Sanders/Warren Threatening Shutdown #TaxScam ?

Ralph Nader said the Dems should have occupied the Senate when the Republicans pulled their shitshow Friday night. Sounds good to me. Dems have run ads against the tax fail but the Republicans spent more. Bernie Sanders has held rallies in several cities as part of efforts to get organize more grassroots oppo.

No surprise Schumer/estab Dems have called out the Republicans for not going bipartisan, skipped a meeting with the President but now have rescheduled it, with Joe Manchin even saying the Republicans should have let them in on the action, might have got 70 votes. Heh.

Meanwhile, thousands of people have been holding tax scam protests in DC and around the country.

Saw the following article on Twitter today and thought , well now, this might get interesting.

Might just be kabuki though....

Sanders had tweeted about video but I can’t get the link to FB to work.

Here is what I found on YouTube if you care to have a look.

FWIW.

up
30 users have voted.

Comments

divineorder's picture

Senator. Is that an endorsement? /s

up
9 users have voted.

A truth of the nuclear age/climate change: we can no longer have endless war and survive on this planet. Oh sh*t.

@divineorder The only senator with any guts to endorse Bernie was Merkely of Oregon. Warren did not endorse Bernie in primaries.

But that aside, they are trying to fight the good fight.

up
15 users have voted.
detroitmechworks's picture

Protests are great but how are they going to actually, you know, DO anything?

Read the damn phone scripts... they read like a fucking robot wrote them. Senators ain't gonna even bother to respond to politely phrased requests.

And since the rest of my thoughts are NSFI,

up
12 users have voted.

You can't expect to wield Supreme Military power, just cause some corporate tosser lobbed a contract at you!

divineorder's picture

@detroitmechworks is to be preferred. Smile

I wonder what stopped Trumpcare? Surely grassroots action had some impact?

up
13 users have voted.

A truth of the nuclear age/climate change: we can no longer have endless war and survive on this planet. Oh sh*t.

detroitmechworks's picture

@divineorder the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

The PTB have decided that this is gonna happen, and it's gonna happen. We can protest all we like, but at the end of the day if a corporate tool will make more money, that's the way the decision will go. Why did Trumpcare fail? Because they haven't gotten ALL the money out of people with Obamacare yet. Corporations have their costs underwritten, and they want that subsidy to keep rolling in, even as they offer less and less.

And I absolutely think action should be taken. Just not at the direction of the PTB to sap away our energy and intelligence on known failed tactics. Namely, protesting in nice friendly free-speech areas that can be easily ignored.

up
17 users have voted.

You can't expect to wield Supreme Military power, just cause some corporate tosser lobbed a contract at you!

divineorder's picture

@detroitmechworks @detroitmechworks @detroitmechworks on the Trumpcare fight.

But yah, the Insurance company thumbs down was surely key as well.
Lot of good it did them Trump startin’ screwing with the markets almost immediately.

up
12 users have voted.

A truth of the nuclear age/climate change: we can no longer have endless war and survive on this planet. Oh sh*t.

detroitmechworks's picture

@divineorder And this reeks of it.

I can practically see the brand name.

The Democrats have dragged out the only politicians they have who can even move the needle on public enthusiasm, and told them to dance.

Honestly, I'd say check back next week on this. If it's still going, maybe there's something there, but I know the news cycles will have moved on to whatever else Trump has done lately. One day protests ain't gonna cut it. AAAAAND about to devolve into NSFI talk there for a moment... But have no fear... I have a plan.

up
12 users have voted.

You can't expect to wield Supreme Military power, just cause some corporate tosser lobbed a contract at you!

divineorder's picture

@detroitmechworks @detroitmechworks

To stop this. Of course I realize that.

Me, I applaud people taking action, and not just in ‘free speech zones.’

..

..

...

up
18 users have voted.

A truth of the nuclear age/climate change: we can no longer have endless war and survive on this planet. Oh sh*t.

detroitmechworks's picture

@divineorder confrontations with militarized police.

Because these images no longer make it to the MSM, and they're shutting down the internet to ensure they no longer get anywhere. A lot of this stuff is from twitter... which has explicitly chosen a side on this tax bill by accepting money to make #CutTheRate their number one hashtag, complete with the lie that America has the highest corporate taxes in the world.

