon.
PS. aside from calling Jill incompetent, it was a good read.
Donnie The #ShitHole Douchebag. Fake Friend to the Working Class. Real Asshole.
BTW, Stein is not against ColoradoCare
She just says it has gaps. According to the Colorado Independent article you linked to.
Donnie The #ShitHole Douchebag. Fake Friend to the Working Class. Real Asshole.
"Gaps" in Coloradocare
are part of the controversy. I get that a Presidential candidate on a quick campaign stop can''t wade into the weeds and get all technical on stuff.
But the right wing talking points against Coloradocare are:
that it will run out of money
Meanwhile, the left wing talking points against Coloradocare are:
And here's what nobody will admit to, the real reason both right and left are trashing Coloradocare: it will create "job churn" in the health insurance industry. Most people will eventually find work in the public option administration; however, the most obscene profit mongering will stop. That is why the Kochs, the insurance PACS, medical PACS, and their hired legislators are coming out against it.
All of the talking point criticisms are highly fact-challenged and debatable; several leading economists and analysts have praised the design. It has to be in the Constitution because of Colorado's unique challenges with the TABOR amendment, which is too much TMI for this comment.
So when Jill Stein comes to Colorado the week after all of this blew up, and she talks about "gaps" and won't say which ones, I call it not being well-informed, trying to straddle an issue without taking a real stand on it. It doesn't give me a lot of confidence in her leadership abilities.
My guess is Jill's 'gap' is that it won't cover abortion.
Which sux. But I suppose if Coloradocare can't be fixed before it goes up for a vote, then why not endorse it with a list of reservations. However, I guarantee Jill ain't bought out by Insurance Industry money -- that would be Hellery.
Donnie The #ShitHole Douchebag. Fake Friend to the Working Class. Real Asshole.
It seemed to me that she did endorse it
Isn't supporting the amendment the same an endorsement? Or does someone have to literally say the word "endorse" for it to count as one? To me, her saying she supports the amendment comes across as her wanting to see it happen.
Yeah I think you are right. Good point n/t
Donnie The #ShitHole Douchebag. Fake Friend to the Working Class. Real Asshole.
She did say that
at both the Ft Collins and the denver event. Her statement in Fo Co was edited out of the video of her speech, which was weird.
She did come out very strongly on the Federal pubic option.....one of the intents of Coloradocare is to demonstrate that the 3% employee/ 6.6% employer contribution can work to fund a public option - it's what Sanders copied for his proposed plan.
"Job churn" in the insurance industry.
Talking point straight from TOP - IIRC Chitown Kev was the point man on that.
Pretty sure that the only "job churn" that Republicans or "Democrats" are concerned about is that affecting the occupants of the executive suites.
Isn't this a state law issue?
I am not sure Stein should have spent much time on this, if any, if it is state law.
Well a lot of people are starting to think the only way
to get around the assholes in washington is to pass state laws. I'm tending to agree after the marijuana successes and other state laws. Of course, it depends on your state b/c some are ruled by bigtime aholes too.
IMO, this was fair game. And Jill probably should have come out for it but listed her issues. But that doesn't mean I'll vote for The Evil like some others here have mentioned.
Donnie The #ShitHole Douchebag. Fake Friend to the Working Class. Real Asshole.
I'm not sure. Why risk ticking people off if it's
something you will never have anything to do with? Jill is not trying to be President. (If she is, she's delusional.) She is trying to get out the Green Party message and trying to get a certain percentage of the vote. In her shoes, I'd stay focused on those two things and not risk alienating potential voters over a state law controversy.
Sure, if she gets asked questions, she has to be prepared to answer, but, again, if it were I, I would have tried something vague.
That was my point
She should have taken a stand on one side or the other of the Coloradocare controversy, or just said that she was researching it. It is complicated, and there is a lot of misinformation out there.
Instead, she tried to have it both ways, straddle the issue, and pissed everybody off.
ballot initiative
which would amend the state constitution - it's the only way to pass laws that cost $$ in Colorado, due to a stupid-ass Taxpayers Bill or Rights (TABOR) passed by an asshole slumlord lawmaker, Doug Bruce, a decade or so ago.
So how many policies
of Hillary's do you agree with?
since you ask....
I like her social justice vision, and the policy proposal to make public colleges debt free. It's not going to help me with my student loan debt (from 30 fricking years ago!!) but it's a step forward.
You pegged me right - I'm a reluctant Hillary voter, but Bernie asked us to do that to defeat Trump.
I suspect monkeywrenching to return no matter what.
I wonder whether there are online courses on that subject? I will check coursera for that, later. I am in a bitter mood this morning. Monday, monday.
Hey! my dear friends or soon-to-be's, JtC could use the donations to keep this site functioning for those of us who can still see the life preserver or flotsam in the water.
Ignore the lyrics for now. Let the harmonies lift your spirits.
Also, try to forget about everything about John, except that he could arrange a song for the voices he had to work with like nobody's business (whatever that means).
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h81Ojd3d2rY&list=RDh81Ojd3d2rY]
As it happens, PBS ran a program on the Mamas and Papas yesterday. Fundraising, as usual. I caught only a bit. Of the songs I heard, I liked this one best.
[video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j43hm1j7liU&list=RDj43hm1j7liU]
Haha. When are fur hats gonna come back
in style. I had one back in the day (sheep skin) but I only wore it outdoors in the dead of winter. Yes, it was a thing back in the 60s for musicians. That is a great song.
Donnie The #ShitHole Douchebag. Fake Friend to the Working Class. Real Asshole.
#JillorGloria #NeverHillary #NeverTrump
Gloria La Riva 2016
Jill's on the ballot here in Washington and I'll be voting for her. Gloria La Riva is another excellent option to the center right Republican that is $hillary and the proto-fascist Trump. Henry Wallace above is right though, $hillary is going to be president for sure but we need to have as many votes as possible for left wing candidates to show viability for 2020. Hillary's presidency will peak on election day and it will be all down hill from there. By the time 2020 rolls around, she will be hated far and wide and the pendulum will be ready to swing back left in a big way.
"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." - JFK | "The more I see of the moneyed peoples, the more I understand the guillotine." - G. B. Shaw Bernie/Tulsi 2020
And yet there is Obama who has been a real
conservative ahole for 8 years and still maintains a level of popularity -- which speaks to the stupidity of the Merican people. He is neck and neck with Bush for worst pres ever. And if he sneaks TPP thru before he is defecated from office, he will take the crown.
Donnie The #ShitHole Douchebag. Fake Friend to the Working Class. Real Asshole.
Nice hit piece.
Of course you failed to mention that Stein served 6 years as an elected town official in Massachussetts, thus eclipsing your PTA service. But hey, hitters gonna hit.
OK, I stand corrected
She does have some local elected experience. I saw the "town committee" position mentioned, and assumed it was a temporary office.
I do try to be accurate.