I'm not going to advocate throwing away people's lives, and livelihoods (Because they fire people for being on the news now...)in pursuit of a goal that frankly does nothing for the 99%. Even if this tax bill is defeated, there will be another one, and you know DAMN well that the Democrats will call any deal that doesn't involve wholesale slaughter of the poor for soylent green a win.

up
16 users have voted.

You can't expect to wield Supreme Military power, just cause some corporate tosser lobbed a contract at you!

divineorder's picture

@detroitmechworks no more than folks were during Occupy Or DAPL.

We will just have to agree to disagree on the value of political action. Have a good one!

up
4 users have voted.

A truth of the nuclear age/climate change: we can no longer have endless war and survive on this planet. Oh sh*t.

divineorder's picture

@detroitmechworks @detroitmechworks

Couple or three stop this.

But yeah, the corpadems are meeting with Trump and want to get in on the action. Of course I realize that.

Me, I applaud people taking action, and not just in ‘free speech zones.’

..

..

...

up
8 users have voted.

A truth of the nuclear age/climate change: we can no longer have endless war and survive on this planet. Oh sh*t.

@divineorder probably also helped. Wouldn't be good for them to lose that "subsidy" profit money. Sorry, I'm that mad today, at all of them.

I would dearly love to see this latest abomination stopped, but I have little faith a shutdown would do it. I hope I am wrong.

up
13 users have voted.
divineorder's picture

@lizzyh7 For the Republicans in the next election.

After watching the vid, can’t even be sure that is what Sanders And Warren were saying.

up
8 users have voted.

A truth of the nuclear age/climate change: we can no longer have endless war and survive on this planet. Oh sh*t.

snoopydawg's picture

d.o, remove the m . from the link to post the YT vids

I'll believe this when or if I see it. I was thinking the same thing as Nader. There had to be some way to stop them that night. Democrats got 1 hour to read the bill and that they couldn't vote on it if they didn't know what they were voting on. I bet there were other procedures they could have used.
Shutting down the budget debate for DACA is good, but the tax bill should be another reason. This is identity politics if they don't try. My opinion...

up
15 users have voted.

a longtime oligarch eugenics plan is already well underway

earth is the insane asylum for the universe

Meteor Man's picture

@snoopydawg
I recall reading an article about this:

Amendments to a measure in the Senate can be offered at almost any time while the measure is under consideration. In addition, an amendment can be debated for an unlimited amount of time. In most cases, an amendment can relate to any subject, even if it is unrelated to the measure that is actually being amended.

https://hobnobblog.com/2011/03/senate-amendment-procedure/

I could be wrong, but I think they could have stretched this process out for quite some time.

up
18 users have voted.

Cali Kush: a bowl a day keeps the doctor away.

detroitmechworks's picture

@Meteor Man to show some real progressive bona-fides and toss some red meat to the 99%. Hell, if they did even ONE of these successfully, I'd consider voting for them.

An Amendment to classify housing as a human right...
An Amendment to immediately end all foreign military actions...
An Amendment to classify the Internet as A public Utility not subject to the oversight of political appointees...
An Amendment to set into place actual policies relating to sexual harassment by political members, and the boilerplate procedures that will be followed with regards to all allegations without exception for rank, service, or gender.
An Amendment to declare the CIA a terrorist organization.
An Amendment to declare all Corporations must have a specific purpose and if that cannot be identified within a single paragraph of a maximum of 6 lines, the corporation must be broken up.

Any one of these would be a good start to rebuilding my trust.

up
22 users have voted.

You can't expect to wield Supreme Military power, just cause some corporate tosser lobbed a contract at you!

snoopydawg's picture

@Meteor Man

be considered if legislation passes through reconciliation. This is why republicans need to pass it this year. There's some rule in congress about that. This is why it only needs 51 votes to pass. I've read too many articles to try to find if this is true or not.
But there has to be some way the democrats could have stopped it Friday night. The longer it's delayed the shorter time they have to pass it. This is if democrats want to stop it. Very few of them were talking about it in media that people could see it. Bernie was and so was Sherrod Brown. He kept going after Hatch

up
16 users have voted.

a longtime oligarch eugenics plan is already well underway

earth is the insane asylum for the universe

divineorder's picture

@snoopydawg This is why they went that route, to try and ram this in before anyone could get a grip.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/11/14/16634200/republican-t...

up
15 users have voted.

A truth of the nuclear age/climate change: we can no longer have endless war and survive on this planet. Oh sh*t.

Meteor Man's picture

@divineorder
I did a search and came up with this:

Republicans are using a special process called “reconciliation” to jam through TrumpCare. This means they only need 50 votes, instead of the usual 60, to pass it. But the trade-off is that they have to allow an unlimited number of amendments. Any Senator can file as many amendments as they want and then call them up for a vote on the Senate floor during a period called “vote-a-rama.” Democratic Senators can and should plan thousands of amendments and keep them going until Republicans agree to have public hearings on the bill.

https://www.ouramendments.org/

And this from The Atlantic:

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2013/03/what-on-earth-is-a-...

No biggie, just still not certain.

up
11 users have voted.

Cali Kush: a bowl a day keeps the doctor away.

snoopydawg's picture

@divineorder

with all the problems republicans are having to get this passed by the end of the year, this is why democrats should have tried to stop the vote Friday night. If they could have.
As it stands now, it's over the Byrd rule by $.2 trillion. They must need a microscope to find items in this and remove them. Plus they have to get both the house and senate bills to line up with each other. This takes more time unless they go with one bill. But this won't happen because in one house, the mortgage deductions are in and not in the other bill. These types of concerns were given to get a member's vote. Take them out and that member won't vote for it.

Everything in the bill has to relate to money. I don't see how artic drilling relates to money. Removing the restrictions on churches being able to talk politics is in it too.
Time might be on our side if they can't come together especially since they have to pass the budget soon.

This is scarier then hell. How is this possibly legal? One person gets to decide policies for the whole damn country? I think not.

Some analysts have also floated the nuclear option, in which the presiding officer of the Senate — Vice President Mike Pence — just overrules the Senate parliamentarian. McConnell did not allow for this in the health care debate, but some have theorized there is more pressure for him to go to extreme lengths this time.

up
15 users have voted.

a longtime oligarch eugenics plan is already well underway

earth is the insane asylum for the universe

Meteor Man's picture

@snoopydawg
And DO as well.

up
11 users have voted.

Cali Kush: a bowl a day keeps the doctor away.

divineorder's picture

@snoopydawg

Heh.

up
11 users have voted.

A truth of the nuclear age/climate change: we can no longer have endless war and survive on this planet. Oh sh*t.

Unabashed Liberal's picture

the other day, Dems didn't even bother to proffer an amendment in opposition to the elimination of the 'individual mandate' during the hours-long Vote-A Rama.

Sounds like more Kabuki (to me). Not to mention that 'Chuck and Nancy' would probably stroke out if they were to get blamed for a government shutdown. I believe they just agreed to another WH meeting sometime this week.

Heard Nancy's so-called Press Availability from last Thursday--all she could talk about was that the tax bill wasn't 'revenue neutral.' Not a word about the inclusion of the Chained CPI, which is to be applied to the calculation of the federal tax brackets (if it stays in the bill, which I figure it will).

Acute

[Hey, not sure what this emoticon indicates--but my intent is to use it to scold the Democrats' response to the tax bill. Wink ]

OTOH, maybe we'll be pleasantly surprised. Guess time will tell!

Mollie


The original meaning of “fiscal conservative” may be gone. In fact, Democrats have had a better claim on the label in recent years than Republicans.
--David Leonhardt, Journalist, NYT, January 9, 2017

"Every time I lose a dog, he takes a piece of my heart. Every new dog gifts me with a piece of his. Someday, my heart will be total dog, and maybe then I will be just as generous, loving, and forgiving."
--Author Unknown

up
16 users have voted.

"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it."
--George Bernard Shaw, Irish Dramatist & Socialist
"We [corporations] are the government!" Actor John Colicos (1978)

snoopydawg's picture

@Unabashed Liberal

when Trump sent out his tweet just before the meeting at the WH. Chuck and Nancy should have gone to the meeting with him, but he hurt their feelings and decided to say no.
And if democrats had a chance to offer amendments but didn't, we got played again. But Manchkin is on record stating he would have voted for it, so there's that. Plus there was a problem with voting to move it on because the Freedom Caucus didn't think it went far enough and they weren't going to vote for it. Enough democrats joined in and voted for it so it moved on. Kabuki all the way!

up
15 users have voted.

a longtime oligarch eugenics plan is already well underway

earth is the insane asylum for the universe

Unabashed Liberal's picture

@snoopydawg

Dems offered some amendments--just not one to oppose/overturn the 'individual mandate.'

Have a good one!

Mollie

up
6 users have voted.

"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it."
--George Bernard Shaw, Irish Dramatist & Socialist
"We [corporations] are the government!" Actor John Colicos (1978)

Meteor Man's picture

@Unabashed Liberal
Votarama is over. I missed it and the Dems folded as usual.

up
9 users have voted.

Cali Kush: a bowl a day keeps the doctor away.

Unabashed Liberal's picture

@Meteor Man

posting the 'blurb' explaining the Vote-A-Rama!

Pleasantry

Mollie

up
6 users have voted.

"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it."
--George Bernard Shaw, Irish Dramatist & Socialist
"We [corporations] are the government!" Actor John Colicos (1978)

Democrats are once again simply reactive after the fact. When Joe Biden recently knocked Bernie over the patriotism of the rich, is it any wonder the democratic party establishment reaction was tepid at best. Will the big money donors Pelosi so brags about actually going to oppose the gop tax bill?

BTW. Just looking at Obama's Cat Food Commission recommendations on taxes and budgets. Quick perusal looks like a lot of what they recommended the gop implemented.

I am not sure what to do except to appeal to the same populism that Trump did with the gop base and convince those who voted for him, that the tax bill is horrid as in eliminated deductions on student expenses and loans.

up
12 users have voted.
Cassiodorus's picture

that all of the electoral politics Bernie can muster will make no difference as long as he persists in being the faux opposition to the faux opposition?

up
10 users have voted.

"Earth/Gaia is maker and destroyer, not resource to be exploited or ward to be protected or nursing mother promising nourishment." - Donna Haraway

In the same fashion that democrats extended the Bush tax-cuts in 2010 that we're going to expire automatically, while democrats had massive majorities in the house and senate + the presidency, they (i.e big political donors) are not really that outraged about about Trump's tax-cuts.
I even think some of the Me-Too-ism is so the networks don't have to fully cover the opposition to Trump's money-transfer (from the working class to the rich), that MSM sponsors (and political donors) really want.
It's ALL Kabuki Theatre.
Both party establishments serve the purpose of keeping the people divided, to prevent public unity against their shared multinational corporate agenda.

up
8 users have voted.

Mike Taylor

mimi's picture

says the joker to the thief.

There must be some kind of way outta here
Said the joker to the thief
There's too much confusion
I can't get no relief

I don't know why I keep the quote of GWBush in my mind saying in his Sept.11 2001 speech:

Americans are asking "Why do they hate us?"

They hate what they see right here in this chamber: a democratically elected government. Their leaders are self-appointed. They hate our freedoms: our freedom of religion, our freedom of speech, our freedom to vote and assemble and disagree with each other.

and then - before he had said the above - said in the beginning of his speech:

Tonight, we are a country awakened to danger and called to defend freedom. Our grief has turned to anger and anger to resolution. Whether we bring our enemies to justice or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done.

Justice has not been done. They (the evil doers) didn't hate your freedoms, they loved your freedom that allowed them to exploit your capitalism thoroughly.

Am I confused or what? I remember back then I was amazed how easily GWBush declared so many countries being their new allies and friends without ever asking if they wanted to be their friends and allies. But I guess I got it all wrong.

Too much confusion. I can't get relief. And darn it, I am not joking.

up
5 users have voted.

"“What difference does it make to the dead, the orphans and the homeless, whether the mad destruction is wrought under the name of totalitarianism or the holy name of liberty or democracy?” - Ghandi